Shin Sekai Yori

[Kraco]

Agreed. And the fact Saki and Satoru, and perhaps others, now think they are getting closer to humans will only accelerate their evolution, if indeed the stray thoughts of cantus users during their sleep affect those outside of the towns. If they are already predisposed to consider them close to humans, their subconsciousness will only grant them more human characteristics. It will also be troublesome in the sense that once they get too close, humans might not be able to fight back anymore due to their conditioning. The cats won't stand a chance against heavily armed armies, either.

[Ryllharu]

I REALLY hated Saki and Satoru in this episode. Oh no, queerats don´t like letting themselves be eaten by their queen! Bad, bad queerats! You´re oh so cruel defending yourself against this awesome example of a "mother". WTF

If you watch her and listen to her words carefully, Saki actually wasn't that opposed to their actions and that upset Satoru further who then spent effort convincing her otherwise. That surprised me at first, I expected it to go the other way around. But then I remembered Saki never liked the fact that the queen once tried to kill Squealer.

So Saki was a bit horrified at the fact they had lobotomized her instead of some other method, but in truth she was having a difficult time finding faults in their logic.

What Saki didn't like was that Robber Fly was using the two of them as a shield and nuke. She recognized that right away, while Satoru didn't.

The pair are not as united as your post seems to imply.

[Buffalobiian]

What Saki didn't like was that Robber Fly was using the two of them as a shield and nuke. She recognized that right away, while Satoru didn't.

^ Which surprised me. I always thought Satoru was the smarter/more paranoid one when it came to dealing with queerat-interaction and politics.

[shinta|hikari]

Saki has the advantage of information. She knows far too much for someone her age. Satoru may feel something is off, but her knowledge supersedes that.

The queerats are really arrogant if they think they can overthrow their gods. Satoru and Saki could have wiped out a colony, or so Satoru claims (quite accurate judging from their power). Imagine what high ranking cantus users can do.

[MFauli]

The queerats are really arrogant if they think they can overthrow their gods.

I find this to be a highly interesting analogy to reality. Just one civilisation pushed back/forth. We = queerrats, using science to master nature/god/whatever. And we´re watching it all from the perspective of god/nature, instead of the usual human view point.

[Kraco]

The queerats are really arrogant if they think they can overthrow their gods.

Perhaps. If only they knew they don't actually need to do anything but survive and wait to win. But of course Squealer might want to see the change during his own lifetime.

[Buffalobiian]

UTW - Episode 16



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I'm happy that Satoru and Saki finally scored one together of course, but with the bonobos genes floating around, such acts of bonding don't carry the same significance that I have in my mind anymore.

I also wasn't aware that Saki and Maria were that close. The entire group had been presented together in such a away that it wasn't apparent the pair were the stronger "childhood friends" out of the bunch. (granted, I'm sure it was purposely presented that way).

Squealer is so saving that card up his sleeve for blackmailing. The key to diffusing the Squealer timebomb is whether Kinoumaru ends up siding with the humans or one of his own kind.

[Ryllharu]

At some point, Saki is going to have to go on a journey, find Maria, and kill her. She knows it, and that tears her heart out. I don't think a lot of it would have to do with Squealer's blackmail. I feel like it has more to do with something else Saki is pretending to forget about Maria amidst all the happy memories.

I'm not sure how much of the Shun-Phantom is Shun somehow still interacting with the world, and how much is Saki's subconscious. She frequently goes to it as a voice of reason.

[Kraco]

Squealer is so saving that card up his sleeve for blackmailing. The key to diffusing the Squealer timebomb is whether Kinoumaru ends up siding with the humans or one of his own kind.

It's not that simple at all. It all depends on Saki's fortitude and little else. Because the queerats can ill afford to try to confront any humans with an attitude like that. If Squealer tries to blackmail Saki and Saki refuses, then what? He goes to some other humans to rat on Saki? Maybe it would hurt Saki, maybe not, but most assuredly it would make those humans, who are already paranoid enough to slay their own children, become extremely suspicious of queerats. Like Maria's letter attempted to teach, these people no more stop at anything when they let fear control them, so it wouldn't spell well for queerats.

So, for now I'd be more inclined to think Squealer is smart enough not to employ it as a tool for blackmailing but rather a favour. He was pretty good at using the kids for his own ends, more than once, so I think such manipulation is more like his chosen path. Until queerats decide to wipe out humans entirely, of course.

I'm not sure how much of the Shun-Phantom is Shun somehow still interacting with the world, and how much is Saki's subconscious. She frequently goes to it as a voice of reason.

I guess I'm pretty miserable, but I can't help but hope it means Shun is still lingering... But naturally Shun's vague memory would play splendidly the role of Saki's inner voice of reason and conservatism considering Shun played it by the book, trying to kill himself once he became a karma demon.

[Buffalobiian]

Maybe it would hurt Saki, maybe not, but most assuredly it would make those humans, who are already paranoid enough to slay their own children, become extremely suspicious of queerats.

But it would prove the queerat's loyalty to the humans overall. I wouldn't be so sure the humans would fear them just yet, since they're pretty sure of themselves about their genetic superiority and ability to kill of queerats at will. They only fear karma demons and fiends because they're something they can't kill. (PS: all the more eerie that Squealer mentions human bones as if he's had to deal with them before).

As as for Shun, I think he's pretty dead. If a karma demon wants to kill themselves, I'd think nothing can stop them.

[Ryllharu]

If a karma demon wants to kill themselves, I'd think nothing can stop them.

Except their own subconscious...

Shun tried once, he failed. Shun tried again while sending Saki away, there's no way to know if he succeeded.

Which was stronger, Shun's desire to keep Saki safe from himself, or his desire to still be a part of her life?

[Buffalobiian]

Except their own subconscious...

Shun tried once, he failed. Shun tried again while sending Saki away, there's no way to know if he succeeded.

Shun thought he wanted to kill himself initially, but he actually didn't and his subconscious degraded the pills. The second time he well and truly wanted to die. I am convinced that Subaru's death got through to him that his very presence means death to those around him.

[Kraco]

But it would prove the queerat's loyalty to the humans overall.

No, it wouldn't. That's my whole point. It would only prove two things: Queerats withheld the information until it suited them to reveal it, and once they heard what Saki had to say, they might also learn queerats tried to blackmail humans. Many of those in power among the humans are paranoid. They don't fear only other humans, they also fear information and thus false minoshiros. If they realised queerats aren't only brainless half-animals, a paranoid mind wouldn't be able to take it for long.

[MFauli]

My favorite part of this episode was the beginning, where Maria basically explained how shit this whole current concept of their society was. Exactly what I´ve been saying last week. Nice.

As for the future, I see at least one of two things happening, necessary from a story-telling perspective:

A) The FULL-ON way: Saki and whoever´s left officially turn against the adults and fight. Destroying most of the villages, accepting everybody who shares their view.

B) The subtle way: Shun is still alive. As are other previously thought dead children, be they karma demons or not. Some big twist is unveiled, showing something like ... like all those who were supposed to be killed but survived, having managed to create a better society by themselves.

[Uchiha Barles]

I'm definitely appreciating the attention paid to detail by this series. Satoru finally brought up questions about the underlying mechanics of cantus and just what exactly must be powering it. His thoughts continue to venture into profitable territory and I really hope that gets fully developed. Not that I have any reason to think it won't. This kind of thing'll be needed because Maria's description of the village was definitely spot on. In particular, she says that it's not simply that the adults are terrified of what happens when a cantus user goes rogue. The way the keep tabs on things seems to suggest something more is happening. I can't tell if Maria is simply lacking knowledge that Saki is privy to, or if she's indeed becoming aware of something more sinister.

That dream Saki had was fantastically creepy. More like a bad shroom trip than a dream in fact, which got me thinking: I don't think she's as free from manipulation as it might seem. It's just a feeling, because certainly the conclusion that Maria has to die is a logical one given the talks she's had with the head of the ethics committee. Even so, something about that dream felt implanted, and her waking thoughts felt like a conditioned response to a stimulus. I'm thinking this probably because of how against the grain it is relative to her feelings on the matter. Thinking a bit more into it, it makes sense that they wouldn't let the members of group 1 completely from under their power even if they're given more leeway.

[Ryllharu]

I don't think you need to think that deeply about the necessity to kill Maria.

Mamoru will get killed, by someone. If not from their home community, someone or something else will. When that happens, Maria is going to become a fiend, and she will return to the villages to wreak her vengeance for driving them away in the first place.

It's not manipulation. Saki knows Maria better than anyone else.

[Buffalobiian]

UTW - Episode 17

[Kraco]

Quite rapid development. I wonder what kind of military technology the main army of Robber Fly is boasting, or if it was sheer strategic excellence that granted them an easy victory. The preview suggested Maria & Mamoru might be somehow involved, but who knows. I certainly see no reason why they would intervene in queerat conflicts. Unless they in fact never fled far but have been living supported by Robber Fly.

Other than that, I was happy Saki and Satoru weren't together. Although I guess there's a danger this incident will cause that to happen.

[Ryllharu]

The Giant Hornets got completely annihilated in a subsequent battle.

Now this is a pretty big if, but what if Robber Fly has Maria working for them?

Saki and Satoru contemplated the effects of lobotomization on humans. The Robber Fly alliance has become experts at it working on their queens, despite the crude efforts they once had with Robber Fly's queen.

I'm not suggesting that they captured Maria, lobotomized her into a compliant state. But what is the possibility that the Robber Flies captured Mamoru lobotomized him, and are using him as coercion? At first, I would think she would go on a bloody rampage, slaughtering all of them to get him back. But what if they had performed it in such a way that she would need them to take care of him for her? Mamoru seems a likely target for capture, he's too timid and would be too trusting of queerrats after his departure from society.

I think Squealer/Yakomaru is too smart to merely be used as a pawn by Maria in her scheme of revenge against society. He would certainly use her if the offer was presented, but he wouldn't tolerate living under her command, he views queerrats as equals to the gods these days. I can't blame him really, he finds it so easy to trick all but the most wary of them (Saki and Asahina Tomiko).


As an aside, 26 year old Saki is hot. I like her air of sternness as well, always did, but now it suits her all the more. I also wonder if she has still been working on her telomere regeneration exercises with Tomiko. Saki working for the exospecies department is not something I ever would have guessed she'd do. Now I am really curious what happened in those last several years.

[Buffalobiian]

I didn't get the commentary during the fight. One side is shooting the other with firearms, and they're surprised that the ones being shot at have bamboo shields? wtf.

While I think Maria is working with Squealer to destroy the Giant Hornets and the village, I don't quite buy the use-Mamouru-as-bait theory just yet, though the more I think about it the more it sounds plausible.

As for Squealer refusing to work with or under a god, I wouldn't be so sure about that. He's got his pride, but he's also crafty. If he has to bow his head to a god in order to use them, so be it. Dealing with one or two gods after the village is destroyed is much easier than trying to overthrow an entire village by themselves.