Shin Sekai Yori

Shisui would have easily melted the bullets as they came at him.

Cantus at such a level is simply overpowered. He even knew about the spies once he started to actively look for them. He simply let his guard down, and it cost him a powerful, albeit irritating and arrogant ally.

I really hope Yakomaru receives the protracted death promised this episode. I hate smarmy ambitious assholes.

Karma demons are karma demons because they can kill. Skill is irrelevant I believe, but as was shown in this episode, geniuses do exist regardless of moral inclination.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shinta|hikari

I really hope Yakomaru receives the protracted death promised this episode. I hate smarmy ambitious assholes.

---

Yeah, fuck the guy that devotes his life to save his kind from slavery and discrimination. Wait, what!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shinta|hikari

Karma demons are karma demons because they can kill. Skill is irrelevant I believe, but as was shown in this episode, geniuses do exist regardless of moral inclination.

---

No, fiends are those who can kill, and probably will kill because turning into a fiend seems to require some screws to become loose in the head. Karma demons are simply individuals who can't control their cantus anymore and thus screw up their surroundings accidentally. Karma demons, after all, have a history of assisting their own removal and recorded their experiences for any later unfortunates to learn from.

Oh crap, in that entire post I meant to say fiends, not Karma demons.

UTW - Episode 19

Yakomaru really got a way to control a fiend, and a fiend's cantus power is in an other league entirely. So I wonder if Shisui would be enough.
I guess the way they control Mamoru's fiend form is thanks to Maria. Also, I guess Saki and Satoru are still alive thanks to Maria's control, since I don't think fiends care that much for old relatives.

Damn, it's annoying to watch people not doing anything to protect themselves but just die like sheep. If not for the brainwashing they would have had any number of ways to get rid of the fiend. But being conditioned as they are, they can barely run away.

I don't honestly see how Squealer or anybody could control that thing. Why would it even want to be controlled by a queerat? If it kills humans for fun, killing queerats should be no different. Maria should make no difference here. Even if the fiend wouldn't kill her, I don't see how Maria would be all too sane trying to control the fiend considering what it is doing. Yet if she is, it'd be somewhat strange she would in turn be controlled by queerats, because she would be pretty much a fiend herself. Even normal humans can kill queerats by hundreds without a second thought.

Maria=Karma Demon
Mamoru=Fiend

And for some reason, although changing so much, they still share a very deep bond but completely lost their sense of reality.

Then, in a way we still have to be explained, Yakomaru can influence a KD (Maria) enough for his own tasks.

I just thought that maybe Qeerats, with their queen to individual reproduction, keep past experience and keep improving over generations as some of them evolve and find solutions to many problems.
Maybe over the course of time, they acquired some ways to influence KDs, and maybe they got that with a minoshiro too.

Finally, all the (at times boring/tedious) build up is paying off. The last two episodes were fantastic.

First, I´d like to repeat that I´m siding with the queerrats. Oh, so I´m supposed to feel empathy for those four "gods", when they´re slaughtering dozens of queerrats in the beginning just by looking at them? I guess everyone who´s siding with the humans in this anime is also a fan of Uchiha Sasuke sadlol.

We finally get to encounter the real threat of the queerrats´ revolution: The fiend. I don´t know how Yakomaru managed to get control over one, but he somehow did. Although I´d like to mention that we really don´t know all that much about how influenceable fiends really are. It´s all hearsay from the human elders. There could be lots of lies or simply broken records hampering with the true image of what a fiend is.
Then there´s David´s posting above mine, introducing an interesting theory, too. Mamoru as a fiend, Maria as a Karma demon, strong enough to keep up with the former, combined with the emotional band between the two.

What I don´t remember: Shouldn´t Saki and Satoru actually be able to fight the fiend? The other humans cannot, due to death feedback. But didn´t the heroes-group "remove" that "seal", when they were on their camping trip and met the fake momoshiro? After losing and regaining their Cantus? Which is why they were considered dangerous by the human elders to begin with?

Which gets me to the point: Is Shisui also free to use his Cantus against other human beings?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by David75

Maria=Karma Demon
Mamoru=Fiend

And for some reason, although changing so much, they still share a very deep bond but completely lost their sense of reality.

Then, in a way we still have to be explained, Yakomaru can influence a KD (Maria) enough for his own tasks.

I just thought that maybe Qeerats, with their queen to individual reproduction, keep past experience and keep improving over generations as some of them evolve and find solutions to many problems.
Maybe over the course of time, they acquired some ways to influence KDs, and maybe they got that with a minoshiro too.

---

A karma demon is somebody who has lost control of their cantus, at least to a substantial degree. It's nothing more than that. They are still as sane as any other villager, unless death feedback or the bizarreness of their surroundings damaged their headspace. They are just involuntarily altering or destroying everything around them. I reckon in the beginning many of them wouldn't even realise what's going on.

So, I don't see the relevance in suggesting Maria is a karma demon and that somehow would help Squealer control her. They can't even control themselves, so it's not like somebody else could - unless that somebody else was a better cantus user than anybody has ever seen and could somehow tweak with a karma demon's brain to control their cantus for them.

A fiend is another matter. They seem to be insane, more or less, and have no inhibitions whatsoever. Quite the contrary, in fact, since normally a human without any fancy hypnotized or genetic conditioning wouldn't just slaughter everybody inside a random building, unless they had a specific mission to do that (like wiping out terrorists). It seems like fiends enjoy killing and aren't simply able to do it.

The man kept saying the Fiend was a "he", but I wouldn't believe him entirely until I see the thing myself. He was growling and was shrouded in darkness, so it could easily have been a misinterpretation.

Maria being a KD is irrelevant, and would make her even less approachable by queerats IMO. The rest of this point was covered by Kraco.

Fiends seem to have lost some of their rationality, but I'm not sure that they're incapable of being reasoned to. Yakomaru can give the field the element of surprise he may need to infiltrate the village and hence they cooperated. That, or the fiend simply had no reason to fight the queerats that helped him in the past. Perhaps he even feels sorry for them because they've been mistreated the same way he had been.

Satoru's anti-queerat tactics continue to impress, and I'm genuinely amazed that he's now able to make a mirror out of condensed air.


--------------------------------

[ASL]_Various_Artists_-_Shin_Sekai_Yori_ED_-_Wareta_Ringo_Yuki_ni_Saku_Hana_[MP3]_[w_Scans].rar
[ASL]_Various_Artists_-_Shin_Sekai_Yori_ED_-_Wareta_Ringo_Yuki_ni_Saku_Hana_[FLAC]_[w_Scans].rar

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

The man kept saying the Fiend was a "he", but I wouldn't believe him entirely until I see the thing myself. He was growling and was shrouded in darkness, so it could easily have been a misinterpretation.

---

The fiend was in fact Maria? Squealer assassinated Mamoru and managed to make Maria believe the village got him?

The only thing that really bothers me about all this is the timeline. To be specific, the ten years jump. What on Earth were Maria and Mamoru doing all that time? Logic dictates they would be long gone. So, what would have made them come back? I find it hard to believe they would have enjoyed Squealer's hospitality right next to the village bent on killing them. There's also no way Squealer could have kept them imprisoned until he was ready to make his grand move against other queerats and the humans. The only logical explanation would be that Mamoru turned into a fiend somewhere far away (perhaps the world was just as shitty everywhere) and in his insanity wandered back to the place of origin, with Maria forced to follow him. Then Squealer would have needed to do nothing but take full advantage of the rare chance. That doesn't exactly explain how he could have used those two to wipe out Giant Hornet, though.

Hmm... Or Mamoru could have randomly died elsewhere and Maria, turned into a fiend, came back to look for her old love, Saki. And decided to kill everybody else in the process while she was at it. I guess that sort of thinking would be natural for a fiend.

Well, there´s one more possibility (if you can call it that) that would also incorporate the 10 years jump.

In the episode where we got to see the imprisoned queerrat queen, we speculated about this kind of control over a superior being. That there might even be a clue to how he, Yakomaru, might gain control over a human being/Cantus user in the future. So, maybe, just maybe, Yakomaru indeed successfully turned the experience of controlling a queen into something that let him control a human. I mean, if this anime decides to become truly fucked up, maybe we´ll get to see Maria kept captive in some dark hole, put in chains agianst a wall, her belly all swollen and big. And we´ll learn that Yakomaru had her give birth to newly born human beings that Yakomaru then turned into his personal war machines. Could we make out how old the fiend in this latest episode was? If not, maybe it is indeed some 9-10 year old boy/girl.
But that´s really the most disturbing "solution" I could come up with. It´s probably something less provoking.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

Well, there´s one more possibility (if you can call it that) that would also incorporate the 10 years jump.

In the episode where we got to see the imprisoned queerrat queen, we speculated about this kind of control over a superior being. That there might even be a clue to how he, Yakomaru, might gain control over a human being/Cantus user in the future. So, maybe, just maybe, Yakomaru indeed successfully turned the experience of controlling a queen into something that let him control a human. I mean, if this anime decides to become truly fucked up, maybe we´ll get to see Maria kept captive in some dark hole, put in chains agianst a wall, her belly all swollen and big. And we´ll learn that Yakomaru had her give birth to newly born human beings that Yakomaru then turned into his personal war machines. Could we make out how old the fiend in this latest episode was? If not, maybe it is indeed some 9-10 year old boy/girl.
But that´s really the most disturbing "solution" I could come up with. It´s probably something less provoking.

---

This post is a bannable offence unless you draw it.

@Kraco: Squealer might have been able to keep tabs on them during the last 10 years. One of them might have spontaneously died or turned into a fiend from some attack, and Yakomaru somehow convinced them that the attacks were from enemy queerats and that the entire human village is after them.

The labotomising technique might be able to detach things in the brain such that death feedback no longer occurs.

I like the Maria Queen idea... Quite plausible indeed. I like the idea very much.

My idea for the KD controlling a fiend stems from the fact that KDs change everything around them, so a fiend would also be changed somehow. I know it's quite a stretch, but we have two powers that can interact with one another and at the same power level so that they can't kill each other. And KDs can influence everything around them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

In the episode where we got to see the imprisoned queerrat queen, we speculated about this kind of control over a superior being. That there might even be a clue to how he, Yakomaru, might gain control over a human being/Cantus user in the future. So, maybe, just maybe, Yakomaru indeed successfully turned the experience of controlling a queen into something that let him control a human. I mean, if this anime decides to become truly fucked up, maybe we´ll get to see Maria kept captive in some dark hole, put in chains agianst a wall, her belly all swollen and big. And we´ll learn that Yakomaru had her give birth to newly born human beings that Yakomaru then turned into his personal war machines. Could we make out how old the fiend in this latest episode was? If not, maybe it is indeed some 9-10 year old boy/girl.
But that´s really the most disturbing "solution" I could come up with. It´s probably something less provoking.

---

... I don't really want to believe in that (because it would be so gross). I feel the facts also speak against it. Narration and some other hints suggest Maria isn't lobotomized. I can't see any other way for powerless queerats to manage to imprison a human for a long time. As long as she could use her cantus, it would take hundreds of queerats to subdue her, and even afterwards it would be a nightmare for the queerats to keep her under control using force. If they did tinker with her brain, she would be in no condition anymore to be a character of much importance.

Besides, who would be the father? If it was Mamoru, the queerats would need to survive keeping two humans prisoners! But other than that, it is actually quite an interesting idea, leaving the queerats out of it. If the fiend was Maria and Mamoru's kid who, without any education or conditioning, was running rampant. Although I'm not sure if 9-10 years is old enough to be so powerful and dangerous.

In the Minoshiro ep, one of the flashbacks depicted a boy that seemed to be quite young.

It's more likely that the queerrats lobotomized Maria, blamed it on the humans, which caused Mamoru to snap, as opposed to some other grotesque means.

To utilize a fiend, Yakomaru would have to ensure that its rage was directed at the human society, so it wasn't randomly slaughtering them. Substantial brainwashing combined with a very clever ruse to keep the Fiend focused on killing only the human society and its allies. That's only if Maria isn't dead. They also could have killed her in the woods with with poison or whatever, and again, blamed it on the humans. This would also have had to happen recently.

Narrator Saki's words long ago were interestingly phrased. She said that if only Maria had died early on, many many lives would be saved, not that Saki herself had to kill her (referring to when Maria and Mamoru escaped). If Mamoru is the fiend, this makes more sense. He never would have fallen desperately in love with her to the point the he would go ballistic trying to avenge her.

At this point, the queerrats aren't really controlling Mamoru anymore. It's like biological or fire warfare. Release it, and stay upwind.

-----------------

As for anyone here claiming to support a particular side, it should be pretty clear that there isn't a "good" side in this entire series. There are no heroes, no one to admire, only villains and our hopelessly lost protagonists, paralyzed by indecisiveness.

Yakomaru is a sociopath who will stop at nothing to secure his ambitions and retaliate against whatever might humiliate him even if it takes years (his queen, Kiroumaru, humans in general). He is exceptionally manipulative. It should be absolutely certain that his "democracy" is a joke. There is no question who truly rules their society. It may have a sort of Senate, but it would be child's play for someone of his skill at manipulation to sway all of them his way over and over and over again. He rarely will even field his own forces unless he is certain of his own safety (often tricking Saki and Satoru into shielding him). He sends the latest subordinate group that his kingdom has subjugated to do the dirty work.

The humans on the other hand, have become as foolish as the Cantus Emperors, thinking that nothing could ever threaten them. Their society as a whole began to treat everything different from them as less than human. They slaughter their own. Their crimes against their own are far worse than anything they have done to queerrats or anything else. Out of fear of creating new Cantus Emperors, they as a whole became what they were so afraid of. It was interesting that Satoru got so angry about what the queerrats had done to their queen, while Saki at least understood that it's not any different from what human do to their own children, equally out of fear.

Yakomaru displays ambition at all costs with no risk to oneself like the worst dynastic Chinese bureaucrat, humans possess an immense hubris, while at the same time constantly cowering in fear about the threats from within.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryllharu

It's more likely that the queerrats lobotomized Maria, blamed it on the humans, which caused Mamoru to snap, as opposed to some other grotesque means.

To utilize a fiend, Yakomaru would have to ensure that its rage was directed at the human society, so it wasn't randomly slaughtering them. Substantial brainwashing combined with a very clever ruse to keep the Fiend focused on killing only the human society and its allies. That's only if Maria isn't dead. They also could have killed her in the woods with with poison or whatever, and again, blamed it on the humans. This would also have had to happen recently.

---

The preview had Maria's voice saying she will protect Saki. Was it a flashback? Or was it referring to upcoming events when Maria wouldn't allow the fiend to harm Saki? I guess only the next episodes will reveal that. With this show, there's no way to know beforehand.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kraco

The preview had Maria's voice saying she will protect Saki. Was it a flashback? Or was it referring to upcoming events when Maria wouldn't allow the fiend to harm Saki? I guess only the next episodes will reveal that. With this show, there's no way to know beforehand.

---

I thought it was indicating that Maria is coming (the fiend) to protect Saki from the humans. Saki will probably kill her since she's the one that Maria lets her guard down against.

UTW - Episode 20

I'm beginning to think these folks don't deserve to survive. Not because I'd side with queerats, but because the humans are so miserable already. They murder their own children out of fear, but then when something bad comes from the outside, they are totally unable to defend themselves and die like sheep. Such evolutionary failures have no business ruling any part of the world anymore.

You'd think out of all those people you could find a few who have lost their family and everything and thus wouldn't mind sacrificing themselves to destroy the fiend. Maybe that's what Tomiko had in mind, who knows. The fiend should be pretty tired already, having been so busy and all the time surrounded by some cantus mist. It must have run out of glycogen a long time ago and is trudging on fat alone already.

Lol @ the scientifc approach here, Kraco :D

My qualm with this episode would be the lack of care for all the dead people. We see Saki, that new boy and other people walking inmidst of dead and injured people. Yet, nobody seems to really freak out.
Maybe that´s just me, but this anime went through great efforts to portray the ultimacy of the Cantus´ power, and how people felt 100% safe thanks to it. Seeing fellow citizens being killed by those "measy" queerats should be super shocking. And I mean SUPER shocking, not just "well, we had one episode showing some reaction, now we´ve moved on to what follows" kind of shocking. I want to see people break down, crawling on the ground, going into fetal position and crying - at the sight of the UNTHINKABLE: Human beings beeing killed by something, and in this case, by queerats.

As for what happened in this episode, yeah, I guess Tomiko is trying to sacrifice herself. And I agree with Kraco: Just someone kill this fiend. One dead human, one dead fiend, and it´s over.
But ... what happened to Satoru? He didn´t die, right? Otherwise, Saki would have shown a stronger reaction. But it´s stupid ... he couldn´t have gone far enough to be so lost out of Saki´s sight to not find him again within seconds. But Saki just went all "whatevs" and journeyed away. :|

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

As for what happened in this episode, yeah, I guess Tomiko is trying to sacrifice herself. And I agree with Kraco: Just someone kill this fiend. One dead human, one dead fiend, and it´s over.
But ... what happened to Satoru? He didn´t die, right? Otherwise, Saki would have shown a stronger reaction. But it´s stupid ... he couldn´t have gone far enough to be so lost out of Saki´s sight to not find him again within seconds. But Saki just went all "whatevs" and journeyed away. :|

---

Satoru's not dead. You see him in the preview. The explosion sent everyone flying, so I can see the two losing sight of each other. That's especially if they were hiding from sight or if one of them fell unconscious. They already established that reporting to the village was more important than the party having to sacrifice lives, so I find it pretty believable. The lack of even attempting to find Satoru was strange. Maybe he can't fly so she counted him as dead. :p

And it seems that there's a KD amongst the queerats after all.

I wonder if Saki's latest flashback of Shun unlocked any more of her memories. Tomiko mentioned before that her mind is extremely resilient and stable, making brainwashing less effective on her. That flight through the air was the perfect kind of trigger to release more of her sealed memories.

I kind of hate how Shun keeps getting in the way.

Saki: I loved him.
Satoru: I feel the same way.

..COCKBLOCK..

Oh, and don´t forget: She mentioned Maria, then "the other precious friend". And that´s it.

PLEASE GO DIE, Mamoru! - is what she´s basically saying :/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

Oh, and don´t forget: She mentioned Maria, then "the other precious friend". And that´s it.

PLEASE GO DIE, Mamoru! - is what she´s basically saying :/

---

Yeah I was getting vibes throughout the whole series that no one really liked him they just kinda put up with him. Like the Bitch comment saki made about her and Maria being a thing and Mamoru being a third wheel. And there is probably resentment from Saki since Mamoru is the direct cause of Maria leaving and possible the fiend attacking them last episode.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

And it seems that there's a KD amongst the queerats after all.

---

Yeah. I would guess that the queerats are using the leakage to produce weapons against the humans. Depending on whether Maria or Mamoru is the fiend attacking the village right now, we might get to see something like this afterall :D.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

I kind of hate how Shun keeps getting in the way.

Saki: I loved him.
Satoru: I feel the same way.

..COCKBLOCK..

---

I never really did like Saki, so a Satoru x Saki only mattered to me in that Satoru might care about it in more than a bonobo gene satisfaction kind of way. It seems like he does not.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

Oh, and don´t forget: She mentioned Maria, then "the other precious friend". And that´s it.

PLEASE GO DIE, Mamoru! - is what she´s basically saying :/

---

This is why I hope Mamoru's the fiend.

UTW - Episode 21

So the baby/children theory was right...

And Queerats really did find ways to control fiends, their best human annihilation weapon.

Tomiko hinted there's a solution to killing fiends, but with luck. My bet is that it takes someone with her ability to manipulate their own DNA into erasing the deathfeedback... but only if the brainwashing part can also be removed.
I guess Tomiko can manage the DNA part, but never worked towards the BW part.
Saki might be the only one who does master both, although we never really witnessed her working on DNA manipulation.

I don't like this. The plothole is so huge. I have nothing against employing fiends as such, but in reality the fiends should be killing queerats randomly and in far greater quantities than humans. There's no way to control them, only manipulate them exceedingly crudely, like possibly making them wander in some direction (still likely at the cost of many queerats). The one in this episode clearly showed how utterly deranged it was. If it kills humans for sport, or even without an intent, it will kill queerats, or anything else, just the same.

I really hope Squeeler will find that out the hard way, or I will need to consider the last portion of this show trash.

Still, the humans in this show are so miserable they totally deserved this catastrophe.

I suppose it would really depend on how the queerrats are indebting the children to them, but the bigger difference is that I doubt they are true Fiends.

They feed them, care for them, maybe even treat them as something special, so the "fiend" sees the queerrats as their family/allies. The "other" that the queerrat-raised-fiend would hate and loathe would be the regular humans. It wasn't hard to see how Maria and Mamoru's child viewed the queerrats as friendlies (6:50). I would be surprised if any queerrats had died by the hand of this fiend. The "otherness" of humans is reinforced every time the Queerrat Fiend witnesses members of their "family" callously murdered by humans with Cantus.

So the Queerrat Fiends aren't Fiends in the traditional sense. The regular Fiends suffer a mental break, out of rage or isolation or whatever. Pure psychosis. The Queerrat Fiends simply aren't trained and have zero discipline or restrictions on their abilities. They are simply raw power. A return to the original murdering Espers from now-ancient Japan. The queerrats don't control them, but they do not have to fear them. They're family.

I don't get how unconscious leakage was supposed to be the key to overpowering Shisei, but it does make some sense that deranged Fiends (and now untrained fiends) aren't able to lock down their Cantus.

I so should have replaced MFauli's avatar with Yakomaru's mug 2 weeks ago.

If the fiends could be controlled and lived happily with like you are suggesting, Ryll, then the humans would never have needed all that bullshit brainwashing, conditioning, gene manipulation, and hypnosis treatment, or culling out the undesirables. Half of the show was about making a point of how absolutely necessary it supposedly was for a stable society (or let's say a society at all) to bring up the children with absolute, and ruthless, care or none of them would survive. That's why the adults were so afraid of children, as absurd as it seemed.

And now we are supposed to believe the queerats can pull it off? One look at that abomination's face and behavior was enough to reveal it must have killed hundreds or thousands of queerats before it got to these villagers - or it's a huge plothole.

Nor do I believe the fiends (humans) would anyway live too long under the rule of queerats. Superior ability breeds superior ambition, like they said in Star Trek. They wouldn't suffer happily a rule of rodents much weaker than they.

Hold on. Death Feedback was genetic, wasn't it? How did Maria's baby get rid of it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

Hold on. Death Feedback was genetic, wasn't it? How did Maria's baby get rid of it?

---

I was asking myself the same question.
Maybe Mamoru of Maria were able to manipulate their child's DNA to eradicate that gene.
But that would still be a problem for the babies they stole, and I do not see M&M child being able to manipulate DNA.

Death feedback isn't genetic. We've seen a flashback of Saki being subjected to the brainwashing that causes it. When she was still in Harmony School ages, the old man at the temple repeatedly blames her for hurting him (well before she had her Cantus) and then stabs himself in the leg with a knife, traumatizing her.

That's where Death feedback comes from. It's very deep brainwashing.

Bonobo genes are the genetic factor. That is, in times of stress they start to think of... things that aren't violent (like sex). I can't really see something as fancy as death feedback being plausible genetically. There might be some factors that could be partially affected genetically, like nausea when seeing blood or paralysis in front of violent behavior. However, I don't see it being fully genetic with creatures as complex as humans. The existence of fiends in fact means it can't be. I doubt fiends become fiends by having a mass of genes spontaneously altered in their brain and elsewhere in their endocrine system.

I initially had the idea that death feedback wasn't genetic, but somewhere down the line I got the impression that it was.

Perhaps I just lumped it with Bonobos genes and thought there were two genetic factors..

In that case, Satoru and Saki shouldn't have it, right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

In that case, Satoru and Saki shouldn't have it, right?

---

Haha, now that would be sweet irony. Most of the town is dead, and then they realise they don't have death feedback and would thus have been able to get rid of the fiend? Nah, I don't think so. I don't see it overly likely the head honcho uber priest leader monk with two irises per eye would have a full death feedback and two random youngsters wouldn't. Saki and Satoru might be missing something, but I very much doubt it's the death feedback. An average human is fully capable of slaying queerats (or other animals), that doesn't require any special conditions. I reckon the monk of the trip arc got weaker because he killed the false minoshiro with its false trigger for the death feedback. At the time it looked like killing dozens of queerats might have affected him as well, but maybe that wasn't the case at all in the light of what we have seen now. Although it would make sense there are individual differences between humans.

The monk was weakened severely by the false monoshiro's illusion, but what did him in were the larger, savage species of queerrat. That clan was much larger and more human like in shape. The more spectacular attack he made, the more he obscured their outlines, making them look even more human-shaped.

He did himself in.

One might argue that Squealer's infiltrator sub-variant would cause the same effect, but they got close enough that it was pretty obvious from their ugly mugs that they weren't human.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kraco

Haha, now that would be sweet irony. Most of the town is dead, and then they realise they don't have death feedback and would thus have been able to get rid of the fiend? Nah, I don't think so. I don't see it overly likely the head honcho uber priest leader monk with two irises per eye would have a full death feedback and two random youngsters wouldn't.

---

Quite the contrary actually. As a village you'd want to make sure your most powerful cantus user wasn't able to kill people left/right/center. As far as humans went, all he had to do was overpower your cantus in order to immobilise you (or just render you powerless) while cats killed you off. (This is assuming you're just a bad human and not a fiend/KD).

I suspected whether or not the kids had it because Satoru's cantus was restored by Saki and Saki's cantus was restored by Shun. That said, all the priest actually did was seal their cantus so there isn't any strong indication that their death feedback was also revoked (and thereby needed to be re-hypnotised into it).

Can someone please explain to me in detail why Shisei was killed? It wasn´t death feedback, but "leaked cantus". Whats that about?

Anyway, great episode. Well, except for EVERY human being being super obnoxious. I hate Saki for still freaking out at this point in time. I hate Shisei´s arrogance. And I hate how Saki and Satoru fail to realize that what the one queerat told them rang all too true (cantus users having queerats live under their tyranny).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

I so should have replaced MFauli's avatar with Yakomaru's mug 2 weeks ago.

---

:-o

I honestly thought that I underestimated the intelligence of the queerats until their world conquest plan was revealed. Then I just loled.

One of these Fiend children will inevitably enter a rebellious phase way before they reach that goal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shinta|hikari

I honestly thought that I underestimated the intelligence of the queerats until their world conquest plan was revealed. Then I just loled.

One of these Fiend children will inevitably enter a rebellious phase way before they reach that goal.

---

Now I really need to know where Maria and Mamoru are.. (I'm assuming Yakomaru poisoned/infected them or something..)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

Can someone please explain to me in detail why Shisei was killed? It wasn´t death feedback, but "leaked cantus". Whats that about?

---

No idea.. (and fuck you're ugly. I regret saying that.)

Assuming my, "Maria and Mamoru's child is not a true Fiend, just an utterly undisciplined Cantus user" theory is right, he has no subconscious control over his cantus at all. The series been clear that all the years of schooling combined with the innate "unknown beyond the holy barrier" are meant to limit the damage done by subconscious Cantus leakage.

This "Fiend" is actually more like a Fiend combined with a Karma Demon. It's an power-mad, rage-filled Esper.

When the "fiend's" undisciplined attacks failed to work on Shisei, the child obviously began to wonder why it wasn't working the way he was used to. As he continued to imagine how it should be working, his subconscious took hold and killed Shisei in a more passive way. The same way a Karma Demon can't help by warp the world around them, the "fiend" eventually managed to make the world match with the subconscious thought that Shisei should be killed by his Cantus.

In contrast, Shisei, who has expert control over his Cantus, could easily deflect any active attack. But as he is not Karma Demon, the subconscious side to his Cantus will not be able to keep him alive and continually deflect the "fiend's" subconscious will to see him dead.

Shisei is too in control to warp reality, while the "fiend" warps it non-stop. It's just that usually, the "fiend's" active thoughts are the same, every foe he comes across should be dead.

I agree. The child's leaking cantus killed Shisei because he couldn't see it coming. Shun wiped out his entire family subconsciously, so it is not surprising that cantus leakage is more than capable of killing people. Shun's incident also shows that there is no reliable way for outsiders to prevent or control cantus leakage, so Shisei was powerless against it.

UTW - Episode 22

Humans are idiots in that show.

Why would you want Kiromaru and Yakomaru+troops with you when you find PsychoBuster?

That's the ideal biological weapon against any and all Cantus users... And I'm sure Yakomaru will easilly use and duplicate it.

Kiromaru at least appears to have some semblance of honor and pride in his servitude. But more importantly, he despises Squealer. He is more likely to abandon them if he sees the opportunity to kill Squealer than he his to betray them.

It doesn't really matter who gets their hands on the PsychoBuster, it couldn't be used to exclusively kill humans. It's Anthrax, biological warfare grade. It works against everything that isn't routinely vaccinated. There will be an inherent danger in using and handling it. I also doubt anyone other than the humans would be able to even produce a vaccine. So if Squealer took it and started using it all over the place, there would be nothing to stop it. Sooner or later, much of their livestock would die, and many of their people. Once the spores are released, there would be no stopping the slow spread.

At least until the queerrats end up with their equivalent of Louis Pasteur. This information wasn't input to mobile libraries if I understood Saki's mother's letter correctly. It was very controlled information.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryllharu

It doesn't really matter who gets their hands on the PsychoBuster, it couldn't be used to exclusively kill humans. It's Anthrax, biological warfare grade. It works against everything that isn't routinely vaccinated. There will be an inherent danger in using and handling it. I also doubt anyone other than the humans would be able to even produce a vaccine. So if Squealer took it and started using it all over the place, there would be nothing to stop it. Sooner or later, much of their livestock would die, and many of their people. Once the spores are released, there would be no stopping the slow spread.

---

Even if it killed 95% of queerats as collateral victims, Squealer would still put it to use if it killed most of humans as well. The only thing holding him back might be the immense success they have had with the fiend. Considering they kidnapped the babies, he must be planning to repeat that success in greater numbers. However, if he really has plans to conquer the whole world, he will need something else than a few fiends. It might suit the Japanese mentality for humans to render themselves defenseless against other humans, but when he gets to Europe and especially America, no chance in hell the humans there would be as pitiful as this. I wouldn't be surprised if the old style of cantus users living as gods using ordinary humans as slaves still existed elsewhere.

One word caught my attention: Highly Contagious.

Humans can't decide to harm/kill other humans if needed be to stop the contagion.

Queerats would have no second thought killing 10/100/1000 or more of their kind to preserve the species.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryllharu

Kiromaru at least appears to have some semblance of honor and pride in his servitude. But more importantly, he despises Squealer. He is more likely to abandon them if he sees the opportunity to kill Squealer than he his to betray them.

---

Something about this whole adventure makes me feel Kiromaru could be out to betray them. Perhaps Squealer is holding all the remains of his clan as hostages. It would also explain a bit of the ease of following them. I wouldn't put it beyond Squealer's intelligence to form multiple plans for contingencies, one of them being to make sure the humans can't fetch any secret weapons from elsewhere. A good way to prepare for that, considering the humans never leave their villages, would be to make a seemingly trustworthy guide available to them. Still, I'm sure Kiromaru hates Squealer's guts, so the mastermind needs to keep a close watch.

However, at the end of the day, I'm sure Kiromaru would have nothing against getting rid of humans. Humans weren't exactly good neighbours. He might not be as fanatical as Squealer, but he's still a man who would put his own people above everything else.

So what's so different about Psychobuster compared to regular military anthrax? Isn't the whole point that it's selective for cantus humans?

Or am I misreading it, and only its intention was specifically against cantus humans?

edit: nvm, rewatched and the machine suggests it's just anti-human

@David: I wouldn't want any queerats around me, but without Kiroumaru I doubt the humans would be able to get to the Psychobuster in one piece considering the environment.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kraco

However, at the end of the day, I'm sure Kiromaru would have nothing against getting rid of humans. Humans weren't exactly good neighbours. He might not be as fanatical as Squealer, but he's still a man who would put his own people above everything else.

---

That´s what makes no sense to me about Kiromaru´s behavior. Why would he be so loyal towards humans, when they treated queerats like shit? He´s too intelligent to just ignore that. We have to remember: At the end of the day, Yakomaru isn´t evil. He´s doing whatever he can to protect/improve/strengthen/free his kin. Of course, he´s on a power trip, too, but that´s more of a queerat thing in general, I think. You know, the whole ... once they see a chance, they take it, at whatever costs. Maybe Yakomaru might pose a problem to the queerat community AFTER defeating humans, but right now, he´s the needed dictator to harbour success.

So, yeah, I kinda hope that Kiromaru will betray Saki and Co., likely due to his clan being held hostage or, more to my liking, due to realizing that while he hates Yakomaru on a personal level, he´s doing it all for the whole of the queerats species. It´d be great if such self-realization could change Kiromaru´s heart, instead of a simple, clichee hostage-scenario.

Btw that undersea boat somehow wouldn´t work, would it? Both spinning wheels face parallel to the vehicles length. Why would it create a forward push, instead of pushing into all and any direction, lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

So what's so different about Psychobuster compared to regular military anthrax? Isn't the whole point that it's selective for cantus humans?

Or am I misreading it, and only its intention was specifically against cantus humans?

edit: nvm, rewatched and the machine suggests it's just anti-human

---

You are sorely mistaken.

It was developed by the military of America as a last-ditch effort to exterminate the psychics that had begun terrorizing the world. We saw what they used prior to that early on, when they used to just drop nukes on them. They might use that again today, but as the letter said, they would all have rotted into uselessness by now.

Anthrax doesn't. The spores remain dormant for centuries.

In no way, shape or form did the dialogue say that it only worked on humans. Human were the only sentient species on Earth at the time this weapon was developed. This strain was made especially virulent so that it would spread quickly and kill off the psychics of the ancient world, preferably by all three ways that anthrax infects humans (skin, pulmonary, and gastrointestinal).

It's anthrax ffs. It works on everything.

UTW - Episode 23

I dont really understand why those worms posed such a danger, and even got to kill Inui. Use cantus -> erase WHATEVER from existence -> the solution. They have god powers, but somehow fail. Wat.

Other than that, filler-ish episode. Next week should be more interesting.
Btw. what I truly like about this anime is that it doesn´t switch between locations. It´s probably been that way from the very beginning, but it just occurred to me when the four split into two groups. Also, when Kiromaru talked about Yakomaru, fiend, and co. following them. We KNOW that those "villains" are coming, but we never see them. There´s zero doubt about their approaching, but it´s not being pushed in our faces. Most other shows would put in-between scenes of Yakomaru following them. Shin Sekai Yori doesn´t do that. And it makes it feel more consistent of an adventure to me. There are no "jumps". We get to see one journey from start to end, even though we might miss out on some other events. Applause.

Btw. is the soundtrack out, yet? I reallly need that main "theme", that´s running whenever shits going down.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

I dont really understand why those worms posed such a danger, and even got to kill Inui. Use cantus -> erase WHATEVER from existence -> the solution. They have god powers, but somehow fail. Wat.

---

They have different abilities that they're good at. It doesn't seem to be as omnipotent as they seem. The only common ones we've witnessed so far are telekinesis of objects (self-propelled flight is harder), as well as flame creation. Neither will probably work against a giant worm in water. Cantus also seem to require some concentrating beforehand unless you're Shisei, so they're not that great at countering surprise attacks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

Btw. is the soundtrack out, yet? I reallly need that main "theme", that´s running whenever shits going down.

---

[ASL]_Various_Artists_-_Shin_Sekai_Yori_ED_-_Wareta_Ringo_Yuki_ni_Saku_Hana_[MP3]_[w_Scans].rar
[ASL]_Various_Artists_-_Shin_Sekai_Yori_ED_-_Wareta_Ringo_Yuki_ni_Saku_Hana_[FLAC]_[w_Scans].rar


[Shin-S] Shinsekai Yori Original Soundtrack 1 (FLAC) [Komori Shigeo & Taneda Risa].zip
[Shin-S] Shinsekai Yori Original Soundtrack 1 [Komori Shigeo & Taneda Risa].zip

[PCXG-50184-2] Pony Canyon - Shinsekai Yori Original Soundtrack CD2 [FLAC]
[Jabonggun] Shinsekai Yori Original Soundtrack CD2

The main "theme" is the first track on the first disc, though I'm not sure if that's necessarily the one you're after.


edit: If queerats could tell the composition of troups just from smell alone, how did Inui escape from the queerats? Adds to the "Kinoumaru's a trap" theory.

The most powerful attacks also require some form of possibly-silent chanting for focus. We've seen Saki do it a number of times to protect herself. Satoru has done them as well. It only takes a brief moment, but it makes a telekinetic blast devastating instead of simply strong.

I would say it was very likely Inui used chanting to defeat the ragworm on the surface, but didn't have the time underwater, partly because he also had to warn Saki. He killed it, but could not stop its momentum.

Could the whole fiend strategy be a complete bluff? It's pretty obv that they wanted the humans to lead them to the anthrax, much more solid than using unstable fiends but maybe they aren't as unstoppable/powerful as they seemed and getting to the pscyhobuster was the true strategy?(well it is but why even do that if they can achieve domination with just fiends) Not sure how that would work though, from what we've seen the queerats have seemed really powerful already. Would be tough for the humans to even reach the psychobuster without kiroumarus(cant remember name) help so such an elaborate plan to make him trick the humans doesnt make complete sense without them seeking it from the very start, though it could obv just be a safeguard and they'd be satisfied with no one finding the psychobuster... I doubt that though.

So this episode they basically spelled out that it wasnt a fiend at all, but even karma demons wouldn't be able to decide to spare queerats right? They've made a point of making the "fiend" look pretty deranged but I guess it could just be having fun. Then again with the walking libraries and random technology unknown to us they could use lots of random stuff to explain it later on. Maybe they infused him/her with death feedback towards queerats using the same techniques? They are probably explained in the libraries too. Please correct me on stuff, I am def a bit confused atm.

Completely agree on loving the one point of view storytelling, boosts the immersion hard.

What is a fiend anyway? That's basically just a term used by the villagers to call someone who has lost all death feedback and is deranged enough to kill people randomly. Or rather, it's not even such a scientific term but a part of their folklore, even though it's real, if rare. So, no matter how you look at it, a human who walks around killing other humans with cantus without succumbing to death feedback is tecnically a fiend. I reckon Shun-inside-of-Saki probably denied it because labelling someone a fiend is nothing but easy labelling. It's kind of like calling someone an enemy without trying to understand anything about the other side.

The preview especially suggests this was nothing but a trap. It's not necessarily true that Kiromaru and Squealer are honestly working together (assuming Squealer is even capable of working honestly with anyone), but it's looking more and more they queerats were after the bioweapon even more than humans now. Relying on a volatile fiend is hardly a perfect solution, in the end, and like I said earlier, I doubt it would work everywhere either.

@Derek: The fiend was used to start a war with the humans and impact on their power and administration. Even if the war was won, the queerats still would have had a bunch of fiends/humans to deal with. They're not something they can reliably control forever because humans are just genetically superior in terms of raw power. One unsatisfied fiend could end it all for the queerats.

The "super weapon" sounds like the queerat's bet on something that could wipe out all humans at once (along with some of their own kind, but they won't mind a little sacrifice for freedom).

As for the fiend not being a fiend, I think it's as speculated in this thread: that the child was just an untrained human - not a deranged fiend. It also leaked cantus like any other human, but because it was never trained the leaked cantus affected its surroundings. Villagers have been conditioned to direct their subconscious leakages towards Tokyo.

They may or may not be a karma demon, depending on the definition of KD.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

As for the fiend not being a fiend, I think it's as speculated in this thread: that the child was just an untrained human - not a deranged fiend. It also leaked cantus like any other human, but because it was never trained the leaked cantus affected its surroundings. Villagers have been conditioned to direct their subconscious leakages towards Tokyo.

---

You have a pretty low view of humans if somebody simply not trained will walk around and kill every other moving human on sight, and even hunt down those trying to escape. And wear a totally nuts expression while doing it, screaming like an animal. It's more than likely the queerats never even taught the poor bastard to talk and treated it like a tool, but it should still be a fiend by the original definition, if the defition is a murderous cantus user free of the death feedback or any other inhibitions. Since their world normally doesn't possess such individuals, it would be okay to call even the "normal" homicidal cantus users of old fiends. The emperors and such we saw historical flashbacks of.

Karma demon, from what I understood, is still responsible. An unresponsible karma demon would be another fiend.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kraco

I reckon Shun-inside-of-Saki probably denied it because labelling someone a fiend is nothing but easy labelling. It's kind of like calling someone an enemy without trying to understand anything about the other side.

---

That does make much more sense, I took it way too literally.

UTW - Episode 24


--------------------------------------------











TEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEASE.




"Make some sense, Saki."
"Maybe next episode."

:(

The mirror idea was so stupid. As if queerats never looked into the surface of a lake or river.

Also, didn´t they explain some episodes ago how just throwing the powder towards the "fiend" wouldn´t work, because it would make the powder vanish before it that could reach it? I mean, all it takes is some simple telekinetic shield, and the powder would have no chance to get close to the fiend.

Btw when did Saki obtain the psychobuster? Must have slept for two minutes during last episode, lol.

Also, the fiend is a he? Always thought it is a girl. Whatevs.

Anyhow, Saki had several stupid ideas there. "Give it a chance" she says. Then wants to make it realize that it is human. Well, silly girl, what would happen then? Yes, insta-death, death feedback. How generous of you. ALSO, even if the fiend would realize it is human, so what? From what I gathered: Death feedback kills you, if you KNOW about death feedback. If all the fiend realized was being human, it still wouldn´t know that harming fellow humans would result in suicide. Which leads me to another question: Just how is death feedback being "installed" into humans´ brains anyway? It can´t be purely genetic, otherwise the "fiend" would be dead, no matter what it thinks of itself.

To conclude, I´d like to say how awesome the queerats are. This show isn´t about those annoying, arrogant human brats, it´s about the freedom move of queerats. Kiroumaru layed out the facts. Even though he doesn´t like Yakomaru´s methods, he planned the same thing. It also shows what a bunch of pricks humans are/were. Zero consideration for this other intelligent race. "Weeding" them out whenever they thought it right. To be honest, I hope Yakomaru wins. Have Saki be his love slave or something for maximum damage.

PS: Favorite moment of this episode: When Satoru stood in front of the fiend, after the mirror had been broken. No defence, nothing. Just that overwhelming terror of the fiend. Facing his end. The chills. Wow.

I'll be happy if by the next episode Saki actually does something, even if it's just sense.

It was so anticlimactic after these episodes that the bioweapon simply got burned away the moment it was used. I wasn't expecting this show to end like Planet of the Apes with its Alpha-Omega bomb... But come on.

@MFauli:

Using powder against Fiend

I don't remember any episode where they said it wouldn't work. If it was something you could visualise you could burn it, but a fiend likely doesn't know about powdered weapons being thrown at him. (might blow up the canister though). Plus, the fiend was supposed to be downwind, so the powder travels faster.

Mirror

This was forced, I agree. The fiend did travel to Tokyo on a boat, after all. It's hard to imagine that it never once had the desire to look at itself. That red hair should give it away.

death feedback

We've established that the feedback is via hypnosis when they seal your cantus. Your brain "learns" to suffocate yourself when you attack a humanoid. Maybe since cantus users have the power to project their thoughts into the world, the idea that you suffocate yourself actually becomes real via your own mental powers.

What also doesn't quite make sense is why Kiroumaru still sided with Saki when they had the psycho-buster. His reason for abandoning the thought of killing humans was because he concluded that there is no way to upturn them. The fact that Saki obtained the psychobuster is proof that they now have the ability.. though I suppose it's not anywhere near enough to kill the entire human race unless the queerats learn to manufacture it. Their technology is still way off from doing that right now.

I don't know who I dislike more at this point: Saki, or Shun.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

What also doesn't quite make sense is why Kiroumaru still sided with Saki when they had the psycho-buster. His reason for abandoning the thought of killing humans was because he concluded that there is no way to upturn them. The fact that Saki obtained the psychobuster is proof that they now have the ability.. though I suppose it's not anywhere near enough to kill the entire human race unless the queerats learn to manufacture it. Their technology is still way off from doing that right now.

---

It's possible Kiroumaru has since changed his opinions a little, due to witnessing Squealer's actions. In the past he wanted a WMD to be able to fight humans, who were arbitrary masters and arrogantly treated queerats like animals, useful animals but animals nonetheless. However, Squealer's reign is hardly better now. In fact it's even worse since Squealer treats his own kind no better than humans. In Squealer's world anybody opposing Squealer's ideas is to be eradicated and the rest are just tools. At least Kiroumaru saw that humans tried to protect each other and in fact are unable to kill other humans. It might be he's now wishing for a middle road.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

I don't know who I dislike more at this point: Saki, or Shun.

---

It's a bit too early to be hating Shun. Do we even know he's anything but a fragment of Saki's insanity?

I'm guessing Saki's plan is to ask Kiroumaru to talk to the fiend in the Queer rat tongue or something. Considering Kiroumaru is a queer rat, so he has the appearance and the language. It might be too silly or obvious a solution, but I don't care at this point anymore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by animus

I'm guessing Saki's plan is to ask Kiroumaru to talk to the fiend in the Queer rat tongue or something. Considering Kiroumaru is a queer rat, so he has the appearance and the language. It might be too silly or obvious a solution, but I don't care at this point anymore.

---

That's what I think too. Sounds like a Saki-plan. Peace it out.

What I really want to know: Where the hell are Maria and Mamoru? Poisoned by queerats during their hospitality stay? Did they ever even get away, or did queerats poisoned them, lobotomised them, then kept them alive long enough to bear a child?

I really think saki should get way more shit for doing that bs, everyone else dying for them to save humanity then she decides one more life is too much

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

What I really want to know: Where the hell are Maria and Mamoru? Poisoned by queerats during their hospitality stay? Did they ever even get away, or did queerats poisoned them, lobotomised them, then kept them alive long enough to bear a child?

---

Squealer waited for Maria to give birth, and then killed the both of them, by force or by guile. Then he delivered their real bones to the villages. He said he would fake it, but at the council meeting it became clear that what was delivered were not faked, which is why Saki started crying at the festival.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryllharu

Squealer waited for Maria to give birth, and then killed the both of them, by force or by guile. Then he delivered their real bones to the villages. He said he would fake it, but at the council meeting it became clear that what was delivered were not faked, which is why Saki started crying at the festival.

---

So did Maria and Mamouru end up escaping at all? Or did they take shelter in Squealer's camp for 10 months? That would have meant the council was happy to wait for 10 months for the bones as well.

edit: Hmm, he did say it could "take some time". Damn Squealer.

Episode 25 Final - UTW





- - - - - - -





Japanese non-cantus humans sure suffered a miserable fate. I wish this show had been longer and Squealer had been less monstrous in his actions and even more subtle and guileful. And patient of course. So that he and his decisions wouldn't have appeared so evil. Now this show kind of ended with two bad sides, the more powerful one retaining its supremacy and the weaker one reduced back to near oblivion. Though naturally it was clear the humans were bad from the beginning since the flashbacks showed them originally witlessly violent and murderous. However, this last episode again showed they aren't deep down much better even now, they just have a civilized icing on top of them, partially forced by the death feedback.

It feels like all the good people died in this show and the bad ones survived... That's too realistic!

Damn.Dammit.
I was close to crying three times during this episode. First, when Squealer just stood next to the dead "fiend", ignoring that two Cantus users are there. Then when he was in the court. And finally, when Saki reminisced to his "living remains", talking about past events. Damn.

Good lost, Evil won. That is my conclusion for this anime. What´s so irritating is that other than 10-years older (but un-aged lol) Saki´s diary writing, nobody within the dominant human society appeared to chance anything about this mess. There´s so much arrogance going on, incredible. Even Satoru (who totally looks like Link from Legend of Zelda) replied to Squealer´s honest words "You could be punished to death for that right now". WTF?! That´s exactly what Squealer meant, you dumbass! ALL the dominant humans in this series always treated the queerats as lesser beings. They never acknowledged these poor beings´ feelings.

And Squealer is now one of my favorite heroes of all time. Yeah, maybe he was on a bit of a power trip, but all he did was for his people´s sake. I was close to screaming when he explained all the sacrificing of his own people. "If I had won, it´d have all been worth it. But I lost ... that´s why I deserve to die." FUCK! I wanted to hug him so much. Poor guy. Poor, poor guy.

And that´s that.
Definitely no happy end. And I wonder what Saki and Satoru will do, if their first child turns out to be potentially dangerous and the society wants it dead. Not much explained there either.
Go, queerats.

Saki didn't age because she probably got to master Tomiko's DNA repairing techniques.

Regarding the ending, yes, very realistic. Survival of the fittest/strongest in the long term, regardless of morals/ethics.
And even worse, thanks to one of the most evolved/smartest queerat ever: Kiromaru.

Really, Cantus humans from the past did worse than a genocide by modifying the non cantus humans DNA to turn them into queerats. It's really a cheap price to pay, having to kill every child you think could harm your community.
With their DNA engineering capabilities, they could have removed Cantus from appearing and give the death-feedback to everyone.
Or Cantus and deathfeedback for everyone, but Cantus management is too tedious, so I prefer the former.
But since they were evil from the beginning, that was not the route taken.

As for what they did to squealer, that was clearly not from an advanced and good civilization.
They've been so far as to let the poor thing in a blob state when they were not able to get enough suffering feedback. Cause I think the poor thing wasn't able to shout or react at all in his last state.



Now, since they didn't show us if they did find the stolen babies, there's hope for an OVA where the queerats use them with even more care...

This whole time I was trying to figure out why the humans would put themselves in such a position where they can't defend themselves against dangerous humans. Apparently they thought they had all the dangerous humans under control save for the fiends. I guess when you're as evil and cruel as the humans are, the solution they came up with to try and create a utopian society was actually quite good. They still need a way to deal with fiends though.

And I'm with Fauli on this one, evil won. Yakomaru is Spartacus, he's William Wallace. Fucking Kimomaru is a tool and a house slave. I'm so mad right now.

So death feedback was genetic after all? AND there's something called attack inhibition? They did a good job in making me forget that (or even bringing attack inhibition up at all).

Saki's plan was much better and practical than I had initially thought too.

Best show this season. I really wished Psycho-pass was more like this.

This goes straight up in my top 5 of all time

the ending is bittersweet, hope we get a 2nd season or at least an ova, anyone know how it did with ratings in japan and dvd sales ?

is there even manga material for more?

It was a novel, an actual novel, not a light novel. Two volumes (it is hard to tell on Amazon.co.jp since I can't read Japanese). I believe it is completed, despite what wikipedia says. About 1000 pages in total, and the anime covered it.

Though there is a manga spinoff version, it isn't the same plot, it is an ecchi and yuri version. It's like how the Mai-Hime/Mai-Otome mangas are completely different from their respective anime series, but with similar premise and characters. The art isn't bad, I'll give it that. It's like a cross between Yabuki Kentaro (To Love Ru) for the humans and Oku Hiroya (Gantz) for the queerrats and monsters.

An ecchi version ... interesting ....

:P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ryllharu

It was a novel, an actual novel, not a light novel. Two volumes (it is hard to tell on Amazon.co.jp since I can't read Japanese). I believe it is completed, despite what wikipedia says. About 1000 pages in total, and the anime covered it.

---

Does Wiki says the manga has 2 volumes and is ongoing. The novel is just one book, right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

An ecchi version ... interesting ....

:P

---

If you didn't know, your Saki-reproductive-slave one-off is out. >_>

Ok, just read the beginning of the manga. Wtf, not only is Saki 10x as hot, she´s got ass cleavage. lol

Um ... continue please :>

Yay for you Squealer love :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MFauli

Ok, just read the beginning of the manga. Wtf, not only is Saki 10x as hot, she´s got ass cleavage. lol

Um ... continue please :>

---

She's cuter, that's for sure. I'd still prefer the gaunt version of the anime though. It conveys the "future, godly human" plus horror feel a lot better. The manga's more comical and wouldn't have worked with that dark theme music the way the anime did.

Rushed, but very satisfying ending considering the theme of the overall series; jesus, squealers fate wasn't a pretty one.

And I loved Saki's animation and how she...developed throughout the time-skips.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buffalobiian

Does Wiki says the manga has 2 volumes and is ongoing. The novel is just one book, right?

---

Two volumes in Japan, about 500 pages each. The companies stating interest in translating into English say it is a total of 1000 pages, and they would produce just one unified novel. That said, the translation seems unlikely, due to finances and low interest.