Timber and stone:
Episode 8 - Mazui
- - - - - - - - -
Edit: The disguised female merchant was an interesting character but I can't help but feel she's planning something that's not beneficial for Lawrence and Horo. I'm not yet thinking she knows what Horo is, but surely she's up to something. Naturally it doesn't alleviate my suspicions she has ties to the church and is also otherwise well connected.
Last edited by Kraco; Fri, 08-28-2009 at 01:34 AM.
I wonder if that old man's words "So you want to head towards the pagan lands" mean anything in particular, or if he's just simply referring to the geographic region and nothing else.
"Careless negotiations" smells like trouble, but I didn't get that impression from the conversation alone.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
It obviously means the lands in those parts are not under the heavy influence of the church like most cities and towns we have seen so far. There was one city in the first season, where they got the gold to be smuggled, that was a pagan one as well, and thus the church didn't have its veritable gold monopoly over there. I doubt it means anything else. Maybe Horo's kind is more evident still in those parts where the church hasn't snuffed out all superstition save their own one god.Originally Posted by Buffalobiian
Conversation alone:
Episode 9 - Mazui
What's it with everyone wanting to buy Horo?
Interestingly enough, this girl is also one who made a living using the Church like Nora was.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
One who made a living:
Episode 10 - Mazui
Edit: The deal has a very strong shady feeling. I'll be surprised if Lawrence doesn't find himself grasping at the shorter end of the stick. It wasn't yet even revealed what significance the low quality salt had. But then again, for all we know, Lawrence might actually already be fully expecting a twist in the deal. He has been fooled too many times already in the past not to.
One funny thing here that hasn't been revealed so far is what exactly Abe is bringing onto the table. Just the ability to pawn Horo for lots of money? That sounds somewhat asymmetrical considering Lawrence and Horo are accepting the full risk should something go wrong. Abe would lose nothing at all.
Last edited by Kraco; Thu, 09-10-2009 at 09:28 AM.
That's the part that is bothering me the most. Lawrence seemed to understand at least a little bit the significance of that revelation, but didn't share it with the audience nor did he appear to have shared it with Horo, his confidant as always.
It seems like it would be the key to understanding whether or not Abe is trustworthy, and as you said, she really doesn't seem to be risking anything at all. We have to wonder why she is so nervous about this going off correctly.
While Lawrence is typically very stupid when Horo is at risk, he didn't seem to be ignoring that issue, only keeping it to himself. I hope that he will bring that out at the proper time.
I think it is all to make him look cool in the end. He has been failing quite miserably lately, so this is his chance to get the Lelouch evil laugh in the end.
Peace.
I'm wondering if Abe being from the noble family has anything else to do with this other than giving Horo a good price tag. The first impression I got was that Abe might be targeted or something, and is palming Horo off under her name as a scapegoat. It doesn't quite make sense, and Abe's nervousness would be either in her lack of confidence regarding the plan's successfulness or a guilty conscience, so I'm not buying it myself.
There's surprisingly quite a lot of flashbacks to when the couple were escaping in the sewers, the details which I can't accurately recall, and why the Church hasn't caught up with them yet.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
Her lack of confidence:
Episode 11 - Mazui
So Horo is afraid to go any further in their relation because she fears the time it ends.
Did she purposedly let Lawrence be sharper than her in their verbal exchanges?
I suppose that Lawrence, contemplating the tree and listening to the nun saw the relationship he shares with Horo. The tree could be Horo, a being that is very different, will live longer than you, but still can interact with you (beauty, fruits etc... for the tree that is). Dying long before the tree doesn't mean the relation was useless, even to the tree that will probably live stronger.
Regarding the bad quality salt, at least we know it has been used for the Virgin Mary figurines.
I wonder if it's not some kind of blasphemy. But for it to be important for Lawrence, I guess bad quality salt gained value once transformed as church merchandising.
Also, those figurines must not last long, so people will have to buy replacements, which is an important part of business, even if in that case people would feel they've been had.
That last point could be the explanation for the rebellion, but it could be the fur trade problem too, I can't see that coming out of the set they gave us.
Regarding the talk about Horo's sale, I was quite lost in what was important or wasn't.
There's the exchange rate beetween currencies, the agreed price, fur trading.
The rebellion will sure make it hard to make the right decisions as their are no more best practice rules in a region that unstable.
All the things I really like to do are either illegal, immoral, or fattening. And then: Golf.
The rebellion really came out of nowhere. I was trying to figure just who is going to cheat whom in the this three party deal - because like you said, that business meeting didn't seem to have overly much concrete matters on the table. Lastly the salt was also brought back, though I doubt nobody had forgotten it yet.
Bam! A rebellion and the city on fire (it's a damn big city, if you have a better look at the picture), so I imagine the deal must be off. It was all for nothing. And I don't mean all the business plans were all for nothing but trying to figure out just how somebody is going to free Lawrence of his assets this time.
Lawrence's hesitation with Horo is starting to piss me off. I guess it also goes the other way, but for Horo the situation is a bit different and apparently not the first time either. In that sense I'd consider it Lawrence's responsibility to forget everything else and dedicate himself to not losing Horo.
Regarding Lawrence and Horo speech, did anyone notice that Horo said she'd die with him?
"They say when you've tasted the poison, you might as well finish the plate.When that happens, I'll eat you up as well."
Or maybe that part of the dialogue was of no importance.
All the things I really like to do are either illegal, immoral, or fattening. And then: Golf.
I don't think that's what she means she'll die with him. He's talking about her eating everything he has (financially), so my take on the issue was that she says if she was to devour him, she'd devour it entirely, including his finances and him personally.
It still doesn't make too much sense. Translator notes would be useful for this series I think. Has anybody tried Frostii?
The rebellion came very suddenly, but there was adequate foreshadowing, I think. The entire city had a very tense feeling with all the less-than-friendly merchants waiting for a decision by the backdoor-dealing bureaucracy. It was only a matter of time before it snapped, given how one-sided the decision was.
What I want to see is how all this matters to their trading. The deal's obviously off, but Abe doesn't look like she's worried about a single lost opportunity. Perhaps their dealings will be seen as siding with the higher-ups and treated the same.
Regarding the sequence with the Garden, in Lawrence's vision, he was holding hands with Horo at the tree, rather than just being with the tree as if it was Horo. The analogy here is that he's happier just humbly being with Horo and watching over her than doing his actual job of being a merchant and pursuing his more ambitious dream of owning a store. Thinking about it that way ties in with his words that "humbler dreams are harder to achieve", since he's about to lose Horo, while owning a store at the time was just around the corner.
The entire table of merchants gave off such a crafty laugh I can't imagine anybody could trade with them without feeling like they were somehow being ripped off.
Following up Kraco's comment about the currency, I think it was the merchants showing off that they deal with enough money that they'd pay them with gold. Lesser merchants wouldn't bother with such large currencies because it would simply be too large. Being able to give out gold coins so casually indicates they deal with large trades that use big gold currencies all the time.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
While I agree with your view of everything else you said, I did not see that exchange the same way. Abe was terrified. This was her chance to make a name for herself, and finally get the respect she believes she deserves, and obviously didn't get from the wealthy merchants at the meeting. Horo and Lawrence got a great deal more respect from the guild head.
Part of that is due to Abe's haughty and poor attitude. She's fallen nobility, and while Horo plays it quite well by acting gracefully, Abe acts like she is merely slumming with the rabble. She deserves better, she's had a hard life, she will overshadow her former buyer/husband.
This is everything she was hoping for, destroyed in a single moment. While she's playing angry, she's panicked and terrified.
This was going to be everything to her, just like losing the statue/salt deal was before this.
Destroyed in a single moment:
Episode 12 Final - Mazui
So Abe spared however much it costed for the inn and gave it to Lawrence? How nice of her.
The finale didn't pack as much punch as last season, but overall I enjoyed this. The earlier half had so much tension that it would have felt like the climax in it's own right. Tension-wise, those two arcs should be swapped around. Story-wise though, that wouldn't have worked, since the romantic issues being dealt with progressed in accordance with increasing maturity in their relationship.
I'm certainly hoping for a Season 3, but the fact that it ended on a slightly lower note than what it previously hit might impact on the hype for those with short-term memory.
If the staff at Brains Base (animator of S&W II) have been converted to Horoism however, then there would be no worries
Last edited by Buffalobiian; Sun, 09-27-2009 at 08:11 AM.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
I'm somewhat disappointed Lawrence got cheated out his money not by a crafty business plot but by a rudimentary physical fight. That he lost against a girl no less. It wasn't a very stylish closure even if it blends into the general disorderly state of the mutinous town.
But in the end it's not so serious seeing how Lawrence managed to prevent Horo from running away.
A third season surely would be in order.
Lawrence did not lose physically. He lost because he is too good natured for his own good, a fitting end for someone like him. That is also the reason Abe left him the inn, so it was not all bad.
I would have liked it better if Holo looked like she enjoyed the kiss more, but it was a great ending nonetheless.
Peace.
[Nipponsei] Spice and Wolf II Original Soundtrack.zip
-Forgot it in my last post.
I wonder if Abe ever considered killing Lawrence during that sequence. She obviously isn't absolutely set on taking his life since she prepared the inn contract as well as the single-edged blade, but greed can get blinding at times. Perhaps Lawrence's good nature actually saved him. Females are crafty beings.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
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