Inou-Battle wa Nichijou-kei no Naka de

[shinta|hikari]

And Tomoyo is a tsundere, and we all know what that means.

"Don't misunderstand! It's not like I like your chuuni personality or anything!!!"

[KrayZ33]

Yet she is the one who complains about his chuuni stuff the most.

Yes, I know she is being tsundere... but that's a lame excuse

[shinta|hikari]

Lame excuse for what? What her being tsundere means (which in fact she is, obviously) that she doesn't mind or even likes Andou being chuuni. This directly contradicts your statement that only Chifuyu is fine with it.

[Kraco]

Yet she is the one who complains about his chuuni stuff the most.

Yes, I know she is being tsundere... but that's a lame excuse

She complains about it because she doesn't anymore have the courage, or should I say she's too decent a member of the society already, to do it herself. Obviously she needs the mentality still more than most because she's attempting to write and sell light novels concentrating around that stuff. It's the same as being a tsundere: She can't be true to her feeling nor admit them. At some level she does desire to make a boyfriend out of Andou, and I doubt she would anymore want to go on dates with a publicly open chuuni even if she secretly enjoys and needs that side of him in privacy. It's an unsolvable internal conflict for her.

[KrayZ33]

Lame excuse for what?

While being tsundere is cute for the viewer, its basically being an ass most of the time towards someone if it would happen in reallife.

You could argue she is the strongest anti-chuuni voice in their group in Andou's point of view, at least prior to him catching her offguard

At some level she does desire to make a boyfriend out of Andou, and I doubt she would anymore want to go on dates with a publicly open chuuni even if she secretly enjoys and needs that side of him in privacy. It's an unsolvable internal conflict for her.

thats exactly what I meant, she would "deny" him or it (that chuuni-thing) any time.
So you can't say she "accepts it" either.

[shinta|hikari]

It's blatant that Tomoyo likes Andou including his chuuni aspect. She's just a tsundere. It isn't all that complicated.

You may dislike tsunderes, but that doesn't change the fact that Chifuyu isn't the only one fine with his behavior. It doesn't matter whose perspective it is or how you feel about it. It's fact.

Someone who isn't fine with it isn't gonna do a combined move pose with him (with such vigor, too) no matter what.

[KrayZ33]

I don't dislike tsunderes, I don't dislike Tomoyo either and yes, she's fine with him being chuuni secretly, but if his chuuni gets loose in public, she can't handle nor bear it.
I don't know how anyone could consider that "being fine with it".

As I said, being tsundere is a lame excuse, she isn't purely tsun because she doesn't want Andou to know she likes him, but also because she is scared of how other see her if she goes out with a chuuni-nerd.

[Kraco]

she's fine with him being chuuni secretly, but if his chuuni gets loose in public, she can't handle nor bear it.
I don't know how anyone could consider that "being fine with it".

What sort of world do you live in? Everybody has secrets, big or small, that they don't go around advertising but still live full lives and have all sorts of friends and acquaintances. You know, don't tell, don't ask and everything. Being a high schooler chuuni must be worse than being an otaku, and not nearly all otaku walk around wearing imouto shirts in public places. She can be perfectly okay with his chuuniness but still not want to be included in public chuunibyou performances. It's not such a black and white thing, few things are in life.

[shinta|hikari]

Once you start quoting words, you know it has already devolved into a semantic argument. I have no idea what you are thinking about "being fine with it," but in the context of the discussion, I would say it means not disliking it. For comparison, Hatoko is not fine with it because it doesn't make sense to her. Then she goes on a rampage lambasting a friend's hobby, one he is very passionate about.

If a friend suddenly burst out and started ranting to me about how LNs and anime are for children and VNs are glorified porn just because I stopped telling them about something they have absolutely no real interest in, I'd probably hit him/her in the face.

I would actually venture out and say that only Hatoko has real problems with Andou's chuuni. The others may complain outwardly, but they seem to be perfectly fine going along with his schemes and activities. This is fiction after all, so it was merely the writer's choice that Hatoko was given this distasteful role, while the others have their own issues.

[KrayZ33]

Everyone complains about him being a chuuni and if they really mean it or not is not really relevant for me.

In that regard I'd like to go back to post #18

Just ignore the

So far, Chifuyu is the only one who is truly okay with him being the way he is.

part if you disagree with it, I still stand for that line though, because so far even Tomoyo prefers Andou without his excessive chuunism in my opinion

I think I understand why Krayz is misinterpreting episode 7. The scenes when Andou appeared to be excluding Hatoko were clearly depicted from her perspective. It was exaggerated because that is how Hatoko saw them, not necessarily because that's how it was actually delivered or sounded like.

That's just unfair... I don't know.
At the same time, people compare Hatoko to a possessive bitch (even if they don't mean it as harsh as it sounds) just because she felt hurt and frustrated since someone very close excludes her by not sharing anything, even though all she ever said to that person was along the lines: "I don't like it as much as you do" when he started doing so
But its a misintepretation if I call out exactly what was shown and actually happened?

Sure, if you (Andou) are passionate about it you might feel disappointed, but that's no reason to totally avoid ever talking about these things again, especially if asked to share it with you. It's not only very impolite, but also *hurts*. Just imagine your wife/friend/girlfriend complains about how you don't show any interest in her hobby and when you do, she tells you to stop trying because you wouldn't like it anyway nor would you understand why she likes it. (which could also be understood as saying you wouldn't understand her)

If a friend suddenly burst out and started ranting to me about how LNs and anime are for children and VNs are glorified porn just because I stopped telling them about something they have absolutely no real interest in, I'd probably hit him/her in the face.

Since we are exaggerating: If a friend asks me to go away because he's about to talk about a topic I don't care/understand much about, so I can prepare dinner for him and goes all "stop bothering me already" while typing on his phone when I ask him to explain what this was all about, I'd spit in his face and leave the place immediatly, never turning back.

Yes, we know Andou is not like that because we see things Hatoko doesn't even has the chance to. We know Andou doesn't want to hurt a childhood friend like that, especially not someone like her.

But I don't believe it was the first time Andou acted like that towards her, she remembered the "book returning scene" because that's what started it and not because it was the only other time he did something like that.

Would you do 'the Andou' just because someone told you they don't like something as much as you do? Hatoko didn't even judge him for liking what he likes...
And its also worth noting that her complains where about him not telling her anything, excluding and providing poor explanation. You don't think sentences like "Talk to me in your own words! I beg you speak so I can understand you" and "If you teach me, teach me right" were said for no reason, do you? (Still kinda hurts me that this was said at the exact moment when she stopped "just" being angry and started crying)

He is dissapointed that Hatoko doesn't like it as much as himself, yet he doesn't really try to convince her either, blames (yes, that's what he *did* even if he probably didn't mean it that way, given his kind-hearted and honest nature) her for not understanding it. (the word is understanding, not "not liking it"). That is actually a huge difference, especially if told by someone you like as much as Hatoko does.
It could (we don't know that though) have been okay if Andou said "Ah, I guess you don't like it. Well, that's just how it goes". And that sentence wasn't said just once but three times in only one episode. You can't understand. You wouldn't understand. You don't understand.

F** it, why would someone say that to a friend?

edit: done with editing, oh my god, wall of text no one reads because it's written by me

[shinta|hikari]

You do understand that Andou has been talking about his hobby to Hatoko for years before he stopped right?

Andou didn't stop talking about chuuni to Hatoko because he felt disappointed (though of course, he was disappointed). The main reason was because he thought she didn't enjoy listening to it and could not understand it anyway (which was perfectly true). He said so himself. We should stop over analyzing the situation.

I didn't exaggerate with my example. Hatoko basically said that his hobbies didn't make sense to her and rejected them. "Talk to me in your own words?" What the hell does that even mean? Did she actually just demand Andou to act in way that she wants instead of how he normally does and wants to? "If you teach me, teach me right?" Did she just demand Andou to teach her something he has absolutely no obligation to (and reason to because she doesn't even understand or care about chuuni, but only likes Andou)? Google it, Hatoko. Chuunibyou (中二病) isn't that long a word.

And really? If a friend does to you what Andou did to Hatoko you would spit in their face? You'll lose friends man. He wasn't even as rude as a moody friend on a bad day.

Face it, his actions didn't warrant an outburst. The only reason Hatoko reacted like that was because she bottled it up for ages and reacted to the recent influx of rivals. That's not Andou's fault. It was her choice.

I guess my basic question would be, why do you think Hatoko is so entitled? I can't help but see how much bias you are placing on Hatoko's side. Why does Andou need to accommodate her? Teach her anything? Tell her anything? It's his own prerogative who he talks to about certain things.

You seem to be bringing up the issue of making dinner a lot, but you do know that she could have refused if she wanted?

Try looking at this more objectively. Andou behaved relatively normally. He might have been a little cold and unlike himself, but people do that often even in real life. Hatoko's outburst is completely abnormal. Shouting at your friend like that, ranting about stuff he had no idea about, and complaining about things she could have settled herself long before is not normal or good behavior. In fact, the only reason we are even talking about this was because of how odd that outburst was.

I'm actually surprised Andou didn't get hurt and prioritized finding Hatoko (even if his understanding of the reason of her anger was off base). He's a pretty good MC.

EDIT: Just to be clear, I'm not saying Andou is blameless. He should've been more perceptive and caught on to this issue long before, but he failed at that. If Hatoko had talked to him in a less psychotic way about her complaints, I would have definitely taken her side. It might be personal bias, but I don't respond well to people shouting at me and blaming me all of a sudden. I imagine a majority of people share my opinion.

[KrayZ33]

And really? If a friend does to you what Andou did to Hatoko you would spit in their face? You'll lose friends man. He wasn't even as rude as a moody friend on a bad day.

Bullshit, that's comming from the guy who would punch people's faces because they shout at them...

I didn't exaggerate with my example.

Yes you clearly did.

You seem to be bringing up the issue of making dinner a lot, but you do know that she could have refused if she wanted?

I don't know, maybe because I have proper manners in that regard. Just a wild guess though

I guess my basic question would be, why do you think Hatoko is so entitled? I can't help but see how much bias you are placing on Hatoko's side. Why does Andou need to accommodate her? Teach her anything? Tell her anything? It's his own prerogative who he talks to about certain things.

Because they are friends? Isn't that reason enough to act properly? Do you only speak to your friends if *you* feel like it? Only take, never give?

Try looking at this more objectively. Andou behaved relatively normally. He might have been a little cold and unlike himself, but people do that often even in real life. Hatoko's outburst is completely abnormal. Shouting at your friend like that, ranting about stuff he had no idea about, and complaining about things she could have settled herself long before is not normal or good behavior. In fact, the only reason we are even talking about this was because of how odd that outburst was.

I am looking at this objectively, he was being a jerk... there is no way around it. Yes, Hatoko was super mad, because as you already mentioned, things bottled up. What gave her frustation voice though was in fact Andou acting like a douche. That outburst was "abnormal" that's the essence of it, no one is denying that... However its perfectly easy to understand why it happened

Sure, she could've done nothing, dig everything in again and not care at all... but that would've made her an idiot. That's not even how a normal person would react.

[Ryllharu]

Google it, Hatoko. Chuunibyou (中二病) isn't that long a word.

In Hatoko's defense, she seemed to have considerable difficulty with chuunibyou type words, before (when she gave him back the book) and continuing through the present (her explosive rant). She's really confused by the kanji and bizarre readings attached to them.



@KrayZ33: Chill the fuck out. You are taking this way too personally for whatever reason.

[KrayZ33]

Because people ask me why I think the way I do?

I'm just amazed at how people look at things
Just like you guys seem to be about how I look at them

In my opinion Hatoko's current situation is the same as Andou's was in the past, but in reverse. The difference is/was how each of them handled it.

[shinta|hikari]

@Ryll - The terms are confusing if you actually want to emulate chuuni, but the wiki explanation is definitely not.

@Krayz - I think Ryll is referring to the amount of emotion you put into your words.

I wasn't exaggerating when I said I would punch someone if he/she shouts and blames me all of a sudden. I'm not saying everyone else would do so. That's just me. That said, I am absolutely certain none of my friends would ever shout at me, demand stuff from me, and reject my interests like that.

Give and take doesn't extend to being able to demand information from people. People have the right to share what they want to who they want. Even spouses keep secrets from each other.

My suggested action for Hatoko had nothing to do with enduring it and doing nothing. I have no idea where you got that. I clearly implied that the best course of action would be for her to confront Andou way before she got this fed up. If she had simply talked to him in a civilized manner (because he is her friend) instead of waiting until she burst, it would've been fine.

In any case, the arguments are spent IMO. Let's agree to disagree.

[Kraco]

According to the master chuuni Kiryuu Hajime, the chuunibyou affected need also people who don't understand them. We could thus deduce Hatoko not understanding a shit Andou was talking about might not have been such a big deal for Andou himself. It only became a deal of any sort after that outburst and Hatoko disappearing. This might explain why he put no effort in trying to teach Hatoko. He could have even been enjoying the feeling of appearing unexplainable in a friend's eyes, especially since he clearly had no idea Hatoko was in love with him and was suffering because she couldn't get a thing out of his nonsense.

[shinta|hikari]

Indeed. That's probably the reason why he failed to notice the stress Hatoko was under. To him, not telling Hatoko about his delusions might have been for both of their sakes.

[Kraco]

Episode 10 - HS




- - - - - -





I don't think anybody can say after this episode that Andou would be a rude and uncaring fellow. In fact I found him acting too saintly for somebody whose right hand is holding a cursed power, or whatever it was. I have to admit I enjoyed this episode quite a lot. I've always liked series where a weird/random dude has to take care of a young girl (in an unromantic manner, of course, I don't care for older dudes loving lolis).

I could swear I've seen the Animal Quiz host in some other show or two before. I wonder if it's some Japanese caricature archetype for the hosts of such shows on TV.

[Ryllharu]

While Andou getting Cookie to fall for him too was fun (and revealing his true motive to her later, the real meat of this episode was with Sayumi.

Andou is insightful enough, or at the least knows his friends well enough, to capture on the fact that Sayumi being her amazing self...wasn't in fact her being her usual amazing self. He caught on to the fact that she was acting differently. I certainly didn't notice anything particularly out of character with her, but Andou did.

[shinta|hikari]

Sayumi = legal wife.
Chifuyu = incest imouto.
Cookie = extra imouto (can't have enough)

Everyone else = meh.