Naruto Chapter 598

[b1gdawg]

It wouldn't be the first time Kishi ignored previously stated "facts" about the sharingan.


Plus, why would Izuna wear a mask to hide his identity? It would be rather anti-climatic to hide his identity for this long, only to reveal him and have nobody recognize him or know who he is.


Honestly, if you're not convinced by this point that it is Obito, then it's going to take seeing his face and having Kakashi say "...O..bi...to...!?" Because Kishi has done everything possible to let us know who he is, except for show his face at this point.

When was the first time Kishi ignored facts about the sharingan. I completely forgot about the going blind thing, but now that i heard it, im 100% sold that it's NOT obito. I wish i see ur reaction when u finally realize it isn't Obito. You would really need to stfu.


Tobi wears a mask to hide his identity obviously. People didn't know he had a sharingan because of the mask, and that mask helped him in his fight with Konan, she thought he only had 1 sharingan, but he used that 2nd sharingan that no1 knew about to save his life with Izanagi.


What other Uchiha actually needs Eyes? Either some1 going blind for over using their mangekyou, or some1 who lost both their eyes. Hmmmm, i wonder who that might be.

[Sidnne]

Tobi wears a mask to hide his identity obviously. People didn't know he had a sharingan because of the mask, and that mask helped him in his fight with Konan, she thought he only had 1 sharingan, but he used that 2nd sharingan that no1 knew about to save his life with Izanagi.

lol. Yes, I know he wears it to hide his identity. Thank you for that valuable tid-bit. I didn't ask why Tobi wears a mask, I asked why Izuna would have a need to hide his identity from people who don't know what he looks like anyway. And why the need for Kishi to hide the indentity from the readers and make a huge mystery (while dropping hints that it's Obito all along the way) for 5+ years, when the readers wouldn't know or care about Izuna either.

What other Uchiha actually needs Eyes? Either some1 going blind for over using their mangekyou, or some1 who lost both their eyes. Hmmmm, i wonder who that might be.

Sasuke from the future??!!


It is absolutely hilarious that you get so upset every time someone talks about Obito. You even result to name-calling and direct insults over it. Too funny.

[UChessmaster]

When was the first time Kishi ignored facts about the sharingan. I completely forgot about the going blind thing, but now that i heard it, im 100% sold that it's NOT obito. I wish i see ur reaction when u finally realize it isn't Obito. You would really need to stfu.

I adressed this like 8 seconds ago :/

I love it how you shrug off any evidence for Obito as circunstancial but when the slightest (fake) hint at not Obito comes out you start handing out invitations to your "Obito is not Tobi!" party inmediately. It has been asked already and you haven`t answered at all, but just for fun i`ll ask again, what is your problem with Tobi being Obito? Did you bet your soul on it? Do you know Kishimoto? Are you actually Obito?

[DB_Hunter]

Why would Izuna wear a mask? Why would Obito wear a mask? Why would anyone wear a mask? They could all just out themselves and fight, I guess it's what ninja's do.

Kurama is always going on about chakra, not just by who people are. Besides, Tobi has shown regenerative abilities not just the use of Kamui. Pretty advanced stuff for a teenager on his own. Plus he knew how to get around the barrier protecting Konoha, something which must be in addition to having use of space-time justu as Minato commented on this despite knowing the nature of Tobi's phasing ability. He also knew a hell of a lot of stuff about the best time to get Kurama out of Kushina. All this can't have been done in the space of a few years, which is what makes it look suspicious or plot hole-ish.

[UChessmaster]

Why would Izuna wear a mask? Why would Obito wear a mask? Why would anyone wear a mask? They could all just out themselves and fight, I guess it's what ninja's do.

If i had a boulder crushing scar, i`d wear a mask.

Besides, Tobi has shown regenerative abilities not just the use of Kamui. Pretty advanced stuff for a teenager on his own.

Hashirama`s cells...

Plus he knew how to get around the barrier protecting Konoha, something which must be in addition to having use of space-time justu as Minato commented on this despite knowing the nature of Tobi's phasing ability.

He also has the ability to teleport, he teleported there.

He also knew a hell of a lot of stuff about the best time to get Kurama out of Kushina. All this can't have been done in the space of a few years, which is what makes it look suspicious or plot hole-ish.

The Uchiha clan has some strong tailed beast taiming powers, i`m sure that for an Uchiha, such knowledge is not that huge of a deal.

Tobi wears a mask to hide his identity obviously. People didn't know he had a sharingan because of the mask, and that mask helped him in his fight with Konan, she thought he only had 1 sharingan, but he used that 2nd sharingan that no1 knew about to save his life with Izanagi.

Tobi never had a second sharingan.

[DB_Hunter]

If i had a boulder crushing scar, i`d wear a mask.

Only that when we see his face when it is revealed in front of Sasuke and Konan there is no scar.

Hashirama`s cells...

OK so we add grave robbing, DNA extracting and biological mutations to this teenager's already impressive array of skills

He also has the ability to teleport, he teleported there.

Minato knew that yet he still commented on it, meaning like I said before it must require additional knowledge to get past the barrier not just teleporting.

The Uchiha clan has some strong tailed beast taiming powers, i`m sure that for an Uchiha, such knowledge is not that huge of a deal.

That may be, but it must hardly be bed time stories that are told to all the little Uchiha kids that everyone knows about them. Hypnosis to control Kurama is one thing, knowing about the seal's details is another.

[UChessmaster]

Only that when we see his face when it is revealed in front of Sasuke and Konan there is no scar.

There are scars on his face...

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__...f_his_mask.JPG

OK so we add grave robbing, DNA extracting and biological mutations to this teenager's already impressive array of skills

Grave robbing isn`t a skill, what impressive array? his sharingan techniques and his sharingan techniques? getting someone else`s techniques isn`t hard, he already transplanted his own techniques to Kakashi.

Minato knew that yet he still commented on it, meaning like I said before it must require additional knowledge to get past the barrier not just teleporting.

Minato didn`t know the exact way his technique works, he just took an educated guess. The whole point of that scene was to point out that Tobi wasn`t some random guy, not to say "Hey guys! this guy is too good, he can`t be Obito!". That said i admit he has a lot of knowledge, but that`s more of an unexplained plot and less of a plot-hole.

That may be, but it must hardly be bed time stories that are told to all the little Uchiha kids that everyone knows about them. Hypnosis to control Kurama is one thing, knowing about the seal's details is another.

Sasuke managed to cancel out the Kyuubi that one time with zero Uchiha training.

[Y]

I'd just like to note that Tobi derisively refers to Kakashi's Kamui as a borrowed power. If the person behind the mask is anyone except Obito Uchiha, this remark makes no sense, because he has Obito's eye and is thus also using a borrowed power.

[DB_Hunter]

There are scars on his face...

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__...f_his_mask.JPG

Those seem more like old man wrinkles than scars

Grave robbing isn`t a skill, what impressive array? his sharingan techniques and his sharingan techniques? getting someone else`s techniques isn`t hard, he already transplanted his own techniques to Kakashi.

It is a skill when it comes down to find the body of a long dead legendary ninja who, after being presumably pillaged by Orochimaru and who knows else, would have had his grave guarded or body moved to a secret location by Konoha to prevent further such actions. His array of techniques include his MS, his regeneration, his knowledge of seals, ability to extract a bijuu. That from what we have seen only, which we could assume isn't everything. Kakashi is a ninja of a thousand techniques but how many have we seen him use? What we see isn't necessarily all that a person has.

Minato didn`t know the exact way his technique works, he just took an educated guess.

Exactly. Even though he was right, lets disregard that for now. As far as Minato knew that was his best hunch, and despite thinking it was space-time jutsu he mentioned the ability to get past the barrier as something additional.

Sasuke managed to cancel out the Kyuubi that one time with zero Uchiha training.

I already mentioned hypnosis as being seperate from being able to deal in bijuu seals.

I'd just like to note that Tobi derisively refers to Kakashi's Kamui as a borrowed power. If the person behind the mask is anyone except Obito Uchiha, this remark makes no sense, because he has Obito's eyes and is thus also using a borrowed power.

It could be said by Izuna (if that is who Tobi is) in the context of an Uchiha speaking to a non-Uchiha.

[Sidnne]

DB, you're just reaching now. All the evidence points to Obito, you're just trying to come up with any reason imaginable to suggest otherwise.

[DB_Hunter]

I am trying, but I'm doing so without saying it can't be Obito. It may well be. I guess I'm playing devil's advocate to test the validity of the Obito theory. Of course the easiest explanation of this could be just to say it is Obito, but I still hold on to the idea it would be a more entertaining story if it turns out to be Izuna as then you could take it to the level of the Madara/Izuna pairing and how they lived vs the Itachi/Sasuke pairing and their interactions. Plus throw in a bit of politics and philosophy on how to deal with conflict, loyalty and philosophy and you have a more mature storyline than just some bitter sod who just went emo and wants to play out his fantasy on everyone.

Plus I haven't debated properly on these forums for years, and in a while I may not get the time to do any of that again.

[Y]

Anything sounds better when you try to dress one side up and mock the other one. Izuna Uchiha is a non-character with zero lines of dialogue in the entire series and a reveal of him would turn the entire proceedings into another generic Uchiha brother wankfest, while Obito's bonds of friendship slowly turning into bitter mistrust and hatred reflects the Naruto/Sasuke relationship.

[Sidnne]

I just don't see how Izuna fits in with the theme of the Naturoverse. That theme being "I've been abandoned/rejected/not accepted, nobody understands/loves/accepts me, but I'll show them!" It began with Naruto in the very first chapter, and has been replayed over and over again with Haku, Gaara, Kimmimaru, Sasuke, Nagato, Kabuto, even the Bijuu. Obito fits in with that theme.

Anything sounds better when you try to dress one side up and mock the other one. Izuna Uchiha is a non-character with zero lines of dialogue in the entire series and a reveal of him would turn the entire proceedings into another generic Uchiha brother wankfest, while Obito's bonds of friendship slowly turning into bitter mistrust and hatred reflects the Naruto/Sasuke relationship.

Jiraiya : Orochimaru, Kakashi : Obito, Naruto : Sasuke.

[Y]

Yeah that pretty much sums it up. The series really is all about different responses to that fundamental crisis.

[FireEmblem]

If it's Obito, then he's an even bigger b*tch than Sasuke has been. Sasuke looks like Gandhi compared to Tobito.

[DB_Hunter]

Jiraiya and Orochimaru, as well as Naruto and Sasuke, had their relationships turn sour slowly until they became opponents. Kakashi and Obito don't fit this mould, they both parted on strong bonds. Madara and Izuna vs Itachi and Sasuke shows the interactions between two sets of brothers. How both sets brought such destruction to Konoha and it is up to Sasuke to bascially to break that cycle of Uchiha hatred for Konoha, aided obviously by Naruto.

The Kakashi/Obtio theme seems too independent whereas the Izuna/Madara theme ties in with the fate of Naruto, the main character of the series. This fits in with the current theme of how to achieve peace in the Shinobi world where there are two options. Force, either softly via Tobi/Izuna or brute strength via Madara or Peaceful coexistance, the option fuelled by friendship and love championed by Naruto and being followed by the Kages.

[Sidnne]

Where has February been? He's usually right on point with calling people idiots for mentioning Obito. Him and b1gdawg would get along great.

[Y]

Bigdawg is a really obvious gimmick account btw.

[darkshadow]

Clearly everything points to Tobi being Obito, but I find there are just too many problems with this.
This post will be about why he shouldn't be obito.

First off there is a clear problem with obito being alive at all.
Yes perhaps he activated MS as he was dying, but he was still clearly crushed beforehand.
Now there is obviously something strange with tobi's body, so if they are one and the same we need a good explanation on how obito survived his injuries long enough to transition it into tobi's body; right now that shit is literally magic, unless you want to accept that some crippled near death teenager somehow crawled into oro's lair and injected himself with a syringe of that sweet senju juice.

Second, there is a huge, heck, gigantic problem with obito's death itself.
After minato roflstomped kakashi's assailants, does anyone believe they wouldn't recover the body?
In fact minato could've easily done this himself by just teleporting the rocks away, or just smashing them with his rasengan, or summon a toad etc..
And if he did do that, why would he hide that the body allegedly disappeared? Anything that happened here to circumvent this from happening is either insanely shitty writing or some deus ex machina that prevented minato from recovering the body at any timeframe.

Thirdly, obito and kakashi parted on strong bonds and unless something happened that turned him incredibly insane, which should be something substantial, I doubt rin's off-screen death would've caused him to want to murder the entire village of konoha twice.
Also, even if Rin was the cause of his insanity/hatred, she clearly didn't die right after obito, why the fuck would he hide that he survived? And if someone was nursing him in a comatose state or whatever, that brings us right back at point one.

Fourthly, controlling the kyuubi is more than just having sharingan, hashirama used some crazy sealing stuff to just unbind kyuubi from madara. If it was that easy, kakashi (or anyone with sharingan) should be able to do it too.

Fifthly, the oh so discussed power difference.
The argument I heard here over and over is: "oh tobi is just phasing out it's no biggie".
Problem with this stems all the way back to sasuke vs lee; even though sasuke could perfectly see lee, his body could not keep up at all.
Tobi kept up with minato, a genius hokage level ninja, whilst obito was nothing compared to kakashi; kakashi in turn could not keep up with minato.
Then there is all the prep to get the kyuubi etc..; all of this points to someone who had a lot of time.

This point however could be adressed if the kamui dimension does indeed have a different passage of time

Oh and extensiveuseofmangekyoumakesyoublindetc..

[Kensee]

Kind of echoing what others are saying, the first thing I thought after that last panel was, "Oh, now his face is messed up and no one will recognize him." [dick move #1]

I thought of Kakashi going blind from over use of that move as a potential dick move #2 but I really think Kishi forgot about that little rule and, well, Kakashi does have another eye.

I'm rooting for Kakashi to take Tobi's eye and get EMS =D

Next weeks leak... what? no, i haven`t.

http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/598/15

http://www.mangapanda.com/93-33-19/n...hapter-28.html

Kinda cool huh?

Naruto face smashing skills are second to none.