Naruto Chapter 605

[Tofu #2]

because he didnt knew he could...
he never heard about the different levels of the eyes and never tried to master them

He sure seemed to have a basic understanding of a more powerful sharingan when he ran into Itachi + Sasuke mentions how he "feels the power" after he got his MS so even on activating he should have felt something

[poopdeville]

That sure is one brutal way to use the wood element. I wonder if the First Hokage ever used it that way...

Also, enough with the "Madara was controlling Rin already". The last thing I want to find out is that Obito went through all that and did all that he did just because he was 'tricked'. Madara doesn't strike me as the kind of guy who would go through all that effort to set this up just to manipulate Obito. He seems genuinely disinterested in the on goings of this modern generation of ninja because he believes they do not compare to his own.

I think the First tried that against the Third.

But I agree about Madara. Even if he had a plan at that point, it wouldn't rely on Sharingan manipulation. Why bother? The ninja world was full of people getting murdered and the desire for revenge. He would just have to wait for the right person (like, how Obito waited for Nagato).

Random question time: is spiral Zetsu the same as "black" Zetsu? How did Obito "give" Nagato the Rinnegan? It didn't look like he did a quick surgery on him while the mist or whatever attacked him.

[darkshadow]

The whole nagato thing is iffy, he basically had to be an uchiha as well.

[Tofu #2]

The whole nagato thing is iffy, he basically had to be an uchiha as well.

Why's that? They said Nagato was a uzumaki, which is descended from the Sage who originally had the rinnegan.
Kakashi and that Mist dude have shown you don't need the blood to use a bloodline eye.

AND Madara awoken the rinnegan after his battle with the first hokage, and he already said he gave his eyes to someone else... presumably Nagato

[darkshadow]

Because if tobi gave nagato the rinnegan, then it had to be an evolved sharingan instead of something he sprouted on his own, which in turn means nagato wouldn't be able to use it 24/7 because it would wear him out like kakashi.

[Tofu #2]

Well it wears out Kakashi faster because yes it's not his, but also kakashi himself said he has low chakra.
We don't really know anything about the rinnegan, if it even uses chakra to keep active, but if it did, Nagato seems to have a shit load of chakra anyways

[DB_Hunter]

fuck. i was wrong about kakashi jumping his sharingan from 2 to MS. now we need an explanation of why he never used it

Doesn't it technically get to 3 right before the panel it starts to become an MS?

[viperwasp]

Doesn't it technically get to 3 right before the panel it starts to become an MS?

The rinnigan only evolves from the Sharingan if the user somehow gets or does thing with senju cells or what ever right? Why it evolved after his fight with senju. Is it not somewhat stated or somewhat suggested that Senju and uzumaki are closely related in some way? In the very least Uzumaki have special Chakra! It was stated even back with narutos mother. Maybe that has something to do with how or why nagato can use the rinnigan so much. Plus to me it seems like the rinnigan more so grants the user more control and chakra ability instead of taking it. Unless the user uses the more advanced abilities of the rinnigan. Nagato could use all Ninjutsu elemental types right? Was that ever directly related to the rinnigan. It was highly suggest at one time. Could that be more uzumaki related? I don't think it is but they have not fully explained that aspect I don't think. Nor the whole chakra controlling black rod things that naturally sprout... or the demon mazu type susanoo thing that Nagato summoned during the flash back with Danzo or even the hole paths and multiple body thing.

We don't really know anything about the rinnigan do we? Except that it probably evolves from the Sharingan? Even that fact is confusing. Well and it shares vision and grants a lot of special abilities a lot of them seem to be about restraining something. The rods control/suppress things, it has the ability to pull and repel, then it has the whole almost sealing ability that apparently created the moon etc.

The rinnigan almost felt like it was created to defeat a massively powerful beast! Were as the sharignan seems more natural and bent on pain, misery and destruction. Since the point were Madara evolved his sharingan into rinnigan I have been lost to trying to understand them.

[poopdeville]

We don't really know anything about the rinnigan do we? Except that it probably evolves from the Sharingan? Even that fact is confusing. Well and it shares vision and grants a lot of special abilities a lot of them seem to be about restraining something. The rods control/suppress things, it has the ability to pull and repel, then it has the whole almost sealing ability that apparently created the moon etc.

It's the other way around. The Sage of the Six Paths had a Rinnegan, and his kids or grand kids went on to found the strongest ninja clans. The Senju, Uzumaki, and Uchiha clan are all distant cousins, I think with Senju and Uchiha being genetically most different (since I hypothesize they were started by the Sage's son brothers, who were enemies, so that the clans didn't intermingle even over time).

So the Sharingan is a "watered down" Rinnegan, from when the Sage of the Six Path's powers started getting split up as he and his descendants made babies with "outsiders". Apparently, putting Senju and Uchiha blood together brings a person closer to the Sage of the Six Paths and a piece of his powers.

The Uzumaki might be the Senju-Uchiha's love child bloodline. Or maybe just an original clan that was neutral in the Senju-Uchiha war. But either way, it's plausible that the Uzumaki can have Sage/Rinnegan related powers. (And Naruto apparently does, since he gets Sage of the Six Paths-looking markings in Sage Mode.)

But yeah, the Sage probably created the Rinnegan's more commonly used powers (the rods, attraction-repulsion, etc.) for his fight against the Jyuubi. I picture the Sage of the Six Paths as having powers only limited by his imagination, and people like Nagato and Obito are only good enough to come up with only a few new moves as useful as the original Sage's.

[Tofu #2]

Doesn't it technically get to 3 right before the panel it starts to become an MS?

Yea thats why I was wrong. Didn't think he was gonna get to 3 AND MS at the same time

[DB_Hunter]

Ah Ok.

Kakashi developing the MS at such an early age does kind of throw his development off a bit. Having such an ability yet going through such dangerous situations as the fight with Zabuza, Orochimaru and of course Itachi without zapping them away in to another dimension whilst risking life and limb is a bit hard to explain away. The only reason I can think of is that he felt his MS was a result of killing Rin and as that was something he hated he didn't want to benefit from having committed such an awful action. However when it came to fighting Itachi he realised the only the way to defeat him and Akatsuki was to use MS which why he began to train using Kamui.

[Prof. Chaos]

Ah Ok.

Kakashi developing the MS at such an early age does kind of throw his development off a bit. Having such an ability yet going through such dangerous situations as the fight with Zabuza, Orochimaru and of course Itachi without zapping them away in to another dimension whilst risking life and limb is a bit hard to explain away. The only reason I can think of is that he felt his MS was a result of killing Rin and as that was something he hated he didn't want to benefit from having committed such an awful action. However when it came to fighting Itachi he realised the only the way to defeat him and Akatsuki was to use MS which why he began to train using Kamui.

I'm thinking its more or less he didnt have control over it and would pass out if he even attempted to use it. After the skip while him and Naruto were chasing Diedra, Kakashi uses it then, mentioning that he's been working on something new. Throughout the time, it seems every time he is able to use it a little bit more and more.

My 2 cents would be similar to SSJ stuff where every time they come close to death, they get stronger. So every time he uses it and is able to rest, he can use it more and more.

[oorainbow247oo]

I think it was Zestu screaming not Obito and this chapter rocked. Something happened between Rin and the Village of the Mist.

Madara turned her maybe on the basis that he could resurrect obito??