86: Eighty-Six

https://i.imgur.com/0gWZP0j.png

"The Republic of San Magnolia has been at war with the Empire of Giad for nine years. Though it initially suffered devastating losses to the Empire's autonomous mechanized Legions, The Republic has since developed its own autonomous units, called Juggernauts, which are directed remotely by a Handler. While on the surface the public believes the war is being fought between machines, in reality, the Juggernauts are being piloted by humans and all of them are 86s, the designation given to the Colorata minority of San Magnolia who originally had equal rights as the dominant Alba race but were persecuted and scapegoated by the racist-led Alba government to the point the Colorata were considered not human, not allowed to have names and forced to live in internment camps in the 86th Ward while being forced to fight in the Republic's war with the Empire to get betterment.

Major Vladilena "Lena" Mirizé is an Alba noble and military officer in the Republic's Military who is assigned as a Handler of the Spearhead squadron of the eastern front, an elite unit composed entirely of 86s veterans who have earned names. Led by their squad leader, Shinei "The Undertaker" Nōzen, Spearhead squadron are infamous due to many Handlers who have commanded the squad having gone insane and some even committed suicide. As Lena gets to know Shinei and the rest of the Spearhead squadron, she becomes sympathetic to his people's plight and tries to help them. At same time, Lena and Shinei learn a dark secret: the Republic and the war with the Empire is not what it seems. "

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/86_(novel_series)

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That first episode was much better than I initially thought this show would be.
Only one gripe so far because it doesn't really made much sense to me from what little we got to know about the whole thing in 1 episode:

Why were they fighting without a Handler (the combat scene right before the end). I didn't expect them to be able to fight autonomously like that, without anyone watching/ordering them around.

Other stuff:

The art is cool, the female lead is pretty hot (for those that care), the mechas look well made.
It's interesting to see that the District 86 humans are seeing the 1-85 disctrict "humans" as "pigs" too.
I kinda wonder how exactly it came to be that everyone has the same hair and eye color.
It'd be weird for them to be clones... and not the other way around. But I guess that's the whole deal about this show, isn't it. The synopsis mentions the "Alba race" (which means "white race" - go figure) but... that's just some kind of human subspecies or an ethnic group of some kind, since they call themselves human either way.

There was a real energy to this production that made everything seem... needlessly lively. There was almost constant motion and hustle that was almost distracting, but still a joy to watch. I had some trouble following the implications of the story (I'm too used to anime dumbing things down for me), but by the end was totally on board. This is probably going to be a favorite that I hopefully will watch to completion (sorry Iron Blooded Orphans), based on episode one alone. There's always some extra bite in series where it is all but a given that named characters are going to die regularly.

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Originally Posted by neflight86

There was a real energy to this production that made everything seem... needlessly lively. There was almost constant motion and hustle that was almost distracting, but still a joy to watch. I had some trouble following the implications of the story (I'm too used to anime dumbing things down for me), but by the end was totally on board. This is probably going to be a favorite that I hopefully will watch to completion (sorry Iron Blooded Orphans), based on episode one alone. There's always some extra bite in series where it is all but a given that named characters are going to die regularly.

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I know the LN seems to be highly regarded, I recall shinta recommending it when there were a few volumes out (officially translated at least).

Will try it later.

Episode 2

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this show is super fun.
Undertaker is obviously super badass - yada yada I don't really care - but I kinda love the spider-bots and the whole idea of the "lore" so far.
So the Empire has sent these bots to conquer the republic but they themselves fell victim to their own creation?
Whether it's true or not, that's very interesting. Kinda makes you think what they did to the people living in that nation. Did Legion just kill everyone?
If they will really stop after 50.000 hours of operation time or not is questionable.

Undertaker ending his service next year is obviously very unbelievable too, considering that we haven't seen a single soldier so far that survived so long. I don't quite understand how that would work in the first place.
This war is over in 2 more years, why would they let anyone go before that happens.

You also start to wonder how other nations reacted, how big was that empire? Did it conquer the whole world? What did other nations do to fight against Legion?
How did the Republic survive exactly? Their weapons are inferior, how did they find the time to build that fortress and more importantly, where is that fortress? So far it looks like they are fighting in the ruins of District 86.

I also love the codenames.
Reminds me of Battletech.

I don't think ojou is going to get off with a simple hand slap after truthing students that hard...

I agree that Undertaker is in no way going to be eligible for release, and his expression kinda suggests he knows that, too.

The fight choreography is much more detailed than I was expecting, almost like Girls und Panzer- great job.

Yup, the whole 'the enemy was actually murdered by their own super weapons' has much more interesting implications than the typical melodrama of the other warring side's human perspective.

Episode 3

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Once more, this doesn't disappoint.
The presentation of this is really good. I liked that they didn't really show the fighting this time around and made it from the Major's POV this time around.
The animation is really good too.

So far, it seems like it will be the winner for me, this season.

Codename: "Wehrwolf" - that's a good one, although tainted by WW2 history.

The first episode was kinda bland, but the 2nd and 3rd more than made up for it.

The girls all shifting to a proper shooting stance within a second at the river was a really nice touch from so many series where they play military but don't react like they are.


A bit confused about what the intention is with the "white-savior" dual narrative they have going. Are they going for a savage critique of it, or is the author trying to redeem the shitty narrative trope?

• The 86ers view her as one, annoyed by her nightly calls and enraged by her sympathy for their losses (though it is genuine coming from her even if they don't believe her).
• Vladilena views herself a more enlightened citizen who cares about the 86ers as actual people and is willing to get in trouble over it, which definitely makes her a "white-savior" who thinks she's the only one who can get them out of this mess and treat them like people again. Sure, she doesn't call them "Eighty-sixers," but she does still call them "Processors" and it does show the hollowness of her concern, which was emphasized by the rant post-credits.
• They show the 'elite' citizens as lazy, drunk, incompetent, etc, outside of a very few. If the war actually ends (I'm going to guess now that it wouldn't even if the robots finally did get exhausted), the 86ers could probably overrun the silver-haired elites easily.
• Vladilena actually being a competent commander by Shin's quiet admission at the end of episode 2, and dedication into looking for the maps with the intent to send them along somewhat undermines the dual narrative, because she actually is a good tactical commander which ends up reinforcing the whole "white-savior" aspect of the series.

The obvious takeaway that, "They're supposed to work together!" still dips its toes in the idea that only an elite and priveledged ojou-san who happens to be a gifted military commander can really save them. Shin and his senior personnel (Daiya, Anju) are obviously extremely competent and the only thing holding them back from not even needing Vladilena is the more up to date tactical information she provides.

I guess...is the author trying to have Vladilena realize she's being a white savior, or is the end goal to make Shin and the rest of the squad accept her as their white savior?

All in all, not bad. The series isn't as overhyped as I expected. It's like a version of Schwarzesmarken/MuvLuv that doesn't suck.

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Originally Posted by Ryllharu

The first episode was kinda bland, but the 2nd and 3rd more than made up for it.

The girls all shifting to a proper shooting stance within a second at the river was a really nice touch from so many series where they play military but don't react like they are.


A bit confused about what the intention is with the "white-savior" dual narrative they have going. Are they going for a savage critique of it, or is the author trying to redeem the shitty narrative trope?

• The 86ers view her as one, annoyed by her nightly calls and enraged by her sympathy for their losses (though it is genuine coming from her even if they don't believe her).
• Vladilena views herself a more enlightened citizen who cares about the 86ers as actual people and is willing to get in trouble over it, which definitely makes her a "white-savior" who thinks she's the only one who can get them out of this mess and treat them like people again. Sure, she doesn't call them "Eighty-sixers," but she does still call them "Processors" and it does show the hollowness of her concern, which was emphasized by the rant post-credits.
• They show the 'elite' citizens as lazy, drunk, incompetent, etc, outside of a very few. If the war actually ends (I'm going to guess now that it wouldn't even if the robots finally did get exhausted), the 86ers could probably overrun the silver-haired elites easily.
• Vladilena actually being a competent commander by Shin's quiet admission at the end of episode 2, and dedication into looking for the maps with the intent to send them along somewhat undermines the dual narrative, because she actually is a good tactical commander which ends up reinforcing the whole "white-savior" aspect of the series.

The obvious takeaway that, "They're supposed to work together!" still dips its toes in the idea that only an elite and priveledged ojou-san who happens to be a gifted military commander can really save them. Shin and his senior personnel (Daiya, Anju) are obviously extremely competent and the only thing holding them back from not even needing Vladilena is the more up to date tactical information she provides.

I guess...is the author trying to have Vladilena realize she's being a white savior, or is the end goal to make Shin and the rest of the squad accept her as their white savior?

All in all, not bad. The series isn't as overhyped as I expected. It's like a version of Schwarzesmarken/MuvLuv that doesn't suck.

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I interpreted it as the typical white savior "but what if they were self aware and actually strove to add value" type of spin. I don't hate the character at all, even if the 86ers are far more interesting, I am curious to learn more about how the previous handlers were being killed / if there is power or tech that could change the power dynamic no longer making the op a "white savior". Just musings at this point.

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Originally Posted by exglitch67

I interpreted it as the typical white savior "but what if they were self aware and actually strove to add value" type of spin. I don't hate the character at all, even if the 86ers are far more interesting, I am curious to learn more about how the previous handlers were being killed / if there is power or tech that could change the power dynamic no longer making the op a "white savior". Just musings at this point.

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I don't hate or even dislike Vladilena, I find her naiveté interesting considering that she's one of the only Alba's under 30 that has apparently seen 86ers, and moreover, actually been to the battlefield at all.

Like she's halfway there to figuring it out, and she just got chewed out by people she tries to treat with respect but still didn't quite get there.

The one that cut the hardest was when he called her out for never asking their real names. All she ever sees is the names on the screen and the voices that go with them. She keeps detailed notes about whatever they're actually sharing with her in her bedroom notebook, but since she can only hear them, she doesn't have a face to associate to.

So, from that aspect, it is also on the 86ers (and the government separation of the districts and 86th). They can lie to her all they want, and since she's innocent, good natured, and "virgin like," she'll believe it. It's hard to put all the blame on her when she's is showing some level of interest, and they have lied to her several times.

It's a "fun" anime, but it's really held back by the generic character designs imo. Especially the main girl just looks like a thousand other anime girls I've seen before. Just last week, the heroine of Tales of Arise was shown and she looks awfully close. Just too generic. I wish this series had a bigger budget for higher quality animation.

Btw which girl was Kirschblüten again?

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Originally Posted by MFauli

It's a "fun" anime, but it's really held back by the generic character designs imo. Especially the main girl just looks like a thousand other anime girls I've seen before. Just last week, the heroine of Tales of Arise was shown and she looks awfully close. Just too generic. I wish this series had a bigger budget for higher quality animation.

Btw which girl was Kirschblüten again?

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I think it was the girl with red hair that was mad at Undertaker for spending time talking to the Valdilena?

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Originally Posted by exglitch67

I think it was the girl with red hair that was mad at Undertaker for spending time talking to the Valdilena?

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would make sense that they kill the girl they focused on the most earlier, yeah.

It was the black-haired girl who so thoughtfully told Vladilena she didn't hate her, and set several death flags this episode.

edit:
Ugh, the official website updates episode to episode. Definitely wasn't the redhead.

It was the black haired girl who kinda liked her new handler.

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I wish this series had a bigger budget for higher quality animation.

Btw which girl was Kirschblüten again?

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The animation is pretty good, especially character animation.
And I don't think she looks alike to the Tales of Arise character.
At least not more than any other anime girl.

She looks way more similar to Esdeath - but that's anime for you.

I guess I don't really get what makes a 'white savior' story archetype, aside from the literal interpretation that she is essentially albino.

She has a job which she got from a combination of privilege (right race in this world) and talent/skill (is a good commander). She sees humanity in and is trying to connect with her jaded team, and they reject her as they have had no confidence instilled in them by their previous handlers. She still endeavors to help, and it doesn't always work, so her team vents at her over the loss of one of their own, harshly. It seems more complicated than simply being a satire or reinforcement. I like the contrast her scientist friend brings to gain a perspective that the rest of their society has on these matters.

Side note- when she was frantically looking at the map before the unit died, was the implication that her instructions got her killed, or that she just didn't realize/warn her in time?

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Side note- when she was frantically looking at the map before the unit died, was the implication that her instructions got her killed, or that she just didn't realize/warn her in time?

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She isn't exactly ordering everyone around all the time. She didn't warn her in time, that's all.

I wonder why the Löwe was there all alone though.
Pretty weird tactics for full AI forces imho.

Episode 5

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all right, this is really interesting now. And super scary too.

Indeed.

This went from, "I wonder what's going to happen as the Alba realize that they're generally all losers who couldn't fight their way out of a shopping frenzy and now the extremely experienced soldiers in the 86ers decide they don't really need to follow their orders at the end of the war," to straight-up Muv Luv "We're going to lose, unequivocally," type stuff.

Things start to add up, like why they made sure the wounded or killed are brought back if possible, shot in the head or burned otherwise, and he only takes mech fragments as grave markers. Also the ominous line, "I'm looking for my brother."

We also got some evidence that their society used to be comingled, with the fashion billboard and Undertaker's backstory that he and his brother used to live in the city center of all places, District 1, not just one of the other 85. Someone decided to segregate their population first, then forge forward with racism, then dehumanize them.

Nope. Just child soldiers left, and a dwindling few at that.

How high up the military does the knowledge go? Her father was pretty high ranking, and thought there would be eventual peace after the fighting ended. Some AoT type stuff?

Much more interesting, indeed. I also got some muv-luv vibes. It is always more scary when the ones who understand the danger are in no decision making capacity, and in this case, not really incentivized to share that information. Too bad the show didn't foreshadow this with a brief 'retrieval' scene in an earlier episode, like after a credit roll or the like, but that is a nitpick.

Excited to see what happens next.

I just wonder what could possibly happen in the next few episodes.
The 1-85ers are not going to fight this war themselves or send backup.
I can imagine the MCs of this show are going on the hunt for the shepherds, but would that even stop anything?

I have to admit, I didn't quite understand the "brain" stuff.
So... the brains of people are used as processor units for the legion (this is probably why Undertaker is called a processer himself, because the Alba "fake" the whole Legion System themselves)?
And currently, the Alba-doctrine thinks that the "current" brains expire in the next few years.
The 86ers however think that they will just be replaced by the brains of the fallen? As we can imagine happened to MCs brother.

I think those are the main implications, yes. Seemingly the electronic brains have a shelf life, but there are potentially way more machines lying in wait, preparing for a massive attack with the shepherds?

The Alba military brass are right, the Legion hardware has a time limit.

But their handler levels at least (Majors and down) are not aware that the Legion AI figured out a workaround, which is to just scavenge any neurons they can find. Conveniently people are the best replacement, and intact brains are actually even better than the original hardware.

Mostly intact brains (dead or still alive at the time they were incorporated TBD) are shepards, dead and broken brains are ghosts and don't do much more than the original electronics.

The shepards have been holding the mass of the Legion back to assault the 85 districts once 86 is finally exhausted and get all the replacement "hardware" they need.

Episode 7

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I have no idea what the Alba military is planning or thinking.

Considering how limited the ressources are that are available to them. Their plans seem to be so wasteful right now.
I understand that they are delusional, but that's more on the "common soldier" command level, right?.

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Originally Posted by KrayZ33

I have no idea what the Alba military is planning or thinking.

Considering how limited the ressources are that are available to them. Their plans seem to be so wasteful right now.
I understand that they are delusional, but that's more on the "common soldier" command level, right?.

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There's an argument to be made that 86 is honestly just a rehash of Muv Luv Alternative with less gore and less fanservice with a few other war based scifi series. It is starting to converge on exactly that with this episode and I'm honestly a little disappointed.

Total Eclipse and Schwarzenmarken were both bad, but the proper series is coming this year, with early 2000s physically-impossible hair styles and everything. 86 is reusing the suicidal squad from Schwarzenmarken, and the separation of the culturally elite angle from Total Eclipse as well. It's also grabbing elements from the main series I won't elaborate on.

The Alba in 86 are wholly incompetent unless there's another twist coming like they are fully aware and are just desperately hoping to have the Legion commit genocide for them. They're probably just blind to it all outside of that particular range. Maybe it is a mix because they are so deathly afraid of putting their morons on the back lines for propaganda purposes that she can't get artillery support and the 86ers have never seen them used to begin with.

edit:
Well, wouldn't you know? The author lists Muv-Luv, Screamers, and Code Geass Akito as her inspirations for 86. I suppose I'll concede to some of the things I said since they're open about it.

Yeah, the whole 'we know we're not getting reinforcements' reveal fell a bit flat. We all saw it coming, but the opportunity to make it gripping was the twist of the reason why, but even that was limp. Them being sentenced to die fighting (and seeing enough good in the Alba to want to save some of them; hence no surrender) feels contrived to make this scenario feel a bit too hopeless, without the emotional weight to sympathize with these characters. A stronger, more utilitarian revelation as to why they continue to fight, like their families being 'detained' or something, would have been much more interesting than some mere sentimentality for people they openly despise.

Maybe the Alba and its brass really do believe the war will be over after the two years?

Episode 8


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I guess the only real surprise this episode was Henrietta was Shin's neighbor, and that she personally finished the Para-RAID. The rest of this was stuff spelled out items that have been easy to piece together for quite a while now. The atrocities, the racism, the deliberate extermination, Shin's brother losing his shit, etc.

But it does seem like the military has no fucking clue that the Legion reinforces itself with dead bodies. They won't listen to the 86 outside the walls obviously, so they have no idea that they're going to lose horribly once the 86 are all dead or incorporated into the Legion.

My guess is Lena has been quiet because she's working out how to get the big artillery batteries working again.

Oh wow, that last scene was absolutely awesome.
It's quite interesting that Henrietta knows Shin too.


My only gripe, once more, is that te military is so dumb about how they waste their "ressources" (in this case, 86ers).
I just can't believe that they have no clue about what's happening outside but maybe it's more believable than I'd like to accept.

Such a lame attempt from Henrietta to shame Lena btw. Her arguments made no sense.
How is she to blame that she uses the PARA-RAID system when she didn't even know about how it came into existence. You can't even blame that one on ignorance.

Super hyped about any future development regarding the world building.
Which countries are alive, is it a AoT scenario or is there other stuff going on.
How do other empires fight against the Legion and stuff like that.

Episode 9


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Alright, that was a really good episode.

I was right that Lena was trying to get the mortars working again, but I was pleasantly surprised that she was bullying Annette into helping her actually do it. Overall, Annette's arc has been kinda short, a little abbreviated, but really good nevertheless. They're certainly not wasting Sugiyama Riho's vocal talents and range here.

The nanite ghost hands were really fucking weird though.

Hopefully Lena won't get in too much trouble because she and her forces did manage to kill a Shepard, which puts the Legion at a significant disadvantage for the near term. But then again, if the goal is to use military service to exterminate the 86ers, she's probably going to get in a LOT of trouble. I wonder if she might even get thrown out into the 86th district. We only learned a few episodes ago that there are or at least were some Alba out there.

Uff.. that last scene was pretty impactful.

Made her really feel like she can't do anything for them all over again.
That's just too sad.

The spider lily didn't help either... I remember reading up on them a while ago because they appear in quite a lot of anime.
Aside from their connection to death, they are also said to bloom when you see someone for the last time.

I'm a big dummy. Someone please break it down for me. What is the significance of the 86es actions after the fight? Did they go AWOL? The way they were speaking sounded like they were not, but they weren't destroyed, either, so I don't get what was going on. What is this sorrowful BGM and framing that sounds like something bad happened/is happening?

They are continuing the suicide mission they were sent on. If they try to return to base, they will be treated as traitors and killed. So they decided to go through with the mission into enemy territory, knowing they will not survive.

Gotcha, thanks. What confused me is that controller girl was acting like somehow their situation had changed, or like some new revelations upset her. I guess she wasn't thinking ahead after this battle that their situation wasn't any better. Kind of odd to me that that realization gets the 'season finale' treatment.

As she was running across the city, I was starting to wonder if the twist was going to be that the 86th district is far outside the other 85, and they were approaching the city and would be executed by artillery on the walls. Meaning that the Legion is between the city and the 86ers, and the Legion isn't attacking the city for whatever reason, and it was all a front to exterminate the other "races." Mostly because she freaked out when they mentioned the spider lillies, and there were some on the banks of the river inside the city as she approached the bridge.

Thankfully, I was wrong, but that scene was really confusing. What point did it serve that Lena was running across the city?

Then I realized she was scrambling to stay in range on the Para-RAID.

Unfortunately, I'm not feeling this anime. I'll finish it now that it's almost over. But the cheap animation and generic character designs really hurt it imo. I wish this had a more distinctive style like, say, Gundam Iron Blooded Orphans, so I'd feel more attached to each individual. But as is, they're just random anime characters to me, including the pretty girl with the silver hair. Also while the story is going for some plot twists, the whole thing is just too shallow for my taste, starting with the genius that survives every battle.

The story had potential, but imo failed to make use of it.

Honestly, I'm more intrigued than ever. There's a second season coming up, and I have no idea where the story is going to go because right now it feels like it is wrapping up or headed for a reset (e.g. all but Shin dies, who hides in the outlands for a year or so, Lena gets a new bunch of death-sentenced operators to command).

Are the remaining spearheads going to die? We don't even know the background of two of them as it stands. Will the survivors of spearhead go back once they find something huge? Are they going to make it fully past the Legion's borders? Is there anything out there, or is the whole region an isolated lockdown by the rest of the world? Are the 86 districts of the republic all that's left? Is Lena going to get court-martialed? Will the military that knows the truth (if there even is any) be happy with her that she was leading her forces in battle and they managed to kill a Shepard? Will they try to silence her, we know the racists MPs and propagandists are already furious with her because she openly refers to the processors as humans. Will she leave the safety of the city like a few of the very early Alba who wanted to fight alongside the 86ers the racists cast out as fodder.

Tons of unanswered questions right now. Knowing that the series is openly inspired by the franchises it is similar to, rather than being a derivative copy of them turned me around on the series.

The supply robot getting blown to bits after the credits this episode, 15 days from now, was rather sad, considering its own backstory was being left behind as the sole survivor of the last group it was deployed with.

I forgot about the handler girl. I expect she will be in the next batch of juggernaut riders for her insubordination, and will be the character who has seen both sides. I expect she will struggle with the next as her peers until Reaper somehow returns to help when things get the most dicey. Anime 101.

I guess the 86 are just living on the lamb for now in legion territory, right? They have no actual reason to press forward with their suicide mission?

The way my brain works, I just do not follow dates on a screen as a valid time reference. Thankfully the time jumps here aren't too non-sequential, but it would lose me fast if they were.

86 - Eps 11 (season 1 end)


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Well that was kind of a bummer end to this season. Guess we'll see in the next cour.

I did like it overall though. So far at least, it isn't anything particularly amazing, but it is both brutal and consistent throughout.

Interested into seeing what Lena does in the next two weeks of this to match up with the Spearhead's timeline.

I guess the robot didn't "die" after all, he just can't be fixed by the remnants of Spearhead. So if Lena or her new squad gets out that far, they might figure something out about their final moments.

I have no idea what happened in this episode. The most "whatever" finale I've ever seen. So Shin and everyone just died. And pretty princess soldier feels guilt again, uhuh.

I guess for magical reasons, Shin and the others will keep their consciousness even when they're turned into machines, so that some drama can happen.

Will not keep watching, unless I'm seriously bored.

Sometimes, a show being thoroughly solid (having no major weaknesses) is a great strength. 86 is such a show.

We're not raving about the story, characters, or execution, but it is very competently directed and made, and the premise is being slowly fulfilled. The second season is an easy 'yes' from me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MFauli

I have no idea what happened in this episode. The most "whatever" finale I've ever seen. So Shin and everyone just died. And pretty princess soldier feels guilt again, uhuh.

I guess for magical reasons, Shin and the others will keep their consciousness even when they're turned into machines, so that some drama can happen.

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Or they didn't die, and that's why there is a 2nd season?

After skimming through the recap episode for any extra scenes (and there is one visual segment at the very very end), it is definitely far more ambiguous whether or not they all died in the final scene of the 86ers. Did they die, or is it just Shin imagining it as he's passes out?

- After taking down his brother, it's true that Shin didn't really have anything else he wanted to do, and was more concerned about saving his friends.
- Their plan was to escape beyond the ruins of the country the Legion came from and see what's there, since they're not exactly abandoning their posts because the Alba sent them off on a suicide mission. Those five are just actually very good at survival and combat.
- The five of them were actually pretty close to a border when Shin cut the rest of them off and tried to give the other four an opening to make it through.

What the visual at the end represents really depends on what kind of series this really is.

- Is it a post-apocalypse world where zombie robots have taken over the entire continent, and the Alba and the 86ers are the only humans left?
- Is it one where the Republic is surrounded by the Legion, but the Legion focuses on the easy target of the 86ers who are outside any walls and are given no real support from their home country hoping to get at the Alba who are all but defenseless? The zombie processors are all full of spite for the Alba as well. There should be other countries out there, since the Legion can't fly (as far as we know).

Season 2 start!

Eps 12
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That was both eye opening, though maybe expected to some degree.

That Lena and Annette still getting along was especially surprising.

So Giad, as an Empire at war with San Magnolia, created the Legion. Then when their war machines went out of control and turned on them, overthrew their own Emperor, and somehow managed to survive? Very interesting. The actual remaining Empress is tucked away as an adoptive daughter to the current President. But they're also isolated by their own rogue machine army, just like San Magnolia is. Lost a lot of their territory between the 86th district of San Magnolia, but otherwise still thriving and apparently more modern than their neighbor at this point. Starting to feel like some influence from another series where it opens in the one remaining city left...until it isn't. At least we know the author does love making thematic homages to the other franchises that have influenced her.

The Giad president seems like a zealot to some degree, but in a positive way. He seems quite against sending children to war like San Magnolia, but he also has this air of shadiness about him. Why keep the deposed child Empress so close to him? The remainder of Spearhead makes more sense, they're an enormous source of intel into how the Legion has evolved.

San Magnolia on the other hand, has continued to fester in the two months since the last season closed. There's a lot more crumbling things in the headquarters, more trash, etc. They must finally be starting to break from the strain as well. Seems like Lena's new superior has some knowledge of how bad the war is going.

Lena's insubordination and her little gathering of allies setting the stage to fend off a very bad surge in Legion activity, I take it? The talk between Lena and her new squad leader Cyclops makes it sound like they're just continuing to build up around various points that lead to the other 85 districts, and the "20% of howitzers are still operational," made it sound like either the upper military has been lying to all their operators this whole time (and they do very much work and should have been used more), or that the city won't be in a position to defend itself when they run out of 86ers to throw at the Legion.

It's worrying how little inter entire empires/states have about the survival of other such entities. Isn't long distance communication possible, or is it only that squad with the ear bands? If the Legion's numbers have effectively cut other nations off from each other, I figure they would have won and finished picking off humanity by now.

There's been enough cast death, but all five of the suicide soldiers making it feels like a wasted opportunity.

Is it me, or does this new state seem somewhat less advanced, technologically speaking, than San Magnolia? Brick structures and older looking vehicles, it seems.

They were all amazed with the technology that Annette had completed for the Republic.

I don't know if they've ever explained what the cloud of flying Legion do. I just assumed they were visual and radio jammers because that kind of stuff always is. A quick and very careful look (to avoid spoiling myself!) on the 86 Wikia says that the "Eintagsfliege" Legion are exactly that, electronic disruption that scrambles radar and all communication, allowing the Legion to fight disoriented and uncoordinated biological enemies. They also apparently serve the same purpose the Laser-class BETA do in Muv-Luv, preventing air combat units.

Annette perfected extending psychic communication, so it works around the flying bugs.

The Federation got torn apart by their own rogue AI army, so probably. But they also have aircraft and San Maganolia doesn't have anything more the helicopters that are extremely vulnerable outside the walls of the main districts.

The Legion seems mostly directed at annihilating San Magnolia, who was at war with the Empire before they had their own civil war and the Legion went rogue.

Eps 13
-------------



Interesting that the childlike Empress has confirmed clairvoyance running in her family. That makes two hereditary families with esper abilities, including Shin's. It's a good way to continue that worldbuilding thread by keeping it limited and secretive. I don't really understand how she talks to intelligently given her apparent age, but it was a least hinted heavily by her embarrassment when she's acting (poorly) to pass as a child that she's older than she looks.

It was also sweet that the five of them were basically waiting on Kurena to say she'd had enough. Especially she's the youngest in the entire squad (including those who have already died last season). They all knew each other well enough that they ultimately wanted to go back to the field despite the President's insistence.

I'm guessing the first thing we'll see at officer's school is their criticism of the heavy slow tanks, in favor for the prototypes that the other woman wanted them to consult on anyway.

I'm half expecting them to be idolised at officer school, and half expecting them to be discriminated against for gaining "easy entry". I have no idea what to expect of this place right now.

As for the president, he seems a bit shady because of his facade, and also because he seems to have this clear idea of what "humanity" should be like. Right now it seems fair, but when it becomes twisted, he'd be the same as the Alba who denounce 86er's humanity because it doesn't suit theirs.

(I just binge watched this show. Pretty nice. Not sure how redundant it would be watching Muv Luv Alternative though)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

(I just binge watched this show. Pretty nice. Not sure how redundant it would be watching Muv Luv Alternative though)

---

It's one of the author's direct influences for this series (along with Geass Akito and Screamers). Now that we know more about the world outside of the Republic, I have strong suspicions she's made the series different enough.

You can feel the references in the last arc, but it is definitely its own thing now.

I never finished Geass Akito but I see the references there. This MC actually also fights a lot like the MC from Iron Blooded Orphans.

Couldn't adjust to civilian life and only one of them bothered to get a job?

Princess had me fooled in that I assumed she really was twelve (thanks, anime) and eye-rolled at her little speech, so I'm glad to be corrected. Is she saying one of her close friend/family is also a shepherd?

Well, I mean for reference in the first arc last season (oldest to youngest):

- Theo is 16
- Shin is 16
- Raiden is 16, he got a job
- Anju is 16, she took cooking classes with adults!
- Kurena is 15 (she was conscripted at 11), and she was sent to school in the Federacy

Episode 14

-------------------





Can't say I'm happy that we're getting Empress instead of Lena as "mascot/cute leader/Shin's confider" but it's probably better than anything else on the cards. I'm not sure exactly what her deal is, but she fits the cute but also smart/insightful mix well enough. I think she's actually a kid, but occasionally acts mature because of Clairvoyance and Royal Experience.

I enjoyed the mecha fight. Good that the CG looks nice and not like complete ass, while Shin's Dulahan motif has a head to signify that his brother's brain has been accounted for. I'll take the multiple cuts over clunky animation any day (though of course slick animation/rendering would be best).

It looks like the Federacy military isn't very competent either, though they do manage to take back some territory.

It's a nice dichotomy from the Republic, who is vicious, brutal and uncaring to their soldiers, but achieve significant military success with some decent strategists like Lena, Shin, Anju, Cyclops (lLena's new Shin) and develops extremely competent operators like the previously mentioned as well as Kurena and Theoto. It doesn't make it right, but their Baptism by Fire methods have kept the Republic still alive long after they should have been destroyed.

The Federacy does care for their soldiers deeply, and they're all volunteer rather than conscriptions, but they don't have the inherent recklessness they need to fight the Legion. Their tank-like mechs are too slow because they care about safety that ultimately ends up futile.

So we end up with two contrasting forces that are equally not equipped or willing to take the correct level of risk involved to actually stop the Legion at this point.

Kinda disappointed in the character development so far. They've been focusing heavily on Shin regaining some emotions, but I'm just as interested in Theo, Anju, Kurena, and Raiden. Most of them are still underdeveloped at this point. Eugene is killed off to early to make his death actual hurt. He showed up before, befriended Shin, then reappears and immediately starts throwing every death flag imaginable.

Not a bad episode, their commitment to the horrors of war is impressive, but it wasn't a particularly good episode either.

I don't have a clear idea (as with many shows airing right now) where this story is going, and am trying to put aside the default notion that 86 is treading water and does have some major paradigm shift coming to make things more interesting again. Stalemates are where war stories begin, but we should be past this by now.

Episode 16
-------------


This was another really strong episode. I do like that this series tends to ramp up in each arc, starting from a relatively cliché series of events and character developments before diving into more complex takes on those tropes. It really lends to driving me further away from my initial impressions of the franchise. The series is derivative, but in a different definition of the word. It isn't lacking in originality, though it does build heavily on preconceived settings before goes in towards better, more nuanced directions. It is in no means shallow and redundant.

Yes, the 86ers are all really good at piloting. Even better when properly equipped, maintained, and managed by decent commanders. They all have their specialized kits on their machines now to excel at their particularly unique strengths (or generic all rounder skills).

But Shinei in particular isn't mentally any stronger than anyone else. Frederica's vision, and then freaking out that he was becoming eerily closer to the behavior of her bodyguard-retainer was quite touching. He was getting bloodthirsty and detached. Frederica doesn't want another monster to appear in front of her from the previous horror she has experienced.

I guess the rot in San Magnolia has reached a critical point. They're done for. Hopefully Lena doesn't kill herself using a supercharged PARA-RAID.

Quite the second cliffhanger though!

Fredrica's dead dear-someone is the legion Shepheard orchestrating this massive attack, correct? And it also somehow sent an explosion into their position in the post credit scene?

I think this is really well made, but for some reason, I find it really hard to follow the story, scene to scene sometimes.

Their one little super squad bought enough time to let the other defenders get into better position, and the same attack time led to the 86 vanguard of the Magnolia finally giving it up (losing) and they got invaded?

Uncle's determination to be racist to the bitter end was pretty funny, in a "I've heard that's how racism works" naïve kind of way. Not enough people hate others more than they love themselves, when given time to process, emotion subsides and pragmatism takes over. Maybe the show was suggesting, at this final scene, that he was actually resentful of his country for its policies, and I'm willing to buy that, but you kinda have to dig for it.

Another small thing that throws me off is that they keep discussing cardinal attack directions, as if these countries were all little islands, which makes since if they have no communication with each other, but the dead space between them is hard to reconcile. If it is flooded with legion, how has anyone survived what should be a never ending assault? If it isn't, why don't the surviving countries have military caravans, exploration/scouting, or trade established with each other? Since the countries apparently aren't butting up against each other, I would like some accounting of that space.

All of this complaining is in service to better visualizing the conflict, because that itself is interesting. This has the rare achievement of selling me on humanity versus a formidable foe without resorting to supernatural constrainments. I want to be fully on-board.

Quote:

---

Fredrica's dead dear-someone is the legion Shepheard orchestrating this massive attack, correct? And it also somehow sent an explosion into their position in the post credit scene?

---

That is correct.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by neflight86

Another small thing that throws me off is that they keep discussing cardinal attack directions, as if these countries were all little islands, which makes since if they have no communication with each other, but the dead space between them is hard to reconcile. If it is flooded with legion, how has anyone survived what should be a never ending assault? If it isn't, why don't the surviving countries have military caravans, exploration/scouting, or trade established with each other? Since the countries apparently aren't butting up against each other, I would like some accounting of that space.

---

My best guess is this:


__________R__o__a____G__r__a__c__i__a
________________-_______ -
___________Legion____________- Legion
____Legion - San Magnolia -- Legion Legion - Giad - (Wasteland/Ocean?)
___________Legion____________- Legion
__________________________________-
_________________________________Wald


The Legion has eaten up a lot of San Magnolia and Giad's territory, with the area that used to be both countries occupied by the Legion to an overwhelming degree and to the point where no one has any idea how big they are. Giad has been trying to destroy their rogue robot army, and San Magnolia is still the primary attack target of the original war. Roa Gracia and Wald are involved because when Frederica's father/grandfather was on his last, he commanded the Legion to attack everyone.

edit: Think I finally got it!

Thanks for the effort in the ascii map. I see three countries listed there, but weren't there at least one more being attacked in this latest wave? I thought I heard a couple country names I didn't recognize, which is why I began to question the topography of these countries all fighting the Legion at once.

There's four.

San Magnolia (Lena and Annette). Giad (all the surviving 86ers and Frederica). Wald which was mentioned at the beginning of the big assault because the Federacy keeps in touch with both. Roa Gracia (same), but I think San Magnolia knew about them too in the classrooms, so they're presumably way bigger.

Key point is that San Magnolia and The Empire of Giad used to both be really quite big. San Magnolia we knew about, and the latter is implied by Frederica's retelling of her family and Kiriya's last stand.

Eps 17
-------------



Holy crap, my map accuracy was close! Roa Gracia a little bit smaller but still spanning all three, Wald further West a little, San Magnolia's capital a little more East and very slightly to the south. Everything a little more compressed. The nations are quite as big as I thought, if it is 100km to the railgun, it wouldn't be that far between Giad and San Magnolia really. These countries are honestly kinda tiny? (edit: Seriously, Tokyo and Kyoto are further apart than Giad and San Magnolia.)

I do like that the 86ers basically don't give a shit that this is a suicide mission, they've pretty much expected nothing less since they re-entered the military. They're generally treated that way too by the Federacy's military leadership, except by Wenzel, who acts a lot like Lena used to with them.

Next week is "Special Visual Commentary Episode"? Is that a new term for Recap?

Sounds like a recap.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ryllharu

The nations are quite as big as I thought, if it is 100km to the railgun, it wouldn't be that far between Giad and San Magnolia really. These countries are honestly kinda tiny? (edit: Seriously, Tokyo and Kyoto are further apart than Giad and San Magnolia.)

---

I asked somewhere else and people replied that I was mistaken about where the distances were from.

San Magnolia's capital is about 600-700 straight-line kilometers away from Giad's capital, if the anime map is to scale.

That's still not very far for Americans...but okay. That's a full day of driving which seems like nothing to me.

I just went to check out whether the source material has been completed yet, and I learned that

1) they're still ongoing.

2) we're still way early (like... book 2).

I've heard we just started volume 3. Most LN readers state they were quite pleased that the previous season added so much meat to volume 1.

But yeah, there's like 8.

Hopefully we get a few more cours out of this.

ep 17.5

--------------




The most exciting part was the model kit reveals. I like the Juggernaut better. The thin legs brings bring out the glass cannon feed.

Eps 18
------------



It's a really good thing that Frederica is a fairly good-natured 10 year old and not a vicious, manipulative monarch. Her esper ability gives her exactly the history she needs to cut deeply into anyone she's talking to and voice their most harbored insecurities right to their face. She tore right through Shinei about his brother and he was starting to crack. I can only imagine what her ancestors did with that power.

I guess we also got confirmation that the General doesn't racistly hate the 86ers, though his subordinates sure as shit do. Wenzel also got a little more backstory so we learned why she wants to protect them so badly, but also why she isn't going to fight them, cry, or scream in an attempt to stop them once they've made their decisions to go to the front lines.

I do not know if ekranoplans were ever used on land IRL because of the danger when something goes wrong. And immediately after the launch would kind of explain why.


edit: The series has been seeing some increasing production issues. There's another recap immediately. Sounds like we're unlikely to see the end of this arc this season.

Question: How much cargo space does Fido have?

Answer: enough for one Frederica.

Yeah, the ammo cases are very large.

The moment that Anzu and Kurena mentioned Frederica had barricaded herself in her room in protest, someone, maybe even Wenzel should have said, "she's probably already on the plane but we can't change our schedule to search for her."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryllharu

I asked somewhere else and people replied that I was mistaken about where the distances were from.

San Magnolia's capital is about 600-700 straight-line kilometers away from Giad's capital, if the anime map is to scale.

That's still not very far for Americans...but okay. That's a full day of driving which seems like nothing to me.

---

700km is roughly the route you have to *drive* from Berlin to Vienna
Or Berlin <> Amsterdam
Or Berlin <> Warsaw

etc. etc.
Seems like Europe to me and completely normal.

Episode 19

--------------------



Hoh...

1) Legion boss is actively protection Shin - or at least preventing him from totally being disintegrated. Do they just want his head, or do they want him for something else? "Your weapon is likely to be fatal" - bit late now when you just fired a fucking shit at him before..

2) While Legion command is absolute, they don't seem to be complete zombies. Those heads aren't just yelling emotions but seem to be reacting and thinking. Having the pride to just not confirm a death when ordered isn't a zombie braindead response. There's still a kill switch to reset their emotions though it seems.

3) Kurena actually locked on to Shin to snap him out of it.

4) Nyaa

https://i.imgur.com/sqIZxT6.jpg

Adorable Frederica flashbacks.

Finally some more backstory on Wenzel, who I can't help but like, especially with her death flagging all the way to the reveal of her survival by the other jerk guy.

The action was good too.

But the scene stealers were the President declaring his authority and not allowing them to pussy out after committing to this plan and furthermore the ideals of his country, and of course Frederica.

Frederica declaring that she was the hostage to keep them from killing themselves in battle was good stuff. Especially the little hint of a waver in her eyes and the corner of her mouth that the 86ers very well might continue to rage away until they finally die in battle and doom her as well. I love the way she's imperiously commanding them to live. They're agreeing with her, but Shin actually needs it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

2) While Legion command is absolute, they don't seem to be complete zombies. Those heads aren't just yelling emotions but seem to be reacting and thinking. Having the pride to just not confirm a death when ordered isn't a zombie braindead response. There's still a kill switch to reset their emotions though it seems.

---

I'll take the Mass Effect logic of (paraphrased) "any mental coercion, no matter how minor, reduces cognitive capacity". Those juicy neurons can't be entirely separated from the brain, so some personality and individuality remain? I like that they gave themselves code names- it's like a robot brain club.

Nice dirty trick to lure out an assault by ditching the damaged howitzer legion in the open to bombard the suicide squad sent to destroy it, though I'm not sure what tactical significance targeting them provided? That also begs the question of how much construction capacity the legion has, and why aren't there 12 more morphos in production or on the field?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by neflight86

That also begs the question of how much construction capacity the legion has, and why aren't there 12 more morphos in production or on the field?

---

There might very well be, they're just lacking good Processors. The Legion core wants Shin's head intact very, very badly, presumably based on intel from his brother's head and his current performance against Legion units.

no episode again?

Better than half arsed crap but still..

Eps 21

-----------

They did the thing (it looks like everyone is presumed dead again).

And due to the production fuck ups, the last two episodes are going to be in March.

Hmm, yeah, I think they're alive. I have no proof, I'm just hoping so, because I like them and there's a lot of material left. I like Raiden as the reliable big brother.

I think that's the Major chiming in there. Yellow is standard radio communication while Red is silence. Green was the colour of their telepathic link, and I think the green moments are crosstalk where the headset picks up the Major's transmissions.

I'll count this as finished, because the cutoff was so to my taste. Let me believe they actually died for a few months.

What is the connection between Shin, the Morpho AI and Shin's brother? Was Fredrica daydreaming they'd be besties if they got to live together in the service, or were they actually related somehow? I admit I didn't follow a lot of what was implied about how her vanguard died when her regime was overturned, ect, so I wouldn't be surprised if I missed some important details.

They didn't know each other. It's a montage of what Frederica assumed they'd have done if they knew each other. Then the brother and Kiri moved on since they died, and transferred the duty to keep Frederica safe to Shin.

Kiriya was a Nouzen too. All three actually are related somehow in the same family tree.

Yes. I should clarrify that while I said they didn't know each other (since they don't recognise each other, and the brothers were 86ers prior to coming to this new country), they are Nouzens. I get the impression that special powers run in that family tree, but I'm unclear about whether they're an established bodyguard family or not.

Gotcha. Appreciate the clarification.

Episode 22


--------------------------------------


what a tease, but I'm glad that there is at least a little more comming up.
Still one of my favorite shows in the last 5 years or so. I like this show quite a lot.

He almost opened up, but then damn Legions interrupted.

Shin keeping things to himself with "I didn't see" xD

I was waiting patiently for the anime to pass what I've read in the LNs years ago.




It didn't.

I understand that Lena thinks they're dead, but she doesn't recognize the voice too?

I get that he couldn't hear her voice until she activated her upgraded PARA-RAID and he picked it up too (the entire system is based off of his powers in case anyone forgot, and the Federacy's new comm systems are based off the old PARA-RAID), but she didn't recognize the voice directly off his mech's loudspeakers?

Cyclops knew the second she saw the emblem.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryllharu

I understand that Lena thinks they're dead, but she doesn't recognize the voice too?

I get that he couldn't hear her voice until she activated her upgraded PARA-RAID and he picked it up too (the entire system is based off of his powers in case anyone forgot, and the Federacy's new comm systems are based off the old PARA-RAID), but she didn't recognize the voice directly off his mech's loudspeakers?

Cyclops knew the second she saw the emblem.

---

It's more of an expectation thing, probably.
I'd probably not even realize my mom is talking to me if I were in like Africa and knew my mom would be at home. (unless she calls my name, of course... or uses a sentence she always uses or whatever)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KrayZ33

It's more of an expectation thing, probably.
I'd probably not even realize my mom is talking to me if I were in like Africa and knew my mom would be at home. (unless she calls my name, of course... or uses a sentence she always uses or whatever)

---

Which he did. He addressed her as Major in the tone he always does, and the audience knows she got demoted. She noticed it too, in order to correct him on it.

She thought he was dead, for one.

He introduced himself as a Federation soldier rather than an 86er, and his attitude was completely different to the person she had admired.

She thought she misheard the "Major" part because that came through her neural link once, while the rest of the entire conversation was held through the vehicle intercom.

While I'm disappointed and saddened that she didn't recognize him, it makes a lot of sense that she didn't.

86 - Episode 23

-------------

I guess that gives me the answer. It wasn't "Major" that triggers her memory, but "Handler One," which I should have known. I won't deny that it got me a little misty-eyed as they slowly peeled Lena's realization that the five were her former charges.

Kinda funny that everyone from Cyclops to the President decided to make a big trick out of it on Lena.

The way they mirrored the Fido-vision of the end of season 1 with this season was a nice touch to show the parallel of despair on that last suicide mission and the hopeful future Shin and the others share reunited with Lena. The lesser parallels with the five reintegrating into society better to compare to the beginning of this season was another nicely done bookend to show that they're not just child-soldiers, they have gotten over that unease and are exploring their own tastes at last.

And Fredericka got punished with excessive amount of homework.

I do kinda wish they gave Annette a little closure with a tearful face-to-face apology full of regret of her own, but she probably figured it out when she saw the tech.

But there's more questions! Why does Fido have a memory bank of Shin and his brother as kids? What tech or toy invention did Fido get adapted from!

All in all, this episode made up for the mess of the rest of the season, and I'm happy with this conclusion.

Indeed, a very sweet ending. It's like a perfect end for a series that could've had a few more seasons.
Even though the story is not concluded in the slightest, it felt like a perfect point to stop.

I don't and do want more at the same time.

This was a better ending than 86 deserved. Good production and music, and some sweet closure. This elevated the preceding episodes, which is quite an accomplishment!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by neflight86

This was a better ending than 86 deserved. Good production and music, and some sweet closure. This elevated the preceding episodes, which is quite an accomplishment!

---

You thought this deserved less?

edit @below: I see.

Yes. After the strongest first few episodes, I had issues with its pacing. Also, after the first half, the story took too long to rebuild tension, and Shinei wasn't a very compelling character most of the time; too moody. Not inappropriate, but not particularly interesting. The plot armor solidified around the other squad characters after the season one break as well and took a lot of the tension out of engagements. Princess loli didn't endear to me very well and would drone on and on sometimes. The morpho arc was still good, and the finale managed to circle around and touch on the more interesting elements (to me) from the first season, like the fate of the republic, and the handler.

For a LN adaptation, this is better than what I expect to get. I meant it as more of a compliment for the ending than a slight against 86 as a whole. The (good) emotional resonance I felt during it was mostly absent during similar scenes during the show; maybe the OST finally wore me down? It was very above average.

I thought the pacing was fine, but I didn't necessarily "wait" for each episode.
Often, it's the weekly release format that ruins stuff, not the actual pacing of the story.

Gave it another chance and started at episode 12 where I left off. Now at episode 14. WHY did they introduce that shitty, annoying loli?! She's so dominant right now, feels totally out of place, and it's like the author said "NOW I destroy my own story, haha!". :/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

Gave it another chance and started at episode 12 where I left off. Now at episode 14. WHY did they introduce that shitty, annoying loli?! She's so dominant right now, feels totally out of place, and it's like the author said "NOW I destroy my own story, haha!". :/

---

Bigger picture things.

All good questions you asked, by the way. As I understand, they all have answers too.

Don't forget that 86 is focused on its own fictional racism as an important core element of its storylines. Frederica and how she was handled is a good display of why the Federacy is different.