He is in school, so he doesn't really need to use it in an instant, at least for now. I would think maintaining his cover takes priority over the 1 second of delay in using geass in a friendly environment.
EDIT: We shouldn't forget that Zero has a mask that completely covers both eyes, and only opens them through a contraption. That should take about the same time with removing a contact lens, since I use them myself.
Peace.
I'll take your word for it. I always thought the slider didn't require any hand movements, so when it opens, it catches the victim in the wtf moment. Removing contacts seems to require too much intervention and action, taking the surprise out of things. But I do find your idea plausible, and it'll work if it ends up that way, but he'll have to explain that he's half blind somehow when it's revealed.
The other reason why I thought he'd be able to turn it off somehow was that C.C said controlling Geass was a requirement of sorts for becoming a true king. Given how C.C warned him so much about overuse and being consumed, I think she treats that requirement quite seriously. Perhaps that's even one of the reasons why she left Mao.
Question that's still not answered in 2 eps: How did C.C. escape from the Gawain/ocean? And Orange-kun?
edit: Since Kallen ran out of the cave, I think she probably helped her.
Last edited by Buffalobiian; Tue, 04-15-2008 at 09:11 AM.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
A couple things here first off Suzuka isn't suppose to look like a definite bad guy in fact he's technically a high ranking good guy and Zero is the one that is designed to be bad guys.
as for the Emperor's "other use" for Lelouch lets not forget he believes in survival of the fittest and actually if zero dies or kills him its all the same the best man won and will be the new ruler of the empire. He's old and his kids killing each other so the strongest comes to win is what he's been doing the entire time. He isn't out for revenge he doesn't care that Zero killed some of his heirs the same way he couldn't care less Lelouch had his mother killed its just all part of his contest to find a true king end of story.
This isn't a Chinese story. The Britannians are the racist oppressors here. Lelouch is trying to liberate people under that ruthless rule of the fittest. In a sense Lelouch is a criminal in the eyes of the central government but in the end quite a few old democracies of our world were born when such "criminals" rose against absolute monarchies and gave power to the people. So, on the pages of the history books those people surely weren't bad guys (as such. I'm sure in the ranks of any force are people who are in just for the thrill and killing, yet might end up called even heroes).Originally Posted by DDBen
my comment was about the character design and the above complaint that Suzaku didn't look enough like a bad guy ala Aizen's change in Bleach. I'm not arguing over who's good and bad in the series its clear enough the viewer is suppose to support Zero. However just looking at the ending where the "good guys" have angel wings and the "bad guys" have demon wings should tell you which character designs are aimed to look like which.
Not trying to go against your post DDBen... but have you ever watched CLAMPs works?
They tend to use Angel wings for the 'bad guys' and Devil Wings for the 'good guys'
For example (without deviating much) take X... Kamui had Devil Wings, as well as the Dragons of Earth (the Seals). They wanted to preserve the current world, despite its wrongness, and save the humans. Fuuma had Angel Wings, and alongside the Dragons of Heaven (the Angels) wanted to purify earth... to save it... by destroying the humans and make the planet reborn.
My point is... with CLAMP designs, never label a good guy for having Angel Wings and a bad guy for having Devil Wings.
You did notice I used quotes around good and bad guys I wasn't saying which side is which. Clearly the Japanese perspective and the Britannian perspective differ greatly on that. There is no reason that Suzaku would wear anything to make him look like a bad guy when he is suppose to look like a Angel protecting the empire as one of the highest ranking knights.
I really don't even understand what point your attempting to prove as X has nothing to do with this nor does how clamp uses wings its simply how the factions are designed in Code Geass I was talking about.
Sorry, I misinterpreted you. Although I personally have no idea what a bad guy should look like and what a good guy should look like. A person's looks have the least to do with his morals, honour, level of compassion, and such, and the most to do with his personal style or job/hobby/aim, or convenience forced by the environment or company. Thus, an intelligent author/director follows such guidelines when planning clothes and appearances.
Well... even if you used "quotes", you clearly based your comments on how the characters were portrayed on the ending sequence, which happens to use CLAMP designs. Geez.
It does use clamp designs but its not written by Clamp its only character designs by them. No matter if someone is good or evil though its pretty easy to stick angel wings on the guys wearing white and Devil wings on the guys wearing black.
The thing is though good or not if your wearing Angel wings you want to LOOK like a good guy and as such the character design of Suzuka has no reason to change because in his mind he's still the good guy. Unlike in bleach where Aizen had played a good guy and later changed his image after becoming a bad guy.
The whole reason for my original post was in response to the earlier post of....
That reason as I've stated is because his look is dictated by his position in the empire where he is considered a "Good guy". This is why he wears the white uniform and why he has angel wings in the ending. It has nothing to do with if he's actually doing good or evil.
Can we really label Suzaku as a bad guy? He's melancholy and probably depressed right now, but I'd hesitate to call him bad. He's on the other side, but as of now his motives aren't evil or anything.
Jupiter....possibly C.C's homeland? According to C.C's memories, Jupiter used to be pretty close to Earth. Accessibly close. Reunion of Ragnarök probably means reunion of the two planets. But what's with the weapon used to destroy gods? My imagination tells me that activating all the monuments around the world turns that temple into a cannon or something. As of now, I just don't see what's in it for the Emperor. Guess we'll find out.
note: this ep showed us again that C.C and Lelouch make a great couple. After being separated for so long, they weren't the hot-blooded "oh I miss you so much" type, but instead were unchanged towards each other. They still throw insults at each other, but also talk sweet when they need to. Pretty much the type that lasts and keeps it's flare.
If it's not Isuzu-chan Mii~
Suzaku is at best an aniti-hero type but to me feels more like a misguided bad guy.
He doesn't seem willing to let anything, including his own morals, stand in the way of accomplishing his goal. He was willing to screw over the Japanese people and his closest friend all in the hopes that maybe he'd someday be allowed into the uppermost echelons of Britannian aristocracy so he might "change the system from the inside".
It's certainly not his motives that make him 'bad', it is his methodology. Lelouch does plenty of 'bad' things in order to get himself into a position where he might be able to do good things later. However Lelouch's bad things involve destroying the current power structure and taking control so he can establish a new one. This seems at least feasible since there is no upper limit to what can be destroyed by force.
Where Suzaku's methodology falters is in the assumption that the entrenched Britannian aristocracy will ever give him Noble status and let him set any sort of policy, this is just an unreasonable expectation. Suzaku has set himself up as a dog who's master is the Empire, his stated goal to rise through the ranks of dogs to become a master. However this just isn't going to happen. A master may reward a dog, and hold it above other dogs, and put it in the most prestigious kennel, and give it the finest treatment, but that will never change the fact that the dog is still just a dog. No matter how precious a dog is to a master, it will always be subservient to that master never the other way around.
I think it can be safely argued that the Britannian Empire, as it presently exists, is a 'bad' organization. And as a servant of a 'bad' organization Suzaku often does 'bad' things. Because he is a dog and can never realistically become a master I don't believe that Suzaku's "If you can't beat 'em, join em" attitude is any more than selfish, foolish, idealism taken to an extreme.
If he was trying to do something good but was hurting people along the way I would forgive him if his methodology had at least a chance for real success (i.e. rebellion). But because he doesn't have a real chance at ever changing policy in Britannia by being a good little dog I have no choice but to hold him accountable for all the 'bad' things he's done in the name of Britannia.
Whatever way you try to deny it, you used the wings to show who was evil and who was good. The series may not be by CLAMP, but the ending IS CLAMP. Or do you see the characters dancing around with wings during the episodes?
Last edited by RyougaZell; Tue, 04-15-2008 at 03:11 PM.
About the Lelouch contact lens idea: That's brilliant. Simple and effective. It doesn't have to be opaque, just like a two-way mirror. That's essentially how Zero's mask has operated this entire time. It was just a mask with a voice-modulator/amplifier, and a little sliding panel to expose his Geass eye. He could see through it all the time, as he frequently engaged in many types of combat while wearing it.
Since the nobility and even Cornelia were getting really uppity about Suzaku potentially becoming Euphie's Knight, I would tend to say that being Knighted by the royalty would grant some title. Cornelia made it completely official after Lelouch geassed her and Suzaku came down to check on her.
Not to mention where Suzaku is now. He's in the super elite Knights of the Round, hand picked by the Emperor. Now, back in mid season, Viletta believed that she could obtain a true noble title for trading in Zero. Shirley put a stop to that, but I don't find it hard to believe that Suzaku trading in the Emperor's wayward son as Zero would give him exactly what Viletta had hoped to gain from the same action.
Sure, no one in the series has said that Knights of the Round = Noble Title, but it has got to be pretty damn close if it isn't.
Screenshots I was refering to earlier, only linked as the width would mess with the forum:
http://david.deals.free.fr/karen.jpg
http://david.deals.free.fr/karen2.jpg
I guess I should have reacted before, but in the whole scene, Karen is poorly drawn, her legs are bent like thos of a horse.
Then, two times in the ep there's that angle from down behind her when she's in her knight that are quite cheap.
But I guess I wasn't in synch with that ep regarding visuals, although the story was nice.
On another subject:
Where does the technology Britania has come from?
They state that Britania invaded the world easily thanks to KMs. It seemed to me as if this technology came out of nowhere in a blink of an eye.
Could it be "alien" as in not coming from our earth/plan of existence (if we take "magic" into consideration)
All the things I really like to do are either illegal, immoral, or fattening. And then: Golf.
He had a voice-modulator?
I always thought he was only masking the voice himself...
I mean... he sounded the same as 'Zero' when he ordered the soldiers to kill themselves, and while saying he was 'Zero' to Kallen and Urabe.
David:
Those links are kinda dead. Error 404.
You could see a small device (circular, black, wires trailing from it). When he put the mask on dramatically from his point of view, when he had it made, or when Arthur the cat stole it.
The only other option was that it was the motor controlling the sliding piece, but didn't you notice after Lelouch starting using the mask, that his voice always had this slightly robotic and tinny sound to it? Like a soft echo in a metal cup. I thought it was more than just the mask on his face, which alternatively would have produced a muffled sound.
I presumed that was supposed to be used to disguise his voice in case he met anyone that would know him from school. Like Kallen, every day. He had a similar device on his phone when calling the Black Knights, that I assume also made his phone untraceable.
EDIT:
@David: The series always looked that way. Both seasons. See any scene with Nina, and many other ones where characters are shocked, insulted or pissed. Euphie on the island when Kallen calls her a doll, etc. That's just the art style.
As for the Knightmares, "Britannia" is just another name for America. I see the map this season does not include the British Isles. The real life Western Empire (that I hail from) has lots of money and plenty of neat toys too.
Go thinly-veiled political statements in entertainment and blatant references to Jingoism!
Last edited by Ryllharu; Tue, 04-15-2008 at 03:46 PM. Reason: for Fun with History
First let me say I don't disagree with anything you've said and from a third party view or from the view of the Japanese this is entirely true. The place where this view falls apart is when you look at it as a Brittannian instead. There goal is order and if the world is united under one group or goal a lot of things like civil war among earthlings should be reduced and less wars in the long run is a good goal. In the short term taking over contries by force and attempting to unite the planet in a cast based society is on the other hand something you look at as evil.
The system of government is designed to integrate the people over time with rewards for those who choose to do so on there own. Eventually people who become honorary Brittanians that fight for the Empire will be integrated into the Empire and there race won't matter to anyone but the hardliners and sooner or later even that will disappear. Its all a matter of do the ends justify the means and if they win the war and things go as planned the survivors will have no choice but to say it was. History comes down to the good guys are the ones who win and the bad guys are the ones who lose at this point there is no winner however as the main character is Lelouche and as such its very easy to claim his side must be good.
@RyougaZell
If you can't understand the difference of stating in a conversation that something is quote good verses saying something is good I don't know how to explain something that basic to you in any other way. I get how you interpreted what I said but it was not my intention for it to have been taken that way. I've gone out of my way to explain and all you do is continue to insist I can't possibly know my own intentions as well as you do get over yourself.
As far as the wings go.
All the wings represent is basically order vs chaos. You can go with X and say the Angelic side wanted to destroy the chaos and recreate the world as order and the Demonic side wanted to preserve the current chaos its not about good or bad its a battle of ideology. In Code Geass its the same the Brittannian Empire is taking over everything and under one ruler there will be one law and a certain kind of order as a result on the other hand the Black Kniights are fighting to restore the "chaos" of freedom where everyone gets to choose there own path.
I would find it very strange indeed that a culture built around conquest could or would want to change gears and start accepting conquered peoples as equal partners in government and I have seen no evidence of that being a high priority in the minds of any of the leaders we've been shown. Psychologically it just doesn't seem to fit that conquerors would happily accept those they chose to conquer as equals without at least a generation or two of integration and hard indoctrination. You don't invade an equal and attempt to eradicate their culture and soul and then decide that you now respect its citizens as equals.
You can label all the people who thought like Orange-kun as hardliners but I look at it this way, how many Britannian commanders/royalty have we been shown who didn't feel that Britanians were naturally superior to non-Britannians and go so far as to not apply value to the life of a non-Britannian?
I believe that the Britannian higher class eats, drinks, and breaths the idea of its own superiority and I can't fathom why such a group of people would ever willingly allow someone not lof their like to control them without being forced by someone like the Emperor or another Royal Family member.
@Ryllharu: Suzaku may be a high rolling Knight of the Round now but all that means is he has a lot of martial power and doesn't have to answer to a long chain of command. It probably gets him some oh's and ah's from the typical hanger's on who populate aristocratic seats of power but I don't think it means he could just go back to Japan and tell the Britanians to be nicer to the Japanese. He's still just a soldier. I'm sure he could wave his status around and scare some small fry administrators and maybe minor nobility, but ultimately he's just a figurehead for the Emperor and he certainly couldn't influence anyone who also has direct ties to the Emperor like a favored Noble.
Of course I must allow for the possibility that Suzaku's smooth talking will somehow make the Emperor change his ways and get him to stop sanctioning the indiscriminate killing of dissenters, but if something like that happens I'll probably curse the show and its creators for life.
@Ryllharu:
I see. I never noticed that thing on the helment. You are right. He did get a more robotized voice when wearing the helment.
@Yuki:
Best example of what you speak is those britannian at the tower, watching eleven battling.
@DDBen:
You have been only avoiding the point. Wheter you quoted or not, you still MADE a comparasion using images from the ending. Do not like comparasions? Please do not use them then.
PS: Do not like me using the rep system? Too bad.
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