Hey welcome. I noticed you lurking in here the past few days and I was wondering what was up. Its kinda strange having you here but its a good thing. So are you reading anything other than Naruto at the moment?
Hey welcome. I noticed you lurking in here the past few days and I was wondering what was up. Its kinda strange having you here but its a good thing. So are you reading anything other than Naruto at the moment?
Dreaming impossible dreams.
Sapphire is awesome!
I heard Inuyasha just finished. Now that I've broken my vow of "not reading that stupid shit anymore" I might as well have a look at that too.
Just kidding. I'm not that bored.
Also:
Maybe it's because I read about 110 chapters in one night, but where was this stated? The version I read just said that he could control them. Or were you referring to Madara (who I think was lying about his innocence in the Kyuubi attack on Konoha), using the perfect Mangekyou?Originally Posted by Abdula
<@Terra> he told me this, "man actually meeting terra is so fucking big", and he started crying. Then he bought me hot dogs
Sharingan users have some control over kyubbi, either supressing him as sasuke did or controlling him as madara did. im guessing MS allows u to control him completely while just sharingan can supress. I'm just going on a limb there. I didn't touch up on this before but with sasukes MS looking the way it did, im gonna go with every person who can gain MS will have a diffrent one like kakashi having a diffren't one compared to itachi. Who knows what madara and sasuke have at this point. Technically if you wanna go the route where how sasuke got MS without killing his best friend, his brother was his best friend at one point.
So? None of this implies that they worked together... ever. None of this means they ever met each other. All it means is that they were famous, and were famous enough to take on pupils.
But since you said the manga said I was wrong, you should FIND where it said I was wrong. Because I looked, and all Suigetsu said is that the swords are passed down from generation to generation, and that Zabuza was his sensei.
So feel free to show me where it says Kisame tried to kill the Mizukage. Until then, I think you're making assumptions (which is fair enough, since the whole story isn't known yet). But you shouldn't throw stones in a glass house.
Not just different looks but different abilities as well i guess. And the ultimate naruto hack comes to play once again, I'm guessing he has all of Itachi's abilities plus some new ones of his own that will show up when Kishimoto needs to save himself out of a jam he himself created after all this twists in the plot. I just wish we got more info on the sharingan i'm sick of the dam thing being able to do anything to anyone at any time.
i think Abdula is referring to the time when Madara controlled the kyuubi to fight with him against the first hokage. Now the question is if all mangekiou sharingan can control the kyuubi or was it just his. Also, can all bijuus be controlled like this or just the kyuubi?
there's potential for quite a stupidity here...
the sharingan can control kyuubi (strongest of the beasts) but not nescerly the rest of them, it's explained by the fact that both the kyuubi and the sharingan origin in the fire country, but then we learn that the 1st divided all the demons between the lands to end the ninja wars.
and it just happens to be that Naruto's only means to equal to Sasuke is his greatest weakness against him, perfect, more sharingan shananigans.
I don't see any reason why the other demons couldn't be controled, the fact the jicurichii (I couldn't spell it then, why should i be able to spell it months after they wasted the acr?) exist in other contries as well is proof enough.
sure, it's possible that Kisame didn't know Zabuza, and that they became missing nins on completly diffrent terms, and that some of swordsman are still in the village. it's possible, but I don't find it likely. it's like saying that the dynamic duo never met, and that the sound four aren't nescerly working together, and that the seven dragons\seal (x1999) don't know each other.
If you value your sanity or you just don't want to waste your free time stay away from Inuyasha trust me. I'm referring to back when Yamato, Naruto, Sai and Sakura tried capturing Kabuto. When Oro showed up and figured out who Yamato was he said the reason he was trying to gain Mokuton was so that he could be able to control Bijuu like the first was able to.
It was never said that Kisame tried to kill the Mizukage and I never said that Kisame tried to kill the Mizukage, you should read more carefully. Secondly they were a group, the anime even did a filler arc with Naruto and the gang hunting down Raiga, I think his name was, to try to get info on Kisame's whereabouts.
It was stated back when Sasuke was fighting Itachi that MS gave the Uchihas the ability to control the Kyuubi and in exchange for that ability they go blind. So you can infer from that that anyone with MS could control the Kyuubi if they know how to use it, you can also infer that that only applies to the Kyuubi. I doubt its that simple though, it seems that you need exceptionally strong chakra like Sasuke and Madara have to be able to do it. I don't know what other benefits Madara's EMS gave him but the reason he got it was so that he could control the Kyuubi without going blind.
Last edited by Abdula; Mon, 06-16-2008 at 10:24 AM.
Dreaming impossible dreams.
Sapphire is awesome!
Of course you shouldn't assume that ONLY the kyubi can be controlled. The kyubi is the strongest of them, it'd be ridiculous if the others were immune.
However, I didn't even think about this much....
Maybe that's why Madara wants to capture all the bijuu...so he can control the bijuu with his sharingan. By giving a bijuu to Sasuke, he's basically letting Sasuke control one of the bijuu with his sharingan...
Well whatever...there's always a different excuse for akatsuki's goals.
We know that Kisame knows about Zabuza, because Kisame mentions Zabuza to Kakashi when they first met. By that point he had already known that Zabuza was defeated. Regardless, this neither proves nor disproves your point.sure, it's possible that Kisame didn't know Zabuza, and that they became missing nins on completly diffrent terms, and that some of swordsman are still in the village. it's possible, but I don't find it likely. it's like saying that the dynamic duo never met, and that the sound four aren't nescerly working together, and that the seven dragons\seal (x1999) don't know each other.
The Sound Four was working together because their goal as a team was to work together. Their skills were defense-based, which grew stronger with the combination of their efforts. There has been no indication of the seven swords of mist having this kind of relationship.
That's like saying that since Itachi was an ANBU when he defected, that all the other ANBUs should have defected as well. A completely baseless empirical assumption.
Last edited by Assertn; Mon, 06-16-2008 at 12:10 PM.
10/4/04 - 8/20/07
Well why not? The Itachi and Sasuke dialog specified that the kyuubi could be controlled but it didn't mention any of the other bijuus, if it was possible to control all of the tailed beasts then why wouldn't they just refer to it as the power to control the beasts instead of specifing just the nine tails? Indeed it is the strongest of them all but you can't tell me that just because of that the other ones aren't worth controlling.
It wouldn't be that strange if different bloodline limits gave control over different beasts would it?
I think I liked the tailed beasts better when they were a force of nature, rather than just tools that are being reclaimed.
<@Terra> he told me this, "man actually meeting terra is so fucking big", and he started crying. Then he bought me hot dogs
concerning the Zabuza and Kisama.I call then as I see them
both Kisama and Zabuza belong to the seven swordman group, and both are missing nins. why is it impossible to believe that the thing that got them expelled from the mist is the same?
I'm not saying that it's a fact, but it's something to consider.
say that there is a group of three ninjas, we'll call team 'traitor', and we get to see two of them, each in a seperate arc, being missing nins. wouldn't it be logical conclusion that they defected toghether?
No, not at all. It would be a huge assumption, but not a logical conclusion. Your evidence of their working in a group is based on their collective (and unconfirmed) missing-nin status, which assumes that they operated as a group in the first place. It's circular.
Zabuza worked alone (and went missing) for his own goals. He tried to raise the money himself, as Assertn said, and looked for his own accomplices, as opposed to gathering the other 6 swordsmen.
There's 0 evidence proving that the 7 worked together at all. Even Suigetsu said the swords were passed down the generations, meaning the "Seven Swordsmen" might not have even existed in the same time period, similar to the different Kage of each village.
Last edited by XanBcoo; Mon, 06-16-2008 at 01:34 PM.
<@Terra> he told me this, "man actually meeting terra is so fucking big", and he started crying. Then he bought me hot dogs
I have been led to believe that to everyone who doesnt know him as uchiha madara his sharingan casts an auto genjutsu to give them familiarity. I think thats why amaterasu activated when sasuke saw his sharingan. Maybe to prevent him looking like a family member or someone he might automatically trust. I think thats why noone was ever like oh the uchiha race cant be extinct if there's an uchiha as mizukage or what have u.
What? That's ridiculous. You guys go on and on about how unexplainable the Uchiha clan's powers are, and then you prefer arbitrary relationships over observable ones. We've already seen firsthand just how Sasuke was able to control Manda, a giant monsterous creature that not even Oro could tame. We've known even since the Zabuza arc that one of the sharingan's abilities is hypnosis. If Kyubi could be controlled, couldn't it be suggested that its done with the same form of hypnosis, and that any creature that has a regular pair of eyes can be controlled the same way?
@Death Boo Z: I reiterate: A completely baseless empirical assumption.
10/4/04 - 8/20/07
Perhaps you didn't say Kisame tried to kill the Mizukage. But an argument whether Kisame and the rest of the Seven Swordsmen were involved in the attempted coup or not precipitated this discussion. Indeed, you said
"I was under the impression that it was all the hidden mist swordsmen who were involved in the attempted coup and what they tried to do was assassinate the feudal lord, not the Mizukage, and that was how the group broke up."
This is completely wrong, by the way. Zabuza attempted to kill the Mizukage, not the Feudal Lord. I guess I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/30/naruto_30_03/
I still have not seen any real, canonical evidence that supports the claim that the Seven Swordsmen were a squad, worked together, or even knew each other. Let alone were all involved in the coup.
In any case, the Raiga filler is not canon. Obviously.
Same as above. Despite my opinion being the opposite of yours on this matter, I agreed that neither were fact, just plausible theories. However, as I showed above, Zabuza left after trying to assassinate the Mizukage. This makes it unlikely that Kisame was involved in the coup.
Last edited by poopdeville; Mon, 06-16-2008 at 10:26 PM.
Yeah you are right Zabuza did attempt to kill the Mizukage but when Kisame was first introduced it was said one of the reasons he was a missing nin was because he had killed the fuedal lord. As of the seven swordsmen, I'll just let this be until we find out more about them. I was hoping we would get more info on them when Suigetsu was introduced but that didn't happen, so hopefully with Madara being Mizukage we'll finally get to visit the hidden mist village.
@ Assertn, If the Kyuubi could be controlled with the same form of hynosis that Sasuke used on Manda then there would be no reason for the Uchiha to develop a different form of the sharingan specifically for the purpose of controlling the Kyuubi. I'm not saying I don't think the other bijuu can be controlled. I'm just saying that based on that its reasonable to think that what is required to control the Kyuubi and what is required to control other creatures would be different but logically if you can control the most powerful bijuu you should be able to control the weaker ones.
I'm wondering what you guys think about Madara sending Hawk after the eight tails instead of the Kyuubi because all things considered just the fact that Sasuke already has MS and even before he acquired it, he could suppress the Kyuubi's chakra and make Naruto essentially helpless, not to mention his familiarity with Naruto and Konoha. I would think it would be easy for Hawk to just capture Naruto.
Last edited by Abdula; Tue, 06-17-2008 at 07:14 AM.
Dreaming impossible dreams.
Sapphire is awesome!
Well i'm guessing that he would want to have a firmer grip on Sasuke before sending him to konoha. You've seen pain's power, logically there would be no way in hell for naruto to defeat him ( yeah i know he will anyway ) so i guess for him it just makes more sense to send the rinnegan instead of the rasengan because he has better control over it.
Thta's just a guess anyway for all i know sasuke already set his mind to destroy konoha just how he set his mind to follow orochimaru.
What is it your trying to say there. Do you mean send rinnegan instead of the sharingan. Anyway I've already considered that he wouldn't want to send Sasuke to Konoha or against Naruto because of how easily Sasuke is manipulated and that Naruto has been a major influence on Sasuke in the past.
However Sasuke already cut his ties with Naruto, and Hawk wouldn't even have to go to konoha because the reason Naruto and the others left the village in the first place was because they were trying to find Sasuke, so at the very least they could use Sasuke as bait to draw Naruto out because they know that no matter what he will come for Sasuke.
Dreaming impossible dreams.
Sapphire is awesome!
It's just bad guy pride, they won't even come up with plans like that since they're so confident on their own strength. That's like saying why not send more than just 1 group to get the tailed beasts especially now that there are only 2 left, they're so full of themselves they won't even consider the possibility of failure.
(taken from closed thread).
Imo wishful thinking, but sounds tempting.
Srsly, Sasuke can't be THAT naive
I wonder if we see the fight between Sasuke vs 8 tails at all, but since there's not all that much story left I guess we will.
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