TV: Breaking Bad

[Sapphire]

Jesus Christ this show is completely lost on you, it's like playing Mozart for chimps.

The episode itself was amazing, for a moment i thought they were going to continue the trend of the paralleling Walt and Gus' journey into a kingpin but if anything Hanks death seems to have brought Walter White back from within Heisenberg. And in the end i still find myself siding with him, even if the conclusion is all that really matters i wish his family at least knew a bit about the circumstances that led to it.

Let's no go crazy with rage because I don't sympathize with the characters, here.

Just because the characters are written brilliantly, doesn't mean I have to like them. Shouldn't you have grown out of ur "omg this show is so smart therefore u should like it if ur smart" phase? It's like you've seen nothing but shitty anime your whole life, the first cleverly written thing you see can endure no vitriol. (Remembering ur rage at me not liking Dexter despite it's amazing and groundbreaking nature vs. nurture themes)

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For example, I am well aware that the son probably midged the story a bit (on who pulled the knife on who) to get the cops to come faster. Or he is one of those guys who think that engaging in self-defense against a woman is bad because, it's, omg! attacking a woman. However, if he went through the whole show blindly believing in his dad, he could have given his dad the benefit of a doubt for 30 more minutes to let him explain what was going on. If my panicked dad (who I had no reason to disbelieve until 30 minutes ago) comes in covered in dirt and grime and says 'we need to get the fuck out of the house NOW, I'll explain later', I'll get out of the house so he can explain, not stand around being super dramatic.

@Ani: Check your wall, love.

[Animeniax]

Let's no go crazy with rage because I don't sympathize with the characters, here.

Just because the characters are written brilliantly, doesn't mean I have to like them. Shouldn't you have grown out of ur "omg this show is so smart therefore u should like it if ur smart" phase? It's like you've seen nothing but shitty anime your whole life, the first cleverly written thing you see can endure no vitriol. (Remembering ur rage at me not liking Dexter despite it's amazing and groundbreaking nature vs. nurture themes)

-

For example, I am well aware that the son probably midged the story a bit (on who pulled the knife on who) to get the cops to come faster. Or he is one of those guys who think that engaging in self-defense against a woman is bad because, it's, omg! attacking a woman. However, if he went through the whole show blindly believing in his dad, he could have given his dad the benefit of a doubt for 30 more minutes to let him explain what was going on. If my panicked dad (who I had no reason to disbelieve until 30 minutes ago) comes in covered in dirt and grime and says 'we need to get the fuck out of the house NOW, I'll explain later', I'll get out of the house so he can explain, not stand around being super dramatic.

@Ani: Check your wall, love.

It just seemed you missed the obvious intent of Walter's call to Skylar and the fact that he was crying and struggling to get through the call. You might have just been busy raging against the women or awe-struck by the events of the show to notice it. I didn't mean to be mean, was just a gut reaction post.

[Animeniax]

The women really did play a submissive supporting role throughout the series, and you can't expect them to behave any differently now that shit has hit the fan.

When he took his mom's side in the fight, I think Flynn was just coming to grips with the fact that everything he was told about Walt was probably true.

I think you misinterpreted the phone call Walt made. Watch it again, and remember every terrible thing he has done in this show was to protect his family.

[Sapphire]

That's what he likes to say, but I'm pretty sure it would have been fine to stop at 5-10 million or so. 80 million? For the empire.

The women weren't submissive, just busy whining and assuming the worst of everything. Though, Walt didn't explain what happened very well either.

[Animeniax]

That's what he likes to say, but I'm pretty sure it would have been fine to stop at 5-10 million or so. 80 million? For the empire.

Inflate his ego*

Both true, he did get a lot carried away with his fortune building. But at the core it was still for his family. Like Carnage said, he never really did explain to his family why he did what he did, that it was (mostly) all for them.

Remember also that he wasn't aware of how much money he had made until Skylar showed him the pile, at which point he stopped, and he didn't even know how much money was there.

[UChessmaster]

Both true, he did get a lot carried away with his fortune building. But at the core it was still for his family. Like Carnage said, he never really did explain to his family why he did what he did, that it was (mostly) all for them.

Remember also that he wasn't aware of how much money he had made until Skylar showed him the pile, at which point he stopped, and he didn't even know how much money was there.

He never had the need to get into the business in the first place, most of gray matter`s money is rightfully his and Eliot and Gretchen were more than happy to pay for everything. It was never a family thing, that was just a screen. Instead it was a pride and ego thing.

[Animeniax]

He never had the need to get into the business in the first place, most of gray matter`s money is rightfully his and Eliot and Gretchen were more than happy to pay for everything. It was never a family thing, that was just a screen. Instead it was a pride and ego thing.

They offered to cover his chemo and treatment, but that doesn't provide for his family or ensure their financial security if he didn't survive. Whether the money/invention is rightfully his or not, he has no legal right to it as far as I recall.

Yes a lot of this was ego, and he had other options than becoming a drug kingpin. Still, after everything that's happened, I think it's crazy to say the family angle was just a screen. I say it was his driving force, and his ego got in the way.

[UChessmaster]

They offered to cover his chemo and treatment, but that doesn't provide for his family or ensure their financial security if he didn't survive. Whether the money/invention is rightfully his or not, he has no legal right to it as far as I recall.

Yes a lot of this was ego, and he had other options than becoming a drug kingpin. Still, after everything that's happened, I think it's crazy to say the family angle was just a screen. I say it was his driving force, and his ego got in the way.

They had no legal obligation, but they were still 100% willing to pay for everything and more. He had zero need to do this, the whole family thing is how he convinced himself that what he was doing was remotely noble.

[Carnage]

Animeniax is pointing out that Walt used the phone call to wipe Skylar's plate/involvement clean as far as the feds are concerned. He cried during the phone call because it pained him to pretend that he is as cruel as his image is, whereas in his genuine anger in the house he wasn't close to crying but lashing out.

Walt didn't have the time to explain, and probably would have had Skylar just waited until they were done packing.

[poopdeville]

Animeniax is pointing out that Walt used the phone call to wipe Skylar's plate/involvement clean as far as the feds are concerned. He cried during the phone call because it pained him to pretend that he is as cruel as his image is, whereas in his genuine anger in the house he wasn't close to crying but lashing out.

If Walt knew the cops were on the line, he totally threw Skylar under the bus. He incriminated them both.

[Animeniax]

If Walt knew the cops were on the line, he totally threw Skylar under the bus. He incriminated them both.

At first I thought maybe you misunderstood the call, but you might be on to something.

[enter internet over-analysis mode] Since the feds don't know the details of all this, they would assume Skylar's involvement is as strong as we know it is. Walt's statements could be used to incriminate her in his crimes. At best it will help convince Marie and maybe Flynn that Skylar is a victim, but how far will that go to protect her from the authorities?

At best, if the family chooses, the feds wouldn't need to find out what Hank and Gomez knew about Walt/Heisenberg. This could be just a domestic violence situation, with the disappearance of Hank and Gomez as an unrelated work-related matter. Of course, Flynn did say on his 911 call that he thought Walt had killed someone...

[Sapphire]

Oh snaps! You're probably right.

Still hate the women, though! NOTHING CAN CHANGE THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Animeniax]

Sorry Sapphy, but I think Arch is saying that you don't seem to understand peoples' motivations or nuances of their actions in this show. It might be the wrong kind of show for you, which isn't the worst thing. It'd be nice to be so innocent and naive about the evil of man.

They had no legal obligation, but they were still 100% willing to pay for everything and more. He had zero need to do this, the whole family thing is how he convinced himself that what he was doing was remotely noble.

Yes they were willing to pay for his cancer treatment, but they didn't offer to take care of his family for the rest of their lives after Walt died. How long and to what extent would they take care of Walt's family? Would they pay for the kids' college and cover Skyler into retirement?

Regardless, what kind of man would take that kind of charity? He provides for his family and is a brilliant guy, but circumstances in life resulted in him being a high school chemistry teacher instead of a millionaire. We can call that ego, but it's standard male ego, not egomaniacal.

[UChessmaster]

Yes they were willing to pay for his cancer treatment, but they didn't offer to take care of his family for the rest of their lives after Walt died. How long and to what extent would they take care of Walt's family? Would they pay for the kids' college and cover Skyler into retirement?

If Walter died, do you honestly believe they would leave Skylar and the kids alone? I very much doubt it.I have no doubt they`d pay for college and whatever, it`s pocket money to them. Let`s review the context here, these two people have a lot of millions thanks entirely for Walter, they are infinitely thankful to him.

Regardless, what kind of man would take that kind of charity? He provides for his family and is a brilliant guy, but circumstances in life resulted in him being a high school chemistry teacher instead of a millionaire. We can call that ego, but it's standard male ego, not egomaniacal.

For family? Any man that truly loves his family would. Again, it is hardly charity.

[Animeniax]

If Walter died, do you honestly believe they would leave Skylar and the kids alone? I very much doubt it.I have no doubt they`d pay for college and whatever, it`s pocket money to them. Let`s review the context here, these two people have a lot of millions thanks entirely for Walter, they are infinitely thankful to him.

I think you overestimate the charity they would give to Walter's family if he died (and this was never broached in the show). They offered to cover his medical expenses, that's all. You can't extrapolate that to say they'd take care of Walt's family, or even that they'd cut him in on their profits if he were to live. If I recall correctly from season 1, he gave up rights to the work and sold his interests to his partners. They did the rest of the work to make their millions.

For family? Any man that truly loves his family would. Again, it is hardly charity.

I wish we lived in a world like you suggest, but we don't. My father loves our family but he struggled to accept welfare when they first came to the US in the 70s. He got off welfare as soon as possible (through legal means) because he hated the idea of it so much, the same as Walt refusing help to provide for his family.

[UChessmaster]

I think you overestimate the charity they would give to Walter's family if he died (and this was never broached in the show). They offered to cover his medical expenses, that's all. You can't extrapolate that to say they'd take care of Walt's family, or even that they'd cut him in on their profits if he were to live. If I recall correctly from season 1, he gave up rights to the work and sold his interests to his partners. They did the rest of the work to make their millions.

You keep calling it charity... I do believe they would take care of his family, but I guess I`m alone in this one, in the end I don`t really have any solid evidence.

I wish we lived in a world like you suggest, but we don't. My father loves our family but he struggled to accept welfare when they first came to the US in the 70s. He got off welfare as soon as possible (through legal means) because he hated the idea of it so much, the same as Walt refusing help to provide for his family.

Are you saying your father`s pride was bigger than the well being of your family? And this is normal? Different countries, different values I guess.

[Animeniax]

You keep calling it charity... I do believe they would take care of his family, but I guess I`m alone in this one, in the end I don`t really have any solid evidence.

I don't remember anything from the episodes that suggested they would go that far to help Walt. They are old friends and I think Walt was the wife's bf in college. Saving his life is one thing, but that's a stretch to think they'd support his family.

Are you saying your father`s pride was bigger than the well being of your family? And this is normal? Different countries, different values I guess.

No because he did accept the welfare checks, but it hurt his pride to have to. What he'd prefer (almost to the point that it would be bad for the family) is the opportunity to make his own way with hard work and effort. I think Walt is the same. A man wants to provide for his family, not have someone else take care of them, especially because he can't. In some cultures not being able to do that is worse than death.

[Carnage]

In addition to what Animeniax has pointed out, remember Walt's ego (not in a purely negative sense). Here we have a brilliant genius out of Caltech, smarter than 99.9% of the people around him, and society seems bankrupt to him because he stuck as an unappreciated high school teacher who can barely make ends meet when there are millions of people doing better who are both extremely less intelligent and ill mannered. Remember the asshole with the bmw at the bank/gas station? Seems like society fucked Walt over and he wanted to leave his kids something he built, something he deserved. You can argue that he isn't justified, but I'm somewhat confident this is the premise.

[Splash!]

I don't remember anything in that phone conversation that incriminated Skylar. He seemed very non-specific throughout the whole thing. He still does seem to care about his family and isn't a complete monster (but after all the shit he has pulled, that isn't saying alot).

I have been along for the ride since season 1, but I have to say that I myself never found the characters to be interesting or likeable in the least. I guess Walt is an exception in that he is at least interesting, even if he is a bad person. The only thing that has kept me in this is the plot itself, which is great. But often times I find myself skipping scenes just to find out what happens next, because I find the characters and dialogue are not as engaging.

[UChessmaster]

Did Walt said anything specifically labeling Skylar as an accomplice? it sounded to me like he was trying to make it seem like she was an abused wife that had no saying or choice in the matter but had to participate because she was afraid of her husband.