GotWoot Story Contest - Preliminaries - Round 3

[Sapphire]

Author of (N)YAC says:

The plot and characters serve as a satire of the pitfall in which majority of anime and manga titles get trapped. While complaining and denying the average, ultimately it still could not escape from it. The classroom setting, the tsundere (kuudere to be more specific) female lead, the blush scene, the bullying, and the kiss conclusion are all generic elements intentionally included in the story.

The writing style is a pastiche of how many popular light novels are written. This includes the gratuitous use of references. Credit and gratitude go to enkoujin and kokujin-kun for noticing.

Parodies don’t need to be funny all the time. It can be ironic like in this story. I do hope, however, that some parts at least made some people chuckle a bit.

[SeanW]

A mixed bag, decidedly. Better on average than Round 1, not as good as Round 2.

A Screwed Story: putting almost no effort into a story isn't necessarily bad; some authors have a gift, and good stories just seem to roll off their fingers. Admittedly, the other story so far which showed so little effort was pretty execrable, but at least 1000 Dicks didn't rub the reader's face in it.

The Flu: well, it's not terrible. There are a number of grammatical and spelling glitches (it's a good sign that I wanted to dive in and fix them; beyond a certain point, as with The Game and Madness' Door, I'd rather throw the laptop against the wall than edit them). Unfortunately, the bulk of the story is just exposition of an entirely standard post-apocalyptic world, the kind of thing that ought to take up a few paragraphs of the beginning of a novel. It's told decently enough, with picturesque but not overblown language. But once the real plot kicks in, it starts to read a little like a story outline interlarded with overly cryptic and flamboyant exclamations ("No time! No choice!") and random scraps of seemingly unrelated text ("Mechanic by day, artist by night."). The last line, though, is just out of left field. It doesn't explain anything in the rest of the story, it's basically just a "to be continued" flag. (And riding west from San Francisco generally just gets you very wet.)

(Not) Your Average Chat: Ugh. Technically sound, but it's one enormous love letter to anime. It seems to have been created solely to allow the author to cram as many anime references in as possible. The attempt at recursion, "being meta", breaking the fourth wall, whatever you want to call it, doesn't help (and itself could be construed as a ref to the likes of "Pani Poni Dash"). It's not a story, it's one long in-joke.

The Beginning: needs more sex. LOL. Seriously though, it's a whole lot of build-up with no real payoff, and the intriguing lead-in about the narrator's career seems to have been forgotten completely. This is basically the first chapter of a book, not a short story at all. Technically it's very good, though there are a few rough spots (the very first clause is missing the word "of", for example). But all in all it's by far the best entry in this round.

[XanBcoo]

I agree with everything Dark Sage said.

It really bugs me that every single story in this competition (aside from the Mechanic story in bracket 2) reads like fanfiction. Surely Gotwoot is better read than that.

Edit: And I can't believe the author of the "wacky anime" story had to write an additional 1,000 words just to defend and explain their story. If it takes that much effort to explain it, it isn't speaking for itself, man.

[Sapphire]

I agree with everything Dark Sage said.

It really bugs me that every single story in this competition (aside from the Mechanic story in bracket 2) reads like fanfiction. Surely Gotwoot is better read than that.

Edit: And I can't believe the author of the "wacky anime" story had to write an additional 1,000 words just to defend and explain their story. If it takes that much effort to explain it, it isn't speaking for itself, man.

It bugs me that every single comment that you've made in this competition is not only derogatory but useless. If you know a way that an author can improve his story then say it, surely as a literate adult male you have more words to say about something than "wacky" and "fanfic"? It's as if your very existence is offended by these stories.

Some people actually worked hard to write these. This implies that it doesn't make people feel good, (meaning they don't feel any desire to do a better job) when you just shit all over them. Just as you are disgusted by these stories, I'm disgusted by your inability to say anything that can help these authors become better writers in any way shape or form.

[Lucifus]

I'm also inclined to agree with Sapphire here; jesus dude, after your first series of 'critiques', give them a break will ya?

I agree when you say they obviously aren't the best short stories in the world but goddamn no one has claimed to be a professional author here.

Maybe they aren't writing to the best of their ability but you can't just chalk that up to laziness. Despite what you think, writing can be time consuming, and I'm sure most of the people who have submitted something spent more time trying to come up with something to write about than actually typing it up. Half way through, I'm sure they lost their motivation.

But they still completed their works and submitted them to the best of their ability with what they had. So try not to take too personal an insult from their poor degenerative writing abilities. Or your just taking something bad home from work. I personally like critiques, as most in general give me a great deal of motivation to improve my work twice-fold. However, that doesn't hold true when they sound like the person critiquing has fire-ants up their ass. And no, I don't have a story in this competition.

I'm fairly certain this competition was put together with the intent of having fun, and I'm certain the participants didn't take the time out of their day to make it happen to listen to people call their work shit.

Edit: My apologies for the rant, I realize this time around you didn't piss all over everyone's stories; however I'd gotten ticked over your last posts, and I guess seeing this one brought it back.

[XanBcoo]

It bugs me that every single comment that you've made in this competition is not only derogatory but useless. If you know a way that an author can improve his story then say it, surely as a literate adult male you have more words to say about something than "wacky" and "fanfic"? It's as if your very existence is offended by these stories.

Some people actually worked hard to write these. This implies that it doesn't make people feel good, (meaning they don't feel any desire to do a better job) when you just shit all over them. Just as you are disgusted by these stories, I'm disgusted by your inability to say anything that can help these authors become better writers in any way shape or form.

Ok, open a creative writing subforum or something. Some platform to share stories and ask for critiques. I don't think I've ever been unfairly critical or have ever "shit all over" someone's art in the fanart subforum and I hope I wouldn't be in a similar subforum for writing.

This is a competition. The stories in this bracket were not that good. That is what I think. I agree with a lot of the points that people have already brought up, and disagree with those who had leniency towards them because they had anime references or something. I'm not going to be "nice" and give a pass to stories that I think are poorly constructed, too long, and hackneyed.

[Sapphire]

Ok, open a creative writing subforum or something. Some platform to share stories and ask for critiques. I don't think I've ever been unfairly critical or have ever "shit all over" someone's art in the fanart subforum and I hope I wouldn't be in a similar subforum for writing.

This is a competition. The stories in this bracket were not that good. That is what I think. I agree with a lot of the points that people have already brought up, and disagree with those who had leniency towards them because they had anime references or something. I'm not going to be "nice" and give a pass to stories that I think are poorly constructed, too long, and hackneyed.

Interestingly enough, despite the title of this forum and the fact that this is a competition, through this venture, authors have the opportunity to improve their writing and even their stories. This means that this thread and comment section is a "platform to share stories and critiques".

Nevermind the stories in this contest, we are trying to say your comments themselves are unenjoyable to read and offensive because they are so useless and derogatory. Say something specific, better than the bland "OH ALL THESE STORIES ARE SHIT OUT IN 5 MINUTES, wacky fanfics," etc.

Also, your negative comment about the author trying to explain his story was just "extra".

[XanBcoo]

Yeah, I literally haven't said anything close to that.

I said all the stories read like fanfiction and that if you had to write an extra several paragraphs to explain your story then that is evidence of it not being clear enough to stand on its own.

I have not personally insulted any of the authors. I have not used inflammatory language. In every post of every bracket I have said at least one constructive thing and explained why I did not like the stories. I am not required to type out paragraphs of detailed criticism and I don't wish to. Others have been critical enough and I agree with the majority decision on this.

[Lucifus]

I would classify that edit above as a personal observation. It isn't a direct insult to the author, but you still didn't need to tone the message like the author was a special kid. Personally, I feel that's the first decent critique you've made in this competition as you were actually specific on something the author could take to heart and improve.

You obviously didn't feel others were critical enough, as you were exponentially more critical than any previous reviewer. (Dark Sage's opinion does not count on the charges that he is a troll.)
-_-

Your critiques, are not constructive in the least. Now read that last line twice. Now read that same line again. Get it yet?

Whether or not you do, I feel I've made my point, and if these posts don't change your mind, arguing over it anymore wont either. Lets leave it at that and stop derailing the thread.

Edit: And as for Dark_Sage, learn some goddamn respect. Who da fuck raised you? I suppose this is the internet but goddamn! I'm glad I don't moderate these forums, because if I did, I'd abuse my effing powers on you. -_-

[Sapphire]

Yeah, I literally haven't said anything close to that. .

-

It really bugs me that every single story in this competition (aside from the Mechanic story in bracket 2) reads like fanfiction.

If the stories we read are objectively terrible, we can't fool ourselves into thinking any differently. Why should I vote that someone has a chance at winning a prize for their writing if their story reads like something they crapped out in 10 minutes?

et. cetera.

Close enough.

And saying something "reads like a fanfiction" without saying why, also is not constructive. Not to mention that one of the best things I have ever READ is a fanfiction, you're just labeling it something that you think is insulting.

[enkoujin]

I agree with Lucifus.

I don't want to belittle anyone in GotWoot, but not all of us are authors nor do we write regularly. Give the writers a slack; we're all doing this for fun, amusement and what I can only assume is the rebirth of GotWoot to draw in more members. It's like bringing in a high-class connoisseur to review food from a fast food restaurant and he/she belittles every item the restaurant provides. What would you expect?

I do understand that XanBcoo does provide some positive feedback although most of it is negative and condescending. It's not helping anyone if we have an intellectual seriously critiquing amateur pieces of work.

I do understand that you have high standards from a community you've been part of for the last six years, but you should know best, since you're a moderator, that this is an international forum where everyone is legitimately busy with their own lives, try to communicate their ideas through a language that might not have been their first language and simply took this idea as something fun to do and not serious (even though there are prizes at stake). I'm sure people like David75, who wrote "Screwed Story", could have come up with something beautiful if they were seriously ambitious about it.

The other thing is that saying simple sentences about a story isn't enough. What constitutes a "fan-fiction"? Some people would not be able to tell from reading that what a "fan-fiction" is. If you say that that you're not required to type out paragraphs of detailed criticism and don't wish to, then that is fine with me. But if you're going to post something you're taking seriously, don't be a half-assed poster. Your posts will end up degrading to those of Archangel and those of the Bleach Manga thread where they say share their opinions about something but aren't willing to put time and effort to explain why they liked or disliked it.

Lastly, to Dark_Sage. I know this isn't a dreamland with ponies and rainbows around us where everyone can write something so profound that its ideas can't be found on TVTropes, but stop trolling and learn to appreciate a piece of work that people put their souls into - even if you don't like it.

[Dark_Sage]

Never mind, delete lol

[Lucifus]

Can someone, please, mod the fuck out of this guy? Why hasn't it already been done?

I see a troll. So take it to the fucking trolling thread.

[Buffalobiian]

Never mind, delete lol

I read that man. Consider this your final warning for personal flaming.

En, you too. I edited out something from your last post.

[DeadlyOats]

Yeah, man. I thought this was suppose to be a fun contest with amature writers, and small-time hoakey prizes for the winners. The way you haters are hatin', it's no fun at all.

Yeah, man. I thought this was suppose to be a fun contest with amature writers, and small-time hoakey prizes for the winners. The way you haters are hatin', it's no fun at all. Take a good laxative, then have a good dump, and let the stress out. Wait a minute.... They are trolling..... Stop spoiling the fun for us, you Forsakenly, Orcish Trolls! You act like a Horde of evil Blood(ed) Elf-Gobblins!

[twofacedkitsune]

Yeah, man. I thought this was suppose to be a fun contest with amature writers, and small-time hoakey prizes for the winners. The way you haters are hatin', it's no fun at all.

Agreed, this isn't the nobel prize for literature or anything.

Not to play the devil's advocate or anything, but I see where Xan and Dark_Sage are coming from. Contests aren't any fun if the stakes aren't high, people don't put a lot of work into their submissions, etc.

That being said, even if the stories aren't award-winning literature, it seems like most of the authors tried pretty hard to write something they thought was good. Some people can take criticism better than others, but I'm sure most of the non-aspiring writers didn't enter the contest to have their efforts flamed and stuff. No need to shower them with glowing praise or anything, but massive props to everyone who did submit a story, for doing so

If I'm not mistaken, the reasoning behind leaving feedback was primarily to give the writers whose stories were chosen advice on improving their stories, so that they could edit them up for the next round

[DeadlyOats]

I voted for "The Flu" as my first choice, because it was an interesting story. LOL! Really, it was. The first thing we learn is that events are unrelated, and that there is no pattern to historical events. Why that is important to know, I din't quite get. However, what I did get was that Spanish Flu destroys brain cells. And this guy has lost his mind, or was losing it after his bout with the flu (Spanish Flu). One of the earlier reviewers seems to have gotten the impression that the guy gained special powers to see into the future, and that he could save people, but what I got was that he was delusional. Him, saving a life, was all in his broken brain. What we are seeing, here, are events that occurred his his delusion. Has the world really ended? Did he really "go west", or was he "taken west" to a mental ward? I WANT TO KNOW how much of this is delusion, and how much is real life, how this man is perceiving it all - through his flu-broken mind! There I go.... speculating again... But that goes to show how hooked I got.

I voted for (N)YAC as my second choice, because.... it was not my first choice. I admit, I had to re-read certain passages a few times - the switching between past and present tenses - and that "aside" (I was taught, when studying Shakespear in high school, it was called an "aside" - but folks are calling it "the fourth wall" these days - or are they different devices in storytelling?) kind of threw me for a few loops, but I kind of lost track at the end.

I din't understand why she was crying, or that there were bullies. I din't see anything about any bullies until it was explained later in a follow up post by Sapphire (who had to go and really dig for it, before she saw any evidence of bullying). And even though the word "parody" did not enter my mind, I did get that the story was making fun of anime love stories. I liked the way the author made fun of the description of every anime I've ever read about. "So and so is an average high school boy who meets such and such a girl who... and then....."

As for Screwed Story... It was hard to tell if the protagonist was thinking out loud or talking to the audience or talking to someone in the story. I got the general idea of the story, but it was a hard read for me.

As for that other story.... There were no problems with the story telling per se, but I didn't like the story.

[RyougaZell]

*sigh*

Let me try this again, since it seems I choose the wrong words and caused misunderstandings.

I *liked* (Not) your Average Chat.

What I liked of this story:
- Pacing of the story is very well done
- Like characterization of the main guy and the girl.
- I *did* like the references to other stories (even if my comments didn't reflect this)

What I didn't like of this story:
- It relies heavilly on knowing recent anime
- The main character's personality is overshadowed by the jokes of him acting like other characters, making him look bland.
- Breaking the 4th wall. While funny handled... I've never *never* liked the breaking of the 4th wall.

The word plagiarism wasn't the correct one used. That is the truth. However, as this isn't fanfiction I expected at most similar personalities... but a direct word by word action.

I do understand this is suppossed to be a parody... but it still bothers me.

And no. I didn't vote for it because if was the least bad or anything (that goes to the sex story). I voted for this story because IT deserves it. I'm just bothered by the main character.

[Yukimura]

I'm done with this contest, I am only posting to give feedback on why I don't feel it's worth it to continue participating and I apologize to the authors for disrupting the thread that should be about the stories in order to say my piece.

The response threads all have positive critiques and negative critiques, flamming critiques and fluffy critiques. What bothers me is that while all of these are normal and predictable responses to a contest of this type several posters, including the moderator of the contest, seem to be somewhat hostile toward certain types of critiques. Negative critiques seem to be held up to a standard that they must be 'useful' and/or 'constructive' and/or 'agreeable' to other posters or else a debate breaks out between meta-critics who would seemingly defend the 'honor' of the authors against negative feedback and the negative critics who have said their piece and will defend their words as their legitimate responses to the stories they just read. No one bats an eyelash at positive critiques that don't say much of anything so the 'be constructive' and 'be useful' arguments fall apart in my mind. Instead it seems the only way to say your piece unmolested is to say nothing negative about the stories at all.

I also don't agree with the notion that criticism in a contest such as this should be based on the presumed amateurishness of the authors. No one was forced into this contest and I don't feel anyone is entitled to having their story given a pat on the back for existing as opposed to not. I also don't feel authors are entitled to not hearing that their story fell short of the expectations or standards of some who read it when they submitted it to a public contest knowing there would be feedback and judgment. I feel that if the authors were willing to put their work out there to be seen by all (and expected to be read) they should be willing to accept that some people did not like it and would tell them so, possibly without specific pointers for improvement.

That said I have no wish to force my views down anyone's throat if they would be unpalatable so I will abstain from the contest rather than risk offending anyone, author or fan, on the chance that I feel like saying only negative things about a work or allotting my votes based on my feelings toward the stories as influenced by all the other fiction I've been exposed to and not any compassion I might feel for the authors.

[shinta|hikari]

It makes me sad that this is happening.

I think that everyone should be able to say what they want about the stories, no matter how harsh it is. People can disagree and debate about it too. That is part of the fun in reviewing literary works. I would suggest that they tone down the harshness in how the critiques are made, BUT I won't stop them if they want to keep doing so, even if I had the power. They are entitled to their opinion, period. While I want to keep it fun, freedom of expression takes precendence, particularly because this IS a writing contest.