phase 43 discussion

[masamuneehs]

Meer > Lacus.

I can't stand how sugary sweet, super righteous and prim and proper Lacus always is. It is irritating to the point of horrendous torture. SHE'S A POP STAR! WHY DO PEOPLE LISTEN TO HER? Where did she get her serious political stance from, her makeup artist? A popstar celebrity singer girl developing into a genius, infinetley good-hearted do-gooder is sheerBULLSHIT. Fukuda never really explains WHY Lacus is the most perfect person in the world and believes all these things. She just is. An annoying hen.

Originally posted by: Digitalgirl
*watches ep. again* Milly's popular... [19:12]

Lol! I noticed that too! I can't remember his name, but the ArchAngel helmsman, the one with blue hair and very Asian features, certainly seemed irked by that other CIC guy sitting down at the table with him and Millie!

& I was glad that Kira noticed that Legend was a beautiful copy of Rey's daddy's MS. Fear Za Burrel!
Seriously, I enjoyed Rey's Palpatine-like ordering of Shinn in this episode.
& Shinn will never beat Kira. The Gods of Hokey Anime Cheesiness (current executive producer: Fukuda) have ordained Kira as the invincible hero, again. I love Shinn's moodiness and overwhelming emotion, its why I like him over Kira. But that kind of emotion in battle often makes people reckless, overly bullheaded, and thus, weaker.

[AtHRunOwNZaLL]

Originally posted by: SFreedomZGMFx20a

Originally posted by: Terracosmo
No, Meer IS hot!

Edit: Oh you meant Lacus? Nah, she better burn in hell and get raped nonstop by tentacles formed as tridents.

Mmmmm.... paaaaain ^_^

TAKE IT BACk.

i must admit, lacus is quite annoying, she always acts so godly, i think she is trying to be like kira and got her annoyingness from him too, o yea and f**k meer, i'd go for meyrin anytime

and athrun going seed was THE GREATEST!!!, but i'd say fukuda was about 15-20 episodes late on that

[KapsLocked]

Ok... Masamune - Lacus' father was a politician, close to Patrick Zala. I forgot his name. He was pretty important in SEED. Anyways, the Clyne faction is known for its stance on pacifism. At least Lacus isn't indecisive like a similar character in Gundam Wing! *coughrelenacough*

I just think it's funny that everyone makes out Kira and Lacus to be such bad people. I feel it's reading too much into the character to be like "OMG Lacus is teh sn0b" even though she was nice to mostly everyone throughout the entire series. This is all based on their characters, mind you, not what they do in the anime (IE, Kira's "godmode" XD).

[Marcis]

Originally posted by: SFreedomZGMFx20a
Destiny is mostly melee, once u cut its arms its almost useless, IJustice is Melee and i think it has integrated beams, like SFreedom (not so sure about that). Destinys possibilities to beat athrun were reduced to less than half of what they were at the beginning. I think we can safely bet Shinn would have lost given the time to continue the battle, Athrun probably lost conciousness because he relaxed otherwise he could go on a little while more (in which time Shinn would be defeated) plus remember SFreedom is going against Legend, most likely Legend would have lost (u see how Rey shoots everywhere?) and Athrun would have SF backing him in case he couldnt go on.

EDIT: BTW @deblas, Shinn did have the advantage taking into consideration Athruns shape. And Shinn was "FOCUSED", he went SEED (with a lot of anger, like always).

Both Kira and Athrun have shown that they can go SEED on will, switching "on" SEED mode when they please.
On the other hand Shinn has gone SEED only when he is in rage. Not the best condition to win.
Ahtrun's abilities were a bit down since he isn't fully recovered from injuries.
As for Infinite Justice's armaments - you are right, it has beam cannons in it's backpack/sublight lifter:

backpack/subflight lifter: MA-6J "Hyper Fortis" beam cannon x 2, MA-M02S "Plephis Lacerta" retracted beam cannon-mounted short beam saber x 2, MR-Q17X "Griffon 2" wing-mounted beam blade x 2, MA-M02G "Super Lacerta" lifter tip beam saber x 1

you can read more about IJs specs here:
http://www.mahq.net/mecha/gund...-destiny/zgmf-x19a.htm
or here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z...nfinite_Justice_Gundam

still... i would love to kill that idiot who added word "Infinite" to Justice's name.
Infinite Justice sounds very cheesy, although Japanese teenagers might dig it. Probably result of some online poll "How we will call Athrun's new Gundam?" [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/img]

[Kovash]

Originally posted by: masamuneehs
Meer > Lacus.

I can't stand how sugary sweet, super righteous and prim and proper Lacus always is. It is irritating to the point of horrendous torture. SHE'S A POP STAR! WHY DO PEOPLE LISTEN TO HER? Where did she get her serious political stance from, her makeup artist? A popstar celebrity singer girl developing into a genius, infinetley good-hearted do-gooder is sheerBULLSHIT. Fukuda never really explains WHY Lacus is the most perfect person in the world and believes all these things. She just is. An annoying hen.

Lacus' pop-stardom was a political move concocted by her and her father, Lacus can (and does) sing to get her politcal message across. This is why Meer could replace her so easily, since people were used to Lacus' political statements.

Lacus is not at all the weak 'sugery' character people make her out to be, she's a political genius who stands for what she believes, and has thus far converted a whole section of ZAFT and the invincible Kira himself to her philosophy. This meek demeanor is just a facade she puts up to seem innocent.

The prime example of this is the very first time we see it crack, when she had just been handed back to ZAFT by Kira and Rau tries to attck the Archangel, she instantly switches off her meekness and order's Rau down. You can hear it in her voice and see it on her face. Hell, she even does the same to Athrun when he confronts her on PLANT, she's in NO way nieve or sweet, but a cool-headed 'warrior princess' that knows exactly what she's about.

[Gangrel]

I would love to see a plot where Lacus is the evil pink bitch who tries to take everything to her side (take over earth and PLANT) and Dullindal isn't a bad guy after all, its just the good guys (aka Kira, Athrun and others) were twisted by her speech and in the end they realize they got fuckd. Of course that I don't believe they would actually make such a thing, but that's too bad, at least that way I wouldn't hate her so much cause of her dumb face.

Note: On this plot she actually hired those coordinators to kill her so she could twist the reality about the other Lacus and Dulindal, and force Kira to become a warrior that answer all her orders.

[Fading_eternity]

Just my opinion. I think everyone, or most of you are missing the point to Gundam Seed and Gundam Seed Destiny. Sure there are many plot device characters. Sure there are many things that are hard to believe and many things that are disappointing and rewarding. But the bottom line is that Fukada is creating a story about the tragedy of war. Everyone who hates or loves Shinn, Lacus, Kira, etc. should recognize what each character stands for. Not only in the series but also in a more tangible way. What message is Fukada trying to project with such archetypal characters?

Many people (including myself at one point, Ill admit) hate Shinn because well for one, hes suddenly on par with these legendary pilots who have way more experience than him. Other reasons being, he whines, cries, has tantrums, etc. I think the more important analysis of his character however is that Shinn is the epitome of innocence lost in war. For ever young man or woman whose thrown in a battlefield with original intent to protect; when a loved one or someone important to them dies, they become a monster or in some way shape or form they do things that greatly deviate from what their original goals may have been. Its the same for Asuran as well and even Kira.

Cagilis father was right when he said violence only breeds more violence. Shinn is trapped in a nest of confusion and anger, which is quite realistic in my opinion. Even though, in entertainment land, wed like to see a different shade of a main character, I think Fukada does an excellent job in portraying a character who embodies the true horror and regret of war in a very personal way, i.e. the very heart of a human being whose desire for peace is derailed and mutated by both internal forces of grief and loss and external forces of political machines and agenda pushers.

I could go on with other character but I get the feeling you all understand my point. As far as Gill is concerned, I think his agenda is quite direct and not altogether evil. Think about it. Hes trying to create a world where one mans desire does not exceed the next. Where man cannot destroy man because of the value of his abilities. Instead of striving to outdo each other, instead everyone applies themselves to the roles they are best suited, (i.e. Asuran and Shinn, as warriors, Lacus as a political symbol, etc.) Also the world united in a cause to destroy those who oppose the new world order of peace. Maybe Im wrong but this all sounds a heck of a lot like communism to me.

Sure not everyone agrees with it, and denying people the FREEDOM and JUSTICE of managing their own lives in favor of falling in line with a given DESTINY may seem unfavorable when you think about it. After all, we all want liberty and freedom with the justice that regulates it. But at the same time, some people call for more preset rules for every individual. For some people who are not fully sure of what path to take on their own, following the path laid out by others is always more preferable I think.

Anyway, I think Gill is trying in his own way to nurture a suffering world that cannot support itself through the natural freedom it is given. Kleuze pretty much laid it out for him when they had the flashback of their conversation.

Im digressing. But my main point is, its fun to have discussions about whats cool and whats not and all that. But I dont think its fair to say Fukada is a horrible writer when all youre focusing on is surface polish and eye candy. Look deeper into the message hes projecting and just maybe& youll find that this Destiny arc may even be a tad bit better than the Seed arc& I think so, anyway.

Again, this is all my opinion and though I normally dont comment in message boards anymore, I just wanted to put that out in the open. Thanks for listening. J

[Aramis]

Shinn was pretty freaked out in this episode. In addition to Freedom, Athrun also comes...he must be like "OMFG! Why does everyone I kill come back to life! DO I really suck that bad? Does this mean Meyrin is alive too?" In his viewpoint things are totally crazy right now.
And LOL@Cagalli's announcement. Meer magically takes over. Then Lacus teleports behind Cagalli from the AA and restores the channel at the same time. BIG WTF.

[shurik]

What's the name of the music played during fight Kira vs Shinn & Rey?

[john_doe_107]

the 4th op is starting to grow one me..
what about you guys?

[Terracosmo]

Gets worse with every listen.

[MeroTZ]

Originally posted by: Kovash

Originally posted by: masamuneehs
Meer > Lacus.

I can't stand how sugary sweet, super righteous and prim and proper Lacus always is. It is irritating to the point of horrendous torture. SHE'S A POP STAR! WHY DO PEOPLE LISTEN TO HER? Where did she get her serious political stance from, her makeup artist? A popstar celebrity singer girl developing into a genius, infinetley good-hearted do-gooder is sheerBULLSHIT. Fukuda never really explains WHY Lacus is the most perfect person in the world and believes all these things. She just is. An annoying hen.

Lacus' pop-stardom was a political move concocted by her and her father, Lacus can (and does) sing to get her politcal message across. This is why Meer could replace her so easily, since people were used to Lacus' political statements.

Lacus is not at all the weak 'sugery' character people make her out to be, she's a political genius who stands for what she believes, and has thus far converted a whole section of ZAFT and the invincible Kira himself to her philosophy. This meek demeanor is just a facade she puts up to seem innocent.

The prime example of this is the very first time we see it crack, when she had just been handed back to ZAFT by Kira and Rau tries to attck the Archangel, she instantly switches off her meekness and order's Rau down. You can hear it in her voice and see it on her face. Hell, she even does the same to Athrun when he confronts her on PLANT, she's in NO way nieve or sweet, but a cool-headed 'warrior princess' that knows exactly what she's about.

Thank god there are other people out there who understand about Lacus. I hate it when people say things about her being a pop star, or weak, or naive.

In 36 of SEED, she watches her personal guard execute about a dozen people. Heads are being popped mere feet away from her and she doesn't bat an eyelash. She practically steps over their corpses on her way out, and never once acts even a little girlish or squeemish.

She's not the type of be scared of a spider. She's hardcore, and knows what its going to take to get things done, and she knows how to do them.

Note how she chose now to reappear... she knows this move is going to have repurcussions. The whole world is going to be in a confused uproar, which is why I believe she has stood aside until now. However, its obvious that if she had done nothing the damage would have been far more permanent.

[Marcis]

Originally posted by: john_doe_107
the 4th op is starting to grow one me..
what about you guys?

I just rewind past it as fast as possible.

[Jurojin]

Originally posted by: Marcis

Originally posted by: john_doe_107
the 4th op is starting to grow one me..
what about you guys?

I just rewind past it as fast as possible.

Rewind.... past...[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-shocked.gif[/img]


Huh!?!?[img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif[/img]

[PSJ]

Fast forward is probably what he meant. I do the same that song sucks.

[SFreedomZGMFx20a]

Originally posted by: KapsLocked
Ok... Masamune - Lacus' father was a politician, close to Patrick Zala. I forgot his name. He was pretty important in SEED. Anyways, the Clyne faction is known for its stance on pacifism. At least Lacus isn't indecisive like a similar character in Gundam Wing! *coughrelenacough*

I just think it's funny that everyone makes out Kira and Lacus to be such bad people. I feel it's reading too much into the character to be like "OMG Lacus is teh sn0b" even though she was nice to mostly everyone throughout the entire series. This is all based on their characters, mind you, not what they do in the anime (IE, Kira's "godmode" XD).

I believe Lacus' father was once the Chairman right before Patrick Zala, so its obvious Lacus was raised to be the daughter of a politician, she was like that from the start. She wasnt a pop Singer and suddenly turned into the LAcus we now, she alwasy was like that, otherwise do u think Reverend Marki would call her Lacus-sama?, she being a Pop Singer?.

[SFreedomZGMFx20a]

Originally posted by: SFreedomZGMFx20a

Originally posted by: KapsLocked
Ok... Masamune - Lacus' father was a politician, close to Patrick Zala. I forgot his name. He was pretty important in SEED. Anyways, the Clyne faction is known for its stance on pacifism. At least Lacus isn't indecisive like a similar character in Gundam Wing! *coughrelenacough*

I just think it's funny that everyone makes out Kira and Lacus to be such bad people. I feel it's reading too much into the character to be like "OMG Lacus is teh sn0b" even though she was nice to mostly everyone throughout the entire series. This is all based on their characters, mind you, not what they do in the anime (IE, Kira's "godmode" XD).

I believe Lacus' father was once the Chairman right before Patrick Zala, so its obvious Lacus was raised to be the daughter of a politician, she was like that from the start. She wasnt a pop Singer and suddenly turned into the LAcus we now, she alwasy was like that, otherwise do u think Reverend Marki would call her Lacus-sama?, she being a Pop Singer?.

Originally posted by: Aramis
Shinn was pretty freaked out in this episode. In addition to Freedom, Athrun also comes...he must be like "OMFG! Why does everyone I kill come back to life! DO I really suck that bad? Does this mean Meyrin is alive too?" In his viewpoint things are totally crazy right now.
And LOL@Cagalli's announcement. Meer magically takes over. Then Lacus teleports behind Cagalli from the AA and restores the channel at the same time. BIG WTF.

TELEPORTS? WTF are u talking about, Kira took her there with Strike Freedom.

[SFreedomZGMFx20a]

Originally posted by: SFreedomZGMFx20a

Originally posted by: SFreedomZGMFx20a

Originally posted by: KapsLocked
Ok... Masamune - Lacus' father was a politician, close to Patrick Zala. I forgot his name. He was pretty important in SEED. Anyways, the Clyne faction is known for its stance on pacifism. At least Lacus isn't indecisive like a similar character in Gundam Wing! *coughrelenacough*

I just think it's funny that everyone makes out Kira and Lacus to be such bad people. I feel it's reading too much into the character to be like "OMG Lacus is teh sn0b" even though she was nice to mostly everyone throughout the entire series. This is all based on their characters, mind you, not what they do in the anime (IE, Kira's "godmode" XD).

I believe Lacus' father was once the Chairman right before Patrick Zala, so its obvious Lacus was raised to be the daughter of a politician, she was like that from the start. She wasnt a pop Singer and suddenly turned into the LAcus we now, she alwasy was like that, otherwise do u think Reverend Marki would call her Lacus-sama?, she being a Pop Singer?.

Originally posted by: Aramis
Shinn was pretty freaked out in this episode. In addition to Freedom, Athrun also comes...he must be like "OMFG! Why does everyone I kill come back to life! DO I really suck that bad? Does this mean Meyrin is alive too?" In his viewpoint things are totally crazy right now.
And LOL@Cagalli's announcement. Meer magically takes over. Then Lacus teleports behind Cagalli from the AA and restores the channel at the same time. BIG WTF.

TELEPORTS? WTF are u talking about, Kira took her there with Strike Freedom.

Originally posted by: MeroTZ

Originally posted by: Kovash

Originally posted by: masamuneehs
Meer > Lacus.

I can't stand how sugary sweet, super righteous and prim and proper Lacus always is. It is irritating to the point of horrendous torture. SHE'S A POP STAR! WHY DO PEOPLE LISTEN TO HER? Where did she get her serious political stance from, her makeup artist? A popstar celebrity singer girl developing into a genius, infinetley good-hearted do-gooder is sheerBULLSHIT. Fukuda never really explains WHY Lacus is the most perfect person in the world and believes all these things. She just is. An annoying hen.

Lacus' pop-stardom was a political move concocted by her and her father, Lacus can (and does) sing to get her politcal message across. This is why Meer could replace her so easily, since people were used to Lacus' political statements.

Lacus is not at all the weak 'sugery' character people make her out to be, she's a political genius who stands for what she believes, and has thus far converted a whole section of ZAFT and the invincible Kira himself to her philosophy. This meek demeanor is just a facade she puts up to seem innocent.

The prime example of this is the very first time we see it crack, when she had just been handed back to ZAFT by Kira and Rau tries to attck the Archangel, she instantly switches off her meekness and order's Rau down. You can hear it in her voice and see it on her face. Hell, she even does the same to Athrun when he confronts her on PLANT, she's in NO way nieve or sweet, but a cool-headed 'warrior princess' that knows exactly what she's about.

Thank god there are other people out there who understand about Lacus. I hate it when people say things about her being a pop star, or weak, or naive.

In 36 of SEED, she watches her personal guard execute about a dozen people. Heads are being popped mere feet away from her and she doesn't bat an eyelash. She practically steps over their corpses on her way out, and never once acts even a little girlish or squeemish.

She's not the type of be scared of a spider. She's hardcore, and knows what its going to take to get things done, and she knows how to do them.

Note how she chose now to reappear... she knows this move is going to have repurcussions. The whole world is going to be in a confused uproar, which is why I believe she has stood aside until now. However, its obvious that if she had done nothing the damage would have been far more permanent.

I remember someone posting that she would cry or something like that when in battle. That person didnt watch that Phase in GS. Ill be looking for that post, maybe i can find it.


EDIT: OOPS, i think i pressed QUOTE instead of EDIT.

EDIT2: Wait a minute, why there are 3 posts mine? Im pretty sure i pressed edit in past occasions, im doubtful in the last but im pretty sure i pressed EDIT b4.

Double-posts are bad, but triple-posts are absolutely ridiculous. If this keeps up you'll be warned.

GotWoot Moderator

[masamuneehs]

All I can say about Lacus is that I find her annoying and am getting sick of seeing her ideals being spouted and carried on about so much. Her political view is presented as if its were the only right way to think and act in regards to war, and its backed up by being lapped up by Kira, Athrun, and the ArchAngel crew, nearly everyone from the first series, who are in turn fortified with unexplained military hardware. The biggest problem for me is that Destiny seems to be showing us that anyone fighting under Lacus' ideals is a hero, moreso than any enemy they face, and that they (Lacus' side) will always win, always rape a bunch of faceless, unknown grunts and even the new, and powerful, Minerva characters who "haven't seen the light". The fact that Kira and Athrun and even Mwu La Flaga have 'died' only to come back as strong as ever (Waldfeld too, but not as powerful in his return) AND soon throw down on Lacus' side is the exact glorification of gallant warriors that perpetuates and breeds wars by giving hope that "by fighting for the right cause" they too will be glorified.

There is no "right cause". (granted, there may be atrocious crimes against humanity and massacres, which are certainly 'wicked', but simply abstaining from such wicked acts doesn't make the cause righteous)

Everyone thinks they're right. Everyone thinks what they're fighting for is right, even if they have some doubts or don't know the whole picture, they have something to fight for, and that justifies their actions, at least in their own minds. Nobody thinks their cause is wrong. Seed, and also Destiny, (and this is seen in GW Endless Waltz as well) focus greatly on HOW the battles are fought. Things that are presented to the viewer as "the right thing to do" are not trying to kill the enemy and opposing the side that will kill the largest number. The people that do it are invincible flyboys like Heero Yuy, Kira Yamato, who have unshakable faith in their causes (along with the most powerful MS of their time, and superior piloting skills)

Gundam is about war. The two Seed series have expanded on MS abilities, the psychology that a newcomer expiriences, scientific morality, and extremist factions. But it has lost the ability to present opposing sides without bias. EAF is evil, Blue Cosmos & Logos are very evil. ZAFT seems nice, but Dullindal is undoubtedly evil and underhanded. Lacus faction? Where are their flaws? What have their mistakes been, and have they recognized their mistakes? When was the last time they lost? (don't count the battle in Scandinavia, because though Freedom was lost, Kira survived and they accomplished their goal, getting Cagalli back to ORB)

Oh, and since many people are stepping up and saying "Lacus is a master politician" then why did she retire to some obscure orphanage on ORB? Why wasn't her side represented in the peace accord or in the world balance of power after Jakin? Only an irresponsible fool saves the world, then throws it to the wolves and hides away to live a private life.

[Splash!]

maybe its just me but I definitely saw FEAR in Kira's eyes when he was fighting Rey who seemed to be more of a nuisance to Kira than Shinn. This is the first in a very long time that i have seen kira scared and it is a very refreshing change. It is making me feel that despite Fukuda's obsession with Kira, it might actually be quite possible for him to let go and kill him off in the series. That would really make for something in my opinion. Rey and Kira going down fighting. After all, my belief is that if this is indeed going to be the end of the SEED universe, might as well kill of the ultimate coordinator