I was under the impression that the stabbed soldier was Saber's son/daughter/heir trying to forcefully take the throne.
I was under the impression that the stabbed soldier was Saber's son/daughter/heir trying to forcefully take the throne.
I was only reminded of Empire Strikes Back and Luke in the dark cave fighting against Vader who turned out to be Luke himself...
Well acording to how the legend goes, the two end up killing each other.Originally Posted by Augury
Pretty cool episode, Gilgamesh decided not to get pawned, and Shirou finally had all his tracing circuits light up like christmas......but then he gets owned by Lancer
R.I.P Captain America.
That would be Mordred.
By most accounts, Mordred is the son of Arthur and his half-sister, the sorceress Morgause (some retellings seem to merge Arthur's half-sisters into a single one, Morgan Le Fey), and was put on a ship and set adrift to die as an infant. Apparently he was rescued, grew up and became a knight on Arthur's court, and when Lancelot's affair destroyed Arthur and Guenevere's marriage, Arthur left Mordred in charge of the land while he made war on Lancelot.
When he got back, Mordred had apparently found out his identity as the rightful heir, and challenged Arthur for the throne. In the battle, Arthur killed Mordred, but was mortally wounded in the fray.
So yeah, illegitimate son of the divinely appointed king, with a slightly unhealthy dose of incest thrown in, who ended up in charge and rebelled against the king. Like many classic tales, the Arthurian legend is a classically formulated tragedy.
Yeah ... that was nifty, but ... shame that it takes him so long to get going. He doesn't seem to be able to do that stuff very effectively unless he's already basically mortally wounded.
The other magicians seem to be much better at cold-starting, where Shirou seems to need to warm up a bit first, which is a definite strategic disadvantage. Maybe he'll improve on that now that he's figured out about how to actually use his abilities, though.
Last edited by complich8; Mon, 05-29-2006 at 11:46 AM.
hey, thanks for the explanation complich8!
Now I wonder... according to Fate/Stay Night, if Saber was King Arthur (Arturia?)... was there a father/mother for Mordred? I mean... was Saber reborn as female... or what?
I mean... I never mentioned anything against the theory of a female Arthur... but with a son/daughter (looks like Saber so....) thrown into the dreams... it leaves you with an open question on the air.
I guess then it's a half-brother instead of a half-sister. I don't know. The whole thing is crazy with Type-Moon changing the legend to their liking.
--------------------------------"THE DROPOUT CREW"-------------------------------
___________________Captain Dropout For Life__________________
I actually like this version better... a female King, in a world prejuidicied (sp?) against women....
yeah me too, it's a very interesting concept. But think about it. Who was Lancerlot and guenevier (SP horribly). But nevertheless it is interesting to have King Arthur (Arthuria) be a woman. Interesting point of view.That is why i love anime, also nothing is out of bounds and can be turned into something awsome.
___---------------------------- "THE DROPOUT CREW"--------------------------------________Deblas, IfingHateTonTon, RyougaZell, dragonrage.________
________ we may fuck up alot but we always pull thru.
The second opening is out by Nipponsei, Now I just need the TOKKO opening.
http://tracker.minglong.org/torrents/...Tainaka Sachi.zip.torrent
Last edited by complich8; Fri, 06-02-2006 at 11:25 AM. Reason: unbreak page layout
Yes!!! Thank you so much for that link. I've been waiting weeks for the full version of the 2nd opening song.The second opening is out by Nipponsei, Now I just need the TOKKO opening.
http://tracker.minglong.org/torrents...ni%20%5BTainak a%20Sachi%5D.zip.torrent
watched episode 21 and even with the 'i should have bled to death long ago but now i'm stronger than ever' anime cliche it was the episode of F/SN I enjoyed the most, by a long shot.
I like how this series isn't afraid to kill off people. Archer and Caster bit it really suddenly, and I was always sort of thinking in the back of my head "Where is Lancer?", but I'd basically written him off as unimportant.
Saber's past, albeit confusing, is very interesting. I just wish they'd made it a little more clear. I had to rewatch to see who was saying what and got sort of confused there.
Who is in charge of this whole Holy Grail war and what kind of shitty screening do they do for candidates applying to be the 'mediator' or whatever Koinime is? I understand NOT having an arbitrator/mediator at all, but if you're going to have one it has to be an impartial third party. I mean, jesus christ guys at least check to make sure he can't summon a servant of his own first...
Then again, if Koinime (sp?) planned this on his own from the end of the last war, setting it up so that he'd appear to be the arbiter (in which case there wouldn't actually be an arbiter) then the guy is a friggin genius
Humans are different from animals. We must die for a reason. Now is the time for us to regulate ourselves and reclaim our dignity. The one who holds endless potential and displays his strength and kindness to the world. Only mankind has God, a power that allows us to go above and beyond what we are now, a God that we call "possibility".
From what i have seen the candidates are chosen by the holy grail itself. Usually a person who is a master or whose family are or were magicians.
Also yeah lancer's master is pretty slick, If all this was planned by him, which i suspect it was.
------------------------ Possible spoiler ( my theories)---------------------
I had always wonder why the mediator was in the first opening, explaining the holy war. I knew he had a great purpose. Why was it him instead a more proment character?
I think it was planned because in the last war, the holy grail was destroyed, by saber's master, shirou's father. He did not win the war but the grail appeared to him anyways. He had saber destroy it. I think that he feared gilgamesh getting his hands on it. This brings up another question, who was gilgamesh's master. Who took place in the last war and is in this one now, is there a connection? I believe so.
___---------------------------- "THE DROPOUT CREW"--------------------------------________Deblas, IfingHateTonTon, RyougaZell, dragonrage.________
________ we may fuck up alot but we always pull thru.
Yeah. This seems likely. It also seems likely to me, after the things Caster tried, with the existence of Gilgamesh, and lastly with Lancer's revealed master, that there really aren't any rules, asides from physical ones, to this game. If there appeared to be some rules, they were just imagination of the players, as if they had tried to make it more sensible for themselves.
It's not easy to be a master, nor a servant:
H264: Episode 22 mkv - Eclipse
xvid: Episode 22 avi - Eclipse
Nice episode. A lot of plot details were revealed and the happenings of 10 years ago are now just about crystal clear.
However, if the grail is only capable of destruction, that means Saber can't remain in this world at the end without consuming souls like Gilgamesh did?
An excellent episode. There were times I think the 24 episodes limit showed in this episode, but on the other hand when Saber confessed she had been lying to herself all the time, it kind of explained how she veered so relatively easily right from the beginning of this episode. It's not like her real opinions or aims really had to be changed, rather she just needed the push and reason to realise what she really wanted.
Also, to make the priesty fellow the ultimate villain of everything evil was kind of the old fairy tale style, but I can't say that unsurprising thing really would have worsened my opinion. It was, after all, just what was to be expected in the light of the recent events.
Since this is from the same source as Shingetsutan Tsukihime, it wouldn't really surprise me if Shirou needed to say bittterly sad goodbyes to Saber at the end of the last episode. I wouldn't really mind that if it was done as finely as in Shingetsutan Tsukihime.
Another interesting note about this ep: it cleared up the whole "alternating gender" idea...
From what Rin was saying, Lancer's original master was a woman (though the hand is sort of ambiguous), and Kotomine wasn't Gilgamesh's original master either, just made a pact with him at the end of the last war -- meaning Gilgamesh's original master could have been a woman as well.
Man ... Kotomine is one dirty bastard though... I never really liked that guy to begin with.
Since Kotomine was able to make pacts with 2 servants, does that imply there is no rule regarding that aspect of the war as well?
That could very well be the case... it doesn't seem impossible.
The trick to it is, most servants are very egotistical. I don't think most of them would be fine with the idea of working side-by-side with another servant, or with someone they don't consider to be their equal.
For example, Lancer pours out a lot of derision on his master for being a coward in the first two eps or so. Caster just outright killed her summoner out of spite. Stuff like that somewhat says that they're not terribly likely to play nicely with each other.
The big question on my mind is: is Ilya the next grail vessel? Knowing that Caster had that whole "use a magician as a vessel for the grail" idea, I would bet Kotomine knows about that too. Might be that Ilya, being a high-class magician, would be an ideal candidate to become the next grail... which would explain the mysterious fever she's got.
Thinking of other characters ... we know Sakura got blasted a bit, but is she ok? How about Taiga ... I know Rider's barrier-drain left the people at school in pretty bad shape, but they all pretty much survived ... so where's Taiga these days?
We're getting near the end of the series ... but there's some definite loose ends I wouldn't mind seeing wrapped up. Wonder if they'll have time...
How did Shirou's dad get the scabbard? It isn't anything material, unless someone traces it I guess. But it was mentioned as a Noble Phantasm, so humans could also have and project Noble Phantasms?
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