inane 230 out

[Sidnne]

Alright Hotsuma, here's my response to what you've been saying in both this and the raw thread. You say all this powering up and usage of alternate power sources is very dbz-like, and you don't like it. You also you say you'd rather see inventive and cleaver fighting as has been the staple of the series from the get go. Well, let me ask you this: how clever and inventive can you possibly get by staying at the same power level? Ingeniuty can only take you so far if you don't become stronger. Naruto would never have beaten gaara if it wasn't for the summoning technique he learned, regardless of his cleverness. Same thing if he's put up against someone like a jounin, ingeniuty won't be enough for Naruto to succeed at this level. So "powering up" is a necessity. The extra power when coupled with ingeniuty (how many times have I said this word already?) will make for far more interesting fights then we've gotten to see so far.

I'm going to have to disagree here. Like Hotsuma said, Naruto can still increase his strength without powering up. He can do it through training, experience, and learning new jutsus.

If you look at the really great shinobi in the series, the jounins, hokage, and sannin. They are all the most skilled and powerful ninja in the series, yet none of them require transformations or power ups to be great. They are all great because of their talent as ninja. Will we never see Jiraiya or Kakashi transforming to win a battle.

Don't get me wrong, it was cool to see Naruto go beserk against Haku and the first transformation agaisnt Sasuke. To me that was Kishimoto telling us Naruto is pissed as hell and ready to kick some ass. But this second transformation is overdoing it IMO.

Also, something that bothered me about this chapter. I loved seeing the sharingan in action and getting look at what user sees. But would the the fully developed sharingan really make Sasuke that much stronger? And by stronger, I mean physical strength, not powerful. I can understand that it allowed him to follow and predict Naruto's movements, but at best, it should have only allowed Sasuke to dodge Naruto's attacks. Having the 3rd doujutsu should not have allowed Sasuke to drop Naruto in only 2 hits. His attacks should not have done that much damage to Naruto if in 229, Naruto defelcted Sasuke's katon with just chakra.

I'm sorta rambling now, but you get the idea.

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Sidnne
Also, something that bothered me about this chapter. I loved seeing the sharingan in action and getting look at what user sees. But would the the fully developed sharingan really make Sasuke that much stronger? And by stronger, I mean physical strength, not powerful. I can understand that it allowed him to follow and predict Naruto's movements, but at best, it should have only allowed Sasuke to dodge Naruto's attacks. Having the 3rd doujutsu should not have allowed Sasuke to drop Naruto in only 2 hits. His attacks should not have done that much damage to Naruto if in 229, Naruto defelcted Sasuke's katon with just chakra.

the 3rd comma did not increase sasuke's strength. all it did was give tremendous insight and movement predictability which resulted in naruto being caught off guard cuz sasuke was able to hit naruto before naruto could even get an attack off. when you're caught off guard like that, it's same as getting hit without knowing it's coming.

[chet_chetty]

In the Haku fight, if Naruto was able to deflect ice spears (or kunai, cant remember) with chakra at a subconscious level, there's no reason why the same shouldnt happen when Sasuke is about to land a punch on him. If his Kyuubi powers were consistent (seems to be more of a storyline inconsistency), it shouldnt matter that Naruto didnt see the punch coming.

And Sidnne is right, Sasuke's taijutsu shouldnt even phase Naruto let alone require Kyuubi to transform him so he can stay in the fight. The only thing different about Sasuke is the third comma. As mentioned earlier he didnt get physically stronger so how ridiculous is it that Naruto got rocked so hard?

It seems like they're dumbing down Kyuubi Naruto for storyline's sake so Sasuke can go even w/ Naruto for most of the fight.

[GotwootNewbie]

This chapter leads me to believe that Naruto is in fact related to the 4th somehow (most likely father and son). That old thoery seems much more logical now and the sharingan seems to be greatly influenced by ones emotions.

Also I don't see any random power ups...
Nine tail doesn't want to die and Sasuke is developing. Sigh why is he so stupid? Why doesn't he realize his sharingan just developed because he isn't using his stupid curse.

[XwingRob]

Originally posted by: basey_69
what mother theory?

Well you see in Japanese mythology there are tales where the Nine Tailed Fox Demon would sometime transform as a princess or something.
Now just modify it a little bit and you have the mother theory of Naruto.(Eg. Kyuubi was orignally a woman that had the demon fox sealed inside of her...but the birth of Naruto caused the seal to break, or some other modification)

That is a heavy assumption though..unless Kishimoto is counting on everyone forgeting that certain tale in Japan. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[Badmamajama]

Ok I'm sorry but the people who are complaining about Hotsuma's comments are completely in the wrong. This thread is for us to discuss the current chapter. If Hotsuma wants to make a comment about how he had some problems with the current arc by comparing it to DBZ then he can. That is in no way taking this discussion off topic. Frankly a lot of people here come off like a bunch of fanboys who can't stand to possibly there is a flaw to this manga and its kinda annoying when people make intelligent comments only to have a bunch of idiots flame them.

Well now that I've gotten that off my chest I'd like to say that I mostly agree with Hotsuma on these last few chapters. It's not that I mind power ups but not if they are used in the way they are currently being used. So far all this fight has been is Sasuke totally beats Naruto, Naruto powers up and totally beats Sasuke, Sasuke powers and totally beats Naruto and then finally Naruto powers up again. It's like some really lame tennis match that just goes back and forth. Now all of this stuff can come off really well if this is only the build up to the main fight where finally Sasuke and Naruto have reached the limit of there powers and do some interesting stuff. Right now it can go either way, this can either be the prettiest yet lamest fight we've scene or it can end up being the prettiest and best fight we've seen.

The Sharingan part was extremely well done though I will give this chapter that. Also for all you out there who think Sasuke taking Naruto down that quickly is unrealistic you do have to realize that most real fights don't last that long so two hits is a lot and let's not forget that if I'm moving forward to do a punch but you punch as I'm moving forward I pretty much move into your punch making the blow that much more powerful, which is what Sasuke was doing, he's just using good timing. That's what I always liked and Kishimoto's fight scenes is that they always had good fight mechanics (well except for the whole tennis match thing that this fight is turning into, that's just horrible)

[Souryusen]

For those of you thinking that Sasuke has beaten Naruto in 2 blows... read the sound effects in the inane version. The focus moves skyward and there are sounds from below indicating "various thumps and thuds."

Sounds like Sasuke took a little time to own Naruto's shit, actually.

[Stoopider]

Going to need to push Sasuke to level 2 absolutely.

[Eurasian]

the whole kyubi will take over naruto thing, i disagree. naruto seems to be in control. i guess it seems that way because kyubi gives him power surges but naruto will go back normal at the end of the battle.

every story in shonen jump involves leveling up. dbz and naruto r similar on that level. but story wise, nah, no comparisons.

[Hotsuma]

Originally posted by: Death BOO Z

and sorry for reviving this argument, but hotsuma, you say your favorite fighting anime is YYH, doesn't it a bit contradicitng to the fact you hate pointless power ups? there wasn't a 'smart' battle in this anime for years... about everything in YYH is 'look at his big reiki!' or 'your amount of reiki isn't enough to beat me!'...

Well, I haven't seen the entire anime, truthfully. The last big thing to happen was around the Toguro saga. And up until the end of that, the battles have been creative. Not just a big slug fest with transformations, and powers coming up out of nowhere. The characters in YYH, at least trained to become that strong, other than relying on gimmicks.

[dbesing]

naruto was blacking out completely, it was getting dark around kyubi again so kyubi took over naruto will most likely gain control at the last minute the seal on naruto didn't even break or start to break, its just the fact kyubi has mental and physical control and is pouring out his power, but no seal breakin i'm sure they woulda shown sumfin or maybe thats in next times hmm that could be

[kAi]

i liked this chapter, liked how it has been brought about...
i think we needed these powerups now during this fight...its important for these characters...he hasnt been kyubi-naruto in a while, i dont think its a bad thing...rather a good thing, as the characters are growing up through this mission,

[Jman]

this chapter kicked ass. as usual we're left to wait with suspense but that's ok. can only wonder what's gonna happen next week.

[Gods_Son]

Another Kyubi awakening, how exciting...

[Guy]

My theory on the next chapters is that sasuke will realise that his sharingan holds more power than the curse seals could give him because after all Itachi doesnt have one and Im sure he would own the sound four. Sasuke and Naruto with beat the info about where Itachi meets from orochimaru and kabuto and then go for them.

[Cryogen]

Another sarcastic remark on the interweb, how exciting...

Still, I kind of agree. Less power fighting, more clever fighting.

[Alu]

Instead of how you are looking at it, I look at it like this.

The more kyubi chakra that is used, the faster he will get used to it. The faster he gets used to it, the faster the two chakras merge.
Kyubi cannot do anything but leak chakra behind the bars. Anything else has yet to be proven. We've seen naruto go berserk with the chakra, but the kyubi is far from berserk. Narutos just not at the ability to handle the power hes recieving.


Also, I think once the fourth had Kyubi sealed in him. It would make sense then for Kyubi to know the fourth.

[empT3]

I'm Agreed with Alu on the assumption that kyubi was once sealed in inside the fourth, if you recall a lot of the jounnins and even the hokage was kinda butthurt over Naruto using Kyubi powers because that meant that the seal was weakening. I think that someone will probably be telling Naruto soon that he'll have to find some ways of keeping kyubi under control. It would probably be boring and kinda lame if they told him that he couldn't use it because naruto really doesn't have too much control over it. Or perhaps I'm incredibly wrong and we're going to see some kyubi/naruto superbeing later on in the series.

[obake]

Aw man! Did I call it or what! Posted this on 9/4.

Originally posted by: obake
I dunno, it's gonna be hard to tell how it's going to turn out. I think Kakashi is going to get there, but not in time to prevent whatever is going to happen.

SPECULATION:

Perhaps the fight will escalate so much that the seal on the Kyuubi will be broken and it'll be freed. The seal weakens whenever Naruto goes all kyuubi-like, so if he "kicks it up a notch," it might unravel completely.

Not 100% accurate, but damned close. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

[?igma]

oh yeah..ehm..I neevr come here, but this Manga chapter was very interesting nad..how ever much you people believe it has nothing to do with DBZ and I quote:

Shonen Jump Question:
Ive heard that you where a huge fan of Akira Toriyamas "Dragon Ball" and "Dr. Slump". What was your favorite storyline of Dragon Ball? Or, if you prefer, who was your favorite character?
Masashi Kishimoto Answer:
I love all the stories up until the first appearance of Frieza. My favorite character is Kuririn, because he has the most "human" feel, and I really associate myself with him.

People that "love"DBZ up to the Freeza saga ..well.. are already influanced beyond human reach..