Gundam 00 Episode 14

[Darknodin]

So... no one posted this before? are you in shock before this awesome ep?

http://a.scarywater.net/shs/%5BShinsen-Subs%5D_Kidou_Senshi_Gundam_00_-_14_%5B76ECEF5F%5D.avi.torrent

:D

[Ryllharu]

I believe the majority of us wait for the Menclave version. We're all whores for Sumeragi (or Felt and Soma for the pedos, Lockon for the ladies) in HD.

I have heard that this episode was good though.

[Yukimura]

Wow, the new OP's animation sequences are just win, I had to go back and watch it again before I could even watch the ep. I'm not sold on the actual song yet but it doesn't immediately offend me so there's hope.

Only thing I'll say about the ep for now, Masa should pop a huge boner at the preview.

[TheBladeChild]

Im liking the new opening, couldnt stop watching it over and over.

[DDBen]

I like the visuals of the new opening but I can't say I'm as crazy about the song the first one was just better.

The ending on the other hand is a vast improvement over the previous one that I actually hated.

Overall both a interesting and rather odd episode. It just seems strange to me before such a major battle that Setsuna would take off on a detour like that costing him value able fuel for the upcoming extended battle. I still can't see any reason for the teenage blonde and her boyfriend at this point either there existence confuses me.

That aside nice buildup and the next few episodes seem like they should be awesome.

[Yukimura]

Gundams run on magic particles and possibly sunshine, the only potential imitation to their range that I can see might be how much energy they can store when the sun is not up, assuming they actually need the sun at all for the 'Solar Furnaces' to work. Setsuna didn't really lose anything by going to see Maria besides loss of peace of mind.

[Inazuma]

Good thing popping up the Foreign Legion think, it really gives the feel that Gundam is taking place in the future and not in a completly different/parralel universe.
Good thing, breaking the pace and not having the Gundams fight. That DMC pace would have somewhat ruined the show.
Good thing, new Op and Ed. So I guess 14 is a good ep.

[DDBen]

Gundams run on magic particles and possibly sunshine, the only potential imitation to their range that I can see might be how much energy they can store when the sun is not up, assuming they actually need the sun at all for the 'Solar Furnaces' to work. Setsuna didn't really lose anything by going to see Maria besides loss of peace of mind.

As far as I'm aware this isn't accurate. The Gundams can't creat GN particles and have to specifically goto space to recharge them from time to time. Setsuna had so use those particles in order to stay undetected as they are what keeps them off radar as well as how they propel the Gundams allowing them to fly in the first place. I'm not sure if they get secondary power directly from the sun or not in this case or if the solar power they require comes from space only but I am sure it cost him atleast some of those particles in order to make that side trip.

[Yukimura]

When was it ever said they had to return to space to recharge the Gundams??? I remember a Gundam has to return to space periodically to charge the Ptolemaios, but I don't remember it ever being implied that Gundams had a finite energy supply? The way I remember it the Solar Furnace at the heart of each Gundam is what generates GN particles and whatever process it uses it does not have an upper limit on lifetime energy production.

If you want to get technical you can read the translated spec sheets off wikipedia and find out the full truth, but in the context of just the show we know a Solar Furnace can at least put out enough energy to charge the batteries of a space ship allowing it to operate for a few weeks in orbit with a good amount of orbital maneuvering.

[Rickbee]

Bring on the three new badass suits they looked sick

[TheBladeChild]

When was it ever said they had to return to space to recharge the Gundams??? I remember a Gundam has to return to space periodically to charge the Ptolemaios, but I don't remember it ever being implied that Gundams had a finite energy supply? The way I remember it the Solar Furnace at the heart of each Gundam is what generates GN particles and whatever process it uses it does not have an upper limit on lifetime energy production.

If you want to get technical you can read the translated spec sheets off wikipedia and find out the full truth, but in the context of just the show we know a Solar Furnace can at least put out enough energy to charge the batteries of a space ship allowing it to operate for a few weeks in orbit with a good amount of orbital maneuvering.

Thats right, I dont recall ever hearing that the gundams ever needed to recharge or refuel. Thinking back, the word "solar furnace" reminded me of spiderman 2. Anyone think that the energy described in that movie might be somewhat akin to the energy sources of the Gundams?

[masamuneehs]

man, i thought this episode was fantastic (i finally broke down and got Shitsen's version)

This felt alot more like what I'd been hoping for from this show. I love that the three nations are "ganging up" on the Gundams, but still trying to keep an edge over each other. I also am really liking the 'normal family' slant that Saji's family brings. I think his sister is going to find out something big about CB's real deal... That Union pedo still looks shifty to me...

We had almost every character in this episode get screen time, and I thought the characters advanced very nicely in it. Graham Acre is still the freaking man. I think it's his VA. Even angst princess was pretty good in this episode. And i don't mean Tieria.

Did they ever say the name of that other blond Over Flag guy? Setsuna really is fucking retarded. I felt like I came to care more particularly about Lockon, Allelujah and Sumeragi, although only one of them had any decent screen time. I like how they did the scenes with them in it.

"Even though STUPID SCI-FI BABBLE let's people live in space, we still make sure to come down to Earth every four episodes or so, for 'mental health', which is always some kind of activity like bathing or shopping which provides shittons of fanservice provision situations."

The new OP is beautiful. First listen of the song was positive.

The ED. You end an important set-up episode, the first episode of the second 'season'. You end it with two scenes: the main character dramatically searching for answers to his woes by going to his female love interests place. He leaves in a huff, all the more scattered. You cut to the final scene, a plot tidbit showing us how the evilest motherfucker in the entire show (the answer to Setsuna's final spoken line) is going to be connected with this big dramatic event you've spent most of the entire episode setting up. The man gets his information, leaves, and 'transforms' into evil incarnate, giving a threatening, tension-building monolouge as he dominates the final moments of this episode.

You cue the music for the ED during this scene, to segue....
...from evil incarnate....

to bishounen cutting each other's hair on the beach?

I mean, LOLtacular. That ED is like straight out of every warm and fuzzy 'safehouse life' Gundam Wing yaoi fanfiction I've ever had the misfortune to come across. They're cooking food, on the beach, and the main character is getting his hair cut by his new most popular seme! Then, a dramatic interlude and our bishounen three and a half (Tieria is only a half) posing in angsty supermodel decours and music video cliches.

This is supposed to be a show about war, the effect of power, desire and strong convictions on the world. THERE SHOULD BE NO HAIR CUTTING ON BEACHES IN SHOWS ABOUT FUCKING WAR!!!!!!

And, yeah, I'm hoping CB gets fucked up beyond all recognition in the next episode.

Finally, a question. If i wrote a Gundam00 fanfic, what pairings would you guys be intersted in? =p

[rockmanj]

Finally, a question. If i wrote a Gundam00 fanfic, what pairings would you guys be intersted in? =p


Geez...Sumeragi (and her twins, of course) and a vibrating spatula. But really, I did enjoy the joint maneuvering by all of the big groups. I cant think of anything to add right now, but it looks like CB might be in some deep shit

[KrayZ33]

woah... next episode will be awesome! i can feel it....


in my balls!

[animus]

Mmmmm Sumeragi

And nice how the new OP shows Kyrios/Allelujha's use of the flying probes/dragoons aforementioned and used in many a Gundam series.

[kpxiceboi]

the new OP does rock. This episode wasn't bad. Being that this episode is the calm beofre the storm, and it's really building up the mometum of the series, the show is going to get a little more exciting. :D

[KrayZ33]

i simply can't wait to see lockon getting knocked out by this flag-fighter who transformed right in front of the collision with him =)
however i hope to see a 343MB version from Conclave...

btw the 2 new gundams(?) to the left and right of Exia in the opening look interesting (or maybe 2 transformations like the from virtue? hmm what was its name, can't remember it?!)

uh btw I don't know if someone is interested in the full OP song but since i liked it so much i'll simply post it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcPfE7J1FBI
wtf giant pandas with snipers *HIDE!!!*

[Yukimura]

That video was pretty involved compared to most of the jpop videos I've seen (Haro FTW) and the lead singer chick was pretty cute, it's too bad her taste in wardrobe was terrible. Also the part of the song used for the OP is definately the 'good' part...

Anyway, back to the episode. Sumeragi needs to stop teasing us and just let the puppies out of the kennel. It's starting to get distracting fantasizing about her in the middle of the eps. Echoing Masa's assertion I think Ali is just plain awesome evil. At first I thought he did what he did just to get money but now I am pretty sure he's insane on a Rau La Cruset level. As long as he doesn't turn out to be a prince of Azadistan (oh how funny that would be) he will probably remain my favorite antagonist for the rest of the show. Graham and Sergei are cool, but neither of them is a sociopath double agent bent on reveling in war.

[NeoCybercoin]

Is it me or does Kate Maniken have the same VA as Irene from Claymore?

Anyway can't wait for next episode. Looking forward to seeing more glimpses of those new suits.

[Ryllharu]

man, i thought this episode was fantastic (i finally broke down and got Shitsen's version)
I've got to admit, my willpower is waning after trying to avoid reading all these positive comments, but fortunately every time I think of Shinsen translating the computer as "Vader" instead of the obvious choice of "Veda" (singular form of the sacred Sanskrit texts) I can hold off for a few more days.

@Neo: It is indeed her, though she'll always be Nabiki Tendo from Ranma 1/2 for me.
http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/people.php?id=845

[fireheart]

When was it ever said they had to return to space to recharge the Gundams???
The whole thing about gundams needing to return to the ship for recharging was mentioned in one of Nyoro~n subbed episodes. Wasn't there a link somewhere around here that had a link to someone that compared Nyoro~n and Mendoi & Conclave subs to each other. The Mendoi once said that the only flaw would be that the gundams have to return in order to charge Ptolemaios while Nyoro~n said well the opposite. I might be mistaken but think that's where it comes from anyway.

Do like the new op, one thing in particular that I liked is the lack of hints concerning any end gundams for CB if there even is any end gundams in it unless you count those new 3 menacing gundams. It'd be something to watch them go on with the same gundams from start to end but somehow guessing it won't be happening. Question is if the solar furnace technology going to leak or if they're going to manage capturing one and finding out the secret or simply just manage to figure it out on their own.

Didn't have any problems with the end and the whole haircutting/food preparing/modeling they did say they were going to aim for a broader audience after all. Plus in a way I liked the contrast of something seemingly normal and then switching to them being in war torn places, sure they pose but hey what else are they going to do? The cha-cha?

Am I the only guy who doesn't care for how much or little skin Sumeragi shows? More interested in their counter attack considering she's been informed of their plans to wear the gundams out so wonder what their plan will be. Also considering she knows their goal wouldn't it be better to not participate at all in their little "training session"? It's not a war yet nor does it really incite to any war unless they show up.

[masamuneehs]

The whole thing about gundams needing to return to the ship for recharging was mentioned in one of Nyoro~n subbed episodes. Wasn't there a link somewhere around here that had a link to someone that compared Nyoro~n and Mendoi & Conclave subs to each other. The Mendoi once said that the only flaw would be that the gundams have to return in order to charge Ptolemaios while Nyoro~n said well the opposite. I might be mistaken but think that's where it comes from anyway.

I trust Menclave. and i'm almost positive that their version said it was the flagship, the Ptolemaios, that needed the Gundams to come back to it so it could keep its energy up. And, it really makes sense, from a design view point. The Ptolemais is essentially worthless in combat (at least on offense), and is only used because Sumeragi and the planning staff aren't the pilots (and to house Veda, I suppose...)

On the other hand, everything CB does depends almost entirely on the Gundams. It'd be a nightmare (and an easy ambush) if they had to go recharge somewhere all the time. All combat units must be autonomous to be worth their grain on their own.

And, I also really hope that the new gundams in the OP turn out to be enemy units. It'd be a fantastic twist to have the good guys stop getting new units, while everyone else gradually catches up in technology and starts to really challenge them. Honestly, though, I'm banking on them making some 'second generation' Gundams for CB, at least a significant upgrade to each unit that will let them sell more model kits...

[Yukimura]

Lol...please don't use Nyoro~n translations as evidence for anything other than the poor quality of Nyoro~n translators. Their record is so poor that anything they say really should be corroborated by a second source. The idea that the Gundams charge Ptolemaios is supported by every peice of evidence I can google except for people who are talking about the Nyoro~n release.

But don't take my word for it, take this guy's, (http://www.darkmirage.com/2007/10/22/gundam-00-nyoron-translation-errors/comment-page-2/) he actually speaks Japanese AND he has a blog, how could he be wrong?

After wtching the OP 10-15 times I have some info to share. The new mobile suits (2:19-2:22) in the the OP all appear to produce red shimmering particles leading me to believe they are equipped with some form of GN Drive. From the colors of the suits that we can see, dark reds and black, as well as the color of the particles themselves, red, it seems extremely likely that these suits will be enemy suits. Also the one that was on the left that gets zoomed in on has a shoulder profile reminiscent of a Tierens (HRL Girls Pink suit) and the left arm (our left) of the one in the middle looks vaguely similar to the shape of the gun Graham has on his Flag. This leads me to believe that each superpower may end up producing it's own Gundam.

Further evidence for their hostility comes from the fight sequence (2:24-2:36). The sequence starts with Virtue firing at where the three new ones were, then the new suits scatter up left and right. Dynames is seen firing at the one that went right, then it cuts to a new location and we see drones coming in from the left and they are trying to surround and attack Kyrios. Those little things attack Kyrios with red lasers and then Kyrios and Exia each destroy one leading me to believe they were not under Kyrios's control at all.

One thing that bothers me though, the new suits seem to have tech that is comparable, if not superior to, CB's (funnels/bits/DRAGOONs, giant lasers, high speed, etc).
What I can't understand is how they would anyone be able to be produced such things without some sort of time skip. Even if the countries managed to capture a Solar Furnace the tech for the Gundams is supposed to be 20+ years ahead of every one else's, you can't just close a gap like that in only months.

[Death13a]

In 200 years of Gundam development i doubt someone wouldn't have ulterior motives for technology.

[masamuneehs]

i agree with yukimura entirely on his dissertation. it's bogus that they've been able to dupe CB's technology to such a high level, at least in such a short amount of time.

this show has taken place across a supposedly pretty decent time line, but that kind of advancements, to be having the tech they do in the OP, is throwing every scrap of realism out of the supposed 'Anno Domini' Gundam universe...

one thing, though, is that from how Tieria goes on and on about how they revealed the Dyanames Super Scope and the Nadleeh GN-04, that I'm guessing the Gundams still have a few things up their sleeves (like funnels/aerods/bits/lancers/possessedsand) that the power blocks won't be able to deal with.

[Kraco]

One thing that bothers me though, the new suits seem to have tech that is comparable, if not superior to, CB's (funnels/bits/DRAGOONs, giant lasers, high speed, etc).
What I can't understand is how they would anyone be able to be produced such things without some sort of time skip. Even if the countries managed to capture a Solar Furnace the tech for the Gundams is supposed to be 20+ years ahead of every one else's, you can't just close a gap like that in only months.

Hah. The fact some tiny private organization like CB would ever have significantly better technology than practically speaking the rest of the world combined is, to begin with, the single greatest breach of realism in this entire show. And honestly if they acquire the solar furnace technology from fallen Gundams, I'd expect them to take a few months at max to equip new frames with it.

Honestly, just today I read how a modern tractor factory spits out 60 specifically customized tractors out in a single day. So, lets jump a couple of hundreds of years into the future and we will have production capabilities that will produce any high tech mobile suit in mere hours from blueprints on a computer screen. Anybody who thinks it will take amazing amounts of time to adapt new technology is hopelessly jammed in the past.

Scientific breakthroughs take time. Not adapting them. That's why the major powers are so desperately trying to capture a Gundam; they have no idea of the science of how it works.

[animus]

Lol...please don't use Nyoro~n translations as evidence for anything other than the poor quality of Nyoro~n translators. Their record is so poor that anything they say really should be corroborated by a second source. The idea that the Gundams charge Ptolemaios is supported by every peice of evidence I can google except for people who are talking about the Nyoro~n release.

But don't take my word for it, take this guy's, (http://www.darkmirage.com/2007/10/22/gundam-00-nyoron-translation-errors/comment-page-2/) he actually speaks Japanese AND he has a blog, how could he be wrong?

After wtching the OP 10-15 times I have some info to share. The new mobile suits (2:19-2:22) in the the OP all appear to produce red shimmering particles leading me to believe they are equipped with some form of GN Drive. From the colors of the suits that we can see, dark reds and black, as well as the color of the particles themselves, red, it seems extremely likely that these suits will be enemy suits. Also the one that was on the left that gets zoomed in on has a shoulder profile reminiscent of a Tierens (HRL Girls Pink suit) and the left arm (our left) of the one in the middle looks vaguely similar to the shape of the gun Graham has on his Flag. This leads me to believe that each superpower may end up producing it's own Gundam.

Further evidence for their hostility comes from the fight sequence (2:24-2:36). The sequence starts with Virtue firing at where the three new ones were, then the new suits scatter up left and right. Dynames is seen firing at the one that went right, then it cuts to a new location and we see drones coming in from the left and they are trying to surround and attack Kyrios. Those little things attack Kyrios with red lasers and then Kyrios and Exia each destroy one leading me to believe they were not under Kyrios's control at all.

One thing that bothers me though, the new suits seem to have tech that is comparable, if not superior to, CB's (funnels/bits/DRAGOONs, giant lasers, high speed, etc).
What I can't understand is how they would anyone be able to be produced such things without some sort of time skip. Even if the countries managed to capture a Solar Furnace the tech for the Gundams is supposed to be 20+ years ahead of every one else's, you can't just close a gap like that in only months.

I just read through all those comments, and thank god I only watched their first "translated" ep. That was some good dorama.

[fireheart]

Lol...please don't use Nyoro~n translations as evidence for anything other than the poor quality of Nyoro~n translators. Their record is so poor that anything they say really should be corroborated by a second source. The idea that the Gundams charge Ptolemaios is supported by every peice of evidence I can google except for people who are talking about the Nyoro~n release.

But don't take my word for it, take this guy's, (http://www.darkmirage.com/2007/10/22/gundam-00-nyoron-translation-errors/comment-page-2/) he actually speaks Japanese AND he has a blog, how could he be wrong?

Not using it as evidence haven't even seen any of their releases so wouldn't know, just saw that link you posted in one of the other threads and from the best of my knowledge that's the only place where it's been mentioned that the Gundams need to be charged from the Ptolemaios. Which is a pretty obvious answer to your own question about where it's ever been mentioned.


masamuneehs: Frankly though does it really matter how realistic the show is? If we wanted realism we wouldn't be watching Gundam in the first place and it isn't the first lack of realism in the show.

[KrayZ33]

Hah. The fact some tiny private organization like CB would ever have significantly better technology than practically speaking the rest of the world combined is, to begin with, the single greatest breach of realism in this entire show. And honestly if they acquire the solar furnace technology from fallen Gundams, I'd expect them to take a few months at max to equip new frames with it.


do we really know that CB is "small"? and even if it was a small organization, as long as it gets support (which i think CB does because who are all these [rich] guys who only observe the gundams) it is possible to get far ahead.. wasn't it even mentioned that CB is probably a 200 years old organisation and that CB could be involed in the disappearing of many good scientist?

and i don't think it would be that easy to copy that technology.... World War 2 showed us that advanced technology was really difficult to copy and ended up in building hundreds of useless tanks or weapons which never worked properly. (take the MP44 or MG42 for example :P these weapons areeven used in modern warfare -> AK47 and MG3 so basicaly you can say that these weapons were far ahead of others..)

they might get some new frames, but they simply won't be as good as the originals because it takes a lot of time to understand technology which is far ahead... and then you have to optimise it which is even more difficult.

[Kraco]

Oh. I didn't say they would be better right away. But like I said, they should be able to produce 20 of them during the first days after cracking the new tech. That's something CB shouldn't be able of even in this series - well, they wouldn't be able to even find enough weirdos for pilots. The three super powers wouldn't have such problems. They should have practically infinite production capabilities and an endless supply of decent pilots.

CB might be 200 years old but honestly if it was a big organization a lot of people would know of it, and when a lot of people know about something it's going to leak sooner or later, and 200 years is many times enough for either soon or late. Especially if the organization has made lots of prominent people disappear. We have seen the intelligence services of the major powers suck to high heavens but even without any agencies they would know if it was big (actually they might be totally without intelligence services based on what we have seen).

[DDBen]

Oh. I didn't say they would be better right away. But like I said, they should be able to produce 20 of them during the first days after cracking the new tech. That's something CB shouldn't be able of even in this series - well, they wouldn't be able to even find enough weirdos for pilots. The three super powers wouldn't have such problems. They should have practically infinite production capabilities and an endless supply of decent pilots.

Actually I'm pretty sure they said in the show itself that it takes decades to fully develope a new line of mobile suits. So no the random earth based groups should have no ability to mass produce the gundam tech.

Hmm as for the above mention of how terrible Nyoro subs apparently are I guess I'll have to switch my archives around if they really are that off but it seems fairly hard to believe to me. I've been downloading some conclave releases depending on if they were released first or not and I certainly haven't seen such drastic translation differences but again that could be based on the episode.

Now assuming that the Conclave releases are correct and its pretty likely they are I find it moronic the Ptolemy uses the Gundams as a power supply. I mean if they can build the Gundams they should obviously be able to make a solar furnace for there own ship being that it runs on the particles they make. Simply put thats one of the most illogical and moronic things I've ever heard. On top of that one would assume they could have just made a Gundam that stays with the ship at all times to both keep it charged and you know DEFEND it considering it has no weapon systems.

well guess I'll get to changing over that archive shame Conclave releases are so stupidly large.

[masamuneehs]

Now assuming that the Conclave releases are correct and its pretty likely they are I find it moronic the Ptolemy uses the Gundams as a power supply. I mean if they can build the Gundams they should obviously be able to make a solar furnace for there own ship being that it runs on the particles they make. Simply put thats one of the most illogical and moronic things I've ever heard. On top of that one would assume they could have just made a Gundam that stays with the ship at all times to both keep it charged and you know DEFEND it considering it has no weapon systems.

Right, that's the problem. The Gundams need to put in work down on the ground, or wherever else they're needed. You might as well make another Gundam than build a solar furnace for a freaking ship that doesn't do anything (unless you just want it to be captured).

Like i said before, there really is no need for a flagship except to house Veda and Sumeragi. They can supply the Gundams without it, as we've seen, and communicate mission orders to them.

A Gundam purely to defend the ship is also an absurd waste of resources and further proves that having a flagship is just a bad idea in the first place.

[DDBen]

Right, that's the problem. The Gundams need to put in work down on the ground, or wherever else they're needed. You might as well make another Gundam than build a solar furnace for a freaking ship that doesn't do anything (unless you just want it to be captured).

Like i said before, there really is no need for a flagship except to house Veda and Sumeragi. They can supply the Gundams without it, as we've seen, and communicate mission orders to them.

A Gundam purely to defend the ship is also an absurd waste of resources and further proves that having a flagship is just a bad idea in the first place.

except in having the gundams come back to space to recharge the ship they are send in cargo containers why they are not maned making them extremely easy to capture. Thats a enourmous risk.

One would imagine if the ship had its own power supply they could at least give it some weapons to defend itself instead of a shield with a very finite amount of power.

Also a Gundam for defense would be more of a last resort the pilot doesn't have to be perfect for a unit that doesn't have to actively go seeking out combat. To find the ship period it cost absurd amounts of money because they had to use thousands of probes to do it and they still failed completely.

Also your correct there is no reason for the ship they have its certainly not a flagship its a transport. A flagship would be a active warship that thing only has shields and is clearly not needed in any way for the missions they have completed so far. It does provide a place to hide the gundams in space and repair/upgrade them at least. Still it seems moronic to have a Gundam repair bay that requires them transporting the Gundams in crates up one of three elevators controlled by the enemy.

[Kraco]

I fully agree. CB's hidden resources should be already spread pretty thin just building and maintaining the awesome mobile suits. By all logic they should be quite careful of how to use any extra production capabilities they might have. And like Masa said, I don't see any reason to invent them in useless endeavours.


Actually I'm pretty sure they said in the show itself that it takes decades to fully develope a new line of mobile suits. So no the random earth based groups should have no ability to mass produce the gundam tech.

Give me a break. It wouldn't take decades to develop a new fighter plane or attack helicopter today, if really needed. In fact, it didn't take even during WW2, and they didn't even have CAD back then, not to mention simulations. In the future of this series they should be able to use AI pretty far to get good designs ready in no time, and then CAM to get the work done fast. If they said somewhere in this series it takes decades then it was just propaganda to get prices higher, or peace time talks. But you can bet if they got their hands on the CB technology they wouldn't develop the new types on low budget. No, it would be quite a race with infinite budgets.

Edit: Fixed a logic error caused by an erroneous negative form.

[masamuneehs]

This is what Graham Acre thinks of your arguments:
http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/4013/1200682539393lt2.jpg

But, seriously, I know sending the Gundams back up into space without an escort is retarded as hell. I never said it wasn't. Don't blame that on the fact that the Ptolemaios needs to be recharged. That's like blaming the horse for the crappy horeshoes you bought.

to add yet another uselessness... the Ptolemaios doesn't go pick them up or anything like that, so...

And, finally, I know it's not really a 'flagship' in the sense of a fleet's flagship. But, in that it houses Sumeragi and Veda, it's at least a mobile command center, which, when coupled with other ships, would probably be called the flagship. Weapons aren't really an issue here.

[KrayZ33]

Give me a break. It wouldn't take decades to develop a new fighter plane or attack helicopter today, if really needed. In fact, it didn't take even during WW2, and they didn't even have CAD back then, not to mention simulations. In the future of this series they should be able to use AI pretty far to get good designs ready in no time, and then CAM to get the work done fast. If they said somewhere in this series it takes decades then it was just propaganda to get prices higher, or peace time talks. But you can bet if they got their hands on the CB technology they wouldn't develop the new types on low budget. No, it would be quite a race with infinite budgets.


you know how long it took from the very first aircrafts to the aircrafts we use now?
i don't think he was talking about small improvements like "stealth bomber type 1a" to "stealthbomber type 2.b" or something like that

we've got gundams here.. there isn't a mobile suit which is nearly as strong as exia etc.

so when a Flag from the AEU is for example a propeller driven aircraft, then a gundam is a F-22 Raptor.

but yes if the world gets its hands on one of the gundam then (after 3 years of study) they would probably be able to even improve these and/or to reproduce gundams..

[DDBen]

Give me a break. It wouldn't take decades to develop a new fighter plane or attack helicopter today, if really needed. In fact, it didn't take even during WW2, and they didn't even have CAD back then, not to mention simulations. In the future of this series they should be able to use AI pretty far to get good designs ready in no time, and then CAM to get the work done fast. If they said somewhere in this series it takes decades then it was just propaganda to get prices higher, or peace time talks. But you can bet if they got their hands on the CB technology they wouldn't develop the new types on low budget. No, it would be quite a race with infinite budgets.

Actually it does take that long to get a new aircraft into production heck why do you think the space program uses such out of date tech as well as our tanks. The overall fact is when you start developement of something you use the best tech available at that time as you go along you don't keep upgrading the Tech as you go along you stay with the outdated base because you know it will work in what you initially designed. Absolutely nothing in the current military uses todays best processors it uses a much much older base as thats what was available when the project was initially started.

Now don't get me wrong if they had any understanding of what they were looking at they could certainly use some very basic concepts to improve existing equipment but they couldn't turn around and mass produce anything this tech is decades ahead of anything they currently have and as such developing a way to produce and use that would not be a instant thing by any stretch of the imagination. As KrayZ33 said this isn't the basic difference of a slight advancement by any means your talking about starting over from scratch and building a Gundam and that wouldn't just happen overnight.

Now the only possible way for this to happen is if CB purposefully leaks them some plans on how to build a gundam but I don't really see that happening any time soon or if like they did in Gundam wing they have a OLD suit that they had nobody capable of using which they dig up and aim to complete that was designed by someone who disappeared in the past but that certainly isn't going to give them something they can turn around and make out of the blue.

I fully expect for those outside CB to eventually get more capable suits of some form capable of at least letting the pilots force the Meisters to get new suits as thats the formula but your blatantly wrong about what your stating here in a realistic setting. Money can't buy everything.

[Yukimura]

Kraco I think you're just full of Gundam haterade because you're starting to sound pretty contradictory. You keep talking about how in the future X,Y, and Z will be the different and therefore the super powers will be able to do things which we would think should be impossible today. Then you say that Celestial Being shouldn't be able to do things because you, looking at it from a 2008 perspective, think they would be impossible/impractical. How can you sit there and pick and choose what will change in the future and what won't? On the one hand you're saying the world of the future won't fit our current preconceptions and what was said in the show (mobile suit development cycles), but on the other hand it will still fit your preconceptions (capabilities of private organizations). Since no one knows what the future will actually holds and both sides are speculation, do you not find anything wrong with the fact that you're essentially trying to predict what will change about the world and what won't and make claims based on your predictions being accurate?

Plus you are willing rationalize away comments stated in the show when they don't meet with your assumptions, but then use others comments in the show to support your assumptions...

[Kraco]

Ho...

I never said the three super powers would build Gundams. I only said they would study the CB tech and adapt it to be used in new frames. We have already seen ace pilots can fight, to a degree, against the Gundams with their "basic" prototype suits. So, throw in a solar furnace (whatever that is) into such a prototype suit (plus the indestructible materials) and you would already have who knows how big a performance boost. And in the process they would probably learn how the CB can communicate despite the interference. This together with a whole fleet of new mobile suits, and they might beat the real Gundams.


Plus you are willing rationalize away comments stated in the show when they don't meet with your assumptions, but then use others comments in the show to support your assumptions...

Sorry about that. A basic fault, I know. Too bad my mind is built so that I try to see logic even where none is present.


You keep talking about how in the future X,Y, and Z will be the different and therefore the super powers will be able to do things which we would think should be impossible today. Then you say that Celestial Being shouldn't be able to do things because you, looking at it from a 2008 perspective, think they would be impossible/impractical.

We are talking about a terrorist organization and countries here. As far as I know the highest achievement of Al-Qaeda is a shoe bomb. They aren't attacking the West with fighter planes of their own, nor submarines of their own. However, the USA has pumped Iraq full of high tech weaponry to hunt down its enemies. That's the logical difference between a super power and a terrorist organization. Why it's the opposite in 00, who knows, but I'm just having difficulties believing it can be so, and thus I try to find holes in it.

EDit: And if I really was filled with hate, I wouldn't be watching this. I'm merely annoyed by some aspects of it. But it's true Gundams aren't meant for me. I should stick to my FMP...

[Yukimura]

Gundam 00 - 14 (1280x720 H264) - [Conclave-Mendoi] (http://bt.mymenclave.com/torrents/%5BConclave-Mendoi%5D_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_00_-_14_%5B1280x720_H.264_AAC%5D%5B24ECF523%5D.mkv.tor rent)
Gundam 00 - 14 (704x400 H264) - [Conclave-Mendoi] (http://bt.mymenclave.com/torrents/%5BConclave-Mendoi%5D_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_00_-_14_%5B704x400_H.264_AAC%5D%5BED42464A%5D.mkv.torr ent)
Gundam 00 - 14 (704x400 XviD) - [Conclave-Mendoi] (http://bt.mymenclave.com/torrents/%5BConclave-Mendoi%5D_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_00_-_14_%5B704x400_XviD_MP3%5D%5B43C1B085%5D.avi.torre nt)


We got the manga and have some official names so the last names of some characters might be different :)