kira being hated and destiny plan

ok, now all throughout the series ever since they tried to assasinate kira and lacas, they've been saying that kira is a nusence, and that kira's existance can not be tolerated ( said by rey and the other clone from reg SEED ) yet in 49,we just heard rey telling shin that the destiny plan in simple words was to make perfect beings JUST LIKE KIRA ( WHO THEY WANT DEAD CUZ HE IS TOO PERFECT FOR THEM ) so im like really f'ing confused. why try to kill someone who u aspire to be? lolz this just buggin me hella inside

Jealousy, Envy, Fear, Hate and so forth and a mix of all and in between. I mean, think about it. Human nature, people fear what they do not know (most of the time). At the same time, Kira is what "they should be" yet as long as Kira is around they are "inferior" to him. I won't go into too much detail, but just trying to touch the surface of the question.

I believe the biggest problem they have with Kira is that he was SUPPOSED to be the Ultimate Coordinator, the one who could use his power to guide/control the otherwise retarded masses that are the human race. Instead Kira goes through life as a civilian, gets stuck up in Lacus Clyne's No-Killing BS and then retires to a remote island at the end of SEED. I'd imagine Dullindal thinks he has skipped out on his responsibility...

As for Rey.... I don't know.... He said he wanted to fight so that there would never be people like him or Shinn, the super-killers if you will, and thats why he'd rather wipe people's brains with Destiny Plan. I also believe he shares Dullindal's sentiments about Kira not playing a bigger role in guiding humanity, seeing as how Rey will die shortly and wants Shinn to be the Ultimate Coordinator Arbiter/Controller that Kira could have been.

He also probably hates Kira because Kira and the Lacus Faction just seem content to stop the battles in the here-and-now, and don't seem to have any bigger plans for preventing further wars in the future.

Or I might be totally wrong....

actually dullindaal didnt really want to get rid of kira but he feels that lacus clyne has messed up his head(which is true). This must be how dullindaall feels(remember that recap episode with dullindaal and the chess) where he says it was unfortunate that the two met. Rey on the other hand does have reason to want kira dead. And remember, dullindaal and rau's beliefs are very different. Dullindaal also commented to shinn when handing him over the destiny that kira's fate was unfortunate. So, in essence, dullindaal probably would want to keep kira around if kira would stop listening to lacus

ENVY, Kira is like the Cordinator-Cordinator, not a Plain-Cordinator.

What good is the ultimate coordinator if he is your enemy? [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

That's right Terra, the only good thing your enemy can be is dead!

To quote an anarchist revolutionary, "Two are fighting for power... Both want to know who their allies are, but, it's hard to read strangers' minds. So, why not kill 'em all and bring in your own people?"

A cookie if someone can tell me who said this!

And to go back to the Destiny Plan, do we even know HOW its going to be implemented? What kind of machinery is behind it? Which people will be effected by it? It still seems very vague and murky to me.... I wish they'd explain it before it gets foiled (which it inevitably will)

I can't really tell if you are being sarcastic. [img]i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif[/img]

Actually, if u like to fight...he's a very good enemy to have....as he'll always be a challenge...and it will help u aspire to become better than he is through hard work and dedication

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: death-wing
ok, now all throughout the series ever since they tried to assasinate kira and lacas, they've been saying that kira is a nusence, and that kira's existance can not be tolerated ( said by rey and the other clone from reg SEED ) yet in 49,we just heard rey telling shin that the destiny plan in simple words was to make perfect beings JUST LIKE KIRA ( WHO THEY WANT DEAD CUZ HE IS TOO PERFECT FOR THEM ) so im like really f'ing confused. why try to kill someone who u aspire to be? lolz this just buggin me hella inside

---

I don't think you have grasped what the destiny plan is. It is not to make more people like Kira. Dullindal want to create the perfect society for example playing around with the genes so miners become mindless brutes with one hell of a physique but nothing to say. Which will minimize the trouble this group gives you and maximize the profit.

He wants to do this with all of mankind so that man can live in peace without wars. Making more Perfect beings like Kira is the opposite of what he wants. He basicly wants to keep people from talking back and having their own ideas.

Though I will admit that I don't know much about this my personal understanding the motivation of these characters is limited, but I will state what I believe anyways:

The term "Ultimate Coordinator" refers to Kira's mental and physical capabilities. The major problem Gil has with Kira is that even with all these given talents Kira doesn't use them the way Gil believes he "should". According to the Destiny plan everyone has their role in the world, and are required to use their abilities to the fullest of their potential in order to fulfill their role. Kira being the "Ultimate Coordinator" is also means he is the "Ultimate" failure of Destiny Plan. Kira out of everyone has the greatest potential, yet because he doesn't use it. The fact that its the "Ultimate waste" of potential means it represents ultimate thing the Destiny Plan is trying to get rid of.

As a side note I dont believe Kira being the "Ultimate Coordinator" meant be leader of the world in Gil's mind. To Gil it always meant Kira's role was one of the "Ultimate" soldier. Gil sees himself as the ultimate leader, as shown from that cute little animation when they were revealing the Destiny Plan. I think in his mind as well Lucus is either superior to him in this way, or is the biggest threat as the next greatest leader. Partly because of the influence she holds over the majority of the populus of the world but also because she has the abilities of a great leader. (I know many of you will hate that I said that but yeah... It's because of her abilities as a leader that everyone listens to her and it's why Gil had to use a fake "Lucus" in order to get into the position he's in now)

As for Rey's view on why Kira should die, half I say would be because Gil says so and the other half is because Kira represents to Rey, his own failure as a Coordinator. Kira has everything Rey will never have even though they were both artificially manufacteured for basically the same purposes. Rey doesn't have a place in the Destiny Plan as he state himself even though his reason for living is it fit into Gil's plans and do as he's told. Kira on the other hand has a role in Gil's Destiny Plan yet he chooses not to accept it. It's kinda like a double slap in the face I believe. I may revise my opinion once I watch 49 again. But this is all from memory for now

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: splash
And remember, dullindaal and rau's beliefs are very different. Dullindaal also commented to shinn when handing him over the destiny that kira's fate was unfortunate. So, in essence, dullindaal probably would want to keep kira around if kira would stop listening to lacus

---

Personally I think Rau and Dullindal were working together. Rau does the work to wipe out the people that are already around and be the "devil", then Dullindal comes in as the savior of mankind and impliments his Destiny Plan. Since Rau died at the end of SEED having failed his role, Dullindal was forced to take other steps. I have no proof for any of this, just opinion.

Well we definately know they knew each other back then, even before he had to use the pills and the mask. What is with those pills anyway? Dullindal GAVE them to Rau, right? so what the hell are they for?

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: redemption2MKII
Well we definately know they knew each other back then, even before he had to use the pills and the mask. What is with those pills anyway? Dullindal GAVE them to Rau, right? so what the hell are they for?

---

The Cloning process is imperfect. The pills are to stabalize the condition so they don't die from it.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: Curium

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: redemption2MKII
Well we definately know they knew each other back then, even before he had to use the pills and the mask. What is with those pills anyway? Dullindal GAVE them to Rau, right? so what the hell are they for?

---

The Cloning process is imperfect. The pills are to stabalize the condition so they don't die from it.

---

Is the cloning process imperfect? I had always assumed that the problem was that cells can only divide a certain number of times, something called Hayflick limit i think, and if you clone someone then the clone someone who is in their 30s it is like a new person whose cells have already undergone 30 years of division, that is why Rey's telomeres are short i think, which would greatly shorten the life expectancy. I thought the pills were somehow suppose to slow down cell division or something, although I just assumed this without noticing anything in the show saying so.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: Freki

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: Curium

Quote:

---

Originally posted by: redemption2MKII
Well we definately know they knew each other back then, even before he had to use the pills and the mask. What is with those pills anyway? Dullindal GAVE them to Rau, right? so what the hell are they for?

---

The Cloning process is imperfect. The pills are to stabalize the condition so they don't die from it.

---

Is the cloning process imperfect? I had always assumed that the problem was that cells can only divide a certain number of times, something called Hayflick limit i think, and if you clone someone then the clone someone who is in their 30s it is like a new person whose cells have already undergone 30 years of division, that is why Rey's telomeres are short i think, which would greatly shorten the life expectancy. I thought the pills were somehow suppose to slow down cell division or something, although I just assumed this without noticing anything in the show saying so.

---

I've never heard of all that before, but personally I would call that an imperfection in the cloning process wouldn't you?

I figured the issue with Raul and Rey wasn't they were a clone its that they basically age to death. As the clones were created and had to age faster in order to be pilots of any worth sooner. This is mainly presented in my eye's by Rey growing from being a little kid when he was with Raul to 3 years later him becomming a full teenager and a MS pilot. In my understanding the pills have just been a way to slow the aging process to a more acceptable rate however as they are constantly aging at a much faster rate then a normal human they will die much faster.

yea the pills make the clones from aging faster

http://www.Imaclone.com

The telometer that Rey was referring to is that his cells are dying and thus he is dying as his "telometer" shortens. According to this article, Fukuda equates human cloning to sheeps. It is not true of all genes of different life forms such as humans & no one yet knows because no one has tried cloning human beings. Telometer is what tells the cell how 'old' you are and is one of nature's biological clocks. Telometers are what sequences of DNA that divides as DNA divides but DNA replication is not perfect thus telometer are cut back each time the cells divide. Dna are in sections & your whole original embryotic DNA can be labeled your original "telometer." Each time after your DNA replicates a portion of the DNA sequences is lost. Also each cell have a different "telometers." In other words immortality is very nearly obtained if we can understand how our telometers & DNA works.

Your brains cells for example stop dividing after you've reached past you teens & your intelligence is most certainly influenced by your experience from childhood to teen years. This is one way of saying when a person becomes an adult though it varies person to person just as much as height. As of now, the limit of cloning seem to be that we are dependant upon mature cells & them & implanting it into an existing person...ahem. Because it is aged & because of the telometer factor that it is inevitable. I can't believe they have all that technology with DNA & still can't even work out gene manipulation or at least cloning. Kira's existence proves that all they can do so far is make a person disease free, have the perfect bodies & have nine lives, nothing more. That blue pill must be some strong stuff if it can slow aging & i wonder why the higher up coordinators dont know about it & grow some for themselves!

because dependance on anything is a nuisence and becomes like the drug those druggies took in SEED. you become completely dependant on them, if the drugs taken away, your screwed, if the pills taken away, rey's screwed. he'll age faster than a strawberry.