The Bitching Thread

[XanBcoo]

I think it depends on the laws in your country. Mass demonstrations here require prior approval, as does election campaigns and advertisements on television by parties who are trying to "slander" the other.

If those people are trying to use a loophole and use televised sporting events to demote certain political parties (if this is against the law), then I can't really blame your government for shutting the whole thing down in response.

You don't really mean this, do you?

[Xelbair]

It is legal to do so over here. you require permission only if your protest will block roads etc. and its more like setting up a time and route, it is not dependant on the topic of protest.
They are using pseudo-fans fights as a excuse for a reason.

[Buffalobiian]

You don't really mean this, do you?

It hinges on the bold part.

If those people are trying to use a loophole and use televised sporting events to demote certain political parties (if this is against the law), then I can't really blame your government for shutting the whole thing down in response.

[XanBcoo]

What I meant was, it should never be against the law. And if it is, the government should not get a pardon for exercising such strict control over the media.

[shinta|hikari]

I think he was speaking realistically of what is currently applicable in that situation, not what he thinks is ideal.

[Buffalobiian]

My mum recently learned of the term Densha Otoko and has been using it to categorise me. She acts like she knows what she's talking about, and uses the term as a convenient remark to comment about everything I do. She thinks being in front of a computer for extended periods of time decreases your ability to communicate with humans when it's her that I have issues talking with (and vice versa). She reckons I have communication problems when I'm really just pissed and annoyed. Of course, this is all because I'm a Densha Otoko.

She did this last time she learned of the "Your mind is like this cup that is filled to the brim and is unable to accept anything else" line too.

I'm pissed and annoyed.

[Animeniax]

My mum recently learned of the term Densha Otoko and has been using it to categorise me. She acts like she knows what she's talking about, and uses the term as a convenient remark to comment about everything I do. She thinks being in front of a computer for extended periods of time decreases your ability to communicate with humans when it's her that I have issues talking with (and vice versa). She reckons I have communication problems when I'm really just pissed and annoyed. Of course, this is all because I'm a Densha Otoko.

She did this last time she learned of the "Your mind is like this cup that is filled to the brim and is unable to accept anything else" line too.

I'm pissed and annoyed.

I think the proper term to describe your type is "hikikomori". Teach her that if you want her to be accurate.

[Kraco]

Simple solution, Bill, simple solution: Move out.

[Buffalobiian]

I think the proper term to describe your type is "hikikomori". Teach her that if you want her to be accurate.

I think Hikikomori is even less accurate. From Hikikomori wiki:

The Japanese Ministry of Health, Labour and Welfare defines hikikomori as people who refuse to leave their house, and isolate themselves from society in their homes for a period exceeding six months.[1]

While many people feel the pressures of the outside world, hikikomori react by complete social withdrawal. In some cases, they lock themselves in a room for prolonged periods, sometimes measured in years.

In general, the prevalence of hikikomori tendencies in Japan may be encouraged and facilitated by three primary factors:
1 - Middle class affluence in a post-industrial society such as Japan allows parents to support and feed an adult child in the home indefinitely. Lower-income families do not have hikikomori children because a socially withdrawing youth is forced to work outside the home.

Hikikomori tend to be financially supported by their parents, or by receiving social assistance. They seldom work since jobs usually require socialization.

I'm not withdrawing from any pressure imposed on me by society, I don't receive social security payments, I'm working and I'm paying for my share of food/board.

Densha Otoko was inaccurate in that she believed that computer use was the key to my "communication problem". Communication problems experienced by Densha Otoko are more like they're unable to express what they think or feel due to the inability to express oneself. That's not me. I'm perfectly able to express myself and my thoughts. In fact, in group meetings and assignments I'm often the one who has to both facilitate the meetings so we can keep talking (and not stare each other), keep talking in a direction that advances towards what we're trying to achieve in the project, and interpret(rephrase) what people are saying so other people can understand each other. (seriously, on this matter I don't know what's wrong with my groups. It's not a language barrier thing.. people just aren't listening.. and don't seem to pick up that others aren't understanding them.. but that's another matter).

If you had to describe the problem that exist between us, it would be personality clash. If you wanted to push it all on me, anger management issues would be the best (albeit still incorrect) way to describe it.

Hikikomori requires me to hide from something and to posses a fear of social interaction. None of that applies to me. What does apply to me is that when I'm using my free time, I like to do things and communicate with people who share the same interests as me. Not many of those two things can be done without a keyboard and monitor because they're simply not available otherwise.

@Kraco: I'm a fairly lazy person to be honest. Moving requires effort, searching, planning, effort, change of environments, packing, money to do the actual move... did I mention effort? The board I'm currently paying is likely to be more than what I'll need for rent/food after moving out (I'm paying this so I won't ever have the excuse of "You were better off here because you incurred less rent etc" bite me in later years) - but in exchange for that money I can stay in a place that I've familiarised myself with for the last 16 years of my life. For a person as resistant to unnecessary change as I am, moving's the final straw (at least until I'm further ahead in my career where my working hours would be such that I'd move just to cut down on transport time alone).

[Kraco]

The board I'm currently paying is likely to be more than what I'll need for rent/food after moving out (I'm paying this so I won't ever have the excuse of "You were better off here because you incurred less rent etc" bite me in later years) - but in exchange for that money I can stay in a place that I've familiarised myself with for the last 16 years of my life. For a person as resistant to unnecessary change as I am, moving's the final straw (at least until I'm further ahead in my career where my working hours would be such that I'd move just to cut down on transport time alone).

You are even paying rent for living in your parents' house? I'm understanding you less and less, because free living was the only thing I'd have somewhat understood. Or if it was some sort of family business related form of living you'd inherit, like a store with the living quarters upstairs and you were already working downstairs. Maybe what you perceive as a communication problem between you and your mom is actually your mom trying indirectly to tell you to find your own place...

[Animeniax]

I think Hikikomori is even less accurate.

Yeah I was just messing with you man. Sorry about that.

You are even paying rent for living in your parents' house? I'm understanding you less and less, because free living was the only thing I'd have somewhat understood. Or if it was some sort of family business related form of living you'd inherit, like a store with the living quarters upstairs and you were already working downstairs. Maybe what you perceive as a communication problem between you and your mom is actually your mom trying indirectly to tell you to find your own place...

Asians tend to live with their parents as long as possible, usually into their 20s. In China, they might stay until their 30s.

My bitch: websites that don't move the cursor to the search field or the most likely place you will go on their website. Amazon.com is guilty of this.

[dragonrage]

What seems to be getting under my skin lately is the fact there there are commercials everywhere. It seems that you can't view a video or a clipping of an article without being forced to sit and watch another commercial. Makes me loose the desire and interest I had in the first place.


Pretty soon you won't be able to sleep without some commercial invading your dreams, like it doesn't stick in you head anyways. Those bastards are after your subconscious impulses and it doesn't seem to be anyway to keep them out.

[Animeniax]

What seems to be getting under my skin lately is the fact there there are commercials everywhere. It seems that you can't view a video or a clipping of an article without being forced to sit and watch another commercial. Makes me loose the desire and interest I had in the first place.


Pretty soon you won't be able to sleep without some commercial invading your dreams, like it doesn't stick in you head anyways. Those bastards are after your subconscious impulses and it doesn't seem to be anyway to keep them out.

Our economy depends heavily on consumerism, which depends heavily on advertising to get you to spend your money on their products. It's all a part of the same vicious cycle.

[dragonrage]

Our economy depends heavily on consumerism, which depends heavily on advertising to get you to spend your money on their products. It's all a part of the same vicious cycle.

I know this very well, I am part of it. Just pisses me off sometimes, especially when it's a bad day.

[Edort4]

I got fired. Nothing new and I was totally expecting it after witnessing recent events but it still pisses me of how they do things and why. In the last few months I have seen some friends and co-wokers getting fired. The reasons where arbitrary and the way they did it was nasty. The modus operandi is as follows.

Two of the branch bosses go to your workplace without notice and give you the papers. Firing advise, indemnization and so. They tell you to sign it and to take all your things and leave at once. They make it clear that the company is willing to indemnizate you above what you deserve if you sign at the moment and that the reasons for the firing where that you where being lenient and that you had bad performance lately.

If you dont sign and leave at the moment they subtlely tell you that company will take it to the courts so you will get less money and much more later. Here this kind of procedures can take 6 months easily. You must understand that this bosses are co-wokers too and posibly you are "friends" with them so its kind of hard to go against them. They go in pairs so they can be witnesses if you dont want to sign and start making a ruckus, so they can protect any company property and sign the papers as witnesses (with the administrative that usually is with you) that you where fired.

Its true that since the crisis things got hard and we have had less work for too much people so its logic to get the branch reduced but what they have done for the last 2 years is fire the cheaper ones. The ones with lower salaries and that have been less time in the company. This is a good move from a boss perspective. They present costs reductions to their bosses and dont have to pay much in indemnizations cause all of them where newbies and had low salaries.

The thing is and I tried to explain it over and over to my boss is that if you fire people that represent the 2% of the brach cost but produce the 5% in the long term you are making a big loss. Here usually the people that have been long in the company (its quite new so the most veterans have been there for about 12 years) dont work at all, they know that they are expensive to kick out. They have the highest indemnizations for antiquity and their salary just kept going up year after year thus making them more expensive at the firing.

So for example after other firings I ended in a team of 4 people (2 vets and a protegee) doing around 60% of the work myself, when even when everyone gives 100% things go wrong. Also to sum to it this people had me in their sights from a previous project we where rulling in parallel in wich they ended expending more money and ended 4 months later than the team I was in, so they ended having some kind of rivalry. My team was almost made of youngsters and newbies in the company so they tried to bully us from the begining. This company is kind of a kindergarden.

So to conclude this rant I ended up getting fired cause project was taking ages and costs where sky high (you have to pay the obscene salaries those guys have for way more months than planned). The other 2 vets and the protegee stood there looking at me with a controlled smile. I ended up not signing the papers cause Im not going to give my consent to something that says that my work was defective, thus giving those guys an excuse to say that I was the reason that project was such a complete mess.

I talked to the boss telling him what happened and what I thought and all he said to me was: Yeah you may be right cause I noticed that every project those guys are in ends being a mess but... those guys aint a threat for the bosses cause they cant do the job... and you where cheaper.

So I end with a sense of freedom for not having to work for those guys again and gotten freed from my co-wokers( some days I felt like john malkovich in burn after reading). But on the oher hand Im angry cause I gave some of my best yeas to those incompetent leeches.

[Kraco]

Seems strange such a company would stay in business. Not much competition?

[Buffalobiian]

Are rival firms also in the same position, or are they ready to mop up all the talent that your company's been culling?

[Animeniax]

@Edort4: Was this a real job or working at a McDonald's? Living and working under the spectre of possibly layoffs or getting fired is no way to live and work. I think it's best that it happened so you can move on to better things, instead of spending each day wondering if or when it will happen. I've been through this, and it sucked. Hopefully you have some options and savings to keep you afloat until you find something new.

[Edort4]

Well the whole sector suffered heavily after the crash in middle 2008. Cause projects take time to be auctioned and durations are around 18 months the real problem started to show at middle 2010. All previous projects where ending and almost no new project was coming in, mine was one of the last. Experts said that around 70% of the sector had to dissapear because it was oversized.

So I heard the same thing happens in every other company. A friend of mine went to a rival and said that it was the same or even worse. Cause seeing how much people is available they have worsened the conditions, lower salaries, more working hours, less benefits and so.

It was a real job (are there unreal ones?) I didnt expect to sound as a part time worker or so. I dont find it being fired so bad, I mean its part of life. If they pay me what they owe me and treat me well. I have good savings and coverage problem is that actually unemployment rates are very high so geting another job will take time and the conditions will be much worse. Just have to decide if I stick with this kind of job or try something different. I dindt work on what I studied so maybe I should go back to that and recycle myself. Anyway bad moment to get out.

What I hated was how it happened and that maybe if my boss would have made a bet for his working people instead of "experienced" ones and protegees things could had been saved or at least well completed, wich never leaves a bad mouth taste.

[Animeniax]

What sector is this exactly? Sounds like an engineering job.