Wow, the second one is pretty awesome.
Wow, the second one is pretty awesome.
So Realta Nua has different art from the original? Is there somewhere we can download it from?
PS: Check out the new sig
out of the FSN-Anime thread
I've got a few questions here... my memory of the game is a bit blurry... I don't know what happened in HF, but I'm talking about UBW and the Fate route here.Originally Posted by Ryllharu
Didn't Archer/Shirou join the Grail War because he wanted to become a hero? If I remember correctly, he wanted to help and save people forever and thus made a contract with the Grail... it would grand him more powers so he could become a superhero, but in return Shirou hast to fight in the Holy Grail Wars after his life ended.. so far I'm right, or am I not.
However Shirou soon realised that he can't save everyone and that his contract with the Holy Grail was a mistake.... I think at one point it was mentioned that people "betrayed" him... but I can't remember what exactly happened there (some help please? ^^).. he couldn't save everyone, because if you help someone, there is always one who can't be helped and such.
So when he joined the Holy Grail War, he hoped to find his past-self and kill it to create a "Time Paradox".. he would never have made the contract and so on. In UBW he succeeds (well he fails at the end but he got far) with his plans, while in the Fate route he dies against Berserker...
however I'm not sure whether the Archer in Fate and in UBW are the same.. characterwise. Archer in UBW seemed a lot stronger than in Fate :/.. so I' don't know if he really tried his best in "Fate" and accepted his old past very early in the route (in UBW he only realised it in the very end shortly before he died)
soooo:
Could you PM me or write here without trying to hide spoilers? I don't exactly get what you mean... I know that in UBW when he was fighting shirou, the game says something like "When Archer saw his determined eyes he got reminded of his old self... he remembered that his life wasn't wrong and that it wasn't a mistake to live for justice" (or so :P)... so my guess is you were talking about that when you said "while in another, he very noticably shifts to "It is happening again." "Two of the arcs he persists in saying, "It won't happen again," while in another, he very noticably shifts to "It is happening again." If you complete enough of the bad endings in that arc, you also learn exactly which one it is, as it says it plain as day.
but what do you mean with "If you complete enough of the bad endings in that arc, you also learn exactly which one it is, as it says it plain as day." in that context?
and with "it won't happen again" in the other two arcs?
also
I always wondered: Couldn't Archer obtain the holy grail and wish his past to be done?Saber destroeyed the holy grail this time
and if that doesn't work:
Couldn't he simply destroy it and it would have the same effect as killing shirou?
becuase if the Grail is destroyed, there won't be any more Grail Wars... and no Grail.. Shirou could never make a contract with the Grail and thus he wouldn't have to suffer so much.
Or is it more like he is annoyed by his past-self, thinks lowly of himself (at least at first) and wants to end his miserable existence?
edit: and just to be sure if I remember it correctly, he didn't kill Shirou from the first second he saw him, because he hoped he would turn out different with the clues he gives them throughout the story... like "you can't save everyone".. "you can't win without killing and only danger other people" etc.?
It's my own impression that the Fate route if anything leads to Archer. In that route Shirou got to be a clean hero and ended up with nothing but his own ideology strenghtened (losing Saber). In UBW he got Rin, and thus is saved from the fate as Rin wouldn't simply watch her man to get wasted on fool's errands. At the end of HF he's hardly a hero anymore.
The way Archer treats Rin of course shows there's a history between them but I wouldn't think the kind of history UBW would lead to. Although I visited no Tiger doujos, so I wouldn't know what that quote is all about.
Shirou of the future or "Archer" explains in one of the intermissions in UBW that as much of a superhero as he had planned to be, he really couldn't save everyone. This happened time and time again, and he slowly slipped into despair. When he finally died doing this, his regret in life was that he had failed...and would be determined to ensure that the future he came from never came to pass. So as the Grail does, it drew him back from the future on that most powerful and determined desire. If he won the Grail, Angra Mainyu possessing the Grail would destroy the possibility of that ever occurring. With that promise Shirou returned as Archer, drawn in by Rin's similar personality (cold and often brutal determination, with a warm squishy center) and her debateable fuckup at summoning during the Prologue.
No, I am talking about Heavens Feel. I can avoid spoiling it for you here just fine.however I'm not sure whether the Archer in Fate and in UBW are the same.. characterwise. Archer in UBW seemed a lot stronger than in Fate :/.. so I' don't know if he really tried his best in "Fate" and accepted his old past very early in the route (in UBW he only realised it in the very end shortly before he died)
Could you PM me or write here without trying to hide spoilers? I don't exactly get what you mean... I know that in UBW when he was fighting shirou, the game says something like "When Archer saw his determined eyes he got reminded of his old self... he remembered that his life wasn't wrong and that it wasn't a mistake to live for justice" (or so :P)... so my guess is you were talking about that when you said "while in another, he very noticably shifts to "It is happening again." "
but what do you mean with "If you complete enough of the bad endings in that arc, you also learn exactly which one it is, as it says it plain as day." in that context?
and with "it won't happen again" in the other two arcs?
There are lines from Archer where he indicates a very different viewpoint on the events of each night. Something appears in front of Shirou, Saber, Rin, and Archer on the first night of Heavens Feel, and Archer is visibly shaken when he sees it. He says, "It is happening again" as opposed to the standard lines where he says he won't allow it to happen.
Archer was weakened in the Fate route because Saber kicked his ass the first night, and he was forced into a weakened recovery state for most of the arc. This is the reason Rin demands that Shirou enter an alliance with her, but she is not in a position of strength. So Archer can't act on his own desires, and in UBW where he can, he dramatically shifts the outcomes in the War (he would have practically killed Berserker on the first night).
After a rather key event that shifts the reader's understanding of everything you took for granted in the other two arcs (one of the reasons I like HF so much), you get a choice in fairly short order. The bad ending that results from that choice tells you directly that Shirou, "becomes the superhero." He becomes Archer. The choice crushes him, but it sends him down that determined path that leads him to that despair we see in UBW. Combine this ending with his lines from Day 4 and you get the truth about what events turned Shirou into Archer.
[Specifically, it is Day 9 of Heavens Feel, Tiger Dojo 30 (numbering from mirrormoon's flowchart). Don't look at the chart unless you want to see spoilers about the arc. The other choice is a big spoiler in and of itself.]
There, just naming the days and one line or two, and it's pretty much spoiler free for you to enjoy on your own.
Sure he could destroy the Grail and prevent something else from happening, but as a I've said above, the reason Archer is so pissed off, depressed, and full of despair is because of what happened as a result of this Grail War from his timeline. Destroying the Grail really wouldn't help him all that much, and it would probably prevent him from getting the power to come back here and try to stop all of it any way he can.Couldn't he simply destroy it and it would have the same effect as killing shirou?
becuase if the Grail is destroyed, there won't be any more Grail Wars... and no Grail.. Shirou could never make a contract with the Grail and thus he wouldn't have to suffer so much.
Or is it more like he is annoyed by his past-self, thinks lowly of himself (at least at first) and wants to end his miserable existence?
edit: and just to be sure if I remember it correctly, he didn't kill Shirou from the first second he saw him, because he hoped he would turn out different with the clues he gives them throughout the story... like "you can't save everyone".. "you can't win without killing and only danger other people" etc.?
Archer is not Shirou. He doesn't think the same way due to what happened to him, and nothing is that easy for him. Archer only thinks about stopping it all by killing everyone, rather than actually being the "superhero" he became. Despair ruins him the same way it or some other emotion (for example, betrayals for Caster) has twisted the hearts of some many other characters in FSN.
hmmm seems like HF is a lot more fun to read than I thought it would be...
thx 4 the info... if I could rep you, I would :P
Actually what really helped in the summoning was the fact that Archer had Rin's necklace in the future while she still had the original.
And yes i agree with you Ryu, the archer we came to know was generated in the HF path on day 9. That decision crushed his spirit and made the path of the hero permanent to him.
Well it gets kinda depressing at times but the true ending makes up for it.
It's highly contradictory the HF path could generate Archer. In HF Shirou already realised he needs to make compromises and sacrifices to gain anything, that is, sacrifice someone else to save someone other. How could he, from such an ugly onset, start on the path of a pure hero to later be broken and betrayed, giving birth to the disappointed, despairing Archer? At the end of HF Shirou should already be pretty close to Archer's state, only with the difference he hasn't lost everything, thus making him vastly different.
I wasn't referring to any of the official endings of HF, just a particular Bad End where Shirou makes a life changing decision based on his ideal that will lead to him becoming the sarcastic archer
Spoiler:
When he decided to Kill Sakura to continue his dream of being a superhero
/end spoiler
Archie is right, it isn't either of the actual endings to HF, it is the Bad End on Day 9 that turns Shirou into Archer.
Concerning the particular sacrifice that you are mentioning Kraco, the difference there is:
[spoiler]
Not only the fact that he lost Saber in the process, but that even after ALL that he had already lost, he couldn't save Sakura anyway (in that bad ending). That is what makes him the disappointed, dejected, despairing Archer. Saving Sakura by going the full length of HF does make all the differnence, because he hasn't lost nearly as much as he does having to kill his chosen love.
[/spoiler]
I thought all the bad endings result in Shirou dying... Ho... I must have missed something interesting. I take it the story didn't still continue for too long?
There's a difference between a "Bad End" an "Dead End"
- A Dead End is one end where Shirou gets killed
- A Bad End is one where he doesn't die. Mostly these ending are for when he gets turned into a doll by you know who ,and in some other rare events he loses someone too dear to him.
After you make the choice there's only about a half dozen screens of text, give or take. You could skip down to it and get the details in less than 5 minutes on a new game (since you completed it).
Hmm... I only got the endings where Shirou died and Sakura lived waiting for him forever, and then the one where they both survived. I guess they were the Good and True endings. But then again, I didn't like HF enough to probe every choice. It was annoying enough with all the traps that killed you after a bunch of other choices that didn't matter anymore.
Like i said, it's not an official ending just a bad end
Realta Nua - 9 Lives Blade Works
Are there any more scene upgrades like this?? Because this is way more awesome than how they did it on the pc version.
there are..with different art and such
but the PC has certain scene which Realta Nua doesn't have :P
and Realta Nua has another ending scene when you get all tiger stamps.. I think the PC version doesn't have that.
I did get a special scene, the final tiger dojo after completing all the dojos and all the endings; is that what you're talking about?
How does the Ps2 version replace all the H content anyway? And how do they deal with HF? That arc isn't suitable for minors no matter how many modifications you make.
Ah... hmm I mixed something up
what is the special scene about?
Maybe that was just the normal ending of the fate-route in realta nua I'm talking about
if you want to see it.
http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=NEGzuJ6EN_k
I think that's the special ending, I'm not too sure though as I already said.
Shirou lived his life, died and meets Saber in Avalon... Merlin talks a bit about how it is possible for 2 people to meet at impossible places (or something) etc. etc.
never found an exact translation.
Last edited by KrayZ33; Mon, 01-05-2009 at 06:28 AM.
No i'm talking about the final tiger dojo
Spoiler:
Taiga and Ilya on a hot spring
What's up with that ending?? Saber looks kawaii !!!
Is that the true ending in the saber route, realta nua version?
Last edited by Archangel; Mon, 01-05-2009 at 06:28 AM.
Yes I think so.. it's the ending you get when you finished all routes (and tiger dojos?) in Realta Nua, obviously for the Fate-route.
It's the most "happy ending" in the game... but from what I've heard it's written really "blurry", so that the reader can make up his own mind (whether shirou is really there or not and so on)
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