Chapter 198 Discussion

[Nine Tailed Demon]

So what do you think? http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/huh.gif

[Spressa]

i think that neji should've killed him off

[rockmanj]

i didnt know that ninja dog chick was kiba's sister....

[sangai]

i dont think it is i think its his mom

[Elite Hentai]

I liked it. This manga doesn't need action every chapter.

[zidane]

Neji probebly isn't dead yet, my guess at least, especialy after seeing what he said. Goodness. Probebly gonna be rescued later on allong with Choji.

[jing]

i dont think neji is dead either, he said I cannot die that easily
I BELIEVE U NEJI I STILL BELIEVE IN U

[cuaghe]

Do you guys know why Oro's hands are bleeding??

[FlatulationNoJutsu]

cuaghe: orochimaru's hands and arms are bleeding because sandaime used that crazy jutsu on him before he died, the one where the shinagami type thing came out and destroyed oro's arms so he couldnt use jutsu.

i wouldnt count neji out just quite yet, i mean after all, they didnt show his curse of hatred thingy dissapear. we all know that when someone with that curse dies, it dissapears and since they didnt show that, i wouldnt say he's dead yet.

[Assertn]

the title DID say siblings......im pretty sure she's kiba's older sister

come to think of it, we've never really seen any of the characters have older siblings (except for itachi, but that doesnt really count, since he's pretty much isolated himself from the whole village anyway)....i think it would be cool to see them hang around sometimes

[*mxyzptlk]

hmmm narutofan's links seem to be down, can anyone provide a mirror to the OT sub?

[JonioAgoGo]

Well at any rate, Kiba's sister=HAWT.

Maybe she'll show up?

And who is this shizune? Did I skip some chapters?

[Assertn]

what? you think so? i cant help but think of the scene where naruto bit kiba and was saying that he reeks of dog......

i would imagine his sister to be the same way ::shudders::

[JonioAgoGo]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AssertnFailure @ Dec 19 2003, 09:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> what? you think so? i cant help but think of the scene where naruto bit kiba and was saying that he reeks of dog......

i would imagine his sister to be the same way ::shudders:: </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
True. Maybe she&#39;s different. Maybe she just can summon dogs or something?

Either way, she LOOKS hot. Can&#39;t say much about the smell.

[84K4]

best chapter in a while I wonder what this &quot;kimimaro&quot; is?

[Elessar]

She is around with his father when defending konoha against the sand/sound invasion when all the parents are shown fighting. So I guess she really is his mother.

And I think Kiba&#39;s parents use wolves. Either that or the meanest looking dogs in the history of dogs.

[makkura]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>And I think Kiba&#39;s parents use wolves</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

i think thats what akamaru will look like when he&#39;ll be all grown up.

[Winged Dancer]

I don&#39;t know what Kimimaro (I think it&#39;s actually &quot;Kimihamaro&quot;, too), but I don&#39;t think it&#39;s a person...

Kidoumaru said something like &quot;I haven&#39;t been this close to defeat since Kimimaro&quot;, and Kabuto seems to be rallying people to a kill-or-die fight. Kimimaro is most probably the proccess that Orochimaru uses to choose his servants - only the best out of the best.
So the four sounds that got Sasuke were/are most probably the best of the best...

Also, I don&#39;t think Neji is dead. It was just too ambiguos, and he said it himself - he can&#39;t die just yet. He probably just fainted - same with Kidoumaru. A little like the Naruto vs. Gaara fight (I still argue Naruto won - at least psychologically&#33;), in which the two of the ended up so battered that they couldn&#39;t move.

So... don&#39;t die Neji&#33;&#33; Nooooo&#33;&#33;&#33; ::Cheers on Neji::

Also, Shikamaru is hinting that perhaps things will be settled in one more encounter... meaning one on one fights ended with this chapter? Hope so... it can get a little boring.

Finally, it seems that Sasuke wont get to Orochimaru at the end. Oro is too busy taking a shower to go and retrieve him, and Kabuto is too busy watching him taking a shower to do it either. &#39;Sides, seems Orochimaru wasn&#39;t thinking of training Sasuke at all - he just wanted his body to reincarnate into. Now, Orochimaru taking over Sasuke&#39;s body would be utterly stupid plot-wise, so I can only guess that Naruto will keep his promise and bring Sasuke back.

[Female ramble]And then Sakura should slap him. At the very least. I know Sasuke could dogde the slap or stop it or whatever, he deserves it&#33; Perhaps someone (Tsunade, for instance) should invent the Slap no Jutsu, specially for egocentric morons.[/Female ramble]

[villin]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (JonioAgoGo @ Dec 19 2003, 10:55 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Well at any rate, Kiba&#39;s sister=HAWT.

Maybe she&#39;ll show up?

And who is this shizune? Did I skip some chapters? </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Agreed


Shizune is Tsunade&#39;s aprentice/lesbian lover whatever you want to call her. http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/mf_dribble.gif

[JonioAgoGo]

Just another thought.

If Orochimaru just wanted Sasuke&#39;s body...

Could that mean that Sasuke really is dead?

I know, highly unlikely, but wouldn&#39;t that just be a freaky twist?

[Raven]

The word sibling doesnt necessarily mean your brother or sister, it can be used for parents too. Just thought you all might like to know. http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/wink.gif

A good chapter, it seems like Orochimaru&#39;s about to die if he doesn&#39;t reincarnate straight away, things are about to heat up a bit I think&#33; http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif

I wonder if there&#39;s a possibility he&#39;ll use Kabuto&#39;s body just to stay alive? http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/blink.gif That&#39;d be kind of dumb though.

[Uzumaki Kakashi]

u know what would be cool if the reason itachi killed his clan was because of orochimaru made him do it while he was still young and probably could be controleed by some mind control jutsu. but then itachi became even stronger and orochimaru had to let him loose because he was a threat to orochimaru. I know this is just rambling but we dont know whether orochimaru left the village before itachi killed his clan . maybe orochimaru was frightned about the uchiha clan and told itach to kill them allbut leave one (sasuke for example) so he could get the sharingan later on and then orochimaru could learn all the jutsus with the sharingan.

[samsonlonghair]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (CmDr_RavEn @ Dec 20 2003, 01:39 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The word sibling doesnt necessarily mean your brother or sister, it can be used for parents too. Just thought you all might like to know. http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/wink.gif </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
According to Websters, Sibling only includes brothers and sisters. There was only one definition.

Sibling n : one of two or more individuals having one common parent.

It says that the word comes from the Middle-english word sib, which means kinsman. So, a few centuries back you might have used sib for your parents, but not today.

Assuming there was no translation error, that must have been Kiba&#39;s sister.

If you can show me an official definition of sibling that includes parents, I&#39;ll gladly retract that.

[XwingRob]

This &quot;reincarnation&quot; is nothing more than mind transfer, isn&#39;t it?

[Uchuu no Recca]

wow elaborate plans.........Evil indeed. Meeee likes.

[MemnochTheCaT]

I imagine that Orochimaru wouldn&#39;t want to take Sasuke&#39;s body until Sasuke gets a bit more powerful. It would be dangerous for Oro to possess Sasuke in a weak form. He&#39;ll probably try to train Sasuke up a bit, raise his chakra stamina, increase his physical strength, then when he feels it would be safe, plan to steal his body.

Of course, someone will stop Oro, and I think it will be Itachi. That would really put a twist on Sasuke&#39;s plans. Being saved by the one you swore to kill .. heh.

[SDShamshel]

Akatsuki means dawn.

[AlbinoFury]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (MemnochTheCaT @ Dec 20 2003, 04:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> I imagine that Orochimaru wouldn&#39;t want to take Sasuke&#39;s body until Sasuke gets a bit more powerful. It would be dangerous for Oro to possess Sasuke in a weak form. He&#39;ll probably try to train Sasuke up a bit, raise his chakra stamina, increase his physical strength, then when he feels it would be safe, plan to steal his body.

Of course, someone will stop Oro, and I think it will be Itachi. That would really put a twist on Sasuke&#39;s plans. Being saved by the one you swore to kill .. heh. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
no it said he needed sasuke now, hes not waiting he needs body cause it seems the arm sealing is fubaring him all over.

Also about the bloody arms in the shower, it seems as if he is using cutting to gain some sort of circulation in his arms so that they dont rot off and die. This is kinda hinted at when Kabuto said that he should stop because he reached his limit. Also if u look close their are little cut marks all over his arms and hands.

[Elite Hentai]

I really hope the next chapter won&#39;t have much blablabla but this time a really cool team fight

[Chi Chi]

It starts to get promising. But Sasuke will never arrive on time unless his soul can stay alive while his body is possessed by Orochimaru, I don&#39;t think any of the Konoha Genin 12 (or 11 + Shikimaru) will ever die before they&#39;re old.

[Uzumaki Naruto]

O MY FUKIN GOD&#33;&#33;&#33;&#33; neiji derserves a round of applause(dont know how it is spelled correct it if u like) but yea shit neiji rocks in this chapt he gave his respect to naruto believing that he can rescue sasuke from the dark like the time naruto rescued him from the dark but u have to agree with me though he does derserve a round of applause http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/laugh.gif

[SirCharlesIII]

wow, this is one of my favorite chapters i think. Looks like we&#39;ll finnally get some team battleing, with shikamaru&#39;s last comment about having a plan, and despite the switches it remains incredibly cohesive. ok a few thoughts:
1. as far as kimimaro, it&#39;s probably the name of the battle to the death that kabuto starts. Obviously Kidoumaru won it at some point.
2. Man when you talk about Naruto&#39;s search for acknowledgement...how much more can you ask for? Neji&#39;s comments and belief in Naruto are amazing, it would take a lot for neji to change that much. talk about acknowledgement, that was incredible respect.
3. kabuto&#39;s comment about the limit could mean that oro had to stop cutting his arms, or it could mean that they&#39;ve (the arms) have lasted as long as they can, and any longer and any hope of saving them will be lost.

[Elessar]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AssertnFailure &#064; Dec 20 2003, 12:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> just because she was with kiba&#39;s dad doesnt mean that she&#39;s his wife.* It would be perfectly reasonable for her to be his daughter. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
I thought of that more because it was at the part when all the parents were introduced.

But it is kyoudai on the front page and, after looking it up, with the used kanji it clearly means &quot;older sister and younger brother&quot;. So I was wrong... *sniff*

[Death BOO Z]

on another subject, did anyone else notice how &quot;unkiba&#39; kiba looks in the opening? i think Kishomonto got lazy and used the same scetches from the time Shika and his father were on the cover, they look too much alike&#33;

i hope kiba will have someaction next time...

and something else... if all the ninjas Kabuto took in for the battle royal thing can&#39;t work togther and find a way out, doesn&#39;t it mean they all suck and don&#39;t deserve whatever rank they have? i don&#39;t think Oro will want a body of some loser...

[hyuga_hinata]

Neji BETTER NOT BE DEAD&#33;
ahh, its too vague for me to handle&#33;

If he does die, we need more action from Hinata - keep Hyuga happening&#33;&#33;

Someone said that Oro&#39;s arms are bleeding cos they&#39;re rotting... maybe blood can get thru and around, so it ends up bleeding?? hmm...

Well, if its gonna end up that all or most of the main characters dying, then i hope that Sasuke ends up living the rest of his life with the guilt&#33; http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/mf_jumpon.gif

[Hotsuma]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Insomniac @ Dec 20 2003, 01:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> we dont know for sure how strong Kabuto really is do we?
we know that he took a hit from rasengen and recovered and that he was beating Tsunade, one of the legendary three.
if you dont think Kabuto has it in him then what manga have you been reading http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/dry.gif
Kabuto so far has shown a massive degree of intelligence and cunning, Orochimaru thinks hes only about Kakashis level but he was still able to take on Tsunade. If you ask me, Kabutos going to turn into the greater threat, hes got the most mystery surrounding his background, cant wait to find out.

and by the way we dont know for sure that Itachi is stronger then Orochimaru, they said one line and everyone clings to that like its their only hope lol, until they fight i&#39;d have to say i dont think that the statement is true. by the way, we&#39;re bound by english translations which means it could have been a completely different context.

I think it would provide the ultimate plot twist if Itachi was Orochimarus reincarnation, it would provoke Sasuke hugely. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Oro himself said Itachi was stronger than himself. Considering Oro&#39;s arrogance, do you really think it&#39;s just a lie? Come on, dude.

Unless Itachi himself says otherwise, the series has made it clear that Itachi is flat out stronger. And, you shouldn&#39;t be blaming English translations as well. For all we know, everything we&#39;ve been reading was mis-translated, or was in different context. Give the translators some credit.

When somebody admits that another is better, do we need a fight to prove it? Kakashi was scared to death of Oro in that sealing area, and scolded himself for trying to rise against Oro. Do we need a fight to prove that Kakashi would have gotten his ass kicked? The point here is, once somebody admits it, there&#39;s really no way to bend it.

[Hotsuma]

I&#39;m getting tired of this Orochimaru crap. I want to see some Itachi and Akatsuki stuff happening. What&#39;s happening around the Konoha should be emphasized, too.

[Insomniac]

Itachi stop Oro? what world are you living in http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/dry.gif
Itachi has nothing against Orochimaru and theres no reason for him to stop him, he probably doesnt even know.
and you think Itachi has a chance while Orochimarus in his own village with probably thousands of nins? Itachi isnt that strong.

omfg just thought of the biggest plot twist ever... ok

Sasuke gets saved by Naruto and Orochimarus plans are foiled, Kabuto comes back with a mysterious body... Itachis&#33; Orochimaru reincarnates himself into Itachi http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/mf_dribble.gif

[Insomniac]

Rock Lee said he was the strongest genin in kohona, which was a lie.
he admitted it afterwards that Neji was stronger but theres no reason for Orochimaru to mention Itachi again is there? hes not apart of the story at the moment (i&#39;m guessing the writer used this reference to build up a threat, to make it seem like he was something big by displaying another bad guy talking about him), you put too much faith in one sentence, Itachi is nothing more then a plot device for Sasuke. when the time comes that hes not needed to fuel Sasukes life meaning he&#39;ll die easily. Its the way with all anime

also Shino said he was a chuunin, which he actually wasnt (even if he was at chuunin level it doesnt make him a chuunin now does it?).
theres alot of these literial meaning things that people prey on, i for one having analysed the story make it hard to believe that Orochimaru would just lay down and die if Itachi was there. The main reason Orochimaru would be scared of him was the sharigan being able to copy his jutsus, the jutsus hes spent countless years assembling, if Orochimaru wanted Itachi dead it wouldnt be that hard a task. I mean come on, hes killed 2 Kages and has a village under his command.

we also have no idea how strong Kabuto is, he never said that he feared Itachi did he? for all we know he could come back with Itachi&#39;s body, its a possibility.
Kabuto has had plenty of times to kill Orochimaru if he wanted to, you think he only follows Orochimaru because hes &#39;stronger&#39;?

[Nine Tailed Demon]

If Itachi is stronger that Oro and Oro is stronger than Kabuto, how will Kaubto defeat ITachi?

http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/dry.gif

Anyway, Akatsuki will be the last villian then the anime is ova...

[Assertn]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Elessar @ Dec 19 2003, 09:52 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> She is around with his father when defending konoha against the sand/sound invasion when all the parents are shown fighting. So I guess she really is his mother.

And I think Kiba&#39;s parents use wolves. Either that or the meanest looking dogs in the history of dogs. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
just because she was with kiba&#39;s dad doesnt mean that she&#39;s his wife. It would be perfectly reasonable for her to be his daughter.

that was a nice touch with the bird feather in neji&#39;s hand (although i think they overuse that caged bird symbolism wayy to much, but maybe im just saying that because they just recently had the whole caged bird explanation in the anime)

[Death BOO Z]

just a small question... is the name of the orginaztion Akatsuki (red moon) or Akutsuki (evil moon)? i see that both are used and both make sense... another thing is that in chapter 148, Itachi talks about the sunset and sunrise but the transelatores chose to keep it in the original form instead of wrriting &quot;until the moon turns into the sun&quot; or something, it makes me suspect that they sun and moon are codenmaes for operations and not just time of day...

I mean, maybe they ran away becuase the can&#39;t do whatever they planned to do with Naruto yet, becuase thier leader is still in phase 1 of something?

just a bunch of nonsense, as usual&#33;

[Insomniac]

we dont know for sure how strong Kabuto really is do we?
we know that he took a hit from rasengen and recovered and that he was beating Tsunade, one of the legendary three.
if you dont think Kabuto has it in him then what manga have you been reading http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/dry.gif
Kabuto so far has shown a massive degree of intelligence and cunning, Orochimaru thinks hes only about Kakashis level but he was still able to take on Tsunade. If you ask me, Kabutos going to turn into the greater threat, hes got the most mystery surrounding his background, cant wait to find out.

and by the way we dont know for sure that Itachi is stronger then Orochimaru, they said one line and everyone clings to that like its their only hope lol, until they fight i&#39;d have to say i dont think that the statement is true. by the way, we&#39;re bound by english translations which means it could have been a completely different context.

I think it would provide the ultimate plot twist if Itachi was Orochimarus reincarnation, it would provoke Sasuke hugely.

[Winged Dancer]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AssertnFailure @ Dec 20 2003, 12:08 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> that was a nice touch with the bird feather in neji&#39;s hand (although i think they overuse that caged bird symbolism wayy to much, but maybe im just saying that because they just recently had the whole caged bird explanation in the anime) </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Perhaps. It was weird how the Neji vs. Naruto anime fight concided with the Neji vs. Kidoumaru one... I didn&#39;t mind the caged bird symbolism at all though. Perhaps by the time we see this in the anime (man that&#39;s a loooong time&#33;), we&#39;ll have forgotten about the caged bird thing... and this&#39;ll remind us ^^

(Hey, think of it this way... since the Chuuning exam and this, we have quite some things to distract us... Gaara, Tsunade, the three sennins battle, then Sasuke goes evil...)

[Insomniac]

exactly

[Hayate]

Itachi and Kisame werent afraid of Jiraiya.

they just didnt want to fight him, well Kisame did.

and it says nowhere who Kabuto is afraid of, but, he did look pretty scared of Orochimaru back when they were chatting during the Chuunin exams.

on topic, do you think that Orochimaru will end up in Kabuto&#39;s body? coz Kabuto seems pretty eager to give himself up. maybe that has been Kabuto&#39;s motivation, and the reason why he thought about killing Sasuke while he was in hospital.

strange kid, that Kabuto

[Insomniac]

i dont think Orochimaru will let Kabuto give up his body to him.
If he does then Orochimaru loses a friend and a very effective bodyguard, i mean you wouldnt let your best friend kill themselves so you could live would you?
Although its a scary thought, Kabutos potential for power seems amazing - i dont think we&#39;ve even seen the surface of what he can do.
He has a history of playing down his skills (failing the chuunin exam 4 times, failing the academy exam 3 times) and yet hes able to do the stuff that he can.
Lets hope that one of the bodies that Orochimaru does reincarnate into isnt just some random person and someone we&#39;ve seen once or twice - would be a better plot.

by the way Kabuto never thought of killing Sasuke in the hospital, he pulled out that knife to throw at Kakashi whom he sensed behind him

[Destroyor]

Lot of wishful thinking Insomniac ... sorry but I just don&#39;t buy it.

[oscar]

i think the story just got more interesting, also kimimaro is also mentioned in chapter 178 page 18, so i dont think its a methos of gettin the best of the best, but most likely some d00d that kicks ass.

[Lenas]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>we also have no idea how strong Kabuto is</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Kabuto has been said to be Kakashi-level in terms of power. And we all know how bad Kakashi got his ass beat by Itachi.

[Hotsuma]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Jiraiy4 @ Dec 21 2003, 01:17 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>When somebody admits that another is better, do we need a fight to prove it? Kakashi was scared to death of Oro in that sealing area, and scolded himself for trying to rise against Oro. Do we need a fight to prove that Kakashi would have gotten his ass kicked? The point here is, once somebody admits it, there&#39;s really no way to bend it. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

well you proved yourself wrong. Words don&#39;t mean nothing.

Orochimaru is scared of Itachi, but not Jiraiya.

Jiraiya is not afraid of Itachi nor Orochimaru.

Kakashi,Asuma,and Kurenai is DEAD afraid of Orochimaru, but they&#39;re not afraid of Itachi, though they&#39;ll admit he&#39;s stronger.

Kabuto is afraid of Jiraiya but not as much of Orochimaru and Tsunade.

Tsunade isn&#39;t scared of Jiraiya or Orochimaru.

Itachi and Kisame are not afraid of Orochimaru but they were of Jiraiya.

As you can see...nothing ever really connects with the shit everyone &quot;said&quot; </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Orochimaru isn&#39;t afraid of Jiraiya, because they were all in the same group, and is generally looked on as &quot;superior&quot; to Jiraiya.

Jiraiya pissed his pants, after seeing the black flames Itachi made to fuck up his jutsu.

We don&#39;t know of Asuma and Kurenai is afraid of Oro. They never met, they probably are, though. Kakashi was afraid of Itachi. Hell, he knew he was going to get his ass beat. All they wanted to do was buy some time, and have some of the other Konoha come in. Too bad Itachi is too smart for that.

Kabuto is afraid of Orochimaru. Oro constantly threatens and picks on him. Think for a moment, if you will.. Orochimaru is a gimp now, and Kabuto is STILL his bitch. Oro must be pretty damn good, if he&#39;s got lackies even after losing his most powerful assets (his arms).

Tsunade and Jiraiya are friends. No need for her to be afraid of him. Orochimaru was a gimp, and she still couldn&#39;t beat him. She can&#39;t beat Kabuto, either sadly.

Itachi and Kisame are the strongest in the series so far. They weren&#39;t afraid of Jiraiya, or Naruto in that little tussle. There&#39;s a difference between being scared, and strategically retreating. NOT that it was required, but Itachi proves to be a whimsical character.

Sorry to say, but you guys have nothing. I mean, all we have is the AUTHORS WORD, that Itachi is stronger. All you people have are baseless speculations and theories. And fandom, of course.

[XwingRob]

Hmm...do you think Kabuto is trying to learn Orochimaru&#39;s secret for &quot;eternal life&quot;?

[Elite Hentai]

Why is everybody saying Sasuke is gay? Isn&#39;t it obvious that Kabuto is the biggest fag in Fire Country?

[SoulTrigger]

Just to cut on the Itachi arms issue...

The Third did cut his spiritual arms, since the material arms are most likely based in the spiritual ones, since spiritual ones are dead, the material ones will follow. I doubt he is cutting his arms, he is at the limit the body can take the pain and still survive, the third´s power seems to be consuming him a bit beyond that, we shall see...

[Insomniac]

he may seem stronger but hes definatly not a greater threat then Orochimaru, for Itachi to survive longer then Orochimaru there would have to be a miracle, Orochimaru has been identified as the &#39;bad&#39; guy and Itachi is merely the goal. Goals are meant to be reached, he will be defeated a long time before characters like Orochimaru.

Itachi simply killed his clan, i dont know why hes seen as a mysterious character - all we&#39;re trying to find out is why he did it.
Kabuto we know nothing about, other then he constantly supresses how strong he really is.
Orochimaru has been identified as the evil, he experiments on living beings from his own village and has no regard for life at all. Whatever plot you can think up for Itachi will not even reach Orochimarus creepy and weirdness, you dont see Itachi with a snake tounge do you?

Kabuto isnt gay, he serves someone who he probably sees as a father, do you have sexual thoughts about your father? Father and son occasionally threaten each other and have fights, but when it comes down to it they still care about each other. I&#39;m guessing Orochimaru took in Kabuto after he was the sole survivor and treated him like his son.

We dont have the authors word for it we have the translators word for it, unless you&#39;ve talked to him about it. Jiraiya didnt piss his pants when he saw the fire, he was intregied and he sealed it with ease seconds later.
Kakashi was never shaking when he first met Itachi, against Orochimaru he was shitting his pants, so he obviously knows more then we do about what they&#39;re both capable of.

my point is, even though Itachi may have been identified as stronger it doesnt mean he&#39;d walk over anyone unless it made sense to the plot. Orochimaru wouldnt lose to Itachi because hes the &#39;ultimate evil&#39; of Naruto, there is no other source for this great an evil and Itachi cant really replace it.

Itachi is disposable, Orochimaru isnt.
(if you&#39;re wondering what this has to do with this chapter, its just adding to my possibility of Kabuto bringing back Itachi&#39;s body, it IS a possibility, greater then most. Excuse me for thinking of possible storylines that would add interesting situations)

[Uchuu no Recca]

Hmm, The most powerful person in naruto is still naruto. It is his show&#33;

[Insomniac]

for those that think Orochimaru and Kabuto are gay lets look at the facts shall we.

Orochimaru has licked Anko (got to respect that)
Kabuto has touched more boobs then anyone in the entire Naruto series (Hinata and Tsunade)

they&#39;ve done things that most people in this forum only dream about and you&#39;re calling them gay? http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/laugh.gif


infact they&#39;re basically the only ones who have had ANY female contact at all
Not only has Naruto kissed a guy, he found Haku more attractive then Sakura, i wonder why people dont call him gay? haha

[JonioAgoGo]

Itachi could very easily become the bad guy, just his motives aren&#39;t as destructive as Oro&#39;s.

But man, Oro has Kabuto wrapped around his finger, I wonder what he did to cause that. Well...he does have that tounge....

But still, I want to know WHY Kabuto is so strong, wouldn&#39;t it be interesting if he has some advanced Curse Seal?

But the Kimmaro(sp?) I&#39;m thinking that its just the name of the competition.

[Insomniac]

from what i&#39;m guessing Kabuto may be from an ancient blood line (his eyes) and he has to constantly supress it in fear that his &#39;old blood&#39; might awaken

if you dont think thats interesting then what the hell is

also about that tounge comment, read my post before yours http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/mf_gap.gif

[Legato 2057]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Death BOO Z @ Dec 20 2003, 04:41 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> on another subject, did anyone else notice how &quot;unkiba&#39; kiba looks in the opening? i think Kishomonto got lazy and used the same scetches from the time Shika and his father were on the cover, they look too much alike&#33;

i hope kiba will have someaction next time...

and something else... if all the ninjas Kabuto took in for the battle royal thing can&#39;t work togther and find a way out, doesn&#39;t it mean they all suck and don&#39;t deserve whatever rank they have? i don&#39;t think Oro will want a body of some loser... </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
I&#39;m sure that Kabuto is stronger than anyone currently in Kimimaro. After all, he is Oro&#39;s right hand man. If they tried to escape together, they would all die. Their only recourse is to kill the other ninja&#39;s and survive.

[Destroyor]

The &quot;Ultimate&quot; evil isn&#39;t Orochimaru. That title should go to the leader of Akatsuki, the one that ordered Itachi to retrieve Naruto.

[Insomniac]

i dont know why people would assume that the leader of Atasuki is someone stronger then everyone, Gattou was Zabuzas leader and we all know he was a weakling.
Also ordering someone to kidnap someone isnt as bad as experimenting on them the way Orochimaru did, as far as we know at the moment he is the &#39;evil&#39;, we cant make assumptions on people we&#39;ve heard NOTHING about.

Also Atasuki doesnt seem to have a ascending command line, they&#39;re probably a democracy on their decisions

[hoob]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Insomniac @ Dec 21 2003, 05:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> i dont know why people would assume that the leader of Atasuki is someone stronger then everyone, Gattou was Zabuzas leader and we all know he was a weakling.
Also ordering someone to kidnap someone isnt as bad as experimenting on them the way Orochimaru did, as far as we know at the moment he is the &#39;evil&#39;, we cant make assumptions on people we&#39;ve heard NOTHING about.

Also Atasuki doesnt seem to have a ascending command line, they&#39;re probably a democracy on their decisions </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
If I remember correctly, Gatou wasn&#39;t Zabusa&#39;s leader, he was just a client of Zabusa&#39;s wasn&#39;t he? If so, then it wouldn&#39;t mean anything, cause yea, Zabusa seemed like he had no leader by then.

[Insomniac]

client, leader whatever, i just meant that Gattou controled what he did.
Gattou told Zabuza what to do but he wasnt stronger
its probably the thing if Atasuki has a leader, Itachi is working for him for a reason other then hes stronger.

[Nine Tailed Demon]

Arguing over opinions where everyone thinks they&#39;re right...

[Blight]

I wonder it seems that in the near future oro will be takeing a new body, and he seems bloody minded about getting sasukes body. and it seems oro is running out of time to change bodies

so oro has a few options

take the body from the winner fighting in the pit

or wait for sasuke, if he waits for sasuke. it means eather sasuke or oro has to die at that point, since sasuke has oro&#39;s curse i dont think sasuke can beat oro, would be a point that kuboto would turn sides. theres also a possablity where 2 souls one body, but that would be silly

anyway i assume that this thread wont happen for awhile as it goes back to the last 2 sound nins for a good 10 eps or more

[Insomniac]

thats what a discussion is http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/tongue.gif
whats the point of a discussion where no one believes what they&#39;re saying? lol

[Nine Tailed Demon]

Well then I&#39;ll gurantee you the body being brought by Kabuto will not be Itachi. The strongest person in the manga, IMO, will be the leader of Akatsuki.

I think the body will be the winner of the battle in the prison...

[Hotsuma]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Insomniac @ Dec 21 2003, 05:04 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> he may seem stronger but hes definatly not a greater threat then Orochimaru, for Itachi to survive longer then Orochimaru there would have to be a miracle, Orochimaru has been identified as the &#39;bad&#39; guy and Itachi is merely the goal. Goals are meant to be reached, he will be defeated a long time before characters like Orochimaru.

Itachi simply killed his clan, i dont know why hes seen as a mysterious character - all we&#39;re trying to find out is why he did it.
Kabuto we know nothing about, other then he constantly supresses how strong he really is.
Orochimaru has been identified as the evil, he experiments on living beings from his own village and has no regard for life at all. Whatever plot you can think up for Itachi will not even reach Orochimarus creepy and weirdness, you dont see Itachi with a snake tounge do you?

Kabuto isnt gay, he serves someone who he probably sees as a father, do you have sexual thoughts about your father? Father and son occasionally threaten each other and have fights, but when it comes down to it they still care about each other. I&#39;m guessing Orochimaru took in Kabuto after he was the sole survivor and treated him like his son.

We dont have the authors word for it we have the translators word for it, unless you&#39;ve talked to him about it. Jiraiya didnt piss his pants when he saw the fire, he was intregied and he sealed it with ease seconds later.
Kakashi was never shaking when he first met Itachi, against Orochimaru he was shitting his pants, so he obviously knows more then we do about what they&#39;re both capable of.

my point is, even though Itachi may have been identified as stronger it doesnt mean he&#39;d walk over anyone unless it made sense to the plot. Orochimaru wouldnt lose to Itachi because hes the &#39;ultimate evil&#39; of Naruto, there is no other source for this great an evil and Itachi cant really replace it.

Itachi is disposable, Orochimaru isnt.
(if you&#39;re wondering what this has to do with this chapter, its just adding to my possibility of Kabuto bringing back Itachi&#39;s body, it IS a possibility, greater then most. Excuse me for thinking of possible storylines that would add interesting situations) </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Who cares if Oro is a greater threat? Itachi can kick his ass, anyday of the week. ORO SAID IT HIMSELF. You can argue all you want - I don&#39;t know with what, though. You have nothing.

Oro has some weird fetishes. And a snake tongue - who cares? He said, with everything he had, that Itachi was stronger. What did he say that puts him in a superior spot to Itachi? Nothing.

And, yes. We do have the authors word. It&#39;s called the manga itself. You can&#39;t really say that it was mistranslated, can you? Hey, maybe everything we&#39;ve been reading was wrong&#33;

Kakashi was too, pissing his pants, when he was up against Itachi. He knew that would be a downhill battle. Only difference between this, and Oro was that Oro was arrogant enough to walk away from a Chidori-wielding Kakashi.

I&#39;ll admit. Oro is a better villain Itachi. Does that make him stronger? No.

Man, you must really hate Itachi, heh. I enjoy people who try to bend concrete words into their own versions, because they hate somebody and love another.

You are excused for making bonehead outcomes where your fandom of Oro makes a pathetic argument against the authors official words (or MAYBE it was mistranslated&#33;). Kabuto bringing back Itachi&#39;s body? Please. A greater possibility than what?

[Insomniac]

oh please this from someone who thinks that Hinata and Neji would be a good couple.
I would think you would be more tolerent of other peoples opinions but obviously you&#39;re just ignorant.
I didnt say that he was stronger then him in my last post did i? i said he was the better villian
which you admitted.

i never said i hated Itachi either, i&#39;m just not a fanboy of every single strong character.
I was saying that it was possible because even though hes strong doesnt mean he&#39;ll win if the time arouse

and no i&#39;m not a fan of Orochimaru either, i gave a possible storyline a chance.
If you want to flame me for that you&#39;re showing not only your lack of maturity but your closed mindedness.

[Hotsuma]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Insomniac @ Dec 21 2003, 08:59 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> oh please this from someone who thinks that Hinata and Neji would be a good couple.
I would think you would be more tolerent of other peoples opinions but obviously you&#39;re just ignorant.
I didnt say that he was stronger then him in my last post did i? i said he was the better villian
which you admitted.

i never said i hated Itachi either, i&#39;m just not a fanboy of every single strong character.
I was saying that it was possible because even though hes strong doesnt mean he&#39;ll win if the time arouse

and no i&#39;m not a fan of Orochimaru either, i gave a possible storyline a chance.
If you want to flame me for that you&#39;re showing not only your lack of maturity but you&#39;re closed mindedness. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Don&#39;t even bring in the Neji and Hinata thing.

Your entire argument in this discussion was that what Oro said might not necassarily be true. What basis do you have on this? Nothing. You were making it seem like the better villain is the stronger character. If not put into words, it was certainly implied. The DISCUSSION was Itachi being stronger, and YOU doubting it.

I&#39;m going to be blunt here. Everything you have, is crap. You have NO BASIS in this argument. You&#39;re going against the authors word (his manga) of Oro being weaker than Itachi, and you somehow bring in a nonsensical &quot;Well, Itachi isn&#39;t as good a villain&quot; Question to be for here, is &quot;Who cares?&quot;

I&#39;ll admit that I&#39;m not the most mature person here. I&#39;m far from it, in fact. When I see stupid crap like the stuff you mentioned, don&#39;t expect me to sit by idly and say &quot;Maybe so&quot;

[Insomniac]

thats your opinion, believe what you want but i&#39;m not going to waste my time trying to convince you

its just like how you were basing Neji x Hinata. your basis for that was &#39;he said she was cute when they were about 3 or 4&#39; and ignored everything thats happened since that.
You had no basis for that arguement.

I was saying that strength doesnt matter not that Orochimaru is stronger.
That was my arguement in the case of Kabuto bringing back Itachi&#39;s body, i&#39;m sorry if you missed that i but i dont think i should have to point out everything - maybe i should in the future for those who cant read and only focus on certain points.

i should stop trying to convince an Itachi fanboy of that though, you&#39;re probably still too amazed by him.

[tuggumkee]

the special thing about the sharingan is that it has more than sight, it can do hypnosis/ the other special attack itachi has. It&#39;s not nessicarily how strong they are, just how their jutsu&#39;s aline.

For example, Gai came and Itachi said lets go this will take to long. This isn&#39;t because Gai&#39;s stronger than Kakashi(well he could be if he opened up all 8 gates but thats not the point) but because Gai can fight with only the reflection from the water. also he doesn&#39;t use any jutsus.

Oro is probably scared of Itachi&#39;s hypnosis/whatever since he has no way to block it.

And i dont think the manga/anime will go into fighting Itachi&#39;s group, maybe in the OVA but i doubt it. the manga will probably end with the death of Oro, and not go into Itachi&#39;s organization.

And btw. i think from what we&#39;ve seen Oro is stronger, Itachi just has the hypnosis thing going for him, i doubt he has as much chakra as Oro. Oro can destroy a small village, and he&#39;s already killed 2 hokages with brute strength. Itachi&#39;s sharingan ability he can only use for like 4 people, then he gets tired. Oro is a better villan definatly

[Insomniac]

exactly its how the jutsus aline.
I never said that Orochimaru would defeat Itachi, i said that Kabuto could bring back his body.
Kabuto doesnt have the same style as Orochimaru.

someone else bought up the point that since Itachi was better then Orochimaru and Orochimaru was better then Kabuto that he couldnt.
which isnt completely true, why dont you read the whole topic first before replying Hotsuma

[Legato 2057]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (tuggumkee @ Dec 21 2003, 05:16 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> And i dont think the manga/anime will go into fighting Itachi&#39;s group, maybe in the OVA but i doubt it. the manga will probably end with the death of Oro, and not go into Itachi&#39;s organization.

And btw. i think from what we&#39;ve seen Oro is stronger, Itachi just has the hypnosis thing going for him, i doubt he has as much chakra as Oro. Oro can destroy a small village, and he&#39;s already killed 2 hokages with brute strength. Itachi&#39;s sharingan ability he can only use for like 4 people, then he gets tired. Oro is a better villan definatly </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
I have to disagree on these two points.

The manga will surely reach a conclusion with the Akatsuki. Kishimoto-san would not have had Sasuke betray the Leaf in order to become sronger, if he wasn&#39;t ging to use that power to fight Itachi.


While I do admit that Itachi hasn&#39;t &quot;kicked ass&quot; yet, and Orochimaru has, I don&#39;t think Itachi has shown all of his powers. After all, he did kill every member of his clan in a single night, so he has to have something besides the hyonotism thing.

[Insomniac]

it was said that Kabuto is at Kakashis level yes, but obviously hes above that to be able to take on Tsunade.
Look at the facts not just the words, Orochimaru said it not Kabuto. And judging by Kabutos &#39;old blood&#39; hes got alot of secrets hidden that havent even started to come out.

Also i dont think that Kabuto is just hanging around to learn that jutsu, hes probably seen it happen before, he also offered himself to Orochimaru as a body to take over - dont see why he&#39;d do that if he was planing to betray him.
As far as i can tell Kabuto is solid loyal for some reason, possibly more so then Haku was to Zabuza. Lets hope they make an OVA on his past or something, that&#39;d kick ass

[Nine Tailed Demon]

The Naruto movie will be about the legendary 3 senins, or atleast I hope so. Then OAVS on the sealing of Naruto and maybe one on Haku and Zabuza...

[Insomniac]

Haku and Zabuza have been resolved, theres nothing to OVA about them.
they had a whole arc about their past, theres not much else you can do.
anyway i&#39;m looking foward to seeing who makes it out of that pit, maybe it&#39;ll be someone we&#39;ve seen before.

[Jiraiy4]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>When somebody admits that another is better, do we need a fight to prove it? Kakashi was scared to death of Oro in that sealing area, and scolded himself for trying to rise against Oro. Do we need a fight to prove that Kakashi would have gotten his ass kicked? The point here is, once somebody admits it, there&#39;s really no way to bend it. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

well you proved yourself wrong. Words don&#39;t mean nothing.

Orochimaru is scared of Itachi, but not Jiraiya.

Jiraiya is not afraid of Itachi nor Orochimaru.

Kakashi,Asuma,and Kurenai is DEAD afraid of Orochimaru, but they&#39;re not afraid of Itachi, though they&#39;ll admit he&#39;s stronger.

Kabuto is afraid of Jiraiya but not as much of Orochimaru and Tsunade.

Tsunade isn&#39;t scared of Jiraiya or Orochimaru.

Itachi and Kisame are not afraid of Orochimaru but they were of Jiraiya.

As you can see...nothing ever really connects with the shit everyone &quot;said&quot;

[Xceleration]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Insomniac @ Dec 20 2003, 12:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> we know that he took a hit from rasengen and recovered and that he was beating Tsunade, one of the legendary three.
if you dont think Kabuto has it in him then what manga have you been reading http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/dry.gif

-insomaniac </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
About kabuto beating tsunade, he only beat her because she had a fear of blood at that time, and kabuto was taking advantage of that by cutting his own hand, and splashing blood on tsunade. Kabuto is obviously alot weaker then tsunade. Please take more factors into your judgements, Kabuto is no way at the level of the legendary 3, and he didnt recover from the rasengan, he even said his chakra wasn&#39;t sufficient for this level of damage. You obviously don&#39;t know how to read.

[MemnochTheCaT]

Kishimoto has hinted at a lot of possibilities for Kabuto, and he may well be something much more powerful and manipulative than anyone imagines at this point. Don&#39;t assume too much either way, but I believe that he will probably turn out to be more powerful than previously understood, and also has a good chance at turning into a good guy.

[Synaptik]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Well, who&#39;s to say, Itachi couldn&#39;t easily copy AND avoid everything Kabuto throws at him? </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Well, who&#39;s to say, that he could?


</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>As for how good Itachi is at taijutsu, there is no direct evidence, but in the flashback you should recall that Itachi is said to be EXTREMELY skilled with a shuriken, so much so that even Sasuke at a very young age noticed that Itachi&#39;s shuriken throwing was far superior to everyone else&#39;s, at least among the Uchiha.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Uh...Since when did skills at weapons handling equate skills at hand to hand combat?


</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Before we found out Orochimaru&#39;s true intentions, what did we think his goal was? &quot;I want Sasuke.&quot; Why? Who knew? It&#39;s just as strange as &quot;I killed my own clan for some reason.&quot; </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

He wants Sasuke, because he&#39;s obsessed with collecting jutsus. And whats good for that? Sharingan.


</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Again, look how much trouble they&#39;ve gone to just in trying to get Sasuke. Now look at how much more powerful Itachi is compared to Sasuke, and he doesn&#39;t even have an entire village backing him&#33; </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

I&#39;m pretty sure the manga mentions his thirst for revenge against the 3rd, as he believes that he shoulda been chosen instead of the 4th as the next hokage. He was also hellbent on destroying the Leaf itself, hence the giant snakes and the village sacking. Sasuke is not his only goal. If it had been, he coulda just sent his 4 nins anytime and took him.




I understand that everyone on this board is speculating, and that bias does come into effect because things can go either way, but please use some common sense and consider all angles and conceive plausible support before dumping all your hopes unto that one cool character.

[SDShamshel]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Well, who&#39;s to say, that he could?</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Neither side has direct evidence, but I feel that saying Itachi would have the advantage has the benefit of more evidence, seeing as Itachi didn&#39;t retreat just because Gai came around. Furthermore, if Kakashi is supposed to be evenly matched with Gai, and Kabuto is supposed to be on Kakashi&#39;s level, and Gai is CLEARLY the top taijutsu user of these three, then I doubt that Kabuto could do anything. It would probably take someone like Hyuuga Hiashi to REALLY give Itachi pause. Again, no concrete evidence, but my evidence is slightly harder than your&#39;s.

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Uh...Since when did skills at weapons handling equate skills at hand to hand combat?</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

There&#39;s basic things like hand-eye coordination, so again, this is merely the closest evidence we&#39;ve had.

Oh, actually, I forgot the other, better evidence for Itachi&#39;s hand-to-hand ability.

He CAUGHT the Chidori. He didn&#39;t dodge it, or anything, he just grabbed Sasuke&#39;s arm. While this doesn&#39;t say THAT much, as Kakashi could probably catch it as well, it semed like Itachi did it with no effort whatsoever.

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>He wants Sasuke, because he&#39;s obsessed with collecting jutsus. And whats good for that? Sharingan.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Hey wow, thanks for missing my point. BEFORE THE ATTACK ON LEAF we did not know Orochimaru&#39;s TRUE intentions. When all we saw from him, he wanted Sasuke for some mysterious reason. This is no different from Itachi, who has the mysteries of &quot;Why did Itachi kill his clan&quot; and &quot;Why does Akatsuki want Kyuubi?&quot; It is no different aside from the issue of time. RIGHT NOW, Orochimaru is the more fleshed-out villain because, well, he&#39;s had practically an entire arc to work from behind the scenes. Itachi has appeared once. We can&#39;t merely dismiss Itachi until we find out his true intentions.

So give it time.

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>I&#39;m pretty sure the manga mentions his thirst for revenge against the 3rd, as he believes that he shoulda been chosen instead of the 4th as the next hokage. He was also hellbent on destroying the Leaf itself, hence the giant snakes and the village sacking. Sasuke is not his only goal. If it had been, he coulda just sent his 4 nins anytime and took him.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

I can concede this point to some extent, but there is the issue of Orochimaru still not getting Itachi regardless. Orochimaru could have easily sent the Sound 4 after Itachi, and they could have created a barrier to block him all the same, a barrier that can stop even a Hokage.

Actually, now that I think about it, it could be that Itachi simply doesn&#39;t have the qualities that Orochimaru can exploit mentally. I doubt Orochimaru could convince Itachi to look for power like he does Sasuke, so Itachi probably has the psychological advantage.

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>I understand that everyone on this board is speculating, and that bias does come into effect because things can go either way, but please use some common sense and consider all angles and conceive plausible support before dumping all your hopes unto that one cool character.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Heh, I hope this wasn&#39;t directed at me at all, but yeah this is good advice to EVERYONE on this board. The opposite is also true. Don&#39;t just dump all of your hate onto one character.

All this is about is establishing that Itachi is an INCREDIBLY strong character, and the chances of Itachi helping out Orochimaru as a vessel or whatever are slim to nil. Let&#39;s just say that MAYBE Kabuto could take on Itachi. Extremely unlikely, but let&#39;s just say yes for a moment. Not only would Kabuto have to deal with Itachi, he&#39;d probably have to deal with Kisame, and possibly even the rest of Akatsuki. The only more stupid thing he could do is to figure out how to release Kyuubi and then fight it with a bar of soap.

[forkshy]

here&#39;s a good one

Kabuto = secret leader of Akatsuki

[Genan]

STOP GUESSING plzzzz
And NOOOO DONT LET KABUTO BECOME STRONGER DANT THE THREE.
Why am i yelling aboute this points so badly.
It wil become to much dbz and i hate dbz. People plz dont get mad cuz I hate dbz
but this is my opinion.
It is like when you just see someone strong you get someone stronger
and so on. And after this the head caracter or goodguy has to become lvl 100000000000000. http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif

Edit :
Azumanga daioh rules and hotsuma youre avatar rules

[hiten mitsurugi]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Hotsuma @ Dec 20 2003, 08:41 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> When somebody admits that another is better, do we need a fight to prove it? Kakashi was scared to death of Oro in that sealing area, and scolded himself for trying to rise against Oro. Do we need a fight to prove that Kakashi would have gotten his ass kicked? The point here is, once somebody admits it, there&#39;s really no way to bend it. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
You brought up a very good point. Compare how scared Kakashi was with Oro, then with Itachi. Kakashi was extremely scared of Oro, but was williing to fight Itachi with relative ease (no shaking or trembling). I believe that Oro is stronger than Itachi. I can&#39;t wait for a fight between them, since Oro left Akatsuki, there will probably be one.

Kabuto really is a dark horse right now. He&#39;s like a double agent. He plays Oro&#39;s right hand man, but probably reports to some other agency (e.g. akatsuki). This way they can keep tabs on all their enemies.

Can&#39;t wait for everything to be revealed.

[Immortal Boner]

I remember writing a bit on this Itachi vs Kabuto thing before on another thread. Summarizing, it&#39;s going to be pretty hard to fight sombody who can copy/see through all your jutsus and immobolize you with any form of slight eye contact. He&#39;s also a very composed fighter who can think on the battlefield as well.

And I have no idea why people keep on saying Kakashi is afraid of Oro and not Itachi. It&#39;s self-evident that Kakashi only backed off due to Oro&#39;s fear jutsu. Hasn&#39;t the Kakashi-recalling-past theory been debunked enough times already?



Back to talking about 198, I&#39;m glad that the translation gives a totally different impression on Neji&#39;s situation. There&#39;s still a chance for him to live after recalling...well...being told to live. http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/laugh.gif

[SDShamshel]

The key point in realizing how much more powerful Itachi is than Orochimaru is that Orochimaru said that it was IMPOSSIBLE to get Itachi.

IMPOSSIBLE.

Look at how many resources he put into attacking Konoha in order to get Sasuke. It&#39;s like everything for the past 10 years or so has been about this. The entire sound village, the alliance with the Sand, loyal troops like Kabuto and the Sound 4, Orochimaru has all of this... and he still said it was IMPOSSIBLE to get Itachi. Not highly unlikely, not barely a chance in hell, but IMPOSSIBLE.

[Insomniac]

i dont know what you&#39;re reading but he never said that. ever.
he said if only &#39;Uchihas heir was here with us&#39; or something along those lines

he never said it was impossible, dont make up lines lol
if he did then that translation was wrong.
Itachi is only stronger then Orochimaru because of the jutsus Orochimaru uses.
Kabuto is more hand to hand then Orochimaru so it would a more even battle, we havent seen any hand to hand from Itachi at all, so far hes just been jutsu copying and thats it.
And when a situation came up where it was hand to hand he retreated.
If it honestly says &#39;impossible&#39; then post that page because whoever translated it did it wrong

[SDShamshel]

You&#39;re doing the exact same thing you claim Hotsuma (?) to be doing in regards to Neji x Hinata.

You are ignoring how much they have set up Itachi to be a threat. If Kabuto really could just &quot;get&quot; Itachi, he would have done so already.

The best Taijutsu user so far in the series is probably Gai, and even Gai, while Itachi said to Kisame not to underestimate him, would probably not be able to beat Itachi. As has been said, Itachi mastered the Sharingan when he was 7 (or 8?) and became leader of the ANBU at 13. This means a hell of a lot. You are only assuming that the reason Itachi is stronger than Orochimaru is because Orochimaru relies so much on jutsu. Well, who&#39;s to say, Itachi couldn&#39;t easily copy AND avoid everything Kabuto throws at him? And certainly, Kabuto is a lot worse than Gai at taijutsu.

As for how good Itachi is at taijutsu, there is no direct evidence, but in the flashback you should recall that Itachi is said to be EXTREMELY skilled with a shuriken, so much so that even Sasuke at a very young age noticed that Itachi&#39;s shuriken throwing was far superior to everyone else&#39;s, at least among the Uchiha.

It&#39;s kind of like claiming that the Byakugan doesn&#39;t work because sometimes Neji still turns his head side ways or moves his pupils, and for something that is near 360 degree that shouldn&#39;t happen. Yes, that might be something superficial added to not make it seem as weird, but it doesn&#39;t discount the Byakugan.

I can see what you&#39;re trying to get at, with Orochimaru having this crazy motive and all, and us knowing barely a thing about Itachi, but it&#39;s all a matter of time. Before we found out Orochimaru&#39;s true intentions, what did we think his goal was? &quot;I want Sasuke.&quot; Why? Who knew? It&#39;s just as strange as &quot;I killed my own clan for some reason.&quot;

As for the impossible thing, I might not be remembering it correctly, but I remember the line to be, &quot;If only Itachi was with us, I wouldn&#39;t have to go through all this trouble. But that is impossible...because he is even stronger than me.&quot; If I&#39;m mistaken, then I apologize, but really, if Orochimaru or Kabuto could have gotten Itachi then they would have. Again, look how much trouble they&#39;ve gone to just in trying to get Sasuke. Now look at how much more powerful Itachi is compared to Sasuke, and he doesn&#39;t even have an entire village backing him&#33;

The only possible point I see is if Orochimaru believed that Itachi wouldn&#39;t be able to handle a cursed seal, but I doubt Orochimaru could get one on Itachi before Itachi kicked his ass so hard he&#39;d have to wipe the stains off of his face with his sealed arms.

[jing]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (forkshy @ Dec 22 2003, 10:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> here&#39;s a good one

Kabuto = secret leader of Akatsuki </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
i like that one... he was a left over child of some war with the leaf right? maybe he wants revenge... or the enemy is really not done, and left a child to create chaos.

[Death BOO Z]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (snowball @ Dec 23 2003, 11:54 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/mf_dribble.gif I just had a cool idea, what if kabuto has a ancient bloodline and thats what the cursed seal is based on. That would explaine why hes so scared of it awakening. If he has a blood based version of the seal im shure its much more powerfull than the copy version that oro uses. (just a idea) http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
i don&#39;t think that there are any bloodlines that base themselves on killing the person with the blood... it doesn&#39;t sound right.
sure, there are gentic deases and stuff, but bloodlines in naruto usually mean good powers, not &#39;let&#39;s go and suicide&#39; stuff, though there might be one like that...

about the &#39;my old blood&#39; thing, he wasn&#39;t scared-scared, he was worried that if he starts fighting he&#39;ll enjoy it too much and show his true self, and the fact he isn&#39;t a normal genin...


one last thing that was bothering me for a few weeks, what if Gai can&#39;t open the eight gates? we all think he can becuase he taught Lee how to open five, but if you consider the dialouge between gai and Kakashi about the gates, it reasonable to beleive that Gai can&#39;t even reach the 5th gate, and that&#39;s why Kakashi consideres Lee a genius, cuz he surpassed his master in such a short time...


about Taijutsu- the top users of taijutsu seem to be Gai and Hiashi, gai cuz we&#39;ve seen he&#39;s speed several times, and Hiashi cuz the gentle fist thing... Kabuto is nowhere among them, he admitted that his Taijutsu skill aren&#39;t that great, and we&#39;ve seen him rellying on decreasing the enemy&#39;s power rather than overcoming them (cutting tsunda&#39;s muscle to stop her inhuman strentgh and doing that elctrical thing to Shinzune and Naruto). Itachi is a mystery, we know he&#39;s faster than Kakashi, but we don&#39;t know how he can go against Gai (it&#39;s possible that he retreated cuz he didn&#39;t want them to know he&#39;s slower than Gai).

about nin and genjutsu, not much to say here... the sharingan thing pretty much means he has to be 133t (elite) in those two fields, we&#39;ve seen him doing counter genjutsu and black fire thingy, so he can rival the hokage and other people with jutsus, at least that i can say.

BTW: Kakashi also cought a chidori attack from Sasuke and the rasengan, so it doesn&#39;t mean much when comparing it with others...

[Mut]

itachi can beat them all.

even the kimimoro guy or whatever his name is.

[snowball]

http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/mf_dribble.gif I just had a cool idea, what if kabuto has a ancient bloodline and thats what the cursed seal is based on. That would explaine why hes so scared of it awakening. If he has a blood based version of the seal im shure its much more powerfull than the copy version that oro uses. (just a idea) http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[Daniel of Lorien]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (forkshy @ Dec 22 2003, 10:33 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> here&#39;s a good one

Kabuto = secret leader of Akatsuki </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
yes...I think this is so http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/ph34r.gif

[tuggumkee]

Kabuto&#39;s bloodline ability hasn&#39;t been shown yet so he&#39;s a darkhorse. It is possible (very unlikely but not denyed by the manga) that Oro and Kabuto can beat Itachi. However it was said in the manga that Sasuke has more potential. This probably doesn&#39;t mean sharingan so i&#39;m guessing this is in terms of Chakra. Its very likely then to assume that they want sasuke because he&#39;s a easier target and once oro is controlling his body, then sasuke will be better than Itachi(wel once the sharingan is mastered)

And i&#39;m absolutely sure Gai can open the 8 gates. and kakashi was only willing to fight Itachi because he was saving his friends, he had more resistance to Itachi&#39;s sharingan hyponotic jutsu, and he knew Gai would show up. Against Oro it was just him and Oro, and he just used a high chakra jutsu to seal the cursed seal. Also nobody at the time in the village had a good matchup against Oro(who uses brute chakra strength)

Personally i think Itachi can beat Oro one on one, but if Oro put his resources together he might have a chance of getting Itachi. Btw he wouldn&#39;t have to fight hte whole organization, it said somewhere they travel in pairs or triplets.

[XwingRob]

Maybe not the leader, but a member at least.

[SirCharlesIII]

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Death BOO Z @ Dec 23 2003, 03:14 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> BTW: Kakashi also cought a chidori attack from Sasuke and the rasengan, so it doesn&#39;t mean much when comparing it with others... </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
didnt he just grab their wrists and deflect the blows into those strategicly placed big metal things? i doubt he can catch a chidori or rasegan, if sasuke has mastered chidori, and chidori cut lightning once....i doubt kakashi&#39;d hand could take it http://www.gotwoot.net/forum/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif

[snowball]

kakashi did just push the atacks away, and that makes a lot more sense than him trying to catch the atack even if he could survive it.

[Mut]

is 199 comin even though it&#39;s xmas weekend?

[Mut]

that&#39;s it, as i&#39;m reading over these ridiculous posts about who is stronger than who, it made me puke in your faces. i just can&#39;t understand why people even think about any other posibilities.

i&#39;ma give you guys the facts here. 100% truth.

itachi is stronger than everyone in that has been shown in the manga so far. there is no way arguing what i just said. itachi can beat them all. no doubt, even kimimaro.

just don&#39;t even try to say something else, cuz it won&#39;t work. itachi is the strongest, so far.

end of discussion.

[ilabb]

Itachi &gt; Orochimaru because OROCHIMARU HAS NO ARMS.

And all Itachi has to do is look at Orochimaru&#39;s eyes and he&#39;ll start spazzing out on the ground.