Roughly half of the Isekais people are watching have this kind of "grooming" and it's not a topic of discussion at all.
Why is it that it's a topic for Mushoku, sounds like some ragebait to me tbh.
So... shouldn't this be completely accepted by now, considering we've seen "it happen" for decades now?
Ragebait?
I thought this entire discussion started when Darth mentioned it in this thread. Are other people (in other spaces) targeting specifically this story for depicting "grooming"?
Peace.
Certainly, but actually about Rudeus grooming the others. (which at least makes sense because that was quite literally his stated goal in a few episodes.)Originally Posted by shinta|hikari
Be that as it may, it's still completely normal to see this in anime and I still have no idea why this is being a topic when it wasn't in so many other shows.
I consider Roxy "grooming" Rudeus to be a big fucking stretch in the first place (because the crime is actually the intent and the objective is sexual abuse or intercourse - which Roxy never even remotely had and actually went so far as to punish such behaviour coming from Rudeus), but I just don't understand why it's a topic for this show and not for the others that do it as well... because they are less popular?
What Roxy did for Rudeus is "grooming" all right, but that kind of grooming which is not a crime and the actual meaning of the word. Mentorship, teaching and coaching a child so that it can be on it's way to achieve something great.
It's quite honestly a bit silly to think this was grooming for the intent of having a romantic relationship later and it's not at all what happened in this show... not even close.
Since that's relatively clear, what else but "ragebait" or perhaps "provocation"(? maybe that's a better word?) would that question be?
Last edited by KrayZ33; Sat, 06-15-2024 at 02:06 PM.
Oh I just didn't realize this topic ("grooming") with regards to Mushoku was a significant discussion in other places. I don't really participate in anime discussions outside of gotwoot.
EDIT:
My wife told me to clarify, she doesn't think male on male buttfucking porn is ew. Just that she personally does not enjoy it, unlike omegaverse wolf buttsecks.
Peace.
Is your wife the Roxy pillow you bought and you speaking as her? Or an actual person?
I'm confused as to how much of a joke this is (or isn't)
She's real, but I get you. I totally get you.
"She's the only non-loli girl in the show, your honor!" will be my defense in court
Any grooming going on in this series was with Rudeus and Sylphiette when they were children. But it was very brief and due to their eventual separation, did not have too much of a long-lasting effect, but it has one nevertheless. You had an adult man in the guise of a child encouraging features and behaviors in a naturally meek girl. They developed a significant codependency that Rudy's parents noticed and corrected by sending him away.
It's a significant driver to why she's the most boring heroine in the entire series. She's meek, demure, and accommodating. Fully boring. Bland wife-servant personality. Bleh.
I support Roxy having her smitten period here because it's already been established that she's an excessively late bloomer due to her disability with her own species which isolates her from her own people and makes her an outcast to her own continent, but a welcome adventurer elsewhere. She has social hangups so it does track that she's finally aware of Rudeus. Others that she has spent substantial time with are like much older siblings to her (even though she is likely older than most humans). It is slowly dawning on her that she's lovestruck, but her main focus is certainly adventuring with a competent person that she gets along with and who can explore magical shit with her without being a creep (the prince she tutored), pervert (the other prince she tutored), asshole (Paul), whore (she doesn't know Elinalise has a path forward and ambition to stay loyal), unhygenic and kinda a weirdo (Geese), no interest in magical stuff (dwarf), or anyone else she's traveled with over the years. Roxy would like that to develop into more, maybe possibly, but she's too stunted to be forward about it so she's playing this card even though everyone around her knows her well enough to see it plain as day.
Rudy just doesn't believe it could be true, so he is Main Protagonist Dense for the purposes of this arc's narrative.
It's a huge stretch to say that she groomed Rudy. She trained him, then left. They stayed in communication like normal close tutor and pupil, though we know that Rudeus developed a complex around her, Roxy didn't and merely remembered him as an exceptional student who helped her get out of an awkward employment and skill development period in her life.
All that said...Eris is still better than both Roxy and especially Sylphie and this series deeply suffers from her lack of presence. Eris' independent attitude and desire for self-betterment is vastly superior to devoted and horny but otherwise Zero Personality Wish Fulfillment Wife and Smitten Late Bloomer Socially Naive Adventurer Roxy.
Fuck Eris. Roxy is the best waifu, and Sylphy is fine in her current position.
A real person lol. We both like the Roxy pillow though (yes, in that way), so we bought it.
She is a barely 5-foot, bisexual, amateur fashion model who aspires to be a voice actress (in English).
Last edited by shinta|hikari; Sat, 06-15-2024 at 07:38 PM.
Peace.
Which is OOC for him, because he's usually very genre savvy.
What the heck is with all this Roxy and Slyphie slandering?! Eris is the worst. Although I generally hate red heads ;>
Ok, now I'm leaning towards "not real" lol :P
"She's the only non-loli girl in the show, your honor!" will be my defense in court
Shinta is like the boy who cried "Wolf". I really have no idea if he's serious or not.
This is so funny to me right now, you wouldn't believe it.
I'm not trying to diss you or your wife - if there is any - I'll just stop .... because..... hahahaha, oh man
I don't even know what to say or how to handle this situation.
I agree with Eris being the best.
But to be fair, she got the most characterbuilding there is in this show (other than MC).
So it's not fair to Roxy.
And it's good that Eris got so much time to develop because without it, she would've been insufferable.
Last edited by KrayZ33; Sun, 06-16-2024 at 05:37 AM.
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Roxy isn't the problem. She's gotten a decent amount of character development and is obviously set to get more before the season ends. This feels like her arc.
The problem is Sylphie. She has no personality. She is "My Husband and Family First" Japanese stereotype wife with no aspirations of her own beyond getting married and having her husband's children. The type of characters who are so bland they feel like an afterthought. She might as well be "Generic Apron Wearing Anime mom" except she has half-elf ears.
There was ample time to develop one in the ED arc, but they didn't. That entire arc is just padding that could have been compressed into 6 episodes with a montage in the middle (and I am including the near suicide episodes).
Princess Ariel has more of a functionally developed and nuanced personality and a place in the story. That's how weak of a character Sylphie is.
Oh no, how dare a woman dream of marrying, having children and leading a peaceful family life!!1 /s
This sort of attitude is what makes modern feminism so toxic :/ Persuing a career is fine. Persuing family life is fine, too. And Sylphie is great. If only she had female curves.
"She's the only non-loli girl in the show, your honor!" will be my defense in court
Which Roxy also thinks about. We've also seen Roxy being patient, nurturing, and thoughtful with children. We've seen Eris do the same with older beastmen children in her own way.
The problem is that a minor scene, a footnote, or background character animation for Roxy or Eris is the entirety of Slyphie's personality.
Actual background characters and minor supporting characters have more character development than Slyphie does. Zenith has a more developed personality. Sylphie's entire narrative is already done unless things change when Rudeus drags Roxy into their household as wife number two.
And I still don't see the problem with this, unless you are strictly speaking from a point of "what would be more interesting to watch". But from a plausible story development pov, Sylphie is a-ok.
Let's look at Eris. What would have happened to her without Rudy? Well, first of all, she'd be dead, lol. But let's assume she'd have survived the teleportation event, then what? Or let's assume there never would have been that event. She would have stayed at home, have trained a little sword fighting so that her father and uncle get some freetime, and ultimately she would have married some random noble guy. She would have ended up as "WORSE" than Sylphie, because at least Sylphie chose family life on her own. Eris would have been forced to become a noble lady, giving children to her husband, while wasting away her time with mundane bs, not even doing cooking and such, because her servants would do it for her.
So please, the whole "Eris had so much more ambition than Sylphie" argument is simply the consequence of things that were forced on her. Had things proceeded naturally, she'd have ended up in a worse life than Sylphie and she wouldn't have fought that life. See her ever-pissed off mom, she would have become exactly that.
"She's the only non-loli girl in the show, your honor!" will be my defense in court
I think that's what they are saying. Eris is more interesting to watch because she is an unpredictable violent bitch.
Peace.
For the majority of fiction, if it isn't interesting, it should be cut. Because it served no narrative purpose. Now Sylphie has been in the story since very early on, but there's also currently nowhere for her to go in the narrative. She gives birth, concluding her arc...which isn't actually HER arc, it is actually a small portion of Rudeus' arc. There's nowhere further for her character to go.
Does Sylphie need to stay at home for the narrative? Not really, that's why Aisha's arc has her wanting to be the perfect housekeeper and as the bastard child of her father with a complex about it, wanting to be just a little selfish. But Sylphie's story got rushed right to pregnancy, limiting her utility in the narrative.
Does she provide a "true love" type relationship? Not really either. That's been set up to be Roxy. Heroic savior at her most dire need and everything.
Does she provide a "dramatic love" type relationship? No, that's Eris' role since we know she still loves him.
Sylphie couldn't be cut because she was a big part of the early events getting Rudeus to be more social. Again, Sylphie serves as a vehicle for Rudeus' arc, not the center of her own. Which is consistent about her everywhere she appears in the story. She's not a lead heroine, she's a tertiary support character to other, more interesting characters in the story.
Her entire role in the webnovel should have been rewritten from scratch to make her an actual character, since they certainly couldn't have cut her. Even Sara has more of an independent sense of development than Sylphie does.
The totality of her personality is horny, available, submissive, loyal, devoted, and obedient. That's toxic social construct writ large. Flaws make characters interesting and engaging. Motivations that don't perfectly align with every other character drive the narratives. Boring is not a flaw, it is a lack of one. Sylphie never affects the narrative, she's carried along by it.
That's literally why she's more interesting, same with Roxy. They're active participants of the narrative, and Sylphie is barely even a supporting character in Rudeus'.So please, the whole "Eris had so much more ambition than Sylphie" argument is simply the consequence of things that were forced on her. Had things proceeded naturally, she'd have ended up in a worse life than Sylphie and she wouldn't have fought that life. See her ever-pissed off mom, she would have become exactly that.
And you clearly misunderstood the best MILF in the series. It's not well explained in the anime, but you can piece it together from her husband's dialogue concerning the Greyrat power dynamics (all moot after the mass teleportation) if you pay close attention. Eris became spoiled because she was the only child Hilda had left, but in that scene, Hilda also berates Eris for not being feminine enough (Hilda knew that Eris needed course-correcting, she just didn't live to see it). Hilda initially resents Rudeus because Paul managed to get out of the traditional Greyrat family dynamics.
Last edited by Ryllharu; Sun, 06-16-2024 at 09:55 AM.
Eris is entertaining to watch.
If you have rose tinted glasses, or manage to somehow be on her good side most of the time (through effort or luck) then you might have a good time. Boy did she take some fixing through. I still remember that demon kid who pulled her cloak, broke a button, and she absolutely decked him for it.
In comedic anime land that's fine. In real life it might be lethal.
Sylphie is boring, unless ehs's a monster in bed I suppose. It sounds like a stress free life with her assuming you have the stamina.
Roxy is a good mix between them. In some ways she's the most childish of them all, but she can have conversations with Rudy regarding magic.
The best wife of course is actually Aisha.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
Are you pulling a DarthEnder now? Sylphie is not the main character. She's now a mother-to-be. And even then there's the possibility of her princess-friend calling for her help. Everything about her status quo is FINE. This is Rudy's story and it's progressing in an interesting way.
Why does it matter that Sylphie is CURRENTLY not the utmost exciting character? That doesn't mean anything should be cut or rewritten, holy shit. Sometimes I want to play Harvest Moon.
"She's the only non-loli girl in the show, your honor!" will be my defense in court
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