Sasuke vs. Naruto

[?igma]

Originally posted by: wirm
Because this matchup is hypothetical and not in the series (as far as I know) then the standard rules of "Naruto always wins because of blah blah blah" don't apply.

Here are some points that I'd like to make:

1) Sasuke is MUCH smarter than Naruto. I don't care how tricky Naruto has been in the past, the guy's got the intelligence of a brick.

2) Sasuke is MUCh faster than Naruto.

3) Naruto has no way of blocking the Chidori. He doesn't have sand to protect him, he's not fast enough to dodge, and unlike Itachi, any attempt at grabbing Sasuke's hand would just be amusing.

4) Naruto's victory against Kabuto was luck. There could have been any number of ways that Kabuto could have gotten away, but he didn't. Kabuto's not the kind of guy who hesitates or makes many mistakes.

I believe that he took the rasengan on purpose to guage it's strength. An example of this happening before would be when he took Dosu's attack right before the chuunin exam. Plus, he thought he could heal his way out anyway.

On what do you base your points ? Naruto is , maybe instinctively, but still so, way smarter, there has not been 1!!!! example of Sasuke being smart!~!!!??

And maybe you didnt notice, but blocking chidori isnt really needed, because he could just dodge the damn thing. Sasuke is a real expert at slowly creating a chidori, its not asif he does it in 1 second or some. Naruto got lots of time to prep a couple thousand clones and then just build up some chidori's on each one of them.

[RoGG]

Originally posted by: DB_Hunter

Originally posted by: RoGG
So you claim that Sasuke could win when Naruto unleash all hells using the Nine Tail chakra?
Gaara, Neji and to some extent Kabuto have fallen to Naruto. Who have fallen to Sasuke?

First of the only person Sasuke has fought of any importance lately is Gaara, and Naruto beat him because of Gamabunta. Gamabunta would be usless against Sasuke, as I have explained before.

As for Naruto unleashing Kyuubi hell, all Naruto can do using Kyuubi chakra is summon Gamabunta and increase him speed as he did aginst Neji. Sasuke is way faster than Neji, and just as Neji could see Naruto with his Byakugan, Sasuke could see him with his Sharingan. Sasuke would be able to match Naruto at Kyuubi speed easily, and if he uses chidori at that speed well then it's good night Naruto.

Perhaps you didn't notice but Naruto fought pretty evenly for a while against Gaara without Gamabunta and managed to damage him. This Sasuke failed to do. It wasn't until Gaara turned completely that Naruto summoned Gamabunta.

Also I don't think that Gamabunta would be useless against Sasuke, it's just a matter of terrain.

Let's say Naruto would just half turn to the Nine Tails in a similiar way as Gaara did. If the fight had to be brought to that level, how could a mere human child with sharingan compete with Nine Tails? Seriously, this is ridiculous.

[Merezz]

ok as for the whole "naruto can't beat kakashi you're a n00b for saying that".. Well - i'm pretty sure this isn't a video game so i can't be a "n00b" at having an oppinion, and secondly, there is no reason to say Naruto is the main character so he can beat anyone. Lets look at the facts here. Kakashi and Kabuto are obviously more skilled than Naruto that isn't even a thought. BUT, Naruto has much more potential than both Kakashi and Kabuto - this should not even be an argument, because of his willpower, and raw power capabilities. It is only a matter of time before Naruto gains more basic skill than Sasuke. Sure Sasuke got most intelligent in his class or whatever, but that doesn't determine crap. Naruto has gained so much more actual experience in battle than sasuke has, and not only that, but Sasuke has been sleeping for such a long time that Naruto MUST have gained some edge on him in chakra control. You guys are all forgeting that Rasengan was a technique that Jiraya taught Naruto to test his control of Chakra, even though Naruto had to develop a new way of doing it, he still MASTERED the skill in a matter of a week. The forth took much much MUCH more time than that to master the technique. Sasuke took more time to master a skill of less power (a month without showing, and was even late to the fight).

Anyway, chill on the flames.. if you don't have a response to the question besides saying something like "you're stupid go away hahahha omg i'm 1337, i am teh pwn" then don't say anything at all.

[uhicha neji]

Naruto would hand Saskue his ass on a nice silver platter. First off, the development stage has drastically changed since there training in the forest (when they were running up trees) Naruto has become more powerful while Saskue lingers.

Secondly look who's training Naruto. A Sannin. He can now pass on all the technique's he has learned from the Third. Saskue does have Kakashi, but he is no Sannin. Let's look at the technique's Naruto now has mastered because of Jiraiya. He can summon the Frog boss Gambunta, and has recently learned the Rasengan. IMO; the Rasengan is more powerful than the Chidori. Saskue has learned what ? The chidori and that's it from Kakashi. I think Kakashi will train Saskue on how to properly use the Sharingan now.

This is a no contest fight. Naruto wins easily.

[wirm]

Originally posted by: ?igma

Originally posted by: wirm
Because this matchup is hypothetical and not in the series (as far as I know) then the standard rules of "Naruto always wins because of blah blah blah" don't apply.

Here are some points that I'd like to make:

1) Sasuke is MUCH smarter than Naruto. I don't care how tricky Naruto has been in the past, the guy's got the intelligence of a brick.

2) Sasuke is MUCh faster than Naruto.

3) Naruto has no way of blocking the Chidori. He doesn't have sand to protect him, he's not fast enough to dodge, and unlike Itachi, any attempt at grabbing Sasuke's hand would just be amusing.

4) Naruto's victory against Kabuto was luck. There could have been any number of ways that Kabuto could have gotten away, but he didn't. Kabuto's not the kind of guy who hesitates or makes many mistakes.

I believe that he took the rasengan on purpose to guage it's strength. An example of this happening before would be when he took Dosu's attack right before the chuunin exam. Plus, he thought he could heal his way out anyway.

On what do you base your points ? Naruto is , maybe instinctively, but still so, way smarter, there has not been 1!!!! example of Sasuke being smart!~!!!??

And maybe you didnt notice, but blocking chidori isnt really needed, because he could just dodge the damn thing. Sasuke is a real expert at slowly creating a chidori, its not asif he does it in 1 second or some. Naruto got lots of time to prep a couple thousand clones and then just build up some chidori's on each one of them.

Did you completely skip the first 40 episodes of the anime? Naruto is a moron. He can't seem to do anything right without a lot of trial and error. Emphasis on error. I'm not a big fan of Sasuke, but the guy was consistantly outshining Naruto in everything they've tried together (with the exception of tree-climbing, which was pretty even).

For one thing, I don't think we need to argue that Naruto's book smarts aren't exactly top-notch. Every subject that's been brought up has had to be explained to him by Sakura, Kakashi, or some other character. This includes advanced bloodlines, the chakra circulatory system, and even chakra in general.

Sasuke demonstrate his intelligence (I'm not saying he's super smart, but at least smarter than the average rock, which is more than I can say for Naruto) in many situations. This includes his dealing with the entrance to the chuunin exam sign-ups, the fake Narutos in the chuunin exam, his paranoid, but completely justified precautions during said exam, his dealing with rogue ninjas in the second Naruto special, and any number of other small factors spaced throughout the series. Also, there is a reason why he graduated at the top of his class. I'm sure that this fact was not just thrown into the anime to annoy Naruto.


As for dodging the chidori, maybe you didn't realize the tremendous difference in speed between the two of them. If there's going to be any dodging, it's not going to come from Naruto. Hell, I can't think of a single time in the series when Naruto actually dodged anything (I'm sure I could think of something with a little time to think, but it's elusive).

Neji didn't have any trouble kicking the crap out of all the kage bunshins, and Sasuke is considerably faster. Hell, with his speed, Sasuke doesn't even need the chidori.

Also, everyone's bringing up the Kyuubi. Naruto seems to have trouble gathering that power without first getting his ass handed back to him for most of the episode (or more than one episode). The same goes for summoning and the rasengan. He's been luck so far in that the enemy has always just toyed with him. If someone just stuck a knife in him right away, we wouldn't have to worry about any of his killer moves.


As for the healing factor. This also has been demonstrated to be useless if there is massive trauma to the heart (as Kabuto explained). A simple kunai (or chidori) to the chest would end the fight immediately.

About the monstrous strength that Naruto gets with Kyuubi, maybe you don't remember when he used it against Orochimaru. That fight lasted about 10 seconds when Oro busted out his tongue and just lifted Naruto up. Naruto is not invincible when he's powered up. He's just tougher. This is also demonstrated hin his head-on collision with Neji's kaiten. Both of them took a lot of damage there.


I'm not professing to be an expert or anything, but I'm willing to debate on any particular points you bring up. I'm also not saying that Sasuke is in any way better than Naruto, just that if they fought, my money would be on the Uchiha.

================================================== ==============


Let's not talk about who's got a better teacher right now. Sure, Jiraiya is probably better than Kakashi. This doesn't mean anything at the moment, because he's only taught Naruto summoning and the rasengan. Naruto is inconsistant at best with either of these. In fact, he's only been successful on maybe 1% of his attempts.

If your argument is that eventually Naruto will be better, then I agree 100%. But not now.

[Assertn]

dodging chidori is right out of the question......
the only way someone can dodge a chidori attack is if they are
A) faster than them or
B) has a better sharingan than them

the point of the chidori, is its a full head-on attack that relies on the sharingan for quick adjustments based on whatever the enemy is doing.
If naruto tries to move to the side, sasuke can easily see it with his sharingan.

[CUE]

Cmon. If a really dumb person, someone I didn't expect to grab my right hand, grabs it. I wouldn't stand there, staring at him for that long. These guys are supposed to have years and years of experience in some such situations. I don't believe he would stand there, stunned, waiting for some kid to shove a giant blue ball in my stomache.

That was just stupid.

[DeluxSkillz]

so what is the conclusion i already stated 2 pages back or so, sasuke would win if naruto didn't have the kyubi, the only way naruto is gonna die is when kishimoto wants him to die and as explained the main hero can not die without the story ending so sasuke will get his ass kicked and handed to him, it's very unfair but sasuke fans will have to deal with it sasuke will never win in a fight against naruto period

[Natural Cause]

Originally posted by: DeluxSkillz
this is just stupid NARUTO WINS BECAUSE OF KYUBI, SKILL WISE SASUKE WINS how is naruto gonna lose when every time he is out of chakra he gets an infinite amount back plus he's the MAIN character so there is no way sasuke will ever beat him just close this thread, naruto hitting kabuto with his rasengan has already been discussed to death

your a complete edit, remember in the chunnin exam, when naruto had the seal on him thus he was unable to use the chakra from kyubi, he won Vs that guy with his dog.

stop posting cos your making urself look like an idiot

[DeluxSkillz]

Originally posted by: Natural Cause

Originally posted by: DeluxSkillz
this is just stupid NARUTO WINS BECAUSE OF KYUBI, SKILL WISE SASUKE WINS how is naruto gonna lose when every time he is out of chakra he gets an infinite amount back plus he's the MAIN character so there is no way sasuke will ever beat him just close this thread, naruto hitting kabuto with his rasengan has already been discussed to death

your a complete edit, remember in the chunnin exam, when naruto had the seal on him thus he was unable to use the chakra from kyubi, he won Vs that guy with his dog.

stop posting cos your making urself look like an idiot

so he won against kiba what does that say that even without kyubi chakra somehow naruto won that battle of course there's where the main character shit comes in he won because he was the main character you're a moron don't insult me when you only got here to do so it's your first EDIT post, if you actually pay attention to what i said you would't have opened your mouth, you see conveniently jiraiya appears before the naruto vs neji fight and removes the seal naruto is obviously losing the fight and what happens the kyubi's chakra blows open his chakra holes and lets him win this battle so why does my statement make me a complete edit?

it's very obvious that naruto will win practically any battle just because he has the power of the kyubi you can jump high and low but a fact is a fact every time it seems like naruto is losing the kyubi pops up and shares some of his chakra with him, now in the worst case scenario naruto gets blown to pieces what happens kyubi regenerates naruto's body breaks lose and kills everybody around....now if naruto was to be matched up against sasuke without the kyubi powers he would LOSE because naruto is in no way as skilled as sasuke is but to bring all of you back to reality the Kyubi does excist and it will pump chakra to naruto when he's about to lose so he will always win

[Natural Cause]

Originally posted by: DeluxSkillz

Originally posted by: Natural Cause

Originally posted by: DeluxSkillz
this is just stupid NARUTO WINS BECAUSE OF KYUBI, SKILL WISE SASUKE WINS how is naruto gonna lose when every time he is out of chakra he gets an infinite amount back plus he's the MAIN character so there is no way sasuke will ever beat him just close this thread, naruto hitting kabuto with his rasengan has already been discussed to death

your a complete edit, remember in the chunnin exam, when naruto had the seal on him thus he was unable to use the chakra from kyubi, he won Vs that guy with his dog.

stop posting cos your making urself look like an idiot

so he won against kiba what does that say that even without kyubi chakra somehow naruto won that battle of course there's where the main character shit comes in he won because he was the main character you're a moron don't insult me when you only got here to do so it's your first EDIT post, if you actually pay attention to what i said you would't have opened your mouth, you see conveniently jiraiya appears before the naruto vs neji fight and removes the seal naruto is obviously losing the fight and what happens the kyubi's chakra blows open his chakra holes and lets him win this battle so why does my statement make me a complete edit?

it's very obvious that naruto will win practically any battle just because he has the power of the kyubi you can jump high and low but a fact is a fact every time it seems like naruto is losing the kyubi pops up and shares some of his chakra with him, now in the worst case scenario naruto gets blown to pieces what happens kyubi regenerates naruto's body breaks lose and kills everybody around....now if naruto was to be matched up against sasuke without the kyubi powers he would LOSE because naruto is in no way as skilled as sasuke is but to bring all of you back to reality the Kyubi does excist and it will pump chakra to naruto when he's about to lose so he will always win

that reply just made you look like a bigger dumb ass. first of all ive been reading these forums for months or so now. i just never post despite the amount of fuckwits here. some posts are actually worth reading. but you stated. and ill quote it again

Originally posted by: DeluxSkillz
this is just stupid NARUTO WINS BECAUSE OF KYUBI

we are not talking about the fight between naruto and neji. and we all know jiraiya didn;t APPEAR, he was already in the village "gathering infomation" and narto bumped into him. if he appeared there would have been a cloud of smoke and 3 episodes of talking.

please do yourself a favour and put a bullet in ur head cos your honest to god a complete dumbass

[uhicha neji]

People seem to be forgetting the episode where Saskue recaps in his mind Naruto and Gaara's battle. He says so himself that Naruto keeps getting stronger, and that he fears he won't

Naruto would win. Period. Saskue is smart, and fast but he cannot withstand both Nartuo technical power and endurance.

[DeluxSkillz]

your the dumbass here kiba is obviously a character you can forget about he was weak if he could be defeated by naruto without kyubi power he isn't even worth talking about, so are you gonna prove me wrong that naruto isn't cpable of defeating all his opponents because of the kyubi because if you can please do so...if naruto uses all of kyubis powers he can beat anyone...the subject was naruto vs sasuke so i stated naruto wins because of kyubi which is a fact so what are you gonna tell me that sasuke can beat the kyubi's chakra?

[frexeze]

mm naruto doesnt get infinite amt of chakra

he used kyuubi chakra once against gaara then they said both he and gaara were out of chakra [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]

[DeluxSkillz]

if he was about to die kyubi would've shot another blast of chakra trough his body so what you said doesn't make sense, some things the characters say can be taken serious and some can't do you think the kyubi is gonna stand by and let his container die? if the container dies he dies no way in hell if i was the kyuubi would i let that happen even if i had to push all of my chakra out of him

[HotSauce]

This is why i said "close this thread"

[Merezz]

"if he was about to die kyubi would've shot another blast of chakra trough his body so what you said doesn't make sense, some things the characters say can be taken serious and some can't do you think the kyubi is gonna stand by and let his container die?"

you're basing your response on an oppinion, yet acting out as if it was a fact. We do not know if Kyubi chakra is infinate or not. that's my first point
Second of all, you say that because Naruto beat someone without using Kyubi he's automatically weak? That's the most moronic thing i've ever heard. Throwing all this main character bullshit out the window because obviously you don't think about that in an argument, i didn't go to see the movie Rocky because i knew rocky was going to win since the movie was named after him. That's not always how things work first of all. Sasuke is just not as powerful as Naruto as the show currently stands. My reasons for this?
1. Sasuke has the sharingan, BUT does not even know how to use it to it's full potential at his current state, there for giving him only a minor edge on Naruto (taking into consideration Naruto's advantages of having Kyubi in him at the same time)

2. Naruto's willpower is FAR greater than Sasuke. Sasuke's only reason for being a ninja it seems is to kill his brother, it's what makes him tick, it is his entire world. when fighting Naruto, do you not think that Sasuke will be thinking of how he must live to kill his brother? because he's an "avenger" he has a strong desire, but when in the face of danger, Sasuke is too "smart" as some of you said to go head on with it. This could give him an edge, but the fact that he doesn't know how Naruto would react in certain situations he can't make any quick judgements, which would give him a disadvantage.

3. Someone said that Naruto's regeneration power wouldn't help. If you remember correctly, Kabuto told Tsunade that Naruto wouldn't be able to move or do anything at all because his heart was destroyed. Shortly after that was said she started to cry and a tear landed on his chest, it then flashed over to a scene with Kyubi growling or whatever and naruto began to flinch a bit again, showing that he was ALREADY beginning to regenerate from what would otherwise be a fatal attack.

4. Stop living in the shows past, Naruto was a stupid ass, he did bad in school, he jumped to conclusions and caused problems for the team. But if you haven't noticed lately, naruto isn't even part of that team (at least for the last 10-20 episodes) You can say it's because Kakashi wanted to train sasuke alone (and yes this is true, but only because of his sharingan) One could make the argument that Kakashi isn't good enough to teach Naruto anymore because of such a difference in personalities, where as Naruto is a perfect fit for Jiraiya, making his training move faster. Don't say shit like "sasuke is better at chakra control" cause that's not true. sasuke WAS better at chakra control, but did you miss the entire point of how Rasengan is a highly developed chakra control technique... which is WHY Naruto learned it.

[Natural Cause]

Originally posted by: DeluxSkillz
your the dumbass here kiba is obviously a character you can forget about he was weak if he could be defeated by naruto without kyubi power he isn't even worth talking about, so are you gonna prove me wrong that naruto isn't cpable of defeating all his opponents because of the kyubi because if you can please do so...if naruto uses all of kyubis powers he can beat anyone...the subject was naruto vs sasuke so i stated naruto wins because of kyubi which is a fact so what are you gonna tell me that sasuke can beat the kyubi's chakra?

well in all the fights when naruto used the chakra of kyubi, it was shown but during the fight vs Kabuto we did not see naruto use the power of kyubi so whats to say he used it? remember he has 2 types of chakra, his own, which he uses 100% of when he uses resegan(sp?) and when he uses all of his chakra he uses the chakra of kyubi, so now, again i quote you

Originally posted by: DeluxSkillz
this is just stupid NARUTO WINS BECAUSE OF KYUBI

naruto won against Kabuto, without using kyubi
naruto won against the dog fella, without using kyubi.

now kabuto is ment to be equal with kakashi, so what your saying is that even tho naruto will not win against kakashi (without kyubi)
but can win against Kabuto (without kyubi)
naruto stands a good chance of winning vs kakashi (with kyubi)

ur comment about naruto winning because of kyubi was stupid and thus ur stupid.

[DB_Hunter]

Look of course Naruto has improved since the whole Chunnin exam started but that doesn't mean he is better than Sasuke... he was so far behind to start with! Don't get me wrong, I'm not a Sasuke fan boy I'm just trying to come out with a rational conclusion. Obviously Naruto will eventually be better than Sasuke... that's why the show is called Naruto and not Sasuke.

As for him defeating Kiba without Kyuubi, Kiba was an unheard of fighter skill wise, he only managed to get pumped up using a food pill if I can remember (or he gave it to Akamaru). If Naruto didn't beat him he might as well start sparring with Udon to improve.

And Naruto hasn't mastered the Rasengan and his chakra control is still crap, that's why he has to do it using two hands. If his chakra control was good he would just use one hand, like Jiraiya does. Personally I don't see why Sasuke wouldn't be able to copy it with his Sharingan, unless it requires alot of stamina to do in which case Sasuke won't be able to do it.

Also remember the Rasengan itself takes a few seconds to actually start damaging the opponent, unlike Chidori which is lethal as soon as it touches you.

The fact that a Sanin is teaching Naruto means nothing, it's Naruto who is going to fight at the end of the day not Jiraiya. For all you know Kakashi could be more skilled than Jiraiya its just that Jiraiya had naturally a greater chakra capacity than Kakashi (Just saying hypothetically). It's just like (Ok no one kill me here lol) the case between Sasuke and Sakura... there is no contest as to who would win in a fight between them but Sakura has better chakra control than Sasuke, she could potentially be a better teacher than him because she knows how to control chakra better and hence could provide more detail (sorry off topic I know).

Edit: Merezz - Your point 3.... come on! Kyuubi was like 'Eh??? What's goin on????' not like 'Bwahahahaaaa another minor attempt at trying to kill me!'. It was Tsunade that healed Naruto, not Kyuubi.

[Raposo_C]

OK, i have not even reached the 4th page because i wanted to see how long i can go before this topic tries my patience. I understand I am the new guy around, but since i can't work at my pic of kakashi or my character since this pc has none of my files, and my bro is using the laptop to watch a DVD i decided i would see what everyone seems to be discusing.

1) I found it funny that anyone would consider just because Naruto got a lucky shot on Kabuto he is officialyl equal to Kabuto or Kakashi ... this has been discused already in this convo to death, expecially since Kagemane_no_Jutsu first post kinda answered all of that. I didn't understand why that topic never stopped there but hey *shrugs* it was funny to read the other ideas.

2) Sasuke VS Naruto - this is kinda of being balanced on a knifes edge, or however the saying goes. My opinion is, Sasuke would win in a match against Naruto, not Kyubbi, remember, Kyubbi's chakra isn't natural. Naruto wasn't born with it so stop talking about that, its an unfair advantage in the whole series, and he can't control it worth a shit. The reason Sasuke would win is simple, he is not as strong in chakra, or physically, but Sasuke is faster, more agile, he can think more clearly - not as well as Shikamaru but well enough - and lets not forget, he has fought side by side with Naruto enough times to know most of his techniques, and how he thinks. The only reason Naruto win's each battle is because yes he is the main character, but go beyond that, don't say, just because he is a main character he lives forever, I say, try and think as each character, each genin and each chunin are sort of equal in standards to the Naruto in respect as a character, then go from there. He beat Naji because Naji underestimated him, Sasuke dosen't.

3) I believe someone put Sasuke is a pussy, hmm, let me see, the guy thinks his soul reason for living is to kill Itachi, think about that for a moment ... to me it seems that there trying to tell us that the reason he falls apart is because of that, Sasuke believes he can only live so live so he can kill Itachi, nothing else, and by him seeing his own death, he freaks out. He is the last of the Uchia's, and to him with his death, he believes his bloodline and clan dies with him.

Now, I am not trynig to be an ass and demand someone to shut this thread, personnaly its not all that bad, but atleast consider that much and be civil about it. I am just stating my opinon, and I don't wan't to be seen as an ass.

Oh, and btw, if anyone has seen ep 98, when Tsunade was talking to Kakashi, was I the only one that felt sorry for the guy, like common, he's fighting against an S-type Ninja, and a master of Sharengen ... lol though it was funny to see him so submissive.

Anyway, peace guys, and keep her civil, and I wish my bro gets off my laptop so I can finish Kakashi ... I have basically forgot about my own character because of that drawing lol.