Heavy Object

[Munsu]

http://i.imgur.com/lHOTli9.jpg


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jj52mMjIdoI


Plot Summary: "Objects" are powerful, massive weapons that change the course of warfare and are manned by Elite Object pilots. An odd Elite girl named Milinda meets Quenser, a student who aims to become a Object mechanic, with the soldier-in-training Heivia on a snowy battlefield.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=16322


Episode 1 from Horriblesubs:
http://nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=739939

[David75]

I was not charmed or anything by that season opening.
It might be it gets better after that, of course there's that ep2 preview. But the subject, those big spheres and the characters were all pretty boring in that first ep.
Also, planes were rather awful in design, even if useless in the story.

[Kraco]

This felt very strange as a world setting. I have come to accept mecha somewhat over the years as tools of war in anime, but this is still much worse. Not to mention the fact that somehow those blobs supposedly changed the whole world, society and politics, practically ending wars, save battles of one Object agaisnt another. We know even nukes, which have the capability to end the human civilization more or less, didn't achieve that. Nuclear weapons simply weren't used ever in a war again. Yet these stupid looking things did it? Yeah, right. Leave it to the Japanese to come up with something like this. As hilarious as Gate was, it still beats this show in believability, har har.

I didn't particularly like the characters, either. As an introduction we have two dudes shoveling snow meaninglessly. If the people can build a giant ball of metal and polymers that moves at very high speeds, you'd think they still remembered how to build bloody tractors, huh? Then we learn one of them has high aspirations as a technician/engineer. Yet he's neglecting his dreams (and the duty he accepted) in favour of shoveling snow and fishing... Hello?

It didn't help the show began with unrealistic military maneuvers (not even counting the ball), but those you have to forgive since the Japanese know nothing of warfare anymore.

[MasterOfMoogles]

The most obvious ridiculous thing is that nukes don't work. But if you give the show that concession, the rest of it kind of makes sense. At least a little bit.

The objects are massive death balls that you can't even get close to. They make every piece of current conventional warfare obsolete. If someone rolls an Object into your country, the only thing you can do is surrender, or fight back with your own Object.

It's kind of like in Gundam, where if you don't have your own Gundam (or tech stolen from Gundams) then you don't even stand a chance.

Production values seem good, so I'm hoping there's a cool battle in the second episode. The author is the same as A Certain Magical Index, so you should keep that in mind when setting your expectations for the plot.

[MFauli]

Objects" are powerful, massive weapons that change the course of warfare and are manned by Elite Object pilots. -> shows picture of pilots being cute girls and young boys. Okay.

[Ryllharu]

Production values seem good, so I'm hoping there's a cool battle in the second episode.

Unless my monitor has Vaseline on it, I don't think we were watching the same series. Heavy Object's animation is remarkably shitty for a series in 2005, much less 2015. I can't even blame this on Funimation's awful stream quality.

J.C. Staff is well known for half-assing things, but this was like stepping back in time.

I'm not seeing a single positive reason to keep watching this. Conceptually it is okay, but there are plenty of other series that have done the, "warfare has forever changed because of _________ combat system," idea a whole lot better than this first episode.

This is basically Mai-Otome, without the charm, school setting, or Kajiura Yuki's music. I'll try to think of a better comparison, but that's a pretty accurate summary of the concept and delivery so far. It's also like a bad Gundam 00, and that's saying something.

Overpowering weapon (Heavy Object, Otome) with each country only owning a few at most, eccentric female domineering headmistress/commander, bright-eyed protagonist (male/female), stoic female co-lead, etc.

edit 2:
And no, I don't mean the CGI looks bad. I mean the animation looks low-quality for even 10 years ago. The CGI isn't that bad, but everything else is.

[Buffalobiian]

Nukes barely work but laser cannons do. Right.

And now everyone making this because Japan taught them to?

I don't even know.

[Munsu]

First episode was terrible. Last scene was a bit promising at least, but that's all there is to it so far. Whole episode was boring.

[KrayZ33]

I have to admit, I didn't watch this yet and only the preview so far but...

WHO COMES UP WITH SUCH A HORRIBLE MECHA DESIGN?

Really? That totally looks like something I drew when I was 8 years old or something, guns wherever they could possibly fit and each one of them is pooping missles out like they don't need to reload.

I can't believe that this isn't an endboss from Castle Crashers. Who...no, HOW does this even sell a single copy? It's just... Japan is so freaking weird man. Their definition of "interesting" or "cool" is completely out of this world.


effort:
http://i.imgur.com/gKucccH.jpg

pretty sure the author stole that design from me when he saw me drawing it all the way back in kindergarten.

[MasterOfMoogles]

Honestly, it is a lot more realistic than any other mecha anime design.

The Objects are basically just tanks blown up to ridiculous scale. What do you expect something with enough armor to withstand a nuke to look like?

Once it is that big, you might as well put as many guns on it as you can. What else are you going to do with the space?


each one of them is pooping missles out like they don't need to reload.
This doesn't happen.

[Munsu]

Honestly, it is a lot more realistic than any other mecha anime design.

The Objects are basically just tanks blown up to ridiculous scale. What do you expect something with enough armor to withstand a nuke to look like?

I'm not sure about realistic or not, but yeah... I'd say this is more of a tank than anything mecha. I wouldn't go overboard over a design.

You can always go with the generic mecha found in all other mecha shows:

http://i.imgur.com/2CtFwoU.png

Of everything there is to criticize, mecha design should be the least of it.

[MasterOfMoogles]

Humanoid gundam-style robots are ridiculously stupid and impractical.
A specialized tank or plane would almost certainly be better suited for any task.

I actually really appreciate that the Objects don't try to look "cool".

[Kraco]

A building sized machine is as stupid as anything imaginable for everything but mining coal. Such a thing can't avoid anything and it's visible far beyond the horizon. It's just a giant sitting duck. There hasn't been a single moment in the human history when an armour wouldn't have been shortly after penetrated by a new weapon. That's why tank warfare in general isn't favoured in the West these days, even if the Russians still love it (because it's such a mighty phallic symbol for a macho culture). A multimillion tank will be destroyed by a weapon costing only tens of thousands at max. We even saw in this same episode that the weapons the objects carry can easily destroy other objects. Those weapons are much smaller than the object itself. This means you can install such a weapon on a much smaller platform and destroy a hulking enemy object before its operator had any idea what hit it. That's how warfare goes anywhere else but in the minds of Japanese authors.

And yeah, human shaped mecha are also ridiculous realistically speaking, but much less so than these things.

[KrayZ33]

Honestly, it is a lot more realistic than any other mecha anime design.


eh... no, just no.


You can always go with the generic mecha found in all other mecha shows

yeah, because like absolutely *every* mecha show has bipedal mechas in it, right?
There are more than enough versions that don't function and look like Gundams.

[MasterOfMoogles]

A building sized machine is as stupid as anything imaginable for everything but mining coal. Such a thing can't avoid anything and it's visible far beyond the horizon. It's just a giant sitting duck. There hasn't been a single moment in the human history when an armour wouldn't have been shortly after penetrated by a new weapon. That's why tank warfare in general isn't favoured in the West these days, even if the Russians still love it (because it's such a mighty phallic symbol for a macho culture). A multimillion tank will be destroyed by a weapon costing only tens of thousands at max. We even saw in this same episode that the weapons the objects carry can easily destroy other objects. Those weapons are much smaller than the object itself. This means you can install such a weapon on a much smaller platform and destroy a hulking enemy object before its operator had any idea what hit it. That's how warfare goes anywhere else but in the minds of Japanese authors.

And yeah, human shaped mecha are also ridiculous realistically speaking, but much less so than these things.

The concept here is that it doesn't matter that you can see it or shoot it from miles away. They can detect you from miles away and kill you first, or they can just ignore you because of their armor.
Or they can just shoot down any projectiles with lasers.

Long-range planes and missiles are almost completely useless.

[shinta|hikari]

How powerful are nukes anyway? Would it be possible to defend against it with a thick enough metal barrier, assuming you have some form of fictional EMP shielding?

[KrayZ33]

No, shit just melts if you actually manage to hit it directly

[MasterOfMoogles]

In trying to search for estimates on what it would take to withstand a nuke, I came across this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object_279

I feel like Kamachi HAD to have read this before writing this story.

[Buffalobiian]

In trying to search for estimates on what it would take to withstand a nuke, I came across this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object_279

I feel like Kamachi HAD to have read this before writing this story.

That read was hilarious. I had to check the page-history section to make sure someone didn't create this page post-anime just to troll us.

[Kraco]

The concept here is that it doesn't matter that you can see it or shoot it from miles away. They can detect you from miles away and kill you first, or they can just ignore you because of their armor.
Or they can just shoot down any projectiles with lasers.

Long-range planes and missiles are almost completely useless.

I wish you had even read my post before replying to it.

There's no reason to assume that blob has some supernatural sensors as impervious to damage as it otherwise seems to be. Does it has superman superzoom cameras that see through the armor or something? No, I don't think so. It only sees stuff from its limited viewpoint and relies on the single operator to react to the information gathered. Also, it has no way of hiding itself, unlike a smarter opponent. I also said, which you ignored, that since an object can destroy another object, there obviously are weapons that can destroy objects, the weapons we see installed on the objects. They are much smaller than the object itself. Take one of those weapons, install it on a platform of an actually usable size, and you can move and hide it at your leisure. Distract the enemy object from beyond the horizon or with mines and such, and while it's distracted, destroy it with the previously hidden weapon. Very cheap and very efficient.

Unlike the beginning of the episode would have you believe, modern warfare isn't the same as 200 hundred years ago: The heavy weaponry doesn't assume you must be within a line of sight of the target. When you attack something with fighters and bombers, you don't fly right next to the target. The same goes for ships.

[MasterOfMoogles]

It's the future. They have even more satellites and other support than we have today. In this episode, we even see the commander telling an Object on the other side of the world to blow stuff up with her tablet. It isn't like they just send these things out by themselves, that would be stupid.

I did read your post. You're basically proposing you take an Object and remove all of the armor and extra guns. It's still big enough to be seen by satellite or drones, and can't easily defend itself from planes since you just have the main cannon. The opposing Object could just blow it up from miles away as soon as it is found.
You can't really "distract" an Object. Anything but another Object is basically worthless.

[Buffalobiian]

Kraco's point is that that's not true. Objects aren't the only effective means against another object - the guns on them are. So why don't we do without the Object thing, mount those guns elsewhere - and fire?

That's the biggest blooper in their whole setup IMO. The only way to say "Objects are the only means to fight against other Objects" is for them to have AT fields that negate each other in proximity or something.

edit: oh, the opening bit also said that nukes melt half the thing. So let's use two.

[MasterOfMoogles]

The guns are still pretty freaking big. In addition, they need to be powered by the same thing that powers the Objects to have enough power to destroy another Object.
Wouldn't you rather have your huge gun and nuclear reactor protected by armor, mobile, and have 100 other guns/lasers instead of being a sitting duck for a bombing run?

Basically I'm saying the idea that you can mount it on a car or truck or something is not feasible. It would probably need to be at least battleship sized, if not larger.

And sure, you can nuke the Earth and then everybody's dead. That would work. Nobody wants to just nuke, nuke, nuke, though. Especially if the thing is on your own territory.

[KrayZ33]

Dunno, this discussion is kinda unfair...

We are basically discussing the pros and cons about a thing that's impossible to build in the first place and enjoys "plot armor" more than anything else.
This thing wouldn't survive a nuclear bomb, the anime just says it does (especially with laser guns still active, yeah right), which means nuclear deterrence should still be active after all and invasions less likely.
In fact there is no reason as to why they don't actually nuke each other in the first place. Just because you can't (for no reason) kill the Object doesn't mean you can't nuke the shit out of everything else.

So that means, in the end, this anime says that nuclear bombs were useless from the start because no one is actually willing to fire them.
This thing has anti-air (lol!) in the size of a battletanks mounted on it which of all things, shoots lasers that somehow only exist on the Objects?
Don't know, the whole concept and world building is really lacking.
Guess you have to accept that before watching it.

[Kraco]

Those weapons ought to fit in a truck, the power source in another. That would be even safer, since if the weapon happened to be destroyed, you could still potentially save the power source (which could be much smaller than an object's power source since it wouldn't need to move thousands of tons of armour and power multiple weapons). I'm sure the enemy would find it hilarious to destroy all the trucks of the country they are attempting to subdue. Destroy with something since their own object would already be destroyed and any conventional vehicles of war could be fought against using conventional means. Satellites and command centers are nothing special. We have those today as well, and they are useful but only in a limited fashion as we have seen in multitude of wars so far. However, you could never hide on object on the move from them, that's for sure, so any enemy will know where your objects are.

Bill did mention the only thing that would make them non-ridiculous: Some kind of an AT field. They didn't have one, though.

[Ryllharu]

I don't recall seeing any of them shoot anything beyond visual range. That's the bigger problem here.

Battleships in WWII could fire from beyond visual range (well, the Japanese ones couldn't because they couldn't hit anything moving even if they could see it). Evangelion handled it nicely, even having to account for the particle beam getting warped by the curvature of the Earth and whatever else they said.

Objects use line of sight particle beams or giant artillery that still only hits things they can see. Maybe there are more models that have different weapon systems, some that might even be actually up to 1950s standards. You don't need armor if your enemy no longer knows where you are once you've fired on them because you moved right away.

[MasterOfMoogles]

I don't think you can fit a 50m gun into a truck.
Or a nuclear reactor...

Kray, the reason they don't nuke each other is the same reason countries don't nuke each other in the real world - it's a horrible idea for everyone involved.


Objects use line of sight particle beams or giant artillery that still only hits things they can see. Maybe there are more models that have different weapon systems, some that might even be actually up to 1950s standards. You don't need armor if your enemy no longer knows where you are once you've fired on them because you moved right away.

They have literally hundreds of guns. You seriously don't think they have long range ballistics?

You also can't really hide tanks or larger with the amount of battlefield surveillance that goes on.

[KrayZ33]

I don't think you can fit a 50m gun into a truck.

The whole object is 50m big/tall, not the gun. Seeing how it is a ball it's obviously 50m tall and wide.
And we saw in the ending that you don't need the huge sideguns to penetrate the objects armor.

Seems like some sort of rail/gauss cannons are enough, which makes sense because apparently, Objects are made of "Glorious Nippon Steel Folded Over 1000 Times" as seen in the first minute. Layer after layer instead of a huge shell, which means penetration is far more effective than explosion.


Kray, the reason they don't nuke each other is the same reason countries don't nuke each other in the real world - it's a horrible idea for everyone involved.


And maybe even the reason why open war between nuclear nation doesn't exist. That's what the stability–instability paradox is all about. Which is obviously not the case here.

edit: wth we even saw someone launching a nuke already. So it's not even like they have problems doing so.

[Ryllharu]

They have literally hundreds of guns. You seriously don't think they have long range ballistics?

You also can't really hide tanks or larger with the amount of battlefield surveillance that goes on.
I can only discuss what the series has shown us. All we've seen is line of sight. As a LN reader, you can talk about all the "hypotheticals" you want, but all we've seen is a massive weapon with mostly fixed turrets firing at line of sight targets. Also, laser and particle beam (which was most of the weapons shown) are only ever going to be line of sight.

I gave the concession that other models might have missiles or something, or use their artillery correctly in a Time on Target (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artillery#Time_on_Target)/MRSI attack, but we didn't see any of it, which is stupid because there's only one operator in the damn thing, some of this should be automated.

The first fight we see is over the ocean. The ocean is big. To the point that a human can't appreciate how big unless they've been on it. Things operate under the surface. The horizon is everywhere.

[MasterOfMoogles]

Going by the wiki for this, Baby Magnum is 75m with main guns expanded. So I guess it's guns are maybe 25m? Maybe they're 12.5m wide and maybe 20-25m long.
The one it is fighting is 140m with main guns expanded (though most of that is the legs). This one, it looks like the main cannon is mounted through the core of it, so it is pretty hard to tell how large they are.

And you still need the huge power source. And you need ammunition, depending on the type of gun, or crazy cooling systems.

The show will be a lot more fun if you just let it have its main conceit and don't nitpick the details. You should assume that the reason people aren't running around with Object destroying guns is because it is just not feasible or they tried it and it didn't work.

[Kraco]

And you still need the huge power source. And you need ammunition, depending on the type of gun, or crazy cooling systems.

No, you don't. The objects probably (we haven't seen it) need a huge power source because they are huge and heavy beyond imagination. The energy goes into moving their own bulk. Weapons don't need so much power unless they fire continuously or very rapidly. Otherwise weapons only use power for a microsecond. They can charge that power for a good while and then release it all at once. For the kind of approach I've been preaching here, it's like Ryll said: You fire once and then you want to move elsewhere, lest you get destroyed in retaliation (by a different opponent since the one you targeted ought to be dead). If you need more shots than one, just a couple of guns. It would be better anyway.

[shinta|hikari]

The problem with this discussion is that this is just the first episode. You can't call MoM out for LN reading if everyone else is speculating based on cuts on one episode, where Objects don't even really fight.

It's really weird how people punish this show for realism when Gundam doesn't get the same treatment. A single tiny flying mech melting down huge spaceships and stopping meteorites is somehow more believable. That just seems unfair.

Their excuse is basically the same. The story happens in the future where amazing technological innovations made all this possible.

What I find really poorly done in this episode was all the info-dumping. They crammed all the info about objects in the intro, the conversations, in every single line, in fact. That's just amateurish.

[Kraco]

It's really weird how people punish this show for realism when Gundam doesn't get the same treatment. A single tiny flying mech melting down huge spaceships and stopping meteorites is somehow more believable. That just seems unfair.


Been there, done that. But I stopped because it's no fun to keep complaining about mecha year after year. Honestly, though, after a single episode this random show has got over thirty posts. Quite an achievement considering how dead this forum is.

[shinta|hikari]

And people are missing the point of the first episode.

Blond expressionless semi-loli with boobs. Her entire existence seems to be screaming "Give me a hug," at least to me. Stop getting distracted by giant metal guns and focus on more important things.

[Ryllharu]

It's really weird how people punish this show for realism when Gundam doesn't get the same treatment. A single tiny flying mech melting down huge spaceships and stopping meteorites is somehow more believable. That just seems unfair.

It would be less of a problem if the series hadn't spent so much time on the technical aspects of the Objects and why they are superior. Info-dump all sorts of technical construction information, have the male lead be a maintenance tech, and somehow we're supposed to ignore all the incredible problems and clear oversights the author made because he knows shit about military hardware, tactics, or operational use?

We're expected to simply accept the conceit that these are superior when they clearly aren't? Gloss over all the actual technical aspects and assume all the mumbo-jumbo Star Trek bullshit is true?

You can't pretend to be a technical show and then simultaneously request that everything you get horrifically wrong is not important.

Gundam and similar established mecha franchises stand up because they are diligent about their technical info. They know there are legions of otaku that will rake them over the coals if they screw up. These are the people that complain that a model kit isn't accurately represented to scale.

Look at Gundam Build Fighters. The details are there. They know about them, and care. This show doesn't give a shit what it gets right or wrong while still trying to wow readers and viewers with technical information.


Stop getting distracted by giant metal guns and focus on more important things.
By dropping this series at the first episode and watching something, anything else? Absolutely.

[shinta|hikari]

By dropping this series at the first episode and watching something, anything else? Absolutely.

Thank you.

[Ryllharu]

If you're gonna be like that, I might watch it only so I can shit on it each week.

Just stop pretending this is good. It's clearly not, and most here or otherwise appear to agree.

[shinta|hikari]

Sigh, I knew you were gonna say that.

And to be precise, I actually don't like this series. I don't think Kamachi's writing is good in general. I only like the semi-loli. I only spoke up because I don't like this:

watch it only so I can shit on it each week.

[Ryllharu]

Then don't ignore or dismiss legitimate criticisms.

LN fans are notorious for it.

[shinta|hikari]

Huh? Where did that come from?

The criticisms were discussed. I don't get where you are getting this ignore and dismiss part. Unless you want to repeat stuff that's already been said before again.

All I'm saying is that I don't want any thread to devolve into "watch it only so I can shit on it each week" thing. There is nothing legitimate or meaningful about that. And it looked to be headed in that direction, as we've seen in the SAO and Mahouka threads.

[MasterOfMoogles]

I don't think anyone's ignoring the criticisms? I agree that Kamachi's writing is generally pretty bad. If you're going to watch the show, you'll have a lot more fun not complaining about all of these things.
I'm just trying to explain that it's not so completely ridiculously unbelievable as some people are making it out to be. That doesn't mean it's bulletproof though.

You just have to take "Objects are synonymous with war" on the same level as "Academy City is a place where people give drugs to students to make espers". If you deny the basic premise, of course the show doesn't make any sense.

You definitely shouldn't go into Heavy Object thinking "This is going to be a good hard science political war drama".

[shinta|hikari]

Totally agree.

I mean, the largest crisis in the first episode was when the elite semi-loli pilot almost died due to a seat belt malfunction and an unnaturally pure boy.

[Buffalobiian]

If you're going to watch the show, you'll have a lot more fun not complaining about all of these things.

I don't know.. I'm actually having quite a bit of fun complaining about all of these things.

[shinta|hikari]

Just don't go overboard.

[neflight86]

Funny enough, I had none of these misgivings until I came here, but now it all sticks out like a sore thumb. I don't like feeling foolish for suspending my disbelief for this one episode but a strong case is made by the generally negative reactions here. Hope this can only get better?

[MasterOfMoogles]

You shouldn't let people requiring hard science from something like Gundam, Star Trek, or Heavy Object detract from your enjoyment of a show.

I expect it to get more exciting once we actually get into a battle.

[Kraco]

I doubt anybody's going to complain about the same things after every episode, at least to this extent. I know I won't. Although that being said, even ignoring the implausibility, like I also said in my earlier post, the character introduction seemed a bit weak as well. Unfortunately that means my two major requirements in a series, good story and/or good characters, had both an unpromising start here. I'm willing to give the show a second chance, however.

[MasterOfMoogles]

I'll agree that Quenser and Heivia weren't really likable this episode.
They're basically just goofball teenagers who don't really seem to understand what they're involved in. I think that's fine though. Not all characters need to be mature or flawless.

I do like like that the pilot isn't completely the quiet type.

[shinta|hikari]

Froyletia is really weird. Why the hell would you eat the leg meat if perfectly normal kabobs are cooking? And why the hell would the whole leg cook faster than sliced meat?

[KrayZ33]

because they put it on it first.

[Edort4]

This show makes no sense. Nuclear deterrence isnt there cause you cant kill one enemy unit but because even if one side is vastly superior they can be retaliated upon.

So... yeah you have an "object", cool. I just wiped 99% of your population. Go ahead and kill my military. And that even assuming that the object idea is pretty stupid. Thick armor, shock absorbers, etc can wistand a nuclear explosion. Dont think the same about all the turrets, cannons and exterior equipment. Also that 1st object... never heard about torpedos? Writer never thought why destroyers (with unbelieveable thick armor) are no more?

There is so much stupidity (characters are boring as hell and as usual pilots are 15 y/o grils) invested in this show that I can even argue about. Just gonna erase it from my memory and keep going on as if never happened.

[shinta|hikari]

because they put it on it first.

Do you even know how long a whole leg needs to cook compared to-

Oh, you were probably kidding like I was.

[David75]

These objects are heavy. Is it to say they are weak against fragile ground, like in Lelouch attacks?
What about oceans?
Do they roll at the bottom? Float? They can do both?

I guess the all-purpose vs specialized HO could be an indirect answer...

[Munsu]

I think we've figured out the way to increase discussion in this forum... have one terrible series premiere.

[Ryllharu]

I think we've figured out the way to increase discussion in this forum... have one terrible series premiere.
This is how I can tell you haven't been around for a number of seasons in a row.

A sufficiently popular but analytically terrible series can even attract the likes of Y.

[Munsu]

This is how I can tell you haven't been around for a number of seasons in a row.

A sufficiently popular but analytically terrible series can even attract the likes of Y.

Or... it's my mere presence increasing the quality of discussion exponentially. You're welcome!

[shinta|hikari]

Or... it's my mere presence increasing the quantity of discussion exponentially. You're welcome!

Fixed that for ya.

[MasterOfMoogles]

This show makes no sense. Nuclear deterrence isnt there cause you cant kill one enemy unit but because even if one side is vastly superior they can be retaliated upon.

So... yeah you have an "object", cool. I just wiped 99% of your population. Go ahead and kill my military. And that even assuming that the object idea is pretty stupid. Thick armor, shock absorbers, etc can wistand a nuclear explosion. Dont think the same about all the turrets, cannons and exterior equipment. Also that 1st object... never heard about torpedos? Writer never thought why destroyers (with unbelieveable thick armor) are no more?

There is so much stupidity (characters are boring as hell and as usual pilots are 15 y/o grils) invested in this show that I can even argue about. Just gonna erase it from my memory and keep going on as if never happened.

Ever watch a Gundam show?
Metals with magical properties and teenager pilots exist there, too. Having some new way to do stuff in the future that is super effective tends to be a sci-fi/futuristic media trope. Teenager pilots, well, that's mainly a Japan thing.

On the topic of nukes, I don't think anyone ever wants to pull the trigger on mutually assured destruction.

[shinta|hikari]

The odd thing is, how did a nuke even manage to hit an object? Shouldn't it have blasted away the missile with a laser miles away?

Teenage pilots make sense if you grow them to be pilots. That, or all the older ones are dead (muvluvluv)

[MasterOfMoogles]

Who knows. Could be the prototype hardware, the pilot, or the support crew. It would have made a lot more sense if it had blown it up from pretty far away and still been semi-damaged from the blast. Then it would have been more believable that the guns on the side it was hit on could fire.

If I had designed the scene, I would have had it shoot down the nuke from far away, detonating it but still taking massive damage. Then the Object would just rotate 180 degrees and fire with guns on its back.

[Kraco]

If I had designed the scene, I would have had it shoot down the nuke from far away, detonating it but still taking massive damage. Then the Object would just rotate 180 degrees and fire with guns on its back.

I'm not nuclear weapons expert, but I'm under an impression nuclear warheads (or bombs) have a pretty precise mechanism of detonation. Blowing it up externally wouldn't thus start the nuclear chain reaction, it would just cause an ordinary explosion and spread some radioactive waste (a dirty bomb). This is partly the reason why it was so hard to build a nuke to begin with and why a portion of scientists claimed it's not even possible.

It would have been better if the object had been under a massive barrage of ordinary weapons fire, thus rendering it unable to detect the nuke in time.

You can see quite a few kilometers away on the sea. Following your idea the object would have logically destroyed the nuke so far away it would have suffered no consequences whatsoever.

I didn't realise how young the the MCs were before checking AniDB. I was assuming they were adults and basically at least had graduated from high school already, possibly had some extra education under their belts as well. I mean, I don't see why they would send an uneducated kid to serve as an object engineer. It can't be that easy (and actually it isn't, as we saw when he accidentally tortured the pilot with the seat belts). The only conclusion is what Shinta mentioned: Contrary to total wars having been ended with the objects, it's actually a much shittier world than ours (at large), where even underage civilians are forced to serve in the military because there aren't sufficient amounts of adults left anymore.

[Munsu]

I'm not nuclear weapons expert, but I'm under an impression nuclear warheads (or bombs) have a pretty precise mechanism of detonation. Blowing it up externally wouldn't thus start the nuclear chain reaction, it would just cause an ordinary explosion and spread some radioactive waste (a dirty bomb). This is partly the reason why it was so hard to build a nuke to begin with and why a portion of scientists claimed it's not even possible.

It would have been better if the object had been under a massive barrage of ordinary weapons fire, thus rendering it unable to detect the nuke in time.

You can see quite a few kilometers away on the sea. Following your idea the object would have logically destroyed the nuke so far away it would have suffered no consequences whatsoever.

I didn't realise how young the the MCs were before checking AniDB. I was assuming they were adults and basically at least had graduated from high school already, possibly had some extra education under their belts as well. I mean, I don't see why they would send an uneducated kid to serve as an object engineer. It can't be that easy (and actually it isn't, as we saw when he accidentally tortured the pilot with the seat belts). The only conclusion is what Shinta mentioned: Contrary to total wars having been ended with the objects, it's actually a much shittier world than ours (at large), where even underage civilians are forced to serve in the military because there aren't sufficient amounts of adults left anymore.

Where in ANIDB are their age mentioned?

Anyways, the presumption that war isn't full of kids is erroneous as well... though I get were people are getting it with all the 13-15 year olds in animes, etc.

But whatever, it is what it is.

[Edort4]

Yeah watched Gundam and those are pretty bad, not my 1st time saying that humanoid shape plane/ships/robots are nonsensical and a waste of resources, but at least in those shows they pretend that technology has advanced overall with major breakthroughs and futuristic set.

Im not pissed at the show cause the nuke did almost nothing to that thing. If armor is thick and has absorbers and lead etc it wouldnt be an impossible feat. Afterall there was a serious project to impulse space ships using nuclear explosions and even to put massive objects into orbit that way (to surpass the limitation of fuel rockets where only a really small % of the weight is cargo/payload).

But you have to be very naive to think that a country with nuclear weapons will let themselves be conquered cause the enemy has one "invincible" tank. Lets not even start talking about how you can attack dozens of targets at the same time (Invincible tank can only stay in one place) even if you have 2nd tier weapons but on a larger scale.

You could throw conventional warfare and take out eveything except the tank itself. What a great victory. Everything except your tank has been wiped out. Tank will run out of fuel, supplies, ammo, etc. By the time that 2 big cities have been razed certain small isle will surrender no matter how invincible the tank is.

Is just way beyond stupid all this object warfare. Man I would like to see this in real life. I would start a kickstarter to buy a smal SpaceX (or similar) launch for 20M$ to send a 1 ton tungsten bar to orbit and blow that object thing with physics alone.

[lelouch]

I find this entire debate of "this is impossible to build" and "these things don't work that way" preposterous. I wouldn't stop just at "Gundam doesn't get the same treatment", I would say no other anime gets this treatment.

Where are the critics of Gate? Fairies and demi-gods don't exist and are impossible.
Where are the critics of Death Note? It's impossible to kill someone by writing a name in a notebook.
Where are the critics of Arslan? Silver Mask's teleporting friend is impossible, because teleporting is impossible.

Just because the setting in this anime is more realistic and similar to our world, doesn't mean everything functions the same way. The setting is fictional and set into the future, with completely fictional technology. You have no way of speculating whether or not anything in that object is required to power those weapons -- they are 100% fictional and not based on reality. You don't know anything about them -- stop trying to.



But you have to be very naive to think that a country with nuclear weapons will let themselves be conquered cause the enemy has one "invincible" tank. Lets not even start talking about how you can attack dozens of targets at the same time (Invincible tank can only stay in one place) even if you have 2nd tier weapons but on a larger scale.

You could throw conventional warfare and take out eveything except the tank itself. What a great victory. Everything except your tank has been wiped out. Tank will run out of fuel, supplies, ammo, etc. By the time that 2 big cities have been razed certain small isle will surrender no matter how invincible the tank is.

This is the only good point I've seen. My guess is that countries have more than one object, and probably leave at least one per major city for defense.

[shinta|hikari]

Or maybe they don't want mutual destruction. Sure they can nuke each other. But they don't want to. It's better to send soldiers, in this case objects, as representatives to limit civilian casualties and environmental destruction/irradiation.

[KrayZ33]

I find this entire debate of "this is impossible to build" and "these things don't work that way" preposterous. I wouldn't stop just at "Gundam doesn't get the same treatment", I would say no other anime gets this treatment.

Where are the critics of Gate? Fairies and demi-gods don't exist and are impossible.
Where are the critics of Death Note? It's impossible to kill someone by writing a name in a notebook.
Where are the critics of Arslan? Silver Mask's teleporting friend is impossible, because teleporting is impossible.

Just because the setting in this anime is more realistic and similar to our world, doesn't mean everything functions the same way. The setting is fictional and set into the future, with completely fictional technology. You have no way of speculating whether or not anything in that object is required to power those weapons -- they are 100% fictional and not based on reality. You don't know anything about them -- stop trying to.

best world building ever.

"everything is possible son, this isn't the real world, Oh he survived 5 bullets to the head? Man, these arn't guns we use here in our world, they are alot weaker and can't breach the human skull, only a flesh wound mate"

That thing literally went through the heat of the sun and came back alive and mostly functional
And I have no doubt we'll end up seeing alot of controversial stuff that won't even work in the world the author wanted to "create", like... machine gun fire from one of the 2 MCs destroying the sensors, rendering the object useless in a fight.

Basically a feat that the combined army of 14 nations couldn't handle with equipment worth a trillion

[Kraco]

Where in ANIDB are their age mentioned?

Anyways, the presumption that war isn't full of kids is erroneous as well... though I get were people are getting it with all the 13-15 year olds in animes, etc.

It's the number under the name, or if you click the name, you get a proper table. I'd assume they are from the novels.

Yeah, I realise the ages are a detail of no consequence whatsoever. The MCs need to be young because the intended main audience of shounen shows doesn't want to watch old beards. So, the main characters inexplicably need to be kids who shouldn't ever have any business being there. That's just how it is. I could hardly keep watching anime if I couldn't live with that. At least it's still better here than in something like Nanoha, haha.

[Munsu]

It's the number under the name, or if you click the name, you get a proper table. I'd assume they are from the novels.

Yeah, I realise the ages are a detail of no consequence whatsoever. The MCs need to be young because the intended main audience of shounen shows doesn't want to watch old beards. So, the main characters inexplicably need to be kids who shouldn't ever have any business being there. That's just how it is. I could hardly keep watching anime if I couldn't live with that. At least it's still better here than in something like Nanoha, haha.

Oh, I never bothered hitting the "Cast" tab there, nice feature... will use it more often from now on. Hope they're accurate and not making shit up.

[Buffalobiian]

Just because the setting in this anime is more realistic and similar to our world, doesn't mean everything functions the same way. The setting is fictional and set into the future, with completely fictional technology. You have no way of speculating whether or not anything in that object is required to power those weapons -- they are 100% fictional and not based on reality. You don't know anything about them -- stop trying to.

They spend 5 minutes telling us why conventional weaponry (and nukes) don't work. When you give an argument, we pick it apart to see what it's worth. When you just say "Knightmares dominated the battlefield" without further explanation, we're stuck with "suck it up or leave". That's the thing behind explaining things - you can stuff it up.

As for power source, we weren't told that it was anything special. They all focused on the armour. There is no reason to believe that it's special like the armour. It's probably a nuclear reactor (assuming they even try to explain it at all).

[shinta|hikari]

As for power source, we weren't told that it was anything special. They all focused on the armour. There is no reason to believe that it's special like the armour.

To be fair, there is also no reason to believe it isn't special, like everything else about an object, from pilot to plating.

[Buffalobiian]

Did they explain the pilot's age? It fell into the "as is" category. They didn't say the power source was special. When you're selling the object that hard, one assumes the power source isn't anything worth mentioning.

[Ryllharu]

All we know about the power source is that the meticulously explained armor transmits power without wires (so presumably there are no weaknesses about severing power cables and there wouldn't be any running through Jefferies tubes to reconnect a power distribution matrix to restore power to the deflector shield in order to deliver a properly-modulated tachyon pulse).

If the armor plating beneath it isn't destroyed, the thing can still fire lasers and particle beams that themselves are not destroyed.

Like Buff said, they didn't explain the power source, so we just accept that it works. It could be nuclear reactors, it could be sakuradite, it could be GN particles, it could be diesel piston engines or palladium reactors. We don't know, and therefore we can't argue about it. If they claimed it was nuclear reactors or conventional engines, I'd absolutely bitch about it.

They didn't explain how they float either, so we don't care about that either.

Suspension of disbelief is hampered by too much detail in the explanation.

edit:
Using the author's other series, espers gain their abilities from the unique interaction with AIM Diffusion Fields (An Involuntary Movement that produces an energy field). That's really all we ever get. Okay...moving on. See how much more effective that is?

[shinta|hikari]

Are you agreeing with Buff or me? Because I agree with him mostly and just pointed out that the power source receives the same mystery effect as you said. Buff mentioned that they aren't special and are probably nuclear reactors, but they could be powered by a silver-haired loli for all we know.

[Kraco]

but they could be powered by a silver-haired loli for all we know.

Broken Blade taught us that an average dude's spiritual energy is just enough to power up a mecha of a conservative size. Madoka taught us lolis produce so much energy it's worth it for space aliens to come here from who knows where and create a complicated scheme to harvest it. From this we can deduce that if you want to move an object much bigger and heavier than a mecha, you probably need a loli.

Quite a plausible theory, all in all.

AniDB lists the operator as 14 years old. I guess she goes for a loli still, with her body type.

Haha: AniDB Rating 2.75 (40) (weighted)

[Kraco]

Episode 2 - HS



- ---- -- ----




Hmm... This episode had one good scene, the correct estimation one. Otherwise it was quite miserable in most possible ways: From the annoying narration in the beginning that assumed all viewers are as stupid as the author to the obvious lack of even basic military skills everybody boasted. I guess the object worship is so deep that people joining the army don't get even a basic training anymore.

I wish everybody had died already.

[KrayZ33]

"Top speed 550kmh"

have fun escaping that mountain surving robot on foot, hahahahaha.... oh wow.

[Kraco]

It's pretty safe to say the power source isn't any ordinary nuclear reactor known to us. Must be an antimatter engine or something else producing helluva lots of power.

I'm looking forward to seeing how they plan to hijack it. That's what they were planning, right? Disabling it purely from the outside is impossible, so it seems unlikely they were referring to anything so simple. I wouldn't dare to expect a plot more complicated than the collapsed cave trick from this show, but who knows.

[David75]

I guess the hints might come from the auto-destruct function.
But they also want to steal that object.
And the only way would be to have the pilot out. Which is a little complicated when he just has to wait in his very safe and confortable large spherical cocoon.

Now how do you fool the system so that the pilot believes the auto-destruct activated, so that he ejects and you can then start hacking the system and get rid of all security protocols to pilot it yourself... Is to be shown in a very detailed and perfectly logical way, in a ten seconds scene.

[Kraco]

Rather than that, it would seem to me relying on human error (in judgement) would be much easier. Get the operator to exit the object normally, surprise her (assuming they are all teenage girls) and take over. In the end the only things those objects can do are to destroy on a rather large scale, shield something for a while, and move fast. If they can create a situation where the operator feels safe to exit and needs to do something outside of the object, it could be possible especially if the objected are only operated by young girls, not grumpy battle scarred veteran men. Furthermore if all the object operators are arrogant like Princess confessed to be, it'd be all the easier.

But now that you mentioned it, getting it to self-destruct would be the second best option. Hard to say how that would happen, though, if it requires considerable damage. I don't think simply getting stuck in some ravine would trigger it. Those things much cost as much as a whole fleet of ordinary naval ships, so it would be illogical to have them automatically self-destruct too easily.

[shinta|hikari]

If the pilot were a loli, you can just make her swoon by saying cliche lines of concern.

Of all the things that bothered me this season, this trend of randomly making girls blush without any sort of build up or development is the most annoying.

[KrayZ33]

The amount of boob accidents is higher this season too, a scary trend.

No really, it's extremely annoying, it's not cute, entertaining, not even sexy I can't even consider it "fanservice" because it doesn't appeal to me in the slightest... It feels so blunt already that I can't imagine anyone getting dirty dreams about... not even a smile, because it happens so casually all the time.

[Kraco]

Episode 3 - HS





- -- - -- --




I really shouldn't have expected an actually inspiring plot to disable the object. Instead we got the awesomely convenient plot device of the enemy camp having basically no sensible guarding at all and the enemy object having a super trigger happy self-destruction. The self-destruction initiation of Baby Magnum might have made some sense due to the combat situation and because it was damaged by the enemy, but even it wasn't destroyed by it but by enemy fire. Here there was nothing like that happening, so the operator should have had all the time in the world to stop it.

But considering the enemy was composed solely of idiots, it seems, all the way to the unncessarily sadistic and stupid commander and the equally moronic rank and file soldiers grinning at the commander's sadistic delusions, I guess it makes sense their object would be a piece of shit machine as well.

The best detail was still the MC dudes blathering nonstop during their infiltration. Their talk only stopped when they needed to actually shout. As incompetent as the enemy was, even they couldn't ignore infinitely all that noise.

[MasterOfMoogles]

Talking is a free action. Haven't you learned anything over the years?

I'm not really sure what you were expecting.

The state of the enemy makes sense given the setting - where all combat is done via Object and nobody has ever worried about attack via conventional means for years.
You could also explain away the self-destruct with a little bit of imagination, considering the MC tinkered with the sensors. If the Object thought its whole leg was blown off and it was going to structurally collapse, firing the self-destruct makes sense. I don't know if I expect the "Faith Organization" to be the best programmers/engineers/fighters.

All that said, the storyboarding for this whole arc was pretty poor. I feel like some minor changes could have made it a bit better.

[Kraco]

Actually the basic idea of sabotaging the enemy object by tampering with a component for regular maintenance wasn't a bad idea at all, but the rest made far less sense and could have been handled much better. These are national armed forces, not some high schools and student councils (like in anime usually). They don't just suddenly forget that enemies might appear in flesh and blood to destroy support facilities. I mean, they themselves annihilated the MCs' facility just prior to this. The soldiers are all carrying guns, which means they are ready for situations where guns could be needed. Still, idiocy happen on a national level even in the real history, like in Soviet Union in the beginning of the WWII when the always paranoid Stalin had purged all competent officers fearing they were all plotting against him, but I'm merely saying they could have possibly written a much better plot here to explain the sabotage.

Also, the self-destruction like it happened might have been a stretch in any case. It could have worked better if a single leg had been totally wrecked, and they would have started to repair the thing, having the pilot exit. At that point the reinforcements could have attacked and the Faith Organization might have been forced to destroy their own object. Or something else than to have a multi-billion machine self-destruct when a single leg was damaged in their own fricking base and with no combat in sight. Do they also self-destruct when somebody scratches the paint?

[KrayZ33]

Just wow @ the distance they had to travel to reach the enemy base and for the reinforcements that were actually going *away* from it the whole time to show up ~3 minutes later.
Holy shit...?

I can only hope that some kind of timeskip was in place here, they took them hostage, got them into cells to be executed and that's what was about to happen a few hours later. Otherwise I don't even know where to start.

The explosiions sounds are really low quality btw.. It's really no fun to listen to them when they get distored that much. Ya, I get it, the explosions are huge... the sounds are devastating, too bad that the good guys are totally unaffected from an explosion like that though. Not even a concussion/acoustic trauma or anything.

Hey, that was some kind of nuclear reactor blowing up, right?

[MasterOfMoogles]

I think it is just a nonsense energy reactor. They threw out some ridiculous acronym name thing this episode. Probably better than nuclear but no radiation.

[Kraco]

Episode 4 - HS




- -- - - - -



It seems to me the home country of those lads has no need for living heroes. According to the general philosophy of the HO world, only Objects (and their maintenance) matters, so it's totally useless to send a couple of dudes in. What happened before was a one time affair, a stroke of luck, no matter how you look at it. No military command would immediately count on it to be repeatable. Of course that actually enhances it's effectiveness, since nobody would be expecting it, but it's still nonsense to send in two men, unless one of them is called James Bond.

I don't honestly know if I should be amused or annoyed by the fact the dudes kept whining about their mission from the beginning till the end of the episode, nonstop. Normally that would be annoying, but you have to admit that given such a mission, anybody would whine.

[lelouch]

I would never pilot an object called Baby fucking Magnum. No wonder that little shit keeps losing.

[KrayZ33]

I don't honestly know if I should be amused or annoyed by the fact the dudes kept whining about their mission from the beginning till the end of the episode, nonstop. Normally that would be annoying, but you have to admit that given such a mission, anybody would whine.

It's what somewhat saved the episode for me. Because there was no freaking way to take their task seriously and since they realised how absurd everything was it turned into slapstick comedy. Like FMP Fumouffu...only half as funny.

[MasterOfMoogles]

That massage at the beginning, lol...

Overall, this was a pretty fun episode. A lot better than the first set.

[Kraco]

Episode 5 - HS



- - - - - -- - -



Two battles, two Baby Magnums, and they both were useless against the opponents. It seems to me the home country of the MCs shouldn't go out of their way to seek troubles like they are doing now. Unless the big idea is indeed to get rid of those two lucky heroes, who probably are an eyesore to many. It could be hard to justify large sums in the defense budget if expensive objects can be defeated by a couple of dudes with practically no equipment to speak of. The military industrial complex at least would like the chaps to just disappear. No doubt established senior officers in the armed forces, comfortable in their positions, are no more fans of this sort of stunts. I reckon the general public should love them, though. I'm not sure getting a little fanservice from their superior makes it worth it.

If Qwenthur really fell for the princess, then there's naturally no helping it for him. It alone would make it all worth the risks and trouble.

[Kraco]

Episode 7 - HS




- - - - - -




This show really goes a long way to force those two dudes be the unlikely heroes instead of the whole fricking military might of their country or even temporarily allied countries.

I feel sorry for the Princess. She would be very happy and ready to dance to the tune of Qwenthur's flute, but he's all the time altenately giving her hope just to splash cold water on her the next time.

Dropping the cell phone felt very unnatural in this episode. I hope it won't be used in a stupid plot later.

[MasterOfMoogles]

I hope Ohoho-chan gets more screentime. She is actually credited as that, lol.

[shinta|hikari]

Ohoho really.

EDIT:
Qwenthur knows his stuff(etish).

[Kraco]

Episode 11 - HS




- - - - -


This has actually been surprisingly entertaining after I got used to the silly things, the foremost being the role of the MC dudes. In a twisted way even that was rationalised by the revelation that for global politics the fact they disposed of Objects without an Object of their own is extremely harmful. So, those in power are basically trying to get rid of the national heroes. What doesn't compute, however, is that their hot superior they look up to apparently fully goes along with that mentality, sending them in whenever there's a deathtrap available. How can they have such a jolly relationship with her when every mission begins with Frolaytia trying to get them killed on purpose?

But whatever, I just keep hoping that Qwenthur and the Princess actually get somewhere.

[shinta|hikari]

But whatever, I just keep hoping that Qwenthur and the Princess actually get somewhere.

Ohoho, you do remember this story was written by the same guy who wrote A Certain novel, right?

[Kraco]

Ohoho, you do remember this story was written by the same guy who wrote A Certain novel, right?

History doesn't need to repeat itself endlessly.

[shinta|hikari]

Ohoho, but it does.

[Kraco]

Episode 12 - HS


- - - - -



Ohoho, but it does.

I'm starting to think you are right.

[shinta|hikari]

Ohoho, nipple pinch ftw.

[Kraco]

Ohoho, nipple pinch ftw.

Despite knowing the author (now), it still baffles me why the story first established so obviously some sort of a connection between Qwenthur and the Princess (Havia already having a bride somewhere), yet ever after, with a few exceptions that didn't lead anywhere, Frolaytia seems to be the one getting the attention. But perhaps it's just my personal problem since I find it so hard to remember (or even believe) she's apparently no older than Qwenthur and Havia, give or take a year or two. I always keep thinking she's closer to 30 or something, considering her position. Nevertheless, in my opinion this nipple pinch scene was the first and only time she seemed to possess a flag at all. Her attitude has always been very clear before.

[NeoCybercoin]

Yeah he was all over dat.

[KrayZ33]

Frolaytia seems to be the one getting the attention.

Woot, it's not Havia + Frolaytia, and blonde+blonde?
Shitty harem. She even tried to ship the Princess + Quenser pairing herself early on, while playing / fooling around with Havia.

[shinta|hikari]

Ohoho, everyone seems to be forgetting about Ohoho.

@Kraco - Like how Index was supposed to be the heroine in her titular series?

Kray is right. This is shitty harem. I love it.

[KrayZ33]

First girl shown in Index was Biribiri.
First girl always wins.

It's shitty harem because it didn't have to be harem... and it didn't make much sense judging from ep1-7 (which is where I stopped watching).

Not to mention this show was basically about a bro-tag team and only 1 of them gets the grills. Outrageous -1/10, would shoot Quenser in the back.

[shinta|hikari]

First girl shown in Index was Biribiri.
First girl always wins.

Only she doesn't.

Well, in reality even Qwenthur doesn't get any girls because he is a donkan protag. Shitty harem ftw!

If Qwenthur took advantage of all the advances and started screwing the princess, Froyletia, Ohoho, and everyone opening their legs to him, Havia would've killed him episodes ago.

[KrayZ33]

Ya, but since this show has 2 dudes being somewhat on equal footing (at least early on) it would've been cool and refreshing if they'd just squad up to get the girls... and it looked like they'd do exactly that at the beginning.

[Kraco]

@Kraco - Like how Index was supposed to be the heroine in her titular series?


Why? Index is just fine being a (spoiled rotten) little sister figure. She's in no possible imaginable way mentally capable of being a girlfriend. Unlily Biribiri, for example. In this show the Princess seems mature enough. She's called an elite and is a fine Object operator, that is, a professional military employee the same as the two dudes. I never even got a feeling from the Index series that Index was supposed to be a part of a couple with Touma. All she ever cares for is eating and abusing Touma. But like Krayz said, this show did try to ship Qwenthur and the Princess for real.


If Qwenthur took advantage of all the advances and started screwing the princess, Froyletia, Ohoho, and everyone opening their legs to him, Havia would've killed him episodes ago.

Yeah, if he did bone everybody. But on the other hand Havia is basically all set with a cute girl, once he gets a break long enough from the suicide missions to go and get married, so he'd have little reason to be jealous if Qwenthur got along with somebody.

[shinta|hikari]

I never even got a feeling from the Index series that Index was supposed to be a part of a couple with Touma. All she ever cares for is eating and abusing Touma.

Except for the first part (volume, few episodes, pick your poison) of Index where Touma goes all out to save that dumb nun. Then he loses his memory and gathers a harem. It's basically the author's style.




Yeah, if he did bone everybody. But on the other hand Havia is basically all set with a cute girl, once he gets a break long enough from the suicide missions to go and get married, so he'd have little reason to be jealous if Qwenthur got along with somebody.

Except Havia openly expresses his jealousy of Qwenthur, who doesn't actively go after any girl, all the time.

[KrayZ33]

Except for the first part (volume, few episodes, pick your poison) of Index where Touma goes all out to save that dumb nun. Then he loses his memory and gathers a harem. It's basically the author's style.

Which means... nothing, because he does that all the time. The very first scene showed him saving thugs from Biribiri which could've beaten him to death.


Except Havia openly expresses his jealousy of Qwenthur, who doesn't actively go after any girl, all the time.

Which means.... it's stupid? That's like being in a relationship with a beautiful girl, but still feeling jealous of the single dude who isn't able to, or doesn't want to, hit on something.

[Kraco]

Which means.... it's stupid? That's like being in a relationship with a beautiful girl, but still feeling jealous of the single dude who isn't able to, or doesn't want to, hit on something.

Nah, I think it's actually pretty realistic. He's happy to have an assured future with a beautiful girl, but being a man he's joking about a single dude like Qwenthur.

[shinta|hikari]

@Krayz - Same applies to Qwenthur and Princess. Qwenthur simply moved on to saving other girls, like Touma did.

[Kraco]

Episode 14 - HS



- - - - -



I don't honestly know which ones are the bigger idiots: The military for not trying to further motivate and use this miracle duo or Qwenthur and Havia themselves for willingly going along with this bullshit. They have probably been associated with more enemy object eliminations than anybody before them, yet they are still being treated like scum. While we did learn at least a part of the armed forces in fact wants to get rid of them, it doesn't explain their willingness to comply with that deadly sentiment. They would probably only need to give a couple of interviews to the media, and their superiors would find themselves sitting on very shaky chairs. As baffling is Frolaytia seemingly sharing the wish to get them killed, one way or another. She's their superior, so after all these victories she should be skyrocketing in her career path, considering the achievements of underlings are the achievements of the leader.

Following the logic of this show is difficult. Does Frolaytia perhaps think that the two national heroes dying would be a beneficial for her promotion? That seems quite unlikely. More plausible would be her opponents using it to hold her back. All of her lipids going to the breasts must have left her brain wanting.

[Kraco]

Episode 15 - HS


- - - --


Either the author is an idiot or I'm really just too old for this shit.

[shinta|hikari]

Answer is both.

[Kraco]

Episode 18 - HS




- - - - -


I don't think mining equipment would have perfect 360 degrees bullet proof armouring. I mean, it's mining equipment, not a tank for battlefields.

Otherwise the arc actually has an interesting plot twist this time.

I don't get why the MCs' home country has the shittiest Objects, though. Everybody else has some special ones, but these guys are running the basic model that's called obsolete in every fricking arc. They only keep winning because of Qwenthur and Havia's unbelievable stunts. Stunts that should be impossible and incredible victories for the country, yet for which the heroes are awarded with nothing but shitty treatment and insults. Actually I do now know why they only have the obsolete Object: It's a thoroughly shitty and fucked up country. They should defect to another country. It's not worth it and one day their luck must run out.

[shinta|hikari]

I think they have other objects. The story just focuses on this none because it has a loli in it.

[Kraco]

Yeah, we even saw another one: It got one hit killed in an earlier arc by a far away enemy with no line of sight. Not really much to write home about. So, apparently their other Objects might be even worse. At least those sent out on missions. It's possible they do have a decent Object as well, but I bet it's permanently assigned to guard the royal palace (not only from foreign but especially domestic threats because it's such a stupid country).

[Kraco]

Episode 19 - HS




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I don't know who would visit an abandoned diamond mine and not pick up any stray diamonds they might find. This is scifi, so I reckon artificial diamonds have got much better and cheaper than thus that small box full of diamonds wouldn't anymore buy a house and a car, but it still has to make a nice bonus for this hero who only gets shit and more shit from his superiors the more miracles he pulls off. Too bad Qwenthur isn't a lolicon; he would totally catch the Princess without any effort if he had the interest. That way he would at least get something out of this all.

[shinta|hikari]

Qwenthur is actually gay and pretends he isn't by acting lecherous from time to time. That's the only logical explanation for him acting so dense.

Just like Touma.

[Harima Kenji]

It's funny how I see this series in a totally different way :D
I'm more drawn to the tactics used to overcome the overwhelming odds (dumb as they may be, sometimes) and the dynamic that the 2 protagonists have together. The fanservice annoys me most of the times, tbh. Although sometimes it results in funny moments (the female drill instructor video scene cracked me up for some reason). I guess it depends on what you want to see from anime.

[shinta|hikari]

You don't watch anime for the girls? You watch it for TACTICS of all things?

You shouldn't waste your time with this medium! There are better things for you!

[shinta|hikari]

Ep 20:



Why is it that the best heroines are never the main ones? Black Uni is awesome cute. So is Myongli. Instead we get psycho object pilot and random commander.

[Kraco]

Just where did all those enemy objects come from? In the 19 previous episodes the MCs have been mainly relying on their single object, or not even that, and when they have got reinforcements, it has been a single other objects (I'm talking about domestic units). Now they got two extras and it was made to look like a big deal. Yet this language supremacist (what a joke) can muster half a dozen objects as if it's no big deal.

This author is some hard M guy. He just loves to make the MCs suffer pettily and pointlessly.

[shinta|hikari]

Wouldn't he be an S though? He doles out the punishment, not receives them.

[Kraco]

Wouldn't he be an S though? He doles out the punishment, not receives them.

I don't think so. The MCs have been suffering nonstop since the beginning yet they always remain so full of energy and don't try to do anything to better their situation, which means they are happy with it. They are unprecedented national heroes, yet they are happy shovelling snow instead of doing what they should be doing (Object maintenance and radar stuff). So, doesn't this suggest its the author's own preference? If he was an S, I reckon the MCs wouldn't be enjoying their treatment that much but would struggle against it. Only a hard M would write a disposition like in this show thinking it looks perfectly natural.

[shinta|hikari]

Can the MCs even choose what they do? I think Froy has been ordering them around since day one.

[Kraco]

Then they should be hating her guts and certainly not saving and defending her. She's misusing her power as a superior officer. Especially since Qwenthur apparently is not even a soldier (and thus not allowed to carry a gun). Yet Frolaytia keeps sending even him to the front lines repeatedly, in addition to the menial tasks that have got nothing to do with Objects he ought to be busy maintaining and studying. For that alone she should be court-martialed. But the dudes never bring it to the attention of other superiors or the military police. Because they are hard M and in fact get their kicks out of every unreasonable punishment she puts them through following her sadistic nature.

[Kraco]

Episode 22 - HS



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I guess I was looking down on this show so much that it actually managed to fool me. Not that I still wouldn't consider this silly. It's kind of annoying elements keep appearing out of nowhere, like the fake merc group by the Intelligence spies ties time. Still, there was quite decent action this time, and it was certainly funny how Qwenthur and Havia got so 180 degrees different treatment.

But it still sucks that after saving the whole town full of people all they got from their own superiors were reprimands and threats. Really, Qwenthur should switch sides to the Intelligence Union (or whatever it was). It sounds like they would appreciate his efforts far more. By the looks of it, he's not even in love with the Princess, considering he never does anything to get closer to her after all, so what's stopping him? He doesn't even have noble family estates to inherit like Havia.

[shinta|hikari]

Idiocy is what's stopping him.

Merc Maids are cool tho.

[Kraco]

Merc Maids are cool tho.

When they first appeared, my reaction was: "Jesus Christ, just when I thought this show couldn't possible introduce anything more foolish", but in the end the combat maids did present quite a good show. So good that I began to ignore their attires.

[MasterOfMoogles]

The best part to me is that the Intelligence Union commander lady and the maid leader have the same voice actresses as Misaka and Kuroko from Railgun.

Also, Prizewell City Slicker, lol, what a name.

[shinta|hikari]

TBH, it's still much better than Knight Commander Beefeater.

[Kraco]

Episode 24 Final - HS




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Quite a decent ending all in all, although naturally it alone won't save this show nor make it good instead of merely tolerable. It has a sort of karmic beauty that the last object the legendary object destroyer Qwenthur had to destroy was the one he was looking after for the whole show. I confess I didn't see that coming before this arc launched, even though it's certainly quite a traditional plot. Perhaps it's only because I never really wasted brain time on analysing this series any deeper than was necessary to write superficial comments here.

I still think Qwenthur should defect, though. Now he was even invited semi-officially. It seems to me he would get much better treatment in a place that respects wits and skills instead of lineage. He would even retain a loli to hang around with...

[shinta|hikari]

But Qwenthur is an M. There's no way he's leaving psycho Froy and jelly Princess.