Naruto Chapter 447

[DeathscytheVII]

I like your way of Thinking Rikudo, that would make things very interesting indeed. I was always wondering what happened to Danzou since the village was destroyed. No doubt he's been keeping tabs on Naruto as well. Either that or Madara will pull off the finishing blow now that his 'tool' is used up.

I also wonder what happened to Danzou in the flashback. Once I saw him there, I had a thought that maybe the reason he lost his eye and became essentially a cripple was because of Nagato.


I honestly don't know what to feel about this chapter. It was great seeing Naruto confront Pain with his answer, at the same time, i'm somewhat disappointed that Pain, the awesome villain who singlehandedly took down a village, has a Sasuke-clone backstory. True, Nagato has a f***ed up past, but how many times have we seen the 'avenge parents/friend' angle. Not saying its bad, just so very common.

[Kagemane_no_Jutsu]

2/3rd the village already knows that the one fighting Pain is Naruto***

got that one for ya... lets hope. Pain should be like their 2012... if a ton full of villagers survive ill be pissed.

[Sam98034]

True, Nagato has a f***ed up past, but how many times have we seen the 'avenge parents/friend' angle. Not saying its bad, just so very common.

I thought his angle was "peace." When everyone understands the pain of war, fully, they won't go to war anymore. He wasn't really on a revenge mission on Konoha, he was on a 9-tails mission. I think he was just trying to make a point with Naruto about the whole revenge thing.

[FireEmblem]

There can't be any peace treaty between Konoha and the Rain. That would be absurd and also wouldn't even make any sense towards the goals that need to be achieved. If they have a peace treaty and the Rain village rises up, some small country somewhere will have to pay for that rise. In the end it'll be the same thing, and that's the main thing that Pain wants to stop.

Naruto will revolutionize the ninja world, meaning he will bring some drastic changes. We already know this is in essence going to be the final answer to Pain's question, when we reach that point. We've already seen that Naruto even has a tendency even before the time-jump to think that way. In his fight with Neji when he told him he'd change the Hyuuga clan when he became Hokage. It'll be interesting (or disappointing) to see what he does. Even if it's "shounen heart" and you don't like it, it'll probably make sense.

[Sidnne]

There can't be any peace treaty between Konoha and the Rain. That would be absurd

Any more absurd than an alliance between the Leaf and the Sand?

[Sam98034]

I don't know about that. The Sand was technically defeated, correct? Konoha had to make some sort deal after defeating them. They were also deceived by an enemy of Konoha. The old saying "any enemy of my enemy is a friend" might have come into play here. But in this case Konoha was defeated, so I doubt they could force a peace treaty.

Also, if Nagato does die here, doesn't that mean that his summon goes away as well? If that happens, they have to scrap the whole tailed beast plan, right?

[FireEmblem]

Any more absurd than an alliance between the Leaf and the Sand?

The person behind the Sands attack on Konoha didn't exactly have this deep master plan to rid the world of evil with MORE evil so it's a lot different. Also this is ONE ninja from the Rain attacking the leaf, compared to a well planned out military attack by the Sand on Konoha. In a sense this is an act of terrorism, while that was a war. Funny though that one ninja did more damage than an entire village haha.

On that note, I wonder if Pain would understand, if someone explained to him that him doing this is making things worse for other orphans, Rain village or not.

When I say it would be absurd, I mean it really would be absurd from a writing/story point of view. Here we have two people with similar goals, but their methodologies that are like night and day. And the underlying problem (people get fucked up) wouldn't be any better if Kishi decided to have a peace treaty with the Rain and Konoha. It shouldn't even matter anyway, the Rain village really has nothing to do with this. If it wasn't for Pain, nobody would care about orphans in the rain.

[Sidnne]

But in this case Konoha was defeated, so I doubt they could force a peace treaty.

That is debatable. The physical village, i.e. the buildings, were destroyed, but its residents live. If Nagato dies here, then Konoha's attacker has died, his goal (capturing the nine-tails) was not accomplished, and Konoha can be rebuilt. Is it really a defeat if "the will of fire" lives on? Its all philosophical, of course.

Also this is ONE ninja from the Rain attacking the leaf, compared to a well planned out military attack by the Sand on Konoha. In a sense this is an act of terrorism, while that was a war.

That to me would seem to support that an alliance with the Rain would be more feasible than with the Sand. Unless you're suggesting that since the Rain village itself wasn't involved in the attack then there is no reason for a peace treaty to exist since the village had little or nothing to do with it?

From a story standpoint, however, it would make sense to form an alliance with the Rain because the goal of Naruto as the "chosen one" or "child of destiny," however they phrased it, is to end war and create peace by uniting all of the villages.

I may be mistaken, but when Jiraiya went to the rain village, was it stated that the civil war in the Rain had ended and Pein's side had won? If Pein was their leader (assuming he was), and he dies, then it would make sense for a leaderless village to form an alliance.

[poopdeville]

That is debatable. The physical village, i.e. the buildings, were destroyed, but its residents live. If Nagato dies here, then Konoha's attacker has died, his goal (capturing the nine-tails) was not accomplished, and Konoha can be rebuilt. Is it really a defeat if "the will of fire" lives on? Its all philosophical, of course.

I agree. Konoha lost a big battle, but they won "the war", because Naruto (for various reasons) beat Pein, who is presumably the strongest in the Rain. Nagato isn't really in a good bargaining position. He can fight and probably die, or surrender, or listen to Naruto and (potentially) make a treaty between himself/the Rain and Konoha, to at least protect what is left. I suppose he could lie, and sic the rest of the tailed beasts on Naruto in a few in-manga-weeks or whatever.

I do think you're right about Nagato probably dying, but I would like to see a real peace treaty between the two. Otherwise, I don't see how Naruto is ever going to make peace in the ninja world. Nagato's whole point is that you can't do it by fighting, unless you're willing to kill everybody. If Nagato dies, Naruto's first act for peace will be "luck".

[FireEmblem]

That is debatable. The physical village, i.e. the buildings, were destroyed, but its residents live. If Nagato dies here, then Konoha's attacker has died, his goal (capturing the nine-tails) was not accomplished, and Konoha can be rebuilt. Is it really a defeat if "the will of fire" lives on? Its all philosophical, of course.



That to me would seem to support that an alliance with the Rain would be more feasible than with the Sand. Unless you're suggesting that since the Rain village itself wasn't involved in the attack then there is no reason for a peace treaty to exist since the village had little or nothing to do with it?

From a story standpoint, however, it would make sense to form an alliance with the Rain because the goal of Naruto as the "chosen one" or "child of destiny," however they phrased it, is to end war and create peace by uniting all of the villages.

I may be mistaken, but when Jiraiya went to the rain village, was it stated that the civil war in the Rain had ended and Pein's side had won? If Pein was their leader (assuming he was), and he dies, then it would make sense for a leaderless village to form an alliance.

I just think that if Pain remains alive, a treaty wouldn't make sense, unless he changes his mind about his solution. A treaty would only help the Rain village out, and would not put an end what he wants to end. Eventually the Rain would become what Pain suggests that the other strong villages are guilty of. That's why I don't think it would make sense or even be a smart choice as far as story went.

At this point, Pain dying in some way is the only decision that will allow the story to forward the way (in my opinion of course) it should. And I think Danzou should be the one to kill him.

[Sam98034]

Don't you think he might have something else up his sleeve? Nagatto's current body might not be the real one. This could easily be another one of those "you may have beat me this time, but you won't beat me next time *poof*" He might also try to summon that eye thing, which should have the power of a few tailed beasts in it, correct?

[Sidnne]

Don't you think he might have something else up his sleeve? Nagatto's current body might not be the real one. This could easily be another one of those "you may have beat me this time, but you won't beat me next time *poof*" He might also try to summon that eye thing, which should have the power of a few tailed beasts in it, correct?

Pein killed Jiraiya, several toads, possibly Kakashi, possibly Tsunade. He destroyed Konoha, brought out nine tails, caused the 4th to appear and Naruto to learn who his father is, caused Hinata to confess her love, and gave Naruto the epic fight of a lifetime.

How could a second appearance possibly top this? Kishi pulled out all the stops on this one; there's nothing left. This is it for Pein.