Why do i seem to hate the Minerva Team and Zaft so much ?

It seems a have a great dislike for the Minerva Team and Zaft. I hate seeing those once great deathbringers Destroys, Zamza-Zah, and Gells-Ghe getting squashed by Destiny and Legend easily without any real fight of any sort. Also what's the deal with Yzak with his Gouf Ignited taking down a Drake class battleship with his puny barrel beam gun.Why doesn't the Impluse just launch in mobile suit form from the start ? Why didn't Lunamaria lauch in the Core Splender when she could have actually used it for once when she was chasing Djibril in a shuttle. Does the EAF not know how to use shields. I mean come on, I always see Daggers/Windam fall in one shot everytime.Argh, Luna plus Shinn to me equals nasty. Why does Luna try to go off to bomb the base secretly and then needs Shinn to come save her. Jeez, she should just have fought with them, then after the numbers died down, she could have gone off. ( Yeah i know, It was because of time issues.) Why are there so few ships with the firepower of the Minerva or Archangel.Is there no competition? Who in the heck gets killed by a boomerang plus his partner as well. Why does Stupid Shinn ask dumb questions such as "These guys are still..." or "Cut it out already". Yes, i bet someone really would stop and allow himself to get killed. Well that's some of my problems with GSD. Good thing the Awesome and Amazing Archangel gang is back.

I got tired of reading your post about half way through so I don't know everything you said, I just agree about Destroy's going down too easy.

Oh, and prepared to be flamed. There are a lot of people here that like Shinn and absolutely want to kill anyone affiliated with the Archangel.

The short answer is: because you suck and have really bad taste.

The long(er) answer is: everybody has different tastes, yours just happen to be very bad.

Well my point is that i don't ever see a real fight unless it's between 2 gundams.

I agree with that...

...but wasn't your point that you hate the Minerva team and ZAFT?

I have to disagree with Terra saying u suck. I actually agree with you. I hate the Minerva more than the Archangel. Actually I like the Archangel, SF, IJ, and all that good stuff. Kira is the pimp, Lacus is the top hoe! But i won't turn this into a which is better thread. But i hate the Minerva now, I hope they all die in the end, even the insects or animals that might be on there!

what do you mean you hate the minerva team???????????????????????????????????????????
The AA team sucks. The only reason they are so high and mighty is because they got fukuda on their side. I didnt mind them at first but now i detest them. Minerva characters are more down to earth and real. AA characters are all full of themselves and think every decision they make is the right one. Rey, i didnt like all that much initially, but seeing him using DRAGOON made me remember Rau, whom i thought was cool. So im going to back Rey up now. I hope he takes a good chunk of the AA team and the clyne faction with him before he dies. In fact here is a list of who i would like to see Rey kill:

1. Lacus (First and foremost, cause she makes no sense and i hate people like that)
2. Cagalli (Cause she is useless)
3. Kira (Because the world doesn't need an ultimate coordinator)

Athrun can die trying to protect Lunamaria, which would make Shinn realise the TRUTH (whatever!). Then Shinn can take on Rey in a crazy battle. Meanwhile, Yzak and Dearka, being on ZAFT, are in a good position to assassinate Dullindaal. Mwu can become the new leader of the Earth Alliance and Lacus can be the new PLANT chairman. Whoops! Lacus is dead so i guess Meer will have to do , provided she makes it to the end, which is not likely

lolz

Hmm...But Rey's another physcho and probably a puppet of that Dirty Dullindal. He even acted pretty badly towards Lunamaria before going out, and they're on the same team. Anyways, can the Minerva submerge underwater ? Nope, but the Archangel sure can and it's 2 years older.

well its not an argument of which is a better ship. You were talking about the teams. And besides when Rey said that, i was pleased. She got what she deserved. As many have already stated her aim sucks. If she was able to get shots close enough to just skim the wings of the shuttle, then she was certainly capable of shooting it down.

Alright then, The AA gang's better IMO than the Minerva team. Who was it that had to bail out of battle when their odds became unfavorable ? Who got his hand chopped off even in his SEED mode with his insanely fast Gundam. The AA team rocks. Man, how come the Babi is the only suit that has a shotgun ?

Don't take any of my above comments as anything bad. Just my opinions since the AA gang tries to do what's best, not just do what they're told like the Minerva's.

Sooo. You all who say that you hate AA really like Arthur? Oh my.

AA is much better ship than Minerva (they totally OWNED zaft in 44) and Maryu is much better captain than Talia and that XO is much better than Arthur ... but on the other hand, Kira suck. Athrun is da man! And Rey is definitively the evilest guy in GSD [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]

so it's fifty fifty.

You hate the Minerva Crew and ZAFT because they stopped Reqiuem from fireing a second shot and they killed Djibril, damn that Rey.

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Originally posted by: CrazyChurros
Alright then, The AA gang's better IMO than the Minerva team. Who was it that had to bail out of battle when their odds became unfavorable ? Who got his hand chopped off even in his SEED mode with his insanely fast Gundam. The AA team rocks. Man, how come the Babi is the only suit that has a shotgun ?

Don't take any of my above comments as anything bad. Just my opinions since the AA gang tries to do what's best, not just do what they're told like the Minerva's.

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OMG Shinn lost his hand and that makes whole AA team better!!! What about the time when Kira totally lost to Shinn and the great mighty Freedom was a total lost? And the time Kira was about to lose AGAIN on his SF if Athrun didnt sneak up on Shinn from behind? Also, would u think that they would make IJ lose instead of Destiny the minute IJ is launched? What do u think ur responses gonna be if tat happened? "DUDE IJ SUX" I mean come on the story turned out like tat because IJ was brand new out of the box. They didnt even show how Athrun got his arm off clearly. He just flew pass him and bam his arm is off? wtf lol If that's the case Kira could have ezly done that long ago and Kira is much better doing that "fly by and chop off thing" anyway.

Alright they dont do what they are told but the way they think everything they do is the right thing makes it annoying. EVERYONE in the story thinks they are doing the right thing so what makes them any better than others. Lacus keeps saying "war is bad, fighting is bad BUT we must fight". WTF is tat lol?

I just dont like AA in this story...it was way better in the original seed. And they way they make Minerva look like the bad guys..arg.. I personaly really like Archangel and Freedom its just the story that I dont like.

This is an age old debate over whether or not you like Shinn or Kira. People who like Kira tend to root for Lacus' Faction and the ArchAngel. Shinn fans root for ZAFT and the Minerva.

There are lots of stupid things in Destiny that have no reasonable explanation. Impulse does come together in mid-air, making it an easy target until its assembled (though no enemy has ever capitalized on this weakness. I mean seriously, you can see its path by the alignment of the three parts!) You know why this is done? For the same reason that every time a pilot launches they state their name, their unit and you see the catapult countdown and the MS deployment. The reason is: RECYCLED CLIPS ARE CHEAPER THAN ANIMATING NEW STUFF! And it wastes time every single episode so they can drag out petty events and battles.

OH, and can someone tell me what the hell Lacus' Faction intends to do? Ok, go beat Dullindal, he's evil, I understand that. But then these Lacus people who are always complaining about how people fight wars and kill each other will be back to square one, a disjointed world where every nation and company seeks their own goals, at the cost of others' lives and prosperity.

Has Lacus, Kira or ANYONE on the AA side mentioned how the world should be run AFTER the war against Dullindal is over?

I hate the AA and love the minerva,... i agree with Splash about the minerva crew being more down to earth and real... Yhere can't be people so blue eyed as Lacus and Kira..

Fukuda sucks.. Thats why the AA aint gone..

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Originally posted by: masamuneehs
This is an age old debate over whether or not you like Shinn or Kira. People who like Kira tend to root for Lacus' Faction and the ArchAngel. Shinn fans root for ZAFT and the Minerva.

There are lots of stupid things in Destiny that have no reasonable explanation. Impulse does come together in mid-air, making it an easy target until its assembled (though no enemy has ever capitalized on this weakness. I mean seriously, you can see its path by the alignment of the three parts!) You know why this is done? For the same reason that every time a pilot launches they state their name, their unit and you see the catapult countdown and the MS deployment. The reason is: RECYCLED CLIPS ARE CHEAPER THAN ANIMATING NEW STUFF! And it wastes time every single episode so they can drag out petty events and battles.

OH, and can someone tell me what the hell Lacus' Faction intends to do? Ok, go beat Dullindal, he's evil, I understand that. But then these Lacus people who are always complaining about how people fight wars and kill each other will be back to square one, a disjointed world where every nation and company seeks their own goals, at the cost of others' lives and prosperity.

Has Lacus, Kira or ANYONE on the AA side mentioned how the world should be run AFTER the war against Dullindal is over?

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the part about Kira fans going for AA and Shinn fans going for ZAFT ain't necessarily true.
I ain't a Shinn fan, in fact i find his constant crying over Stellar and his sister quite annoying. THere are quite a few other reasons to why i would prefer ZAFT over AA. First of all, they are more realistic, as i said before because they are bound by limitations, despite their desires, cannot do what they always do what they want and they have to follow orders. Since when does AA team have anyone to answer to?They just go around gallivanting doing whatever they want to. And they usually end up appearing to be more noble and brave for no reason. In reality , no one ship can go around destroying entire armadas and betting the pulp out of such a vast alliance like ZAFT. IF it weren't for those convenient plot devices put in by Fukuda, dammit, they should have all been DEAD. He's making a mockery out of it. I don't care if Kira is the ultimate coordinator, he should have been dirt and bones be now.

About Lacus and the end of war, as i said earlier she goes on and on about the war but she has no clue how to end it. Actually the only people in the show who really brought anything to the table on how to end the war were Rau and Dullindaal. I don't know why Lacus is the leader of the faction anyway, everyone can complain about how a war isnt good but few can actually think of ways to bring an end to it

If Lacus doesn't have an answer to the end of the war, I blame Fukuda on not having an answer himself. that's why he just stuffs the dialogue of the AA crew with mumbo jumbo. And Lacus at least, didn't try to assassinate anyone. All she was doing was living in an orphanage before a bunch of idiots came out of the water, tried to kill her and got blasted by Freedom.

As idealistic as the Destiny plan is in bringing about a utopian era, well, for once I'm goint to side with democracy and freedom for all. All empires with Autocratic figures eventually fall. In the long history of China, it has always been like that. Emperors come, bring up the country into prosperity through control and power and then it comes crashing on their heads. First Emperor Shi Huangdi is example of this. He was considered the most brutal but the most efficient of China's Emperors, uniting the country with a standard language, writing, weights and road systems that linked what was once fragmented states of China. And the Empire lasted only 10 years after his death. Because he failed to relinquish his power at the end of his reign and his son was useless.

Dullindal is human too. (Yes, I consider Coordinators humans) Sooner or later, power will get to his head, and even if it doesn't, it'll get into his heirs who will want power for personal pleasure, not the idealistic future that Dullindal may want with good intentions.

The Archangel Crew, well, truth is I still have faith in them. We have to. ORB's goal in Gundam Seed was to be the sole voice of reason between the two mad superpowers that was ZAFT and EA. In Gundam Seed, they more or less succeeded in ending the war. But in Gundam Seed Destiny, the Seiran family has seriously screwed ORB up politically and militarily. Politically, they're now vilified by most of the world for siding with the EA. Cagalli is going to have a hell of a time getting ORB's diplomacies back to the way it was with Uzumi Atha.

ORB doesn't invade others, nor do they allow others to be invaded. But they must first not fight others at will in order to not get into the cycle of vicious fighting that is now consuming that GSD. This is the reason Cagalli is staying back on Earth, she is now recognising her role as a Representative and leader.

Like it or not people, she is maturing. Note, she didn't go whining about how she can't go to space with the AA crew.

Back to the damn Seiran's. Militarily, ORB is diminished. A large portion of was sacrificed in the useless battles against Minerva, dozens of Murasames, a gigantic fleet carrier and smany warships. And with ZAFT attack on ORB, they're power is even more less. This are the crimes of Seirans, and they deserved their ignomonous deaths.

So why do I still support the AA crew? If they were bungling meddlers during most of GSD, they're not now. In case you all noticed, the AA is on a RECON mission, not an attack mission. I assume that means no combat unless Mister All Mighty Shinn comes along. Even now, they're still not sure of Dullindal's absolute plans and they're going to Coppernicus to investigate. And this time, they won't have to worry about fighitng their own ships like the Crete fiasco.

Minerva crew, what can I say. Am I the only one who thinks Talia's seiyuu is so drab? If I consider Maryu and Talia shouting fire in japanese, this is what I hear.

Talia: "teeeeeeeeeeeeeiiiiiiiiiiiiiii"

Maryu "TTTTTTTTTTTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII II!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Granted Maryu is a little hopeless in the matter of guys. Am I the only that's gonna be sorry for Andrew Waldfeldt when he finds out his girlfriend just fell for her ex back again? Nevertheless, point is Maryu's seiyuu is more talented in potraying both a soft spoken and understanding Captain as well as a Charismatic Leader captaining the one the two most powerful ships in GSD. (Minerva and AA)

Kusanagi we don't know enough about its capabilities, especially in terms of armour whereas we know Minerva and AA can withstand many laser shots and missles.

And the crew of Minerva honestly don't act like soldiers at all. Only Rey and Talia show some form of military discupline but the rest are essentially a bunch of kids who happen to know how to run a battleship and think driving the Minerva is a field trip, not a battleship designed to protect their colonies. Unlike Kira's gang who were FORCED to grow up in the war, where have we seen the crew of the Minerva's personalities?

GSD again, suffers from having too many characters. And the sidelined character development to showcase their unoriginal Gundams. I did my research. The DOMS, ZAKUS, GOUFS, hell even AKATSUKI are derived from the Original Mobile Suit Gundam. At least in Gundam Seed, the Ginns were original, as were the five original Gundams, Strike, Aegis, Buster, Blitz and Duel.

For those who find it hard to side with the AA crew, now is the time to side with them fully. Because they're not meddlers now. They're on the side of ORB, whereas previously they were a rogue faction. They've got purpose, and their purpose is to defend the freedom of everyone.

Kira and Lacus have never declared they were supreme or the right faction. At the very least, they did not impose their views violently. The fiascos at Crete I attribute to Yuna Roma Seiran who fired on his own leader, and Shinn Asuka, who just happen to hate Cagalli and nothing in the world short is going to change his thinking. That guy is consumed by his anger and continues to allow anger to consume him. Looking back on Kira's actions, sure they made a lot of chaos. But how much is actually attributed to them? The blame has to be distributed and you cannot blame the AA crew completely. After, they're only goal is peace and a neutral ORB is essentialy to that.

I hope you can accept my explanations for the actions of the AA crew. One last thing to comment about them. Have they ever claimed to be the "RIGHT" faction and declared everybody else wrong? I don't think so.

Take care everyone and good night.

I have been in the army, and one question appears when i see lacus on the bridge of, for an example AA... WHAT THE HELL DOES SHE DO ON THE BRIDGE???

Is she there smiling away enemies, have she got any military training???

WHAT THE HELL DOES SHE KNOW ABOUT WARFARE????
She's a civilian..

She just keeps talking BS, and screaming KIIIIIRRRAAAAAA.,.... Or someone elses name from the AA..
And looking cute in the camera..

I just want to know, why, whyyy, WHYYYYYYYYYY...

I would be more than glad if she die in one of these 5 upcoming episodes, plz fukuda.. plz...

Too lazy to read the entire thread, so feel free to ignore my post (everyone always does this without me needing to tell them anyway.) =P I know it said no mobile suits but the reason why they became dominant is because they are far more agile than other types of attack vehicles. Battleships and such go down so easily because beam shields don't work against physical objects such as the Gouf's whip or an Anti-Ship Sword. They aren't as agile as mobile suits so they can't out manuver them and so they fail miserably at melee range. Because of this weakness I think it was simply deemed more efficient to focus on the mobile suits rather than trying to improve a concept that was already outdated.

In terms of power and abilities, the ArchAngel outmatches the Minerva. The EAF had always kept the balance by bringing out new technology first (Phase Shift, Mirage Colloid, Beam Weapons, Beam Shields, etc..), combined with sheer numbers. ZAFT kept up by copying the technology and using *much* more skilled pilots. Crew wise, and plot wise, I dislike both of them. Both sides are blindly over zealous towards different causes, although I suspect Talia actually has a functioning brain. Neo/Mwu might have one too, but he is too busy watching Murrue's breasts bounce around to comment on the situation. If I had to pick a crew I liked more then it would have to be Minerva. Rey for the win.

Edit: oops, I seem to have merged my replies from this and the Minerva vs ArchAngel thread.. meh, oh well. Still relivant I guess.

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Originally posted by: isso
I have been in the army, and one question appears when i see lacus on the bridge of, for an example AA... WHAT THE HELL DOES SHE DO ON THE BRIDGE???

Is she there smiling away enemies, have she got any military training???

WHAT THE HELL DOES SHE KNOW ABOUT WARFARE????
She's a civilian..

She just keeps talking BS, and screaming KIIIIIRRRAAAAAA.,.... Or someone elses name from the AA..
And looking cute in the camera..

I just want to know, why, whyyy, WHYYYYYYYYYY...

I would be more than glad if she die in one of these 5 upcoming episodes, plz fukuda.. plz...

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I concede you bring up a good point, yet, keep in mind that the same could be said for the Minerva. What are a bunch of 16 year olds doing on a war ship (if we're going to get technical about the proper stuff in an army). What type of soldiers does the Minerva have if there are crew members that do not follow orders nor are punished (think Shinn). Many of these arguments have been brought up, so I detest bringing them up again.

What is Zaft doing with Meer (she is taking Lacus role)? If you defend Meer by saying that she is a part of the Chairman's plan, I will not consider that sufficient. Meer was used to unite the soldiers, increase their morale and faith in Zaft. Lacus does the same thing for the AA, she inspires the crew. She is not just someone that yells "KIRA." She is the one that gave Kira the FREEDOM in SEED, and JUSTICE to Athuran, not once but twice. She does have a military faction that supports her. She is more than just a happy go lucky woman. She commands the same power and respect that Diana does from Turn a Gundam. Diana need not be in war either but supported her people. Lacus is more a political figure/influence. Although it is uncommon for our real political figures to take part in a war now, I find her actions to be admirable, honorable, courageous, idealistic and pure. Cagalli is the same as Lacus too. At least she is there, it would be worse if she said "No more War" and just did nothing. By her just being there and supporting Orb, Clyne Faction, AA, and Eternal, she is doing more than what most people do. This is a big message in the GS/GSD series, so many people want no wars but do little about it. Take action.