I want to do this...I hope I am not just asking for it with this one

[RangeOfHakke]

I think Byukan is better, personally i think neji could beat sasuke. They have never talked about what defensese one has against the other. The sharingan came about because of the byukan. I think the byukan has more power then we are lettign on. We dont no the true power of the hyuga clan...when we saw the leader of the hyuga clan take out those sand ninjas it was scary...his kaiten let a huge crater...way bigger than nejis geez lol i was pissing my pants. I think the leader of the hyuga clan could take out ITACHI!!!.

I want this to be a calm discussion, thats why i made this topic. i just want to hear what we all think and compare ideas, i am open so lets discuss...plz try not to form this into a flaminng topic

[Assertn]

well....yes.....i agree that the leader of the hyuga clan (hyuga hiashi) can take out neji i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

[RangeOfHakke]

lol that was pretty funny....and dumb at the same time...i ment that Hyuga Hiashi could take out itachi.

[hiten mitsurugi]

Yes, I agree that the Hyuga Hiashi can take out Itachi. Byakugen is much better than Sharingan.

He'll put the swastika onto Itachi's forehead.

[Mut]

no one can take out itachi, yet. seriously. come on guys, get with the program.

[Death BOO Z]

damn, this sepecualation is almost as stupid as Sakura beating Itachi (well, it's even stupider, since Sakura has a reason to do so [beside him being evil]).

tell me, why do you think Hiashi is so spectacular? even though it was said that Hizashi was stronger than him?

the head of the hyuuga clan doesn't have to be the strongest, it can be someone like Hinata, so just saying that he's strong becuase he's the head doesn't mean anything.

next poing to argue about can be the Kaiten and Hakke, you might say that since he can do both he must be good. but there's still the option that those moves are special becuase they are only thought by the old clanmaster to the new one, and that's why neji was so immpressive, since he learned them on his own, not for preforming, but for seeing the best points in the byakougan eyes.

there was nothing in the story so far that could make anyone believe that Itachi will lose to Hiashi, it doesn't make sence in battle logic, and it certinaly doesn't make sence in plot logic...

[Suzu]

Sharingan hands down. Sure the Hyuuga is strong but when it comes to Itachi and his mastery of ninjitsu and genjutsu do the Hyuuga who rely basically on taijutsu really have a chance? Itachi would wreck Hiashi (who is one mofo that most couldn't mess with) hands down. As kakashi said the Byakugan is superior to the Sharingan only in insight. In all other departments the Sharingan excells.

[Assertn]

i dunno......i find it very hard to believe that any konoha jounin is better than kakashi and gai
and since kakashi lost to itachi pretty badly.......i'd say itachi would beat hiashi

also, if itachi's mange sharingan can affect anyone who makes eye contact with him, wouldnt it be even tougher for hiashi if he was to use byakugan, since his sight extends all around him?

[Gods_Son]

Both Byakugan and Sharingan have their own advantages, so it's hard to call one better than the other, but saying Hyuga Hiashi could take Uchiha Itachi is just dumb. Like Death Boo Z said, you don't have to be the strongest to be the leader, and even if he was, Hyuga Hiashi is still nothing compared to Itachi.

[itachi_]

Hiashi wouldn't stand a chance against Itachi, however Neji would easily win against Sasuke.

[Uzumaki Naruto]

Originally posted by: RangeOfHakke
I think Byukan is better, personally i think neji could beat sasuke. They have never talked about what defensese one has against the other. The sharingan came about because of the byukan. I think the byukan has more power then we are lettign on. We dont no the true power of the hyuga clan...when we saw the leader of the hyuga clan take out those sand ninjas it was scary...his kaiten let a huge crater...way bigger than nejis geez lol i was pissing my pants. I think the leader of the hyuga clan could take out ITACHI!!!.

I want this to be a calm discussion, thats why i made this topic. i just want to hear what we all think and compare ideas, i am open so lets discuss...plz try not to form this into a flaminng topic


ok, personaly i think that Itachi will own hinatas father, forgot his name, why, bc even orochimaru fears him, and he wiped out his own clan just to test out his power, Itachi byfar is the strongest char introduced so far, and even he was able to stop 3 jounins, kakashi, kurenai, and asuma. so if itachi were to go againts wuts his name then itachi will win the fight.

now to the other thing, yes i do think that neiji can defeat sasuke, i hope he does if they do ever face off, bc the byakuugan has a more powerful view or whatever u call it the the sharingan bc it allows u too see the tenketsus and if neiji were to seal sasuke tenketsus then sasuke is over bc he cant use do anything but run.

[rockmanj]

i'm gonna play devil's advocate here, and go with hiashi...they did say that the hyuuga taijitsu is the strongest in all of the leaf; i mean as incredible as itachi's taijistu is made out to be, i think the 64 hands of hakke may be more than a match for it, especailly coming from a true master....but as far as long range fighting and mange is concerned..i'm not too sure

[Mut]

neji cannot defeat sasuke anymore.

EDIT: response to below:

no, he really can't.

[Strider]

Neji could still defeat Sasuke. Tons of new power, and the brat probably will not even know how to use it ..

However, as much as I like the Hyuuga abilities, Itachi is a monster. Noone introduced so far could take him on. .. I think Itachi could pimp Gamabunta.

Ninja vanish.

[Gods_Son]

Sasuke has a level 2 cursed seal now, Neiji can't beat him

[Lee Rock]

I don't really see how it is all that improbable/unlikely for Hiashi to beat Itachi. Now I do admit that it's been a while since I've seen the below area of the anime/manga so my recollection may be off, so please correct me if I'm wrong...

When you take Byakugan vs Sharingan the key is the Gentle Fist style taijutsu that the Hyuuga use that would make the difference, more than the Kaiten or the 64 points. The thing about this style is that it allows the user to directly deal damage to his opponents internal organs. There is no counter this short of actually dodging the blow entirely.

Now I believe that it is possible for a high level Hyuuga master like Hiashi (Hinata's dad) or Hizashi (Neji's dad) to cause someone's heart to basically explode inside their chest. If my faulty memory is correct that is what Hizashi did when Hinata was briefly kidnapped by what was assumingly a high level Thunder country ninja. This pretty much enables them to get a one-hit kill on virtually anyone.

As such I think that if Hiashi could get one good shot in on Itachi he could end it quick by causing serious internal damage. Now you could argue that Itachi would use the mange sharingan before that could happen, but that is besides the point. I think Hiashi (or his brother if he was still alive) would have a 50-50 chance against the Naruto world's fan appointed god.

[Lithonite]

the real issue is lays in wether or not itachi ever gets touched. if he gets touched it over. not only would his chakra get cut off most likely 1 blow from the hyuga would kill any man in 1 shot...but again he has to get close enough to toch Itachi. odd are with his arsenal of jutsu he could not beat Itachi, or nay of the 3 for that matter

[Xceleration]

Not stand a chance? I highly doubt that he wouldn't stand a chance. Itachi isn't as good as you think he is. Kaiten. How is Itachi going to do anything when Hiashi uses kaiten? Itachi is a genius, but he is definately not invulnerable, he can be defeated. Just because you saw Itachi school Kakashi and the other jounins doesn't mean that he's that powerful.

[rockmanj]

i agree, because even though he's a genius, it does not mean that he is unbeatable...especially by someone who has been a master as long as hiashi. iknow some people may say that oro is a master, but then again oro is a coward who hides behind jutsus. i think that if hiashi gets itachi within jyuuken, its over...dead weasel... but he does indeed have to get close enough, which may be a battle in itself

[Fobik-X]

hmm with nearly 360 degree's of vision is there anyway for hiashi to avoid itachi's eyes? If itachi uses his blood limit its all over, to do the gental fist thing hiashi would need to use byukan making him even more vulnrable to the blood limit attack. I think its like itachi said only someone with Uchiha blood can over come the blood limit(if they look into his eyes). Altho i do think gai would be able to stand a small chance if he can deal with all of itachi's jutsu, he is prolly the only one who could fight him with out looking into his eyes from all his duels with kakashi. But even if hiashi learned to fight that way he could not use gental fist and is not strong enuf for his taijutsu to be a threat by its self...

[Assertn]

"the trick to defeating neji, lies in the high speed combo".....i think gai put it best......and since sasuke is as fast as lee AND a genius type.......neji wouldnt stand a chance unless he starts doin some intensive training with leg weights

[Uchiha]

Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
"the trick to defeating neji, lies in the high speed combo".....i think gai put it best......and since sasuke is as fast as lee AND a genius type.......neji wouldnt stand a chance unless he starts doin some intensive training with leg weights



Gai said that the trick to defeat Neji was high speed combo but Sasuke isn't even close to that speed. Gai said that when Lee opened the 5 gates, so for sasuke to beat Neji he need to open more then 3 gates or something like that, dunno how fast he will be with cursed seal lvl 2 but neji could easy cut that off.


and for Itachi vs Hiashi I don't think Hiashi would win but he would have a chanse of wining. I think Hiashi is stronger then any jounin in the leaf and as Xceleration said, just b/c Itachi took out 3 jounins dosn't make him that powerful. Orochimaru and Jiraiya could take out more then 3 jounins easy.

[MemnochTheCaT]

Itachi vs. Hiashi is the most *vague* of encounters, because we know so very little about either one of them. Each of them are both obviously fighters of extreme skill and power, and with what we have to go on, no conclusion can be made with conviction and honesty.

In my personal option, I would place Itachi slightly above Hiashi, and slightly below Jiraiya, for various reasons .. but this is ALL SUBJECTIVE.

There is NO PROOF of Itachi/Hiashi/Jiraiya being any more or less powerful than the other, beyond supposition and rumor. There are numerous examples, however, of all of them being extremely capable and historic warriors.

On the strict topic, it seems like Sharingan would have more value to a village as a whole, in terms of adapting and spreading information on enemies/jutsu .. and Byakuugan (sp?) having more value to an individual fighter of equal skill. The ability to 'see' and strike chakra-sensitive areas would probably be very hard to counter for a fighter of equivalent skill, because one blow is debilitating. I'm sure anyone who has been a veteran fighter can attest to how easy it is to be hit by a blow or two that you couldn't predict. It's a huge disadvantage to not be able to risk being hit even once.

This all changes if the sharingan user is all the way to the level of Itachi, but then again, who knows what the pinnacle of either truly is?

The only truth that can be determined at this time .. is that someone who tries to conclusively say that either is definitively stronger .. is truly idiotic.

[Hotsuma]

I think Byakugan is better. It allows you to see through walls, see behind you, see long distances, even gives you better insight. Then, there's the fact that you can completely KO somebout by tapping them. That's pretty freaking badass. And, of course.. the best strength of the Byakugan is.. in addition to see through walls, you can see through girls clothing. If that isn't awesome, what is?

Sharingan. Boo. Sharingan's main strength is copying and learning JUTSUS. And, not all jutus, but just generic ones that can be learned by anybody. (theoretically) Mangekyou Sharingan? Useless against Byakugan. Why? Byakugan users can fight you without ever having to look into your eyes. A strength it has, is the ability to just look straight at your chakra highway. That means, no eye contact, which Sharigan NEEDS.

So, I'll say this. Byakugan is able to be powerful on it's own, relying on the user's strength. Sharingan can only be used with the help of an opponent, feeding them their secrets. And, unfortunately, even with that, Byakugan techniques (taijutsu) can't be copied.


Btw, Itachi is strong. You can't say "Well, just because he took out 3 jounins, doesn't mean he's strong/" That's bullshit, sorry to say. Jounins are the most bad-ass ninjas, next to the Anbu. And, as for the Sannin. Who's to say they can take on more than one jounin at a time? Keep in mind, they're all way past their prime. Jiraiya's writing porno mags. (good man) Tsunade is gambling away her life. Hell, she even admits that she's no longer as strong as she was back whenever. Oro, I give credit, because he's so persistent in getting stronger. Back to Itachi.. He took out KAKASHI. This guy's name is written in textbooks. He's a living legend, people! That means, Kakashi himself, is pretty damn good himself. Just beating Kakashi, is enough to say you're badass.

[Lee Rock]

Sharingan. Boo. Sharingan's main strength is copying and learning JUTSUS. And, not all jutus, but just generic ones that can be learned by anybody. (theoretically) Mangekyou Sharingan? Useless against Byakugan. Why? Byakugan users can fight you without ever having to look into your eyes. A strength it has, is the ability to just look straight at your chakra highway. That means, no eye contact, which Sharigan NEEDS.

This is an interesting point, and one that I hadn't considered before. We don't know much about the mange sharingan so no one can say for sure, but it is not that unlogical a step to infer that the user and victim must lock eyes in order for the jutsu to transmit. If a Hyuuga used thier Byakugan to look past Itachi's eyes to the tenketsu and chakra paths beneath then are they really meeting the Uchiha gaze?

I think this would be the equivalent of trying to use the jutsu on a blind person. Sure they may be looking in your eyes, but they're not seeing the sharingan so they can't be "hypnotised" by it.

Also remember that the sharingan is the illegitimate child of the byakugan. This may or may not give it a full/partial resistance, but given what little we actually know, I'll make the bold and wholly unfounded assumption that this bloodline relationship will give Hiashi enough time to land a hit and end it.

[Xceleration]

I doubt Sasuke would be able to defeat Neji, even though someone said Nejis weakness is high speed taijuutsu. Even if thats true, when Lee had his full speed he couldn't defeat Neji, and Neji wasn't even trying, not evening having to use kaiten, and his byakugan. Lee with his gates open might be able to beat Neji, but Sasuke can't open gates, so Sasuke would pretty much lose. Hotsuma also stated that you don't need eye contact if you have byakugan, thats also true. From what I know Neji can probably fight with his eyes closed because his byakugan can see through his eye lids. With Kaiten, Sasuke probably can't get too close to Neji without being ripped to pieces. It's the same with Itachi vs Hiashi, Hiashi's kaiten is crazy and can probably keep Itachi away, but then again Itachi is at legendary sannin level, so he even if Itachi does lose he won't lose by much.

[Assertn]

who says he couldnt beat neji at his full speed? im pretty sure lee hardly ever takes his weights off, so neji prolly wouldnt even know lee can move that fast....i believe the flashbacks of lee losing to neji was way back before neji adopted gai's habits and fighting style, and he still had the old haircut back then

the kaiten would be tricky to beat, but when neji was fighting naruto near the end, he had to make sure to start it up sooner than normal so it'll be up by the time naruto charged into him...this leads me to believe there's a delay involved before its performed....a delay that can be easily exploited

[Hyuga Koji]

But during the fight Neji was only surprised by the Ura Renge Lee's speed prior to that didn't even faze him.

Lee's had Omoto Renge for a long time so Neji knows all about it.

They know each other's fighting styles in and out.

[Hotsuma]

Gai said that the key to beating Neji, was his high speed COMBO. Not just straight up high speed. You notice that Neji looked indifferent to Lee's speed, even after he took off his weights.

[Assertn]

he looks indifferent most of the time anyway....the uchiha clan is more famous for being better ninjas than the hyuuga, im pretty sure the reason why people would say the hyuuga's strongest now is because the uchiha clan doesnt really exist anymore....

i wonder if there's a possibility that sasuke could copy the kaiten....the only trick to the move is to distribute chakra all over your body....so the only flaw with sasuke's version would be that he couldnt see any attacks from behind coming, so it would only be a semi-absolute defense for him

[Lithonite]

i have a feeling most of Gai group is pretty quik espcially the hand to hand combat users are gooing to be extremely fast.

if you remember Neji's fight with Naruto- he was moving pretty freaking quikly. basically someone would have to move fast enough to get in a position Neji could not counter offensively or defensively. without opening the gates none of the current gennin or chunnin can really move that quikly.

example of Neji speed can be seen when fighting one of the sound 4. he got up, into positio, and was able to make an offensive maeuver, and finish it.; before he hit the ground.

and it wasnt until use of ura renge did gai make mental note of what was needed to defeat Neji...


Neji was not suprised or threatened by any of the speed he knew Lee was capable of. the opening of the 4th and 5th gates, well that caught hi attention.

[Shin_Naruto]

Kaiten is only performable by those who have mastered the gentle fist style and the style is really only usable by the Hyuga since it wouldnt make much sense for someone to learn how to hit someone softly =P

some facts:
Itachi is the strongest villain in the series so far. Oro fears him and we've seen why.
Kisame is a member of the Akatsuki - so it can be assumed he is just as deadly.
Kisame makes the observation that Jiriya could be a match for Itachi -and- him. (though my bet is the translation is -or- because of 2 on 1 at that lvl has only been seen with the 3rd vs 1st/2nd - we saw how one sided that one was)

When Jiraiya and Oro face off its unclear who would come out the victor if they were both 100% - I've heard their summons represent a rock paper scissors with snake > frog - frog > slug - slug > snake, and Kishimoto uses that symbology for a reason. Its also referenced by kakashi when talking about the similiaritiys with the relationships naruto/jiraiya and sasuke/oro have.... and we know Sasuke is generally stronger then Naruto - despite the see-saw as of late

Itachi > Oro
Oro > Jiraya
Jiraiya > Itachi

.... so my conclusion is Jiraiya is the only person with a good shot at defeating Itachi right now
the 5th is #2 - she cant die during combat.... and her freakish str gives her some of that '1 punch could win the fight' appeal
Gai is probably #3 because he trains w/ Kakashi and knows how to go up against the sharingan - hes also the strongest taijutsu fighter we have seen to date and Lee has pointed out that Taijutsu is the only real good shot at defeating the 69 (... hey look... an abv form for sharingan)

heres a thought: thats why Oro really wanted Kimmimaro - because his blood line is amazing for taijutsu - which is what Oro lacks - it would make him much more rounded fighter to go up vs itachi or anyone for that matter

[Assertn]

after giving it some thought, the probable case scenario of neji vs sasuke would prolly just be a stalemate....seeing as that even though neji's got the kaiten and a pretty good defense overall, sasuke's got the sharingan and can prolly dodge any attack neji would throw at him....so what it all comes down to is whether neji runs out of chakra before or after sasuke runs out of stamina

its always hard to predict the outcomes of these matches, since they are much more paper/rock/scissors than other anime series tend to be

[SkyDragon]

In the case of Sasuke vs Neji I would say Neji. Sasuke can never catch Neji off gaurd which is the only way to beat him. Once he gets in the range of his 64 hands move he would lose.

Itachi vs Hiashi I'm not sure. HIashi seems to be definitely a hihg jounin seeing as how Kurenei(spelled it wrong) acted around him. I'm not sure about thist one.

If it was 2 people of equal skills one with Byukagan one with Sharingan. I would say the byukagan. Just an opinion. Jus tsya the sharingan user knows all teh things sasuke does and byukagan neji. But they have equal speed. The sharingan user won't be able to hit the hyuga because he can't be caught off gaurd. The hyuga can't hit the sharingan user since he would see it and dodge it. But if the sharingan user attacked the other can use the kaiten which is also an offensive move. Hitting the sharingan user. Then he would should be hurt at least a little bit enough that the other can close his chakra points.

[Assertn]

neji's range on the kaiten is barely enough to be considered offensive, and i dont know where people get the idea that neji is as fast as sasuke or lee....just because he's gai's student doesnt mean that he actually gets much training from gai......the fact that he chose to train out in the forest on his own with tenten is proof enough of that

[SkyDragon]

Neji isn't slow. Gai said the 5th gate WITH the Ura Renge was the key to beating Neji. He obviously can beat him if he tries any less. The stronger the attack on the user the more hurt the person who did the attack against the kaiten. Neji is quite fast as seen with his battle agasint kidoumoru. He also was easily beating all does clones of Naruto attacking 2 and a lot more at a time withotu even being tired 1 bit.

You can't base the power of each with characters. You can know what it's capable of but you can't say since Neji > Sasuke or Sasuke > Neji the sharingan/byukagan is better. We haven't seen any main family moves aside from 2. We've seen 2 of the strongest move for the sharingan.

[Mut]

yeah, none of the "name" > "name" work except itachi > "name".

[SDShamshel]

Kaiten isn't something learned by every Hyuuga.

Normally, the only people who know Kaiten are the very heads of the Hyuuga clan. In this case, Hiashi.

Neji is exceptional because he figured it out on his own. Thus, it's not like when you fight the Hyuuga you fight an unstoppable spinning clan.

The Byakugan is much more open-ended, but the Sharingan is much more versatile.

[MonkeyKingGoWest]

Hmmmm...why is it that everybody thinks Itachi is such an unstoppable god or sumthing.. the guys just powerful because we haven't seen him in a REAL fight to measure our weak he really is.
Once they find an weakness in him he'll just be another shinobi.
And it's pretty much indefinite that Sasuke is gonna kill/beat him sooner or later.

[GokuSonGoku]

Umm.. If the leader of the Hyuga clan could take out Itachi why aint he Hokage then.. If he can do that he is very strong...

[SkyDragon]

Itachi isn't as strong as a Hokage. The 3rd wasn't really hokage really. More liek a replacement so was the 5th. THe 3rd's time apssed. In his prime Oro can't touch him or the other sannins, so he can beat Itachi. The 4th could most likely beat him also. Tusande is a replacemnet for the death as I said and she isn't a fighter. The 1st and 2nd who knows if he can beat him. Plus He might not want to be hokage by the way. The otehr hyuga's don't even go to the academy.

[Lithonite]

the 4th was strong but he could not defeat any of the sannin i dont believe. he had his sealing jutsu but , remember the reason Oro wasnt chosen to Hokage was because of his dark side. Oro wanted to be Hokage because he was sure he was the strongest...and the things the 3rd said tended to support that. as for Oro not being able to touch the 3rd in his prime...hrmm possible but Oro had such a superiority complex going until he was caught that i dont think he was fighting his hardest..actually he wasnt he was letting the first, and the second fight in his stead. However i am inclined to believe the 3rd was stronger when he was at the same age as Oro

[Assertn]

Originally posted by: SkyDragon
Neji isn't slow. Gai said the 5th gate WITH the Ura Renge was the key to beating Neji. He obviously can beat him if he tries any less. The stronger the attack on the user the more hurt the person who did the attack against the kaiten. Neji is quite fast as seen with his battle agasint kidoumoru. He also was easily beating all does clones of Naruto attacking 2 and a lot more at a time withotu even being tired 1 bit.

You can't base the power of each with characters. You can know what it's capable of but you can't say since Neji > Sasuke or Sasuke > Neji the sharingan/byukagan is better. We haven't seen any main family moves aside from 2. We've seen 2 of the strongest move for the sharingan.

you're right, he CAN beat neji if he tries less than that....lee obviously has gone through alot of training since the last time he challenged neji, so its hard for anyone to guess how far he'd have to go to be able to surpass him.....he might only need 1 gate, or maybe none at all....

its extremely hard to see how fast neji was against kidoumaru since its manga....but i dont see any reason why he WAS fast based on the manga.....and you dont need alot of speed to beat naruto's clones and not be tired

if you ask me, the fact that gai acknowledges lee as a taijutsu specialist who would lose to no one would indicate that his taijutsu level is much higher than neji's......gai should know more than anyone, and the only thing neji trains for taijutsu is power and chakra control, not physical speed...this is why he's considered more of a defensive character

i never said that the outcome of a match between neji and sasuke determines which clan is better, btw

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

Personally I think that Sasuke and Hinata should hook up and then you would have the Ultimate Ninja Baby!

i/expressions/devil.gif

[Zansatsu]

Originally posted by: iMUSTbeTHEdevil
Personally I think that Sasuke and Hinata should hook up and then you would have the Ultimate Ninja Baby!

i/expressions/devil.gif

The baby would have either Sharingan or Byakugan. Depends on what genes are stronger. But if they would somehow get mixed... omg.

[RangeOfHakke]

why do people keep saying that with the sharingan the person will just dodge the hit. We have seen plenty of times where sasuke has been hit. So you cant jsut say that, sasuke saw lees kicks coming every time and still got owned by them. Byakugan on the other hand allows you too see it and then counter. That is its purpose. I also agree with the person that said that Byakugan is open ended. not every one is awesome that have it. only the elite like the head of the family will learn all of the really good techniques.

[petoix]

quote: "i dunno......i find it very hard to believe that any konoha jounin is better than kakashi and gai
and since kakashi lost to itachi pretty badly.......i'd say itachi would beat hiashi"

i don't remember kakashi lossing to itachi. can someone tell me when this happened -- and where i can find it?

thanks,
petoix

[Vagabond]

You don't remember that. i/expressions/face-icon-small-confused.gif
Edit: Chapter 142 to be exact. You can find it at Narutofan.com. Do you even read the manga?

[*mxyzptlk]

I believe that with the sharingan one can reverse engineer the gentle fist style fighting. With the powers of a skilled sharingan user, one could observe the intended targets of the gentle fist and replay them against the opponent. It wouldnt be perfect due to the chakra holes possibly being in slightly different locations on different peoples bodies, but i believe that one could get close enough and perhaps with practice/repeated viewings one would get even better. Of course someone would still need the required chakra control to be able to release chakra from the hands/finger tips, but that seems like something just about any ninja on the show should be capable of learning.

with that said, i also believe that buykugan would offer some level of protection against the mange sharingan attack.. i dont have any evidence to support this, but i just think that eye jutsu's should cancel each other out somehow..

[Assertn]

Originally posted by: RangeOfHakke
why do people keep saying that with the sharingan the person will just dodge the hit. We have seen plenty of times where sasuke has been hit. So you cant jsut say that, sasuke saw lees kicks coming every time and still got owned by them. Byakugan on the other hand allows you too see it and then counter. That is its purpose. I also agree with the person that said that Byakugan is open ended. not every one is awesome that have it. only the elite like the head of the family will learn all of the really good techniques.

that was BEFORE his body was fast enough to dodge it....dont you remember the whole conversation between lee and sasuke? lee specifically says "even if you can see my moves, your body still wont be able to react fast enough to avoid it"
also note the other detail lee mentioned during the main matches, where sasuke's sharingan gives him the upper hand because he can run straight at an enemy and still be able to react fast enough to avoid any counter attacks

[jing]

Itachi will own him.
Hiashi won't even get close enough to do 64 hands of hakke.
Like Rock Lee said, your eyes can keep up, but can your body?
we know itachi has a lightning speed....

[Knives122]

i thinks rock lee would stand a decent chance against itachi up until he gets his ass kicked

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Knives122
i thinks rock lee would stand a decent chance against itachi up until he gets his ass kicked

what? this doesn't make any sense. itachi would tear of rock lee's head as soon as rock lee blinks.

[petoix]

You don't remember that. Chapter 142 to be exact. You can find it at Narutofan.com. Do you even read the manga?

i/expressions/face-icon-small-blush.gif

yes. but there was a time <can't quite remember when> when i read obsessively through about 30-40 chapters... guess i should go back and revisit them i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif with patience this time.

thanks for the info.

[Death BOO Z]

that sentence didn't even make sense, there's no point in discussing something so obvious, you can replace Lee with Udon (plz, restrain yourselves from udon jokes, that trend is over, and we're all very happy about it) and it'll be the same.

Udon will fight decently against Itachi until he gets his ass kicked = until Itachi kicks udon's ass, udon will put up a fight.

by the way, itachi isn't afraid of anyone alone, but he is worried that he'll be ganged up by ninjas who have one skill higher than his, and that they'll work together to beat him, for the same reason, he retreats alot, so he won't reveal any week points to his enemies, think about it, Itachi retreated becuase he didn't want to reveal the fact that Gai is faster than him, and he didn't want to expose all his secrets while fighting Jiriya, if he was afraid that Jiriya will retreat with Naruto and then make a counter to all of his attacks, and even worse, will provide information about his attacks to the leaf village.

[Assertn]

i dunno....it seemed to me like he was actually reluctant to put up a fight against jiraiya for more reason than just exposing secrets

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Death BOO Z
by the way, itachi isn't afraid of anyone alone, but he is worried that he'll be ganged up by ninjas who have one skill higher than his, and that they'll work together to beat him, for the same reason, he retreats alot, so he won't reveal any week points to his enemies, think about it, Itachi retreated becuase he didn't want to reveal the fact that Gai is faster than him, and he didn't want to expose all his secrets while fighting Jiriya, if he was afraid that Jiriya will retreat with Naruto and then make a counter to all of his attacks, and even worse, will provide information about his attacks to the leaf village.

jesus christ...ever heard of a RUN ON SENTENCE? lol

but anyways, i dunno about your theory on why itachi ran away. we still don't know why itachi isn't like "OMFG WE HAVE TO GET NARUTO RIGHT NOW OR PLAN FAILS" he seems to be taking it real easy. i don't think time is concern for him.

i mean... itachi > kyubi, you know. i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif

[Lithonite]

Hiashi would not waste time useing the hakke it is likely he can thrust enough chakra into someone to kill them with one finger. he is someone you cant get within touching distance or your dead. Itachi would definately know this. And as long as he does not get within kaiten range( wich he probably will not ) hiashi will not be able to match Itachi range Ninjutsu

[Assertn]

i never did get the point of the 64 hands of hakke myself.....it seems like it would be more practical just to make them all mortal blows instead of just trying to disable their chakra
maybe the move was intended for keeping an enemy alive so they can interrogate him later i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

[kaigan]

you think itachi is at hokage lvl? don't make me laugh. Itahi is a little stronger than orochimaru, and orochimaru has to wait until the third is almost dead to attack konoha. Neither is the Hyuga clan can be that strong. As for the hiashi vs itachi, no one knows for certain. But Hiashi is definitely above jounin lvls. Look at zabuza vs kakashi fight, if it wasn't for naruto, kakashi is dead. I am sure hiashi can take out zabuza without a sweat.

[Mut]

Originally posted by: kaigan
But Hiashi is definitely above jounin lvls. Look at zabuza vs kakashi fight, if it wasn't for naruto, kakashi is dead. I am sure hiashi can take out zabuza without a sweat.

this is not a fair example to make. kakashi had to protect those helpless genins from getting killed. not only did he have to think of his safety, but the safety of those four other people first. as you saw in the one on one fight at the bridge, zabuza got owned. don't try to take away kakashi's bad ass-ness.

[Baka_Desuyo]

Okay, all of you people who are thinking that this Hiashi vs. Itachi thing would be such an uncallable match up, you're all crazy. We have a little bit of knowledge about Itachi, and you saw Hiashi fight once. It's just really stupid to think of it this way.

However, for the sake of the argument, I'd have to say that Itachi would win. As we do know, though it is small, the Byakugan leaves a small weakness in the back. What's to say Itachi would not exploit this?

Just something to think about.

[rockmanj]

taking nothin from kakashi, i think thta hiashi is more experienced than kaikashi, and i speculate that he is probably much stronger (even though they say kakashi is the #1 technician in konoha) technique wise. I say thi because even though he probably knows a wide variety of techniques, he is highly specialized in the hyuga style jitsus. And as for kakashi, you know what they say about jacks of all trades...

[kaigan]

my conclusion is that we seen little of the two that we can came up with an answer. btw, this match would never happened.

even if the kids wasn't there, zabuza is roughly the same lvl as kakashi. after all, he came from the same place as kisame(sp?), so he can not be taken lightly either.

[XXUchiha_ItachiXX]

Ok this is the most retarded forum topic I have read. How in the world do u expect a byakugan user to beat a sharingan user. How can Hiashi beat itachi when he cant even stare at itachi. Plus hiashi and his clan are such wussies because they have to put the swastika crap on the branch family's in case they are stronger than they are. Why do people always try to make reasons for the strongest bad guy in the manga to get beat by some inferior POS. The ones that would put up the best fight would be Jiraiya and Gai. In the end this topic is way too stupid to be even posted.

[Hotsuma]

Originally posted by: XXUchiha_ItachiXX
Ok this is the most retarded forum topic I have read. How in the world do u expect a byakugan user to beat a sharingan user. How can Hiashi beat itachi when he cant even stare at itachi. Plus hiashi and his clan are such wussies because they have to put the swastika crap on the branch family's in case they are stronger than they are. Why do people always try to make reasons for the strongest bad guy in the manga to get beat by some inferior POS. The ones that would put up the best fight would be Jiraiya and Gai. In the end this topic is way too stupid to be even posted.

Shut the fuck up, newbie. Nothing you say has any validity in here.

[hiten mitsurugi]

Originally posted by: XXUchiha_ItachiXX
Ok this is the most retarded forum topic I have read. How in the world do u expect a byakugan user to beat a sharingan user. How can Hiashi beat itachi when he cant even stare at itachi. Plus hiashi and his clan are such wussies because they have to put the swastika crap on the branch family's in case they are stronger than they are. Why do people always try to make reasons for the strongest bad guy in the manga to get beat by some inferior POS. The ones that would put up the best fight would be Jiraiya and Gai. In the end this topic is way too stupid to be even posted.

1. Sharingan branched off from Byakugen. If there was no Byakugen, then there would be no Sharingan.

2. If they are such wussies then why is there still a clan? Can you say that there is still an Uchiha Clan? With that being said, who's stupid?

Byakugen can pretty much do everything that Sharingan can and more. Byakugen has better insight abilities (and no that doesn't mean seeing through objects). That's the ability to foresee things before it happens. So if they simply wanted to copy jutsus they easily could, it's just that they don't train byakugen in that manner. Neji gave us a clear indication of this when he used byakugen on Hinata during thier fight. When Neji told her to give up and she said that she wouldn't give up because it's her ninja way. Neji read her thought and said that she totally believed in what she said. He did the same thing to Naruto, when Naruto stated that he would be hokage during their fight.

How can Hiashi beat itachi when he can't even stare at Itachi? Simple, because byakugen can see 359 degrees. That means that he can fight even with his back turned to him. Just a couple of touches from Hiashi and no more chakra. That means no sharingan, no water clones, no mange, no nothing but taijutsu.

[Mut]

Originally posted by: hiten mitsurugi
Byakugen can pretty much do everything that Sharingan can and more. Byakugen has better insight abilities (and no that doesn't mean seeing through objects). That's the ability to foresee things before it happens. So if they simply wanted to copy jutsus they easily could, it's just that they don't train byakugen in that manner. Neji gave us a clear indication of this when he used byakugen on Hinata during thier fight. When Neji told her to give up and she said that she wouldn't give up because it's her ninja way. Neji read her thought and said that she totally believed in what she said. He did the same thing to Naruto, when Naruto stated that he would be hokage during their fight.

this is the most incorrect thing i've heard.



How can Hiashi beat itachi when he can't even stare at Itachi? Simple, because byakugen can see 359 degrees. That means that he can fight even with his back turned to him. Just a couple of touches from Hiashi and no more chakra. That means no sharingan, no water clones, no mange, no nothing but taijutsu.

but that's the thing. you cannot fight with your back turned, or in any other way, as well as looking directly at them. and since you bring up 'couple of touches from hiashi and no more chakra.' well, ONE look from itachi and death.

[hiten mitsurugi]

Reply believe what you want; it's easy to say that its incorrect. Kakashi said it himself.


Since byakugen vision spans 359 degrees, then it's not really like fighting with your back turned. Can't you see that? Your just no looking into his eyes with your eyes. Byakugen benefits from this vision greatly.

[Hotsuma]

Originally posted by: hiten mitsurugi
Reply believe what you want; it's easy to say that its incorrect. Kakashi said it himself.


Since byakugen vision spans 359 degrees, then it's not really like fighting with your back turned. Can't you see that? Your just no looking into his eyes with your eyes. Byakugen benefits from this vision greatly.

Actually, I think only Neji's Byakugan is 359 degrees in vision. But, I do agree w/HM. Byakugan has a lot going for it.

Byakugan lets you see through anything physical. One of it's greatest strength is simply see your chakra system - and surprise, that means no physical eye contact. All the Byakugan user would see is a silhouette with coils of chakra inside of them. And, that would be an excellent advantage.

[Hakeem_21]

If a byakugan user and a Sharingan user who are at the same level fights eachother the byakugan user would have a small advantage since the byakugan user cant cut off the sharingan user chakra. I would like to Neji vs Sasuke or Kakashi or Itachi vs Hiashi just to see what happens.

[Assertn]

Originally posted by: Hotsuma
Shut the fuck up, newbie. Nothing you say has any validity in here.

way to throw your status around, Hotsuma

that point about hiashi not being able to look at itachi's mange sharingan was something i also pointed out earlier, and having the ability to see all around you would only make you more vulnerable to it.

also the blind spot in the back is NEJI's weakness......im sure hiashi's is more like the size of a needle if any at all. I can assume this because it seems to me that neji was out in the woods training to decrease this blindspot when he was trying to see all the birds

[Hotsuma]

Originally posted by: AssertnFailure


Originally posted by: Hotsuma
Shut the fuck up, newbie. Nothing you say has any validity in here.

way to throw your status around, Hotsuma

that point about hiashi not being able to look at itachi's mange sharingan was something i also pointed out earlier, and having the ability to see all around you would only make you more vulnerable to it.

also the blind spot in the back is NEJI's weakness......im sure hiashi's is more like the size of a needle if any at all. I can assume this because it seems to me that neji was out in the woods training to decrease this blindspot when he was trying to see all the birds

I said what I did, because newbies shouldn't come in here, and automatically say "This thread is stupid" without even having been here w/us.

And, the Byakugan's 360 vision isn't what'll fight the Mangekyou Sharingan. It's the ability to have a different view of him (his chakra field).

[Assertn]

yeah i did consider that....it sounded like from kakashi that the only way to negate the powers of the mange sharingan is with another sharingan, but whether or not the chakra view of the byakugan would help or not is pretty much entirely up to kishimoto

[Boogster]

I don't think we have seen the sharingan's powers to the extent to which we have been shown the Byukagan's.

[Hotsuma]

How do we know we've seen all of the Byakugan's secrets?

[hiten mitsurugi]

Originally posted by: Hotsuma
How do we know we've seen all of the Byakugan's secrets?

I agree. All we've seen is genins use it. We have seen the difference in Kaiten when Hiashi performs it. Just like there's a difference in Itachi using sharingan and Sasuke using Sharingan. Hiashi's byakugen usage should be extremely badass.

[Mut]

Originally posted by: Hotsuma
How do we know we've seen all of the Byakugan's secrets?

i think we've seen all of it, if not all of the 'devastating' abilities of it. we might not have seen the other little things that it does but there isn't an important enough character to develope with the byukagan. however, sharingan is crucial to the 2nd main character of the story. kishimoto wouldn't have some super secret ability that byukagan has but it won't be developed/shown.

[Assertn]

im still waiting for the opportunity for a hyuga to use tenketsu to increase chakra flow, as they had stated at least once or twice so far

[Baka_Desuyo]

Okay, I found a good site while looking for some Naruto maps that has some good information and comparisons between the Byakugan and Sharingan. The site is: http://www.anime-dojo.free-websites.com/catalog.html

Just something for you all to look at and hopefully get some ideas from. For me, though, it really just seems like this fight would come down to what techniques Itachi would start off using. I mean, he'd probably be smart enough to know not to get close to Hiashi, and so could use plenty of jutsus against him. But Hiashi's defence might be so good that all jutsus would be in vain. Who knows.