Would Naruto be here without his...

[Nightmare]

now as you all obviously know, kage bushin is naruto's signature move, he uses that every fight at some point, so if the series didn't start with him stealing this move would he be where he is today?? same goes for the demon fox chakra, he's just lucky enough to have the demon in him as well as the kage bushin, the demon gives him enough stamina to support his on going kage bushine which allows him to surprise his enemies in tricky ways in conjunction with other techniques such as henge, and now he's lucky to have a legendary sannin to train him!! otherwise he still would have ppppoooor chakra control, dunno jack about how to use his demon chakra, actually those two go hand in hand, i recall frog hermit saying because he has the demon chakra it makes him harder to control his regular chakra [?] or was that about five element seal, well in any case, that's my opinion, he's pretty fortunate to get to where he is now

[Someonemanr]

Naruto is indeed fortunate to have things happen to him the way they have, but it doesn't mean he doesn't have a lot of determination and talent of his own. He's lucky he got Kage Bunshin so early on, but it still takes a lot of stamina to use such a move, it is a jounin level move after all. And while you can say that he has the Kyuubi chakra to help him out, like you also said, he was just lucky enough to start learning how to control it recently, since he ran into Jiraiya. Also, since he was sealed up during the prelims, his fight with Kiba was done all on his own, same with when he beat those illusionary guys in the forest. Yeah he beat Kiba with a fart, and had help from Sasuke and Kabuto in the forest, but it still took a lot of guts and stamina to do what he did. He's definately lucky to have met Jiraiya but if you think about it, it could have been not so lucky, if he hadn't been able to draw out the kyuubi chakra he would have died at the bottom of that cliff. Course it would seem that Naruto's own abilities aren't enough to match up to the likes of Neji, but Neji was "lucky" enough to grow up with the byakugan, so it's only fair that Naruto's luck of having the kyuubi chakra helps him whoop Neji's ass, well, at least I'm hoping Neji gets a whooping. The only person I want to see schooled worse then Neji is Gaara, but I don't know if Sasuke is even going to show at this point.

[Nightmare]

Hmmm, you have a point there, and Neji's just so bloody lucky to learn all those crazy head family moves at such a small age when he's a bloody branch family member

Yeah hopefully some one's gotta kick his ass, hopefully Kakashi gave him a new trick or two specifically made to desttttrrroooyyy Gaara's defense

[Xeo]

It may seem quite fictional, but a lot of things in real life are also based on luck, and everyone gains a bit and loses a bit because of it. Would Naruto have gotten this far without his luck with being able to learn Kage Bushin in a night? That's a question we'll never know. He might have learnt something else? He might have run into another Legendary Senin, he might not have had Kyubi inside of him, but learn how to break through gates like Rock. What I'm saying is that there's a wealth of possibilities of what could have happened and there's nothing to keep him from getting this far because there are so many other paths he could have taken. It's almost like asking ourselves would we be chatting on this forum it it wasn't for our love of anime/manga? Possibly.

So what I mean is yes, he would probably make it this far anyway sooner or later as long as he's the main character

The fact that we all get to share our thoughts and our passion about the Naruto anime series, I think that we're all lucky in that sense

[jing]

I agree, if he didnt steal the scroll, he would never had learned kagebunshin, and he would never had passed the academy graduation exam. however, Naruto has already good stamina by himself, and a strong will. Having kyubi or not, i think he owned kiba

[El Duende]

i think kage bunshin is not so great... only that naruto has learn how to use it and how to take advantage of that jutsu in his battles. If he had learnt another jutsu instead of kage bunshin, I guess he would mastered it and learnt how to use it the proper way and time during his battles.

(it was clear??? my english teacher can kill me if she read this )

[jing]

yeah i guess you make sense too. i find naruto a very tactical person, like the creative things he does with kagebunshin makes him my fav character =P

[Nightmare]

that's true well he is the number 1 ninja in surprising others

and I guess it's true that the jitsu is useful but it must be put to good use in order to maximize it's potential, like you can have a gun but you need to pull the trigger yourself at the right timing in order to be a powerful shooter, I guess what I'm trying to say is with other people they can have direct damaging jitsu's that make them unique but naruto's is truly unique, let's take, say, that sound guy that controls air pressure (forgot his name) his technique is one you can actually study and try to find a counter for it whatever the counter may be. But for naruto's kage bushin, I'm sure everyone knows he has that move, but they can't really do much to figure out a counter can they? cuz Naruto can think of new styles everytime with his creativity to trap different opponents differently, even Neji got a little cocky there in 61, come to think of it, I think everyone's gotten cocky in battles with naruto (Kiba - thinking his dog [also forgot his name ] defeated naruto) (Those ninjas specilized in cloning with the earth technique near the end of the 2nd exam [the one sasuke encountered early on in the 2nd exam <the ones that wear gas masks[?]>] - they thought their clones had Naruto and friends fooled when they were all naruto clones under henge) and they shouldn't have been so cocky!

[fear_my_jutsu]

well i think that if u think about it naruto could have been a great ninja, because he would have never gotten the demon foxes chakra if he hadn`t attacked rite? so then he would still have parents and his chakra would be easier to control because he has no demon in him. and by havein parents he owuldn`t have been hated er that kinda stuff and he could have been like any other normal kid. also he prolly wouldn`t have stolen the scroll if he wasn`t so unacknoledged which would make him not no kagebunshin. anyway thats what i think

[KakashiSensei]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (fear_my_jutsu @ Dec 9 2003, 09:29 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> well i think that if u think about it naruto could have been a great ninja, because he would have never gotten the demon foxes chakra if he hadn`t attacked rite? so then he would still have parents and his chakra would be easier to control because he has no demon in him. and by havein parents he owuldn`t have been hated er that kinda stuff and he could have been like any other normal kid. also he prolly wouldn`t have stolen the scroll if he wasn`t so unacknoledged which would make him not no kagebunshin. anyway thats what i think </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
ok that was one of the most confusing things i have ever read.

But i agree to a point. If he never had teh Nine tails, he wouldn&#39;t be hated, he wouldn&#39;t be the same person, and he would have been a different kid all together.

[TheAwesomeChow]

haku would&#39;ve spanked both naruto and sasuke if not for kyuubi.

[Insomniac]

yeah, even if he was a completely different person the kyubi was sealed in him after birth, which means all the lack of talent and stuff was there since birth, even if he didnt have the kyubi then sure he might have more friends but that wouldnt make him any different ninja wise

whereas Neji was born with the talent but chucked into a lower house of &#39;slaves&#39; and he still has gone far

[Nightmare]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (TheAwesomeChow @ Dec 10 2003, 02:05 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> haku would&#39;ve spanked both naruto and sasuke if not for kyuubi. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>haku would&#39;ve spanked both naruto and sasuke if not for kyuubi.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Hmm... makes me wonder now, if he had kage bushin but not kyubi, then he wouldn&#39;t have the stamina to keep making clones, and if not, then Sasuke wouldn&#39;t have enough time to develop his Sharigan, well all in all, Haku was going soft on them, if he didn&#39;t toy with them from the start I don&#39;t think Kyubi would even have a chance to leak chakra

[SasukesGirL]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Insomniac @ Dec 9 2003, 10:15 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> yeah, even if he was a completely different person the kyubi was sealed in him after birth, which means all the lack of talent and stuff was there since birth, even if he didnt have the kyubi then sure he might have more friends but that wouldnt make him any different ninja wise

whereas Neji was born with the talent but chucked into a lower house of &#39;slaves&#39; and he still has gone far </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
who knows if he was borned with lack of talent or not. I mean there might be a POSSIBILTY that he could&#39;ve been hokages son or related to him. If so he then u know....

[Noonan]

I think all of this has been revealed in the anime so hopefully this is spoiler free..

#1 - Naruto&#39;s curse seal allows the Kyubi Chakra to slowly leak into his body in a form that is normally UNUSEABLE

#2 - Naruto has huge stamina and chakra ability on his own - see episode 1 - those Kage bunshins DID NOT use Kyubi chakra (no red eyes on Naruto)

#3 - the curse seal on his belly runs directly over several of the opening points for chakra - go back and look at episode 60 - when Naruto creates chakra and uses the Kage Bunshin - Neji sees Naruto&#39;s chakra as a flame that spirals out through the curse seal to the opening points. (so the seal interferes with him using HIS OWN chakra)

#4 - the reason Naruto Failed the exit exam for ninja school three times is that Iruka Sensei always chose naruto&#39;s WORST jutsu - the Bunshin no Jutsu.

So lets assume Naruto doesn&#39;t have the Kyubi - and doesn&#39;t learn the Kage Bunshin -

Most likely Naruto would have been a normal Ninja boy - taken care of by Iruka or one of the other teachers - and he probably would have become a Gennin at 9 or 10 - depending on if he had been as motivated in that reality.

So you could almost say he would have been better off without them - but he wouldn&#39;t have been the rediculously powerfull nutcase we know and love now ..

[SasukesGirL]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Insomniac @ Dec 10 2003, 01:49 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> the huge stamina is a result of the kyubi chakra leeking and merging with his own, its not pure kyubi chakra but its melted into what Naruto uses everyday </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
How do know this exactly? -__-

[Insomniac]

the huge stamina is a result of the kyubi chakra leeking and merging with his own, its not pure kyubi chakra but its melted into what Naruto uses everyday

[Krbadass]

Naruto would definatly be here without it.. his hard work and determination brought him this far, not kage bunshin.

[Insomniac]

yes he would, but he probably wouldnt be this far without the kyubi
even if he was a completely different person he still wouldnt have talent

[boomorman]

Without the demon fox Naruto would be a very determined ice cream truck driver.