Check This! Sasuke is Owned!!!!

**poopdeville** · Sun, 09-25-2005, 07:33 PM

Quantify your claim that there are five cops who don't engage in racial profiling for each who does. Keep in mind that if 5/6ths of a police force are don't engage in racial profiling, then the remaining sixth is searching about fifty times more black people than the others, assuming the eight times figure from the study. This is totally implausible. The police systematically engage in racial profiling.

As you have said, statistics are not a religion. But when there is a large body of statistics indicating that racial profiling goes on (like this one), and that (depending on the community) black people are between 2 and 10 times more likely to be pulled over or searched, it is naive (indeed, stupid) to suppose that there are just a few bad apples doing the profiling. Indeed, even if black people were "only" five times more likely to be searched by a cop than a white person, your 1/6th of bad apples would be searching about 30 times as many black people as the rest. Totally implausible, unless 5/6th of the police force are just lazy bums.

And why on earth do you think I want the military to govern? (Hint: that's what martial law means)

***Terracosmo*** · Sun, 09-25-2005, 08:25 PM

What? You don't want the military either?

(hint: NO SHIT?)

You know what, I'm quite tired of you at this point, so let's go with your dream society then. No authority whatsoever! Let everybody run free and steal each others' food and stuff. It will be great, because you'll probably last about 5 minutes, and then the rest of us get to laugh at you for being so silly who wanted that to begin with [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

**poopdeville** · Sun, 09-25-2005, 08:47 PM

Blah blah blah. None of this is remotely relevant to the claim that cops are assholes. Being dismissive won't make my claim false. I've presented evidence, and you have not undermined it. You have not presented contradicting evidence. You've just offered red herring after red herring. So the evidence stands, and you look like someone who can't argue his way out of a paper bag. In the end, this is fine with me. Bye! :-D

**Zinobi** · Sun, 09-25-2005, 09:22 PM

poopdeville and terra shut the fuck up......

Originally posted by: drcitan
Hmmm he must've not been able to open his sharingan

LMAO!!!! i dunno why but tht was funny...........and anyway i think that guy didnt use but he is "Dipshit-no-jutsu"

**XanBcoo** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 12:58 AM

poopdeville, your problem is that you're just making a stupid generalization. For you to say you hate cops because they're all assholes is like me saying I hate black people for whatever reasons (I'm using this as an example, of course - this goes for any group and any race). You're just hating on a specific group of people based on a few select cases and experiences from "bad apples." But really, for every example you can give of cop "racism" or being an asshole, I can give you a case where an african american male has been genuinely guilty of a crime, or has been even more of an asshole. Does that justify me hating the whole race?? Go ahead and bitch about the police, sure, some of the ones you've encountered might have been jerks. Just don't accuse them of being racist, or targeting a specific group of people, because it makes you sound like a retarded hypocrite. Don't say all cops are assholes, because that is DEFINITELY not true. If you want to make any god arguement, don't stoop to generalizing.
I've also got to say: most of the black people (and white people, and whatever people) I know are NOT out there on a daily basis, either putting their own safety at risk, or trying to make the world a safer place. Police officers are.

Again, I'm not racist at all. Just using this as an example (seems to be a popular one).

In any case, it'd be funny if that kid was wearing sharingan contacts.

**poopdeville** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 03:50 AM

Originally posted by: XanBcoo
poopdeville, your problem is that you're just making a stupid generalization. For you to say you hate cops because they're all assholes is like me saying I hate black people for whatever reasons (I'm using this as an example, of course - this goes for any group and any race). You're just hating on a specific group of people based on a few select cases and experiences from "bad apples."

No, sorry. I'm hating on cops for systematic racial profiling. I've already presented a large study that shows that black people are eight times more likely to be searched than white people. The study was based on the police's own records. There is no mistake, and it's not a few isolated incidents. I won't say that any one particular cop is a racist (unless there's specific evidence to the fact), but the institution as a whole is racist.

But really, for every example you can give of cop "racism" or being an asshole, I can give you a case where an african american male has been genuinely guilty of a crime, or has been even more of an asshole. Does that justify me hating the whole race??

But you should note that black people are the second largest minority in the US. Last I heard they comprised 17% of the population. Sure, you can find a black person who is genuinely guilty of a crime for each cop that is an asshole. This isn't saying much considering the very large difference in the sizes of the populations.

Let me try to flesh my argument out more. Let's assume that the black population in the US is 17%, and that a study in a region shows that black people are five times more likely to be unfairly searched. Now, for ease in calculation, suppose that there were 100 "mistakes." -- 100 innocent people were unfairly searched. If things were fair, we would expect the probability of being unfairly searched p(B) = p(W), so that there would be 17 black people and 83 white people unfairly searched. This is an average -- small variations from this are insignificant. (So, for instance, if 15 black people and 85 white people were searched, we shouldn't be surprised.)

Good so far? We'll call the total US population "USP." Now, the probability p(B) of a black person being searched unfairly is 5 times greater p(W). So we have the equation: .17 * p(B) * USP + .83 * p(W) * USP = 100. Substituting, it becomes USP (.17 * 5 * p(W) + .83 * p(W)) = 100. We can solve this easily: p(W) = 100/(1.68 * USP). In the end, we would expect p(W) * USP white people to have been unfairly searched, so we end up concluding that about 49 white people were unfairly searched. This means that 51 (more than half) black people were unfairly searched, three times what you would expect. This shows tremendous institutional bias.

This doesn't mean that every cop unfairly searches black people maliciously. What it does mean is that police departments either allow some cops to do it on a massive scale, or more likely, that most cops do it fairly regularly. If you'd like, I can do an analysis to show that the first scenario is very implausible.

Go ahead and bitch about the police, sure, some of the ones you've encountered might have been jerks. Just don't accuse them of being racist, or targeting a specific group of people, because it makes you sound like a retarded hypocrite. Don't say all cops are assholes, because that is DEFINITELY not true. If you want to make any god arguement, don't stoop to generalizing.

I've already made it very clear that the police, as an institution is racist. I would not accuse a particular cop of racism without clear evidence, specifically because he may be one of the nice ones. But keep in mind that people choose to be cops, and they're aware of the enormous discrepancy I've outlined. And even the nice ones choose to look the other way. This isn't "active" racism, but in the end, they let the real racists off the hook.

I've also got to say: most of the black people (and white people, and whatever people) I know are NOT out there on a daily basis, either putting their own safety at risk, or trying to make the world a safer place. Police officers are.

This is true. The police perform a valuable service for their communities. But it's tarnished by the misery they pointlessly cause every day while abusing their priviledge and authority.

Again, I'm not racist at all. Just using this as an example (seems to be a popular one).

I certainly wouldn't accuse you of being racist. Nobody in this conversation has demonstrated anything of the sort.

In any case, it'd be funny if that kid was wearing sharingan contacts.

Yes it would! Or better yet, if he drew a cursed seal all over his face with a sharpie. :-)

**Jaredster** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 08:17 AM

i love how this thread is going.

***Terracosmo*** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 11:46 AM

Hint: The american police force isn't the only one. In Sweden, for example, there exists no such racial profiling within the force.
Then again I assume this doesn't matter because I don't have random statistics put together by even more random people to back my rational argument up.

Or perhaps you are talking about the US exclusively? In that case, yeah, I'm sure removing the american police force will do wonders for the already extremely low crime rate [img]i/expressions/rolleye.gif[/img]

***Assertn*** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 12:12 PM

terra, how can there be racial profiling in sweden when everyone is of the pasty white variety? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

poopdeville discovered the secret: People learn to make generalizations through stereotypes. Good work. If you're subconsciouly taught that blacks are more likely guilty of suspicious activity than whites, then you'll follow this assumption. If your people fly a plane into our buildings, then we'll be more wary of giving you a plane ticket. People judge all the time, its what they do. When you go for a job interview, when you meet some new friends, when you see a girl walk down the street. It's pretty much unavoidable based on the way society raises us.

If you want to blame someone for racial profiling, blame people like Dave Chappelle

**XanBcoo** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 01:31 PM

If we stop watching Dave Chappelle, the terrorists win [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

lol at the sharpie cursed seal.

***Terracosmo*** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 01:56 PM

I don't even know who Chappelle is. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

**KitKat** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 02:05 PM

Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
terra, how can there be racial profiling in sweden when everyone is of the pasty white variety? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]

I'm sure he was talking about the terrible racial profiling against transsexuals and guys who worship Yzak. Good work on eliminating this horrible travesty of injustice from your nation's police force, Terra.

On a more serious note though, the point that regional differences must be taken into account is a valid one. Often, statistics that take into account a large area such as a country are averaged over the different regions, so one state might have an extremely high rate, but in another it might be virtually nonexistent. The statistics don't usually tell you this.

***Terracosmo*** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 02:09 PM

Exactly. The goal that should be pursued on a greater scale is of course to make it so differences disappear altogether.
This, however, is not something that can be attained overnight. Or by removing the police force *cough cough* for that matter.

And yeah, it's tough being a Yzak loving transexual in Sweden these days. How I yearn for personal liberation! (or something)

**Jaredster** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 02:16 PM

Arn't Swedes just a race all by themselves [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]

**The Heretic Azazel** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 03:08 PM

Since we're not allowed to make generalizations, only 99% of US cops are sorry sacks of shit.

**a_odessey** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 03:28 PM

went from talking about a guy dressing up as sasuke getting arrested, to racial sterotypes by cops.

**dark maginn** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 03:29 PM

lol thats funny never seen that pic before

**Board of Command** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 03:47 PM

poopdeville is sounding like Y in the earlier days. Your study is based on very general statistics, ones that don't quite account for people's behavior. Yes, it is a fact that police are more likely to be searched than white people.

Why though? This should have been in your study as well. Why are they more likely to be searched? Let's look at demographs. I can tell you, without any generalization, that a majority of black people live in parts of the city where crime is highest. A lot of black people didn't quite have the greatest childhood. Look at The Bronx. Look at LA. Where is crime the highest? When those crime areas comprise of mostly black people, how likely is it that the shoplifter yesterday is the odd white guy standing on that street corner?

I'm not saying police are right for the things they do. When you work in a specilized field like law enforcement, generalizations begin to take place in your mind. I agree that cops are not the holy defenders of peace that everyone wants them to be, but they do their job whether we like it or not. Our society put the institution there and you're complaining about human nature getting in the way.

**PSJ** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 04:00 PM

That picture is priceless.

On the matter of cops, i agree with BoC. The world would probably be one hell of a bad place if there were no police force, personally i'm thankful that there are police officers that keeps a certain order. Then again i don't commit crime. Police officers harrasing people aren't a big problem where i live.

**heero** · Mon, 09-26-2005, 04:11 PM

Originally posted by: poopdeville

Originally posted by: Terracosmo

Originally posted by: poopdeville
I fucking hate cops.

Yeah

Let's get rid of cops and let anarchy loose, who needs order.

You've obviously never been hassled by a bored cop. Instead of doing their jobs, they hassle kids and illegally arrest homeless people for "camping." (http://www.outofthedoorways.org/articles/gallagher.html) They are generally racist: police are eight times more likely to search a black person than a white man (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2413979.stm). Here's a whole lot of evidence of racial profiling: http://www.racialprofilinganal....edu/library/index.php

Cops might be necessary (though I'm not committing myself to that), but I have plenty of reason to fucking hate them. The two aren't incompatible. In fact, I would hate them less if they just did their jobs instead of screwing people over. Your terse, superficial assessments might work to intimidate the immature, but it won't work on me.

you are criticizing every single police out there based 1 single case and a news article? No matter how u do ur math, ur opinions based on just those are gonna be biased. Look at the news article for example, "Black people are now eight times more likely to be stopped and searched by the police than white people, new Home Office figures show". Does that even give you enough information to actually look at the statistics and see if there's anything wrong with it? How did they find that number? what kind of questions did they ask? How big is the sample size? How did they interpret their findings? We have no knowledge about where the statistics came from. So how can you base ur reasoning on it? Would you think that news are gonna talk about how good a job police were doing each day? No because it would be pointless and boring! You see all those plane crashes on the news. Does that mean your chances of dying on a plane crash is very high? Hell no, you prabably more likely to die in a car accident. Why does the news talk about each and every plane crash but not every single car accident out there? Because people don't really care about the small things! You can do ur math all you want but as long as ur sources came from just the news and 1 single case, your generalization is going to be biased.

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