Well, the red particle emitting Gundams sure aren't any allies of the countries. I guess they were back-ups of the old Gundams.
I wonder how it's going to end up now. In this episode the super powers didn't fire a single armor piercing round, they only used what looked like antipersonnel rounds and grenades and HE bombs in order to wear out the Gundam pilots but retain the full structural integrity of the machines themselves, I guess to keep them totally functional for their laboratories.
However, now that they face even more Gundams and probably lost everything they gained with so big losses in this operation, I wonder if they are going to just say "to hell with them", and switch to APs and even tactical nukes just to get rid of the enemy. It doesn't look they can win anymore any other way. It's a bit unequal, after all, when the Gundam meisters gleefully slaughter their opponents but the pilots of the super powers aren't allowed to harm theirs.
Wow, that was intense. Pesonally, I don't see anything special about the gundam meisters. I guess it's too early, but I'm just wondering, what qualifies people as a meister?
I mean, we'll i guess Lock-on has his aim, and Sumeragi has his second personality, but what about Virtue and Sestuna? Can't wait to see what happens next now
virtue is a fag (yet he looks the best in his combat-suit...lol) and setsuna is depressive....
i think you must be a retard to pilot a gundam... or something like that.
can't wait for Conclave-quality
Honestly though after watching this episode am I the only one thinking that Sumeragi is either not completely loyal to CB or just stupid like no other. I mean hell she knew of the battle plan that the factions were using in order to capture the Gundams and she just sent all four of them straight in there even though they had 800 something mobile suits to attack them with. Unless those 3 suits were part of the plan worst case scenario to have them escape then at least it makes a bit more sense but even then it's a pretty damn stupid plan considering she just sent them to get shot at for what 15+ hours before any kind of back up arrived. Or rather have them go in there kill the terrorists and pray that they manages to escape the bombardment and suits they had waiting for when they would show up. Good plan indeed... they better have a logical explanation to the lack of plan that Sumeragi had other than endure and endure then try to escape.
You are here alone again
In your sweet insanity
All too calm, you hide yourself from reality
Do you call it solitude? Do you call it liberty?
When all the world turns away to leave you lonely
I hope Sumeragi got false plans. I mean, why on earth would military operation plans be given to some outsider in any case? The only logical explanation would be that they are too comfortable and overconfident in their Gundams or that Sumeragi's plans were based on false information and thus things didn't proceed at all like she thought.
I don't see how the plans would be false at all since when she met up with the guy they talked about it briefly and the plan was basically to gather as much forces as possible and then wear the Gundam meistars out. But she commented herself in that what kind of military man he was for even sending her the plans from the start. And why they would be given to some outsider isn't exactly hard to imagine seeing she's not just any outsider, they obviously know each other from before, studied together or whatever since the professor knows her as well. And frankly it seems as if he's interested in Sumeragi mostly because of his comment after their meeting that it's ok as long as he can see her again so it's not exactly unfathomable that he'd send her the files. Also because of her former position as tactician or whatever it's called she could have valuable opinions on the plan as to things they should take into consideration. The fact that she happens to be on CB isn't something he could have known. And she did give some comments that there's too little information to be able to make a proper evaluation such as the fact that they don't know if there's only 4 Gundams.
And frankly it seemed like she sent them out there without any real plan whatsoever, just shot the terrorist and then escape. Virtue and Exia were after all there in order to help secure a escape route seeing as they weren't there to fight all the 800+ mobile suits and if they were then you'd think they would equip Exia with all his swords instead of just his basic equipment. In my opinion she failed horribly even worse than when they were up against just Sergei. Even if those three new Gundams were part of the plans she still fails horribly because it's a stupid idiotic plan from the start especially when she knew what their objective and plan was.
You are here alone again
In your sweet insanity
All too calm, you hide yourself from reality
Do you call it solitude? Do you call it liberty?
When all the world turns away to leave you lonely
None of that really matters. In the military you don't give classified data even to your mother unless she has a clearance. So, either the dude is being used by the military intelligence (assuming such a thing even exists in this series) or he's going to spend the next 20 years of his career in a prison, or he knew what he was doing and gave compromised information. Or the Gundam 00 script writers ate something quite different instead of their Matsutake.
Frankly, if I had to choose between compromised data or Sumeragi being brainless, I'd choose the former option. Although even that doesn't mean she would be redeemed, as it'd be hardly professional to base a whole operation on intelligence received from a dubious source...
I agree it's unprofessional and probably would have him ended up in prison but seeing as realism isn't needed in anime I find it quite possible that the information was true, there was talk about that in the ep 14 thread wasn't there realism that is.
Think about it, do you honestly think that the information he gave her wasn't true or accurate? From what we knew from their talk they were gonna drag the fight on and on in order to wear the meistars out then capture them if it worked etc and after watching this episode that's exactly what they did. So I'd say whatever information he gave her was pretty damn accurate. Secondly it could have been used for plot reasons to make the two of them more clearly connected which is why any real military rules regarding the information is automatically thrown out the window. It doesn't make Sumeragi any less of an idiot for not using that information though, if she is professional then she would have taken into account that the information was real from the looks of it their plain and operation was not built around what to do if they all gang up and shot the crap out of us. And looking at it, it seemed quite possible that they had several possible plans if those two had made it out from the start I highly doubt that Virtue and Exia would just appear and walk away they probably had some kind of plan incase they weren't needed. So they should have had a plan on what to do incase that plan was real and they start shooting the crap out of them for 15 hours. Only thing I can think of is that she didn't want to base any operation or plans on any information she can receive from him but that's equally or even more stupid.
Edit: Found this which is suppose to be the meistars for the three new gundams eins, zwei and drei
http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/2237/02310561da3.jpg
Last edited by fireheart; Tue, 01-22-2008 at 01:58 AM.
You are here alone again
In your sweet insanity
All too calm, you hide yourself from reality
Do you call it solitude? Do you call it liberty?
When all the world turns away to leave you lonely
thats......a relly big pic
Favorite Gotwoot Mod moment: "Why is everyone in that show black? The art and music are pretty good, and the voice acting is alrite as well......but i can't stand that guy who follows afro around. Hes so, well, black, for the lack of a better term (well thats not true, there is a better term, but i wont use it here)" Assassin
i was raised by this woman =O
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JrR7hPT9Bs
Can you make that a clickable link. You just ruined the whole forum layout!
This whole episode was intense I loved every moment or it. If that new Gundam didn't come in to save Setsuna at the last moment I got the feeling he might have gone berserk mode on "Gary Biaggi" lol!
Episode 15 is out by Conclave-Mendoi
HD x264
SD x264
Last edited by Maverick-DBZ-; Tue, 01-22-2008 at 12:59 AM.
_
Nice. Another Haro. Haroes are the best
Stupid plot disagreeing with the OP and my analysis/predictions. They may be on the same side but there's a still a chance the new and the old will end up having it out over something, wouldn't be the first time Gundam pilots ended up fighting against their original 'side'.
As to the Sumeragi being dumb, the only smart thing to do in that situation would have been to not go. They already knew it was a giant trap even without the lovestruck nerds plans, but they went anyway because stopping terrorists is part of what they do. Sumeragi apparently came up with several plans and contingencies to try and get them out, however when it's 4 vs 864 there isn't really viable solution because no matter where they might have gone the enemy could just throw more bodies at them to keep them pinned down.
I really didn't like the way the time kept skipping forward from an action standpoint, but it did a good job of showing things from a dramatic standpoint. Sumeragi and the rest of the crew weren't involved or keeping appraised of the situation at all, they were simply waiting for the meisters to make it out somwhow. Considering the amount of caring some of the crew have shown for particular meisters I am forced to conclude they were doing nothing because there was simply nothing they could do to help them but wait.
One thing that really bothers me though is Allelujah, why do they continue to use him knowing that one the people he might encounter on the battlefield can completely incapacitate him just by being nearby, now that's foolishness IMO.
So much to say...but I'll keep it brief, as always. Yea, like Yuki says, Allelujah is a huge liability in any mission that may involve the HRL, and thusly should not be included in any soirée that could possibly involve that world power. That being said, I think that it was a smart strategy to attack the human faculties of the meisters.
They may have super-ridiculous mobile suits, but they cant fight nature (speaking of that, i hope their suits have...facilities inside of them). And again, I have to give it to Lockon for having the coolest moment in the episode...when he snipes Joshua with the handgun...absolutely classic; especially how slowly the gun moves towards Joshua (remember..."He just LOVES sneak attacks"). And those new Gundams look sinister...with the red and black energy; kinda reminds me of brimstone and hellfire.
Something tells me that Sumeragi had some knowledge of this little deus ex machina coming into play, but I'm not sure why she would send her troops into that kind of duress. Also, was I the only one really annoyed by the Saji and Lousie thing at the beginning? Somebody needs to splash some water in that broad's face.
are you sure sumeragi is stupid? using that info is like setsuna saying he is a gundam maister... and not going to kill the terrorist contradicts the whole idea of CB.
i think that the three new gundams are part of CB, but are not in control of sumeragi, someone else's. and this someone just ordered them to save the 4 gundams as they werent going to destroy themselves... i still think yukimura was right, just that the 3 new suits know the real goals of CB, just like saji's sister said in chapter 14, and they are just using all the people we know of CB... and then CB gets divided in two groups...
Think about it for a moment what would have been the point of dividing the Gundams into two like they did? More or less each of the Gundams had to fend for themselves the way the plan was executed, in what world is that a smart plan when you're facing 864 mobile suits? True they were cut of and were being bombarded all the time but hey they're Gundams and frankly it wouldn't have been to hard to actually try and met up instead of standing still and take a beating while shooting every now and then. As I pointed out it's just plain stupid to not equip Exia with what they've had, Exia had standard weaponry that he pretty much always have and not equipped like he was when they fought that war where ever against who ever it was. Of course it's a liability for CB seeing as he might drop the swords but hell I'd still wager on it's better to equip Exia to match his name. Secondly notice how Hallelujah doesn't even flinch or scream or anything while being bombarded but Allelujah does and mostly everyone. Meaning it was possible to keep you're head cool not scream and get a beating and actually fight back instead.
You may not find her stupid but I do, because here imo was a great chance to actually have them pull of some teamwork by helping each other and using tactics rather than the flimsy plan they had, ok secure a path smart but what if it gets compromised and they managed to launch that full out attack? Apparently it was stand still wait for a chance and then run like hell. In other news something I think would have been an obvious way of dealing with the terrorist would be to just have Lockon snipe them from space. If he can snipe from earth into space he should by all logical means be able the do the opposite of that. But no of course there's a time lag but looking at it the time lag isn't as long as Virtues recharge time and if he snipes them early on it wouldn't be a problem. Secondly seeing as Virtues big secret is already out it can't be against all rules to actually use it. Simply put seeing as they knew what they had for plan their counter plan really sucked and for that Sumeragi is plain stupid for not coming up with a better plan than that. And who says she has to use the exact information, she doesn't need to know every troop or what plan they're using it's enough to just use the information that they're all going to join and fight them. There's no specific information there that would reveal her as part of CB.
You are here alone again
In your sweet insanity
All too calm, you hide yourself from reality
Do you call it solitude? Do you call it liberty?
When all the world turns away to leave you lonely
Remember how she kept commenting on how they'd probably switched to plan LetterNumber if it's taking this long. I think the whole point was that they kept trying to do stuff and the enemy was able to react and counter it by throwing more and more bodies at the problem. Since the Gundams could be detected by that communications field thing and carpet bombed there wasn't really anything they could do. No matter what exit vector they might have tried there would still be shit tons of mobile suits waiting to eat them alive. And since this series' Gundams can't simply ignore physical damage unles they're standing still and defending just flying through the bombardment was pretty much out as well.
I disagree granted I haven't checked out mendoi-conclave release yet on what they said. However from what I got they went with B2 to secure a route for the others to escape, the whole point of Virtue charging and shooting of that beam. After that if it proceeded like expected then it should have gotten to E5 I think which seemed to mean that one of the suits would show up soon if she meant the three new ones or one of the meistars is hard to know but seeing as she said Allelujah right afterwards I'm gonna wage on that she meant him. Besides the three new Gundams didn't show up until at least 13 hours after she said that which isn't what I'd call soon. Also they never said anything about switching plans other than the beginning when they switched to B2 that Kyrios and Dynames should be arriving at the rendezvous point. And Sumeragi only said that judging from the time that it should have proceeded to E5, kinda like their phases was my take on it. No where does it mention anything about switching to any plan because it's taking so long.
None of which make it any better because they should have had a battle plan just incase they would have been forced to battle it out with all those troops. They shouldn't have been so stupid as to not realize that they might have to fight and as such a plan should have been made if something like that happened so that they don't get to worn out. And because they didn't have one I called Sumeragi stupid, granted who knows she might have had one but looking at it if that was part of the plan then she still fails and still stupid if it relied on those 3 new Gundams.
And it still doesn't address any of the other points I made for why the whole plan was stupid. Or the alternative method of dealing with the terrorists.
You are here alone again
In your sweet insanity
All too calm, you hide yourself from reality
Do you call it solitude? Do you call it liberty?
When all the world turns away to leave you lonely
na... Fireheart.
she predicted exactly what happened. when she said "that suit" she meant the Taozi.
also, i really think the new Gundams are going to be the main antagonists of this show in the future (or whatever organization, group of CB they follow).
also, in my opinion, everything is going according to plan for CB. if the 7 Gundam manage to defeat 864 suits (or simply escape actually), it will be a HUGE blow for the non-CB (morale and resources wise). it'll basically be what happened with the HRL earlier on a greater scale. its... sublime.
Well, with the 3 other Gundams, its like what some people said earlier: there is a possiblity of CB having different "cells" that dont know the existence of each other and act independently of each other (for the most part). I think that this is an example of that.
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