Iraq War

[chambers]

didnt they get their own country? and look what that did now, israel and palestine on the news every single day.

well who the hell are you tlaking abotu you fuckin moron? sounds like jews to me.

also america isnt the be all and end all of the world you guys know, europe in terms of technology, army size, navy size, airforce size AND experince in ALL kind of battles europe comes out on top. i know it isnt a country but you could not nuke germany with out the whole of europe with the exception of probly the UK doing something about it. also MANY MANY countrys have nukes now, its not like the US is alone there any more, one nuke in fort knox (bad sp maybe?) and america would be wasted utterly and truley, no other country relys on the gold they have (heck no other country HAS that gold for a start lol) for almost everything they do.

[Mut]

dude, that's completely unfair. why are you trying to create a scenario where a country has to fight a whole continent?

[SK]

what the hell is chambers talking about now? chambers your the fuckin moron, what the guy said was where he came from 6 million jews were murdered and they didnt get any condolensces or ask for any. so yeah i reffered to some european jews as they, like i said if you had read the above posts then you would had known what i was talking about. but instead you have to act like an ignorant dickhead and try to start a debate about me calling the european jews who settled in israel after WWII as they. big deal i called them they, why are you so offended?

and um...whats the point of your europe vs usa comments? oh i know, its your nature as an idiot to write stupid bs like that to try and stir up trouble.

[FearTheMullet]

Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
the reason why there's never a fight on our turf is cause everyone else is afraid to attack us directly....
so if we're pussies, then what word would describe THOSE people? geez do you always contradict yourself in your statements?

Originally posted by: FearTheMullet
They dont perfer Saddams tyranny, but they sure as hell dont want Americas

you were right up until that comma, im afraid....for it seems they do in fact want a democratic government

as for your obviously exaggerrated opinions about hundreds of millions of people.....nice attempt on your stereotyping, but it seems even people who dont live in america are calling you a dumbass......so i suggest you go find some other activity to play with, rather than making a fool of yourself within the safe confines of your little computer desk......your mullet has "tree hugging hippie" written all over it [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

i think the thing that surprises me most, is that it seems you're from germany....and before us an our allies intervened, your government was killing millions of your people, as you had mentioned yourself........
yet.....you.....DO have a problem with outsiders helping to free a country from its government? I think you better take a look in the mirror at the face that might not exist if it wasnt for our country

I am from Poland. Not Germany. Close but no cigar. And Iraq is far form free. If you read the rest of what I put, you might have caught the part about the difference in culture. Like I said, it'll never work. Iraq, a country which has been imprisoned by a dictator will not become democratic in one year jsut because America thinks they can do it. It's impossible.

I never said they didnt want, or wont desire a democratic way of life. But a democratic way of life can not be pushed upon them by America invading them. This isn't like when Germany had a Democratic puppet government installed. They have been living for hundreds of years in a different culture with religious fanatacism. I know my previous rants have gotten out of hand, but my main points (which, I can admit were drowned out in some, ... poorly phrased sentences) that I am trying to communicate is America may be a super power, but her government lacks the mental capacity to think it can change Iraq into a democracy just like that. If America, the worlds super power (which they are) can't contain a guerrilla war between the Sunni, and Shi'i, do you think its at all possible for a 3rd world country to do this? A country that has a totally different culture then that of the west?

For Iraq democracy and an equal way of life is a big step, a step that war from a foregin state cannot institute lightly. In the long run getting Saddam out of the country was a good step but now that Americas backing out and "transferring" power, or as I like to put it "releiving themselves of responsibility for their war", what do you think wil happen? Poeple will rush to the polls to elect a government? Sunni and Shi'i will walk hand in hand? I predict a civil war, were thousands more will die. For the next few years, the Iraq people are not going to be thanking america. Rather, they will be cursing her name, as her backing out this june is only going to cause them more problems.

"so if we're pussies, then what word would describe THOSE people?"

THOSE people are smart. Why do you think Poland sent her GROM (Polish Special Forces) into Iraq? Cause everyone knows Americas an economic superpower, and Poland knows she has more to gain economically from keeping a good front with America and the EU. Something thats no easy task, as the "leading" nations of the Eu (Germany, France) are opposing America. A laughable group of states. Everyone knows America has a strong economy for now, so why not utilise it. Remember jsut because a "weaker" cuontry is "sucking up to" your country (which Poland is not, we got payed quite a lot of money to sen GROM into iraq) doesnt mean they respect your country. Its an economically sound think to do with a national debt of 60 billion dollars to do anything for money.

[chambers]

erm SK perhaps because i may be a jew? i dont particularly like people saying " hey they got there own country and look what they did with that". did you ever stop to think about it. jeez you are so narrowminded. AND OF COURSE I FUCKIN KNEW YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT JEWS if i didnt know what you were tlaking about how the FUCK did i find it offensive?

the point of europe v usa? the point is all you americans are saying "hey well just drop a nuke" now if you listen to what i said instead of pulling random part of it and taking them out of context you would see thta iff a country tried to drop a nuke in any country in western europe, the country that droped it would be removed from the map.

[FearTheMullet]

Chambers, using "they" is not racist, NEITHER is it racist to say what the Israeli Army is doing in Israel is worng. Condemming the killing of children is not anti-semetic, its common sense.

[MemnochTheCaT]

Originally posted by: chambers

didnt they get their own country? and look what that did now, israel and palestine on the news every single day.

well who the hell are you tlaking abotu you fuckin moron? sounds like jews to me.

also america isnt the be all and end all of the world you guys know, europe in terms of technology, army size, navy size, airforce size AND experince in ALL kind of battles europe comes out on top. i know it isnt a country but you could not nuke germany with out the whole of europe with the exception of probly the UK doing something about it. also MANY MANY countrys have nukes now, its not like the US is alone there any more, one nuke in fort knox (bad sp maybe?) and america would be wasted utterly and truley, no other country relys on the gold they have (heck no other country HAS that gold for a start lol) for almost everything they do.

Sorry to break it to ya, but google up information on the nuclear arsenals of the world, there is no credible equal to the United States in terms of quickly deliverable (anywhere on earth) thermonuclear warheads. If you combined the strategic nuclear capabilities of every country on earth other than the US, it's still child's play in comparison. Nothing to be proud of, I'm somewhat ashamed that my country has spent untold trillions of dollars on weapons of unimaginable destructive power. Food for thought : the trident boomer sub can surface and fire it's entire payload of MIRV missiles in under six minutes, and a single one of those subs carries enough destructive power to kill or destroy just about every living thing on a continent the size of north america.

The reasons for this are pretty simple : the US more or less 'cheated' on nuclear arms treaties, saying one thing while doing another .. and was competing with the USSR to maintain a fragile stalemate of mutual assured destruction should one side choose to start a war. In the midst of this arms race, virtually every other country on earth with nuclear arms was recieving directive from one of these 2 superpowers, and of course, much weaker arsenals and technology so that the balance of power did not shift from the titans to the little guys. Even the Chinese nuclear arsenal is pathetic in EVERY area of strategic importance (Targeting, time to fire delay, missile guidance system, warhead power, sigint).

A conventional war between the US and EU would go to the EU, but a nuclear conflict is something Europe and most of that part of the planet simply wouldn't survive. The fallout and tertiary effects would be catastrophic GLOBALLY... meaning everyone would be a loser in the end. Unless you want to take into effect Neutron weapons, commonly called clean nukes .. AFAIK Israel is the country with the most development in this area, but information is difficult to come by regarding that issue.

[L8r]

Originally posted by: chambers
the point of europe v usa? the point is all you americans are saying "hey well just drop a nuke" now if you listen to what i said instead of pulling random part of it and taking them out of context you would see thta iff a country tried to drop a nuke in any country in western europe, the country that droped it would be removed from the map.

has any1 seen the movie "wargames"?
1 country drop a nuke then EVRYBODY will.... then we are FUCK
no humans no animals and FFS NO ANIME/MANGA...

NO NUKES, NO NUKES [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

[MemnochTheCaT]

Originally posted by: L8r

Originally posted by: chambers
the point of europe v usa? the point is all you americans are saying "hey well just drop a nuke" now if you listen to what i said instead of pulling random part of it and taking them out of context you would see thta iff a country tried to drop a nuke in any country in western europe, the country that droped it would be removed from the map.

has any1 seen the movie "wargames"?
1 country drop a nuke then EVRYBODY will.... then we are FUCK
no humans no animals and FFS NO ANIME/MANGA...

NO NUKES, NO NUKES [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Actually, something that is *quite* sobering and scary .. is that the USA and USSR spent untold fortunes in anticipation of actually developing a strategic nuclear attack that would annihilate the enemy while nullifying retaliation (GW optic defense, etc) .. thus enabling the use of nuclear arms as 'pre-emptive' options. China is a good example of this, their DF ICBMs use liquid fuel, and the silos take upwards of 30 minutes to prepare for launch. A pre-emptive strike on China with subs in the area would most likely take effect before a counterattack could be manifested.

The goal of the world should be to make nuclear weapons either (A)- something that no one will use, because of assured mutual destruction (the old cold war balancing act) .. or (B)- with effective defense systems, they are ineffective at penetrating improved missile defense systems.

[SK]

Originally posted by: chambers
erm SK perhaps because i may be a jew? i dont particularly like people saying " hey they got there own country and look what they did with that". did you ever stop to think about it. jeez you are so narrowminded. AND OF COURSE I FUCKIN KNEW YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT JEWS if i didnt know what you were tlaking about how the FUCK did i find it offensive?

the point of europe v usa? the point is all you americans are saying "hey well just drop a nuke" now if you listen to what i said instead of pulling random part of it and taking them out of context you would see thta iff a country tried to drop a nuke in any country in western europe, the country that droped it would be removed from the map.

wtf chambers your such a dumbass it amazes me. all your doing is putting words into peoples mouths left and right. i never once said " hey they got there own country and look what they did with that" YOU did. i really could care less if your a jew or not chambers.

before you said "s-k i dont think its very nice to refer to the enitre jewish religion as 'they'" now obviously i did refer to some jews as they, but hear you are, the village idiot, putting words into my mouth. when i said they were given their own country, i wasnt reffering to the entire jewish religion, i was reffering to the european jews who immigrated to israel. that was why i said look at the above posts. so that maybe your simple mind could understand that i wasnt reffering to the entire jewish community.

i still dont see the point to your europe vs. usa comments, except to show how much of complete imbecile you are. now who said drop a nuke on europe? im just wondering but i just skimmed through so im not sure. lets play the numbers game, US nukes=12100, France=510, UK=400. hmmm...why would the US want to fight europe anyway, doesnt look like much of a contest. Lets check out manpower, US=73,597,731, France and UK combined=24,443,355. hmmm....i guess you could add in more countries to even it, like portugal or something.

[Xollence]

I say we ban the word "they" when referring to European Jews since it's so offensive. Actually we should just take it out of the dictionary since it's such an evil word. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

[originalkrn]

The US is the most powerful country in the world. Beleive it. However, we are only at top because we've been pretty lucky so far. The two World Wars nearly destroyed all the top nations of the world, except America since there was not a single battle fought on American soil.

[FearTheMullet]

Originally posted by: MemnochTheCaT

Originally posted by: L8r

Originally posted by: chambers
the point of europe v usa? the point is all you americans are saying "hey well just drop a nuke" now if you listen to what i said instead of pulling random part of it and taking them out of context you would see thta iff a country tried to drop a nuke in any country in western europe, the country that droped it would be removed from the map.

has any1 seen the movie "wargames"?
1 country drop a nuke then EVRYBODY will.... then we are FUCK
no humans no animals and FFS NO ANIME/MANGA...

NO NUKES, NO NUKES [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

Actually, something that is *quite* sobering and scary .. is that the USA and USSR spent untold fortunes in anticipation of actually developing a strategic nuclear attack that would annihilate the enemy while nullifying retaliation (GW optic defense, etc) .. thus enabling the use of nuclear arms as 'pre-emptive' options. China is a good example of this, their DF ICBMs use liquid fuel, and the silos take upwards of 30 minutes to prepare for launch. A pre-emptive strike on China with subs in the area would most likely take effect before a counterattack could be manifested.

The goal of the world should be to make nuclear weapons either (A)- something that no one will use, because of assured mutual destruction (the old cold war balancing act) .. or (B)- with effective defense systems, they are ineffective at penetrating improved missile defense systems.

Even scarrier then nukes are biological weapons. A nuke is just radiation that breaks down your cells so fast you wouldnt hav etime to know what hit you. I watched a documentary on the cold war, America mae 1 billion tonnes of biological weapons per year, the USSR mand 500 billion per year. Imagine a biological war like that. Utterly more terrifying then a mere nuke.

Without nukes being considered at all US and USSR could have destryoed the world 30 times over with jsut Biowarfare

[chambers]

SK you fucked up big there somewhere, this aint a flame but i wanna know whos ass you pulled those figures out. your own government last time i checked has a limitd on your standing army of 487k. 73m??!?!?! thats well over a million form every state!!! and where did you only get 2m for both of the UK and france yet you managed to get 73m for the us? if your talking total man power, the uk alone has a population of around 70m, with france cumming in at 40-45m. where the FUCK did you get them numbers from?

also i dont see how the us v eu is a wrong argument. iam basically saying that if the US decided to launch a nuke at a european country the rest of the EU would most likley attack the US due to there close proximity.

and abotu people quoting numbers for nukes, it doesnt really matter most country could probly be disabled with 100 launched at them, and that would be the entire country. also do you REALLY think that country tell eachother how many nukes they have? i dont think so. its not the kind of infomation that a country would disclose to the public.

[SK]

i got all those numbers from the CIA factbook, but i guess you know more than them huh chambers. looked like i missed a 4, but i corrected it.

[Xollence]

Chambers: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/....html#Military That's where he got it from.

You launch a nuke at a country they launch one, we all know this, what's the point in bringing it up in every single post? Once the US develops the missile defense system, that won't matter much. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif[/img]

[Assertn]

FearTheMullet.....it sounds to me like you're saying that since that people of iraq would have to deal with a strong culture change by changing the government, that they should just stay as a dictatorship forever. Change happens, and its something that is for the best, whether it may be inconvenient or not. I was just talking to my friend who served in iraq today, and he told me how horrible the conditions were there.....here you have saddam living in huge palaces while the people live in such poor work environments that when the US gave them hard hats for construction, they all took them home and left them there because they didnt want them to get SCRATCHED! My friend even saw some guy with a big circular saw cutting pipes while just sitting on the pipe without a hat, goggles, gloves, or anything....having a better government would not only give them more power, but it would improve their standards of living as well. There were iraqians who begged the US officers to take them to the US to live or to recieve medical treatment...and my friend says that they ask soldiers for stuff ALL the time because they view americans as "VERY GENEROUS PEOPLE"

you really have no grasp of reality, do you?

[chambers]

SK iam sorry, there isnt 24million men in the french and UK armies, theres not even 10 million if you put them both together. i dont know which CIA fact book your reading but i advise you to throw it away because ita garbage. utter garbage at that. if the uk half half the men you mentioned that would be 12m people in our army, thats over 1 in ten in the army, thats just not a realistic figure for any 1st world country.

[Stoopider]

Originally posted by: FearTheMullet

I am from Poland. Not Germany. .

Hey!! I was right!! BTW, do you like Jerzy Dudek?? I like him too. Go LIverpool! Sorry. Sidetracking.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hmm Chambers, if they do have a martial law like the discussion earlier, the numbers would be more realistic. Especially to have a full blown war like that, the Gov would throw in everything they got.

But that is the CIA book whatever. Who are we to dispute?

And the US army does have the Anti-Nuclear tactical weapons or something like that I was hearing in the news.. Saying that it can take out a nuclear arm weapon from a distance before it touches US's soil.

US is still the worlds superpower, supirior technology so what not. But it's impossible for them to rule over countries. Too many God damn liberals!! Hah [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

[chambers]

^^^^
well ive been in the british army, thats who iam to dispute. the UK couldnt raise a 15m strong army in ten years even with conscription. neither could any other 1st world country for that matter. i dont care what book says it its wrong, its not the number for the standing army and the reserves put together, even that is less than a tenth of what he stated.

listen this book is WRONG. sk tell me that author/editor of it please? (iam not saying it doesnt exsist, but i would like to know who fucked up so much and still managed to get abook published)