Shokugeki no Soma

[NeoCybercoin]

http://cdn.myanimelist.net/images/anime/3/72943l.jpg

Genres: comedy, tournament
Themes: cooking, school

Plot Summary
On a mission to explore all aspects of the culinary world from the divinely decadent to the unbearably grotesque, Soma Yukihira’s ultimate goal is to become a chef that can surpass his father. He’s attends to a prestige cooking school. However, there is a catch – only less than 10% of the students graduate from this elite institution, and his father says any dream of beating him will be a joke if Soma can’t succeed.

[HorribleSubs] Shokugeki no Soma - 01 [1080p] (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=673546)

Been waiting so long for this one.

[MFauli]

extremely disappointing first episode. The animation is good, but ... the rest not so much. The hero seems too experienced already, Sure, he´ll go to this elitist academy, but still ...
And, ya know, as much as I like sexy scenes in anime, having so many and so crass orgasms and sexual reaction just came off as tacky.

Ill give this another 1-2 episodes before my final decision on whether to keep watching or not.

[shinta|hikari]

It really was as tacky as hell.

Also, the way they were eating that potato dish made no sense. It won't hold like that with a fork, and the slices change size every frame.

The cooking scenes were very well done. They should have toned down the fanservice and focused on that instead.

[David75]

I concurr.
They have a hell of a good storyboard with the manga, everything's in there. And they think overexageration will do that work justice?
Cooking is all about precision and delicate sensations.

Here, we get fast and dirty orgasms, much like your average hygienic fapping.

Regarding animation, yes there are so many mistakes on the slices, calves size for that land shark and the list goes on.

I just hope they've been a little over the top for first ep and they did tone it down or make it much more appropiate.
Thing is, they really messed it up and might have some of the audience just forget about such a slap in the face show.

Sadly, the father/son interactions in SD was funny, some parts were ok. But overall the first ep really ruined everything.

[NeoCybercoin]

Well the first few chapters of the manga all of those foodgasms and they are still in there just expanded greatly so it's not just being naked. After that they tone it down a lot and yes Soma has a lot of experience even in that school but that's against the other students. He isn't anywhere near as good as his father or other professional chefs are.

[David75]

Yeah, the manga also has some FS, but you can flash through it... when you can't in anime format.
So if it's not done nicely, with bad art/taste, it becomes anoying as hell, even more when it becomes heavilly repetitive.

That doesn't mean I'll refrain from watching, only that it could've been better even without the overexageration and without costing more (or less) yens to produce...

[Buffalobiian]

I haven't watched the food porn show from last season, but I imagine it was a whole lot of this as well - maybe just more cute and less obviously tits Shounen.

That was an alright episode, but nothing sets it apart from all the other shounen power-up-through-an-instutute shows so far. I'll watch this with revised expectations.

[David75]

Well, the one fom last season was getting repetitive... but was not as porno as that one.

[Ryllharu]

Considering the manga is drawn by a former hentai artist, I actually expect the foodgasms to be over the top and quite lewd. That's the point.

The problem is that when J.C. Staff animated it, they make it look a lot more like the girls (and guys) are trying their best not to pee. Every instance, from start to finish in this episode.

The clenching and quivering muscle sets were all wrong, something the manga never makes the mistake of. Add the land shark's foodgasm being about meat juices that were somehow more yellow than they are broth-colored...and the impression they make is very much the wrong one.

edit:
Even though the director worked on episodes of Nurse-Witch Komugi-chan, J.C. Staff isn't good at fanservice. They should have given this one to ARMS (http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=creator&creatorid=771).

[NeoCybercoin]

[HorribleSubs] Shokugeki no Soma - 02 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=676577)

Main bitch of the story is introduced. Also...Soma is quite the troll.

[Ryllharu]

Bitch? I believe you misspelled endgame love interest. His father mentioned that the trick to cooking your best is to find a woman to give the food to, and Erina's God's Tongue is incredibly difficult to satisfy among even the best chefs.

Then Soma goes on to make her knees buckle.

The foreshadowing is anything but subtle.

[Buffalobiian]

Bitch and love interest need not be mutually exclusive.

This show is hilarious, but I'm laughing at it, not with it.. Hopefully that's intended.

How are other people from his school not orgasming repeatedly from tasting his and his dad's food though is beyond me. Are common people supposed to be insensitive to bad AND good food?

I'm pretty happy I'm not a God Tongue. To be easily satisfied is to be easily happy.

[shinta|hikari]

Are common people supposed to be insensitive to bad AND good food?

Yes. The common palate is pretty bad at judging food. If you add in personal food preferences (which severely limits what is "good" for normal people), the tasting gets even more biased and inaccurate. Pearls before swine.

[MFauli]

Ep 2 was better than the first one, but Im still not happy about the overly sexual presentation. It doesnt add to the show, it´s just tacked on. But the premise of cooking competitions keeps me interested.

And yes, Erina is a super-bitch. Great to see someone like her getting shaky knees from the "lowly commoner"´s food.

[David75]

Fanservice and sexual presentation aren't a problem in themselves. It's just that it's not done very well in that show.
That second ep as better though.

[Kraco]

I don't know what he really says in Japanese, but I simply can't accept Horrible's (Crunchy's) 100% generic and uninspired "Hope you liked it!" after getting used to "It wasn't much!" in the manga scanlation. Maybe it's a case of a good translation being better than the original? "Hope you liked it!" doesn't even make any sense considering the people were orgasming from eating the food right behind his back. No shit they liked it by that point, huh?

I don't actually have much to complain about. I thought I'd find Kirito's voice annoying, but I got used to it. Erina could have used a more arrogant sounding VA, but I think I'll get used to her as well. Maybe the fact she doesn't sound like a pureblood bitch is good for the possible love prospects Ryll was talking about.

[shinta|hikari]

"It wasn't much" is actually the more accurate translation of "Osomatsu." It is a Japanese expression used after treating someone to a meal. It literally means that the item, food in this case, is bad or ill-prepared, but that's just the Japanese being exaggeratedly humble. I guess they believed it wouldn't translate well to English and changed it.

[Kraco]

I guess they believed it wouldn't translate well to English and changed it.

More like after their extensive background check of zero seconds they didn't realise it's the dude's catchphrase that's going to be repeated in the story any number of times. "It wasn't much" really fits his personality. He was ready to bet on his cooking skills to beat the property sharks and was the only one ready to challenge Erina's taste test of the whole bunch of people. This is, in Crunchy's opinion, a wishy washy dude who meekly dares to plead people to like his cooking? The Crunchy translators must be working under a whip without any extra time in their hands.

[shinta|hikari]

Maybe they should've used "Glad you liked it" instead. That captures the intention of the expression "osomatsu sama" better.

[Kraco]

Episode 3 - HS


-- - - - -



Maybe they should've used "Glad you liked it" instead.

They actually changed it to that in this episode. I reckon "catchphase" is an unknown concept to the Crunchy folks who are only doing this for money, but it's still better than their original version, so whatever.

A jolly good episode. I had forgotten the early feelings of reading the manga, and this refreshed it in my mind. Mainly how amusing Yukihira was with his nonchalant and self-confident attitude. I had totally forgotten how things started between Yukihira and Megumi. Good comedy.

[NeoCybercoin]

I loved this episode. Mainly because it showed everyone even if they didn't show faces.
Megumi though....just too damn cute.

[shinta|hikari]

Kirito's VA did a great job. I didn't expect it to work.

[David75]

Souma should have had a E for that Boeuf Bourguignon, at first sight alone. No need to even taste it.

I might be wrong, as I only eat that dish 3 times a year, in restaurants or many home cooking events and do not prepare it myself.
But here's why for the on sight immediate death:
Meat size
Lack of important vegetables and lardons (similar to small bacon bits), potatoes

Meat size:
I've never seen a Boeuf Bourguignon prepared with a single huge meat portion.
Why is that? Well, the meat part used for bourguigon has long fibers, lacks fat and is a bit dry and hard. You need smaller bits for the meat to be well cooked and more edible. I'd say cubes around 1/2 inch, less than 1 inch
Also, the meat part felt like a steak at first (extremely wrong), then felt a lot thicher in the plate...
Vegetables
You need at least carrots, why? Because it's a dish from Burgundy with Burgundy wine for the sauce/cooking (Bourguignons are people from Bourgogne/Burgundy).
Carrots give a subtle sugary taste that lowers the sour taste from the cooked wine.
Potatoes are important because they absorb part of the sauce and become incredibly good. Also, this is a dish for cold days, so carbs are important (that's why you can accomodate with pasta too, although it's a bit different)
Lardons are also very important because they bring some fat to help with dryness and cold days too.
They bring lots of collagens too, adding to the collagens brought by the beef. This gives incredible body to the sauce, putting tastes forward. Health hipsters love collagens.

They didn't even mention wine did they? Why even bring a contest around Boeuf Bourguigon and forget the master element?

I'm stopping here, I don't remember exactly how it turned out in the manga. But it feels like there's a clear lack of documentation here. It might be because it was the early days of the manga and the author didn't have resources for research, but for the anime they've had time so I can't let it pass.

[Kraco]

I always thought the manga boasted a semi-believable sense of the dishes, but there's no way they could fool a Frenchman, huh? But then again, I would never call myself even a fledgling gourmet, having only some baking skills and very basic cooking skills, so I'm far from being anyone to really judge this manga one way or another. It was very interesting to read your analysis, nonetheless, David.

[MFauli]

kinda hate that erina is already in lock-on of being Souma´s love interest. Megumi is way better :>

Best episode so far. The sexual presentation was kept minimal (although honey tentacles at the end, sigh) and I love it when Souma gets ready to cook. Now, I´m not expert in terms of french cuisine, but even then I found it hard to believe that Souma could just do "whatever" and still get it all done in time. Surely there´s a reason for cooking the meat the way it´s documented within the recipe. If honey was the end-all solution, it´d be the regular way of cooking that meat. And considering the reaction-sequence featuring honey so prominently, it´s fair to assume that the honey left a greater impact on the whole dish´s taste - a dish that didn´t even feature honey at all originally! Since the judge/teacher gave a strictly defined task, Souma should have failed simply because he didn´t deliver on what had been asked for.

[Ryllharu]

The culinary science in this episode is sound. Honey and pineapple indeed contain proteolytic enzymes, which tenderize meat remarkably quickly.

I've done pineapple and pork kabobs. Pineapple makes incredibly tender meat, which can otherwise get dried out on the kabob when you're trying to get the vegetables done. The pineapple does have to be fresh. Cooking and canning destroy the enzymes.

It isn't the common way to do things, because as Soma pointed out, buying an entire pineapple for a dish is unfeasible in Japan where they are rarer (and likely also expensive), and honey isn't exactly cheap either.

[MFauli]

It isn't the common way to do things, because as Soma pointed out, buying an entire pineapple for a dish is unfeasible in Japan where they are rarer (and likely also expensive), and honey isn't exactly cheap either.

bs
theyre the top of the world cooks. Time is a more important good to them than the price of, lol, honey.

[David75]

Yes, honey does what was described. But the Boeuf Bourguignon is all about the heavy and tainting red wine that permeates through the meat and changes its color from inside out.

And yes, to summarize he didn't do what was asked, so he failed. The only way out is that he made something so tasty Chappell smiled, despite sabotage and in a very short time. So it's more about rewarding all that.

And yes, I'm a little maniac about food. Not necessarily an expert, not cooking either. But I like variety, testing/tasting, and understanding why it's good or why things are done the way they are.
I also have quite a budget spent on food and mid to high end restaurants. Maybe that's why I'm a little dissatisfied with the adaptation when Erina trashes simple dishes and they are so imprecise about Bourguignon. But this only is anime after all.
And they even reach overdosing climaxes like dopes on steroids. So I guess I should tone it down a little too.

[Buffalobiian]

Do post about the inaccuracies though. I like reading those.

The food orgasms are fantastic. I love them now.

Keep up the good work Soma.

[Ryllharu]

Time is a more important good to them than the price of, lol, honey.
For Erina and most of the other elitist students? Absolutely.

For Souma who's family runs an affordable diner at the edge of a shopping district? Speed and cost are king. He looks down on the other students because they've never served people. Cooking to them is an art and they're at Tōtsuki for the fame. As the first episode showed, the worst thing in Souma's mind is not being able to serve a dish. So he's figured out a few ways to cut down on things on the off chance something goes wrong. Same with his scheme to fake the texture, juiciness, and flavor of meat. He's got the creative art part of it down too, as shown from his rice dish. That combination is why he's so confident, to the point of casual arrogance.

Souma isn't used to serving dishes with truffle oil, gold leaf, and rare spices and herbs (that's why he was impressed by the spice rack in the classroom). He serves flawless executed dishes to common people. But that narrow area won't get him to the top of the culinary sphere, so his father forced him to go to Tōtsuki.

Similarly, Tadokoro is from the rural countryside. Pineapples are out of the question to her, though honey may not be. Still, she's probably used to having all the time in the world to cook, so shortening the process doesn't occur to her.

@David:
Definitely love the critical analysis. Keep it up.

Erina trashing the simple dishes and then getting weak in the knees from just rice, eggs and chicken broth is a lovely point. She's been spoiled by only the finest flavors and tastes all her life. Her reputation as having a God's Tongue is well-known, so the chefs that seek her out are only going to present her with, "the very best." For all her haughty bullshit, she probably hasn't been exposed to all that much.

Just as an example, I'm willing to bet that Tadokoro has had real wasabi about as frequently as Erina, but Erina's was acquired with a fair amount of money, while Tadokoro probably harvested it herself for free. Or to make it less common, maybe whatever the equivalent to ramps is in Japan. Erina eats only the best leeks harvested in fabulous horticulture gardens, Tadokoro grew up on something with an even more delicate and refined flavor that her grandparents plucked out of the dirt.

[David75]

I got the manga page for the BB again, same huge beef part. Some asparagus, parsley, "champignons de paris" (Agaricus bisporus), and maybe some potatoes but the picture is so dark it's hard to tell. I guess I had the same dissatisfaction, but didn't bother commenting in the manga thread since I was so late in starting the manga.
I wonder about the opportunity of asparagus and parsley in BB. Mushrooms (champignons de paris), I think I had it served and it did go well. Potatoes are a must.

In both cases, we have cauliflower I didn"t mention before. It's probably one of the most difficult vegetables to use, because it's either too powerful and in a bad way, or just tastes like water and you don't care... I'm not too sure about its use in BB.
In any case I do not remember having cauliflower in BB.

Regarding Erina and Souma, we have the classic opposition of style. One is a Genius and hardcore worker, always at the heart of the cooking battle right where it counts, centimeters away from the taste of everyday life customers who are the hardest to please because they want a fast, good, easy to digest while fulfiling and cheap meal. The other being a Genius with Deus Ex powers who is at the top of the top of everything food.
Thing is, they both need one another because they have to exchange the best they know to really access food Nirvana.
Souma needs refinement, needs to access exceptionnal ingredients/foods/recipes without forgeting his qualities.
Erina needs to understand there's lots of joy to be found even in seemingly simple foods.
She would never try a "Pasteis de Nata" -Portuguese Egg tart- or Lasagna. Both seem so simple and so vulgar to her.
But properly done, they need quite a level of control, you do not have room for mistake to make good ones. and good lasagna need lots of time to prepare... Good Pasteis need lots of precision, because you do not have lots of ingredients and it's easy to make average ones. Good ones on the other hand are hard to find.

[Kraco]

I'm not so sure this story would have genuine European recipes and styles even if they use the names and there are supposedly European chefs around. Maybe they are like the Japanese versions of the dishes. Like oft when you go to a regular Chinese, Indian, or whatever restaurant in the West, the dishes might be somewhat adapted to the local tastes and customs, despite the owners of the restaurants being from their respective countries. That is, if the author actually does have a culinary hobby and this isn't all just a product of googling while the dude is munching on curry day in and day out.

[shinta|hikari]

Even with honey or whatever, you can't tenderize beef flank, especially a cut that size, in less than 30 minutes. He didn't even use a pressure cooker for crying out loud.

Shokugeki no Souma is decidedly shounen, not seinen, so I'm not really expecting realism. I just wanted to put my two cents in. Like David, I am a gastronome, but I also love to cook.

EDIT: And the salt sabotage was ridiculous. Why would they put in that much and not even give the pot a shake to allow it to mix in? It's like they wanted to announce the sabotage, which no one in their right mind would do.

[David75]

I thought the same about the sabotage, but as you said this is Shounen, so everything must be easy to read, even that plot line.

Thinking about what you wrote Kraco, it's true that BB really is home cooking. And the home version isn't restaurant ready... or rather not mid range to high end.
Not a problem for your special of the day or familly restaurant though. And there are some presentation ideas I've seen for a similar dish that could be used in a more rustic setting (you still can't bring it easilly to the upper standard restaurants)

I guess that presentation would be best in you average mid-range venue. But I would call it Boeuf "façon" Bourguignon. Or Boeuf à la Bourguignone. (Beef done like a Bourguignon)
Also, the smaller pieces have other merits, for example the way you eat the dish is different with smaller pieces than with a single one.
But I feel like there was just a lack of documentation on that one.

A last blow, a BB is a very slow cooking dish. 3 hours at medium to low temperature is a minimum.
Most people even prefer it after a second cooking the next day.
This is after all a dish for famillies with enough income to buy beef, but not the best parts. And the dish has to be easy to heat and must be easy to reheat.
Add potatoes, vegetables, reuse what's left of the sauce and meat, add some water, reheat, enjoy.

[shinta|hikari]

And he "did" it in 30 minutes.

LOL.

[David75]

Talking about bourguignon all day made me crave for some. But I'm full already and we've had hot summer heat days this week, so it's totally inapropriate.

Well prepared, with a carefully chosen wine, it is a simple yet strong and succulent dish. Seems like there are lots of recipes around in Shakespeare's language and Imperial units. So think about it for cold days ;)
And discard any recipe with less than 3hours cooking... time is of the essence. It allows for collagens to move out of the meat and for all tastes and wine to mingle together and get the whole better

[shinta|hikari]

I love slow cooking meats, particularly braised dishes and stews simmered for ages. Stews are actually even better the next day because the flavors have mingled and unified into a smoother, richer flavor experience.

In cooking competitions on TV, they always limit the time to one hour or less, making such delectable options impossible to make. I understand that they want to make the show suspenseful and dramatic with the time pressure, but I think it severely shackles the chefs and the possibilities. I personally would want a cooking competition show that focused on the final product instead of the race to get there.

That limitation is not present in anime cooking shows because time is magical, like in this episode. That's actually a good thing because we get to see dishes that never take the stage in Iron Chef, Masterchef, Chopped, and the like. I've forgotten most of the manga, so I'm looking forward to the surprises Souma has in store for us. I may bring up some scientifically improbable cooking techniques like I did in this episode, but I'll be doing that more for discussion and possible interest on more realistic alternatives than actual dissatisfaction.

[Ryllharu]

A last blow, a BB is a very slow cooking dish. 3 hours at medium to low temperature is a minimum.
Most people even prefer it after a second cooking the next day.

So it is like chili? Good when you first cook it, but always better the second day after a round in the refrigerator.

edit:
Hell, even a few months in the freezer.

Pro-tip: Add beer to chili instead of water.

[shinta|hikari]

That is a tip I will gladly take. Beer in food is always awesome.

[David75]

I don't know much about good Chili, but except for strong spices, it feels similar to cassoulet. Another slow cooking dish for cold days.
And cassoulet also is one of theses dishes you can enjoy several days.
As for beer, it might work with cassoulet thanks to the beans and some of the spice, but obviously not with boeuf bourguignon because we already have wine as a base.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 04 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=682509)

--------------------------------------




















Given how much of a bitch Erina's been thus far, I have to say Megumi > Erina right now. Great stuff again. I was getting worried when the granny went to taste his stuff, but they managed to make it okay. Guess we all grow old.

Again, squid works wonders.

[David75]

Regarding the composed steak, I was skeptical about it for a long time. Then one day my honey prepared some with salmon for a fish burger and I was really surprised how good it turned out to be.
I did not wet my pants, but it was good enough for me to crave for more.
The ep felt short, good point. I would really like having 2 or 3 eps a week.

[Kraco]

Damn, despite reading the manga, I didn't even remember the naked appron dude belongs to the Top Ten. Considering Erina's unfortunately useless personality, it's no good for the school that she's among the Top Ten and thus possesses more power than teachers and other staff, aside from the director. She was even kicking somebody like Yukihira out solely due to the fact she didn't like him personally (as if she liked anybody at all, by the looks of it).


I have to say Megumi > Erina right now.

Anybody > Erina.

[MFauli]

Kinda boring episode. We get it, Soma can make delicious stuff out of thin air. Okay. I´m more interested in the real competitions at school.

Megumi continues to be both hot and cute. Unfortunately, it appears to be set in stone for this kind of anime that the hero will choose Erina-bitch for his girlthing. meh.

[Ryllharu]

I was moderately surprised they kept in Ryouko's illegally brewed sake and the resulting underaged drinking. That's something consistently cut out of manga for the anime adapations.

It was just "fermented rice juice" though. Har har har.

Also Fumio's flashback. Hrrrrng.

[David75]

Grandma You would have liked to fuck.... Hehehe.
GMYWHLF

An ep you easily forget though.

I guess expectations where way too high and we have to tone it down quite a bit. It's a shame though, because competitive shonen anime works well with simple recipe that can be reused quite a bit.

[shinta|hikari]

5 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=685468)

1741

Congrats on the translation, editing, and TL check of Crunchyroll.

There's no way fish skin will remain crisp for that long if you doust it with liquid. Crackling, whether pork, chicken, or fish, must be kept dry if you want to keep its crunchy texture. I'd get it if Souma simply topped the dish with crisp skin, but he specifically mentioned that serving it wet will lead to a different experience. ...A soggy experience.

[David75]

And ochazuke is all about soggyness...So here we have mackerel onigiri ochazuke ? And again one of the elites thinks poorly of a dish, like if it was some burger.
But his dish was also very common and way too simple by usual gourmet standards. Thing is, the more simple the dish, the more difficult it is to make it good and surprise people.
Regarding commoners dishes, bourguignon falls in that category too. It's only a question of how frequent it is in the region you live I guess.

Back to ochazuke, I like the version with raw fish on top (maguro for example) that changes color when you pour the hot liquid on it.

[Buffalobiian]

I have a feeling Ibusaki is a bit of a hot shot himself as well, given how they talked on the balcony.

Anyway, props to the slap-in-the-face imagery.

[Kraco]

Even if the sumo wrestlers' cooking club was stagnant and degenerate, I can hardly see why Erina would need to bulldoze their club room to build her own. The school seems to possess a whole mountain and surrounding lands, so space isn't exactly premium commodity there. Of course her talk with the sidekick suggested she's actually on a crusade to get rid of everybody she doesn't approve (which probably means everybody but herself and the grandfather), but in that case why would she need the excuse to erase the building to get the plot? She's just a mega bitch.

[Buffalobiian]

She thinks the room is better served for her productive research than the sumo club's non-productive research. They're wasting the school's budget.

The cook-off is a test. If they are fit enough to survive they will.

[Kraco]

She thinks the room is better served for her productive research than the sumo club's non-productive research. They're wasting the school's budget.

No, it was still a proper club with many members, even if they had failed to cultivate themselves as innovative cooks. Now the building got destroyed and Erina will build in its place a new one to serve as her personal kitchen extension. Now that's what one would call a waste of budget.


The cook-off is a test. If they are fit enough to survive they will.

A member of the Elite Ten challenging random people isn't really a test, it's just bullying. But then again, we have already seen that Erina is a proper bully in addition to being a bitch.

[NeoCybercoin]

Poor Megumi....waking up and seeing that first thing when she wakes up.

[Ryllharu]

Even if the sumo wrestlers' cooking club was stagnant and degenerate, I can hardly see why Erina would need to bulldoze their club room to build her own. The school seems to possess a whole mountain and surrounding lands, so space isn't exactly premium commodity there. Of course her talk with the sidekick suggested she's actually on a crusade to get rid of everybody she doesn't approve (which probably means everybody but herself and the grandfather), but in that case why would she need the excuse to erase the building to get the plot? She's just a mega bitch.
I assumed it was more about location convenience than anything else, including her pride and arrogance.

The school seems to own several mountains, and even a place as formerly prestigious as the Polar Star dorm is very distant from the main part of campus.

Why should Erina-sama be forced to walk or be driven to another part of campus to cook whenever she feels like trying out a new dish?

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 06 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=688142)

---------------------------









That was a strange sight, seeing the senpai not orgasm on Souma's food right away but say "no, not quite". Even his regular school friends were able to do that back in episode 01. That sounds like Souma's secret menus were more or less his perfected works despite how he seemed to improvise with scraps according to his onlookers.

It's not like he'll lose a Shokugeki anyway, that'd mean he's out of the school. Ironically a less dire wager would be more exciting.

[shinta|hikari]

Souma's menus weren't his. They were Yukihira's. They were ripping off Yakitate Japan except for that difference, but now it goes to more Souma-original territory.

I just went to Animeminneapolis and a "bad anime panel" there basically unanimously declared this show as horrible because of the food rape.

[David75]

They are using the manga as a script. So there's no element of surprise at all.The only bonus in such case is godly voice acting and animation. But this is plain boring and vulgar. I love fanservice and sex references. But here, it's more like bad porn.
Also, following the manga to the letter creates an unpleasant rythm.
Maybe I'm hard on that show because of some expectations I should'nt have in the first place.

[Kraco]

I have no such problems with this show. Sure, I might prefer a bit less fanservice, which would then be sparingly saved for really meaningful events, but it doesn't break the show for me as it is currently.

All in all I like how strong Soma is, yet he still must work hard. Actually he enjoys working hard. His attitude is also quite nice for an anime MC, even though the school is full of arrogant and self-assured people. The difference is that he wouldn't lick the footprints of the likes of Erina 'Bitch' Nakiri.

[NeoCybercoin]

Man, Nikumi's sizes are all over the place. Or they have some very clever angles to they use.
But yeah, Soma uses his dad's recipes that he can make just as good. He has the creativity but not the level of skill that his dad has.

Anyway you'd think since his dad made these amazing dishes he'd be more known in the cooking world. But Yukihara doesn't ring a bell to anyone. So most likely changed his last name when he got married.

[Kraco]

He has the creativity...

I don't think so. When you know more and have more skills, your creativity is also boosted. Soma has lived all his life in Japan, so he would know nothing of great many things out there in the wide world. He might know some exotic (in Japan) things his dad tried back at the restaurant, but considering it was a place for affordable food, I doubt his dad used overly much imported stuff. However, go to India or Europe, and you would find everywhere stuff that would be rare in Japan (or vice versa). Soma is still highly lacking in that sense.


Anyway you'd think since his dad made these amazing dishes he'd be more known in the cooking world. But Yukihara doesn't ring a bell to anyone. So most likely changed his last name when he got married.

Not known by whom? The kids? I don't think the Nakiri geezer overruled Erina's decision to refuse Soma's admission into the school just to piss off his granddaughter. No matter what Soma's old man did in the past, for as long as Soma has been living (which is also about as long as the other students have lived) the man has mostly spent his time with Soma in the whatever town they were living in. I guess he would travel every now and then (don't remember if it was mentioned), but since he's now travelling, why not before? If he mainly travelled abroad to do some cooking, it's natural few of the students would know of him.

[shinta|hikari]

I don't think so. When you know more and have more skills, your creativity is also boosted. Soma has lived all his life in Japan, so he would know nothing of great many things out there in the wide world. He might know some exotic (in Japan) things his dad tried back at the restaurant, but considering it was a place for affordable food, I doubt his dad used overly much imported stuff. However, go to India or Europe, and you would find everywhere stuff that would be rare in Japan (or vice versa). Soma is still highly lacking in that sense.


That "sense" isn't creativity. That's knowledge. Making something good with limited knowledge and ingredients is creativity, like the bacon wrapped fake-meat potato, the honey bourguignon, the canned fish burger, and the mackerel onigiri chazuke (all of which make little sense in reality, btw).

Of course, having more information and experience expands what he can create, but that isn't being creative. That's merely application of knowledge. Doing something different or applying something in a new way falls more on the grounds of creativity,

[Kraco]

If he doesn't know some spice, ingredient, or technique exists, he can't use it create new dishes or just enhance existing ones. Of course it limits him.

[shinta|hikari]

I absolutely agree. I only disagreed with the label. Creativity is more resourcefulness. Having a wide repertoire is not equivalent, though usually correlated.

[MFauli]

That "sense" isn't creativity. That's knowledge. Making something good with limited knowledge and ingredients is creativity, like the bacon wrapped fake-meat potato, the honey bourguignon, the canned fish burger, and the mackerel onigiri chazuke (all of which make little sense in reality, btw).


Tbh, most of that sounds pretty gross and vomit-inducing. Especially the fake meat thing and the canned fish burger. Eww.

[shinta|hikari]

The canned fish burger is just wrong.

[Kraco]

The fake meat potato with bacon thing actually doesn't sound so bad. It was some soya shit, then yes, but baked potato that has sucked in juice from meat should be tasty. Doesn't beat the real thing, naturally, but I don't see why it would be bad. I guess if you don't like potato at all, then it would be no good.

[Buffalobiian]

Souma's menus weren't his. They were Yukihira's. They were ripping off Yakitate Japan except for that difference, but now it goes to more Souma-original territory.

I just went to Animeminneapolis and a "bad anime panel" there basically unanimously declared this show as horrible because of the food rape.

I do mean Yukihira's when I called them his. By perfected I mean he's done it multiple times till it was good and he couldn't improve anymore on it.

[KrayZ33]

The canned fish burger is just wrong.

Isn't/wasn't that just a normal fish burger?

bread - eggs - salt+peper and fish

done

[shinta|hikari]

Canned?

Normal?

What have you been eating all your life?

Or maybe you just haven't had canned mackerel and its can juice.

[David75]

canned sardines or mackerel are good, provided you choose well.
Good bread, some fish on it, and you have a nice little sandwich. It is by no mean an everest of fine taste and an orgasm of reactions. But it is quite good, even with that strong aroma and sent.
Regarding quality, I have no doubt they use the good ones at the polar star dorm.
Now, is it really possible to get something very good out of it, probably. But you really have to find ways to tone the sent and taste down.
Use hot boiled potatoes cut in 5 to 8 milimeters slices, oignons, shallot, red wine vinegar and canned sardines and you already start getting something real nice. Add some rucola salad (arugula in the States it seems, roquette in France) and it's really hard to stop eating that.
Works well with canned mackerel too.

Ideas are not that bad in the manga/show, there is some documentation. But there are mistakes and the anime delivery is subpar.

[KrayZ33]

As far as I remember (it's not really eaten frequently here and I don't like fish very much) it tastes like tuna but more "fishy".

it's pretty fat too, so it's actually a good fish if you want to grill or fry it.

[shinta|hikari]

Grinding canned mackerel to mush and making a patty out of it (therefore drying it out and removing any texture resembling food) is not the right way to eat it.

[KrayZ33]

It's just fish (really cheap one too), you hack it, knead it with bread, form it and cook it.
Probably more bread than fish anyway, it will taste and smell like fish though.

[MFauli]

ep 07 is out
-----------------

damn, this episode made me hungry. I loooove the simple combination of white rice, some well fried meat and sauce on top of it :>

[NeoCybercoin]

I like how she is the meat master and is pretty much constantly displaying her top quality meat.

[Kraco]

Episode 8 - HS





- -- - --- -



Damn, that was stupid to watch. Very limited time, yet everybody was just standing still, staring at Aldinis cooking. There are scenes where time can be stretched for the sake of dramatics, but this certainly worked in an ill manner. It made zero sense and that's it.

At least the beginning of the ep was better with Souma hardly giving a shit when the others were panicking.

[shinta|hikari]

It's not just the direction that was stupid.

All of a sudden, the Aldinis have a plucked duck ready for butchering. Where the hell did all the steps between that go? Plucking requires scalding the duck to remove the feathers. Somehow, in the middle of the wilderness, the Aldinis managed to dip the duck in hot water to loosen the feathers and pluck them off.

In the first place, how the hell did they catch a duck? The idiom sitting ducks got its meaning because the hunters have a gun. These guys had nothing, but somehow, they got a plucked duck ready right when Souma got 2 fish (a perfectly reasonable catch).

And all of a sudden, all the chef candidates are awed by a mezzaluna as if it's something awesome. Er, it's just a blade...

Souma is a story catered specifically for people who know nothing about cooking. A better cooking manga to adapt would be Bambi, but oh well.

[MFauli]

Catching two fish within 2 hours at will isnt that reasonably either, lol.

Also, if I were Souma I´d forget about Erina-sama, forget about Megumi and go for that female chef that´s leading their group. Damn.

[shinta|hikari]

Fishing isn't that hard. (Yes, I have experience. At not catching any while watching people catch a few in the short time I was there...)

It depends on the place, etc, but it sure beats magically procuring a plucked duck from the wilderness.

[neflight86]

Souma is a story catered specifically for people who know nothing about cooking. A better cooking manga to adapt would be Bambi, but oh well.

Seeing as it's published in WSJ, I think that is appropriate. I enjoy the theatrics of this far more than I care about how feasible the techniques or setting is. I mean, the whole tournament school thing is the stop where 'serious story' got off... Not having pre-plucked duck.

I'm with you on a Bambino anime, though.

[shinta|hikari]

The thing is. it's perfectly possible to do this story without screwing up basic cooking facts. That's what I'm complaining about.

[Kraco]

Catching two fish within 2 hours at will isnt that reasonably either, lol.


Fishing isn't that hard. (Yes, I have experience. At not catching any while watching people catch a few in the short time I was there...)

Dunno how many fish the stream had, but there was a lot of competition since most of them were apparently fishing. It was quite a stretch all in all that the Aldinis were the only people, among these folks aiming to be top chefs, who realised there's meat other than fish in the world. I'm willing to give them a bit of a break, though, because the theme was a Japanese dish and fish is very prominent there, especially historically. The weakness of a tunnel vision could have been directed 1000% better, of course, since it was created by the strict time limit, yet after all that they still had the luxury to just be a relaxed audience for the Aldinis, from the beginning till the end, so obviously there was no hurry in the world after all.

[Buffalobiian]

Also, if I were Souma I´d forget about Erina-sama, forget about Megumi and go for that female chef that´s leading their group. Damn.

That's not going to happen. She already loves Megumi.

Everybody loves Megumi.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 10 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=698344)

--------------------------









Soma you're so boss. :3 Marry Megumi already and forget about Erina.

There's been a lot of battles and eliminations in this anime. I'd love to see some more nurturing though, instead of simply picking off the weak. It's an academy after all.

[David75]

With that title, it's a bit hard to complain about the lack of anything but shokugeki...And for manga readers, the show feels both slow and lacking in details.

[MFauli]

Seriously, Megumi is moch better than Erina. Fuck typical anime progression that forces Soma to go for Erina :/

And challenging the chef to a Shokugeki, haha

[Ryllharu]

No, no, no. You don't understand.

Souma has to tame Erina. They went over it pretty well this episode again (better than the manga did imo). Erina is an elitist. She doesn't respect simple flavors (Souma), she doesn't respect people who can't do it right the first time but work around it (Megumi), people who "fail" her (Nikumi), and she can't appreciate "common" activities despite being inexplicable drawn to them.

She was very much enthused about playing cards with Hisako, until she found out that Souma also intended to do the same. He's the archetypal "common" person to her, even though he is anything but. She even almost relented once Souma was out of her sight, because she really does want to enjoy common things, but her own stupid pride ruined it for her yet again. In her own mind, she has an elite image to protect.

Erina was so upset that someone made her enjoy a common-people dish that she flunked him out of spite.

Doujima said that she's only ever had the best foods since she was very young, even baby food and comically, breast milk. Has she even ever had fried chicken? Ramen? A mere roasted potato? Erina can't appreciate rustic flavors. Souma and Megumi both cook street or rustic cuisine. Souma's father semi-retired after finding a woman who can appreciate his cooking, and wanting to for her.

Souma has to defeat Erina's God's Tongue, he has to make it appreciate the unrefined, but good flavors by cooking them perfectly.


Yes, Megumi is better than Erina. Almost every other girl is. But Souma breaking Erina's haughtiness will be well worth the aggravation.

[Kraco]

I'm not so sure Soma and Megumi would be overly compatible. Megumi would never drive Soma forward, or anywhere at all. She would be simply satisfied with anything like the Yamato Nadeshiko she is (which would be no good for Soma, who already foolishly thought his old man's restaurant was all there is to the world of cooking). As much I hate Erina for being such a bitch, even she would be better than Megumi if Soma can break her stupid, false pride.

[Buffalobiian]

I'm sure everyone can appreciate a God Tongue.

[shinta|hikari]

Indeed.

Am I the only one who thinks the chef dude's reason for expelling Megumi is ridiculous? They seriously want us to believe he is an elite professional with that kind of attitude? His power-tripping is so exaggerated that it blew suspension of disbelief for me out of the water. And I managed to keep watching after all the ridiculous foodgasms.

[David75]

I agree, this is just bad writing. Tasting is already heavilly not a good way of judging, you do not need to be even more of a jerk in your setting of the event. Cooking being massively about skill and knowledge, there are an infinite number of irrefutable details you can fail someone with. Changing the recipe was enough in my eyes. But then you can always chose to be clever and propose another test to get megumi back in the game, since her dish was acceptable in taste and aspect.

But since shokugeki is the only way out... Souma had to save the powerless girl.

[Kraco]

The setting was pretty cruel and crafty, but not totally unreasonable. Megumi made a mistake by first going for hardier ingredients instead of cauliflower. I don't actually much care for cauliflower personally, so I don't know if it's so problematic in reality, but I guess it is. The setting was like a miniature version of the challenges a restaurant owner faces while procuring the various ingredients needed for the menu dishes. Some can be handled in a more relaxed manner and stay good for a long while, some might be harder to acquire and go bad fast. Different strategies are needed. So, it wasn't only about Shinomiya being a jerk (although he is a jerk through and through).

[David75]

Failing her because it tastes bad as she was late picking the best ingredients, would have been acceptable.

But it tasted good enough he had to get that rule the recipe must be followed to the letter after the test.

Souma in the same predicament got a A for his bourguignon that felt flawed on so many levels...

[Ryllharu]

I don't actually much care for cauliflower personally, so I don't know if it's so problematic in reality, but I guess it is. The setting was like a miniature version of the challenges a restaurant owner faces while procuring the various ingredients needed for the menu dishes.
It does go brown pretty easy at room temp. I won't deny the perceived logic behind the act, but deliberately putting in bad produce (and barely enough of it as it is) is bullshit. Souma called him out on it for good reason. He rigged it to prevent the full group from passing. If the elite 10 were all in that room, he would have only put in 8 good cauliflower heads. That's a bad test. It doesn't prove who is a good chef or good at shopping. It rewards needless ferocity and punished deliberate caution.

Shinoyima is a douchebag.

Hinako's test was hard (and the cut to her next group proves it), but only the students own inadequacies cause them to fail. A lack of creativity, a lack of knowledge about native/wild ingredients, losing composure under pressure, or simple lack of determination. But they could all pass in theory.

[Buffalobiian]

Shinomiya's reason wasn't as simple as "you changed my recipe". The fact that the cauliflower was enhanced in whiteness and sweetness upset the balance of the vegetable combination. I agree he's a douchebag for putting in dud cauliflowers though.

[shinta|hikari]

No. He said so himself that the change was a good idea in and of itself (perfect harmony, in his words). The intention of the recipe was to bring out the sweetness of the vegetables, but Megumi used acidity to add a different but similarly delicious effect. Changing the recipe is what he got pissed off at.

[David75]

he admitted he lost... Only to disqualify Megumi because he can not tolerate losing, when it's not even the point.I repeat myself, but at this point, finding a student that overcomes a hurdle that way should be a nice surprise and you would try your best to get them back into the race. If they lose after that, so be it. But don't fail them for your petty ego, when they show great promise.

[Buffalobiian]

No. He said so himself that the change was a good idea in and of itself (perfect harmony, in his words). The intention of the recipe was to bring out the sweetness of the vegetables, but Megumi used acidity to add a different but similarly delicious effect. Changing the recipe is what he got pissed off at.

You're right. It's the added acidity that failed Megumi.

I'm still of the opinion that throwing in guaranteed-fail cauliflowers was the dick move. I can appreciate why he failed Megumi though. He's not examining creativity or anything else like the previous examiner. He's examining precision and following a recipe to the letter. Remember how some of you (David?) said Souma's French dish from last time (the one with red wine) wasn't even the same thing anymore? It's the same idea.

The exam wasn't "Make me something that tastes good based loosely on X", it's "Make X".

His dick move was how he set up the exam (guaranteed fail quota), not how he marked it.

In this show it's a gamble as to whether or not your creativity will be appreciated. That's why real-world exams have marking rubrics to keep clarify expectations.

[shinta|hikari]

No, Megumi's change was so minor a layman would not even notice it. Souma's bourguignon barely bore any resemblance to the real thing. That analogy simply doesn't work.

[Kraco]

It was Shinomiya's own recipe. There's no way a man with that much pride would allow a mere student to alter the recipe for an exam. In fact I doubt he would allow it at a restaurant either, when it's his name that everything's riding on.

I reckon every examiner must drop a number of students, to reduce the amount. Shinomiya just made the disqualifying process a bit wider, not only based on the final dish. The two fools earlier were kicked out because they broke the rule of no cooperation, for example.

[shinta|hikari]

Dropping a student who he himself recognized as creative enough to create perfect harmony by altering his recipe is utterly ridiculous. Bad writing.

[Kraco]

It's a school that takes pride in allowing only 10% of the students to graduate. What else did you expect?

[David75]

The 2 were failed on the rule that was explained BEFORE the exam.

As I said earlier, he can fail her for not following the recipe to the letter. But he can recognize her efforts and propose a positive way out because she obviously shows promise. And it's not a favor here. But Shinomiya has to accept the fact his test was not perfect, and he can not tolerate that on an egoistical level. Not many people can come close to something acceptable on their first try at this recipe even with perfect ingredients, but she managed to with less than perfect cauliflowers. He should acknowledge that somehow. That's my gripe.


PS: And he really is a douche, because he knew from the start he would fail her and had her finish the dish and even tasted it... instead of failing her early.

[NeoCybercoin]

The man is just an arrogant egotistical chef with zero flexibility. The dude shouldn't be a judge in this.

[shinta|hikari]

That's what I'm wondering about. Is being an elite chef so easy in their world that deluded asshats like him can become so popular?

[neflight86]

Not many people can come close to something acceptable on their first try at this recipe even with perfect ingredients, but she managed to with less than perfect cauliflowers. He should acknowledge that somehow. That's my gripe.


He did mention that her recipe was not bad, implying it was as good as or better than his original. I thought it was nice of him to acknowledge that before firing her.

[shinta|hikari]

I'm not even sure if you're joking. Acknowledging it AND firing her is what makes him an asshole. If he had fired her out of a subconscious reason, he'd be less disgusting.

[Kraco]

I'm not even sure if you're joking. Acknowledging it AND firing her is what makes him an asshole. If he had fired her out of a subconscious reason, he'd be less disgusting.

She failed the assignment. David said it already that it's a very simple reason for firing her. They were supposed to follow the recipe, she didn't. There were dropped students who did follow the recipe as well as they could but Shinomiya thought the result wasn't good enough. It would be bullshit if Megumi altered the recipe yet still passed. That would make him an ever worse examiner, who first tells the students they must follow the recipe, but then would let somebody pass after she knowingly altered it.

[shinta|hikari]

Sure, failing people who can actually come up with dishes equal to his (in his own words) on the fly despite disadvantageous circumstances is what makes a good examiner. But NO! She altered a recipe! In a good way but who cares! There's no way she deserves a spot in this cooking school!

Talk about putting the cart before the horse...

[Buffalobiian]

I wouldn't say adding acidity makes her recipe better. It comes down to assessing the task vs assessing the person. In a school, you're really supposed to assess the task. However, schools also need to set clear marking criteria so students know exactly what is expected of them. It doesn't happen here, which is the source of angst and confusion.

Souma's past creations are based on the idea that "I have to serve the customer something". Shinomiya runs his place thinking "You give the customer exactly what is prescribed. Nothing different." As perfectly put by Ryll, the problem was his dooming a number of students by default regardless of skill.

[Kraco]

As perfectly put by Ryll, the problem was his dooming a number of students by default regardless of skill.

He didn't doom anyone regardless of skill. Like I said perfectly before, he just expanded selecting the ingredients to be a part of the necessary skill set. He even dropped a hint by telling the students they should consider each other enemies. Megumi's skills were lacking because she didn't go for the most sensitive vegetables first. Lacking skills = fired. Just like the two dudes were kicked out because their rule abiding skills were apparently lacking and they shared info.

[Buffalobiian]

If everybody got to the cauliflowers first, then what? It's the biggest, most aggressive person getting the best pick (assuming they know how to pick). They didn't show any vegetable stealing or sabotaging in this episode, but that could have easily happened too. That's the type of thing that's happening here.

Like Ryll said, if only 8 good cauliflowers were available to the Elite 10, 2 will fail - either the two slowest, or two most gentle.

[neflight86]

I'm not even sure if you're joking. Acknowledging it AND firing her is what makes him an asshole. If he had fired her out of a subconscious reason, he'd be less disgusting.

No joke there; it is as I said. He has an inflexible standard that she didn't meet, so he fired her. But he expressed an admiration for what she did and even gave her the courtesy of answering her question of "Why?". I'm not saying anything about how good or bad his character overall is, but that I appreciate that he separated his personal feelings from his cooking standards in this regard.

[NeoCybercoin]

Separated his personal feelings? The decision was BASED on his personal feelings. Sure he explained what she did in a calm manner but that was it. It was his original recipe. Something he obviously takes a lot of pride in. Then this kid comes along that makes a good one with bad ingredients by altering the recipe. His recipe.

That's how I see it anyway.

[David75]

The "follow the recipe to the letter" was not a rule displayed before the exam. The way he refered to that even let us think he stated that rule as a convenience to fire Megumi.

And as I said, he can fail her for that test and then offer her a way to save her neck to show respect for her hard work since she got a more than satisfying result. Or he should have failed her early. Failing her that late with no options is just pure sadism he savoured the moment he saw her using a less than perfect cauliflower.

[neflight86]

Separated his personal feelings? The decision was BASED on his personal feelings. Sure he explained what she did in a calm manner but that was it. It was his original recipe. Something he obviously takes a lot of pride in. Then this kid comes along that makes a good one with bad ingredients by altering the recipe. His recipe.

That's how I see it anyway.

I think if his pride were truly hurt and his judgment impaired by that fact, he wouldn't have given her either the positive critique of her dish or the (explanation of the) infraction that cost her the evaluation. It seems very dispassionate to me. He didn't even uncross his legs, if I recall correctly.



The "follow the recipe to the letter" was not a rule displayed before the exam. The way he refered to that even let us think he stated that rule as a convenience to fire Megumi.

And as I said, he can fail her for that test and then offer her a way to save her neck to show respect for her hard work since she got a more than satisfying result. Or he should have failed her early. Failing her that late with no options is just pure sadism he savoured the moment he saw her using a less than perfect cauliflower.

I think I see where you're coming from, but I disagree on the notion that, given how much authority he has over the students, and how little (none) accountability he has for their passing or failing, everything he has done has been essentially a courtesy. He even said this was his simplest recipe. This is pure conjecture, but I wonder if he would have minded if Megumi left the exam area to get a decent produce?

I'm not blaming her and her situation is unfortunate, but I personally don't see his methods as purely evil, is what I'm trying to say. Even if he accepts the shokugeki on her behalf, that is still more than he would be obliged to, as he could expel Yukihira without it based solely on his "authority" (assuming he wagers his own expulsion), so if he does participate, he has nothing to gain if the only tangible net change is reversing a decision to fail a student he complimented anyway.

His attitude does rub one the wrong way, though.

[shinta|hikari]

Didn't he threaten to expel a student who passed (Souma) because he disagreed with him?

Not evil at all.

[neflight86]

He merely threatened, but nothing stopped him from actually doing so except himself. It could be argued (but I won't) that he threatened him for openly disrespecting his station as a former alumni without having proved himself yet by graduating.

I expect that, in his own mind, he is upping the standard of foodcrafters Tooksuki (sp?) produces by his machiavellian standards. The ending of the previous episode also suggests that there may be more to this character than has been shown so far.

That being said, I understand my view is in the great minority and I cannot offer any solid proof that the examiner is not actually evil beyond the obsticle he poses to the students, so there's that. Either way this turns out, its always good fun to discuss a decisive character like this!

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 11 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=700665)


-------------------------











Shinomiya (with "full discression") gets stalemated by Hinako! God bless Hinako. Megumi too. Everybody loves Megumi.

Erina's a bitch, but she's hot. I'll give her that.

http://i.imgur.com/OplEVKs.jpg

[MFauli]

Megumi is hotter. Also come on, Soma, the way he´s talking to her is totally flirtatious behavior. Screw Erina and keep the cuter girl!

As for the episode, I find it dumb. Unless they´re planning on having Megumi as a cooking prodigy of sorts, it´d be dumb if she won this Shoukugeki, only to return to mediocrity afterwards. Winning against an alumni should be a big deal after all.

[Buffalobiian]

I think the point is that she gets flustered, but she's not mediocre at all. When she's not worried about failing things (failing to impress Dorm-masters or examiners) her cooking is great (stuff she does for the students in her spare time).

She is talented, but the way the school pressures students with the constant threat of failure doesn't mix with her.

Aside from changing the recipe, her Terrine warrants pass material.

[Kraco]

In some other show I wouldn't mind Megumi, but in this one where most of the really prominent characters are kind of special, self-confident, egoistic, and success oriented she stands out in a bad way, mainly making me think she has no business being there in the first place. Just like they told Soma: Is he going to keep looking over her shoulder for the whole duration of the high school and save her time after time if necessary? She should instead go to a more regular cooking school that doesn't make a point of dropping ten times more students than graduating.

I never thought Erina wasn't hot. It's just that her personality is rotten.

[David75]

Regarding Shinomiya's Dish:
This is Auvergne, with a V. I know Vs are hard for Japanese people, but CR translators could be a little more refined and/or check.
A bit strange to have a mousse or the like in a choux farci. The farce is minced meat with other ingredients, but you have to have a grainy feeling. Having a mousse instead feels like some other dish.

Last complaint: Foie gras. This is not a complaint for the show/dish. Just a global complaint: Many chefs/restaurant like to add foie gras everywhere. It's some kind of marketing trick. But most of the time it does little to no good to dishes.
People have to remember this is mainly fat, with some taste to it. So mixing it finely and adding plenty of other tastes around makes it a bit hard to justify its use...
And lets be clear, foie gras is a farmer's delicacy. Use it with a thick dark bread loaf, you'll get a foodgasm with something that feels too common and simple, but closer to the truth of the product.
Of course, you can also use figs, if you like to mix salt and sugar tastes.

Then, you have so many levels of quality in foie gras... First is: Duck or goose? the latter has a more refined taste to me.
Also, that product has had so many (awful) clones created by industrials that you should be very careful in chosing it.

Aside from that, I like the idea of the choux farci, well prepared, it certainly is something great to eat in autumn. It's also very close to my (father's side) cultural roots.

[MFauli]

btw i had always thought a terrine is a kind of soup ... :o

[shinta|hikari]

@David - I perfectly agree about the foie gras. When it was mentioned as part of the ingredients, I immediately thought, "How passe." Foie gras shouldn't be treated as a magical ingredient, especially because it is strong in flavor and will overpower your dish, like it should have done in this episode.

[David75]

Well, this is in fact anything that is gelified with layers of ingredients or multiples ingredients. Some recipes have a name of their own. But anything that uses the same techniques to have a gelified block you can cut in slices works.
The idea is that it's easier to serve some ingredients in a terrine as you can easily slice them. Nice for traiteurs (people selling cooked food)
A terrine last a little longer than other dishes.
Beef gelly can bring some flavors to the front.
You can have a very nice combination of colors
It's fairly easy to prepare

[KrayZ33]

btw i had always thought a terrine is a kind of soup ... :o

the 5 minute-instant stuff describes the cup, not the soup :D

[David75]

Duck foie gras is stronger. Goose foie gras would be wasted in his dish...
There's bacon already in his recipe. That should really be enough to counter some of the dry feeling you get from pork fibers.

[neflight86]

About the episode, well, it's hard to defend Shinomiya's behavior after this episode. I suppose I gave him too much benefit of the doubt as far as his character goes. I like the rainbow of Megumi's dish.

[Buffalobiian]

About the episode, well, it's hard to defend Shinomiya's behavior after this episode.

What's different?

[neflight86]

Specifically, it appears he is making decisions based more on personal pride than in the interest of benefiting the exam process. He demonstrated spite so plainly that it leaves little room for interpretation this time, I feel.

[Kraco]

Specifically, it appears he is making decisions based more on personal pride than in the interest of benefiting the exam process. He demonstrated spite so plainly that it leaves little room for interpretation this time, I feel.

There are plenty of people like that among the top specialists in the world, especially among those who needed to compete intensively to get where they are. It doesn't change the fact they are required to eliminate a bunch of students during this camp. I still maintain it's fair to eliminate someone who deviated from the recipe. It doesn't matter if the exam supervisor is a scumbag by nature or not.

[shinta|hikari]

You can argue all day that it's fair (it really isn't given all the traps), but it doesn't change the fact that it's stupid. It's a school to train those with potential, not trap them.

[Kraco]

It's a school to train those with potential, not trap them.

Yeah, but it's also a school in Japan. They can only reward those who respect the teachers and follow instructions to the letter. Naturally this doesn't need to apply to the MC in a shounen series, who always somehow gets off the hook.

Also, like I said earlier, this clearly isn't the right school for Megumi as she is now, which explains partly why she got kicked. Or was now, assuming she finally changed after having to bear the role of the chef in this contest. It's a school for the bold and self-confident.

[Buffalobiian]

It's a school to train those with potential, not trap them.

I agree with this, which is why I'd like to see more training and teaching, and less expelling.

[shinta|hikari]

Only the dickhead glasses guy wanted her kicked out. The other instructors didn't. An informal shokugeki was even arranged to give Megumi a chance to remain. If she deserved to be expelled, the other instructors would not allow it.

[Kraco]

They are all individuals. Bold and self-confident assumes a certain amount individualism. Among such people there would even be inherent value in disagreeing just for the sake of disagreeing (just like here on the forums). Besides, perhaps Shinomiya is exceptionally unpleasant among the many instructors of the school, and the rest would rather give Megumi a chance to adapt her personality and avoid wasting her skills by dropping out. Moreover, they risk Soma getting kicked out as well. A blind man would see the potential in him, and he has the correct personality to boot.

[shinta|hikari]

Besides, perhaps Shinomiya is exceptionally unpleasant among the many instructors of the school, and the rest would rather give Megumi a chance to adapt her personality and avoid wasting her skills by dropping out.

Uh, that's what I've been saying.


Moreover, they risk Soma getting kicked out as well. A blind man would see the potential in him, and he has the correct personality to boot.

The informal shokugeki risks Souma getting kicked out. Kicking Megumi out plain and simple doesn't, unless he decides to quit, which he won't.

[Ryllharu]

I agree with this, which is why I'd like to see more training and teaching, and less expelling.
I actually disagree with this.

The middle school section is for that. That's the place where the school trains the students to cook. Souma (and the Aldini brothers) look down on those students who learned to cook at the school and never served an actual restaurant. Those three learned on the job, not at a school learning theory and scientific technique.

The high school section on the other hand, is specifically set up to find leaders. They're not looking for line cooks or sous chefs, they are looking for executive chefs (or Chef de cuisine). They only want students who can prove that they'll innovate, command, and revolutionize restaurants.

The problem with this is assholes like Shinomiya. He's so set in his ways that a chef should dominate the kitchen, not lead it. Hinako correctly identified Megumi's potential, which is why she is so biased. She is a Japanese chef, while Shinomiya is a French chef. Hinako sees that Megumi has a firm grasp on Japanese rustic cuisine, but lacks in confidence because she is ultra-Japanese and therefore modest to the point that it hurts her. Megumi is preeminently Japanese, and that is counter-intuitive with what being a stand-out chef is all about.

We can't forget that Hinako is no less cruel than Shinomiya, but she hides it better.

[Kraco]

The informal shokugeki risks Souma getting kicked out. Kicking Megumi out plain and simple doesn't, unless he decides to quit, which he won't.

Shinomiya did threaten to kick him out as well if he doesn't back off. Yukihira was the one who issued the challenge, so there's no way he would.

[Buffalobiian]

The high school section on the other hand, is specifically set up to find leaders. They're not looking for line cooks or sous chefs, they are looking for executive chefs (or Chef de cuisine). They only want students who can prove that they'll innovate, command, and revolutionize restaurants.

And to do that you need time to train, practice and fail. Innovation doesn't happen within the 2 hours that you're pressed to produce something of good quality.

Remember Souma trialling different ways to make his Don for the shokugeki? That's what I'm talking about.

All the other "do it right or fail" scenarios are about exercising what you already know in an unconventional way. It lets you break out of a tight spot, but you're not going to make a breakthrough. It's destructive, not constructive.

[Kraco]

Aren't you just saying that they are supposed to use their free time for innovation and bettering themselves, either in clubs or on their own? Simply taking the official lessons and practice isn't a sure way to survive the school. They should all know that, so it's perfectly valid.

Those "do it right or fail" experiences make them develop a mindset that allows them to break out of quite likely tight spots they might face later in their professional life. Of course it's vastly exaggerated here, but this is a shounen series. In any case, like Soma puts it, you have to serve something to the customers and you can't keep them waiting infinitely. If a sudden tight spot paralyses you, it's all over. That wasn't Megumi's problem during the exam earlier, but it almost was during this shokugeki.

[Buffalobiian]

Aren't you just saying that they are supposed to use their free time for innovation and bettering themselves, either in clubs or on their own? Simply taking the official lessons and practice isn't a sure way to survive the school. They should all know that, so it's perfectly valid.

I'm saying they should have free time, but also official R&D time, with input from senior colleagues in classes.

We see no classes, only tests. Souma is only tested on how well he can use his current skills in that instant - not how to develop them. Like the alumni said this episode, Souma is a level above other students thanks to his family restaurant training. What has the school done for the others?

This isn't a school that produces good chefs via mentoring. It's an institute that finds the already good ones and give them a badge.

[Ryllharu]

And Erina is culinary royalty, highly regarded since she was little, in the Top 10, and spends a great deal of her time composing dishes that Hisako ends up tasting. She got rid of another club so her testing kitchen could be conveniently located and she could spend more time there.

The Polar Star dorm members, including the 7th seat on the Top 10, spend most if not all of their free time doing research in their specialty, testing dishes on each other, or torturing Marui while he's trying to research.

Using your free time to research and plan for the inevitable challenges that the staff throws at you is expected. As far as we've seen, all the clubs are Research Societies.

As I said, the mentoring was for the Middle School section. The difficultly clearly ramps up in the high school section and they start throwing out the people who can't handle the simulated environment of a real restaurant. They're testing their ability as sous chef and line cooks when forcing them to make 50 servings at night.

There was one transfer student. Souma. The overwhelming majority start at the school in Middle School.

[Kraco]

Nah. We just aren't seeing that stuff because it's not interesting or exciting. I'm sure they spend many hours every day sitting in an ordinary classroom taking lessons. It's a high school, even if cooking oriented, so I reckon they have ordinary lessons as well. You want to see it all? We already know they have clubs like any Japanese school (although I imagine they are all cooking related). That's for gaining insight from older students. Many students have special interests they develop on their own. If one is not interested in any of this but instead expects the school has to offer everything on a silver platter, they deserve to get kicked out. Nobody else is going to make them Michelin chefs after they graduate. They need to do it on their own. Even Erina was expanding her own kitchen to stay on top of things.

[shinta|hikari]

I agree with Kraco that they should have those during the off times, but I also think that Buff is right in that they should show at least a couple of those scenes. The current story is more like a reality TV cooking show than a school. If you watch Hell's Kitchen, Chopped, MasterChef, etc, you will notice how this is patterned after those.

[KrayZ33]

I get these vibes too, I always have the "This meal is so unfinished, EA tried to publish it" picture in mind when I watch this show.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 13 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=705309)


----------------------












I prime myself for dinner every Saturday by watching this now.

Souma's problem must be not making appealing dishes - people won't know how good something tastes if they don't feel like trying it.

I'm not quite sure about his dad saying "people won't order things if it's way out there". I tend to order things that are more unconventional, especially if it's something I can't make at home due to technical difficulties or sheer time/labour intensiveness.

[David75]

When traveling, it sometimes happen that novelty/discovering everything everyday takes a toll on you and going back to something very simple is a nice change. It's easier on your mind, you do not have to think too much about it and it evens recreates enough room for further discoveries.

Also, they very much stressed out the broad range of customers, from under 7 to over 77. Novelty might really put you in a very small caterogy of people. Moreover, this is not a diner, but a breakfast where diversity is much smaller and people wait for specific dishes. And that challenge would be even harder in France where breakfast is mostly based on sugar, milk and coffee... When other countries even in Europe have heavy salty/meat dishes.
I personaly do not care and can adapt to almost anything in the morning, even seafood. But my wife will never eat anything else than bread with butter or morning pastries, with coffee or hot cocoa.

[Buffalobiian]

I eat anything in the morning. My main constraint is usually time or ingredients.

[Ryllharu]

The problem he's about to have is pretty obvious. He's used to cooking for customers on the spot at the diner, not having a lot of servings available that then sit out. All the previous tests have been cook-and-serve immediately. It doesn't help that he's right next to Erina, the food industry darling.

As an American, I find it hilarious that Erina's miracle dish here is something that you can get pretty much everywhere in the US (budget hotels), and is always gross. There's no saving eggs benedict, especially in a setting like this. Doesn't matter how good of a chef they claim she is. The Hollandaise sauce always develops an unappetizing skin on it within minutes.

At least Tadokoro's is something legitimately novel, fun to eat and appeals to all ages.
Aldini's is kinda weird, but salad for breakfast isn't that unusual on that side of the world.

[David75]

It had an apetizing dessert look at least, that egg benedict. But I think I never tried it. I can only state it feels a bit heavy and Inhave yet to find a dish I like with bacon in it... But that's because I have troubles with fatty or oily dishes.

[Kraco]

This show is starting to highlight Soma's biggest weakness, which is the fact he knows nothing outside of their diner and his old man's dishes and derivations. Now he even admitted he doesn't know what hotels serve as breakfast. His dad is a real cheap bastard if he never took his family anywhere. Or maybe the dad is a sadist troll who is now laughing at his "frog in a well" son's troubles behind his back. An arrogant and self-confident mind combined with limited knowledge is a deadly combination. Good for Soma he's a main character.

[Ryllharu]

I'm pretty sure that is exactly why his father challenged him to go to the school. What better place to broaden his culinary horizons than an internationally famous cooking school that's always do or die?

They had a business to run, and now Souma gets to continue his daily challenge lifestyle while his father is making insane buckets of money overseas.

That's good parenting, given their relationship and home life.

[Kraco]

I'm pretty sure that is exactly why his father challenged him to go to the school. What better place to broaden his culinary horizons than an internationally famous cooking school that's always do or die?

They had a business to run, and now Souma gets to continue his daily challenge lifestyle while his father is making insane buckets of money overseas.

That's good parenting, given their relationship and home life.

Sure, sending him to the school was good parenting, but he could have done just a little bit before it, you know. Like it was revealed, the dude hasn't even eaten a hotel breakfast before. Such an elementary thing makes you wonder just how much normal experience he's lacking otherwise. That can't be it all. Has he even been visiting other, varied restaurants?

[David75]

Sure, sending him to the school was good parenting, but he could have done just a little bit before it, you know. Like it was revealed, the dude hasn't even eaten a hotel breakfast before. Such an elementary thing makes you wonder just how much normal experience he's lacking otherwise. That can't be it all. Has he even been visiting other, varied restaurants?
You can always always script a background story:Souma's mother died after a long illness that needed very costly treatment. Souma's father had to pay the debts, but with no budget had to open a small restaurant where he got enough people/income to support his child, instill high-end cooking skills, pay the debts, but no room for extras.

[neflight86]

No comments on new girl? It was pretty cute how she tried to give everyone the shakedown (including Erina), and her 'muscle' was clueless as to his purpose in it all.

[Ryllharu]

Alice?

All of us love Alice. There's no needs for words about it.

[Kraco]

Alice was actually shown a couple of times before in random eps among crowds of people, just for the sake of eager manga readers. There's not much to talk about yet, to be honest, after these brief scenes and the current exam still unfinished.

She's my favourite of the girls, nevertheless. Although she's also arrogant, she's much funnier than Erina. As you might have noticed, she's not in the picture at the end of the OP. I hope she will now be added to it. There's some space left on the right.

[NeoCybercoin]

Shokugeki no Soma Ep 14 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=707555)






Well that's one way to do it. Pretty nice too. And all of this made me remember why I liked Alice so much.

[MFauli]

All i remember about this episode is booooooobs.

[Buffalobiian]

Oh look, it's Shinta Souma!

http://i.imgur.com/ivvOe29.jpg

[Kraco]

That was a bit too dramatic, like the ages old, beaten to death trope of disassembing a time bomb with only a second left. There was basically no sensible reason why he waited until there's only half an hour left. Did he have his back turned towards the customers all that time so that he never noticed his products were losing their structure and nobody ate them?

Still, Alice saves any episode. She's so funny with her pride that's not bitchy like Erina's and all those petty grievances. Not to mention those eyes which tell about how she's leaving reality behind when getting excited.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 17 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=718172)


-----------------------












Nikumi!! You're so not my type, but this episode was so much more entertaining thanks to you. She's "defiant" like Erina is, but thanks to her attraction to Souma it's not stand-offish to watch.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 18 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=720564)

--------------------













Is it me, or does the Karaage reviewer sound really unenthusiastic? She sounds exactly like she did the first time with that cheery yet hollow voice.

[MFauli]

Too many girls around Soma. I cant enjoy this when I´m feeling sorry for this childhood friend that just doesn´t have a chance. Not only is this anime set on having Soma date the arrogant bitch that is Erina, but also does it have Megumi, who successfully fills out the "cute girl" category. No place for this one. :/

Also, I find it silly how evil the Karaage owner is portrayed. She´s fucking selling fast food! Even if her store is successful, it´s not like she´ll get rich from it. Makes me feel bad, too, seeing her going down.

[shinta|hikari]

Also, I find it silly how evil the Karaage owner is portrayed. She´s fucking selling fast food! Even if her store is successful, it´s not like she´ll get rich from it.

McDonald's (original owners sold it, but still got rich). If you want a more third world example, Jollibee.

[Buffalobiian]

Also, I find it silly how evil the Karaage owner is portrayed. She´s fucking selling fast food! Even if her store is successful, it´s not like she´ll get rich from it. Makes me feel bad, too, seeing her going down.

I find it quite funny and enjoyable. And fast-food you may call it, but the packaging and image is pretty up-market and clean. Souma couldn't even emulate it. Don't look down on Karaage.

Honestly though, the idea is that she's a huge business kicking mum-and-pop shops out of business. I don't see her as being particularly evil, but this is competition. Souma creates a niche market for his shopping district, and she keeps all her eat-at-home packages that are required for train passengers anyway.

[Kraco]

Souma creates a niche market for his shopping district, and she keeps all her eat-at-home packages that are required for train passengers anyway.

If it's reheat and eat-at-home food, she would be competing with grocery stores as well.

[MFauli]

episode 19 is out
------------------

that was dumb. i dont care if this is anime ... she looks the exact same! and her mannerisms, bleh ...

Regarding spices, I personally don´t like to use them too heavily. I prefer creating a nice flavor by mixing various ingredients, treating them differently. Spices always felt like cheating to me. Like, "there´s a flavor I cannot reproduce by my own skills ... so let´s just use this powder here!".

Also, it´s a little bit hard to believe that Soma would know nothing about spices. For a professional cook, they´re part of everyday usage.

[Kraco]

One more episode proving why Alice is so much better than Megumi. I still can't understand how Megumi lasted this long in the first place, before Soma took it upon himself to rescue her every week. The academy is a totally wrong school for her. It's a place centered around harsh competition, fearless innovation, and self-promotion, which are all things she obviously doesn't like. I can only imagine she had no idea before applying, and afterwards she's desperately trying to stay in order not to let down her whole village. Such a bore. She's the only person of her sort among the named characters we have seen (and even among most unnamed), which in itself strongly suggests she doesn't belong.

But whatever, these elections are individual contests, so Megumi should appear less in Soma's company, even if she was tagging along this time to the curry master's lab.

[David75]

Like many westerners - and I am in that group - you know next to nothing to spices...

But sometimes, at a restaurant, you taste something you would discard based on prior tests... and get a surprise you never saw coming.

Happened twice this year.
Once in a sichuan cuisine restaurant in Paris with red chili. First it was delicious and strong. But I thought I would suffer the consequences, as I have always had a vengeance in my stomach with such food. Didn't happen. So I had a very pleasant surprise.

The other once recently, I'm not fond of cocoa milk and curry. Always thought it was a bit bland and lacking.
Had those mixed together as a sauce for mussels. It was some sort of revelation, never would I thought this could be so good.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 22 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=727571)


------------------------










Megumi!!

No upsets here in the rankings. The older Aldini did rank somewhat lower than I thought though, given that he's the (self proclaimed) rival of Souma. Either he's not actually that good, or Secretary-chan is also at least on equal steps with Souma.

[MFauli]

I hate secretary-chan. Her dish was so ... unexciting. Meh.

Also lol, here I thought the tournament would be concluded this week xD

Who survived the prelim now anyway?

Secretary-chan
Older Aldini
Megumi
?

[Buffalobiian]

I hate secretary-chan. Her dish was so ... unexciting. Meh.

Also lol, here I thought the tournament would be concluded this week xD

Who survived the prelim now anyway?

Secretary-chan
Older Aldini
Megumi
?

Alice. She topped.

[Kraco]

I just can't bring myself to like Megumi in this show. In some other show I might have rooted for her, but not in this one. She's so out of place here. But I guess it's good there're all manner of girls for people to pick their favourite from. That being said, although Alice is my favourite girl in this show, I think I'd have still preferred to eat someone else's dish if I could have only chosen one. Both Aldini servings looked delicious, as well as the Chinese restaurant girl's.

[Buffalobiian]

Clearly Kraco isn't after an other-worldly experience.

It's funny watching people trip while figuring out what they just ate.

[shinta|hikari]

Nah, Isla tripped a lot and Kraco loved her.

Must be the boobs.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 23 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=732499)


--------------------------------















The food porn is ridiculous. I feel like I'm watching Prison School.

That means it's great, even if it can't be taken on a serious level.

[David75]

It felt like that ep was stronger on that. Back to what it was at the beggining. Very forced and ridiculous, and not even appealing, cute or sexy.

[Buffalobiian]

You didn't say "I wasn't amused".. so were you amused?

[Kraco]

In my opinion the biggest problem was that the noname characters got so low points, all the named characters suddenly really high. Why were the nonames even involved in this contest? Of course it's a foregone conclusion only the main and main supporting charaters can continue on, but it still looks stupid. One Chinese restaurant girl could't break that unnatural situation. It's like watching men's javelin championships and seeing how 5 people throw close to 90 meters, whereas 25 reach only 50 meters. That would make no sense whatsoever.

But whatever. I don't mind the fanservice at all. It was like that from the beginning so I knew what sort of manga/anime I'm following. If it bothered me, I wouldn't be here in the first place.

It was nice to see vichyssoise mentioned. Good stuff. I make it every now and then. Exceedingly simple yet jolly good.

[David75]

Not even remotely amused or anything. That episode was trash.
The awesomeness of food anime was really impacted by the mediocre fanservice. And I like fanservice. It's just it rubbed me the wrong way this time as it is back to the low quality it was in the first few episodes.

[Buffalobiian]

Ah, yes. It was definitely a step backwards to the early episode or two when I wondered if I should have been watching this as well. I don't mind an episode here or there for laughs though. Making 24eps full of it is a different matter.

[MFauli]

i had no problem with the more sexually pronounced presentation in this episode, as it made a nice stark contrast to the stuckup bitch in the jury that would score everybody with 0 up to that point.

Anyway, finally nearing the final showdown.

[Kraco]

Episode 24 Final - HS




- - -- - -




Clearly a series that simply continued as long as there were episodes left, paying only cursory attention to where it ended. That is, it ended right after the first round of a tournament (at least not in the middle of a round). Of course considering overall pacing, there might not have been much of a choice, as the pacing was rather good. If they had tried to avoid this tournament entirely, there would have been lousier episodes before the end.

Quite a decent ending to the show. The old director's laughter was a suitable ending to the tournament preliminary round itself. Alice was as funny as ever, contrasting Nakiri 'Bitch' Erina well. I can't claim I'd have been super thrilled about this show as the manga has generally speaking been enough, but it was a surprisingly gfood watch. It's most of time nice to see and hear characters animated and voiced.

[MFauli]

what do you mean with "ending to the show"? Is it not going to be continued?!

[NeoCybercoin]

I certainly hope it will continue. I mean they still got the entire tournament in front of them!

[shinta|hikari]

This should be popular enough to get a continuation.

Shit.

[Buffalobiian]

If the accuracy in food isn't there,.. eh. I don't cook enough to notice. I'm all for the characters however, so bring on the sequel.

[Kraco]

I don't know if it continues. When writing that earlier post, I tried to check ANN for news of a second season, but didn't find any. Of course it's entirely possible I missed an article. You'd certainly think this was popular enough, being full of boobs'n'stuff.

[David75]

Main gripes probably are that it does not add much interrest for the manga readers and that it is at times unapealing to appaling...
But when you're a manga reader, you're prepared to face such hardships and watch that regardless.

[shinta|hikari]

I wasn't.

I started this and dropped it in the first few episodes. The manga is just much better. I hope OPM doesn't tread the same path.

[ForteCross]

I wasn't.

I started this and dropped it in the first few episodes. The manga is just much better. I hope OPM doesn't tread the same path.
well, seems like there will be a second season after all next year (2016).

speaking as a non manga reader, i can assure you this was a really entertaining anime.

it just an underdog story, but the characters are really lovable and pretty much all of them are memorable...

at the beginning i was expecting a boring story where the main character will pretty much win all the battles, but most of the time he fucks up at first, and then improvise using his own skills.

even the season's finale was bitter sweet (pun intended) when he won over more judges but then didnt got the highest score.

i watched the whole season in less than 24 hours (with work in the middle, i think i slept only about 3 hours), by the end of episode 24 i was smiling knowing there will be more stories to tell.

[shinta|hikari]

I just don't want a second season because the manga is better. If you don't read the manga, naturally that doesn't apply to you. That said, I've stopped reading the manga at around the same point the anime ended, so I'll probably hop back in to see if I'm still interested.

[NeoCybercoin]

HS- Shokugeki no Soma S2-01 (https://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=826248)

And it's here! Certainly felt a bit rushed but hey, delicious Alice-Sama.

[MFauli]

Honestly said ... it felt too rushed. The first season had built up Alice as this (seemingly) invincible cooking genius. And now Soma beats her in a single episode with a ... not that impressive dish. I´m not a bento expert, but from what I´ve seen in anime, I´d vastly prefer Alice´s bento, where I can pick and eat everything with a single bite, hasslefree. Whereas Soma´s bento requires hashi and has a soup and sauce, both of which I´d be too scared to carry around in my bag the whole day. The only real argument given against Alice was "if the topic had been sushi, you´d have made the exact same thing", but how does that refute her bento´s validity?

Ma, ma, let´s see how this goes. Although I do not understand why it´s only 13 episodes. Are we almost caught up to the manga?

[shinta|hikari]

Are you studying Japanese? I notice you keep inserting random Japanese interjections in your posts for some reason.

The reason Souma won is because he took advantage of the theme instead of just working around it, like Alice did.

[MFauli]

Are you studying Japanese? I notice you keep inserting random Japanese interjections in your posts for some reason.

Yes, I am. Although I used "hashi" because "sticks" wouldn´t come to my mind while I was writing that posting lol


The reason Souma won is because he took advantage of the theme instead of just working around it, like Alice did.

I get that. As I said, I´m arguing from the perspective of somebody who knows bento only from school-themed anime. In that context, or even if I had to choose what I´d take with me when I leave the house, I´d prefer Alice´s bento. It´s less complicated and less likely to spill all over my notes.

[David75]

Regarding Souma's bento, you understand the container is made purposefully for that use and it can't leak right ?
You also understand when Souma says that the hot soup/sauce will cook the vegetables by the time you eat the bento.
Souma really did cover all of the aspects of preparing and then eating a bento several hours later.

Alice's was nice, but didn't qualify as a bento you can bring to work to eat several hours later for example.

[Kraco]

You might be visiting a hospital next if you planned to eat Alice's bento several hours later. Keeping sushi in RT or even higher for hours doesn't sound like a good idea. She had absolutely nothing in her presentation that would deal with that problem. Even the initial cooling was only for the show. Souma's multi-compartment stainless steel thermal bento container looked like it would cost 50 bucks at the absolute minimum, most likely a lot more, so I doubt it would ever leak.

Souma won this easily and unquestionably. But I still enjoyed watching Best Girl Alice very much.

[KrayZ33]

This episode felt....weird? I can't really pinpoint it but they constantly switched between "silly" and "dead fucking serious I'm going to kill you, you fucking loser", 'twas really awkward.

I guess Souma has always been like that, but if two characters do it at once it's really difficult to take them more serious.
Alice's flashback to the past didn't convince me either. It wasn't as good as the others imho, probably because she never had a bento in her past.

Souma rocked her ass, and what a fine ass she's got. Alice is my absolute favorite in terms of character design/looks in this show.

[NeoCybercoin]

Alice is the in nr 1 spot for me. Well...shared with another character that they haven't introduced yet in the anime.

[Buffalobiian]

S2 Episode 04

------------------







I didn't like where this episode went. It's saying that you can always add a twist and just beat someone else. It's saying that you can't have a perfect recipe from previous trials, where any further alteration will just ruin it.

edit: lol, I just watched the preview. I guess ^ is exactly what they're going for. Souma will perfect his own dish through taste-testing and Murasaki will self-destruct by trying to twist it differently.

Hayama needs to win his own duel so we can have him vs Souma again. His fragrance war is a more refreshing watch compared to assistant-kun's Umami battle.

(Seriously, half the battles are about whoever can concentrate the most umami.. have they not heard of MSG? :P )

[Munsu]

Was about to look for this thread as I just began watching this series, I'm on episode 15 of season 1. Should catch-up soon.

It's been entertaining to watch, but man is it making me hungry as fuck.

[MFauli]

Don´t really enjoy this new season anymore. It feels so rushed, and nothing has gravity. Feels more like a parody of itself. One battle per episode and it´s completely arbitrary who wins. There´s no build-up, no tension.

And yeah, the whole "more umami = better" shtick is kinda silly.

[shinta|hikari]

When the main character promises to quit the premise of the story if he loses, it makes the turnout of the match completely predictable.

Still gonna be an awesome beat down though.

Isn't it how funny how the antagonist here is named Subaru?

[Munsu]

Just caught up.

Enjoyed the first season. I'm glad some of you feel the second season feels rushed because I completely support this arc being rushed. It hurts the pacing and all the setup, but I want to get through this tournament as soon as possible as I really don't care for it. Didn't care for the last arc of the first season, and this is an extension. So let's finish it up as quickly as possible and go along to the next stage.

Also thought it was a very poor choice to eliminate all the girls from the tournament in their first match-up, what a dumb decision to make.

Furthermore, the new judges suck balls. The ones from the preliminary were much more interesting, and of course, lady judges included.

I'll also mention, I would've liked to see more actual teaching in this school, so far I haven't seen the purpose of having a school at all. Might as well simply have a privileged series of tournament and be done with it.

Lastly, they ruined the impact of having Nakiri Senzaemon around. Thought he'd be a more interesting character, but he's completely irrelevant.

[shinta|hikari]

Also thought it was a very poor choice to eliminate all the girls from the tournament in their first match-up, what a dumb decision to make.


Because women can't cook. All they are good for are foodgasms and tasting stuff men produce.

[Munsu]

Because women can't cook. All they are good for are foodgasms and tasting stuff men produce.

Well, it beats the malegasms they've been replaced by.

[shinta|hikari]

The author of this show doesn't really cook. Or gave up the pride of being able to. Some recipes just don't need gimmicks, like Buff said. It's like saying a margherita pizza would be enhanced by adding shit on top of it.

EDIT:

Oh I remember now. The reason I dropped the manga ages ago is because of this Mimasaka arc. Copying recipes by profiling? This is more unbelievable than... anything. Utter trash.

[MFauli]

Fast-forwarded the entire episode. Really boring. First you´re switching the anime to a rushed, shallow "one match per episode" format, now you expect me to care about Soma´s side story? Tough luck.

[KrayZ33]

The author of this show doesn't really cook. Or gave up the pride of being able to. Some recipes just don't need gimmicks, like Buff said. It's like saying a margherita pizza would be enhanced by adding shit on top of it.


It makes sense though, these kids aren't learning how to cook using recipes, everyone of them can cook already, they are supposed to learn and show how to create own recipes.
They might as well not be there otherwise, even if they are able to make the best margherita in the world, if they don't add anything to it, the difference in taste will be marginally better/worse.
They are basically trying to get a doctor title in cooking, you don't do that by doing "science" that has already been done.

[neflight86]

I've always been slightly puzzled by just how much scrutiny Shokugeki gets about cooking around these parts. It's almost like people are offended by how 'gourmet' cooking is portrayed in an over the top anime.

Is the problem that the show presents itself seriously? As a work of fiction (in this medium), it can't afford to be too mundane. This is plainly a shounen battle anime who's setting happens to be the creation and evaluation of foodstuffs. I don't know how it could be done any differently, for its audience, and remain true to the tone established at the beginning of the first season. Set pieces, exciting climaxes, and snobby smack-talk are hallmarks of the genre, and here have constant complaints about their use!

We have't been pirates. Or ninjas. Or hunters. But we have cooked in our lives, so we suddenly expect an exacting recreation of that? It just seems like a reaching thing to complain about. On the other hand, there hasn't been much else to discuss since this season started, due to the fast pace and pitched battle format.

[shinta|hikari]

The problem is this isn't supernatural. All the other examples you gave have magical fruits, chakra, or nen. Shokugeki has... food science. If they go that far pretending to be realistic, then at least man up to it. Sometimes simpler things are simply better.

The first season was relatively better because the recipes made sense. Now, they are just piling gimmicks on top of gimmicks, and if you actually cook the recipe, it'll be an utter mess, or irrelevant because most of the twists done aren't detectable by the human tongue. God's tongue ftw.

EDIT:
I'm not saying Shokugeki is terrible or anything. It's just personally annoying for me as someone who cooks and enjoys food a lot. It's like how Gate annoyed the shit out of Military Kraco, while I didn't know a damn thing about how choppers or jets worked.

[David75]

And they just plainly forgot the main ingredient of boeuf bourguignon last season: red wine.
They always emphasize how precision is important in cooking, which is true, but they also make huge mistakes and miss what's important at times.
But if the manga/anime help getting genius chefs 10 years from now, I'll be delighted IRL.

[Buffalobiian]

Episode 06

----------------------------











The bigger the asshole, the better the win feels.

Bring on the assholes.

[neflight86]

I loved how even the male tasters were in sailor uniforms at Yukiland!

[MFauli]

This episode was as unsatisfying and disappointing as I expected it to be. There was no proper reason why Yukihira should have won this match (ofc aside from him being the "hero").

1.) So what made HIM of all people so unpredictable? He told us a bunch of bullship, but nothing that couldn´t apply to thousands of other cooks, including the Aldini brothers.
2.) Maybe it´s my lacking understanding of the English language, but ... the dish was supposed to be a beef stew. A stew is a stew. What this twat did, was to add random ingredients on top of it, passing it off as "garniture", lol. Yeah, sure, I´ll also just put a lobster on top of it as "garniture" - got nothing to do with a beef stew, but it´s fancy and delicious, so I´ll win!

Yukihira won this match from a combination of inexplicably being unpredictable and breaking the rules (as far as I´m concerned). Good job. Not.

[shinta|hikari]

What's new? Cooking and judging in this show was and is bullshit lol.

Wanna watch real cooking? Flying Witch and Amaama to Inazuma.

[MFauli]

There´s bullshit and then there´s bullshit. This victory of Yukihira´s didn´t have the slightest hint as to why HE won this match.

[shinta|hikari]

Because his stew made men gayer.

[neflight86]

I believe all of the additional meats were cow-based, still, right? I figure that still counts as beef stew.

[Buffalobiian]

I believe all of the additional meats were cow-based, still, right? I figure that still counts as beef stew.

But he only stewed the ox-tail. That's what makes it an oxtail beef stew.

Pork garnish is readily acceptable because it's garnish and serves as an accent to the dish. Oxtail made up maybe 20% of Souma's dish. The rest of it is "beef cooked in a variety of manner then added to soup", even if they were all cow-based meats.

The judges were unhappy about that at first since it's barely a stew.

That said, he didn't actually have to make a stew. He just has to make something Western and amazing.

[shinta|hikari]

What soup? The oxtail is taken out of the soup/sauce when serving.

[Buffalobiian]

What's the hexagonal-looking piece of meat in the middle of their dishes?

Looks like oxtail to me.

[shinta|hikari]

It's taken out of the soup and served. The soup doesn't go into the dish. They explained that in the last episode when talking about garnishes and why they are so important (they're not).

[Buffalobiian]

So this broth/sauce isn't what the oxtail is cooked in?

http://i.imgur.com/oO99l0H.jpg

[shinta|hikari]

Actually, I got confused by the type of stew he was making, thinking it was more similar to nikujaga. The sauce DOES go into the dish. What doesn't go into the dish is everything else it was cooked with. So in your example image, those carrots would be strained out.

However, the stew doesn't have a soupy sauce. It'll be reduced to a thick consistency, and the garnishes are not mixed in it. Garnishes, by definition, are toppings or placed on the side, not mixed in the sauce. So the flavors they had during cooking are distinct from the stew, supposedly allowing for that amusement park effect. That I can actually understand as a very fun eating experience. It's just not stew, and those aren't garnishes anymore because they outweigh the main dish lol.

It sounds more like a beef platter. Actually, it would've made more sense for Souma to win that way. Mimasaka thinks he's making stew. Then Souma makes a completely new dish that isn't stew, but is western, with stew being only one part of it, making Mimasaka's dish the incomplete one in comparison. That's a better reason for winning than "I used my whole protagonist's life to make this dish."

[Munsu]

There´s bullshit and then there´s bullshit. This victory of Yukihira´s didn´t have the slightest hint as to why HE won this match.

He won the match because it tasted better and was superior. What other hint do you need?

[shinta|hikari]

I think it's because he was calling it a stew when it technically isn't anymore. It's like having a pasta competition and using pasta as a side dish with a giant steak as the main.

However, as Buff said, it's not a stew contest. It's a western dish contest. That said, the cooking techniques Souma used for the "garnishes" were pretty Japanese... So it's still not a perfect fit to the theme.

[MFauli]

He won the match because it tasted better and was superior. What other hint do you need?

You´re missing the point. Soma´s opponent was there because he´s known as the copy-monster. Stealing any cook´s cooking and improving upon it.

Soma won because he broke he either broke the rules, or because he was unpredictable because ... BECAUSE!

I actually had hoped Soma would just cook whatever he planned to and not do anything special, then winning, because "it tastes better", showing his pure cooking prowess. But that didn´t happen.

[neflight86]

I actually had hoped Soma would just cook whatever he planned to and not do anything special, then winning, because "it tastes better", showing his pure cooking prowess. But that didn´t happen.

From how they described it, I assumed that what happened was: copycat took Soma's recipe, and improved it with a simple twist. Soma took his recipe and added a lifetime worth of experimentations and revisions to improve it. I believe he mentioned it wasn't even done being revised until that morning. You could argue no amount of profiling could capture the entirety of a person's cooking theology if brought to bear (copycat always cornered his opponents with a baited shokugeki to narrow their thinking under the pressure and make predictions easier), or that his profiling simply didn't account for that facet of his personality, the calm under pressure no matter what.

I doubt I've convinced you, and it is the author's job to garner buy in from the audience, but I wanted to share that I feel there is 'enough' there to conclude a deserved win with what we were given.

[shinta|hikari]

Enough bullshit, definitely lol.

Basically, Souma overcame the copycat by breaking the rules of his copycat ability instead of going around it or thinking of something new/different. It's typical shounen, and last time I looked, this is shounen. Mimasaka summarized it best. "This guy went beyond my trace ability!"

I'm pretty sure most if not all the chefs Mimasaka battled put all their experience and skill to the fore considering the stakes. It'd be weird if no one else did what Souma allegedly did, which was, well, do his best.

[neflight86]

Actually, as copycat himself mentioned, most opponents panicked or even gave up "not producing a dish". Even Aldini's shokugeki demonstrated he was in a compromised state of mind with his and his brother's 'honor' on the line. People generally don't perform as well under pressure, and the pressure of being imitated (or even surpassed by that imitation) further compromises your abilities.

As an unrelated example: I play Street Fighter. The most stressful match I can be in is a mirror match, because both my opponent and I are working with the same toolset, and the winner simply better leveraged that toolset to his or her advantage. Excuses like 'that was a bad matchup for me' or 'I didn't know that character's mixups' don't work and as a player that loses in this scenario, you either choose to ignore the results or try to be objective and see where you made a mistake. That is 'back of the mind' terrifying to people with egos (like me), leading to poorer, reactionary play.

If anything, Soma's shounen power is his complete disregard of the weight of competition, and the weight of loss. Maybe this is the manifestation of a complete lack of pride?

[shinta|hikari]

Then the reason Souma won was simply because he managed to stay calm. The bullshit about pouring all your experience into a dish is an insult to every other chef Mimasaka has battled, including Aldini. It assumes they weren't doing their best. But that was the exact reason that was mentioned. Souma staying calm was just an afterthought that supposedly enabled him to do what he did.

I wrote an alternative explanation earlier:

It sounds more like a beef platter. Actually, it would've made more sense for Souma to win that way. Mimasaka thinks he's making stew. Then Souma makes a completely new dish that isn't stew, but is western, with stew being only one part of it, making Mimasaka's dish the incomplete one in comparison. That's a better reason for winning than "I used my whole protagonist's life to make this dish."

And the reason why I like it, aside from the fact that I wrote it, is that it combines the 2 patterns Mimasaka observed in his opponents. 1) They try to trick him. 2) They try to improvise.

This method is a combination of both. Mimasaka gets tricked because Souma decided to improvise using inspiration in the end. So Mimasaka completely read Souma's stew dish and exceeded it. What he failed to read was that Souma was looking at a much larger picture, with that stew dish just being a part of it. While Mimasaka was only looking at Souma's past and emulating it, Souma was looking at the vast future without pigeonholing himself.

It kinda is what this episode tried to do, but explained and delivered better. It's also a completely fitting end for a troll like Mimasaka.

But then again, this is shounen. Souma isn't supposed to be devious or smart enough for such a plan. He's supposed to power through impossible obstacles and befriend all his former enemies.

[Munsu]

Then the reason Souma won was simply because he managed to stay calm. The bullshit about pouring all your experience into a dish is an insult to every other chef Mimasaka has battled, including Aldini. It assumes they weren't doing their best. But that was the exact reason that was mentioned. Souma staying calm was just an afterthought that supposedly enabled him to do what he did.

I wrote an alternative explanation earlier:


And the reason why I like it, aside from the fact that I wrote it, is that it combines the 2 patterns Mimasaka observed in his opponents. 1) They try to trick him. 2) They try to improvise.

This method is a combination of both. Mimasaka gets tricked because Souma decided to improvise using inspiration in the end. So Mimasaka completely read Souma's stew dish and exceeded it. What he failed to read was that Souma was looking at a much larger picture, with that stew dish just being a part of it. While Mimasaka was only looking at Souma's past and emulating it, Souma was looking at the vast future without pigeonholing himself.

It kinda is what this episode tried to do, but explained and delivered better. It's also a completely fitting end for a troll like Mimasaka.

But then again, this is shounen. Souma isn't supposed to be devious or smart enough for such a plan. He's supposed to power through impossible obstacles and befriend all his former enemies.

I think you're mischaracterizing what Souma did vs. what the rest did. The rest came into the competition with a set recipe, yes the best version of it they had (or maybe what they were complacent with at the time) only to be one-upped by the opponent who did the same, but with a twist (one can assume that the twist was also tailored made to get the judges approval).

What Souma did was kept trying to surpass his previous recipes, while at the same time leaving no trace of what he was attempting. He said it himself, he created it in his head. More so, he was confident that his experience and all his gains and failures are not something Mimasaka was going to be able to duplicate. There was no info to gather.

So in the end, it was a new dish for him that only Souma knew about and since as prolific as Mimasaka's profiling may be, he was simply incapable of first guessing the exact dish Souma was going to do, and then secondly wasn't going to one-up it by adding his twist.

It's not that he put all his experiences and did his best (as opposed as to other opponents), the point was that this wasn't exactly improvised (though that point is still unclear all told, guess it depends on what one means by improv). It wasn't really a dish he come up with suddenly, it was a dish that his experiences built him towards. It was a dish that only existed for him and him alone, until now that the cat is out of the bag.

Call it bullshit or whatever, but the premise of this show is based on said bullshit... seems pointless to complain about this arbitrary way of competition 6 episodes into season 2.

But yeah, I also agree that the explanation failed as it were.

[shinta|hikari]

What Souma did was kept trying to surpass his previous recipes, while at the same time leaving no trace of what he was attempting.

This is literally what every chef should be doing in a cook off against Mimasaka. My point was this isn't anything special or impressive. That's why I said it's an insult to Aldini and the other beaten competitors if they aren't even considered to have given their best.

Basically, Souma is just plain better than everyone that was beaten before him, so he won. No tactics, no twists, nothing.

And to be clear, I've always been a critic of the shounen bullshit and culinary inaccuracies of this show, not just this time.

[Munsu]

This is literally what every chef should be doing in a cook off against Mimasaka. My point was this isn't anything special or impressive. That's why I said it's an insult to Aldini and the other beaten competitors if they aren't even considered to have given their best.

Basically, Souma is just plain better than everyone that was beaten before him, so he won. No tactics, no twists, nothing.

And to be clear, I've always been a critic of the shounen bullshit and culinary inaccuracies of this show, not just this time.

1. You're assuming the opponents were aware of Mimasaka and his style, Aldini was unaware of it.

2. Cooks can become complacent with a specific recipe, more so, additional "twists" for lack of better word to tailor make that specific recipe to the judges, which is Mimasaka did. They did their best because they were unaware that there was anywhere higher to go.

3. From the get go it's been a point of focus to show that Souma has more experience, wordly and proffesional experience, than just about anyone or most in this school. So putting all his experiences together on one dish will be vastly different to another's experience.

4. Main point though is that he left no trace of what he was attempting.

5. And yes, not everyone is capable of giving their best at any given moment. While I don't agree with your conclusion, insulting as it may be, yep, they very well might have not put the best what they had to offer. They're students and kids after all, and even if they weren't.

6. Also important to note, that was mentioned in the context of not why or how he made this great dish, but it was to explain why it wasn't "improv" and whatever that means.

[shinta|hikari]

1 - Trying to improve your best recipes applies to all match ups, not just Mimasaka, and in fact should be done by all chefs constantly. Take note, some recipes can in fact not be improved. Which is why I think Mimasaka's style is inherently bullshit, but I digress.

Also, I'm assuming at least some of the losers knew Mimasaka's style. So many people in the show apparently do.

2, 3, and 5 are basically elaborating on my point: Souma is just plain better than everyone who lost to Mimasaka, so he won. Souma constantly strives to improve, has more experience, and is always calm. He's better in all aspects!

4 is the 1st option of Mimasaka's opponents, as he said so himself. Pretend to do something else while hiding your Ace as much as possible. Everyone else still got traced, except Souma, even after Mimasaka got full coverage of his trials from the reporter.

My complaint was that Souma didn't win this match by tactics, seeing a weakness in Mimasaka's style, or turning Mimasaka's trace against him. He just bruteforced it with his sheer superiority over all those who lost. He was basically immune to trace just because he is that good.

Or everyone else just kinda sucks because they don't investigate the enemy, don't constantly improve themselves, don't have enough experience, and don't have the guts to stay calm in a contest.

However, Mimasaka actually recognized all those strong points that Souma possessed and still had full confidence in his trace. Why did his trace fail then? It all boils down to Souma doing 6. The "not improv but a product of experience" element is supposedly what put his stew above Mimasaka's trace.

6 is the truly bullshit part. It's either you made it up on the spot or you planned it beforehand. Calling it both and saying it's a sudden ejaculation of accumulated experience is bullshit.

Souma basically said, "I improvised, but my improv is different from the improv of everyone else who tried it against you because I've got experience (that Aldini also had but meh) and mad skillz. Your trace deserved no countermeasure because I can beat it by being myself."

The problem with this conclusion is that the trace ability was built up in such a way that it was a perfect copy of the recipe with an additional twist. It has never failed before despite everyone else's attempts to counter it. But Souma beats it without even doing anything to directly address it. He beat it by being his bad ass self, but it was explained in such a way as if he had actually done something special for that match. He didn't.

It's like watching a shounen fighting series, have an enemy that can copy moves perfectly plus more, and then having that enemy beaten by the main character just because the main character is stronger and faster. What was the point of introducing the copy element?

[MFauli]

Great posting, shinta, fully agreed.

I´d only question the fighting shounen comparison. There it actually makes sense that simply copying moves isn´t enough, if you´re lacking the experience, physical strength and speed to execute these moves. See Kuririn doing his first kamehameha. Sure he was able to do a kamehameha. But it was laughable.

[Munsu]

1 - Trying to improve your best recipes applies to all match ups, not just Mimasaka, and in fact should be done by all chefs constantly. Take note, some recipes can in fact not be improved. Which is why I think Mimasaka's style is inherently bullshit, but I digress.

Also, I'm assuming at least some of the losers knew Mimasaka's style. So many people in the show apparently do.

2, 3, and 5 are basically elaborating on my point: Souma is just plain better than everyone who lost to Mimasaka, so he won. Souma constantly strives to improve, has more experience, and is always calm. He's better in all aspects!

4 is the 1st option of Mimasaka's opponents, as he said so himself. Pretend to do something else while hiding your Ace as much as possible. Everyone else still got traced, except Souma, even after Mimasaka got full coverage of his trials from the reporter.

My complaint was that Souma didn't win this match by tactics, seeing a weakness in Mimasaka's style, or turning Mimasaka's trace against him. He just bruteforced it with his sheer superiority over all those who lost. He was basically immune to trace just because he is that good.

Or everyone else just kinda sucks because they don't investigate the enemy, don't constantly improve themselves, don't have enough experience, and don't have the guts to stay calm in a contest.

However, Mimasaka actually recognized all those strong points that Souma possessed and still had full confidence in his trace. Why did his trace fail then? It all boils down to Souma doing 6. The "not improv but a product of experience" element is supposedly what put his stew above Mimasaka's trace.

6 is the truly bullshit part. It's either you made it up on the spot or you planned it beforehand. Calling it both and saying it's a sudden ejaculation of accumulated experience is bullshit.

Souma basically said, "I improvised, but my improv is different from the improv of everyone else who tried it against you because I've got experience (that Aldini also had but meh) and mad skillz. Your trace deserved no countermeasure because I can beat it by being myself."

The problem with this conclusion is that the trace ability was built up in such a way that it was a perfect copy of the recipe with an additional twist. It has never failed before despite everyone else's attempts to counter it. But Souma beats it without even doing anything to directly address it. He beat it by being his bad ass self, but it was explained in such a way as if he had actually done something special for that match. He didn't.

It's like watching a shounen fighting series, have an enemy that can copy moves perfectly plus more, and then having that enemy beaten by the main character just because the main character is stronger and faster. What was the point of introducing the copy element?

Damn, what a lot of words for a series we really don't care all that much for. So, I'll be succinct about it, since I agree with what you're saying in many regards.

All I took exception was to the statement concluding that what Souma did was 1) Simply try his best, and that would've been enough to beat Mimasaka, and that being so 2) That it's an insult to previous opponents because apparently it would mean they didn't try their best.

None of what you say contradicts/invalidates my observations of why that statement is flawed and the conclusion that accompanies it, and why there's no reason to take exception about it.

As for your last paragraph, that's a false comparison. More accurate to say that after the hero KNOWS he's going to face an enemy that can copy his moves, he focuses in developing a move that will kill his enemy in one shot (taking steps there's no way that the enemy will be able to see it prior to the fight). Yes, it'll take all his experiences and talent to come up with that move, and not just anyone can do it, but it is what it is. And it says no less about the previous opponents, whether they gave their best or not.

The point of introducing that element it's because it's a difficult enemy to beat, not everyone can do it. And two, it simply pushes our hero to reach heights he didn't imagine before.

All else simply ignores the nature of competition and how it pushes and motivates people.

And yeah, I wrote a shittier longer post that I intended, but whatever.

[shinta|hikari]

The fighting shounen comparison was made from the creator's perspective. Why introduce a copy move if you aren't gonna beat that move with something new or a counter? If you're just gonna have the hero do the same thing as always, then don't build that aspect up. When an author adds an element to a story, it has to have a purpose. An overly dramatized and complicated "trace" move has to be countered. If not, it would be completely under utilized. That is what happened in this episode.

Going back to numbers:
1) Souma really did just try his best. And that beat Mimasaka. Tell me, what new thing did he do this round that he didn't do in any other round? Do improv? But that DOESN'T WORK on Mimasaka! But apparently it does, if it's Souma.

2) It is an insult to all the previous opponents of Mimasaka because that means they suck. It's not because the trace skill is awesome. It's just because they were too low level to defeat a crappy skill that Souma beat without even preparing for it specifically. The "they didn't try hard enough" part was limited to your comment that they got lax on recipes or didn't hide their plan properly (unlike Souma who kept it in his head, god knows everyone wrote their recipe on a sheet of paper and left it somewhere unguarded). Of course they tried. Why would you assume they didn't? They aren't dead beats. They are people with ambitions.

Unfortunately, they just weren't the protagonist.

[Buffalobiian]

The "they didn't try hard enough" part was limited to your comment that they got lax on recipes or didn't hide their plan properly (unlike Souma who kept it in his head, god knows everyone wrote their recipe on a sheet of paper and left it somewhere unguarded).

It's not that they leave it unguarded, but that they would have trialed it in person first instead of giving the judges the very first time they've made a dish.

I'm pretty much in agreement with shinta's post here (https://www.gotwoot.org/showthread.php/23198-Shokugeki-no-Soma/page12?p=557654#post557654), as well as Bud's post here (https://www.gotwoot.org/showthread.php/23198-Shokugeki-no-Soma?p=557665&viewfull=1#post557665)

The entire premise of the battle is that:

1) In order to perfect something, you have to physically practice it (and Mimasaka would profile it)
2) In order to avoid profiling you have to improvise (and it would be inferior to anthing Mimasaka has prepared - see "brine was used for 5 days" segment)

Mimasaka is so good at profiling that no one tricks him. If you come up with something randomly, it will never be as great, even if it's good. (that was his prediction of Souma's dish)

Souma won because he broke both rules: That you can pull a dish first-go and have it surpass anything you've physically created before.



------------

Mimasaka is actually small fry. All of his previous opponents were either small-fry who knew about Copy but could never beat it, or were good chefs that weren't prepared to counter Copy (like Aldini).

Souma beat Mimasaka by thinking "What do I have that his copy can never replicate: 16 years of experience". (Shinta explains that the reason why Souma could do this while no one else could, is due to protagonist power. His argument is that improvisation should always be like this. )

Aldini may not have lost to Souma in experience, but he definitely lost by not being prepared for Copy. He didn't have a bunch of meats/ingredients at his disposal.

[shinta|hikari]

Souma beat Mimasaka by thinking "What do I have that his copy can never replicate: 16 years of experience". (Shinta explains that the reason why Souma could do this while no one else could, is due to protagonist power. His argument is that improvisation should always be like this. )

Not exactly. My argument is that when in a shokugeki with valuable tools on the line, you will pour everything you have into the match, which includes your X years of experience, improv or not. Souma won because he had more experience, like always. That's his thing, right? Winning because you're simply that good actually does make sense. That's not the problem. Well, it is a problem because it is kinda anti-climactic, but see below.

This is where I take issue: Why even introduce a complicated copy skill for the enemy? Souma just shrugged it off without doing anything special. Souma always makes something using his everything (albeit limited by the rules), including experience, knowledge, and inspiration. That's what he did here.

Complicated skills are introduced to be countered. While there are exceptions, like having a protagonist so bad ass that he'll say you are so small fry it didn't matter, coating it with bullshit like experience ejaculation doesn't help.

Also, Aldini knew about the copy ability when he did his own improv using the olive oil, which Mimasaka knew about through stalking. Souma knew about the copy ability and brought various meats to the match, which Mimasaka ALSO knew about, yet Mimasaka was still darn confident it wouldn't beat his time-consuming bacon. But it did.

[Buffalobiian]

Aldini had the oil on him, but he didn't bring it as an extra specifically in to counter Mimasaka. Souma prepared extra things to improvise with.

He won by saying 'you can't copy EVERYTHING' I know and cooked each and everything bit of meat he had.

Aldini didn't have that option even if he tried - because he didn't prepare each and every ingredient for this counter. His last-ditch effort was largely decided by what he had at hand.

[Munsu]

Not exactly. My argument is that when in a shokugeki with valuable tools on the line, you will pour everything you have into the match, which includes your X years of experience, improv or not. Souma won because he had more experience, like always. That's his thing, right? Winning because you're simply that good actually does make sense. That's not the problem. Well, it is a problem because it is kinda anti-climactic, but see below.

This is where I take issue: Why even introduce a complicated copy skill for the enemy? Souma just shrugged it off without doing anything special. Souma always makes something using his everything (albeit limited by the rules), including experience, knowledge, and inspiration. That's what he did here.

Complicated skills are introduced to be countered. While there are exceptions, like having a protagonist so bad ass that he'll say you are so small fry it didn't matter, coating it with bullshit like experience ejaculation doesn't help.

Also, Aldini knew about the copy ability when he did his own improv using the olive oil, which Mimasaka knew about through stalking. Souma knew about the copy ability and brought various meats to the match, which Mimasaka ALSO knew about, yet Mimasaka was still darn confident it wouldn't beat his time-consuming bacon. But it did.

Again, you're reducing what Souma did to simply "all he did was use his experience, knowledge, inspiration" as if that was all he did. That's a false premise.

Secondly, you're providing another false comparison with of Aldini's scenario against Mimasaka vs. Souma's scenario. It was completely different.

You're using a lot of wrong assumptions about the whole thing, that your conclusions simply don't hold up.

For example, had Souma not known that Mimasaka was a copy master, he would've lost... though plot shield might've prevented it, but logically, considering how things work in this world, he would've lost.

He had preparation in his favor, vast experience, and ability/skills to pull off a new dish (without practicing, though technically practicing versions of it throughout his lifetime).

So yes, ability, experience, knowledge, etc., etc., were a big part of it, but that's not ALL he brought to the table, and reducing it to just that, and then champion the idea that it somehow means that it's an insult to previous opponents is silly honestly.

[shinta|hikari]

So what exactly did he do different from what he usually does? Do improv? Then what exactly did he do different from all the defeated opponents who did improv?

My main argument is Souma didn't do anything to target the copy move. That's not unbelievable at all. People win just because they are better, that's fact. My gripe is Mimasaka's copy move didn't get countered directly, just overwhelmed by lots of other factors (most of them deriving from the fact that Souma is the protagonist and is therefore that good), making the introduction and build up (that trace was an unbeatable move by concept) of the skill a waste of time. It was a plot element that was severely underused in Souma's win.

Aldini also tapped into his experience when he did his improv, but he came way behind the trace dish, losing unanimously. Having more time to "prepare" doesn't matter in improv. That's the whole point of improv, you don't plan it and depend on inspiration and skill at the time (and yes, that includes your X years of experience. I mean, why the hell not?). Does that mean Aldini is just that inferior to Souma, who won unanimously?

If you're saying Souma's dish isn't improv, that's incorrect. He was clearly winging it when he was cooking those beef parts. He even said he was lucky he had that old fashioned grill with him. So cooking those beef parts in those ways was something he came up with on the fly, just like how Aldini came up with using olive oil on the fly. I think the comparison holds up pretty well.

Now if you're saying that Mimasaka wasn't able to predict how Souma planned to pull the whole dish together, then that makes the least sense. Because why? Why wouldn't Mimasaka predict that final dish? He knew about the oxtail stew, knew about Souma's past, knew about the beef parts, and even knew that they were gonna be used as garnish. He even prepared a targeted counter, a time-consuming bacon garnish. Why did Mimasaka think he would win until the judges started tasting Souma's dish..? Why was Souma's dish so different and unpredictable from everyone else's Mimasaka defeated?

He's the protagonist, that's why.

[Munsu]

So what exactly did he do different from what he usually does? What exactly did he do different from all the defeated opponents who did improv?

My main argument is Souma didn't do anything to target the copy move. That's not unbelievable at all. People win just because they are better, that's fact. My gripe is Mimasaka's copy move didn't get countered directly, just overwhelmed by lots of other factors, making the introduction and build up (that it was an unbeatable move by concept) of the skill a waste of time. It was a plot element that was severely underused in Souma's win.

Aside from the new dish he had to come up with without practicing it in a competition where your opponents have ample time to do so and perfect what they're doing?

Not sure why you have problem accepting that Souma managed to produce a new dish without practicing + coming prepared to the competition for any audibles he might need to employ as not a direct counter to Mimasaka.

You also work under the assumption that without Mimasaka there to challenge and push him that Souma would've managed to produce a dish this good (whatever that is in the context of this anime) vs. potentially a more pedestrian dish, that might've still been very good, but not this good. That's the nature of competition, it motivates. Growing as a cook is part of the point, not merely beating his opponent.

Your conclusions also seem to be assuming that Souma would've beaten Mimasaka even if he hadn't known of his copy strategy, since of course he would've used his full experience anyways... that'd would be false as well.

[shinta|hikari]

I'm pretty sure Souma would've beaten Mimasaka without knowing his copy ability. Why? He's the protagonist.

Kidding aside, you didn't answer this question: "What exactly did he do different from all the defeated opponents who did improv?"

And I think you missed this edit:

"Now if you're saying that Mimasaka wasn't able to predict how Souma planned to pull the whole dish together, then that makes the least sense. Because why? Why wouldn't Mimasaka predict that final dish? He knew about the oxtail stew, knew about Souma's past, knew about the beef parts, and even knew that they were gonna be used as garnish. He even prepared a targeted counter, a time-consuming bacon garnish. Why did Mimasaka think he would win until the judges started tasting Souma's dish..? Why was Souma's dish so different and unpredictable from everyone else's Mimasaka defeated?

He's the protagonist, that's why."

Now if you're saying that Souma evolved past anything Mimasaka could predict, that's actually supporting my point. Why did everyone else fail to do that, including Aldini? Weren't they motivated enough to defeat Mimasaka, despite having their beloved tools on the line? What makes Souma so different?

Again, plot armor.

Like I've said 3x now, this conclusion isn't unbelievable per se. It is just extremely unsatisfying.The trace ability deserved better treatment. Heck, I came up with a more reasonable way of beating it on the fly. Improv ftw.