Haku was barely stronger than rookie Sasuke. If he were still alive, I could see him as REALLY strong. But from what we've seen, I'd say C to C--
Haku was barely stronger than rookie Sasuke. If he were still alive, I could see him as REALLY strong. But from what we've seen, I'd say C to C--
even with kimimaro in second form he is still super strong
Having read through several who is strongest threads, and this one, the thing I'm curious about is Gaara.
First Gaara matching up against top Fighters:
Gaara v. Itachi: There's no proof that when surrounded by sand and percieving through either the sand eye or other means, that the Tsukiyomi would succeed. Especially if Gaara had any warning on Itachi being his opponent. Conceivably, if the eye were vulnerable to genjutsu, Gaara would dissolve the eye and simply hammer the entire region out to several acres with a mass of sand, and then create massive pressure and subduction like how he did with Kimmimaru, using the mass to pin them in place long enough to suck them down. We've seen from Itachi's escape from Jiraiya that he isn't fast enough to run several acres faster than Gaara could drop the sand. We know that the Amaterasu would burn through things even resistant to flame, we don't really know if it would have an equally dramatic effect on Gaara's sand. We also don't know how it's used, if it is short range or usable at anything LOS(line of sight).
Gaara v. Kakkashi: It's explicitly said that Kakkashi cannot use the MS (Mangekyou Sharingan) instantly, it takes a fairly significant amount of time. Therefor Gaara is given the opportunity to defeat Kakkashi. It's also not clear if the MS is LOS if it's not and has a finite range Gaara can stay outside it.
Gaara v. Sannin: Gaara's vulnerability to massively damaging physical attacks isn't entirely clear. It's possible that with a powerful enough AOE(Area of Effect) they might be able to defeat Gaara, but again range is an issue, the same is true of something penetrating. Sasuke's Chidori isn't able to, and we don't know if a wind jutsu would.
Secondly Analysis of Gaara as a whole:
The amount of sand, and the speed with which it was called(i'd use summoned but that would imply something other than what I mean) during the Deidara fight demonstrates how much and how quickly he can control general sand. Given that, and assuming he was trying to kill his opponent without having to defend a large stationary target, such as a fight out in the desert, it could be argued that he can simply deal with powerful opponents by surrounding them in a mountain of sand. Without the city it's conceivable Gaara could have simply called a mass of sand and hammered it flat on the entire region. So far no one (demons excluded) has demonstrated a Jutsu that could wipe out a mountain of sand. The amount puts Byakuya's Bankai to shame, and only a character either a) fast enough, or b) with a powerful enough penetrating jutsu would be able to blast their way out before being immobilized. The biggest factor is quite frankly we just haven't seen too many characters capable of flying, and without that all short range and medium range jutsu are irrelevant ultimately. For the most powerful characters especially we have no way of knowing if they would be capable of counterattacking fast enough or defending against Gaara when he means to simply kill them and without anything fragile nearby to worry about such as a city or the like. My final point is would Gaara be able to be defeated by any of the current characters if he focused entirely on defense and simply buried himself in an enormous sphere of sand, and did so somewhere off center so attacks that bypassed the defense missed? Surely that invulnerability should count for something. [Edited for spelling mistakes]
The conclusion that I draw is that while Gaara might not be S,(I personally would rate him thus) and thus legendary, he should at least be A+ due to his sheer capacity for massive AOE damage and incredible potential for defense. It's true that some of the assumptions I made were that Gaara was fighting under favorable conditions, eg not protecting something, has sand around, and isn't attacked by surprise, but the same might be said of any qualitative analysis of Itachi or Jiraiya's powers, such as Itachi being rested and so able to use the Tsukiyomi.
PS If I cited any erroneous information or anyone has any salient and coherent counterarguments to offer, I'd be welcome to attempt to defend my opinion's against them, or acknowledge them as valid if I don't have any.
Last edited by Ikepuska; Sat, 11-11-2006 at 07:37 PM.
"Beware of bugs in the above code; I have only proved it correct, not tried it." -- Donald Knuth
Just a quick comment about the 4th. Back in the Oro/ Third Hokage fight Oro originally planned to summon all three of the previous kages, including the fourth.
Third managed to stop 4th's coffin from rising, recognizing instantly who it was, he seemed to fear the prospect of fighting him the most. Even going as far as to say that he was relieved and that fighting the other two would just make things more difficult as opposed to facing the fourth.
Plus the third also mentions that the death god summoning jutsu was developed by the fourth as well.
Nothing really new or extraordinary, just a few tidbits I thought were worth mentioning about little clues that kishi has left for us to indicate how badass the 4th was and how he warrents his place as an S + rank character.
I personally have always thought that at some point latter in the manga when Naruto confronts Oro again that Oro might wind up summoning the forth's corpse in order to keep naruo distracted while he gets away.
Maybe we'd even get a nice, "I'm your father revelation" before the actual fighting begins.
Seeing how much hints that kishi had dropped about the connection between naruto and the 4th seems like an inevitability that we'll eventually find about his relation to naruto.
I would agree that the fourth and the akatsuki leader have to be S+. We've seen the fourth in action and he has some incredible jutsus, and the leader must be powerful to be allowed to command the other akatsuki members.
The ranking for akatsuki is off i think. All the akatsuki should be either S or A+. Sasori, Kakuzu, Hidan, Itachi, Kisame, and possibly Zetsu should all be S at least. I'm not sure about Zetsu since we haven't seen him in action, but he probably has some weird powers up his sleeve. Sasori was incredible, I think he's ranked one notch too low. But on that note, since Chiyo demonstrated some awesome techniques, her rank should also be A or A+ due to the 10-puppet summoning jutsu (which could take down a castle in the right hands). I also don't think Oro is as strong as the strongest akatsuki, so he should be down to A+. Since Oro was the first major villian to be introduced, he has somewhat of an inflated rep among fans since we've seen him fight the most of all the bad guys. I would have to group the three sanin at A+ since they all trained together. Tsunade hasn't shown her skills very much, so she might be a rank lower, but I'd give her the benefit of the doubt. The rest of the people in A+ I agree with.
The sound five should be in the B+ rank, except for kimimaro in A rank. Neiji, Rock Lee and Sai should all be in B just because they haven't really shown themselves as exceptional ninja yet. Gaara is either A or A+ depending on your opinion of his sand abilities. But just remember that other elements can be used against sand (fire to melt it, and water to harden it so it doesn't flow). I'd say all the rookie nine plus gai's team are either B or C rank. Kankuro and Temari are either B or B+ rank.
Wow, when I started ranking people I realized that it's really hard... after all, you have to consider many different scenarios of this character vs. that character, etc. and it becomes very difficult. No character can win in every scenario against everyone ranked below them. That's what I love about Naruto - characters actually use strategy in their fights and the outcomes aren't guaranteed beforehand.
Gai (Even though he has never shown us anything except Taijutsu, I think that Gai is capable of using ninjutsu;; only Lee is incapable. If Gai's student Lee was that exceptional in taijutsu, we can expect much more from Gai especially with his gates opened)
well according to wikipedia, he has a 3/5 rank in ninjitsu and genjitsu so one would assume he can use it.
Guy has never been shown using ninjutsu or genjutsu (even going so far as to use a regular disguise instead of using a transformation jutsu); however, unlike Lee, he is given a ninjutsu and genjutsu score of three out of five in the databooks, so one can assume that he simply doesn't like to use either. It is implied early on in the series that Guy summoned Ninkame on at least one occasion (offscreen), and he is capable of dispelling genjutsu (as seen during the Invasion of Konoha arc).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Might_Guy
I can't find shino in the list where would he be put?
Well, they did mention that with all the gates opened, a ninja would even surpass a hokage. If that ninja is guy, that would mean he would even be more powerful.
Peace.
I would rank him at C before the time jump, but he may be stronger now. It's hard to tell since we haven't seen him in action since then. He is chuunin I think, so he should be B rank at least.Originally Posted by rjkiller
I can't find shino in the list where would he be put?
The Sannin cannot be A+ while the akatsuki members are S. That would not make sense since Jiraiya would have been unable to protect Naruto against 2 ninjas a class above himself, as well as many other scenarios pointing out the Sannins power as compared to Akatsuki. Hell, even kakashi said he could defeat an Akatsuki member.
Peace.
Some of the akatsuki could be S while the sannin are A+, I don't see how this is contradictory. Sure, Jiraiya took on a weakened Itachi and Kisame, but he didn't defeat them. The very fact that they were able to escape a jutsu that no one had escaped before attests to their skill. Kakashi has defeated an Akatsuki member recently, but he was practically dead already. I stand by my rankings, I don't think Kakashi is as strong as the strongest akatsuki.
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