translated 222 manga discussion

[ohpeekaboo]

it's out, go get it at narutofan.com

and yes, itachi is a psycho.

i knew it wouldn't be some "framed good guy" crap.

thanks kishimoto i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

[Kumiriko]

What group did the Translation?

[Jakob]

Bakafish

[Mut]

man, itachi is so cool and badass. it must suck to have a different character as a favorite.

[Himura_san]

He's not as cool and badass as Rock Lee and Gai sensei.

[Kumiriko]

I was ether Tierd or it wasnt so coherent for me as i read it. Good chapter thought

[hopeknight]

Originally posted by: Himura_san
He's not as cool and badass as Rock Lee and Gai sensei.

Itachi IS badass. Rock Lee and Gai are just comic relief.

I'm not minding this set of flashbacks at all. I don't see why everyone was complaining. This is showing some great insight into the Uchiha clan. There probably won't be anymore than 2 more chapters of flashbacks, but who knows, they might be able to finish it in the next one.

[AnimeEd]

i for one did not understand a page of that translated text

[Death BOO Z]

Itachi is a maniac bitch, there isn't much more to it... everyone's gonna get killed in a few chapters anyway, so they don't matter...

[Hokage-IV]

Originally posted by: Mut@t@
man, itachi is so cool and badass. it must suck to have a different character as a favorite.




lol......that was sad

[Stoopider]

Sounds like his another Orochimaru.. to achieve everything you have to throw away all that doesn't matter on your path to become the ultimate ninja.

[SasukesGirL]

Originally posted by: Stoopider
Sounds like his another Orochimaru.. to achieve everything you have to throw away all that doesn't matter on your path to become the ultimate ninja.

Probably where sasuke been getting ideas to just leave konoha. I think sasuke isnt coming back.

[Assertn]

i agree.....bakafish can be more accurate at times, but it can also be more confusing as well

from what i gathered, those guys were part of the police corps, and they questioned why itachi wasnt at the meeting recently, and that another guy who was killed didnt attend as well....the other guy was found dead, and it was supposed to be a suicide, but they suspect itachi killed him....

most of the lines itachi was saying seemed deep, but i couldnt really catch most of it...however im pretty sure he was saying stuff about how the society and clans and government shouldnt dominate a person's personal beliefs or ambitions or something

[Saruto]

Can i have a link please.

thx


edit: ...oh...i just saw the first post that he said it i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

[KevKoN]

narutofan isnt working for me, can someone post a direct link to it? thx.

[hinatacretu]

i still tink the massacre of ya own family is sick... so my verdict???
itachi is so UNcool

[AlbinoFury]

flashbacks are fine, but friggin month long flashbacks gotta end, take us back to the naruto sasuke fight pronto i say. once this goes to anime itll translate to about an hour or mores worth of flashback, gah!

[Assertn]

the newest chapter had sooo little plot development....at least much less than my expectations had for it anyway

one thing that confused me though.......was that the 3 guys came regarding a meeting that itachi skipped, right? Well, if itachi is anbu, then one would assume the meeting he skipped was one for anbus......
however near the end of that chapter, doesnt the leader of them (or maybe itachi's dad, couldnt tell)...say they would be out of their jurisdiction to arrest him since they were police corps and he was anbu?

therefore, why would THEY be involved with anbu affairs like meeting attendance if they are police corps, rather than anbu?

[Lenas]

I actually think this chapter had the most development concerning Itachi's character.

It showed him change from someone just trying to move up the ranks (joining ANBU) to someone that, now, doesn't care about rank (or village, affiliation, clan) and just wants to become stronger. He looks down on those restrained by such things and finally shows how he feels. However, I think he *does* care about Sasuke from a couple things. One, thinking to himself, he said he loved Shisui like a brother, so that makes me think he loves Sasuke. Second, when Sasuke yells at him to stop, without thinking he automatically drops to his knees and apologizes - meaning that he cares what his brother thinks, or he wants to spare his little brother the sight of a major asswhooping that was about to take place.

I don't think Itachi meant for Sasuke to see the slaughter of the Uchiha clan.

[ohpeekaboo]

assertn,

i got the impression they were talking about an uchiha meeting and the only two who didn't show were itachi and shisui (and i guess if one's to argue sasuke wasn't there, it was probably cause he was too young to attend). they just happened to be MP corp involved with murder investigations and crap while itachi is doing his own extra cirricular activities w/ the anbu i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif

and, as for this chapter having little development,

i disagree. this chapter gave us more insight into itachi's character, hinted that maybe he went and killed "uchiha's best man" and with itachi's "vessel" talk allow us to see there's more to him than just trying to see how good he is by killing off his clan..

i'm intrigued to see where this will go, and i'm hoping we see more of the background before we get back to the naruto/sasuke fight

[Terracosmo]

I think it ruled like blue hell.

[onlyelliot]

you guys are looking at what itachi is saying all wrong
he wasnt saying that rank, clan, duty etc. are worthless and only the pursuit of strength is important
his main point is that all these puruits are corupt because they make you lose sight of whats actually important
he never really defines what he deems as important, but it seems to me that all the other clan members are afraid of him because he does not succumb to the same corrupt values as everyone else
all of there beliefs/values are therefor threatened by itachi's existance
i have a feeling that the slaughtering of the clan isnt going to be initiated by itachi but will at least start as self defense

[Stoopider]

Self defence?? LoL. Sounds too unlikely.

The way he's talking about it, sounds more likely that he's pursuing after power, because thats whats most important to him.

[RasenDori]

Originally posted by: AlbinoFury
flashbacks are fine, but friggin month long flashbacks gotta end, take us back to the naruto sasuke fight pronto i say. once this goes to anime itll translate to about an hour or mores worth of flashback, gah!

the anime will probally break it up in between things like they did with the gaara flashbacks

yes!!! i dont have to doubt that itachi murdered the clan for his own amibitions anymore this chapter proves it! only thing is i feel that there is something up with his relationship with sasuke...the speech he gave him in the last chapter...him giving up upon sasukes comand...and the fact that he kept him alive...there is still more than meets the eye here

[onlyelliot]

pursuing power??? LoL Sounds too simplistic.

he only said that once and that was when he was obviously trying to piss sasuke off
plus we also know that itachi believes brotherly hatred to be an important thing (for growth/motivation?)so he very likely just said that he killed everybody to test himself to piss sasuke off (among other reasons most likely)
Itachi is most likely the most complex character so far introduced in Naruto yet everyone keeps trying to reduce his motives to some simplistic explenation
Itachi definately is not completely evil and he most definately isnt a misunderstood good guy
Not a single vilain with the exception of maybe Orochimaru has been pure "evil", but plenty have been confused and emotionaly underdevoloped psychos

also i said STARTED in self defense from the looks of it all the other Uchihas are threatened by Itachi and would get rid of him at any chance they got
Im thinking they see an excuse with perhaps blaming for this murder and go after him Itachi retaliates, slightly too harshly(he flips out and kills them) then more Uchihas try to stop him because hes gone too far Itachi does no when to quit and doesnt stop till every last one who trys to stop him dies

[Gods_Son]

Good chapter, I don't mind this flashback.

[Mut]

Originally posted by: onlyelliot
Itachi is most likely the most complex character so far introduced in Naruto yet everyone keeps trying to reduce his motives to some simplistic explenation

just because itachi is a complex character that doesn't mean he can't have simple motives. for example, he simply wanted to take naruto away because he was ordered to.

[onlyelliot]

yes i realize that he can have simple motives however you gave an horrible example Itachi isnt some obedient dog who does whatever he is told to by his superiors so he wouldnt "simply" take the orders of anyone in less their motives paralleled his own
that does not sound really all that "simple"

my point is that a good story teller gives his characters depth and i think that we would all agree that Naruto has some great story telling
if you want to understand itachi then you have to look at him as more than just a "psycho" or "not a psycho" type of guy

even the simplist of actions have complex motivation

[Kurapica]

Nice chapter. I'm starting to like Itachi more and more.

[AlbinoFury]

the inane version is out btw, u can get at narutofan. After reading through with the better translations that they provide it came together much better, it seems maybe itachi left sasuke the way he did to gain power in the same vein that itachi himself pushed everything aside for power.

[RasenDori]

Originally posted by: onlyelliot
yes i realize that he can have simple motives however you gave an horrible example Itachi isnt some obedient dog who does whatever he is told to by his superiors so he wouldnt "simply" take the orders of anyone in less their motives paralleled his own
that does not sound really all that "simple"

my point is that a good story teller gives his characters depth and i think that we would all agree that Naruto has some great story telling
if you want to understand itachi then you have to look at him as more than just a "psycho" or "not a psycho" type of guy

even the simplist of actions have complex motivation

why is it that he just cant be taking orders? itachi rose the the ranks of the leaf by following orders and my be doing the same in the akatsuki. you give this arsertions about itachi being a complex character but never give any reason y some things cant be simple...not everything has to be complex. i think that it feeds into the complexity that is itachi if his motives have a simple reason. its kind of erie and leaves you asking what is he thinking. and there is plenty of depth to itachi that he done know...and we will learn it all later.

[Death BOO Z]

well, apparntly, Itachi said all those things just to piss off Sasuke, and he also kills the clan just to get Sasuke mad at him...

if Itachi was able to kill shisui (whatever that sucide guy name is), i don't think that anyone in the Uchiha clan could rival him, so he decided to force Sasuke (his brother, and therefore, the person who is most likely to have the same strentgh as him) to get better and to hate him...

but becuase he was afriad that someone else will attack Sasuke, he contatcs the largest crime orginazation, and promises to work for them as long as they promise not to hurt Sasuke. but Orochimaru hears that, and quits th akatsuki...

[RasenDori]

...that seems to be far off for me. there is one major hole...what would the akatsuki want with sasuke? i think that itachi joined the akatsuki because the members are as strong as he is. like he said when you have power you can become arogant and isolated...the akatsukis members are powerful, arogant and isolated from their respective villages

[Assertn]

last week i was looking forward to seeing itachi totally mess up those 3 guys that came to his house, and then conclude the flashbacks shortly after.....and instead i just got a discussion about how they think that itachi mightve possibly killed some guy....and then itachi saying that he didnt, and then talking smack. It is interesting and all, but not worth waiting a week for

[JonSamurai]

Very interesting chapter indeed, it makes me believe that Itachi felt he had to slaughter the clan because of all their "corrupt" ambitions/motives. Of course, he spared sasuke cuz he either wanted someone to punish him for his action, or he felt Sasuke could be different from the other clan members.

[onlyelliot]

i explained why he cant "just" be taking orders
itachi has a serious problem with athority as he explains in the chapter following orders for the sake of loyalty to the clan, village, or whatever makes you lose sight of what is really important
if itachi says something like this does that really sound like the type of guy who would be someones lapdog hell no
to me it seems like itachi is rejecting the fate he is bound to as the most powerful uchiha
yes he probably has followed many orders thus far but im sure its not out of respect for his superiors or anything like that he just sees these missions as ways to test himself/bide time to figure out how to escape his fate as the uchiha clan's poster boy

if you are going to accuse me of not having support for my arguement you could at least try reading my posts first

[Mut]

Originally posted by: onlyelliot
i explained why he cant "just" be taking orders
itachi has a serious problem with athority...

he's taking orders from the higher eschelons of akatsuki. kthx.

[RasenDori]

Originally posted by: onlyelliot
i explained why he cant "just" be taking orders
itachi has a serious problem with athority as he explains in the chapter following orders for the sake of loyalty to the clan, village, or whatever makes you lose sight of what is really important
if itachi says something like this does that really sound like the type of guy who would be someones lapdog hell no
to me it seems like itachi is rejecting the fate he is bound to as the most powerful uchiha
yes he probably has followed many orders thus far but im sure its not out of respect for his superiors or anything like that he just sees these missions as ways to test himself/bide time to figure out how to escape his fate as the uchiha clan's poster boy

if you are going to accuse me of not having support for my arguement you could at least try reading my posts first

i read your damned post the first time and i read it again a second time and i STILL dont sufficient analysis to support why itachi cannot have a simple motive. i argued before that itachis simplistic reasoning for murdering his family and clan only serves to make him more complex., and i dont buy itachi has a problem with authority...he only problems with the clan.
...now here is the reasoning that something simple can lead to the complexity of a character. itachi doesnt follow the akatsuki because of loyalty, but because he believes what they support (whatever that is). thus itachi has reached kolhbergs 4th stage of moral development where a person follows and/or do certain actions based upon entirely on what they see as right. its the most complex part of moral development that not everybody reaches in life. (if you dont know kolhbergs analysis on moral development...look it up...its interesting) and there is a decent analysis on how the simplicity of itachi killing the clan, and his reasons for following the akatsuki make him more complex...now i gave my argument...wheres yours?

[onlyelliot]

damn RasenDori we are saying the exact same thing lol
my whole point is that on surface level his actions appear simple but noone seems to wont to look any deeper than that thats where the complexity comes from
I dont think Itachis actions should be taken for their surface value because of the undrlying complexity of his motives
Really i dont know why you are arguing with me when we are both making the same points
maybe i wasnt specific enough in what i was saying sorry but i really agree with what you are saying
oh and btw i dont think Itachi was sugesting that he himself has become arrogent from his strength but was more stating as a concern he has for himself

and yeah Mutata he is taking order but read RasenDori's post for my reasoning of why its more complex than that

[RasenDori]

then i apolygize

[Superman]

Originally posted by: Mut@t@
man, itachi is so cool and badass. it must suck to have a different character as a favorite.

HAHAHAHA really funny post

[Terracosmo]

This chapter seriously calls for a sig change. *Points down*

[Hakeem_21]

Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
the newest chapter had sooo little plot development....at least much less than my expectations had for it anyway

one thing that confused me though.......was that the 3 guys came regarding a meeting that itachi skipped, right? Well, if itachi is anbu, then one would assume the meeting he skipped was one for anbus......
however near the end of that chapter, doesnt the leader of them (or maybe itachi's dad, couldnt tell)...say they would be out of their jurisdiction to arrest him since they were police corps and he was anbu?

therefore, why would THEY be involved with anbu affairs like meeting attendance if they are police corps, rather than anbu?


I think the meeting was a clans meeting not a anbu meeting since only Itachi is in Anbu not the three dudes.

I read inane version and i guess he didnt go to clan meeting since he thinks Uchiha is a wortless clan.


The police leader was Itachis dad.

[PSJ]

wow itachi really is a badass. i love these kind of characters. calm and collected most of the time but when they snap they get crazy. cool to see him call the uchiha clan worthless cause it is indeed worthless.

[Ryllharu]

I hope they give us a real reason why Itachi is "testing the limits of his powers"

Him just going power lust crazy just doesn't seem to make sense with the way he's being portrayed earlier. I bet its some ANBU mission he did or someone he killed.

[DeluxSkillz]

Originally posted by: Ryllharu
I hope they give us a real reason why Itachi is "testing the limits of his powers"

Him just going power lust crazy just doesn't seem to make sense with the way he's being portrayed earlier. I bet its some ANBU mission he did or someone he killed.

i don't think so because itachi says this: hehe...it''s not always a good thing to be talented, if you have power, you will become isolated and arrogant.

it''s obvious he got powerful really really powerful and everyone praised him for his talent so he got power crazy and wanted to see how far he could push him self where his limit would be

[hinatacretu]

but killing ya own family even if they're weak is not acceptable... even by society today...

[DeluxSkillz]

Originally posted by: hinatacretu
but killing ya own family even if they're weak is not acceptable... even by society today...

so your point is? itachi killed his family and that''s that what does todays society have to do with the naruto universe? nothing, to itachi his parents and everyone else were just a measuring stick he probably felt regret after killing them all and kept sasuke alive to see if sasuke could surpass him and take revenge for the clan, the fact that itachi didn''t let himself be killed or captured by konoha is proof that he's a insane murderer

[Death BOO Z]

sorry, no way Itachi killed his clan just to test himself, he's too much of a calculated guy to do so...
my guess is that he's trainning Sasuke to fight him, and that's why he killed the clan and keeps getting on Sasuke's nervs all the time, he awaits for the time that another sharingan user will come to oppose him...


besides, it makes sense, seeing how everybodye else is crazy after Sasuke... Heck, he even has the largest flashback so far (if 223 will be another flashback, it makes 4 chapters in a row. Gaara only had 3 chapters, and most others had 2 or less).

[Knives122]

But this is taking so long though, we all thought we'd finally have a good fight in this arc but now we have to sit back and wait for this flashback to be over, its like they completely forgot about the fight and decided to do something else, If kishimoto is just wasting time to think of how hes going to do the fight then it better be by far the best one weve ever seen in this show, or this entire arc will just go to waste completely. IMO

[The Lord of Morning]

see i am happy we are having a nice relaxing flashback.. one i am not a big sasuke fan but i do like itachi and everyone was screaming for itachi info before. . so now they SHOULD be happy.

we have had a huge fight arc for a damn long time, i am happy for the rest. seeing the other genin's fight for months was draining to me. 3 weeks for each battle if not four. . ugh.

yeah looking forward to seeing naruto vs sasuke conclusion but will wait. we cant have a constant rush, the fight scenes are only good cause they are spaced out by info chapters.

[PSJ]

judging from what he said i guess he killed the clan to see if you are stronger as a group or as an individual. but all of the uchihas seem to be quite weird.

[Knives122]

They all seem really paranoid for some reason, like they know how strong Itachi really is but they dont really want to say anything out loud

[kaigan]

all uchiha's are garbage except itachi, he just a badass.

[The Lord of Morning]

i think he definatly killed the other uchiha. who was the 'best' among them before. as he said before, a ninja who polices other ninja's is an even greater ninja. the reason he killed the clan was to see if there were any ninja's who could police him, even grouped together they lost against him.

he definatly is the best uchiha at the time, but there are several hints that sasuke (whether you hate him or not) has more potential. not sure how orochi and others came upon this but i think itachi also believes so. he killed the clan for his own twisted test, but he saved sasuke because he still wants to push his brother and make him grow.

[xtort]

I really like this mini story arc. Itachi has been a mediocre typical super-bad-guy up to this point, and this has done nothing but flesh him out, in a way that I really like.

What strikes me about the arc is that we've been shown tons and tons of negative things about the Uchiha clan, most of them simple things people have said which ... well... don't make you feel all warm and tingly about the Uchiha family life. The relationship between Itachi and Sasuke has, from the beginning, been very warm. It really makes me wonder if the only reason Sasuke is alive is because he defied all that it meant to be Uchiha by the simple act of being a loving younger brother.

The whole arc seems to mitigate what from the beginning of the manga seemed/seems like a horrific act (uhh, killing your entire bloodline is a bad thing, right?) by saying succinctly that this family sucks.

This is good stuff.

-xtortout

[The Lord of Morning]

i dont think this minarc has justified killing the clan. actually i think it only strengthens the idea that itachi killed them to test himself. Before we thought there might be some other 'factor' that we didnt know about that caused his actions but it seems to me that his behavior is as portrayed, he is a ninja who wiped out his family to see if any could best him.

even though the uchiha family is strict and the dad is an ass that doesnt mean its ok to kill them! true the parents have extremely high expectations of their children but the mom seemed to be compassionate and itachi seems like an ok older brother overall. its not like he picks on sasuke or beats him up, he seems to have an honest love for his little bro.

in chapter 221, when sasuke and itachi are sitting beside each other and itachi says his speal, did you notice sasuke's report card? I thought that sasuke showed his brother, who then in response said how hard it was to be elite and how it can change a person. Itachi HAS gone beyond the abilities of the clan and sees himself as more then just an elite uchiha, he is an elite ninja that should nto be tied down by the simplistic notions of the clan. If he doesnt want to be what his parents expect him to be then by God he shouldnt have to be, although killing them all wasnt really the right choice

[Assertn]

the actions of a villian dont have to be justified

[Terracosmo]

If you seriously think this flashback is unnecessary and not justified, you are nothing but an idiot.
And I'm not even going to bother stating why as it should be completely clear.
Sasuke is a main character. Itachi is his brother. Itachi is cool. He killed his damn family. I for one would like to know exactly why. This isn't FORGETTING about the fight, this is making it even more dramatic once it starts. It's called story telling.

[PSJ]

lol terra you just explained why i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif and btw who said this flashback was unnecessary?

[Lefty]

If you kind of read into what itachi was to talking to Sasuke and said to the cop's, was that the clan was becoming stagnent and to complacient with the life they had come to regard as normal. I think Itachi killed the rest of the clan to ride it of the stagnation that had formed over the years. He left Sasuke because he knew that his little brouther had a lot of potentional it not more than itachi himself and would restor the Uchiha clan to former glory it once had.

[PSJ]

it doesnt matter if sasuke got more potential right now since he ran to orochimaru and wont grow more than what orochimaru can make him.

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Terracosmo
If you seriously think this flashback is unnecessary and not justified, you are nothing but an idiot.
And I'm not even going to bother stating why as it should be completely clear.
Sasuke is a main character. Itachi is his brother. Itachi is cool. He killed his damn family. I for one would like to know exactly why. This isn't FORGETTING about the fight, this is making it even more dramatic once it starts. It's called story telling.

i love the way terra speaks... such authority! yes!

+1 for terra

[Terracosmo]

*Collects props & bribes accordingly*

[Destroyor]

*bribes terra with free ramen coupon i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

Anyway correct me if I'm wrong but didn't rock lee said something about being the "first" backup or something? Ok I'm going to search back my chp now ...

[PSJ]

shouldnt you searce for chapter before posting? seems more logical that way......... because that makes your post completly unnecessary. altho i dont blame you i do the same sometimes i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

[Assertn]

what does lee have to do with any of this? maybe he knew the sand were coming? he WAS hangin around tsunade for a while afterall

oh, and before i forget.....
<gets out his bag of mad props, hands one to terra> i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

[xtort]

You guys kiss so much ass, I can smell your breath from here. As far as the flashback being necessary and justified, I believe it is and hope Kishi will back that belief with some more good storytelling, but... is it worth insulting a 12 year-old?... probably not.

Some people like manga just for the action, and whether they're idiots or not is debatable. That this story has changed in shape isn't. Much of the levity is gone, and some people (myself included) long for the goofiness of the original couple of arcs.

Regardless, this flashback will hopefully push the story much farther forward, if only by telling us what really happened to make Sasuke the sniveling piss-ant that he is. i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif I very much hope his relationship with Shisui is made clear quickly, as that's where the answer will be found. i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

-xtortout

[Kenshiro]

I agree with Xtort.

The fighting is badass, but there hasnt been a properly funny episode since Ero-Sennin and Naruto were looking for Tsunade.

[Ryllharu]

I was about to post the same thing soon, I miss the humor.