this wasn an interesting chapter i think kishimoto is finally drivin us toward finding out the relationship between naruto and the yondaime.
Printable View
this wasn an interesting chapter i think kishimoto is finally drivin us toward finding out the relationship between naruto and the yondaime.
It was pritty cool. Much more info then in the Raw but the main point was driven across.
(reguarding the first post.)
yeah now that kyubi thinks the two are similar, things may prove to be very interesting.
Edit: Omfg, why would kyubi think that the Fourth and Naruto are alike, i mean.. how the hell does the nine tailed fox "know" the fourth.. sweet jesus, i wonder if this is a translation mistake or something much much bigger
I'm hoping Naruto's first punch shatters Sasuke's hitai-ate. That oughtta wipe that smirk off his face.
Yes much was revealed, this arc is serving as a major turning point for the story. As many people have said it seems as though naruto is going curse seal level 2 (ssj2) lol. anywho i only saw 1 tail so maybe as he gets more and more chakra he gains more tails or something. and sasuke has yet to release his 2 levels of curse seal. Also thinking bout to seeing gaara fight it seems now that naruto could prolli beat gaara again as could sasuke. All in all sweet episode
Please dont compare naruto to that dragon ball garbage.
btw read my first post, i kinda had a revelation, hehe.
How can you not compare it to DBZ, when all you've been seeing lately IS DBZ-like elements? Power ups, lack of any real technique, trashy Taijutsu fighting, lack of cool ninjutsu, and above all changing forms to accompany your "newly" aquired powers? I bet anybody who likes gimmicks *cough*Kyuubi*cough* denies the fact that Naruto and DBZ are blindingly similar, while people who have some depth accept, and wish for MORE.
Quote:
Originally posted by: piasEnigma
(reguarding the first post.)
yeah now that kyubi thinks the two are similar, things may prove to be very interesting.
Edit: Omfg, why would kyubi think that the Fourth and Naruto are alike, i mean.. how the hell does the nine tailed fox "know" the fourth.. sweet jesus, i wonder if this is a translation mistake or something much much bigger
well if the kyuubi knew something about the fourth it would make sense because remember when the third said that the sealer than the target fight in the belly of death forever? Maybe the kyuubi and the fourth somehow are still tangled together and the fourth and the kyuubi know each other , or maybe some of the other theories that have been thrown around about the kyuubi being naruto's mother are true.
I don't know why, but has it ever occured to people here that Kyuubi isn't as invincible as people make it out to be? What I mean to say is, maybe Kyuubi is a double edged, sword. And by tapping into his power, Naruto ultimately loses a part of himself in the process. I dislike the idea of having an invincible trump card for Naruto, mainly cause he's such a clever fighter, and will use trickery to win, instead of brute force.
I wouldn't be surprised if Kyuubi was a double edged sword. The way Naruto has to draw upon it with more and more frequency and the fact that he's having to draw more than ever... there must be some kinda side effect.
There were some scenes a few chapters ago where Kyuubi was manifesting itself despite the fact that the situation didn't seem particularly dire.. perhaps Kyuubi is attempting to get a stronger foothold in Naruto's psyche?
If he has to give of himself to use Kyuubi.. it might be a good incentive for him to train harder... to avoid drawing on that power at all costs. Hopefully this excessive kyuubi-usage is to further Naruto's character and not Kishimoto running out of ideas.
but the kyubi's chakra and naruto's intertwine, so as time passes it'll be easier for naruto to draw it out. i don't know, but naruto is just awesome going kyubi. damn, that last page!! oh man, i hope he beats the crap outta sasuke. i was expecting that in this chp but it didn't happen. as for kyubi saying that naruto and yondaime r alike, uhm...well...i don't know. a speculation - he met him when they were battling. who knows.
Alright Hotsuma, here's my response to what you've been saying in both this and the raw thread. You say all this powering up and usage of alternate power sources is very dbz-like, and you don't like it. You also you say you'd rather see inventive and cleaver fighting as has been the staple of the series from the get go. Well, let me ask you this: how clever and inventive can you possibly get by staying at the same power level? Ingeniuty can only take you so far if you don't become stronger. Naruto would never have beaten gaara if it wasn't for the summoning technique he learned, regardless of his cleverness. Same thing if he's put up against someone like a jounin, ingeniuty won't be enough for Naruto to succeed at this level. So "powering up" is a necessity. The extra power when coupled with ingeniuty (how many times have I said this word already?) will make for far more interesting fights then we've gotten to see so far.
You might argue that this rate of power acquisition is ridiculous, but then I'd have to say that it's also necessary. It might be ok for everyone else to just gain skill and power at the rate that you're used to through seeing the training sessions and what not, but it's not enough for Sasuke and Naruto. They're special. As you've seen them up until now, they were superior ninjas for their levels, but still comparable to other ninjas like neiji and gaara. As should be obvious by now, these two have destinies that far more encompassing, and potentials that far exceed those of the other ninjas. It's only natural in a series like this, that at some point, that this passes from speculation to fact. This is that point. I don't believe the series is going to remain like this, in the sense of continual power ups. But right now, it has to happen for the sake of moving these guys along they destined paths. If you don't believe that they have destinies in the story (taking Naruto's position instead of Neiji's), you can at least believe that kishimoto has plans for them, and those plans involve Naruto and Sasuke being head and shoulder above the rest.
You'd like to believe that, wouldn't you? But there's only one thing wrong with them interwining. If we go by your scenario, Naruto will indeed become stronger. But what will Kyuubi get on his end of the bargain? Maybe taking over Naruto's psyche, as Souryusen said. Kyuubi, in both mind and strength are more powerful than Naruto, alone. It's not impossible for him to suddenly start taking over.
There's no such thing as a free lunch, my Economics teacher told me in HS. I seriously doubt Kyuubi appreciates just giving out chakra (as much as he has) for free considering his twisted character.
this is starting to get really interesting, i reakon the fight scenes once the anime gets up to this will be of similar quality to lee vs gaara (drools)
Well It seems that kyubi is trying to get a better grip on narutos mind and body. Why did kakashi get all freaked out when kyubi first came out when naruto was fighting haku. Maybe kakashi didnt understand that kyubi was released we arent really sure but its either kyubi is fighting without naruto. Or naruto is using kyubis power a lot more than usual. Also its not very fun if naruto never got stronger how will he reach hokage?
I never said anything about staying in the same power level. It's possible for Naruto to get stronger, but still use creativity and ingenuity to win a battle, instead of a "I've more chakra than you, so I'll win!" I think you underestimate Naruto's good points as a tricky ninja, and only look to him as just strong. That's boring. Don't think that getting strong must mean you have to use brute force to win.Quote:
Originally posted by: Uchiha Barles
Alright Hotsuma, here's my response to what you've been saying in both this and the raw thread. You say all this powering up and usage of alternate power sources is very dbz-like, and you don't like it. You also you say you'd rather see inventive and cleaver fighting as has been the staple of the series from the get go. Well, let me ask you this: how clever and inventive can you possibly get by staying at the same power level? Ingeniuty can only take you so far if you don't become stronger. Naruto would never have beaten gaara if it wasn't for the summoning technique he learned, regardless of his cleverness. Same thing if he's put up against someone like a jounin, ingeniuty won't be enough for Naruto to succeed at this level. So "powering up" is a necessity. The extra power when coupled with ingeniuty (how many times have I said this word already?) will make for far more interesting fights then we've gotten to see so far.
I do think the power acquisition is ridiculous. Powering up is all fine and dandy. But through a lame and boring way as just tapping into something you've had forever? Come now. If Naruto and Sasuke gained strength, via work and training, I wouldn't look down on the current events. Instead, we're seeing recycled material, where the power pops up out of nowhere.Quote:
You might argue that this rate of power acquisition is ridiculous, but then I'd have to say that it's also necessary. It might be ok for everyone else to just gain skill and power at the rate that you're used to through seeing the training sessions and what not, but it's not enough for Sasuke and Naruto. They're special. As you've seen them up until now, they were superior ninjas for their levels, but still comparable to other ninjas like neiji and gaara. As should be obvious by now, these two have destinies that far more encompassing, and potentials that far exceed those of the other ninjas. It's only natural in a series like this, that at some point, that this passes from speculation to fact. This is that point. I don't believe the series is going to remain like this, in the sense of continual power ups. But right now, it has to happen for the sake of moving these guys along they destined paths. If you don't believe that they have destinies in the story (taking Naruto's position instead of Neiji's), you can at least believe that kishimoto has plans for them, and those plans involve Naruto and Sasuke being head and shoulder above the rest.
Dont bitch at us Hotsuma for what has happend so far in the manga. Go complain to kishimoto. So Please stop bitching at every single aspect.
Well, Kyuubi won't die forever...I'd think that would be a good deal for chakra.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
You'd like to believe that, wouldn't you? But there's only one thing wrong with them interwining. If we go by your scenario, Naruto will indeed become stronger. But what will Kyuubi get on his end of the bargain? Maybe taking over Naruto's psyche, as Souryusen said. Kyuubi, in both mind and strength are more powerful than Naruto, alone. It's not impossible for him to suddenly start taking over.
There's no such thing as a free lunch, my Economics teacher told me in HS. I seriously doubt Kyuubi appreciates just giving out chakra (as much as he has) for free considering his twisted character.
That was kind of the point of Kyuubi aiding Naruto in summoning Gamabunta, if Naruto dies, the Kyuubi goes too. Sasuke is trying to kill Naruto to gain his silly super-sharigan (I know what its called, I just don't want to type it anymore), so Kyuubi needs to help Naruto win this fight to survive.
I'm not bitching at you. Stop taking it personally. It's called a discussion. An opinion. Criticism. The internet is full of it. Deal with it.Quote:
Originally posted by: kyubisrage
Dont bitch at us Hotsuma for what has happend so far in the manga. Go complain to kishimoto. So Please stop bitching at every single aspect.
It's not about Kyuubi surviving. I'm looking at it from a slightly different angle. A pessimistic, or "what if" view. It's about Kyuubi slowly beginning to influence Naruto's overall character. I guess, in a way, it's like giving yourself over to the devil. (Religious replies are not welcome)Quote:
Well, Kyuubi won't die forever...I'd think that would be a good deal for chakra.
That was kind of the point of Kyuubi aiding Naruto in summoning Gamabunta, if Naruto dies, the Kyuubi goes too. Sasuke is trying to kill Naruto to gain his silly super-sharigan (I know what its called, I just don't want to type it anymore), so Kyuubi needs to help Naruto win this fight to survive.
Hotsuma, if u dont like it u dont have to read it...if someone says they like it, it doesnt mean u must attack them. I respect ur opinions u should respect others.
Anywho, why does everyone think its a bad thing that kyuubi is mixing chakra with naruto, did jiriaya talk about there powers mixing? and he didnt think it was a bad thing. Also if its so bad the powers mixing then howcome after the haku fight and the orochimaru fight and the gaara fight naruto wasnt trying to kill every1 like kyuubi would try to do? I reckon its all part of his growth and as he gets older he'll get more power from the kyuubi.
I love it when people say "if you don't like it, don't watch it."Quote:
Originally posted by: Naruto_-_Kun
Hotsuma, if u dont like it u dont have to read it...if someone says they like it, it doesnt mean u must attack them. I respect ur opinions u should respect others.
Anywho, why does everyone think its a bad thing that kyuubi is mixing chakra with naruto, did jiriaya talk about there powers mixing? and he didnt think it was a bad thing. Also if its so bad the powers mixing then howcome after the haku fight and the orochimaru fight and the gaara fight naruto wasnt trying to kill every1 like kyuubi would try to do? I reckon its all part of his growth and as he gets older he'll get more power from the kyuubi.
Get one thing straight. I like Naruto. Probably more than any other fighting anime so far. With the possible exception of YYH. Now, just because I don't like a certain element of it, DOES NOT MEAN I hate the series.
I said it once, and I'll say it again. Hidden power and instant leveling up is fucking gay. I don't like that aspect of fighting, because it's been done forever and then some, but that does not mean I hate the series.
Now, for attacking people. Sorry, I tend to get a little overboard on that. I do think people are undermining Naruto's character and individual strength, when they see *only* Kyuubi in there.
I don't mind criticism, but people like to discuss the chapter and not compare Naruto to DBZ.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
I'm not bitching at you. Stop taking it personally. It's called a discussion. An opinion. Criticism. The internet is full of it. Deal with it.Quote:
Originally posted by: kyubisrage
Dont bitch at us Hotsuma for what has happend so far in the manga. Go complain to kishimoto. So Please stop bitching at every single aspect.
It's not about Kyuubi surviving. I'm looking at it from a slightly different angle. A pessimistic, or "what if" view. It's about Kyuubi slowly beginning to influence Naruto's overall character. I guess, in a way, it's like giving yourself over to the devil. (Religious replies are not welcome)Quote:
Well, Kyuubi won't die forever...I'd think that would be a good deal for chakra.
That was kind of the point of Kyuubi aiding Naruto in summoning Gamabunta, if Naruto dies, the Kyuubi goes too. Sasuke is trying to kill Naruto to gain his silly super-sharigan (I know what its called, I just don't want to type it anymore), so Kyuubi needs to help Naruto win this fight to survive.
If it's bothering you get the fuck out there are plenty of other manga's out there.
You should by now know what shounen manga is about, if it's not your taste go read Chobits or something else, don't complain about something you are getting for free.
I never said anything about staying in the same power level. It's possible for Naruto to get stronger, but still use creativity and ingenuity to win a battle, instead of a "I've more chakra than you, so I'll win!" I think you underestimate Naruto's good points as a tricky ninja, and only look to him as just strong. That's boring. Don't think that getting strong must mean you have to use brute force to win.
On the contrary, I'm not underestimating Naruto in any way. Like you, what draw me to this series was all the cool tricks and tactics the ninjas used to win fights, specifically Naruto. And I don't think that getting strong just means increasing you ability to dish out damage through brute force, but I do think that it's necessary to increase your actual power (dealing damage, illusions, whatever.)
I do think the power acquisition is ridiculous. Powering up is all fine and dandy. But through a lame and boring way as just tapping into something you've had forever? Come now. If Naruto and Sasuke gained strength, via work and training, I wouldn't look down on the current events. Instead, we're seeing recycled material, where the power pops up out of nowhere.[/quote]
These power ups didn't pop out of nowhere. Like you said, Naruto's always had that power. Isn't it time time he started using more of it's power? I mean, what he was using before was a pittance. Gaara had more access to his demon's power than Naruto did. Also, this might serve as a starting point in the near future for Naruto to learn techniques that he simply cannot do without the demon chakra, like bloodline abilities (not like the summon technique, where if he had enough chakra of his own, he could do it). All the coolness potential this fight is setting up is well worth the dbz type power gains, specially since this happens so rarely (if ever?) And Sasuke...I don't quite see your problem with his evolution. He's developing his Sharingan. How do you train that? In battle of course. It's only natural that the third dot would appear in a fight of this caliber. Also, he's not using the power of the cursed seal right now. The way I see it, Sasuke's evolving quite wonderfully.
How can you not mind criticism, but hate it when it's compared to something else? That's part of what criticism is, dumbass. Here, let me tone this down for you.Quote:
Originally posted by: Himura_san
I don't mind criticism, but people like to discuss the chapter and not compare Naruto to DBZ.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
I'm not bitching at you. Stop taking it personally. It's called a discussion. An opinion. Criticism. The internet is full of it. Deal with it.Quote:
Originally posted by: kyubisrage
Dont bitch at us Hotsuma for what has happend so far in the manga. Go complain to kishimoto. So Please stop bitching at every single aspect.
It's not about Kyuubi surviving. I'm looking at it from a slightly different angle. A pessimistic, or "what if" view. It's about Kyuubi slowly beginning to influence Naruto's overall character. I guess, in a way, it's like giving yourself over to the devil. (Religious replies are not welcome)Quote:
Well, Kyuubi won't die forever...I'd think that would be a good deal for chakra.
That was kind of the point of Kyuubi aiding Naruto in summoning Gamabunta, if Naruto dies, the Kyuubi goes too. Sasuke is trying to kill Naruto to gain his silly super-sharigan (I know what its called, I just don't want to type it anymore), so Kyuubi needs to help Naruto win this fight to survive.
If it's bothering you get the fuck out there are plenty of other manga's out there.
You should by now know what shounen manga is about, if it's not your taste go read Chobits or something else, don't complain about something you are getting for free.
My criticism is : Currently, this turn of events is predictable and lacking in any real creativity, which we've come to expect from Naruto. INSTEAD, it's turning into something that is not Naruto like. It's lame, but that won't stop me from reading it. I'm not bitching, simply saying I dislike it.
There's my take on it, with a candycoated "But, I'll still read it" at the end. Now, shut the fuck up with the "like it, or shut up" attitude.
Uchiha Barles :
The way I see it is this. This fight would be far more interesting, without the addition of seals and beasts, and whatnot. Just a bad-ass fight to the finish utilizing what each of them have. Naruto uses what he has (high stamina, chakra, kagebunshin, henge [sexy no jutsu]) and Sasuke uses whatever he has to counter it. It would definitely dazzle the readers more, if you see tricks upon tricks, different jutsus on different jutsu, and so on. Not just a fight that gives a DBZ-like (oh, better watch out for the haters here) powering up of like..everything but your mind. Now, let's say they DID power up. I wouldn't mind them using said powers to further enhance what they were already doing (on a grander scale), but what I think we'll be seeing now is just a brawl without much thought.
Again. Power ups is cool. It serves as even more action potential. But, just duking it out without any thought, and trying to overpower the other... Just not fun, and expected from Naruto.
Alright, I'll agree with that, but the fight isn't over yet, so there's still hope, and I think they're both approaching a limit. But I'd be fine even this turned out to be a slug fest, because I'm expecting excellent things to surface from the improvements these two made in this fight. I would however, prefer some surprising uses of the new powers they've acquired, while the fight is still happening. For me, this fight has been pretty unpredictable, but only because I predicted it, and refused to believe that kishimoto would be so predictable. But it's turning out alright despite that, specially now that Sasuke isn't using the cursed seal.
Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
How can you not mind criticism, but hate it when it's compared to something else? That's part of what criticism is, dumbass. Here, let me tone this down for you.Quote:
Originally posted by: Himura_san
I don't mind criticism, but people like to discuss the chapter and not compare Naruto to DBZ.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
I'm not bitching at you. Stop taking it personally. It's called a discussion. An opinion. Criticism. The internet is full of it. Deal with it.Quote:
Originally posted by: kyubisrage
Dont bitch at us Hotsuma for what has happend so far in the manga. Go complain to kishimoto. So Please stop bitching at every single aspect.
It's not about Kyuubi surviving. I'm looking at it from a slightly different angle. A pessimistic, or "what if" view. It's about Kyuubi slowly beginning to influence Naruto's overall character. I guess, in a way, it's like giving yourself over to the devil. (Religious replies are not welcome)Quote:
Well, Kyuubi won't die forever...I'd think that would be a good deal for chakra.
That was kind of the point of Kyuubi aiding Naruto in summoning Gamabunta, if Naruto dies, the Kyuubi goes too. Sasuke is trying to kill Naruto to gain his silly super-sharigan (I know what its called, I just don't want to type it anymore), so Kyuubi needs to help Naruto win this fight to survive.
If it's bothering you get the fuck out there are plenty of other manga's out there.
You should by now know what shounen manga is about, if it's not your taste go read Chobits or something else, don't complain about something you are getting for free.
My criticism is : Currently, this turn of events is predictable and lacking in any real creativity, which we've come to expect from Naruto. INSTEAD, it's turning into something that is not Naruto like. It's lame, but that won't stop me from reading it. I'm not bitching, simply saying I dislike it.
There's my take on it, with a candycoated "But, I'll still read it" at the end. Now, shut the fuck up with the "like it, or shut up" attitude.
Uchiha Barles :
The way I see it is this. This fight would be far more interesting, without the addition of seals and beasts, and whatnot. Just a bad-ass fight to the finish utilizing what each of them have. Naruto uses what he has (high stamina, chakra, kagebunshin, henge [sexy no jutsu]) and Sasuke uses whatever he has to counter it. It would definitely dazzle the readers more, if you see tricks upon tricks, different jutsus on different jutsu, and so on. Not just a fight that gives a DBZ-like (oh, better watch out for the haters here) powering up of like..everything but your mind. Now, let's say they DID power up. I wouldn't mind them using said powers to further enhance what they were already doing (on a grander scale), but what I think we'll be seeing now is just a brawl without much thought.
Again. Power ups is cool. It serves as even more action potential. But, just duking it out without any thought, and trying to overpower the other... Just not fun, and expected from Naruto.
I don't think you understood so let me clear it up for you. This thread is about the current chapter not about comparing Naruto to DBZ. We are talking about chapter 30 not how Naruto is like DBZ. When you start saying shit like that on this thread, where a majority of the people are Naruto fans then you are begging to get flamed. What I would suggest is for you to make a thread called "Naruto is like DBZ" or something similar, then you can see how many people give a fuck about your opinion.
First off, I've only been stating that this is like DBZ, and defending it. And that's only because people continue to dwell on it. The similarities are there. I'm acknowledging it. Nowhere in this thread, did I begin to prod on that obvious fact, attempting to make a discussion about it. Only dumb shits like you take it personally and start offering choices like "Don't like it, don't read it."Quote:
Originally posted by: Himura_san
Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
How can you not mind criticism, but hate it when it's compared to something else? That's part of what criticism is, dumbass. Here, let me tone this down for you.Quote:
Originally posted by: Himura_san
I don't mind criticism, but people like to discuss the chapter and not compare Naruto to DBZ.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
I'm not bitching at you. Stop taking it personally. It's called a discussion. An opinion. Criticism. The internet is full of it. Deal with it.Quote:
Originally posted by: kyubisrage
Dont bitch at us Hotsuma for what has happend so far in the manga. Go complain to kishimoto. So Please stop bitching at every single aspect.
It's not about Kyuubi surviving. I'm looking at it from a slightly different angle. A pessimistic, or "what if" view. It's about Kyuubi slowly beginning to influence Naruto's overall character. I guess, in a way, it's like giving yourself over to the devil. (Religious replies are not welcome)Quote:
Well, Kyuubi won't die forever...I'd think that would be a good deal for chakra.
That was kind of the point of Kyuubi aiding Naruto in summoning Gamabunta, if Naruto dies, the Kyuubi goes too. Sasuke is trying to kill Naruto to gain his silly super-sharigan (I know what its called, I just don't want to type it anymore), so Kyuubi needs to help Naruto win this fight to survive.
If it's bothering you get the fuck out there are plenty of other manga's out there.
You should by now know what shounen manga is about, if it's not your taste go read Chobits or something else, don't complain about something you are getting for free.
My criticism is : Currently, this turn of events is predictable and lacking in any real creativity, which we've come to expect from Naruto. INSTEAD, it's turning into something that is not Naruto like. It's lame, but that won't stop me from reading it. I'm not bitching, simply saying I dislike it.
There's my take on it, with a candycoated "But, I'll still read it" at the end. Now, shut the fuck up with the "like it, or shut up" attitude.
Uchiha Barles :
The way I see it is this. This fight would be far more interesting, without the addition of seals and beasts, and whatnot. Just a bad-ass fight to the finish utilizing what each of them have. Naruto uses what he has (high stamina, chakra, kagebunshin, henge [sexy no jutsu]) and Sasuke uses whatever he has to counter it. It would definitely dazzle the readers more, if you see tricks upon tricks, different jutsus on different jutsu, and so on. Not just a fight that gives a DBZ-like (oh, better watch out for the haters here) powering up of like..everything but your mind. Now, let's say they DID power up. I wouldn't mind them using said powers to further enhance what they were already doing (on a grander scale), but what I think we'll be seeing now is just a brawl without much thought.
Again. Power ups is cool. It serves as even more action potential. But, just duking it out without any thought, and trying to overpower the other... Just not fun, and expected from Naruto.
I don't think you understood so let me clear it up for you. This thread is about the current chapter not about comparing Naruto to DBZ. We are talking about chapter 30 not how Naruto is like DBZ. When you start saying shit like that on this thread, where a majority of the people are Naruto fans then you are begging to get flamed. What I would suggest is for you to make a thread called "Naruto is like DBZ" or something similar, then you can see how many people give a fuck about your opinion.
Second, not every topic will follow exactly what the thread says, you fucktard. This is the internet.
Third. I said it clearly, that I'm a Naruto fan too. Why the fuck would I even be d/ling the books, and anime if I wasn't? And no, just because I'm a fan, doesn't mean I will like every part of it, either.
Having explained this, please just shut the fuck up and let the topic die already.
Fucktard its called taking a thread off-topic, it happens does that make good? No!Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
First off, I've only been stating that this is like DBZ, and defending it. And that's only because people continue to dwell on it. The similarities are there. I'm acknowledging it. Nowhere in this thread, did I begin to prod on that obvious fact, attempting to make a discussion about it. Only dumb shits like you take it personally and start offering choices like "Don't like it, don't read it."Quote:
Originally posted by: Himura_san
Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
How can you not mind criticism, but hate it when it's compared to something else? That's part of what criticism is, dumbass. Here, let me tone this down for you.Quote:
Originally posted by: Himura_san
I don't mind criticism, but people like to discuss the chapter and not compare Naruto to DBZ.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
I'm not bitching at you. Stop taking it personally. It's called a discussion. An opinion. Criticism. The internet is full of it. Deal with it.Quote:
Originally posted by: kyubisrage
Dont bitch at us Hotsuma for what has happend so far in the manga. Go complain to kishimoto. So Please stop bitching at every single aspect.
It's not about Kyuubi surviving. I'm looking at it from a slightly different angle. A pessimistic, or "what if" view. It's about Kyuubi slowly beginning to influence Naruto's overall character. I guess, in a way, it's like giving yourself over to the devil. (Religious replies are not welcome)Quote:
Well, Kyuubi won't die forever...I'd think that would be a good deal for chakra.
That was kind of the point of Kyuubi aiding Naruto in summoning Gamabunta, if Naruto dies, the Kyuubi goes too. Sasuke is trying to kill Naruto to gain his silly super-sharigan (I know what its called, I just don't want to type it anymore), so Kyuubi needs to help Naruto win this fight to survive.
If it's bothering you get the fuck out there are plenty of other manga's out there.
You should by now know what shounen manga is about, if it's not your taste go read Chobits or something else, don't complain about something you are getting for free.
My criticism is : Currently, this turn of events is predictable and lacking in any real creativity, which we've come to expect from Naruto. INSTEAD, it's turning into something that is not Naruto like. It's lame, but that won't stop me from reading it. I'm not bitching, simply saying I dislike it.
There's my take on it, with a candycoated "But, I'll still read it" at the end. Now, shut the fuck up with the "like it, or shut up" attitude.
Uchiha Barles :
The way I see it is this. This fight would be far more interesting, without the addition of seals and beasts, and whatnot. Just a bad-ass fight to the finish utilizing what each of them have. Naruto uses what he has (high stamina, chakra, kagebunshin, henge [sexy no jutsu]) and Sasuke uses whatever he has to counter it. It would definitely dazzle the readers more, if you see tricks upon tricks, different jutsus on different jutsu, and so on. Not just a fight that gives a DBZ-like (oh, better watch out for the haters here) powering up of like..everything but your mind. Now, let's say they DID power up. I wouldn't mind them using said powers to further enhance what they were already doing (on a grander scale), but what I think we'll be seeing now is just a brawl without much thought.
Again. Power ups is cool. It serves as even more action potential. But, just duking it out without any thought, and trying to overpower the other... Just not fun, and expected from Naruto.
I don't think you understood so let me clear it up for you. This thread is about the current chapter not about comparing Naruto to DBZ. We are talking about chapter 30 not how Naruto is like DBZ. When you start saying shit like that on this thread, where a majority of the people are Naruto fans then you are begging to get flamed. What I would suggest is for you to make a thread called "Naruto is like DBZ" or something similar, then you can see how many people give a fuck about your opinion.
Second, not every topic will follow exactly what the thread says, you fucktard. This is the internet.
Third. I said it clearly, that I'm a Naruto fan too. Why the fuck would I even be d/ling the books, and anime if I wasn't? Just because I'm a fan, doesn't mean I will like every part of it, either.
If you want I can make a thread for you where you can compare Naruto to DBZ.
Speaking of you downloading the manga/anime, it seems that you have'nt spend a penny on it yet you like to bitch about it, typical "spoiled kid" mentality. That is we say if you don't like it get the fuck out! no one will miss you! If you spent money on it, then maybe I would say you have a point, but your getting it for FREE!!!!!!!
Getting tired of educating these cuntrags. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-disgusted.gif[/img]
oh my god.
please, take your conversation to somewhere else besides the boards, yeesh.
p.s. nice fight scenes in the chapter. really smart with the description of how sharingan works and how sasuke was fighting against the future spots that naruto would be in. oo.
The way I see it, is you're the only dumbass here that's even dwelling on this.
AGAIN. Just because I'm a fan, doesn't mean I'll enjoy everything that's happening. People hate Sakura, and yet they still read the books. This is no different. And, also, they're still here! What part of Not everything will be liked, do you not understand?
And man. I totally understand where you're coming from. I hate having to dumb down obvious liberties such as opinions and criticisms. Take a hint, douchebag.
@ohpeekaboo:
sorry man.
I am done here, I don't need anything else to add so if you excuse me.
@hotsuma:
check your private messages.
Yeah, me too.
Anyways, back on topic. I predict Sasuke will win this fight. Not because he was the better fighter or anything (he isn't), but just because we need some closure on this Orochimaru deal. And Kishimoto will definitely have to deliver it. If not, he'll be like a thorn on the side for the rest of the series.
And the level 2 thing as well. Next chapter will be Naruto owning Sasuke. Then Sasuke comes back w/level 2 madness. At that point, I think Naruto will be held back by Kakashi, while Sasuke finishes his deal with Oro. BUT, since they'll be doing more than just fighting (Naruto is a good friend like that), Sasuke *might* turn on Oro himself.
the best part about this is... I'M NOT PART OF THE FLAMING!
woot. where is that hiten mitsurugi guy? i miss shutting down his stupidity.
What happened to Phoenix? He was actually pretty cool, simply because he saw the series past Naruto the character, but more as a whole story. I.e. "OMG. Kyuubi Naruto will never lose,even if it's getting boring!"
lol nice chapter.
HAHA the demon fox thinks teh fourth was weak.
- what you get when you mix a warewolf an a ninja ......
NARUTO!!!
A rare occasion for gotwoot.Quote:
Originally posted by: Mut@t@
the best part about this is... I'M NOT PART OF THE FLAMING!
I actually really liked this chapter, this is the fight i was waiting for...
Sasuke's sharingan kicked ass, and soon Naruto will kick unpridectable ass (sasuke couldn't see Naruto standing back up, cuz naruto's movements are now affected by Kyubi's mind)... no chidori or rasengan are being thrown aroud, and no obscure smoke comes out and wastes two pages...
and sorry for reviving this argument, but hotsuma, you say your favorite fighting anime is YYH, doesn't it a bit contradicitng to the fact you hate pointless power ups? there wasn't a 'smart' battle in this anime for years... about everything in YYH is 'look at his big reiki!' or 'your amount of reiki isn't enough to beat me!'...
Well this chapter shows that Kyuubi knew the Fourth. So it could support the mother theory...
but...
I really hope that's not true...it would be so creepy.
stop bitching and discuss the chapter. Now it's just out of topic!
what mother theory?
I'm going to have to disagree here. Like Hotsuma said, Naruto can still increase his strength without powering up. He can do it through training, experience, and learning new jutsus.Quote:
Alright Hotsuma, here's my response to what you've been saying in both this and the raw thread. You say all this powering up and usage of alternate power sources is very dbz-like, and you don't like it. You also you say you'd rather see inventive and cleaver fighting as has been the staple of the series from the get go. Well, let me ask you this: how clever and inventive can you possibly get by staying at the same power level? Ingeniuty can only take you so far if you don't become stronger. Naruto would never have beaten gaara if it wasn't for the summoning technique he learned, regardless of his cleverness. Same thing if he's put up against someone like a jounin, ingeniuty won't be enough for Naruto to succeed at this level. So "powering up" is a necessity. The extra power when coupled with ingeniuty (how many times have I said this word already?) will make for far more interesting fights then we've gotten to see so far.
If you look at the really great shinobi in the series, the jounins, hokage, and sannin. They are all the most skilled and powerful ninja in the series, yet none of them require transformations or power ups to be great. They are all great because of their talent as ninja. Will we never see Jiraiya or Kakashi transforming to win a battle.
Don't get me wrong, it was cool to see Naruto go beserk against Haku and the first transformation agaisnt Sasuke. To me that was Kishimoto telling us Naruto is pissed as hell and ready to kick some ass. But this second transformation is overdoing it IMO.
Also, something that bothered me about this chapter. I loved seeing the sharingan in action and getting look at what user sees. But would the the fully developed sharingan really make Sasuke that much stronger? And by stronger, I mean physical strength, not powerful. I can understand that it allowed him to follow and predict Naruto's movements, but at best, it should have only allowed Sasuke to dodge Naruto's attacks. Having the 3rd doujutsu should not have allowed Sasuke to drop Naruto in only 2 hits. His attacks should not have done that much damage to Naruto if in 229, Naruto defelcted Sasuke's katon with just chakra.
I'm sorta rambling now, but you get the idea.
the 3rd comma did not increase sasuke's strength. all it did was give tremendous insight and movement predictability which resulted in naruto being caught off guard cuz sasuke was able to hit naruto before naruto could even get an attack off. when you're caught off guard like that, it's same as getting hit without knowing it's coming.Quote:
Originally posted by: Sidnne
Also, something that bothered me about this chapter. I loved seeing the sharingan in action and getting look at what user sees. But would the the fully developed sharingan really make Sasuke that much stronger? And by stronger, I mean physical strength, not powerful. I can understand that it allowed him to follow and predict Naruto's movements, but at best, it should have only allowed Sasuke to dodge Naruto's attacks. Having the 3rd doujutsu should not have allowed Sasuke to drop Naruto in only 2 hits. His attacks should not have done that much damage to Naruto if in 229, Naruto defelcted Sasuke's katon with just chakra.
In the Haku fight, if Naruto was able to deflect ice spears (or kunai, cant remember) with chakra at a subconscious level, there's no reason why the same shouldnt happen when Sasuke is about to land a punch on him. If his Kyuubi powers were consistent (seems to be more of a storyline inconsistency), it shouldnt matter that Naruto didnt see the punch coming.
And Sidnne is right, Sasuke's taijutsu shouldnt even phase Naruto let alone require Kyuubi to transform him so he can stay in the fight. The only thing different about Sasuke is the third comma. As mentioned earlier he didnt get physically stronger so how ridiculous is it that Naruto got rocked so hard?
It seems like they're dumbing down Kyuubi Naruto for storyline's sake so Sasuke can go even w/ Naruto for most of the fight.
This chapter leads me to believe that Naruto is in fact related to the 4th somehow (most likely father and son). That old thoery seems much more logical now and the sharingan seems to be greatly influenced by ones emotions.
Also I don't see any random power ups...
Nine tail doesn't want to die and Sasuke is developing. Sigh why is he so stupid? Why doesn't he realize his sharingan just developed because he isn't using his stupid curse.
Well you see in Japanese mythology there are tales where the Nine Tailed Fox Demon would sometime transform as a princess or something.Quote:
Originally posted by: basey_69
what mother theory?
Now just modify it a little bit and you have the mother theory of Naruto.(Eg. Kyuubi was orignally a woman that had the demon fox sealed inside of her...but the birth of Naruto caused the seal to break, or some other modification)
That is a heavy assumption though..unless Kishimoto is counting on everyone forgeting that certain tale in Japan. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]
Ok I'm sorry but the people who are complaining about Hotsuma's comments are completely in the wrong. This thread is for us to discuss the current chapter. If Hotsuma wants to make a comment about how he had some problems with the current arc by comparing it to DBZ then he can. That is in no way taking this discussion off topic. Frankly a lot of people here come off like a bunch of fanboys who can't stand to possibly there is a flaw to this manga and its kinda annoying when people make intelligent comments only to have a bunch of idiots flame them.
Well now that I've gotten that off my chest I'd like to say that I mostly agree with Hotsuma on these last few chapters. It's not that I mind power ups but not if they are used in the way they are currently being used. So far all this fight has been is Sasuke totally beats Naruto, Naruto powers up and totally beats Sasuke, Sasuke powers and totally beats Naruto and then finally Naruto powers up again. It's like some really lame tennis match that just goes back and forth. Now all of this stuff can come off really well if this is only the build up to the main fight where finally Sasuke and Naruto have reached the limit of there powers and do some interesting stuff. Right now it can go either way, this can either be the prettiest yet lamest fight we've scene or it can end up being the prettiest and best fight we've seen.
The Sharingan part was extremely well done though I will give this chapter that. Also for all you out there who think Sasuke taking Naruto down that quickly is unrealistic you do have to realize that most real fights don't last that long so two hits is a lot and let's not forget that if I'm moving forward to do a punch but you punch as I'm moving forward I pretty much move into your punch making the blow that much more powerful, which is what Sasuke was doing, he's just using good timing. That's what I always liked and Kishimoto's fight scenes is that they always had good fight mechanics (well except for the whole tennis match thing that this fight is turning into, that's just horrible)
For those of you thinking that Sasuke has beaten Naruto in 2 blows... read the sound effects in the inane version. The focus moves skyward and there are sounds from below indicating "various thumps and thuds."
Sounds like Sasuke took a little time to own Naruto's shit, actually.
Going to need to push Sasuke to level 2 absolutely.
the whole kyubi will take over naruto thing, i disagree. naruto seems to be in control. i guess it seems that way because kyubi gives him power surges but naruto will go back normal at the end of the battle.
every story in shonen jump involves leveling up. dbz and naruto r similar on that level. but story wise, nah, no comparisons.
Well, I haven't seen the entire anime, truthfully. The last big thing to happen was around the Toguro saga. And up until the end of that, the battles have been creative. Not just a big slug fest with transformations, and powers coming up out of nowhere. The characters in YYH, at least trained to become that strong, other than relying on gimmicks.Quote:
Originally posted by: Death BOO Z
and sorry for reviving this argument, but hotsuma, you say your favorite fighting anime is YYH, doesn't it a bit contradicitng to the fact you hate pointless power ups? there wasn't a 'smart' battle in this anime for years... about everything in YYH is 'look at his big reiki!' or 'your amount of reiki isn't enough to beat me!'...
naruto was blacking out completely, it was getting dark around kyubi again so kyubi took over naruto will most likely gain control at the last minute the seal on naruto didn't even break or start to break, its just the fact kyubi has mental and physical control and is pouring out his power, but no seal breakin i'm sure they woulda shown sumfin or maybe thats in next times hmm that could be
i liked this chapter, liked how it has been brought about...
i think we needed these powerups now during this fight...its important for these characters...he hasnt been kyubi-naruto in a while, i dont think its a bad thing...rather a good thing, as the characters are growing up through this mission,
this chapter kicked ass. as usual we're left to wait with suspense but that's ok. can only wonder what's gonna happen next week.
Another Kyubi awakening, how exciting...
My theory on the next chapters is that sasuke will realise that his sharingan holds more power than the curse seals could give him because after all Itachi doesnt have one and Im sure he would own the sound four. Sasuke and Naruto with beat the info about where Itachi meets from orochimaru and kabuto and then go for them.
Another sarcastic remark on the interweb, how exciting...
Still, I kind of agree. Less power fighting, more clever fighting.
Instead of how you are looking at it, I look at it like this.
The more kyubi chakra that is used, the faster he will get used to it. The faster he gets used to it, the faster the two chakras merge.
Kyubi cannot do anything but leak chakra behind the bars. Anything else has yet to be proven. We've seen naruto go berserk with the chakra, but the kyubi is far from berserk. Narutos just not at the ability to handle the power hes recieving.
Also, I think once the fourth had Kyubi sealed in him. It would make sense then for Kyubi to know the fourth.
I'm Agreed with Alu on the assumption that kyubi was once sealed in inside the fourth, if you recall a lot of the jounnins and even the hokage was kinda butthurt over Naruto using Kyubi powers because that meant that the seal was weakening. I think that someone will probably be telling Naruto soon that he'll have to find some ways of keeping kyubi under control. It would probably be boring and kinda lame if they told him that he couldn't use it because naruto really doesn't have too much control over it. Or perhaps I'm incredibly wrong and we're going to see some kyubi/naruto superbeing later on in the series.
Aw man! Did I call it or what! Posted this on 9/4.
Not 100% accurate, but damned close. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif[/img]Quote:
Originally posted by: obake
I dunno, it's gonna be hard to tell how it's going to turn out. I think Kakashi is going to get there, but not in time to prevent whatever is going to happen.
SPECULATION:
Perhaps the fight will escalate so much that the seal on the Kyuubi will be broken and it'll be freed. The seal weakens whenever Naruto goes all kyuubi-like, so if he "kicks it up a notch," it might unravel completely.
oh yeah..ehm..I neevr come here, but this Manga chapter was very interesting nad..how ever much you people believe it has nothing to do with DBZ and I quote:
Shonen Jump Question:
Ive heard that you where a huge fan of Akira Toriyamas "Dragon Ball" and "Dr. Slump". What was your favorite storyline of Dragon Ball? Or, if you prefer, who was your favorite character?
Masashi Kishimoto Answer:
I love all the stories up until the first appearance of Frieza. My favorite character is Kuririn, because he has the most "human" feel, and I really associate myself with him.
People that "love"DBZ up to the Freeza saga ..well.. are already influanced beyond human reach..
What "Power levels" are you guys talking about, everything is usually fucking explained in Naruto. Powerlevels have never been mentioned, not once have i seen Naruto just stand there and take a 2 hour beating like it was a two hour tickle fest as you see in dbz because of a silly "power level". To me it seems like you guys are using the wrong word. Sasuke's eyes as already stated above, only gave him more insight. And they did NOT appear out of no where the curse seal helped him with that as mentioned in the manga. The fox seems to be gaining a upperhand no naruto slowly, we do not know if the seal will ever come off completely or if there is a double-edge sword to it that affects only naruto personally.
Also what the hell? Powering up in which way you're all using it (DBZ) is standing there for 30 minutes grunting with a huge aura, NO one has ever done that in naruto. Kyubi chakra is just an effect, it's so massive that it's visible with life protecting Naruto. As for naruto not being able to deflect sasukes hits with the chakra, well he could see his movement before the chakra "reached and wrapped" Naruto's body it looked like (Not that sure, but it sounded like that from him explaining). It's a wonder i havent found any "OMFG DMC (Devil may cry) = DBZ!!" because of Dante's "powering up" as the game progresses and Devil Trigger, you silly people will always compare and look back at the first chance you get. Was it really that traumatizing? Dragonball Z i mean, you tell me.
great, first it was chambers, now it's this ?igma guy.
anyway
i don't know why it's such a surprise for you guys. it's not ridiculous at all. sasuke has gotten way stronger and it's only right that he can smash naruto in the face like that. think about this, when you try punching someone and before you can even extend your arm you're knocked right in the face. do you think you're gonna be completely fine? absolutely, not you're just not expecting something to happen like that and you're caught off guard. no matter how strong someone is, if they are caught off guard, it's gonna hurt way more than if they got when they're expecting it.Quote:
Originally posted by: chet_chetty
In the Haku fight, if Naruto was able to deflect ice spears (or kunai, cant remember) with chakra at a subconscious level, there's no reason why the same shouldnt happen when Sasuke is about to land a punch on him. If his Kyuubi powers were consistent (seems to be more of a storyline inconsistency), it shouldnt matter that Naruto didnt see the punch coming.
And Sidnne is right, Sasuke's taijutsu shouldnt even phase Naruto let alone require Kyuubi to transform him so he can stay in the fight. The only thing different about Sasuke is the third comma. As mentioned earlier he didnt get physically stronger so how ridiculous is it that Naruto got rocked so hard?
It seems like they're dumbing down Kyuubi Naruto for storyline's sake so Sasuke can go even w/ Naruto for most of the fight.
also, naruto can only deflect projectiles (whether they are needles or fire jutsus) when he expels chakra. he didn't do that when he got punched by sasuke.
you know what reminds ME of DBZ? when that main guy in YYH shoots spirit energy things at people......OMFG KAMEHAMEHA ROFL ROFL
seriously, get over it.....dont act like a noob hotsuma when you've been on the forms for so long. Every time someone brings up the debate, it's always concluded with the fact that "MOST LONG RUNNING ACTION SERIES BORROW ELEMENTS FROM DBZ"
i think transforming is cool. It's lame when it totally comes out of nowhere with seemingly no explanation, like "omfg freeza still has 5 more forms!!"...but with naruto and sasuke its totally acceptable.
and for those of you who miss the days when people were using strategy and doing creative things instead of brute force.....go read the shikamaru vs tayuya match again
THis chapter was awesome sasuke gonan get F*cked up ahah naruto's gonna eat him lol
have to agree with you on that.... characters from naruto don't get constipated while drawning out more chakra [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif[/img]Quote:
Originally posted by: Tap
Also what the hell? Powering up in which way you're all using it (DBZ) is standing there for 30 minutes grunting with a huge aura, NO one has ever done that in naruto.
on 230.... it was awesome seeing how sharingan works... no wonder the uchiha clan scared the shit out of everyone. i find the fight amusing, reminds me of two elementary school kids beating the hell out of each other.
Naruto rising in strength through Kyuubi is no different then Goku leveling up into the various versions of the SSJ forms. Coincidentially, they both have to start losing in order for that power to really kick in Just because it's "explained" doesn't mean shit. I can just as easily say "Well, Goku can turn into SSJ lvl infinity (like you Kyuubi fans are saying Naruto can become) because he's an alien, and has always had the powers in him." It would be no different than "Well, Naruto is simply tapping into the power more fully" Or "Well, Sasuke can lvel up more, because of that stupid pill" Taking the cannon out of the picture, it's still reminscent of the DBZ power battles, where a new power arrises (or just expands) when somebody starts to lose. And so on. It's an ongoing cycle, until one just *happens* to be at his or her limit and dies.
And that's what we've been seeing. Sasuke and Naruto fight. Both are fairly equal. Sasuke gets stronger, beats up Naruto. Naruto, then becomes even stronger than that, and beats on Sasuke. Sasuke becomes stronger than Naruto, and wins that round. Naruto becomes stronger AGAIN, and will probably end up beating on Sasuke for a while. Obviously, the next step in this ongoing cycle is Sasuke will reach level 2, and we're back at square one. Explain the "Well, it's okay, because -x- reason" all you want to me, or anyone else. As a fan, taking the official cannon out, and looking at the plot of events so far, this is no different than DBZ.
Most of the people here are going to be exagerrating the situation with a random number out of their ass, like "Naruto is only using .123456789134741 percent of Kyuubi's power (DBZ like again!). Sasuke can't win this.!!!!!11one" Not once do people try to explain it without having the Kyuubi's nuts in their mouth.
remember when yusuke was rising in strength through genkai's spirit ball thing? ah those were the days
hostuma,youre completely ignoring the underlying storyline of emotion,friendship and revenge that is driving each of the characters to reach their limits so they can accomplish their goals. Its like saying a marathon runner gets passed in the last 100 meters on the race and digs deep for extra energy to retake the lead and win the race. Its called perservarance and motivation. Its not like DBZ where they go in a room to purposely reach another level. Levels were never mentioned in naruto besides ninja rank and that means nothing. levels were in dbz from the start they had powerlevel readers for godsake.
And i still think sasuke wont use the curse seal he will realise he own individual potential.
Quote:
Originally posted by: Mut@t@
i don't know why it's such a surprise for you guys. it's not ridiculous at all. sasuke has gotten way stronger and it's only right that he can smash naruto in the face like that. think about this, when you try punching someone and before you can even extend your arm you're knocked right in the face. do you think you're gonna be completely fine? absolutely, not you're just not expecting something to happen like that and you're caught off guard. no matter how strong someone is, if they are caught off guard, it's gonna hurt way more than if they got when they're expecting it.
also, naruto can only deflect projectiles (whether they are needles or fire jutsus) when he expels chakra. he didn't do that when he got punched by sasuke.
I stand corrected. Sasuke did get physically stronger after he was "reborn" so I'll give him that. I just find it funny that Sasuke was able to land the blow in the first place. I dont belive, in the Haku fight, that Naruto actually saw those spears coming at him thus enabling him to shield them off w/ chakra. It seemed like 100% of his focus was pointed at mauling Haku and the chakra shielding was a subconscious act. It was a physicaly reaction rather than a mental one. It seems that they've built Naruto to have somewhat of a Gaara-like natural defense when he's in Kyuubi mode (again basing this on the Haku fight) but it doesnt make itself present in this current fight. That seems inconsistent.
Remember the time you edited that message becuase it's a damn spoiler for the last episodes?
geez, there's a diffrence between talking about Yusuke's reigun and his powerups (since they occured in the first 20 eps) and between blabbering about the end of the anime...
unfourtanly, i was long since spoiled with that piece of information, but it doesn't mean everyone should be...
i memory serves correct....didnt ewerybody in the 229 discusion say that the third dot i sasukes eye wouldt change a thing.....anyway a good chapter
You still don't get it, do you? I said, not taking the story into consideration (like revenge and stuff), it's STILL stuff we've seen before. It doesn't matter what the reason - that doesn't change the fact that we have seen this same cycle in a different series, which ultimately made it bad. What you're saying is "Well, it's ok that the fights become boring and their powers sky rocket, because of everything at stake." Maybe you're more forgiving than I am, but I'm only pointing this out, not to instigate this inane discussion of people denying obvious fucking facts with "justifications," but cause it's been done before and it is. boring.Quote:
Originally posted by: Guy
hostuma,youre completely ignoring the underlying storyline of emotion,friendship and revenge that is driving each of the characters to reach their limits so they can accomplish their goals. Its like saying a marathon runner gets passed in the last 100 meters on the race and digs deep for extra energy to retake the lead and win the race. Its called perservarance and motivation. Its not like DBZ where they go in a room to purposely reach another level. Levels were never mentioned in naruto besides ninja rank and that means nothing. levels were in dbz from the start they had powerlevel readers for godsake.
And i still think sasuke wont use the curse seal he will realise he own individual potential.
Umm... if naruto can recover from an impaled right lung (with sasuke's hand sticking out on the other side) within a few seconds, Sasuke's hits shouldn't have phased Naruto at all. Even if Sasuke's punch's power is combined with Naruto's own force running into it, it's nothing compared to a hole through the chest.Quote:
Originally posted by: Mut@t@
great, first it was chambers, now it's this ?igma guy.
anyway
i don't know why it's such a surprise for you guys. it's not ridiculous at all. sasuke has gotten way stronger and it's only right that he can smash naruto in the face like that. think about this, when you try punching someone and before you can even extend your arm you're knocked right in the face. do you think you're gonna be completely fine? absolutely, not you're just not expecting something to happen like that and you're caught off guard. no matter how strong someone is, if they are caught off guard, it's gonna hurt way more than if they got when they're expecting it.Quote:
Originally posted by: chet_chetty
In the Haku fight, if Naruto was able to deflect ice spears (or kunai, cant remember) with chakra at a subconscious level, there's no reason why the same shouldnt happen when Sasuke is about to land a punch on him. If his Kyuubi powers were consistent (seems to be more of a storyline inconsistency), it shouldnt matter that Naruto didnt see the punch coming.
And Sidnne is right, Sasuke's taijutsu shouldnt even phase Naruto let alone require Kyuubi to transform him so he can stay in the fight. The only thing different about Sasuke is the third comma. As mentioned earlier he didnt get physically stronger so how ridiculous is it that Naruto got rocked so hard?
It seems like they're dumbing down Kyuubi Naruto for storyline's sake so Sasuke can go even w/ Naruto for most of the fight.
also, naruto can only deflect projectiles (whether they are needles or fire jutsus) when he expels chakra. he didn't do that when he got punched by sasuke.
actually, the kyubi chakra does not act as a natural defense that is active all the time like gaara's sand. in both sources (manga ch. 28 and anime ep. 17), it clearly shows naruto exerting chakra outwards to deflect the needles away. they're all voluntary acts and they have not shown to act involuntarily.Quote:
Originally posted by: chet_chetty
I just find it funny that Sasuke was able to land the blow in the first place. I dont belive, in the Haku fight, that Naruto actually saw those spears coming at him thus enabling him to shield them off w/ chakra. It seemed like 100% of his focus was pointed at mauling Haku and the chakra shielding was a subconscious act. It was a physicaly reaction rather than a mental one. It seems that they've built Naruto to have somewhat of a Gaara-like natural defense when he's in Kyuubi mode (again basing this on the Haku fight) but it doesnt make itself present in this current fight. That seems inconsistent.
naruto healing immediately after getting impaled by a chidori and naruto getting knocked down by a punch have nothing to do with each other. i do not see the point of the comparison. plz explain how naruto's healing ability has anything to do with sasuke's punch being effective.Quote:
Originally posted by: randomguy
Umm... if naruto can recover from an impaled right lung (with sasuke's hand sticking out on the other side) within a few seconds, Sasuke's hits shouldn't have phased Naruto at all. Even if Sasuke's punch's power is combined with Naruto's own force running into it, it's nothing compared to a hole through the chest.
there needs to be some kind of chakra measurement readers in naruto that would be really cool i wish i could see who is stronger by just numbers it would rule beccause i wouldnt have to see them fight
let me explain how Sasuke punched worked, or better yet, i'll let you on a diffrenet example of it.
those of you who read\watched Hajime no ippo, there was the fight between Machita (or whatever he's called, Ippo's first rival) and Jimiy Hoppe (from taiwan), and there they disscussed the perfect counter, using both your enemies movements and you owns to deliever a finishing punch, Sasuke can do it with every strike, becuase of his sharingan.
Naruto's movement patteren leaves him vunrable on a few spots during a few moments, Sasuke can see those moments cordinate his attack even before Naruto gets in position, this way, Sasuke strikes are always 'critical hits', or 'natrual twenty'.
Sasuke doesn't need to be stronger than Naruto if he is able to slide in those hits, just like how Machita (or whatever his name is) wasn't one bit stronger than Jimiy Hoppe, and he still won.
I'm not talking about getting knocked down. I'm saying if Naruto can recover from an impaled lung, Sasuke's hits shouldn't hurt at all.Quote:
Originally posted by: Mut@t@
actually, the kyubi chakra does not act as a natural defense that is active all the time like gaara's sand. in both sources (manga ch. 28 and anime ep. 17), it clearly shows naruto exerting chakra outwards to deflect the needles away. they're all voluntary acts and they have not shown to act involuntarily.Quote:
Originally posted by: chet_chetty
I just find it funny that Sasuke was able to land the blow in the first place. I dont belive, in the Haku fight, that Naruto actually saw those spears coming at him thus enabling him to shield them off w/ chakra. It seemed like 100% of his focus was pointed at mauling Haku and the chakra shielding was a subconscious act. It was a physicaly reaction rather than a mental one. It seems that they've built Naruto to have somewhat of a Gaara-like natural defense when he's in Kyuubi mode (again basing this on the Haku fight) but it doesnt make itself present in this current fight. That seems inconsistent.
naruto healing immediately after getting impaled by a chidori and naruto getting knocked down by a punch have nothing to do with each other. i do not see the point of the comparison. plz explain how naruto's healing ability has anything to do with sasuke's punch being effective.Quote:
Originally posted by: chet_chetty
Umm... if naruto can recover from an impaled right lung (with sasuke's hand sticking out on the other side) within a few seconds, Sasuke's hits shouldn't have phased Naruto at all. Even if Sasuke's punch's power is combined with Naruto's own force running into it, it's nothing compared to a hole through the chest.
Quote:
Originally posted by: Death BOO Z
let me explain how Sasuke punched worked, or better yet, i'll let you on a diffrenet example of it.
those of you who read\watched Hajime no ippo, there was the fight between Machita (or whatever he's called, Ippo's first rival) and Jimiy Hoppe (from taiwan), and there they disscussed the perfect counter, using both your enemies movements and you owns to deliever a finishing punch, Sasuke can do it with every strike, becuase of his sharingan.
Naruto's movement patteren leaves him vunrable on a few spots during a few moments, Sasuke can see those moments cordinate his attack even before Naruto gets in position, this way, Sasuke strikes are always 'critical hits', or 'natrual twenty'.
Sasuke doesn't need to be stronger than Naruto if he is able to slide in those hits, just like how Machita (or whatever his name is) wasn't one bit stronger than Jimiy Hoppe, and he still won.
A hole in the chest sounds like a critical hit to me. End of story.
Quote:
Originally posted by: Mut@t@
great, first it was chambers, now it's this ?igma guy.
anyway
i don't know why it's such a surprise for you guys. it's not ridiculous at all. sasuke has gotten way stronger and it's only right that he can smash naruto in the face like that. think about this, when you try punching someone and before you can even extend your arm you're knocked right in the face. do you think you're gonna be completely fine? absolutely, not you're just not expecting something to happen like that and you're caught off guard. no matter how strong someone is, if they are caught off guard, it's gonna hurt way more than if they got when they're expecting it.Quote:
Originally posted by: chet_chetty
In the Haku fight, if Naruto was able to deflect ice spears (or kunai, cant remember) with chakra at a subconscious level, there's no reason why the same shouldnt happen when Sasuke is about to land a punch on him. If his Kyuubi powers were consistent (seems to be more of a storyline inconsistency), it shouldnt matter that Naruto didnt see the punch coming.
And Sidnne is right, Sasuke's taijutsu shouldnt even phase Naruto let alone require Kyuubi to transform him so he can stay in the fight. The only thing different about Sasuke is the third comma. As mentioned earlier he didnt get physically stronger so how ridiculous is it that Naruto got rocked so hard?
It seems like they're dumbing down Kyuubi Naruto for storyline's sake so Sasuke can go even w/ Naruto for most of the fight.
also, naruto can only deflect projectiles (whether they are needles or fire jutsus) when he expels chakra. he didn't do that when he got punched by sasuke.
whoooooo .. easy on the guy stuff, we don't know eachother I presume, just ?igma is enough.. don't get so familiar here.
But whatever you say, a naked DBZ comes down to this:
power->defeat-> more power-> win
Naked Naruto comes down to this:
Humor->storyline->power->storyline->defeat->humor->storyline->power-> win
so basically, not that much is different. I just think it can't be compared by what we have seen.
If you compare the visuals, there is in no way any connection to DBz.
If you compare the main focus, I think both are on equal lvl.
The visuals we see, as when Naruto "powers up" are there to make it look better, not because there is just this DBZ rip-off.
Naruto would be boring without some of those effects I suppose.
Although it would be stupid to deny any connection with DBZ.
you're trying to make a connection between healing and pain but you can't do that in this case. why shouldn't sasuke's hits hurt at all? naruto isn't invincible so if he is hit, it'll still hurt him. naruto is only 'fine' after he has healed up. the only way for naruto to be uneffected by sasuke's punches if naruto was invulnerable to all attacks. i think you're getting something confused here. the kyubi's healing powers do not make naruto not feel pain.Quote:
Originally posted by: randomguy
I'm not talking about getting knocked down. I'm saying if Naruto can recover from an impaled lung, Sasuke's hits shouldn't hurt at all.
?igma, who said we were familiar? "this ?igma guy" represents a description of a person who i'm not familiar with, if anything. but hey, you're probably correct considering you're 'smarter' than i am cuz you think the chidori can act as a magnetic force and i wasn't able to understand that.
I'm not talking about pain. I'm talking about the damage Naruto receives for the duration of the battle. Sure, he should feel "pain" upon taking the hit, but that shouldn't hurt him for the rest of the fight with his healing abilities.
the fourth did not have the kyubi sealed in him. how would he have done that even if it did happen?!Quote:
Originally posted by: Alu
Also, I think once the fourth had Kyubi sealed in him. It would make sense then for Kyubi to know the fourth.
ok, i can't give a completely clear answer to your question cuz only kishimoto is able to answer that, but my whole point on getting caught off guard still works. i don't think naruto is hurt real badly or anything, he just probably real surprised that sasuke whooped him so easily so he's probably stunned at that fact.
in the translations from that one guy before inane came out, kyubi said something along the lines of "kid, you should thank me.....and the 4th hokage who sealed me inside you"
while inane says "kid you should be thanking me....the one who sealed me, the 4th hokage....you're both alike"
i hate when that happens -_-
i dont get what people are complaining about though. I've never really seen an anime before that showed from the point of view of a character who could read the next move before it happens. Sure transforming can get redundant when used in alot of series, but here they took it a step beyond and showed sasuke's perspective, in how he can view what naruto's about to look like before he reaches that point, and leave it there until next week for you to see the full thing.
kishimoto is one artistically clever mofo
or maybe Kishimoto is trying to show that Sasuke's strength has increased soooo much (because of the rebirth) that his attacks could cause Naruto to be immobile, when this hasnt happened before. I dont think we've seen Naruto incapacitated from a taijutsu attack ever (unless maybe at the end of a battle). He always gets up (sometimes w/ the aid of Kyuubi chakra, but nothing so much as a transformation occuring) even if he's busted up. And all those times he got up, he wasnt even in Kyuubi mode; he was just normal Naruto getting up because of his willpower or drawing from Kyuubi's chakra (not the same as Kyuubi mode). In this case, he was transformed and still couldnt get up and it wasnt becuase he was stunned or surprised. This is why I was in disbelief that a simple kick could prevent Naruto from getting up. He was in too much pain cuz he was knocked the fug out? It's very difficult accepting that happening to Kyuubi mode Naruto. But since it did happen, I'm willing to say that Sasuke's current physical strength is the strongest we've seen in the manga thus far exceeded only by Tsunade or even that big sound four dude.
Excellent chapter, perfecto!
Something to consider is that chakra is used in Taijutsu. Remember way in the beggining of the story when we first met Lee, someone(i think sasuke) mentioned about weird chakra. And sasuke is now conserving chakra, so the third dot itself allows Sasuke to make all his blows "heavy"
This is because now he's not using any chakra until he goes for a blow, then uses a substantial amount of chakra for the blow.
the 3rd dot doesnt affect him physically......it just increases his awareness about chakra and movement
I liked it. And I am pleased that Kishimoto did not fulfill hotsumas dreams of a "dbz-unlike" anime.
- Sasuke and Naruto meeting
- Sasuke releases lvl 2 curse seal, 3rd dot and one chidori per arm
- Naruto summoning Gamabunta, freaking kyubi mode, kage-bunshins
-> one big clash (double page)
-> fight over.
It's the only way to possibly not use an "action / reaction" scheme for a fight. If you can't reduce a fight to a single clash, you will always find a power or technique that counters the previous attack and compare that to every other random anime that involves fighting.
Other than that, I liked 230.
I think if Gamabunta can do Kage Bunshin, well.......... the world is fucked.
"Attack of the huge yakuza frogs with snake skin wallets from space" anyone?
sigh. i just read 5 pages of naruto vs. DBZ. and im depressed that its gone on this long. anyways, hotsuma, at the end of the chapter i kinda felt like you. i thought the new kyuubi transformation was rather lame, but i decided to sit and think to myself and come up with an answer as to why kishimoto, being the genius that he is, decided this was the best path. this is what i came up with: 1) i think hes trying to make this fight last another full volume which should happen within the next 3 chapters, but that reasoning in and of itself is pretty lame ,so 2) naruto would be completely out classed otherwise. with sasukes speed and now the complete sharingan not even the kyuubi naruto we knew for so long was able to keep up. i think kishimoto wants to show us the level 2 sasuke, but if he is able to defeat naruto already, whats the point? personally i dont think that this new "level" of kyuubi is gonna mean jack shit, unless its like a million times faster. and 3) naruto eventually is going to have to face off against aktsuki members at a young age, and if sasuke, orochimaru, and kimimaro are making kyuubi naruto look nothing, what chances does he have against kisame, itachi and the rest (okay...so he will never have a chance against itachi...but thats what sasukes for). my theory for the next chapter is that naruto will gain the upper hand, but not to the level that he just beats the shit out of sasuke (we saw that like last week...i dont want to see someone completely own the other again like the past 2 weeks) and then sasuke will decide that its best for him to go level 2.
okay, ive decided.
gamabunta with kagebunshin can own itachi.
why do people find it lame when naruto gets more kyubi power, but not when sasuke gets a 3rd pupil for his sharingan? i dont get it
you act like the sasuke thing is different because we all knew there was a 3rd level to obtain, but dont tell me you honestly expected the extent of kyubi's power to be that lame-assed kyubi naruto mode that couldnt lay a finger on oro and 100 of whom were beaten easily by kimimaro......
just think about it......if sasuke's supposed to be as strong as kimi and kimi beat 100 kyubi clones, then wouldnt it be lame if naruto could beat sasuke without having to go to the next level?
you guys act like the only thing cool in action series these days is when people fake people out with henged shurikens......
geez, if every fight was about strategy, then wouldnt you think THAT would get boring?
do yourself a favor and dont get involved in any series that has more than 50 episodes in it.........k thx
Quote:
Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
do yourself a favor and dont get involved in any series that has more than 50 episodes in it.........k thx
And do yourself a favor by coming up with something more mature than "If you don't like a certain thing, don't watch it." choice.
Sasuke gaining an extra comma. Naruto gaining mountains of power. Makes no fucking difference. It's LAME.
Not to be a dick or anything, but the way you put it, it sounds like you're one of those people who just hate to admit that there are similarities between a good and bad series. Stop being such a fanboy man, damn.
Edit, oh and that henged shuriken was top tier. Nothing Naruto did was ever this cool. If I can see something as crazy as this from Naruto again, this anime would be perfect. But it doesn't, so too bad.
After some thinking, I have changed my mind. I realize now that Sasuke being able to hurt Naruto with his punches WAS EXACTLY what I was hoping and arguing for. You see, it is clear now that this fight is still based on skill and not raw power. If it was based on raw power, then Naruto would just stand there and take Sasuke's punches and say something lame like "Is that all you've got?"
It is actually more unlike DBZ (first time I have mentioned DBZ) because it would have been like Krillin trying to punch Cell, which had no effect.
I now like the fact that despite Naruto's transformation and power, he is still able to be hurt by Sasuke IF Sasuke is able to hit him. I look at it like this, if Naruto were to fight Orochimaru, Naruto would probably get beaten because Oro is just too powerful for him. But, if Naruto managed to land a punch on Oro, it would still hurt him. The trouble for Naruto would be having enough skill to actually land the punch.
I guess what I was hoping for before, was the 3rd doujutsu allowing Sasuke to only see and dodge and defend Naruto's attacks, but not actually allow him to stand and fight on par with Naruto. Then the transformation from the lvl 2 cursed seal would give him the strength required to make it an even fight where both had the same amount of raw power, and still had to use other jutsu's and strategies to win. This, IMO, would have eliminated the need for the 2nd transfomation by Naruto, which I'm still not a fan of.
I agree. The shadow shuriken was one of the best things that Naruto has ever done for several reasons. First off, with the kyuubi inside of him, we know that Naruto is powerful. But the characters in the series all consider Naruto an idiot, but the be able to devise a strategy so clever that it was successful against a jounin that gave Kakashi trouble, that IMO is very impressive. And secondly, that strategy combined the elements that were the basis for Naruto early in the series: Teamwork, never giving up, and not leaving a comrad behind.Quote:
Edit, oh and that henged shuriken was top tier. Nothing Naruto did was ever this cool. If I can see something as crazy as this from Naruto again, this anime would be perfect. But it doesn't, so too bad.
I don't think Naruto being in Kyuubi mode makes his defense godly. It does a lot, but taking a shot unscathed was never one of them. If that were the case, healing wouldn't be necassary.
Also, I think Naruto would be able to hurt Orochimaru w/a punch even when he's not in Kyuubi mode. Nobody in Naruto has that kind of defense. That's one of the non-DBZ like element of the series, which does hella lot for it. (Making Naruto, Naruto for one)
maturity has nothing to do with it. It's plain and simple....long running series tend to involve stuff like this, and if you cant handle it, then its not our problem, its not kishimoto's problem, its nobody's but your own.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
Quote:
Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
do yourself a favor and dont get involved in any series that has more than 50 episodes in it.........k thx
And do yourself a favor by coming up with something more mature than "If you don't like a certain thing, don't watch it." choice.
Sasuke gaining an extra comma. Naruto gaining mountains of power. Makes no fucking difference. It's LAME.
Not to be a dick or anything, but the way you put it, it sounds like you're one of those people who just hate to admit that there are similarities between a good and bad series. Stop being such a fanboy man, damn.
Edit, oh and that henged shuriken was top tier. Nothing Naruto did was ever this cool. If I can see something as crazy as this from Naruto again, this anime would be perfect. But it doesn't, so too bad.
and if you've been paying attention to the last several posts i left here, i was making comparisons between yu yu hakasho and dbz because I KNOW THAT ACTION SERIES RESEMBLE DBZ IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. It's a fact of life...and i have absolutely no problem with it. It's all about the execution, and frankly kishimoto's execution is far different than dbz's.
the problem people like you have.....is something like classical conditioning. You see stuff like energy beams and transformations and planets blowing up (all of these normally being cool action elements)
then you see long drawn out fights, entire episodes of nothing but powering up and repeated animations, and a recurring plot (all of these normally being bad elements), and since they are both in the same show, you associate the two.
therefore whenever you see energy beams, transformations, or planets blowing up, your response is its lame.
You don't have a problem with it. And honestly, I don't care that you don't either. What I think is ridiculous is you trolling me(and anybody else)by saying "If you don't like it, don't read it" when I've said for the umpteenth time that I'm STILL a fan of the series. Disliking something isn't necassarily a problem. It's just a disagreement, one that I can live with. (but I'll still rag on it) Especially for one damn fight. You're making this waaaaaay bigger than it really is. I'm saying it has DBZ elements plastered all over it, and that I dislike it. You're the fool that's taking it like I insulted your fucking religion.Quote:
Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
maturity has nothing to do with it. It's plain and simple....long running series tend to involve stuff like this, and if you cant handle it, then its not our problem, its not kishimoto's problem, its nobody's but your own.Quote:
Originally posted by: Hotsuma
Quote:
Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
do yourself a favor and dont get involved in any series that has more than 50 episodes in it.........k thx
And do yourself a favor by coming up with something more mature than "If you don't like a certain thing, don't watch it." choice.
Sasuke gaining an extra comma. Naruto gaining mountains of power. Makes no fucking difference. It's LAME.
Not to be a dick or anything, but the way you put it, it sounds like you're one of those people who just hate to admit that there are similarities between a good and bad series. Stop being such a fanboy man, damn.
Edit, oh and that henged shuriken was top tier. Nothing Naruto did was ever this cool. If I can see something as crazy as this from Naruto again, this anime would be perfect. But it doesn't, so too bad.
and if you've been paying attention to the last several posts i left here, i was making comparisons between yu yu hakasho and dbz because I KNOW THAT ACTION SERIES RESEMBLE DBZ IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. It's a fact of life...and i have absolutely no problem with it. It's all about the execution, and frankly kishimoto's execution is far different than dbz's.
Uh, no shit. It's kind of hard not to associate the two when they share that many similarities. And yes, it is lame. When you see everything mentioned above, I don't know a word that better describes it. You can preach to me all you want as to why it's happening (Because Naruto is so mad!!!111one), but that won't change a thing.Quote:
the problem people like you have.....is something like classical conditioning. You see stuff like energy beams and transformations and planets blowing up (all of these normally being cool action elements)
then you see long drawn out fights, entire episodes of nothing but powering up and repeated animations, and a recurring plot (all of these normally being bad elements), and since they are both in the same show, you associate the two.
therefore whenever you see energy beams, transformations, or planets blowing up, your response is its lame.
Do the board a favor. Shut the fuck up and let me think what I want, without trying to drive me away from the series.
Can't we all just be friends.... and hate sakura?
kids kids, please grow up.