Strongest in Akatsuki?

[CapsuleCorpJX]

Is it Itachi? But it seems like Itachi is being used as a foot soldier, running missions for his boss. So are there ninjas in Akatsuki that are stronger than Itachi?

On the other hand, in the anime (and maybe the manga, I forget), Itachi states that trying to kill Jiraiya would only end in both sides dying in the best case, and that bringing MORE men would not matter. So does that mean that even if Itachi asked his boss to help, it would not matter? That might mean Itachi is stronger than anyone in his organization.

[PSJ]

no thats a translation error in the anime or just some crap they decided to throw in. he says nothing like that in the manga. all he says is that he overused his sharingan and must rest. you can work under ppl even if you are stronger than them the question is what does these ppl have that itachi wants, i doubt itachi is the one that wants kyuubi.

[raijin]

Actually, the current circulating translated manga chapter is incorrect (mistranslation)... Itachi says the same thing in the manga as he does in the anime.

[Knives122]

Anyway, right now Itachi is the strongest character introduced in Akatsuki, even if there are people above him, that doesnt mean they are stronger, they could just be the people who founded the group

[hornetmike]

Well i suppose it would make sense since Oro was also there and left. He most likely was not the strongest and therefore did not like that and left to become more powerful. he also did not like taking orders.

[PSJ]

Originally posted by: raijin
Actually, the current circulating translated manga chapter is incorrect (mistranslation)... Itachi says the same thing in the manga as he does in the anime.

hmm... wierd doesnt seem like something itachi would say "oh no i will die if i fight him lets run" thats basicly what he did.

just checked that chapter out and in it itachi is talking about the moon and the sun, how could someone translate that wrong? its more likely that he says he cant fight because he overused mangekyou sharingan, not like in the anime where he only says, we would die if we fight him.

[raijin]

Originally posted by: Pervert-Sennin Jiraiya
hmm... wierd doesnt seem like something itachi would say "oh no i will die if i fight him lets run" thats basicly what he did.
It appears the Itachi is well aware of Jiraiya's strength and abilities, which is why he decided to flee.



just checked that chapter out and in it itachi is talking about the moon and the sun, how could someone translate that wrong? its more likely that he says he cant fight because he overused mangekyou sharingan, not like in the anime where he only says, we would die if we fight him.
Well, translation mistakes do happen from time to time, it all depends on the translator's knowledge of Japanese. For that particular manga chapter, it seems the translator just goofed on the translation. He/she translated Amaterasu as "sun" and Tsukuyomi as "moon", when in fact Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi are both Shinto deities of the sun and moon respectively. But in reference to Naruto, Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi are both techniques of Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan.

Although this may sound ironic, you can't trust some of the manga translations as 100% accurate unless they are from a reliable source such as Toriyama's World, Inane, BakaFish, etc. But, even reliable sources make mistakes from time to time.

[Kurapica]

Funny to see the Itachi-fanboys not wanting to believe that somebody might be stronger than Itachi.

[Toruxxx]

the strongest in the the akatsuki is a person called fred! itachi is nothing compared to fred

[Zhan]

itachi sucks...relys on his sharingan too much, without his sharingan he would be weak as. Thats wat pisses me off about sharingan users...they are too sharingan dependent....know wat im getting at?

[Toruxxx]

yes but i supposed have to live wit it orochimaru will kick itachi's arse dun worry about it i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif *waits for the itachi fanboys to come*

[Death BOO Z]

a big sac of flames, that's what you're getting yourself into...

as much as I love to hate the sharingan users, even I can't say that the sharingan is all they have...

Sasuke was the number one rookie even before discovering his sharingan (he was even able to fight two chunins equally, and catch up to Haku).
Itachi became a chunin (or a genin) even before mastering the sharingan, at age 6-7..
Kakashi became a genin at age 6, and even if he already had the sharingan, it means that as a six years old, he was smart\strong\skilled enough to steal\take the eye out of someone's head..


Even though I hate Sasuke and Itachi, and I'm annoyed at Kakashi, you can't diss their skills and say it's all the sharingan or thier bodies...

[Toruxxx]

yea we know that hehe. but kakashi did over do it abit lol 1000 jutsu's man come on. sasuke did have alot of quite gd jutsu when he couldnt use the sharingan and well itachi not sure about him just know that he was chuunin at a early age b4 he got the sharingan so we dunno what he was able to do then.

[Kale Ironfist]

Originally posted by: Death BOO Z
a big sac of flames, that's what you're getting yourself into...

as much as I love to hate the sharingan users, even I can't say that the sharingan is all they have...

Sasuke was the number one rookie even before discovering his sharingan (he was even able to fight two chunins equally, and catch up to Haku).
Itachi became a chunin (or a genin) even before mastering the sharingan, at age 6-7..
Kakashi became a genin at age 6, and even if he already had the sharingan, it means that as a six years old, he was smart\strong\skilled enough to steal\take the eye out of someone's head..


Even though I hate Sasuke and Itachi, and I'm annoyed at Kakashi, you can't diss their skills and say it's all the sharingan or thier bodies...

actually, kakashi became genin at 5, chuunin at 6

[PSJ]

Originally posted by: raijin


Originally posted by: Pervert-Sennin Jiraiya
hmm... wierd doesnt seem like something itachi would say "oh no i will die if i fight him lets run" thats basicly what he did.
It appears the Itachi is well aware of Jiraiya's strength and abilities, which is why he decided to flee.



just checked that chapter out and in it itachi is talking about the moon and the sun, how could someone translate that wrong? its more likely that he says he cant fight because he overused mangekyou sharingan, not like in the anime where he only says, we would die if we fight him.
Well, translation mistakes do happen from time to time, it all depends on the translator's knowledge of Japanese. For that particular manga chapter, it seems the translator just goofed on the translation. He/she translated Amaterasu as "sun" and Tsukuyomi as "moon", when in fact Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi are both Shinto deities of the sun and moon respectively. But in reference to Naruto, Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi are both techniques of Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan.

Although this may sound ironic, you can't trust some of the manga translations as 100% accurate unless they are from a reliable source such as Toriyama's World, Inane, BakaFish, etc. But, even reliable sources make mistakes from time to time.
yea there are some volumes that are translated bad. just seemed strange in a way. oh well i would like to have the bad part retranslated, would mean alot of job to someone tho..

kurpica who are you talking about?

[Uchiha-Itachi]

Well if you watch the episode where Jiraiya explains what Akatsuki is to Kakashi, you get a screen where all 9 are standing in the shadows.. you clearly see Itachi standing in the middle (leader position) .. but thats debatable. i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

[Toruxxx]

jus coz hes in the middle doesnt make him the leader i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif hes probably in the middle coz him and kisame are the only ones we seen so far so they thought will just stick em in the middle lol i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif i wouldnt of thought that the leader would have to go and get naruto/kyuubi his self he would get lil ppl like bleh! itachi and kisame

[Stoopider]

This thread SUUUCKS. We only know 3 Akatsuki members... and we're discussing who's the strongest? LoL.

[Toruxxx]

ive alrdy said who is the strongest fred is i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif

[Uchiha-Itachi]

baka! thats why i said it's debatable...

[PSJ]

Originally posted by: Stoopider
This thread SUUUCKS. We only know 3 Akatsuki members... and we're discussing who's the strongest? LoL.

we only know 2 of them. itachi and kisame. who the third one?

[FearTheMullet]

Originally posted by: Pervert-Sennin Jiraiya


Originally posted by: Stoopider
This thread SUUUCKS. We only know 3 Akatsuki members... and we're discussing who's the strongest? LoL.

we only know 2 of them. itachi and kisame. who the third one?

Our good friend Oreochimaru....err Orochimaru. He left though, so technically we know 2 and an ex.

[Stoopider]

Originally posted by: Uchiha-Itachi
baka! thats why i said it's debatable...

Hence.. I believe the strongest in Akatsuki is Fred. The person we've havent seen, we don't know his powers or his ability.. But he could be the strongest because maybe he beat Itachi and maybe convince Itachi to kill his village to prove joining the akatsuki because Fred's so damn powerful.

LoL. Have fun debating. I won't disturb this thread no more.

[jing]

Fred? I thought akatsuki leader was Udon, that is why he owns Itachi, no?

[Mut]

Originally posted by: ZhanZhao
itachi sucks...relys on his sharingan too much, without his sharingan he would be weak as. Thats wat pisses me off about sharingan users...they are too sharingan dependent....know wat im getting at?

OOO WITHOUT BYUKAGAN NEJI WOULD SUCK TOO AND NOT ONLY THAT, SO WOULD NARUTO WITHOUT HIS KYUBI. GOOD POINT GENIUS.

[Knives122]

LOOOOLLLL, that was funny as hell you ZZinnged his ass

[Stoopider]

Udon is second in command next to Fred. Your right Jing. Udon possibly could be as strong as Fred. But I think Udon has some ulterior motive.

[Toruxxx]

lmao yes udon is not as tough as fred but very close indeed. but no one can defeat fred he hasnt had a fight that last more then 5 secs!! beat itachi in 2.3secs

[LaZie]

nah Sakura is the leader of Akatsuki


waaaaaah!

[PSJ]

Originally posted by: jing
Fred? I thought akatsuki leader was Udon, that is why he owns Itachi, no?
udon is old and should be spoken about anymore, and so we dont get a new "udon" stop this nonsense about fred...... soon he will appear in every thread imaginable.

[Goingin]

Fred?
FFS, when did they start using western names?

(I started watching the manga from 213 so forgive me i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif)

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Goingin
Fred?
FFS, when did they start using western names?

(I started watching the manga from 213 so forgive me i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif)

it's a joke.

[samsonlonghair]

No way, Fred sucks. I kicked Fred's ass just last week, but all his friends spread it around that he beat me. That's how he became leader of Akatsuki; it's all Fred's propaganda that gave him his power.

[Stoopider]

Damn.. I knew Kisame fishface liked to lie.

[Toruxxx]

Originally posted by: samsonlonghair
No way, Fred sucks. I kicked Fred's ass just last week, but all his friends spread it around that he beat me. That's how he became leader of Akatsuki; it's all Fred's propaganda that gave him his power.

u have to be lying i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif fred cant get beat!! hmmm i wonder if thats why he never teaches me any jutsu coz hes crap??

[Everon]

hmmm. Fred? I dunno it sounds like a girls name. And you know that girls can't do jack shit in this anime, so I don't buy it. My vote of the strongest goes to the all incredibly masculine Heman Hulk. Now there's a dude u don't want to cross anytime soon. I found this info in the newtype mag:

Heman Hulk
Leader of Akatsuki
Height:213 cm (7 ft)
Weight:118 kg (260 lbs)
Powers: Ownage Jutsu, By the Power of GraySkull! Jutsu, HulkSmash Jutsu, You're making me angry Berserko Jutsu.
Info: Little is known about Heman Hulk, some believe this leader of the Akatsuki became so powerful after he was bestowed a magical sword and exposed to Gamma Radiation. It is believed his original name before his transformation into the ultimate super human being of the "Naruto Universe" was Prince Adam Banter, but to be called, "The Heman Hulk, formerly known as Prince..." would sound utterly rediculous. So now he is known as Heman Hulk...or just Prince. BTW, he pwns all.

They even have some pics, I'll scan them in and post them as soon as I can.

[Destroyor]

You guys are all wrong, the strongest =leader.
Leader = Bakamaru, where stupidities grant ultra-god like body and Ultimate jutsu, don't forget about the baka blood limit.

Baka > Udon > Fred > Sakura.

[Kalean]

well while we're on this debate... it's worth noting that when Rai-jin said that Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi were techniques of Itachi's, it's made upon an assumption (possibly faulty) that was circulated as fact for a long time on this forum. What the actual translation's basic meaning was in essence, was that Itachi needed some time to rest. It was KISAME who mentioned that Jiraiya might be enough for the both of them. While I believe that myself, all Itachi said was a very fancified way of saying that he needed a while to rest. As for the rest of Akatsuki, while noone knows for certain, it's worth noting that strongest and cheapest do not necessarily coincide. In Naruto, everything is a big game of rock paper scissors. Rock Lee could beat Naruto (and did, for whatever it's worth) and Gaara could beat Rock Lee, and Naruto could beat Gaara, etc. So Itachi could BE the strongest member, and still be unable to defeat the top member, not that he strikes me as the kind of person who is in the organization for power. It is worth wondering what he wants from them, as he seems very enigmatic and matter of fact at the same time.

[Mut]

rock, paper scissors theory only works when applied to the three appropriate individuals. for a theory to work, it has to work on all scenarios. so therefore, rock, paper, scissors theory does not work.

[Kalean]

Originally posted by: Mut@t@
OOO WITHOUT BYUKAGAN NEJI WOULD SUCK TOO AND NOT ONLY THAT, SO WOULD NARUTO WITHOUT HIS KYUBI. GOOD POINT GENIUS.

Actually, Neji is still extremely fast and skilled in hand to hand combat, not particularly needing his byakugan to completely and utterly make a joke out of Naruto's attempts at close combat, and good enough to take out at least 20 clones at the same time before being 'smart' enough to know which clone to attack. Granted it was a feint on Naruto's part, but that goes more to naruto's skill than to any lack of skill or overall awesomeness on Neji's part. Which brings me to Naruto. Naruto is already a stamina freak WITHOUT the Kyuubi. He made all 100 of the clones he fought Neji with of his own chakra, and later on against Gaara in the same day, he did successfully create another 4,000 (The manga counted for us) clones ALSO of his own chakra. He didn't use the Kyuubi's chakra until at the VERY earliest he summoned Gama Bunta, because of lines stating that 'doing all that used up my chakra', but it's even possible that he summoned gama bunta without the Kyuubi, although I'd say that's highly unlikely. Regardless, Naruto and Sasuke tricked Zabuza without any usage of Kyuubi OR Sharingan, and freed Kakashi. Naruto can use the rasengan without the Kyuubi's chakra, and thus technically beat KABUTO with his own strength and freaky kind of willpower. Without using Kyuubi's chakra he double faked out Sakon, and got up after MANY of Kiba's fang strikes, which we HAVE established are really damn strong, and took care of the enemy genjutsu team in the chuunin exams almost entirely on his own. Noone can say that Naruto would suck without his Kyuubi, it's just a part of him that is very useful in certain situations, but hardly necessary for all. Of course, I don't think Sasuke sucks without the Sharingan, but your point is just immature AND incorrect. Thought I'd point that out.

The rock paper scissors theory does work on appropriate individuals. There could easily be a ninja near the head of Akatsuki who was just so rawly cheap or so wildly unconventional that noone else could defeat him, even if they were stronger and faster, and possibly even more skilled. Think about Gaara in his most recent battle and his underground sinking pressure move. That's about as cheap as you can get, short of making the enemy inhale sand and crushing/exploding them from the inside. But because Naruto only fought him on the trees, that move was hardly an option. Also, Naruto would never have pierced Gaara's sand shield without the rasengan, but because of differing circumstances, in mid transformation, Gaara did not HAVE the sand shield. Otherwise Gaara would've been the rock to Naruto's scissors, as it were. The theory does have a lot of merit, because for EVERY character in Naruto, there is a character that could completely own them. Naruto's chakra DOESN'T TURN OFF, making him a pain in the ass for Neji, as was Kidoumaru who was by design anti close combat, and pro horde-attacks. Of course, Neji would be the perfect counter for Jiroubou (the overweight sound nin) because no matter how strong that guy is, he isn't fast enough to come close to stopping the Hakke, and as Kakashi said, no matter how strong someone is, they can't train their inner body. So Neji would have OWNED that guy rather quickly. There are quite a few examples of this (Kankuro being a good match against Sakon and Ukon, for example) throughout the series, and they will continue to persist. If you can't deal with it, you really shouldn't be reading the manga, because EVERYONE in the manga has weaknesses. Even the third and Orochimaru have serious weaknesss. The third was seriously limited on Chakra, Orochimaru is seriously limited in foresight, and even more limited by his own ambitions. Kimimaro was mostly close combat and fighting for the wrong 'teacher' who showed no concern about him whatsoever. Without the curse seal level 2, Gaara would have completely destroyed him without the fight even becoming remotely close. It's just the way it works. One would think you could've figured that out on your own, but if I have to point it out then so be it...

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Kalean


Originally posted by: Mut@t@
OOO WITHOUT BYUKAGAN NEJI WOULD SUCK TOO AND NOT ONLY THAT, SO WOULD NARUTO WITHOUT HIS KYUBI. GOOD POINT GENIUS.

Actually, Neji is still extremely fast and skilled in hand to hand combat, not particularly needing his byakugan to completely and utterly make a joke out of Naruto's attempts at close combat, and good enough to take out at least 20 clones at the same time before being 'smart' enough to know which clone to attack. Granted it was a feint on Naruto's part, but that goes more to naruto's skill than to any lack of skill or overall awesomeness on Neji's part. Which brings me to Naruto. Naruto is already a stamina freak WITHOUT the Kyuubi. He made all 100 of the clones he fought Neji with of his own chakra, and later on against Gaara in the same day, he did successfully create another 4,000 (The manga counted for us) clones ALSO of his own chakra. He didn't use the Kyuubi's chakra until at the VERY earliest he summoned Gama Bunta, because of lines stating that 'doing all that used up my chakra', but it's even possible that he summoned gama bunta without the Kyuubi, although I'd say that's highly unlikely. Regardless, Naruto and Sasuke tricked Zabuza without any usage of Kyuubi OR Sharingan, and freed Kakashi. Naruto can use the rasengan without the Kyuubi's chakra, and thus technically beat KABUTO with his own strength and freaky kind of willpower. Without using Kyuubi's chakra he double faked out Sakon, and got up after MANY of Kiba's fang strikes, which we HAVE established are really damn strong, and took care of the enemy genjutsu team in the chuunin exams almost entirely on his own. Noone can say that Naruto would suck without his Kyuubi, it's just a part of him that is very useful in certain situations, but hardly necessary for all. Of course, I don't think Sasuke sucks without the Sharingan, but your point is just immature AND incorrect. Thought I'd point that out.

The rock paper scissors theory does work on appropriate individuals. There could easily be a ninja near the head of Akatsuki who was just so rawly cheap or so wildly unconventional that noone else could defeat him, even if they were stronger and faster, and possibly even more skilled. Think about Gaara in his most recent battle and his underground sinking pressure move. That's about as cheap as you can get, short of making the enemy inhale sand and crushing/exploding them from the inside. But because Naruto only fought him on the trees, that move was hardly an option. Also, Naruto would never have pierced Gaara's sand shield without the rasengan, but because of differing circumstances, in mid transformation, Gaara did not HAVE the sand shield. Otherwise Gaara would've been the rock to Naruto's scissors, as it were. The theory does have a lot of merit, because for EVERY character in Naruto, there is a character that could completely own them. Naruto's chakra DOESN'T TURN OFF, making him a pain in the ass for Neji, as was Kidoumaru who was by design anti close combat, and pro horde-attacks. Of course, Neji would be the perfect counter for Jiroubou (the overweight sound nin) because no matter how strong that guy is, he isn't fast enough to come close to stopping the Hakke, and as Kakashi said, no matter how strong someone is, they can't train their inner body. So Neji would have OWNED that guy rather quickly. There are quite a few examples of this (Kankuro being a good match against Sakon and Ukon, for example) throughout the series, and they will continue to persist. If you can't deal with it, you really shouldn't be reading the manga, because EVERYONE in the manga has weaknesses. Even the third and Orochimaru have serious weaknesss. The third was seriously limited on Chakra, Orochimaru is seriously limited in foresight, and even more limited by his own ambitions. Kimimaro was mostly close combat and fighting for the wrong 'teacher' who showed no concern about him whatsoever. Without the curse seal level 2, Gaara would have completely destroyed him without the fight even becoming remotely close. It's just the way it works. One would think you could've figured that out on your own, but if I have to point it out then so be it...

wow, it's like you have something against me or something.

well, you think you are god damn smart. but you fail to realize the whole point of me posting "OOO WITHOUT BYUKAGAN NEJI WOULD SUCK TOO AND NOT ONLY THAT, SO WOULD NARUTO WITHOUT HIS KYUBI. GOOD POINT GENIUS." was to prove that saying "itachi sucks without his sharingan" is stupid because we all know he is awesome without it. but no, you decided to read what i wrote and comprehend it on your own retarded way without viewing the other possible meanings while acting like a fucking smartass jumping on an opportunity to disprove me (which is impossible). no shit neji and naruto are awesome without it, we've seen many examples of it. do you think i'd just look over them or i don't know these things? i don't have to prove my knowledge of naruto to you, newb. so let me return your shit back to you: your point is just immature AND incorrect. Though I'd point that out.

and as for the rock, paper, scissors theory... if you can't figure out why that theory doesn't work then you're just not gonna make it in life. you should get a medal for just being able to not choke on your own tongue while sleeping and then wake up in the morning.

EDIT: no, fuck it. i'll show you an example where rock, paper, scissors theory cannot apply. the last fight we saw (between lee, gaara, and kimimaro). first let me get this clear: lee and gaara would've both died if kimimaro was not sick. even gaara admitted that they would've been gotten their ass kicked. but you might think of this to say: "no, gaara would've used his sand to protect himself." wrong, you clown. gaara's sand only protected him when the tanuki came out and he used the strongest minerals from the ground. not only, is it quite hard to do that when you're in the air but we've already seen that kimimaro can break through walls of sand. so therefore, i just proved that gaara and lee would've been toast if it weren't for kimimaro's illness. ANYWAY, getting back to my main point... with what i said about how gaara and lee would've died, that just shows you that rock, paper, scissors theory does not work on all cases. it only works when certain factors are thrown in with appropriate individuals, such as kimimaro's illness.

here's a better example... hmmm, let's just mix up random characters and see if the rock, paper, scissors theory still applies. itachi vs hinata vs sakura. wow, lookie here. *looks down as the rock, paper, scissors theory goes down the shitter*

[Tofu #2]

thats like the biggest burn ever.

+1

[Kalean]

A) My problem was not actually with you, but with the people who bought into your sarcastic remark, therefore I was pointing out that it shouldn't be taken seriously, because the people that see a remark like that, take it seriously, and jump on the forum to comment, really piss me off. It's good to know that you're so extremely defensive, however. I'll keep that in mind.

B) The entire Kimimaro arc was a walking problem. At the end when Gaara and Lee were going to be beaten, the mangaka was being rather un-intelligent, as he had been for several chapters. Kimimaro was mentioned to be slower after his transformation into level 2 because of his new setup (He lengthened his spinal chord into a tail, you'd be a little disoriented too.) and yet, as he pops out of the bone (implausible, but it's Naruto, we'll ignore that.) Lee just sits there like an idiot. While Gaara might have needed to summon his rather stupid looking Shukaku shield again to save himself, all it would've taken was for Lee to just do what he always does when someone tries to kill him. Kick Kimimaro in the face. At that juncture, Kimimaro was only half out of the bone, he was a perfect target for a beating. But again, there were a lot of problems with that little fight. If Kimimaro had not had the ability to teleport through his bones (which again, is one of the most ridiculous things I've seen, although not THE most.) then Gaara would've been the perfect opponent for him. We noticed how Gaara completely bested him on every front. Mainly because Kimimaro was a melee attacker. The fact is that through that entire fight Kimimaro was losing VERY badly, and they just threw in the impossible teleport to make it seem like he wasn't completely outclassed. It appeared that Naruto would've lost to Kimimaro (although we all know that if that last sword had hit it would've been a shadow clone, that's just the way the manga works. ) and yet we all know Naruto is even more ridiculously powerful than Kimimaro by a lot, and definately a lot more creative. Some fighting styles just work better against certain others, which is the whole point of the rock paper scissors debate. I'm not saying that everyone can beat someone, for example, unless you count Ino, Sakura can't beat... well... anyone. Same goes for Ino, really, although she at least has a few quirks that make her special. But Chouji's meat tank beat Zaku's air pressure cannon easily, because spinning objects are only fueled by that kind of attack. It's not a particularly difficult thing to understand really. There could very easily be someone in Akatsuki that Itachi is stronger than, faster than, or just plain more skilled than, and could still soundly defeat him. Kisame just might be stronger than Kakashi (I certainly hope he is actually, otherwise that'd be sad) but that doesn't mean that Kakashi couldn't defeat him. It's just the way it works. It's hard to have an even fight with people that fight completely differently. The rock paper scissors concept isn't meant to apply to everyone vs. everyone, but rather meant to simplify for people that don't seem to get it, that it's not simple math as to who could defeat whom. If you fail to understand the point of the simplification, and try to belittle it without understanding the concept behind it, you really don't gain much. The fact that we have no idea what is going on in the world of Akatsuki means that if we want to theorize about it, it requires intelligent thought behind it. Denying that some people are just plain perfect to fight other people, is incorrect. Kidoumaru was practically designed to fight Neji (Entire body defense to protect himself from the Hakke, Ninja spiders [wtf, anyway?] with sticky webbing to stop the Kaiten's spin... Infinite ammo because of his techniques so that he can assault Neji from *EVERY* direction to find the weakness in the byakugan, massively powerful ranged attacks with perfect accuracy from outside the Byakugan's range that can be adjusted to compensate for him turning his head and removing the blindspot? That's quite a list of anti-Neji stuff right there.) and Gaara's improvements were pretty much designed to make him own Kimimaro, they just decided to go ahead make Kimimaro not look like a loser, probably because they liked the character a lot. As the power tiers rise, and the flexibility of a ninja increases, it becomes less and less likely that there is someone who just plain outclasses them because of their method of fighting rather than their skill or strength necessarily. However, it is quite probable that there is someone in Akatsuki who does not belong, and is only in there because of some cheap technique or ability they have, or a cheap set, thereof. It's very common in anime, especially in the 'group of 9 evil people' that is prevalent in everything from Kenshin to Trigun and now Naruto. Zazie the beast was only in the gung ho guns because he had technology to control animals, and when that was taken away, well, he sucks. The old half of the hagun didn't belong, but because he came with Fuji, he was in the team. Now if there's any Mangaka to defy predictability, it's Kishimoto, but... don't count on it.

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On a sidenote, that doesn't belong in this thread, but I'm too lazy to place anywhere else, Kimimaro's fight showed a greater ignorance of physics and human anatomy with every chapter. First and foremost, Kimimaro's bloodline (which was 'scientfically' explained, a major mistake since the explanation doesn't make sense) was the ability to manipulate bones. Barring the horrid explanation for that, we can accept this. However, every time a bone or group of bones rips out of his body, a panel or two later, he's completely healed. I don't recall him having a HEALING bloodline, as well. People who want to give me the "It's a technique like Tsunade's" crap should be silent before they post. Tsunade's the only one who can do that, that's what makes it unique. Moving on. Ignoring the james bond-esque 'I'm fine in the next panel' happenstance, we next note that Kimimaro makes 'bone masks' under his skin to protect himself from the desert coffin. Up to this point, I was still excited. However, what he should have done, make an exoskeleton for his 2nd curse seal form, was not done, and when he was caught in the desert coffin, the fight should have been over. The crushing force of the dessert coffin would still have completely and utterly DESTROYED his skin, leaving nothing but a bloody mess, because it would then be squeezing the skin against nigh-adamantium bones. Besides which, I don't think he really created bone masks under his eyes, they should've been crushed into his head. However, none of that matters because upon creating bone masks underneath his skin, he would've severed every ligament in his body and instantaneously lost the fight as he would no longer be able to move correctly. Moving on from this, he then proceeds to, not unexpectedly, use his spinal chord as a whip sword. Not a problem due to his ability, but rather the place at which he yanked it out of his back. That's not only impossible to do from that angle considering the new length of his spinal chord, but would also kill him instantly, as growing the bone out there would displace the delicate cartiledge discs there and basically do the same thing as someone dissecting your spinal chord. If it had grown out the small of his back, however, would be a logical and safe place to grow the bone out from, as from that point onwards it was mainly false tail anyways, and there is the least worry about injury there. Of course none of this matters either because he was running at full speed while doing this, which is blatantly impossible. We won't get into the whole 'performing Jutsu while immobilized underground' thing, and of course the part where he turns himself and all his vital organs into bone so that he can escape his prison, and then detransforms back into a humanoid form so that he can bleed from his mouth, because those aren't improbable to impossible level thing at all. Does this comment belong here? No. Am I an idiot for posting it here? Quite possibly. Know what? Don't care.