If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
Nothing awfully surprising in this episode, pretty much just verifying officially what we all have guessed so far. But then again, naturally this was quite an important episode by having Saki hear about the plans those in charge have for her. I was looking forward to some other sort of revelations from the ethics committee chief, something relate to Shun, but I guess that was nothing but my own useless hope of Shun not being dead... It's still a pity he needed to become Saki's own experience of a karma demon.
If I had to pick some minor surprise, it would be the short history of dealing with fiends and karma demons. The world seems to have a dwindling human population, so one would have surmised there were more of those in the past and thus traditions of getting rid of them safely would have existed for a long time.
Quite an interesting ending, in any case. Becoming a fiend seems to require preconditioning and doesn't happen suddenly without any warning, so I doubt Mamoru (or Maria) will become one now, but who knows. They could have the signs simply hidden beneath the repetitive reprogramming this group has suffered due to the summer trip and then the Shun case.
I love the visuals in this series. The fiend starting in a struggling human guise, and then tearing apart to become a enflamed demon with a human shape, or the karma demon flashing a skeletal form with tears running down its face.
I felt it was pretty obvious what will set Saki's decision. She would either succeed as Ethics Committee head because she wants her memories back of Shun (not very likely), or she will have to stop or even kill one of her friends (almost certain). Mamoru doesn't seem that likely, but Maria is still the primary. I'm not willing to let go of that ominous warning that we got so early on just yet.
Lately, especially after they became official partners, Maria has gotten past her teasing and toying with Mamoru. She has all but vocally admitted she loves him. Maria was protecting him last episode, and furthermore, she was very concerned by him running away here. She's almost desperate to find him. She knows a lot more about him than we've ever seen her say before, so she does pay a great deal of attention to him. I think she is far too proud to admit how much she loves him. She's upset now, and revealing her hand a little.
I suspect that Mamoru will get killed as a result of this. The Board of Education is paranoid after all. Despite Asahina's request to leave them be, they may get fed up with how many chances Group 1 has been given, particularly after they've already had one major failure. If one turned into a karma demon, they're probably afraid another will do after acting erratic. But that act itself will drive Maria into becoming a Fiend. She will seek revenge for Mamoru, and snap, probably slaughtering a group of queerrats and then everyone in the school. This will force Saki's hand.
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Big fan of Asahina. She was very elegant and attractive, both in the flashback and now.
Lastly, Maria is really cute in her cloak.
That's what I was also thinking, but this show fortunately isn't so straight-forward and linear I'd yet sign that prediction. It could happen, certainly, but will it happen now? If it does happen and if it's the last thing needed to push Saki into accepting the position, it would be kind of... too smooth a ride plot wise. Although if she then did something radical once in power, it would naturally make the plot again meaningful.Originally Posted by Ryllharu
They never mentioned the other "benefits" that a Ethics Committee head is granted, just the release of all her suppressed memories. What if they also undo the death feedback? If Maria does become a Fiend, I can't see her going down quietly. She wouldn't be as easy to trick as with pretending a poison is medicine. Also, Saki can't die as a result, as in how the doctor sacrificed himself. It would be something else if Saki actually had to do it with her own cantus. Saki shows a great deal of devotion toward her friends. That led to why she got nominated in the first place. Maria is her closest friend. I wouldn't say that would be smooth, though I also wouldn't say that plot point would be very original.
There is also the issue of Saki's sister to deal with yet. They haven't explained the mirror (which daughter actually made it?), or why her sister was removed. I suspect that will become a bigger issue if they return Saki's memories. There's a lot more to it than just killing her because she was weak, or she lost control too.
While I'm thinking like Ryll as well, I'm also expecting my thoughts to be wrong as you've said. Since I've got no other alternatives though, the money's still on Mamoru triggering Maria.
Too right. Satoru's got good genes. I wonder what place he'd have in the society as an adult? I can only really think of him as being on the Education board since he's quick and decisive but not quite compasionate/open enough. Their time during the Summer camp would suggest he's also on the paranoid/cynical side. I'd even say he had more nerves than Saki then.
He just doesn't fit being a librarian (the only other role we've been introduced to).
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
There's also community utility workers, like Saki's father. He runs the waterwheel and electricity lines.
Maybe they'll put him in charge of queerat relations. He has proven he's quite efficient at... dealing with them.
Sub-sophomoric joy ahead!
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"You are not free whose liberty is won by the rigour of other, more righteous souls. Your are merely protected. Your freedom is parasitic, you suck the honourable man dry and offer nothing in return. You who have enjoyed freedom, who have done nothing to earn it, your time has come. This time you will stand alone and fight for yourselves. Now you will pay for your freedom in the currency of honest toil and human blood."
- Inquisitor Czevak
That is quite the independent observation. I never noticed it.
[UTW] Shinsekai Yori - 13
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The biggest question from this episode is what exactly saved Mamoru? Mamoru is far too weak to crush a copycat and Maria was sent home.
Maybe Shun isn't quite as dead as we might have thought.
I'm guessing the Education Committee picked Mamoru as a sacrifice for a test. Like Satoru's grandmother said, the group is kept alive at the request of the Ethics Committee, who finds promise in them (mostly Saki), a certain resiliency, while the Education Committee has repeatedly proposed that the whole group be purged because they're paranoid.
In killing Mamoru, the Education Committee hopes to provoke another one of them into snapping, justifying the execution of the entire group. They probably really don't like that Asahina met with Saki, and proposed that she be her successor.
Last edited by Ryllharu; Sat, 12-22-2012 at 06:45 AM.
I automatically assumed Mamoru attacked the cat there out of fear since I had no better explanation. The Ethics committee already said that they don't interfere with the Education department though, so I wonder if they'll make such a case by stopping a kill.
I'm not quite "feeling" Maria's attachment to Mamoru still. Time has passed, but it still feels pretty jarring to me how it's gone from:
"I love Saki and don't give a shit about Mamoru"
to
"Mamoru!!!!"
My interpretation is torn between bonobos-love and a weak-brother/overanxious-sister relationship.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
If the education committee is indeed at odds with the ethics committee on letting the members of that group stay alive, I can see why that society is in the precarious state its in. To *not* utilize people like Saki and Satoru for their talents is absurd, even if they broke rules at some point. One of things that's been bugging me is that, not only is there no hard counter to cantus, even by way of cantus itself, but thus far there's been no discussion about it. No discussion on why such a counter would be possible or impossible, desirable or undesirable. You need people in place to examine that kind of thing with candor, and as a whole, they don't seem to have (or have had) very many such people.
"You are not free whose liberty is won by the rigour of other, more righteous souls. Your are merely protected. Your freedom is parasitic, you suck the honourable man dry and offer nothing in return. You who have enjoyed freedom, who have done nothing to earn it, your time has come. This time you will stand alone and fight for yourselves. Now you will pay for your freedom in the currency of honest toil and human blood."
- Inquisitor Czevak
The point is they're paranoid about their experiences turning them into destructive forces. It's not entirely unjustified, Shun was turned.
Also, to date we haven't been shown that a strong Cantus is somehow beneficial to society. It seems more like a convenient tool to life. The Ethics head also said it wasn't a requirement for her position, and Ethics sits at the top of the hierarchy.
They explained about how two Cantus interferring with each other is a big taboo back in one of the earlier episodes (ep2?). It was during the games where you pushed a ball with puppets. One guy from the opposite team slowed down Shun's puppet. He was subsequently never to be seen again.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
Here's my understanding of the defenses they have against cantus users when the social conditioning fails or when conscious control of the cantus is lost:
1) Cats sent to track down and kill the cantus users.
2) Relying on the cantus users to take themselves out.
3) Queerats
Based on what I've seen thus far of cantus users, 1 rogue user could potentially bring down society. 10 could potentially bring down the planet. We know how easily the cats can be defeated, we've seen it happen twice, maybe 3 times. We know how unreliable it is to expect the users to commit suicide. Shun failed even while actually trying (but being unwilling). And the queerats...a rogue user would rip them to shreds, let alone more than one. The methods of defense in place just do not live up to the potential harm posed by unrestrained cantus. I don't see how that society has sustained itself or will continue to sustain itself.
This is why their paranoia and wanting to kill the kids in that group is a problem for me, and it has nothing to do with their cantus. Saki and Satoru are inquisitive. While Saki's mental and emotional stability is exceptional, Satoru's displayed a tremendous amount of insight. These qualities were discovered outside of the curriculum established by the school. Looking at them through paranoia goggles just blinds them to the potential those kids have to help the society. If their way of doing things ends up in the culling of a lot of people like Saki and Satoru, that's a problem. They seem to be working to maintain a status quo that's going to inevitably end in their eradication, when they should be working towards improving their situation. The cowards in charge don't have what it takes. You need some of the people they're trying to kill.
For instance, why is it taboo to interfere directly with another user's cantus? I do recall them saying that, but I thought initially it was only for the sake of the game's rules.
Last edited by Uchiha Barles; Sat, 12-22-2012 at 12:18 PM. Reason: More stuff to bitch about
"You are not free whose liberty is won by the rigour of other, more righteous souls. Your are merely protected. Your freedom is parasitic, you suck the honourable man dry and offer nothing in return. You who have enjoyed freedom, who have done nothing to earn it, your time has come. This time you will stand alone and fight for yourselves. Now you will pay for your freedom in the currency of honest toil and human blood."
- Inquisitor Czevak
Nothing would make me happier than Shun still lingering, but I wouldn't trust on that. I also got the impression it was Mamoru doing that, but perhaps it was half-subconsciously, leading him down a very dangerous path. But maybe it was, after all, someone else who doesn't agree with the Education committee's decision. It would be strange, in my opinion, if eliminating citizens' children, for any reason, didn't generate opposition, so technically there could be any number of people willing to save him, but naturally the Ethic's committee still seems the most likely helper, unless there's a mole within the very Education committee itself.
Wasn't that the theme of the show? That a group of children find out truths about their world that's slowly destroying itself. That's what the paranoia and lack of tools, ideas, and methods is doing.
They´re all assholes. OH, suddenly you claim you care about Mamoru? Yeah, sure. smh
As for how Mamoru survived that copycat attack...it´s either that Shun is really alive in some form and guarding his friends. Or, Mamoru´s true Cantus powers were showing. Or maybe we witnessed his first steps towards becoming another karma demon.
Whatever. Wonder what they´re about to do now. Sacrifice Mamoru or go back to how things were before their mind being erased. And flee or start a revolution?
I'm not quite sure how to guage Mamoru's power. They've mentioned things from "weak" to "average".. and they're not exactly the same thing.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
Well, I don't know if I'd call it the theme, mainly because I don't quite know where this story is heading, and there's enough missing of where this story came from. It'd be nice to see what the other societies that arose after the dark ages were/are like, as well as some of the details of how they handled the problem of out of control cantus users. Because there could be reasons they don't try. A friend of mine likened it to everyone walking around with a pocket nuke as a vital organ. There's no counter to that, and there are reasons you might not want to experiment with that. I'm just not convinced that Cantus has been properly presented as such a case yet.
"You are not free whose liberty is won by the rigour of other, more righteous souls. Your are merely protected. Your freedom is parasitic, you suck the honourable man dry and offer nothing in return. You who have enjoyed freedom, who have done nothing to earn it, your time has come. This time you will stand alone and fight for yourselves. Now you will pay for your freedom in the currency of honest toil and human blood."
- Inquisitor Czevak
That's just it though. The implication has been that there aren't any others left. What wasn't wiped out by the god-kings was wiped out by karma demons, fiends, or warped by the subconscious collective within the Holy Barrier.
Queerrats are quite a bit more intelligent than any of the other warped species (monoshiros, exploding flycatchers, blowdogs, etc.) that it might be more likely they didn't start as an animal, but are de-evolved humans.
And the most savage of the queerrat tribes are from across the sea. The closer to the civilization, the more advanced they are, the more humanlike. It could go one way, or the other. Maybe they did start as mice or rats and become more and more evolved the closer they get. At this point I'm no longer sure which.
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