Shin Sekai Yori

[Buffalobiian]

I thought death feedback is genetically programmed? What's the training?

[Kraco]

Surely not. It doesn't sound like something you could genetically program. At most it works in the background, making the training possible. Lessening aggression, increasing empathy and regret, that sort of things.

[Buffalobiian]

If death feedback uses training/hypnosis, then it doesn't really make sense that humanoids like the Queerats (which the monk clearly doesn't recognise as humans) set off his feedback.

If the Cantis user doesn't believe they're harming a person, then the feedback shouldn't work if it's acquired through training.

[Kraco]

I don't think that's an area known very well even in RL. Some people are so delicate they can't even bear to see blood. Some can slay non-mammals no problem, but would feel uneasy if required to kill for example a cute bunny. Others can kill any animal without a second thought, yet would suffer mentally if they killed a fellow human in cold blood. Lastly there are those for whom human lives are inconsequential. However, I reckon it's compeletely unknown how much of this is due to anything genetic, how much to the surroundings, apart from obvious mental disorder cases. So, I'd say that no matter how much they were genetically manipulated, they still need thorough training and psychological conditioning.

[Buffalobiian]

UTW - Episode 06


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Hmm, strangely enough Satoru hasn't suffered from Death Feedback by killing those foreign queerats. The last two episodes have been at a pretty breakneck pace. I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing, just different from what I was used to from watching the first 3 eps.

I'd hate for Satoru to die. I find him to be more interesting than Shin. He was kinda annoying when nothing happened in the village, but now that they're in a crisis he's showing how he can put his proactiveness to work.

As with previous weeks, the episode had me engrossed. The portrayal of squealer being more dangerous and shifty than you can read from his words alone was well done. I was actually entertaining the idea that the Robber Fly might have even teamed up with the Ground Spiders to kill off the human rulers - but then it would make no sense to have Squealer save them in the first place.

The most confusing part was that Saki didn't tell Satoru to reverse he own seal. Perhaps she thought he might lose his powers, or that herself knowing the process is hypnotic would render it useless (but so would the Seal, if that was the case).

[Kraco]

As with previous weeks, the episode had me engrossed. The portrayal of squealer being more dangerous and shifty than you can read from his words alone was well done. I was actually entertaining the idea that the Robber Fly might have even teamed up with the Ground Spiders to kill off the human rulers - but then it would make no sense to have Squealer save them in the first place.

I was thinking the Robber Fly got their Queen kidnapped by the Ground Spiders and they were blackmailed to lead the humans to an ambush. However, in retrospect I think their behavior is explained by their simplistic animalistic nature and the fact they consider humans (cantus users) gods. Of course they might now start to doubt that godhood, but they probably might be more willing to push any deeper analysis to the future and concentrate on the immediate problem of the Ground Spiders. In short, it might be useless to try to use only logic to explain their actions. The Ground Spiders look more developed and witty, though.

The most confusing part was that Saki didn't tell Satoru to reverse he own seal. Perhaps she thought he might lose his powers, or that herself knowing the process is hypnotic would render it useless (but so would the Seal, if that was the case).

Satoru couldn't do the thing in reverse because he doesn't know Saki's mantra. But I think it's a plot failure that Saki's own hypnotic block is still in effect after that. Satoru's case is very clear, he didn't need to realise anything, but since Saki now fully knows what's going on, she ought to be able to click her own switch - or rather the switch shouldn't be there anymore in the first place. It seems weird her hypnosis would still work if she fully knows that flimsy thing is the only thing holding her back.

[Xelbair]

I think if you 'unseal' someone's cantus you have to redo the death feedback training - at least that's what this ep is suggesting.

Kraco - it think is is ok - hypnotizing yourself is really hard... and maybe the whole sealing makes them forget their own mantra(which i assume is needed for them to use cantus).

[Buffalobiian]

@Kraco: Saki could have just told him her mantra, but then..

and maybe the whole sealing makes them forget their own mantra(which i assume is needed for them to use cantus).

I guess that explanation works somewhat. I interpreted the hypnosis as inducing the belief that your cantus is sealed and doesn't work (rather than selectively wiping your memory of your mantra).

[Kraco]

I don't buy them needing the mantra to use cantus. That's just another aspect of the training and conditioning allowing more control, both precautionary and in case something goes wrong. However, I can't see how Saki could have had such a revelation and could have unlocked Satori from the hypnosis without realising she's not really incapable of using her own powers in the first place, that she only thinks so. It's obvious they forget their own mantra, and that's precisely why they are heavily discouraged to share their mantras with each other (since those aren't forgotten).

Well, nevertheless, I won't be too dissatisfied with the current plot progress if Saki does awake on her own when Satori's stamina fails for good or he even dies, and Saki has to defend herself.

Other than that, I'd also like to know what happened to the rest of them.

[shinta|hikari]

Satoru dying is fine with me. He is being too stubborn and needlessly brutal for me to want him alive.

I think hypnosis in this show works differently from RL, where hypnosis mostly has no effects at all. It seems to act more like a spell, and undoing it by using a similar ritual is the only way.

[Ryllharu]

Saki undoing his seal didn't work quite the way they thought it would. She has definitely noticed that Satoru has become substantially more aggressive, and called him out on it. While a certain amount of it can be tied to fatigue, frustration, and obvious rage at the foreign tribe, there was more to it. Saki didn't quite recognize the way he was acting. She may have undone quite a bit more than she thought.

The both of them realized by the end that Saki not using her own abilities is starting to gain attention. They very likely will kill her if they find out, so the two of them returning to safety quickly is paramount. They also caught the potential of the "friendly" tribe using them for their own ends. They were most certainly not taking the pair to safety, they were using them as a sort of "nuclear" option. They were running the group through the worst of the trapped areas, they weren't lured in by the other tribe thanks the scouts making it through safely.

This is another part of why Satoru is getting desperate. The most expedient way to get home is brutality. Satoru said it himself. Fear works the best on the queerrats, for both tribes.

This was somewhat of a rambling post, but you're too hard on Satoru. Something is off about him after what Saki did, but nevertheless, the situation somewhat demands his current methodology.

[Kraco]

Yeah, I also think Saki reusing the hypnosis might have unlocked a bit more than just Satoru's cantus.

The "friendly" tribe using them for their own ends is obvious and perfectly natural. That's what you would do with living gods, assuming the living gods won't kill you outright, which would also be perfectly natural. You seek from the gods what you can't do on your own. If the gods can't do it either, they become instantly useless. I think that was pulled off pretty well in this episode, especially the small moment of uncertainty when Saki made the careless comment nearing the end.

[shinta|hikari]

I don't hate Satoru, I just don't need him alive to enjoy the show. I also find it more interesting when even main characters that are developed for a few episodes can die, making the suspense more real.

If Satoru can do all this with his Cantus, I wonder how powerful Shin is, considering he is an honor student and is viewed even by Satoru as an elite.

[Buffalobiian]

UTW - Episode 07



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<<Obligatory "great episode!" comment be here>>

I'm once again impressed by Satoru's ability to think things through here. Saki helped him out as far as strategy goes against the catapults, but his doubts about the queerats and initiative to lead their escape were much needed for group survival (even if you argue that his doubts were ultimately "misplaced" since Kiroumaru ultimately helped them).

I'm not sure if Squealer's guidance to the lake was all part of the plan, or whether Kiroumaru simply tracked him there and decided to help out. I find it strange that Shun and the others would be conveniently waiting at the exact same spot when Saki and Satoru went through so much more trouble to get there. It would seem more likely that they received Kiroumaru's help somehow.

There seems to be great variance between all these queerats, from the lowly Robber Flys, bandit-like Ground Spiders.. and now the seemingly most advanced, war-worthy Giant Hornets. One would even describe Kiroumaru as being handsome. I'd say his decision to help them (and defy the Ethics Council) was based on the word spreading about Saki saving queerrats from before.

The preview for the next episode suggests that our group is starting to go rogue after having the magic of hypnosis lifted from them.. but the whole remove-bad-children system should still be active, which suggests they've all be conscious of how adults perceive them ever since and adjusted their image accordingly.

[Kraco]

Hard to say. I think the stress and constant danger to their life was making them paranoid, rather than there being any real reason to escape. I did get the feeling Kiroumaru was highly intelligent and I doubt he bought the whole godhood thing above the level of the dangerous psychic powers. Besides, to think the village would make queerats eliminate gods is ridiculous. Nothing would plant a seed of rebellion better than to have the queerats experience killing humans firsthand. It could work with a special, isolated death squad living totally separated from the rest of the queerats but not otherwise. Kiroumaru might have helped them simply because Satoru saved him from the explosion earlier.

I don't think Kiroumaru helped Shun's group, though. They obviously had faced no hardships whatsoever, so they escaped successfully after the monk's death and then likely camped around that very lake for the whole time Saki and Satoru were fighting for their lives. I have to confess learning this lowered Shun in my eyes quite a bit. It's kind of sad Satoru is now the most experienced among them... But then again, Satoru is still Satoru, so I wouldn't be surprised if he was the one making the most mistakes now that they are back.

[Ryllharu]

Judging by the narration before the ED, combined with the preview, I'm guessing that, like before, Saki's method of restoring a Cantus isn't quite the same as the method originally used to lock a Canti user down from their true, world-dominating strength that they're born with. They're brought down from their initial strength, and further ingrained with mental compulsions and restrictions. It's been carefully crafted over centuries. Saki was inexperienced with the methodology, and is just unravelling it, repeating the words, perhaps missing the other parts that she was hypnotized into forgetting about. Like the flashback when the old man was stabbing himself and convincing her that she was doing it in order to ingrain the death-sickness in her. What other parts was she made to forget?

So with a bit of a time skip, we will likely see more and more of the instability creeping its way into their personalities. Satoru became more aggressive, and from the earlier ominous narration, Maria goes berserk at some point, my guess would be due to jealousy toward Saki.

We'll also likely see a rivalry between Satoru and Shun over Saki. Shun and Saki like each other, her tears thinking she'd never make it back while thinking of their night on the river show that, but Satoru and Saki also have a connection (more of an emotional entanglement) due to their escape that can never be broken.

Maybe that's what pushing Maria over the edge. She wants one of them, but they both want Saki, and her jealousy erupts. The existence of the narration proves she didn't kill Saki, so perhaps Maria will be torn between her hatred and fondness for Saki.

[Buffalobiian]

UTW - Episode 08


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Wow.. didn't see that coming, even if in retrospect the hairstyles in last week's PV were screaming BL.

[Kraco]

Wow.. didn't see that coming,

Yeah, although looking back at it now, this surely was the most obvious way to make the "bonobo genes" evident. In any case I'm happy it didn't last longer than a single episode. It made its point already in that limited time, and it was annoying to watch Shun with somebody else than Saki.

I wonder what happened to Shun. I'd hate to think he was disposed of, but with this series it's not altogether impossible. He even left a memento behind, in Saki's hands. But right now I'm still inclined to think his fate will be tied to the next arc, and he won't be found dead by the end of it.

The best scene of the episode was the meeting between the masked priest and Shun, and the deranged grin Shun sported afterwards, nicely followed later by Saki's memory of the eye peering out of the cracked eggshell. In my opinion it demonstrated how Shun was all the time expecting repercussions from their little side trip two years prior, and he couldn't anymore handle the stress. So, when it finally happened, he was actually glad it's all over. It would have been nice to know what the priest said inside the distortion bubble, but I guess that's not essential.

[Buffalobiian]

Yeah, although looking back at it now, this surely was the most obvious way to make the "bonobo genes" evident. In any case I'm happy it didn't last longer than a single episode. It made its point already in that limited time, and it was annoying to watch Shun with somebody else than Saki.

I, on the other hand, am very pleased with the results. Bonobo genes ftw!

I wonder what Maria is to Saki. Is she just a sexual frustration outlet, or is it a case of "I love Maria, but I love Shun more" triangle?

[Ryllharu]

Well, that episode didn't at all go the way I thought it would!


Theirs is a weird relationship. Maria is definitely the dominant one in their relationship, but Saki is only there because she couldn't have Shun. Maria may be Saki's source of comfort, but once there, Maria is the one in control.