Aldnoah.Zero

[Buffalobiian]

http://i.imgur.com/BGzpNhl.jpg

Genres: science fiction
Themes: mecha

Plot Summary: In 1972, the Apollo 17 mission discovered a hypergate to Mars on the surface of the moon. Soon a war breaks out between Earth and Mars, and Martian soldiers begin to descend from the sky, riding steel giants, intent on exterminating humanity. -ANN

Links: ANN (http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/encyclopedia/anime.php?id=16028), AniDB (http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=anime&aid=10445), MAL (http://myanimelist.net/anime/22729/)

DL: HS - Episode 01 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=571571)

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Well that was decent enough a start. I'll be in on this to see what it can deliver. Best thing so far is that Sawano Hiroyuki (Attack on Titan, Kill la Kill) is doing the score.

Urobuchi Gen is the creator, but given how normal some of his endings have been I'm not holding my breath here. Expect a twist somewhere.

[David75]

I guess the Princess had at least 2 "immortal" flags... Her power she herited from her lineage and the talisman she got from Slaine, the terran scum. I guess that thing is a key to a technology that will reunite all human beings.
I do not think that show has that much potential.

One thing I wondered, those ships have a meteor like landing. Given their mass and speed, it's only natural the cinetic energy explodes like a Nuke. I just wonder why if they got acceleration dampeners that can absorb those levels of deceleration for such large ships, they can't use it for a smooth landing. But I guess that kind of landing is efficient as a prelude to a full scale attack.

[MFauli]

Ah, just read the OP, so it really was a Sawano-song at the end. Sounded so much like Attack on Titan :D

However, the actual anime is rather medicore as of now. Generic artstyle and slow setup. The aliens, while powerful, don´t look very threatening. Guess because they´re just humans, too.

Will give it another episode.

[KrayZ33]

MFauli, what the hell?


the actual anime is rather medicore as of now. Generic artstyle and slow setup

don't know what to make out of "generic artstyle", feels like an empty comment, since this doesn't look like most shows and both animation and visuals were *very* well done, but a slow setup? why?


he aliens, while powerful, don´t look very threatening. Guess because they´re just humans, too.


Tha-... B-... Huuuuh...
Ya, you are right, its perfectly reasonable and unimpressive to crash a space battleship in the middle of a heavily-populated urban area to trigger an explosion that would label the "Zar" as a mere firecracker, what am I thinking!
however, since the military guys were like "yeah, well war it is then..." I guess you are right. They must have something that is able to fight them on equal ground after all, it would explain why there was a "cease-fire".


as for my thoughts on this show so far
I don't really understand why there was a "cease-fire" and why they attacked Earth in the first place.
"they've been fighting a war up there in the wreckage of the moon, a war to live"
It sounds as if something happened to Mars when the Hypergate exploded.
Did anyone notice that the "war" didn't even last a whole year before they agreed on a cease-fire?
And why did they fight on the Moon? It certainly doesn't look like Earth has the ability to produce Spaceships that are able to compete with the invaders.



the Mecha/Pilot introductions @ 20:15 were freaking epic btw

[MasterOfMoogles]

The only problem I have with this show is the exposition overload.
Like, they had radio/tv on in the background numerous times trying to get in the various plot elements and setup, and I still honestly have no idea what is going on.
So, after we landed on the moon we got a portal to Mars or something? Then 30 years later the people who colonized Mars decided to revolt? Who the heck are these people anyways?
So confused... but I liked the first episode regardless.

[animus]

Episode was cool and all, but I hate this way of telling story. Instead of telling this backstory right smack at the beginning of the series by some dude simply sitting there talking to someone and just straight up saying it, it would've better to have been demonstrated and shown throughout. Show not tell.

[lelouch]

I think my thoughts are in line with a lot of other peoples' here. Even though the show seems well designed and has a decent enough plot, idk there's just something about it that doesn't get me hooked and makes me think it will be disappointing. Maybe it's the way the story was told, or the lack of a clear protagonist. I expect to drop it by episode 3 if things don't pick up.

[shinta|hikari]

This is created by Urobutcher, so I am keeping my hopes up. His stories usually only get better as they go along.

[Archangel]

Lol, Urobochi always hires the same people for the music.

Anyway i'm getting Guilty Crown flashbacks from this, will probably be bad.

[Ryllharu]

Anyway i'm getting Guilty Crown flashbacks from this, will probably be bad.
Eh?

It's very clearly more of a Gundam/CodeGeass vibe to it, but with a bit more of the Gunbuster/MuvLuv-style "Let's Teach High School Students to Pilot Mecha so They'll Meet an Untimely Death When Forced to Fight." With maybe a bit of Valvrave mixed in just because itrecent. It seems to be a fairly open secret that Earth trains students to pilot mechs in preparation for breaking the armistice. The flamboyant authoritative behavior of the enemy "nobility" is flat-out Gundam.

I'm not really getting the Guilty Crown vibes except for realistically fleshed out characters (we'll see if they are squandered through terrible clichés) and the initial interactions between the girls and the main character. I only think about it because you bring it up.

---

The Princess is very plainly a Deianeira (http://anidb.net/perl-bin/animedb.pl?show=character&charid=40)-type. That makes her very dull as far as I'm concerned. Having some sort of special powers (being able to activate the Aldnoah) combined with being so kind-hearted, selfless, and naïve that she basically has no personality. Ugh. I really hate that character archetype. She obviously survived by summoning the Aldnoah itself that was alluded to multiple times this episode.

In general, I'm very annoyed by the talk of "even though we're descended from Earthlings, no matter how long it may seem..."
- Apollo 17: 1972
- Moon gets blown up: 1999
- Series takes place in: 2014
40 years is not a long time. That's two, maybe three generations. Are you fucking kidding me? For a little perspective, Korean families are still participating in the reunions the North and South occasionally allows. It's been 60 years since the Korean War ended.

Honestly, I'm getting more of a Mars Daybreak vibe from it than anything, and that doesn't fit this story introduction even remotely. That is, does some neat things but is generally forgettable.


Things I very much liked:
- Sayaka Ohara ♥ playing the sister.
- Nina's (the blonde school friend) hairstyle, normal as it may be.
- I guess false flag attacks are at least interesting, due to rarity in anime.
- The fact that the MC was like, "Let's get out of here, I just saw a missile," while being completely calm about it. That was pretty badass. He's a nonchalant dude in general, but he went all icy-veined when he saw the missile.
- Kinetic orbital bombardment weapons are pretty cool, castles with super special techno-magic inertial dampers or not.


edit:
That was a stunningly bad Kalafina song. It's even worse than the horrifically generic and bland Kuroshitsuji II ED. It sounded like both Kajiura Yuki and the three vocalists completely phoned it in.

[KrayZ33]

MC reached maximum autism in ep2.


In general, I'm very annoyed by the talk of "even though we're descended from Earthlings, no matter how long it may seem..."

I totally agree, its quite possible that most of their *fathers* were, or even are, terrans.

The "defense" of the Earthforces was even weaker than expected, how did they manage to fight them on the moon? What kind of brainwashing made them believe they could stand against them.

I expect Gundams to show up next episode, otherwise.. I don't know, nothing would make sense
they could've done some "reverse engineering" to create them...meh

[David75]

Yes, Marsians are way to advanced technologically for the Terrans to even hope of opposing them.
It might be that Marsians found all of those toys after the war.

An armor that desintegrates anything that touches it... thought about it long ago, I wonder if that one can convert the matter directly into usable energy tough. For some reason, it seems that power is limited to a maximum volume per second of matter disintegration, explaining why he didn't want to use it to follow the vehicule into the underground tunnel.

Of course, that weapon was used on people. It should deal some psychological damage to people witnessing someone dying that way. But it seems that teenager kept his stoïc face for some reason.

[Ryllharu]

The "defense" of the Earthforces was even weaker than expected, how did they manage to fight them on the moon? What kind of brainwashing made them believe they could stand against them.

This they did cover, through the alcoholic guy. Everyone on Earth was lied to. The Martians curbstompped Earth's military with probably just a single Cataphract. It was likely over in an instant. Then the Earth governments covered it up, and the alcoholic was made to look like a cowardly idiot who ran from battle rather than one of the very few survivors.

Not knowing how ridiculously badly they were defeated, the remaining forces deluded themselves into thinking they were being sneaky about rebuilding their military. In all likelihood, the Martians have known the entire time they were rebuilding and training and didn't give a shit.

It's not like infiltrating is particularly hard...

[lelouch]

Eh?
It's very clearly more of a Gundam/CodeGeass vibe to it

I gave this series another chance solely because you said that, and now I hate you forever because it certainly doesn't have a Code Geass vibe to it and you got my hopes up. Definitely agree with the Gundam/Valvrave twist though. I'll give it a few more episodes, I think it will pick up.

[Buffalobiian]

He did say that the Martians were fighting for their lives on the moon though. Perhaps securing the warp gate on the moon (or rebuilding it?) was crucial to their survival somehow. It may be their only link with Mars (resource or otherwise).

As for the armour, it had two modes: walk through things and keep it intact or walk through things and disintegrate them. Inaho made a pretty good, albeit lucky call there based on what he saw.

[lelouch]

This they did cover, through the alcoholic guy. Everyone on Earth was lied to. The Martians curbstompped Earth's military with probably just a single Cataphract. It was likely over in an instant. Then the Earth governments covered it up, and the alcoholic was made to look like a cowardly idiot who ran from battle rather than one of the very few survivors.

Not knowing how ridiculously badly they were defeated, the remaining forces deluded themselves into thinking they were being sneaky about rebuilding their military. In all likelihood, the Martians have known the entire time they were rebuilding and training and didn't give a shit.

I have no idea how you caught this. I did not realize this AT ALL. Are other people in my shoes too or is it just because I watched both episodes high as shit.

[KrayZ33]

This they did cover, through the alcoholic guy. Everyone on Earth was lied to. The Martians curbstompped Earth's military with probably just a single Cataphract. It was likely over in an instant.

But then I can't explain what made them sign a peace treaty, sure, the hypergate exploded - but why? Earths technology isn't that advanced, the mechs were created after the first war if I'm not mistaken. So how did they even send military forces to the moon... on top of that, they must have managed to pass all the martian fortifications orbiting around earth (Knight-castles)

[Ryllharu]

I gave this series another chance solely because you said that, and now I hate you forever because it certainly doesn't have a Code Geass vibe to it and you got my hopes up.
Uhh...it absolutely does have many of the same elements in its setting.

Slaine = Suzaku
Cold and calculating protagonist (too soon to say) = cold and calculating protagonist who gets emotional
Princess = Euphemia (and probably CC as well)
Scheming corrupt nobles = scheming corrupt nobles
Martians = Brittania (and their corresponding overwhelming power by comparison)
Earth = Area 11
Cruhteo = [redacted!] (converting him to their side is the endgame, doesn't look like he's in on the conspiracy)
etc.

The general political setting shares the same with basically every Gundam series ever, which Geass copied as well. That's why I said Gundam/Geass.

[Xelbair]

Yes, Marsians are way to advanced technologically for the Terrans to even hope of opposing them.
It might be that Marsians found all of those toys after the war.

They've adapted the tech found on mars - i recall something like that being implied.


An armor that desintegrates anything that touches it... thought about it long ago, I wonder if that one can convert the matter directly into usable energy tough. For some reason, it seems that power is limited to a maximum volume per second of matter disintegration, explaining why he didn't want to use it to follow the vehicule into the underground tunnel.


I would rather say that even if he was disintegrating the tunnel, he wouldn't be able to visually track them.



Of course, that weapon was used on people. It should deal some psychological damage to people witnessing someone dying that way. But it seems that teenager kept his stoïc face for some reason.

He was clearly in shock, at least that's what i think.




Enemies are clearly based on Clans from Battletech.
Superior technology, better training, and only thing that can make them lose is their arrogance and esp 'do not retreat from lesser threats' mentality... where everyone else is a lesser threat.





This they did cover, through the alcoholic guy. Everyone on Earth was lied to. The Martians curbstompped Earth's military with probably just a single Cataphract. It was likely over in an instant. Then the Earth governments covered it up, and the alcoholic was made to look like a cowardly idiot who ran from battle rather than one of the very few survivors.

Not knowing how ridiculously badly they were defeated, the remaining forces deluded themselves into thinking they were being sneaky about rebuilding their military. In all likelihood, the Martians have known the entire time they were rebuilding and training and didn't give a shit.

It's not like infiltrating is particularly hard...

Well yeah, it was clearly shown in the flashbacks.

[KrayZ33]

They've adapted the tech found on mars - i recall something like that being implied.

But did they manage to adapt the technology before - or after the first war?

If before (which is what I believe happened):
Why didn't the Martians win the war?

It sounds and looks like all of the flying castles were in earth's orbit for the last 15 years, why exactly do they need a Casus Belli in the first place

If after:
Why did they even go to war against Earth back then? they are (most likely) a relatively small colony compared to Earth's population and depend on its ressources and manpower etc.

[lelouch]

Uhh...it absolutely does have many of the same elements in its setting.

Slaine = Suzaku
Cold and calculating protagonist (too soon to say) = cold and calculating protagonist who gets emotional
Princess = Euphemia (and probably CC as well)
Scheming corrupt nobles = scheming corrupt nobles
Martians = Brittania (and their corresponding overwhelming power by comparison)
Earth = Area 11
Cruhteo = [redacted!] (converting him to their side is the endgame, doesn't look like he's in on the conspiracy)
etc.

The general political setting shares the same with basically every Gundam series ever, which Geass copied as well. That's why I said Gundam/Geass.

Shit you might be right!! It will all depend on how calculating the protagonist is. Currently neither of the two possible choices have spoken enough to show. I think there's the possibility though the Earth forces protoganist (I forget his name, the one who encountered the princess under the bridge) seems more emotionless and smart rather than passionate and calculating. but we'll see

[shinta|hikari]

The gigantic difference between this and Code Geass is that the MC does not seem like an anti hero. That is huge because a huge chunk of plot and characterization in Code Geass is based on the fact that Lelouch is one.

[lelouch]

The gigantic difference between this and Code Geass is that the MC does not seem like an anti hero. That is huge because a huge chunk of plot and characterization in Code Geass is based on the fact that Lelouch is one.

This.

Which is why I'm saying we'll have to wait and see. The show is starting up a lot slower than CG, so we don't yet know much about the main characters.

[Buffalobiian]

But did they manage to adapt the technology before - or after the first war?

If before (which is what I believe happened):
Why didn't the Martians win the war?

It sounds and looks like all of the flying castles were in earth's orbit for the last 15 years, why exactly do they need a Casus Belli in the first place

If after:
Why did they even go to war against Earth back then? they are (most likely) a relatively small colony compared to Earth's population and depend on its resources and manpower etc.

They had the super strong technology before the war, and they could have won it had it not been for something that happened on the moon that made them fight for their survival until recently. Now they used the princess's death to legitimize their decent onto Earth instead of unilaterally breaking 15 years of peace.

That's my take on things.

[Ryllharu]

My post got eaten by an accidentally closed tab, so this is all I'm gonna post instead.

[HorribleSubs] Aldnoah.Zero - 03 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=577149)


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[07:43] <%Ryllharu> Okay, I like Aldnoah Zero.
[07:44] <%Ryllharu> Protagonist is one of cold rage, almost sociopathic.
[07:44] <%Ryllharu> And the Princess doesn't totally suck.
[07:45] <%Ryllharu> It's kind of nice that it is basically a martian civil war [that's fought on earth] rather than earth vs mars.

[David75]

Achilles' heel was necessary.
But it wasn't that complicated either, although the strategy and thinking were nice.
That barrier sure is incredible to be able to disintegrate what must be a huge volume of water. That represents huge levels of energy that goes somewhere we don't know yet, and might no be explained.
For a civilization with technological levels as such, having very large surfaces of the barrier open is a tad unbelievable.
After all, if you can create such devices, it's probable that the average technical level is high enough in your population to think about such weakness.
Moreover, they have laser coms. It's not unthinkable to have multiple holes the size of a needle head that move/open-close around the barrier, making it impossible to do what our MC did. But in the end he had to win, so it's ok I guess.

[shinta|hikari]

They could afford having holes that big in the armor because no one is smart enough to be able to identify that hole, immobilize the Cataphract, ambush it from behind, then stick a knife in it.

That is, until Inaho came along.

[David75]

Sure, in a lower civilization environment.
But where that cataphract came from, this is too huge a weakness, compared to the awesomeness of the barrier. Just my opinion

[Ryllharu]

They could afford having holes that big in the armor because no one is smart enough to be able to identify that hole, immobilize the Cataphract, ambush it from behind, then stick a knife in it.

That is, until Inaho came along.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say being smart enough isn't the reason Inaho was the first to figure it out. Not being killed right away, and by luck making their way to a tunnel is why he figured it out. The rest of the military died almost immediately, with very few survivors. The daughter of the moles/agent provocateurs survived by luck alone as well.

Don't forget there was a fair amount of testing involved from he and his friends. They systematically determined why it hadn't found them yet, and exactly what their drone could and could not see. The drone is the reason they figured out what the field did, and where the holes are.

Cold, analytical, and friends with various skills. Genius? Not so much.



I think the real question about the conflict in general, is why the Martians are still surrounding Earth, and were looking for pretty much any excuse to come down. They were the ones that stopped the last war, Earth didn't do anything to stop them according to the drunk teacher.

My guess is that Mars isn't quite as habitable as their technological advancement would lead us to believe. Perhaps the Royal Family and their loyalists want to stay on Mars despite the challenges they face and make peace with Earth so they can visit, where the other side wants to conquer Earth and enjoy the benefits of their overwhelming technology on a planet that doesn't suck.

The Princess herself is no slouch with her transformation Clarke techno-magic, so who knows, there might be even more to it than that.

[NeoCybercoin]

Im surprised with their overwhelming technology that they don't have global terraforming tech. Then again we haven't seen what's going on on Mars at the moment.

[shinta|hikari]

Cold, analytical, and friends with various skills. Genius? Not so much.

His quick thinking, decisions and plans so far scream genius to me. Not anime nonsensical genius (thing NGNL), but proper really intelligent believable genius.

[MFauli]

just saw episode 2. absolutely hate the main character´s lack of emotion. Makes no sense here. Fuck off, dude. Give me someone who cares about his buddies, like Eren.

However, the Kataphrakt was nice. Gave me a genuine feel of desperation there when this thing´s mere touch would desintegrate anything and everything.

Also: Hiroyuki Sawano´s music would make anything epic. Someone should remix the music for the new Sailor Moon-anime for the lulz.

[shinta|hikari]

I think he cares. He even went to stop the Cataphract because his friend was killed. He just cannot show emotion on his face for some reason. I'll admit I am not a fan of it in this specific case because he feels way too robotic, but it isn't a big issue.

[MFauli]

Aaand episode 3 watched. I agree with some here that it´s almost inexcusable to habe such big energy gaps in this awesome Aldnoah-field. "Holes" the size of a needle should indeed be enough to let through radio signals.

I also don´t find the hero to be that smart. Yeah, it´s played up that way here, but really, what he did was the one obvious plan: Enemy has a shield that destroys anything by touch. Solution? Well, its foot soles cant be covered by the shield, otherwise it´d fall into the ground. Going from there, it wasn´t a huge stretch to think the enemy gets his visuals from somewhere else - although it was luck that he really depended on top down-cameras. With their advanced alien technology, the cameras could have easily been flying all over the place, giving him a near-life like front vision. Had that been the case, the heroes would have run to their sure death.

[shinta|hikari]

I think it is simply a matter of degree when it comes to expanding the vision or protection for this particular Cataphract. It was working fine before, and was likely unrivaled by its enemies, so they simply didn't see the need to make it even more invulnerable, likely at the cost of more money or other technological conflicts.

The hole might be that large simply because they aren't able to finely control the field enough to make it the smallest possible size for its use.

Inaho didn't just "choose" the "obvious" solution. He planned everything, including the locations, timing, reaction of the enemy, and deduced most of the specs of the Cataphract from what he has seen and from the experiments he devised. He also used what he had to the maximum extent, but even then the enemy was so formidable that luck ended up deciding things. The princess being there and reacting that way was probably not part of his plan. He looks pretty brilliant to me.

EDIT: What I did find weird was the scene with Inaho stabbing the Cataphract with a knife. He was narrating his plan and taking forever to do it. That could have been delivered better, such as mentally narrating it as if going over the plan again before the knife attack, or narrating it post success. Doing it at the most critical junction does not make sense. It also prolonged the attack time because he had to say all his lines, making it odd how the enemy didn't react having such a large window to do so.

[KrayZ33]

why did that Cataphract not move after it fell into the water, I think I missed that.

[lelouch]

Cold, analytical, and friends with various skills. Genius? Not so much.


Yeah guys, he's totally not a genius. A genius can do magic and shoot laz0rs out of his eyes. Having the analytical capability to run these series of tests and analyze such incredible data and find such a small hole, and then devise a plan of how to actually fight the machine given very limited resources under such duress and extreme circumstances is no big deal. Ryll could have totally done it if he was there. Without even blinking an eye. You go Ryll.





This series is taking a really good turn, I have high hopes.

[Buffalobiian]

I like that he doesn't get get emotional and instead thinks of a plan on how he could turn things around. "Screw you Martians!" works so much better when you actually screw them first.

[MFauli]

I like that he doesn't get get emotional and instead thinks of a plan on how he could turn things around. "Screw you Martians!" works so much better when you actually screw them first.

I definitely prefer a hero that gets emotional when a friend dies in front of his eyes. But that´s just me.

[David75]

[HorribleSubs] Aldnoah Zero - 04 [480p].mkv (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=view&tid=580126)



[HorribleSubs] Aldnoah Zero - 04 [720p].mkv (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=view&tid=580125)


[HorribleSubs] Aldnoah Zero - 04 [1080p].mkv (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=view&tid=580123)





Nice pacing, nice animation, seems like the story is nicely knit too.
It's just a little strange the trio of trainees can come up with such a finely tuned strategy on the go when soldiers die like flies stuck on sticky paper.

[MFauli]

Agreed. Being good at strategizing is one thing. But when Inaho doged the enemy Kataphrakt´s attack by swiftly circling him, I had to call BS. When not even trained soldiers couldn´t do such maneuvers, he shouldn´t either. In other words: You can´t be both Lelouch and Suzaku at the same time, come on!

[shinta|hikari]

Yes you can, but Inaho didn't do that. Suzaku would have destroyed the enemy with just his skills alone. It took Inaho a lot of luck, being underestimated. and help from an unexpected source to survive.

He would have died barring any of those, and this episode even explicitly stated how unnaturally reckless he was. He isn't great in this episode, but extremely lucky. If you had to criticize something, that would be perfectly valid.

[Buffalobiian]

The comedic moments in this episode made it for me. The exoskeleton and the crane girl's "Guess not".

Rayet seems to be less of a threat than I thought.

[Xelbair]

This show keeps giving me Battletech vibes all the time.

[Ryllharu]

I really hate the "Inaho is a genius," declaration.

It has less to do with genius intellect and more to do with being underestimated, Orbital Knight arrogance, having two competent friends, and just enough time to experiment. Like shinta said, it is more luck and recklessness, combined with not losing his head.

The series makes it abundantly apparent that the Terrans have no chance if the Martians go all out (like dropping rocks). They've been lucky enough to get hit by one Cataphract at a time, and Inaho/Inko/Calm get time to play around and figure out its gimmick after the enemy pilot has gotten cocky from killing soldier who don't observe.

Inaho tried the HE rounds same as the other soldiers, but then switched to AP rounds and it worked. But this pilot wasn't as cocky as the last and adapted. The pincer plan also failed. But they had always intended to hit it with a crane. The trio knew what they could do at the base, while the Orbital Knight was wandering into unfamiliar territory with a backpack of arrogance from his earlier kills.

Furthermore, the dateless and tardy commander also figured out the plasma saber trick he was using, and ordered her artillery fuses disabled, firing them as kinetic weapons too. In a few seconds after arriving in range. So Inaho isn't some Zero type genius, and he's not any more skilled than his sister is (probably the opposite) at piloting. Calm is on par with Inaho in piloting.

The difference is that this trio stays calm and watches what the enemy does, while the enemy exhibits their arrogance and gets burned for it. Even Calm, as pissed off as he is and basically ready to murder a Martian he sees on foot, behaves in accordance with his namesack. Inko is often bewildered at what's happening and skeptical of their chances, but she's levelheaded in battle once it starts. The enemies we've seen lose their shit almost immediately, because they are so convinced they have overwhelming superiority.

This isn't genius, this isn't skill. It's the Art of War.

[NeoCybercoin]

It's just Inoha who keeps thinking up the strategies though. Try, analyse results, did it work? No, try something else. Repeat. But he did think ahead with the container bash.

[lelouch]

I really hate the "Inaho is a genius," declaration.

It has less to do with genius intellect and more to do with being underestimated, Orbital Knight arrogance, having two competent friends, and just enough time to experiment. Like shinta said, it is more luck and recklessness, combined with not losing his head.

Once again Ryll declares that he is not impressed and would definitely have been able to pull off the same thing were he in Inaho's situation. Ryll you are so fucking smart how are you not emperor of the galaxy yet.


You can´t be both Lelouch and Suzaku at the same time, come on!

My name is Lelouch and I approve this message.

Yeah that is the one thing that bugs me. I wish they split the skill sets of brains and brawn among the two protagonists.

[Ryllharu]

(A) Get off my dick.

(B) It doesn't take a genius to see that high explosive rounds don't work. It doesn't take a genius to switch to armor piercing rounds. It doesn't take a genius to stop the blade by grabbing the other robot. It doesn't take a genius to lure the enemy to where they can be hit with a shipping container from the crane you've been hanging around all day.

Using the environment against an opponent who is unfamiliar with the area does not require genius intellect. Inaho isn't L-elf, he isn't Lelouch, he's not Yagami Light or L. He's observant and doesn't get panicked. That's it.

[lelouch]

(A) Get off my dick.

(B) It doesn't take a genius to see that high explosive rounds don't work. It doesn't take a genius to switch to armor piercing rounds. It doesn't take a genius to stop the blade by grabbing the other robot. It doesn't take a genius to lure the enemy to where they can be hit with a shipping container from the crane you've been hanging around all day.

Using the environment against an opponent who is unfamiliar with the area does not require genius intellect. Inaho isn't L-elf, he isn't Lelouch, he's not Yagami Light or L. He's observant and doesn't get panicked. That's it.

(A) I wouldn't group L-Elf in the same category as Lelouch or L, at all.

(B) Being able to calmly come up with that plan under those conditions IS a form a genius. He certainly isn't Lelouch, but that is clearly obvious by the complete difference in character. That's not to say he isn't a genius. He's actually a totally opposite form of genius than Lelouch. Lelouch is a genius strategist, Inaho is a genius tactician. No matter what you say I'm confident you would be shitting your pants and would not have come up with that plan when you have a giant robot lazer samurai minutes away from killing you and everyone you know.

[KrayZ33]

Hmmm... did they cut something out? 20:55 - 21:15 was really odd.

I have to agree with Ryll on this one.
He looks (and is) clever, but thats because the other soldiers are preforming so poorly... "in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king"


No matter what you say I'm confident you would be shitting your pants and would not have come up with that plan when you have a giant robot lazer samurai minutes away from killing you and everyone you know.

That's unfair, Inaho has autism, Ryll has not... probably, heheee

[Buffalobiian]

Hmmm... did they cut something out? 20:55 - 21:15 was really odd.


It did look weird. The logical sequence of events seemed to be that Inoha got up using the crane (but not very far??), Martian gave chase but took a shot, so retreated. The students just sat still afterwards.

It was very weird indeed.

[MFauli]

Episode 5 is out
-----------------


Well, fuck the experience of a well-trained soldier, right? Who needs experienced mech-pilots, when you can just depend on a school boy.

Fucking anime tropes at full-force :/

Also, how exactly could this last scene play out? "Your majesty, there´s a chance that this boy will come here and tell you your daughter is still alive. That´s how you will know he´s a villain. Also, he might not come since I have no idea what´s about to happen. But please let me wait here with you. Wanna play cards?"

[shinta|hikari]

Err, "Your majesty, earth is trying to deceive us." period? Then luckily, some brat suddenly popped in, and the dude in the room beforehand just bleeped out, waited, and used the opportunity?

It was obvious the guy only found out about the princess fan at that point.

About the anime trope comment, yes the young genius is indeed an anime trope. I hope this episode has made that clear by now.

[MFauli]

About the anime trope comment, yes the young genius is indeed an anime trope. I hope this episode has made that clear by now.

As others have said in this thread, it´s less about Inaho being a genius and more about experienced soldiers being idiots.

[lelouch]

Yeah unfortunately I have to agree. This is like Code Geass with Lelouch being an average person and everyone else just being dumber than your average school girl. Damnit...what a half-assed job.

[NeoCybercoin]

Well in this ep they didn't plan to depend on him. He went out by himself. But I have to say I am liking him more and more.
He thinks ahead and prepares, hoping it should be enough. I'm sure there will be an episode where that shit just won't work just to show him wits don't work all the time.

[Ryllharu]

Also, how exactly could this last scene play out? "Your majesty, there´s a chance that this boy will come here and tell you your daughter is still alive. That´s how you will know he´s a villain. Also, he might not come since I have no idea what´s about to happen. But please let me wait here with you. Wanna play cards?"
This is one of the worst sins in fiction period. It's a horrible cliché, and it is simply lazy writing. Whenever someone can resolve a situation, there is always the pure coincidence that someone else on the opposing side was already there to taint opinion or otherwise discredit it.

The only thing worse is when the only person who can resolve things peacefully is tragically, accidentally, or randomly killed an unrelated third party. Assassinating messengers is fine, because it implies a deliberate plan by one side. But it is all too often the person holding the key to diffusing the situation is prevented from doing so by "tragic" fate. I was legitimately surprised the Emperor didn't just die from old age or something fucking stupid like that.

At least Slaine can try again or otherwise still act, which he'll figure out the moment the war resumes.

It's also not really clear why Rayet is convinced that the princess telling the commander and only the commander will lead to her death by the enemy. Rayet may still be devoted to the cause I suppose. Having the Earth forces know that they didn't kill the princess would put them on even footing with the Knights of Misinformation. Of course the princess is too stupid to think for herself...at least Slaine had the right idea, though he couldn't wait for proof he would need to tip the scale.

[Buffalobiian]

It was obvious the guy only found out about the princess fan at that point.

Was it obvious? Count Saazbaum said to look into the actions of a certain "someone" before. I'm inclined to think that this "someone" was Slaine, since he was Sir Trillram's pilot. He then predicted this move and planted the lie beforehand. I still blame the King for being dumb though, unless Saazbaum managed to be very convincing off-screen.

I had a feeling Inaho's PJ with patches was an analogy for reactive armour, but it would seem stupid to use the term like that.


It's also not really clear why Rayet is convinced that the princess telling the commander and only the commander will lead to her death by the enemy.

She's worried that information would be intercepted and that the ones with ulterior motives would attack the ship I suppose. The other idea is that she hates all the Martians indiscriminately, so would rather the war drag on and have some more die instead of letting them get away.

[shinta|hikari]

Was it obvious? Count Saazbaum said to look into the actions of a certain "someone" before. I'm inclined to think that this "someone" was Slaine, since he was Sir Trillram's pilot. He then predicted this move and planted the lie beforehand. I still blame the King for being dumb though, unless Saazbaum managed to be very convincing off-screen.

How did Saazbaum know Slaine knew of the princess being alive though? I don't think Slaine ever mentioned it to anyone except the King. I find it more convincing that it was just coincidence and human discrimination, even if it is indeed a bit lazy.


She's worried that information would be intercepted and that the ones with ulterior motives would attack the ship I suppose.

I think this was what she implied when she said she didn't want to get dragged in. Rayet simply didn't know how anyone else would use the information. If they did try to communicate it, chances of what you mentioned are reasonably high enough to avoid doing so.

I don't think the soldiers were being idiots. They were surprise attacked during a cease fire by an over powered enemy (that swats hundreds of bullets with a sword LOL). I don't get how you can see that as being idiotic. I would think that a trainee managing to come up with the idea of the armor, pull it off with his piloting ability, then decide to tilt the ship so both machines fall into the sea, and have the courage to risk not being able to eject on time and dying, and do the same shit almost every episode, is NOT being normal.

Inaho isn't anime super genius maybe, but far more than satisfactory in a more realistic setting.

[Ryllharu]

How did Saazbaum know Slaine knew of the princess being alive though? I don't think Slaine ever mentioned it to anyone except the King. I find it more convincing that it was just coincidence and human discrimination, even if it is indeed a bit lazy.
I'm more inclined to believe that Saazbaum didn't believe that the Terrans had any way of defeating a Kataphract without someone helping them. Since Slaine is a Terran, knows some of the martian secrets, and was assigned to the killed moron, he'd be suspect number one when a racist martian noble is on the investigation (as well as another one being the victim).

It's just fortunate for him that not only was Slaine very likely involved in the actual killing, he is also suddenly quite knowledgeable about their whole conspiracy. Saazbaum basically had every suspicion confirmed.

What was bullshit was that he already knew enough of that in order to dissuade the Emperor from looking into what Slaine was actually saying. He shouldn't have been able to give such a convincing argument without learning what Slaine knows before he said it.

[shinta|hikari]

Maybe the Emperor was also racist, and at that time blinded by grief. Saazbaum could have simply said that Slaine is a spy without mentioning the princess (because he has no way of knowing), then followed up after Slaine left.

[KrayZ33]

He shouldn't have been able to give such a convincing argument without learning what Slaine knows before he said it

Wouldn't it be enough for him to say something along the lines of: "Spies have infiltrated our empire and we have reports of them trying to cause an infighting between our troops."

Well.. something like that

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 06 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=585810)

---------------------------








They're still keeping Lt Marito out of the battle. I was really expecting the last shot to be made by him and not Slaine. The day he overcomes his trauma is the day the group gets a real soldier I suppose. On the other hand, Inaho is also an adept marksman.

I enjoy Inko's screen-time the most. They're simply non-heavy and easy to digest.

[shinta|hikari]

I could go on a nitpicking hey day from this episode but I won't. Nitpicking by definition is petty anyway.

I hope Slaine meets the princess in the next episode. He deserves some reward for all the trouble he has had to go through. It looks like princess X Inaho is out, and I hope it stays that way.

Those Mazinger rocket punches were hilarious. They were an obvious nod to the old mecha show, but nowadays it just looks retarded. It's funny how the rule of cool evolves as years pass.

[Ryllharu]

I felt the reveal that the Colonel being the dead solider's sister was pretty hackneyed. Totally unnecessary. They'd been hinting at the fact that Magbaredge and Marito had something going on, but if they were exes, that would have been better than what we just got. Just as clichéd, but better.

I agree with Buff about Inko, but I feel like the death flag on her is huge. They'll do it too, just for cheap (and again unnecessary) drama points.

It was interesting that Inaho could easily shoot the horizon-following fists, but struggled with the one coming from above. It should have been the opposite. I would have understood if he was having difficulty deflecting it, but he couldn't even hit it.

I also assume from Eddelrittuo's comment about piloting a kataphract, that she's as much bodyguard as she is lady-in-waiting. It is funny that she keeps accidentally blowing the princess' cover.

[KrayZ33]

It was interesting that Inaho could easily shoot the horizon-following fists, but struggled with the one coming from above. It should have been the opposite.


Hmmm, now that I think about it, why?

http://i.imgur.com/k2RXqPcl.jpg

the lines should clarify it (circle = the ship's bridge)

[Ryllharu]

I'm not really sure what your image is trying to project, but your vectors seem off.

The fists are coming at the carrier's tower (and Inaho), so they're coming right at him, while he's firing from a relative elevated position. Your image shows a distinct target being fired at, not one headed toward the elevated position you're on. I think to properly represent it, you'd have to draw the vectors from standing on a tower (with the lower targets aimed at the base of that tower), and it would be two separate images.

The difficulty is the horizon-following fists are moving toward him from a distance, so he has to continually depress to keep tracking it. While the overhead target is moving almost entirely downward, keeping the firing position steady. The overhead target should function the same way a Goalkeeper or Phalanx CIWS work (with a lower rate of fire obviously). The horizon-following targets operate the same way that a CIWS system is weaker to (modern anti-ship weapons), and should be more difficult to intercept.

[KrayZ33]

They are all going for the tower which is a few steps away from him, just like the circle
You need to lead the target significantly less because there is no "up to down" motion
I could draw the line comming from above with a right angel to clarify it more.

If they were comming "right at him" as you said, then there wouldn't be any difference. the targets are following a straight path after all. Inaho would see a dot getting bigger and bigger as they come closer.


The horizon-following targets operate the same way that a CIWS system is weaker to (modern anti-ship weapons)

source? I don't get the reason why, makes no sense for me tbh..

[Ryllharu]

I think the circle is still too far to accurately represent it. And you have to be at an elevated position (relative to the fists) firing on a target following the ground to the base of your elevated position.

Changes it substantially.


EDIT:

I'll use a water tower because images are easy to find and the elevation is close.

http://i.imgur.com/yBcvI4V.jpg
The circle on the first image is not on the street at ground level, but at the same height as the observer (I should have put it halfway off the image).

[KrayZ33]

. And you have to be at an elevated position (relative to the fists) firing on a target following the ground to the base of your elevated position.

but then its the same thing as if they were comming from above lol, the only difference is that its downward diagonal and not upward diagonal

edit: I don't get that picture of yours tbh
the Mechs are pretty much on the same level as the bridge so it should look like in my picture if he faces the target

[Ryllharu]

Re: CIWS weakness

CIWS fires continually to damage the target and throw it off course (as they were doing here). The stream of bullets hammers a missile and eventually destroys the warhead or aerodynamics. Most CIWS systems can only depress so far, so surface-trajectory targets have a very short time to be fired on.

Because the bullets are being at it instead of the missile running into them, it is also less effective (sides of the missile instead of the front). Once it gets too close, the weapon can't fire at all. Modern anti-ship missiles also move instead of following a straight path. The more the target moves, the harder it is to get a hail of fire on it.

CIWS systems are reactive, they can't anticipate where an erratic target will be. They essentially can't lead a target moving dynamically. But they do process it so fast it works anyway. Ballistic targets are obviously the easiest. The second radar in the system tracks outgoing rounds and "walks" them onto the target.

CIWS systems were made for a ballistic trajectory (the right image in my last post). Worldwide, they are being upgraded (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phalanx_CIWS#Upgrades) for the surface trajectories, or replaced.

[KrayZ33]

I don't think that helps me to understand the situation
Most CIWS systems can only depress so far, so surface-trajectory targets have a very short time to be fired on.

what is that even supposed to mean?

I can only speak of my own experience in computer games, but horizontal targets are always easier to hit than stuff that is flying in an up and down motion and not directly at you.
http://i.imgur.com/j5F0JDM.jpg

this is what it could've looked like for Inaho, I can't show the one from above properly because he wouldn't be facing it...

It's probably just as easy to hit and only slightly more difficult, however I don't believe it to be easier, you could argue that its more difficult by default because of how you'd have to set up your shooting position

[Buffalobiian]

what is that even supposed to mean?

It means that the guns have a limited angle when aiming downwards. They have to pick off targets before they move within minimum range. It's a fact that doesn't actually sway either argument though.

[KrayZ33]

It means that the guns have a limited angle when aiming downwards. They have to pick off targets before they move within minimum range. It's a fact that doesn't actually sway either argument though.

Okay, then I actually understood it correctly...I didn't/don't get what this has to do with what we've seen though

edit: it also means that this

The horizon-following targets operate the same way that a CIWS system is weaker to (modern anti-ship weapons)
doesn't apply

[Buffalobiian]

Firstly, Ryll, I don't think the fists were as near sea level as you thought they were. See this pic where the fist actually seemed to aim towards the actual bridge and Inaho knocked it off course towards his left.

http://i.imgur.com/xvZDegi.jpg

The bridge also isn't as tall relative to the mech as the water tower would suggest. It's between double and triple the height of the mech.



---------------------
Image A.
http://i.imgur.com/Jh8XXSw.png
Image A depicts what Ryll originally said, where a projectile is launched from the horizon (point 1) towards somewhere left of and below the shooter (point 2).

However, you could argue that the fist's target is actually above the shooter, making Krayz33's last pic somewhat more representative.


---------------------
Image B.
http://i.imgur.com/2HtXe55.png

Image B depicts a fist falling from the sky from point 1 to strike a tower (2-3x the height) next to the shooter at point B. Note the stone pillar is obscured by the gun animation, but this view was chosen as the bridge is also on the right of Inaho.

It's tough to argue the true trajectory of the rocket though, as the animation makes it unclear. The radar from the bridge suggests a vertical drop, while Inaho's view suggests a more diagonal trajectory.

One could also argue that only the first misdirected fist was aimed at the bridge, and that the rest were just aimed to take down the ship.

[Ryllharu]

And you both honestly believe Buff's Image A is easier to target?!

Try to actually hit a fast moving target coming at you...quickly while it skims across the ground.

http://i.imgur.com/Ba3GE7S.jpg

When it is yellow, you probably can't accurately hit it, but its relative speed appears low enough that you might be able to lead it accurately.

The red line is when you can effectively hit it while it cruises along the water.

Once it turns red and pink, you're fucked. It's moving too fast to hit it because it is too close and moving at too high a relative speed.

[Buffalobiian]

And you both honestly believe Buff's Image A is easier to target?!

I'm not sure which is easier, so I only posted pics for clarification as opposed to backing up a particular argument.

Experience-wise, sniping while the enemy moves at a slower angle per second has always been easier, so it would suggest Image B.

The other side of the argument is that despite the shot being easier, Inaho was losing concentration by then. He's under pressure as well after all.

edit: I can't unsee the Kamehameha now.

[Ryllharu]

Okay, let's try this, since you are both basing your opinions entirely off Battlefield and not, you know, actually firing a gun at a moving target (like shooting a running squirrel...which is hard as fuck).

Battlefield lets you shoot down cruise missiles with LMGs. Unbelievable as that is, you can (http://youtu.be/NWIDyb6vnMY). Which is easier: hitting one coming down or hitting one zipping along the ground? For a better comparison, could you shoot down a tank shell coming at you? I know the game doesn't allow it, but could you even do it if you could? Bet not.

Also, you do both realize how slowed down BF is compared to the real thing, right?

edit:
A nice video of a real thing (http://youtu.be/jspEovlEK-w)added.
and another (http://youtu.be/TmhuQqPcOtY). The solid rocket booster of a cruise missile isn't that fast, but once they go (http://youtu.be/4aIvY91JB6c), they go.

[shinta|hikari]

The other side of the argument is that despite the shot being easier, Inaho was losing concentration by then. He's under pressure as well after all.


That makes sense. People aren't robots. Sometimes you miss shots you would normally make, due to various internal or external factors, or even just basic human inconsistency. Athletes are a good example.

[KrayZ33]

Ryll

1. you could also move (1) in Image B to the left and a bit higher it would look even harder...
2. image B shows what it looks like if the fist hits the hull of the ship, not the bridge...
3. the fist/missle being fast applies to both cases.... the one on ground level just "looks" faster for obvious reasons. I'd even go so far and say that since they are flying on ground level, they are easier to hit with reaction shots because you can grasp the velocity *much* easier...


Okay, let's try this, since you are both basing your opinions entirely off Battlefield and not, you know, actually firing a gun at a moving target (like shooting a running squirrel...which is hard as fuck).

really bad comparison, hitting a squirrel thats running *towards* you on a rope that is spun 2 feet away from you at chest/head high level is most likely not that difficult either, I wouldn't know though, I don't shoot animals for fun :P


Also, you do both realize how slowed down BF is compared to the real thing, right?

yes, I still need to lead targets though, sometimes 2-3 times (or even more) the size of the vehicle, so what? In the end I'd say its pretty much impossible to hit a missle with a sniperrifle too, but just like Inaho, I can do that in BF.

Lets also consider the position you have to be in to shoot a target directly above your head... not comfortable, who knows, maybe the Mechs can't even rotate accordingly (funny enough I believe in Buffs case, he wouldn't be able to hit the missle at all.. the arc you are able to shoot at is probably ~150° vertically :D)

[Ryllharu]

I give up.

Clearly your vaunted experience with EA's Battlefield 3 and/or 4 trumps how things like CIWS and weapons actually work.

Never again will I question the knowledge and experience of a video game player.

Nice ad hominem attack too by the way. My argument is invalid because I am some great, heartless torturer of small animals by killing them in one shot.

[MFauli]

Battle veteran Ryll has spoken.

Major lol.

Can we go back on topic and talk about something relevant? Like ... which version of the princess is hotter, real or disguised one?

[Ryllharu]

We could discuss the other ridiculous firearms issue in this episode:

The fact that Slaine was moving on a cable at a really slow speed and trained guards 10 meters away or less couldn't hit him. Stuff like that makes me miss Valvrave.

Marito wasn't kidding. Neither side of the military has had any experience in decades. Makes me start to wonder who was piloting the kataphract that showed up at Tanegashima.

[David75]

The plasma blades dude showed how untrained they are, this is not just about being cocky. He had the only Kataphrakt that needed to be very active in combat, and he showed he doesn't have much skills.

The "desintegrate everything I touch" kataphrakt guy just needed to be fairly passive, since it was almost impossible to hit him before his Achiles' heel has been found.

Now, our six flying Mazinger punches kataphrakt seems to be another rather passive kataphrakt. If Inoha finds a way to stop those punches/hands/arms, I'm pretty sure that lady will be pretty useless and be beaten rapidly.

In a way, I understand Marito's line.
Of course those Martian kataphrakts are extremely strong and overpowering those on earth. But if the pilots are average and cocky, it's still possible to own them as Inaho showed a number of times.

[KrayZ33]

I give up.

Clearly your vaunted experience with EA's Battlefield 3 and/or 4 trumps how things like CIWS and weapons actually work.

Never again will I question the knowledge and experience of a video game player.

Nice ad hominem attack too by the way. My argument is invalid because I am some great, heartless torturer of small animals by killing them in one shot.



I couldn't care less how C-RAMs work tbh neither do I believe *you* could explain it properly lol. However, they had nothing to do with this situation, first of all its a human shooting these things, not some computer guided weapon. I don't even know why you bring them up? I just want to know why you think its more difficult for a person to hit that one


Btw...That second comment made it sound like you actually *did* shoot them, what kind of sicko are you?

And I didn't really attack you in person, it was a joke, but its not like you aren't at fault for that
saying something so stupid:


Okay, let's try this, since you are both basing your opinions entirely off Battlefield and not, you know, actually firing a gun at a moving target (like shooting a running squirrel...which is hard as fuck).

Really? How is someone supposed to now read it as "Lawl, you play your silly video games, I shoot real living targets!" Even if I leave out the part with the squirrel, it's still funny you think you know exactly how stuff works (because of...what exactly?). Guess what, military training is pretty normal in most countries it's not like people never held a weapon in their hands.


I still fail to see a valid argument concerning the difficulty of shooting targets on the horizon compared to shooting targets in the sky. For example, the picture of the carrier you posted - why do you think the trajectory would look *any* different for the fist comming from above. It's the same deal.

[Buffalobiian]

BF4 screens were shown for ease of capture, not for its physics engine.



Can we go back on topic and talk about something relevant? Like ... which version of the princess is hotter, real or disguised one?

Disguised. Easily IMO.

[Roko]

My impression was that Inaho's shots were all still on target for that last one, it's just that the increased velocity that the last arm had with the addition of gravity, in addition with a horrendous angle since Inaho was right next to the bridge, meant that the bullets did not have sufficient force in the right direction to deflect the arm. I find it hard to believe that he was 3/3, then suddenly couldn't hit at all with his next couple of shots, unless the sun was in his eyes or something.

[Xelbair]

I couldn't care less how C-RAMs work tbh neither do I believe *you* could explain it properly lol. However, they had nothing to do with this situation, first of all its a human shooting these things, not some computer guided weapon. I don't even know why you bring them up? I just want to know why you think its more difficult for a person to hit that one


Btw...That second comment made it sound like you actually *did* shoot them, what kind of sicko are you?

And I didn't really attack you in person, it was a joke, but its not like you aren't at fault for that
saying something so stupid:



Really? How is someone supposed to now read it as "Lawl, you play your silly video games, I shoot real living targets!" Even if I leave out the part with the squirrel, it's still funny you think you know exactly how stuff works (because of...what exactly?). Guess what, military training is pretty normal in most countries it's not like people never held a weapon in their hands.


I still fail to see a valid argument concerning the difficulty of shooting targets on the horizon compared to shooting targets in the sky. For example, the picture of the carrier you posted - why do you think the trajectory would look *any* different for the fist comming from above. It's the same deal.

fast moving targets. when target is big enough for you to reliably aim at it is too close to change it trajectory, angular speed is not that high, but the target is too small to hit accurately. while target overhead has even less angular velocity - in this case.

add the fact that 'horizontal' fists were below them - aiming at something below you isn't as comfortable as aiming at target above.

Also - it looks like he hit the last target - but it was noticed too late for him to change its trajectory.

[KrayZ33]

http://www.chuckhawks.com/shooting_uphill.htm

The fact aside that its pretty much impossible to hit any of the targets, how far away was each target? edit: The girl kept screaming "X mil" and after some wiki research, isn't that information kinda useless for a target thats closing in on you at missle speed?


However its certainly not easier or more comfortable to precisely shoot +70° upwards than it is to shoot -20° downwards.
It's particularly hard if you have no time to adjust after you just shot 3 targets at horizon-level

[Xelbair]

http://www.chuckhawks.com/shooting_uphill.htm

The fact aside that its pretty much impossible to hit any of the targets, how far away was each target? edit: The girl kept screaming "X mil" and after some wiki research, isn't that information kinda useless for a target thats closing in on you at missle speed?


However its certainly not easier or more comfortable to precisely shoot +70° upwards than it is to shoot -20° downwards.
It's particularly hard if you have no time to adjust after you just shot 3 targets at horizon-level

she gave him offsets to the direction, not the distance - so he could acquire the target in sights, and hit it with great accuracy - probably by using her radar.

[shinta|hikari]

Episode 7. (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=588490)

Inaho = Awesome.

[MFauli]

Inhao = Apparently the only person on earth paying attention to his surroundings.

Those hands being vulnerable when they´re about to attack? Their engines being vulnerable? Who´d have thunk!
:/

Also, how convenient that they find this huge flying battle ship otta nowhere, lol.

And lastly, all those soldiers leave it to the little assassin girl to finish off the Martian Kataphrakt. Lol.


If it wasn´t for the incredible soundtrack, I wouldn´t put up with this shit. Only badass moment that I have to acknowledge: when Inaho jumps on the other guy´s martian glider without a single word of communication needed. That was great.

[Ryllharu]

The one badass moment was when the took out the enemy kataphract by ramming it with the battleship's bow, crippling it completely.

The girl finishing it off was overkill in my opinion, but it at least shows she intends to kill them regardless and may be a risk to the Princess.

As for the rest of the developments in this episode, you had to know they were coming. Their previous ship was all but dead (so some form of new transport was needed) and they've been hinting that the Princess will have to take an active role to even the scales for the last few episodes. They were running out of mechs at a pretty substantial rate as well, so the seized kataphract being used is also a given.

I did appreciate the effort they took to show how damn loud weapons of that size are, especially when directed toward a enclosed space.

The soundtrack is 50/50. The instrumental songs are quite good, but when it shifts to jpop inserts, they almost always feel out of place. It isn't Symphogear ffs.

[Buffalobiian]

Dat soundtrack.

Inaho is cool. His application of theoretical knowledge and hypothesis testing easily wins my approval. I wonder at why he's top sniper for their team, but that's only a minor complaint.

I thought it was stupid that the woman gave each of her fists a name though. Children? Seriously?

[Ryllharu]

Inko is way better than Inaho. In general.

I also realized that battleship looks like the Saint's Cradle from Nanoha with a different paint job (smaller too obviously).

The big question still hanging out there is why these two things were stuck there. They say the kataphract crashed too. I'm guessing the doctor (Slaine's father) figured out a countermeasure to Aldnoah energy and shorted the kataphract and warship out. Probably from orbit or whatever. Then the Heaven's Fall in that area was meant to cover it up so it couldn't be repeated. If you think about what Morita has said about that battle, there was no reason for the Martians to have to use such punishing methods. The lunar gate overloaded? I'm starting to doubt it.

[Xelbair]

They were named after demons if i recall right - I'm sure I've spotted Ronove and few others from Lesser Key of the Solomon.

[MFauli]

The soundtrack is 50/50. The instrumental songs are quite good, but when it shifts to jpop inserts, they almost always feel out of place. It isn't Symphogear ffs.

wow, complete disagree. every time the vocals go off, it gets awesome.

[David75]

The music seem to use the same constructions/instruments as in Kill la Kill.
I also thought it was way too convenient to get that ship and kataphrakt in an abandonned base/combat area. I suppose that a better princess/slaine story management could have led to a better way to get that...

A bit of a useless ep, except for that last scene I guess.

[KrayZ33]

A bit of a useless ep, except for that last scene I guess.

Please come again? Half of it was fighting, which is always good, the other half was pretty much only "progress" and revelation


wow, complete disagree. every time the vocals go off, it gets awesome.

the vocals ruin it most of the time, for example the first 10 seconds of the ED, the "chiptune-ish" part, is cool, the slower, calmer part with vocals too, but that german at the end makes me cringe.

[David75]

Of course it was action, but lacked novelty/interrest compared to previous fights, even with the unexpected help of Slaine

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 08 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=591471)

-------------------------













Another good ep. Weaving the Inaho's story into Slaine's lapsing consciousness for an entire episode effectively showed how long he had to endure without actually making it a 10 minute segment. The blonde knight would have been a good ally. Too bad about that. Too bad about that.

[MFauli]

i still dislike inaho´s lack of emotion. this anime needs a real hero/protagonist. So far, Saline fits that role the best. Hope he gets more screentime.

[David75]

That kataphrakt was damn fast. I read on animesuki that if he came from stationary orbit. He'd need 20 minutes with 10G acceleration for the first half and 10G deceleration for the second half. I did the calculation and that's exactly 20 minutes. Even accelerating 10G all the time and hiting full speed, it would take 14 minutes. Incredible acceleration/speed here.
We're talking 85 000 m/s impact speed, meaning 36 Mega-joules per ton of energy to dissipate on impact, or 8.5kg TNT equivalent per ton. That's a lot by our standards, but not that much considering the technology level we've seen.
I'm a little surprise they have no flying object artillery equivalent, they have no effective shields or defenses against that, when they can land such a gigantic structure at full speed.
Unless of course there are helping hands and Count Crutheo's death was planned beforehand.

[lelouch]

This show is becoming awesome, although I don't really get why Inaho shot down Slaine. Cruhteo not having any type of defense on that giant spaceship is pretty laughable, must have been a pretty damn weak knight.

Looks like we have another Gundam Seed, with a prized legged ship attempting to make its way to HQ with a crew of makeshift students-to-soldiers.

[NeoCybercoin]

Inaho took him down because he was an enemy. Like he said...the enemy of my enemy doesn't have to be a friend. But can still be useful. After that he was no longer of use to him. Plus...Martian=enemy.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 09 (http://uploadrocket.net/cea28thi4lic/_HorribleSubs__Aldnoah_Zero_-_09__720p_.mkv.html)

-------------------------------
















You're not fucking serious.

[David75]

As a temporary measure, I put Kickass torrent Horriblesubs list here:
http://kickass.to/usearch/horriblesubs/?field=time_add&sorder=desc

It's less cumbersome than the DDL sites.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yup, that was a very nice episode.
I hope the princess really is dead and wonder how they can move the scenario from there.
But my guess is Rayet did not wait enough.

[Buffalobiian]

I hope the princess really is dead and wonder how they can move the scenario from there.

Slaine goes all crazy and hunts down the "Orange". (http://i.imgur.com/MLvhkZ0.jpg)

[Xelbair]

Urobutcher y u do dis.

i hope that she just lost consciousness due to lack of oxygen.... fat chance.

[shinta|hikari]

I think she will be resuscitated. The purpose of that scene was to show how dependent the ship is to the princess. She isn't just the key, but the battery.

[MFauli]

good ep, really glad she died. hopefully for good. i hate these well-protected princess characters, they never improve a story.

but here´s another twist im expecting: inaho really being a martian. the assassin girl who´s martian herself was irritated when she thought inaho´s sister had her figured out, while talking about the lack of expressiion and all that. it would kinda explain why inaho is such an unlikable asshole.

[shinta|hikari]

I think you're the only one who hates Inaho.

Some may not like him, but your dislike for him is pretty polar.

Also, what does being a Martian matter? IIRC, Martians and Earthlings are both human. The main distinction is their territory, much like countries in real life.

[David75]

Inaho being a hidden child from... Saazbaum?
Nah, this isn't some kind of space opera... or is it?

[Buffalobiian]

Inaho being a hidden child from... Saazbaum?
Nah, this isn't some kind of space opera... or is it?

Haha, that would be pretty awesome. And then if Slaine and Inaho were to take opposite sides...

[David75]

The only merit in my dumb idea, is high grade Aldnoah DNA... but Inaho would clearly be a little too OP. Him inside that Tanegashima Kataphrakt would be a little too much.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 10 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=596196)

[ASL]_SawanoHiroyuki_nZk_mizuki_-_ALDNOAH_ZERO_ED1_ED2_-_A_Z_aLIEz_[FLAC]_[w_Scans].rar (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=596312)
[ASL]_SawanoHiroyuki_nZk_mizuki_-_ALDNOAH_ZERO_ED1_ED2_-_A_Z_aLIEz_[MP3]_[w_Scans].rar (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=596313)

[ASL]_Various_Artists_-_ALDNOAH_ZERO_ORIGINAL_SOUNDTRACK_[FLAC]_[w_Scans].rar (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=596335)
[ASL]_Various_Artists_-_ALDNOAH_ZERO_ORIGINAL_SOUNDTRACK_[MP3]_[w_Scans].rar (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=596336)


-----------------------------------------------













I'm somewhat happy that the princess survived since I do like having her around in this story and interesting things do revolve around her existence, but I'm a little bit disappointed that she didn't become more jaded after this near death experience. Her incorruptible nature seems so perfect.

[lelouch]

An excellent fucking series this is turning out to be. Sunrise needs to take note and remember its roots after watching this and stop putting out shit like valverave musicals. The ED soundtrack..my god. Did they play that during a battle scene? If not, they def need to.

[Buffalobiian]

The ED soundtrack..my god. Did they play that during a battle scene?

They haven't, though they've had a few other songs that did just as well.

[shinta|hikari]

Called it, but that is nothing new.

Inaho definitely has the hots for Asseylum. It would be interesting if he gets dumped because the princess likes Slaine. I'm glad how Asseylum actually sees through Inaho's poker face. He really is kind, particularly how he desperately tries not to appear so.

Slaine joining Mars is a stupid development. It would shit on everything that was told about his feelings for the princess so far.

[Ryllharu]

Saazbaum taking revenge on Earth because Martians blew up the Lunar gate while prepping their invasion and killed his fiancé makes no sense at all.

I get that he wanted to take revenge on the royals for his lady dying, but wouldn't that result in a coup on Mars first? It seems like they're skipping a step. After his faction took over on Mars, then they could invade Earth from constantly being whipped up by their leaders to suppress local unrest.

As it stands, Saazbaum's motivations make no fucking sense...and watch his lady friend not be dead. The original Deucalion wasn't in that bad of a shape if they were able to pull out a functional Aldnoah drive, and know how to install it on a battleship.


Other thing that made no fucking sense: How the battleship Deucalion landed at the base. They crashed into snow or ice. They continued over snow or ice after reviving the princess. Then they dock in a miraculously pre-prepared hanger for VTOL battleships that shouldn't exist on appropriate support crawlers that the base would have no use for. A hanger well inland or on the edge of a port that's not usable in winter.

They should have floated into covered water docks.

edit:
And the martians know exactly where this base is anyway! Some secret base/refuge.

edit 2:
Terrans can't go extinct. Martians are also humans! 40 years does not diverge a species. The culture might get wiped out at best.

[Buffalobiian]

Saazbaum taking revenge on Earth because Martians blew up the Lunar gate while prepping their invasion and killed his fiancé makes no sense at all.

I get that he wanted to take revenge on the royals for his lady dying, but wouldn't that result in a coup on Mars first? It seems like they're skipping a step. After his faction took over on Mars, then they could invade Earth from constantly being whipped up by their leaders to suppress local unrest.

It makes sense (-ish) when you consider the princess dying as being integral to his revenge. Basically he wanted to spill royal blood, and invading earth was just the side-effect of saving his "clan" from destruction.


"How dare you oppress us, lie to us about Earth and make us go to war with them. You want war? Fine, I'll give you war - and I'll make sure it's because your (Emperor's) precious daughter's death that starts it. Still like your war you old fart?"

I thought that the royals could inactivate Aldnoah drives at will, making the counts/countess entirely dependant on them for military might.

----

You made a point about Duecaleon's pilot being alive. That's quite valid. Inaho's mum? I find it hard to see her being happily married unless she escaped from the machine and hid her identity before the military arrived.

Slaine's dad may also play a role here somewhere.

[shinta|hikari]

Amnesia flag.

[Buffalobiian]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WptwiNiQLKM&feature=player_detailpage

As much as I enjoy this song, I must admit that the lyrics are completely senseless.

http://i.imgur.com/jKZZrmw.png

[shinta|hikari]

Wait, was this translated or is that what she is actually saying?

[Buffalobiian]

Wait, was this translated or is that what she is actually saying?

lulz at the fact you can't tell xD (She's actually singing in Engrish)

[shinta|hikari]

I guess that means she is actually saying them.

I really like Mika Kobayashi's songs, but I never thought they were sung in English. Are they?

I thought it was an invented language, like Yuki Kajiura's.

[Buffalobiian]

Before my body is dry (Kill la Kill) was sung in English. attack ON titan (Attack on Titan) seems to be in German, as is βios (Guilty Crown).

[Ryllharu]

No one has better Engrish than MELL (http://youtu.be/PKBoHUG9_JE). No one (http://youtu.be/DQwzxeUjYmY).

Of course, the arrangements to her songs are much better too (as part of I've), and she does write all her own lyrics.

[MFauli]

two minutes into the latest episode and my bs-o-meter already broke. wtf is this shit. so bad. she was dead.

[Buffalobiian]

two minutes into the latest episode and my bs-o-meter already broke. wtf is this shit. so bad. she was dead.

I had a pretty long think about this. In the end, I couldn't rule out the possibility of hypoxia sending Seylum into ventricular tachycardia or ventricular fibrilation, which are the only two rhythms that you actually shock with a defibrillator for. (Otherwise the defibrillator would say "Analysing rhythm... shock not advised.. continue CPR".)

Still, from an animation perspective it did look like magic defib paddles reactivated her heart. In real life, defibrillators send a shock to disrupt abnormal rhythms in the hope that the heart will regain a normality. I don't blame the general misconception though. Defibrillators must look more like car jump-starters than a reset button for the uninformed.

[lelouch]

I had a pretty long think about this. In the end, I couldn't rule out the possibility of hypoxia sending Seylum into ventricular tachycardia or ventricular fibrilation, which are the only two rhythms that you actually shock with a defibrillator for. (Otherwise the defibrillator would say "Analysing rhythm... shock not advised.. continue CPR".)

Still, from an animation perspective it did look like magic defib paddles reactivated her heart. In real life, defibrillators send a shock to disrupt abnormal rhythms in the hope that the heart will regain a normality. I don't blame the general misconception though. Defibrillators must look more like car jump-starters than a reset button for the uninformed.

You're overthinking this by assuming that those are regular defibrillators. Remember this is in the future where they've discovered that blue skies are a result of "mie scattering" instead of light refraction. Those things that resemble defibrillators might have a totally different function.

[MasterOfMoogles]

Actually, it isn't in the future at all. It is present day of a crazy alternate history!

[shinta|hikari]

I googled this and wiki says:

"Defibrillation is effective only for certain heart rhythms, namely ventricular fibrillation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventricular_fibrillation) or pulseless ventricular tachycardia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulseless_ventricular_tachycardia), rather than asystole (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asystole) or pulseless electrical activity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulseless_electrical_activity). CPR may succeed in inducing a heart rhythm that may be shockable."

I guess the last sentence happened, That is easier to believe than a futuristic non-defibrillator defibrillator.

[Buffalobiian]

I googled this and wiki says:

"Defibrillation is effective only for certain heart rhythms, namely ventricular fibrillation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ventricular_fibrillation) or pulseless ventricular tachycardia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulseless_ventricular_tachycardia), rather than asystole (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asystole) or pulseless electrical activity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulseless_electrical_activity). CPR may succeed in inducing a heart rhythm that may be shockable."

I guess the last sentence happened, That is easier to believe than a futuristic non-defibrillator defibrillator.

That last sentence is true. What the wiki fails to tell you is that you do not shock anything other than VT and VF. It's not a case of "we'll do both and see which one works". Unless you're a doctor, you do not use manual defibrillator paddles. If you're a doctor, you use manual defibrillator paddles because some other heart monitor they're hooked on to confirms they're in VT/VF.

That said, I'm still trying to find out what happens when you shock non-shockable rhythms. Logic would suggest that it screws up your survival even more, since otherwise you'd shock everybody and disregard the analysis stage.

----------------------------




edit: That was just something that confused me, but it's not the only "false" thing to hit TV screens. Hollywood's already convinced everyone you can zap "flat-lined" people to life, shoot suppressed firearms at cars without people knowing, with said cars exploding with a brilliant fireball.

I do understand that shit like this happens and it's an artistic license. It just the first time I've seen a case where it was tried on asphyxiation instead of the usual cardiac arrest.

[Ryllharu]

So what was it supposed to be Buff? CPR and a little adrenaline/epinephrine?

I thought it was pretty clear the CPR part did more to save her life than the AED did.

[Buffalobiian]

So what was it supposed to be Buff? CPR and a little adrenaline/epinephrine?

I thought it was pretty clear the CPR part did more to save her life than the AED did.

Continuous CPR, re-analyse rhythm ever 2 minutes. Give adrenaline/epinephrine every 2nd cycle (every 2nd rhythm analysis).

Reversing the cause is also important, and in her case it would be hypoxemia (low oxygen in the blood).

If we were concerned about realism, then it can be broken down to this:

A) Does hypoxemia via strangulation result in ventricular tachycardia or ventricular fibrillation the way Seylum did? If so, then all is good. We can zap that.

B) If Seylum should have gone into asystole or pulseless electrical activity (PEA) instead, then the defibrillator should not have zapped.

Found a good site explaining advanced life support/defib for those interested.
http://theconversation.com/mondays-medical-myth-flatlining-patients-can-be-shocked-back-to-life-13662

It seems that inappropriate shocking causes more harm in the form of time-off-CPR and lack of organ perfusion. Hypoxemia probably causes PEA, from my short research, which is unshockable.

[KrayZ33]

two minutes into the latest episode and my bs-o-meter already broke. wtf is this shit. so bad. she was dead.

From something like this? Sounds like baby's first TV show.

Come on, its happening in like every series ever filmed - it's so common, you'd think you are fit for CPR just by watching TV

tbh what happened to Seylum looked like ventricular fibrillation (if we consider how this situation came to be) to me and if I'm not mistaken, the defibs in the metro for example are used to handle that (Inaho said *counter* shock too.. so it's not like he's zapping a lifeless body). You are actually suppossed to use a defib then because it's the only way to fix it from what I know. The difference is, that they work fully or semi-automatic and they actually tell you whether a shock is appropriate or not. Since this is a battleship, one would believe they have automatic ones hanging around as well. "Normal ones" would be rather useless after all, wouldn't they?

[lelouch]

Love how everyone is debating the show's explanation for defibrillators. Now let's debate that the show explained that the sky is blue from Mie Particle Scattering, not light refraction.

[shinta|hikari]

This has been a common trend in GW nowadays. You just gotta live with it.

[Buffalobiian]

Love how everyone is debating the show's explanation for defibrillators. Now let's debate that the show explained that the sky is blue from Mie Particle Scattering, not light refraction.

There's two reasons for this:

1) Few picked up on, or know what Mie particles are, so whether that was correct or incorrect was not picked up nor dwelled upon. (I was actually going to add something to my previous post about how there may other erronous parts that I didn't happen to be familiar with). Whether that Leidenberg effect could really change bullet projectiles like it did would also be debatable.

2) Light refraction / scattering was a relatively minor point in that if the point was wrong, it means Inaho was wrong and Slaine was right. Character-development-wise you can argue that Inaho being wrong is very significant. However, in the case of the defibrillators and her hypoxemia-induced heart rhythm - it impacts on whether Seylum should or should not have survived. Since that was the entire cliff-hanger of the episode before last, I suggest that it is a point more worthy of discussion than light scattering.

(Note that I say it is more worthy of discussion, instead of saying that either is worthy of discussion at all)

[lelouch]

2) Light refraction / scattering was a relatively minor point in that if the point was wrong, it means Inaho was wrong and Slaine was right. Character-development-wise you can argue that Inaho being wrong is very significant.

I think you misunderstood this scene. My understanding was that Earth has learned a lot more about science in the past years and has developed further knowledge, while Mars is dependent on Aldnoah and is behind on the most current information.

EDIT: ------------------------

Okay so I googled Mie & Rayleigh scattering, apparently that's a real fucking thing? I thought that was some crazy shit the show made up to show how smart Inaho is that something everyone else thought to be known, he found out some like even more complex answer. I legit thought the sky was blue because of refraction. But apparently it actually is because of Rayleigh fucking scattering? What the fuck is this shit? Was I lied to all through school?

EPISODE 11: ----------------------

Okay that fight scene soundtrack is officially on my workout playlist. What a great fucking show. Haven't been this excited for the next ep since Code Geass or Gundam Seed.

[Munsu]

OK, now I've caught up with this series. Have quite enjoyed it, but I love the ED theme aLIEz - Sawano Hiroyuki / [nZk]:mizuki.

Anyways, looks like the next episode will be the final one for now? I think I read this will be divided in to 2 seasons of 12 episodes or so.

[shinta|hikari]

What.

No way.

[Munsu]

What.

No way.

Well, I don't know if they'll continue non-stop for 24 episodes or if there'll be a break, but anidb has it listed at 12 episodes and I'm pretty sure I read somewhere else hat it would be 24 episodes, don't recall where.

[Buffalobiian]

Okay so I googled Mie & Rayleigh scattering, apparently that's a real fucking thing? I thought that was some crazy shit the show made up to show how smart Inaho is that something everyone else thought to be known, he found out some like even more complex answer. I legit thought the sky was blue because of refraction. But apparently it actually is because of Rayleigh fucking scattering? What the fuck is this shit? Was I lied to all through school?



I don't think you were "lied" to, but the papers talking about mie effect seem to be relatively recent. There was one in 2003 which was about verifying that the effect was even real.

Mahou showtime doesn't have an episode count for this show yet, but in recent years I've found that site, while reliable, tends to lag behind in the times. I won't be surprised to see this end in 1-2 episodes however. It's not the first Urobuchi show to do something like that.

[David75]

http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=599921
ep 12 out

------------


I didn't like the fact that szaasbaum kataphrakt was just a compilation of those we've seen before.
It gave a meh effect to what should've remained a climax battle.
It was a little too easy for Inaho.

Now for the cliffhanger, well, I like the idea of the princess dying in a previous ep. But having Inaho dead too pushes it quite a lot.
No, I'm wrong. Inaho should be dead because no one can survive that long, that many impossible battles like he did. It's just that dying like that is too cliché...

And then they spoil the fun by implying the princess might not be that dead, like they did twice before.
Provided the blond thing that was shot twice, once in the right lung and the other shot probably even better, she really should be dead.
Unless that body morphing was applied to the Loli and her, so,they trade places. But then there's the Aldnoah deactivation. They never told us the loli has aldnoah "royalty" DNA. And I don't think the loli is the true princess and asseylum just has some aldnoah DNA.

Another anime trope is that Inaho planed it all and this was all an act involving szaasbaum, the bigger scheme being the will the stop the war.

[lelouch]

Uhm... what the fuck? Why did he shoot Inaho? Clearly he was friends with the princess? This series went from a 9/10 to a 1/10 in a matter of minutes.

[shinta|hikari]

@David - Or they could both be simply dead? This is Urobutcher we are talking about.

Damn, that was shocking. Inaho's crawl was heartrending. It showed how much emotion he actually feels despite pretending not to and being unable to show it on his face.

Slaine really is Suzaku. Few characters have garnered my hatred this much.

[David75]

Honestly I hope they are and can still make it an entertaining show afterwards.
But the princess came back twice, each time from a more dire setting than the previous one. And the narration kept us believing that maybe...

As for Slaine killing Inaho, it was obvious it's from the emotional shock of seeing his beloved princess die in front of him and jealousy when he understood they shared a love bond...

I can't dislike him that much, he's just a teenager always in hard to, judge situations, making the wrong choices but surviving regardless.

[KrayZ33]

Uhm... what the fuck? Why did he shoot Inaho? Clearly he was friends with the princess? This series went from a 9/10 to a 1/10 in a matter of minutes.



What's the problem with that? They were both pointing guns at each other and Inaho even said that he is his *enemy*. "2 much tragedy 4 u?"

The question is, why did he rescue Saazbaum? What did he expect would happen?

[Buffalobiian]

The question is, why did he rescue Saazbaum? What did he expect would happen?

That's my biggest issue here. Slaine was cool when he held up to the torture, but he's a running bag of emotions here. Save the guy who you know plotted to kill the princess, who told you he'll kill the princess, and then fucking does.

Another question is why Slaine was given rights to pilot his mech? If rights can not be transferred by anyone other than royalty, then the remaining possibility is that Slaine is royalty.

As for the princess being alive, that seems to be a lingering possibility. I would have thought that Slaine could have wanted the war to continue though, under the guise that the princess was dead all along. I'm not sure if Saazbaum jammed her broadcast to everybody, or whether he merely stole it from his fellow Martians. While Slaine was batshit about Saazbaum killing the princess, he did seem gravitated towards the count's idea of ending the hatred (at least for the Martians). The encounter with the friendly Martian soldier in this episode may have solidified this for him.

Slaine shooting Inaho was a given. Inaho shot Slaine down and prevented him from "helping" the princess, thereby ultimately leading to her death.

Inahoh x Seylum ftw.


Unless that body morphing was applied to the Loli and her, so,they trade places.

That can't happen. It's a hologram. The bullet would have gone over chibi's head. The chest shot may have clipped her ear.

[David75]

I just hope Slaine didn't get his aldnoah powers from Aseylum's kiss... That would be one of the worst clichés to use... And Inaho would also get such powers. Well if he's dead it doesn't matter anymore.
I also hope there's no hidden ' I can't die ' power in the royalty aldnoah power, that would prevent Aseylum, Inaho and Slaine from dying... That would be another hard to swallow cliché on top of the kiss one...

[Ryllharu]

I found it quite comedic that no matter where Inaho had been fighting Saazbaum relative to where the Princess was, twice he crashes through a wall or ceiling into the very same hallway or room.

The much darker assumption is that Slaine simply took her body with him because he is a creepy possessive stalker, and that she's still very much dead.

I think I would have liked it more if Inaho didn't try to kill Slaine with his last movement, but rather stayed defiant and went to kiss her, because that obviously would have pissed Slaine off that much more.



But we know what will really happen is that she somehow will survive, but have amnesia and Slaine with convince her they are boyfriend and girlfriend.
/Ryllharu vomits



My takeaway from the series is this: Inko is great, and Nina and Inko need to be the protagonists of the sequel. Their great friendship will bring peace to humanity as a whole.

Unfortunately, they're likely to make the main characters of the sequel Rayet and Slaine assuming that Inaho and the Princess stay dead.

[fireheart]

Another question is why Slaine was given rights to pilot his mech? If rights can not be transferred by anyone other than royalty, then the remaining possibility is that Slaine is royalty.

His father was allowed to study Aldnoah so maybe he figured some things out and gave his son the rights to activate any drive similar to the royal family. After all it sounds like the only reason the royal family is the royal family is because they were the first to come into contact with the Aldnoah drives.


The much darker assumption is that Slaine simply took her body with him because he is a creepy possessive stalker, and that she's still very much dead.

This was pretty much what I assumed minus the creepy possessive stalker thing.

[Xelbair]

I just hope Slaine didn't get his aldnoah powers from Aseylum's kiss... That would be one of the worst clichés to use...

it is obviously related to Slaine's father - i'm sure that he discovered how to actually use aldnoah.

[Ryllharu]

how to actually use aldnoah.
Wishing really hard that the thing you're in turns on? That's all that Slaine did. What an amazing researcher his father must have been!

If he screamed really loud about his frustrations at not being able to save the princess and [whatever] is happening again, that scene would have been very GAR, instead it was just kinda lame.

[shinta|hikari]

Wasn't the princess shot in the head? I think she blocked the bullet aimed at Inaho using her head.

[KrayZ33]

I don't think she did anything to catch that bulllet, haha.

[shinta|hikari]

I remember her bowing and her head overlapped Inaho's.

[Buffalobiian]

She jerked forward before being hit in the head. Her head did overlap somewhat. I'm unsure as to whether she fell forward due to the chest pain or whether it was an intentional block. It could be either way. Now that the latter's been suggested I'm actually leaning towards it.

Saazbaum was most likely aiming at her all along though since she's his target.

[David75]

In slow motion, she clearly leans forward as if to protect Inaho.
Then we move to the muzzle, and back to Aseylum that gets the shot we don't know where with blood gushing out from we don't know where.
Her head airbag deploys after that, so I do not think they'll use that plot device if she survives.

[MasterOfMoogles]

What a horrible ending. Slaine's motivations in this episode were nonsense.

[shinta|hikari]

I realized that Inaho probably committed suicide in the end. He was far too logical to pull a gun at that moment. The Inaho shown in the series so far should know that he would be shot if he did that. He was probably so damaged by the princess's death that he no longer cared or intentionally did it to follow her in death.

[NeoCybercoin]

Or maybe he was hoping the enemy who he knows cares for the princess would be too upset to respond in time.
Anyway, I did not see this ending coming.

[shinta|hikari]

That was too high risk for Inaho to do. He could have just stopped crawling and waited for help. If Slaine wanted to shoot him anyway, he would not have warned Inaho to stop.

[Buffalobiian]

I realized that Inaho probably committed suicide in the end. He was far too logical to pull a gun at that moment. The Inaho shown in the series so far should know that he would be shot if he did that. He was probably so damaged by the princess's death that he no longer cared or intentionally did it to follow her in death.

This makes the most sense.

[shinta|hikari]

Every time I hear the fucking songs for this show, it makes me tear up.

Gen, why the hell do you keep doing this to me?

This is like Fate/Zero's Sora ha Takaku, Kaze ha Utau and Kiritsugu's tragedy all over again.

I can really empathize with seemingly emotionless characters who actually hide their feelings. I respect their iron will, but also feel pity for the side of them that gets crushed by it.

Asseylum was probably one of the most likable princess characters in anime. She wasn't written to be unique or different. She was simply a really good person and understandably naive. The facts that she is really pretty and kept kissing the male characters are also points for consideration.

[Inazuma]

Damn right Buff, suicide by Slaine.

It's weird though, because it's like Gen remembered on the last episode he was supposed to butcher. The previous episode had no build up to that ending

[shinta|hikari]

Aside from the princess dying once before and the general danger Inaho is always in?

[MFauli]

I guess I was never in the mood for this series, but ... it all fell flat on me. Not only consisted every episode of showing Inhaho´s superior mind by showcasing the incompetency of all others. I had no emotion at all over their death in this last episode (quite ironic, eh, Inaho?! lol).

The writing of this anime just feels so incompetent, so rushed, so ... "wanna-be". Like it´s trying to emulate other, more famous, more popular anime series that had a theme of desperation and cruelty. But where other anime manage to present properly developed characters with properly developed motives and behaviors, Aldnoah.Zero never even got close to that. Instead, it´s formualic almost to Pokémon-levels: Episode begins with some exposition -> action scene -> hopeful occurence -> suddenly desperation -> cliffhanger ending on either positive or negative note, accompanied by awesome Sawano-music. And in before, no, you could not describe every anime like that. It was painfully obvious in this case.

In the end, I guess your enjoyment depended on what you were expecting. From the bombast, time-taking beginning, I expected a much more intelligent, satisfactory story. What I got was a China-ripoff of Attack on Titan.

[Ryllharu]

I shouldn't even touch this one but I have to.


What I got was a China-ripoff of Attack on Titan.
Emphasis mine.

What. the. Fuck.

If this is a ripoff of anything it is Gundam SEED. I have no idea what would make you possible think this could be a knockoff of Attack on Titan. This has more in common with Muv Luv Alternative or even Code Geass than it does Attack on Titan.

[MFauli]

I shouldn't even touch this one but I have to.


Emphasis mine.

What. the. Fuck.

If this is a ripoff of anything it is Gundam SEED. I have no idea what would make you possible think this could be a knockoff of Attack on Titan. This has more in common with Muv Luv Alternative or even Code Geass than it does Attack on Titan.

I don´t know Gundam SEED, so I cannot draw comparisons here.
The setting is closer to Code Geass, true, and the main character wishes he was 1/10 as smart as Lelouch (he´s not).
But the overall theme in atmosphere and mood is an attempt at Attack on Titan´s popularity. Introduce characters, have them unexpectedly die, raw gruesomeness and cruelty, desparation and despair ... yeah.

[Ryllharu]

You're so off base that I can't even come up with an appropriate analogy to describe it.

edit:
I'll try this one:
You make drive-in movie theaters jealous with your projections.


The way you describe it, Shingeki no Kyojin was the first series ever to have characters die.

Hell, this series has more in common with Guilty Crown than it does Shingeki no Kyojin.

[shinta|hikari]

You can't blame him for his inexperience.

...Wait, you can.

[MFauli]

You're so off base that I can't even come up with an appropriate analogy to describe it.

edit:
I'll try this one:
You make drive-in movie theaters jealous with your projections.


The way you describe it, Shingeki no Kyojin was the first series ever to have characters die.

Hell, this series has more in common with Guilty Crown than it does Shingeki no Kyojin.

I could have also mentioned Claymore, although that one is somewhat detached from typical human grief.

[KrayZ33]

But the overall theme in atmosphere and mood is an attempt at Attack on Titan´s popularity. Introduce characters, have them unexpectedly die, raw gruesomeness and cruelty, desparation and despair ... yeah.

Whenever I read something you wrote about a show, I can't help but think that I/you watched something totally different. I can't even say its "wrong" because I'm not really sure if we are talking about the same series. Wth.. seriously

[shinta|hikari]

I guess different people tend to focus on different things.

I, for one, was focused on the love story veiled in all the war and politics bullshit in this show.

Even though I liked Inaho's badassery at first, it grew more and more unbelievable as it progressed. The last fight made me lose suspension of disbelief.

[MFauli]

Cant say i didnt expect the neg rep for my postings in here today :P

Anyway, as I said, I guess I just couldnt ever connect to this anime in the way many of you did. For me, it was a poor attempt at replicating the success and popularity of Attack on Titan and Code Geass. For you, it seems, it was another anime on par with the aforementioned.

No need for personal insults, though.

[KrayZ33]

The annoying part was that Inaho+Saazbaum kept crushing through walls whenever the Princess entered a new room.. as if they're trying to say "Hey, I'm here too"

the fight itself was okay, the fights prior to this one were hard because they had to figure out how to fight them... since the last one was a mixture of all cats so far (which was both unlikely, since all cats were so different up until that point, and boring imho), Inaho knew how to defeat him from the get-go



For me, it was a poor attempt at replicating the success and popularity of Attack on Titan and Code Geass.


*maybe* it didn't try to replicate anything at all
just like Death Note didn't want to mess around with Code Geass or the other way around for example, I don't know. ("Both have clever MCs, damn dis' copy-pasta!")
If you want to review a show you might want to view it in all objectivity and not nit-pick on stuff in one show (for example how stupid everyone is except for Inaho) and ignore the very same thing in the second show (Code Geass) just because you like that one more.

[shinta|hikari]

The entire combination thing was a bad idea I think. Maybe it was done to sell figures or something?

@Mfauli - I'm not saying that you're right, but imitating a popular series or format is a normal and accepted way of getting popular and selling. That by itself should not have a negative connotation.

Personally, I don't think Aldnoah is up to par with Code Geass and Shingeki, but we have only seen the first season.

[MFauli]

If you want to review a show you might want to view it in all objectivity and not nit-pick on stuff in one show (for example how stupid everyone is except for Inaho) and ignore the very same thing in the second show (Code Geass) just because you like that one more.

Disagreed, sorry. Lelouch´s enemies weren´t dumb, they were capable soldiers trained for their purpose. Lelouch was a genius of three advantages: He was smarter than the rest. He had a lucky upbringing. And he´s got the Geass. All of that allowed him to outclass his enemies, that did their best to dispose of the threat.
In Aldnoah.Zero, the only reason why Inaho is "special", is because he keeps figuring out trivial stuff, like in this last episode the weak point in the joints of Saalbaum´s mecha. Maye I´m playing too many videogames, but come on, EVERYTHING Inaho did was applying basic videogame boss strategy. And worse, the veteran soldiers around him were absolutely incompetent. That combined with Inaho´s lack of emotion (which, I guess, was only so to make him "unique") made it truly annoying to watch.

@shinta: I´m looking forward to the second season. If both of them stay dead, that could actually make the series extremely interesting. However, Im not yet convinced that they wont come back :/

[Ryllharu]

In Aldnoah.Zero, the only reason why Inaho is "special", is because he keeps figuring out trivial stuff, like in this last episode the weak point in the joints of Saalbaum´s mecha.
...
And worse, the veteran soldiers around him were absolutely incompetent. That combined with Inaho´s lack of emotion (which, I guess, was only so to make him "unique") made it truly annoying to watch.
You're missing the point and forgetting what his sister keeps saying. Inaho is "special" and successful against Martians because he is both insanely reckless and doesn't lose his shit under ridiculously stressful situations...and frankly, Inko isn't much different.

Inko is a little more cautious, but neither of them realize how insanely dumb they're being. The adults perform worse because they're not dumb teens. Teens are always reckless, it's part of being a teen. The difference is that occasionally Inko realizes that she's about to die and freezes up, usually cringing (adorably) in her cockpit.

Inaho just keeps his cool. He logically or rationally realized early on that if he doesn't act he's gonna die anyway so...why the hell not?

Contrast the two of them to Rayet. She's far more like the adults and carefully plans and plots revenge, though still has that impulsiveness of being a teen. It screws her over time and time again. She's way more competent than either Inko or Inaho, but she's cowardly and cautious and it bites her in the ass. She's reckless when she has plenty of alternatives (killing the princess), and methodical when she doesn't have any options and can't really afford to be. Rayet is far and away the cause of most of the implausibility in the series. Unlike the others, she's not trained as a pilot and none of the students or teachers recognize her, but they frequently let her pilot anyway, and there's never been any basis for why she isn't completely clueless getting into cockpits the first few times.

As for Saazbaum's mecha's weaknesses...Inaho already fought them all. They knew the trick with the barrier and they understood that they could easily counter-attack the joints of the flying arms because he was fighting them close up with them like an arrogant fool. I suppose it was weak that the creators never bothered with a more original mecha for him, but he didn't really have to "figure anything out" there. Saazbaum had no idea Inaho was the one doing all the killing so far. Hubris brought down every single one of the Orbital Knights prior to that as well.

Saazbaum was the dumbass in that fight. He went inside the castle, rendering the drones that let him see outside the barrier worthless (resulting in needing to frequently drop the barrier), and used the flying arms up close where they could attack the body. Had he kept them outside, he would have defeated them easily with his mech's speed and agility alone.

[Ryllharu]

http://i.imgur.com/puKrgXll.jpg



Aldnoah.Zero - 13 [HorribleSubs] (http://nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=643968)



-------------------




Well...it wasn't completely as bad as I was afraid it would be (http://forums.gotwoot.net/showthread.php/22984-Aldnoah-Zero?p=545500&viewfull=1#post545500), but it sure was close.

Slaine takes Princess, becomes well respected, and they have another princess they pulled from god knows where to play the amnesiac Asseylum that has "come to her senses."

I guess I can accept that Inaho has a robotic eye now, and that brain damage actually made him more sociable. Capturing the castle gave the Terran forces access to some nicer technology and a lot of intel on kataphracts. It's a little bit more reasonable now for Inaho to make these amazing attacks on kataphracts because he already knows how they operate and can try something reckless, but now fully informed.

That said, it was a nice touch that Inaho realized right from the start that the Princess was a fake because she doesn't remember a private discussion they had where he told her the secrets of the Earth's pretty blue colors (that Slaine is too stupid to know).


And yes, Inko is still the best part of the series.

[Buffalobiian]

And yes, Inko is still the best part of the series.

I don't know. Rayet's hardass attitude is pretty cool now that she's not a bomb (but is a bomb). Everybody staying alive is kind of meh, but at the same time I'm kinda happy to see them again.

Especially Slaine - I'm so glad I can continue hating him for the next season to come.

[shinta|hikari]

Really mixed feelings about this. I dislike how they chickened out by Sunraising everyone from the dead, but at the same time, this keeps InahoXAsseylum alive.

If, and only if, that happy end happens will I forgive such a Kira Yamato/Nunnally level resurrection.

@Ryll - Excellent image. I almost missed it in my haste to post.

EDIT: Really, they could have made S1's ending less conclusive-looking (not showing all those blood pool camera shots) to make room for this. It simply feels like I was trolled right now.

[David75]

I'm sorry, but Inaho alive after a bullet traversing through his eye, not meeting any bone, then going through his brain and probably exiting at the back of his head... is a lethal wound no matter the technological level they have *. Aldnoah isn't an explanation either because Vers knights die too, and even Assylum seems to be in a dire state.

* I continue from the techno level:
It might remotely be possible to act if very quickly without moving the subject too much and waiting for too long.
But he's been shot like at least 10 minutes ago and was brought inside Deucalion without any proper care at all.
Blood loss seems incredible too.

Then there's the ass pull vers princess getting out of nowhere.

Regarding Slaine's new Assylum SM caged pet, well I had a smirk honestly. But that's about it.

That first ep failed on so many levels.
I knew shit would happen, and it did.

[KrayZ33]

I'm sorry, but Inaho alive after a bullet traversing through his eye, not meeting any bone, then going through his brain and probably exiting at the back of his head... is a lethal wound no matter

I don't like it myself but people survive and survived things like that or even worse, shotwounds are weird, minor ones kill, others that appear to be fatal don't do anything at all.
If I'm not mistaken its actually more likely to survive a bullet to the head if it doesn't bounce around and enters + leaves in a straight line... even if it passes through half the brain. Location matters too.
So it's not like I can't believe it, but I would have prefered to see something else here

Well, the first fight this season was weak and thats more of a problem for me. I hope that all they wanted to do with that is to set everything in motion again.

[Ryllharu]

Yeah, my take was that the bullet passed through his eye and straight out (through the back or temple), hence the cyborg eye. I assume they reconstructed that side of his face and a sizable piece of the back of his head.

From the dialogue between Inaho and Inko as well as Inko and Nina, he's been gone this entire time. It isn't like he's been dashing around activating Aldnoah drives, he probably finally got certified to return to duty and was assigned to his own unit. It seemed to me he was driving the truck that had his mech on it to bring it to the Ducalion prior to launch.

Inaho's miraculous survival, subsequent return and Asseylum's survival, hell even Saazbaum's survival bother me a whole hell of a lot less than the Secret Princess that was conveniently added so that the Knights can continue to have aldnoah drives without the emperor himself showing up.

There was no foundation for Asseylum having a cousin, sister, or half-sister. At all.

[David75]

I'm OK with a very high mid season cliff-hanger. But if you can't even write a passable transition from there...

Yeah, while writing my rant about the headshot, I was remembering some weird cases too. It's just too convenient here and not the only over convenient case too.
As for Inaho's rehab, the other rant is that 19 monhts isn't that much and it doesn't even feel like he lost any mobility or anything at all. But let's close that rant for now. We knew shit would happen, and it did, big time.

Somehow, I'm not even sure I want to watch the other eps after that, but I know I will.

[Buffalobiian]

I thought the episode said the bullet went through his eye and damaged his temporal lobe (which is on the side). The temporal lobe does a few different things, like high order visual interpretation (not "seeing" something, but recognising that the object in front of you is an apple etc), language in your dominant hemisphere and memory.

Movement is largely your parietal lobe, unless the bullet cut the subcortical white matter.

[Ryllharu]

Since they did specifically mention that he lost part of his temporal lobe, I hope that comes into play somehow. It didn't seem like it hurt his recognition or memory though.

Rayet/Inko did say he was showing some more emotion, so perhaps he's slightly less...whatever he was before.

[KrayZ33]

Wiki research tells me damage to it might cause savant syndrom... how fitting.

I remember reading something about how brain-regions can switch functions and take over for other regions of the brain whenever they don't work properly. Like.. I don't know, if the dude is blind, the region responsible to analyse visual imput might switch over to language instead or something.

[Buffalobiian]

I assumed that by getting injured he gained an infra-red, 80x optical zoom camera eye with an integraded supercomputer inside it or something. In other words, I expect this Inaho to be upgraded, not downgraded.

[shinta|hikari]

Screw it. I still enjoyed myself when Inaho showed up with amazing music and used sharingan to analyze the shit out of the Kataphrakt, making the deaths of fodder soldiers as meaningless as usual.

Using grenade launcher explosions to heat up was pretty cool as well. I think S1 established well enough that expecting realism from this show is like expecting realism from Code Geass.

[MFauli]

Three characters were sure to be dead.
Three characters magically survive.

Ugh, this was superbad.

And the rest of mankind continues to be stupid, because NOTHING Inaho did in the fight against the ice kataphract was impressive. Anybody who´s played a videogame in his life could have come up with that "strategy". It really is a pitty that this anime puts so much focus on having Inaho be this genius, but fails so hard at it, because instead of actually having him be a genius, the author decided to make everybody else a retard.

It´s still enjoyable enough, but these flaws really prevent that this anime will be anywhere near my all time favorites.

[shinta|hikari]

I don't think normal people would think of using grenade launcher explosions to keep their mech temp high. I certainly didn't. I'd be impressed if you did before Inaho did because the speed at which he came up with the solution is part of his excellence. Retrospect revelations don't count.

[MFauli]

i dont know about using grenades, but it should be any person´s normal train of thought: enemy uses freezing attack, we cannot approach him - only solution: unfreeze the path towards the enemy.

From there, you´d use whatever means are available. Id say putting some napalm all over the place would have been my first idea. But if grenades are the only thing available, then yes, that wouldnt be hard to come up with, either. You use what´s there. But apparently Inaho is the only person to realize "fire beats ice". Guess nobody but him played Pokemon :/

[Buffalobiian]

I usually need a few lives before I learn how to beat a boss. I thought that was pretty normal, but according to MFauli I'm just dumb.

[shinta|hikari]

@Mfauli - The mechs had anti-freezing equipment, but it didn't work. They went in there thinking it would. They didn't randomly go near Mr. Freeze knowing they would get frozen.

@Buff - I'm sure Mfauli has perfect win records in all his games. That, or he is just as dumb as we are.

[MFauli]

i actually beat most bosses in a Zelda-game on first try ... and that´s the kind of difficulty Inaho is facing here. He wasnt under serious time pressure.

@shinta: So their anti-freezing equipment didnt work and they ... gave up? Tbh, what would have happened if Inaho had gone in first? Or worse: Did he know the equipment would fail, but let the other pilots run into their demise? Really makes no sense whatsoever.

When Im watching Death Note, Im truly impressed by Light and L. Their plans arent predictable or obvious, they really are geniuses. Inaho isnt, he´s just being called it.

[shinta|hikari]

A lot of L's and Light's plans are unbelievable. In contrast, Inaho's plans are more believable, to the point that video gamers actually believe they can pull it off themselves in real life. The difference lies in the level of realism the series is trying to portray. Most of Death Note's (I won't even mention NGNL, oops I did) plans are absurdly improbable and plot armored. Predicting that many steps in the future (and having only one plan and that somehow works without problems!) doesn't happen in reality. Naturally, it feels more amazing when it works.

So... you beat most of Zelda's bosses on the first try. What about the times you didn't? That would have resulted in death in Aldnoah Zero. But Inaho is still alive after beating boss after boss after boss. Moreover, I would think playing a game in your room is far less stressful, nerve wracking, and panic inducing than actually risking your life. Inaho's calm is part of what makes him special. Normal people, even soldiers, panic when faced with absurdly powerful opposition.

Er, and what part of the episode suggested he wasn't in any time pressure? They were being attacked. People are dying every second, and more will die if the enemy advances.

Play Demon/Dark Souls 1-2 and beat the bosses there without dying even once before bragging about your skills. Even compared to that, I'm sure Inaho's one hit = death situation is far harder.

In addition, Inaho is not only evaluated for his planning and deduction. His Suzaku-level piloting also adds to his already OP repertoire of skills.

After the anti-freeze equipment didn't work, Inaho came and beat the boss. Inaho can't have been first because he came late. He may or may not have died if he came earlier because he has no data on the enemy, but we will never know because that didn't happen. It was simply luck (and plot!) that some people had become guinea pigs for the anti-freeze system before him.

And please, you completely missed the anti-freeze part until I mentioned it.

TLDR: You overestimate yourself.

[MFauli]

You talk about Death Note being plot armored, but have no qualms about the same being true for Inaho. Yes, failing once for him means death, unlike me failing once at a video game. That´s because Inaho is plot-armored, he´s the chosen protagonist so he cannot die (fucking lol, he even survived a headshot!!1). And if you went through with your complaint about videogames versus Inaho: He has full control over his movement and actions. In not a single first- or third-person action-game do you have this level of natural controls and overview. Compare driving a real car versus a car in GTA - youre much more prone to crashing in the latter, Id assume. Until OculusRift, Morpheus et al become a reality, videogames will always be a lot harder than real life because of this lack of environmental overview. In a current day-videogame, I have often have to input absurd button-commandos to achieve a certain result, and even if Im good at it, Im limited by what the game is programmed to allow me. In reality, I could do whatever pleases me, only limited by physics.

Now, would I have been able to do the same feat that Inaho managed to achieve? As I am, no. I also wouldnt be Nico Rossberg in a formula 1 race as I am now. But if I was acustomed to a Kataphrakt´s controls? Yeah, I think I could have achieved the same thing. Although unlike Inaho, I´d have contacted hq first to ask if we have any high temperature sources. But I guess that wouldnt have been as badass.

What you´re ignoring, though, while you´re focusing on attacking me: Nothing excuses why nobody else of those pilots came up with a similar plan. I´ll give you that Inaho successfully combines these ideas with masterful kataphrakt-piloting (a skill he somehow possessed from the very beginning, sigh); but it´d be nice to see some short scenes of other pilots where they talk to each other, like "incredible that this brat managed to actually do it! I had thought of something similar, but I wasn´t confident enough to try it". Because when it comes down to confidence, Id have no problem accepting that Inaho is more confident then other pilots. But the point stands: What he did shouldnt be enough to earn the title "genius".

[fireheart]

What you´re ignoring, though, while you´re focusing on attacking me: Nothing excuses why nobody else of those pilots came up with a similar plan. I´ll give you that Inaho successfully combines these ideas with masterful kataphrakt-piloting (a skill he somehow possessed from the very beginning, sigh); but it´d be nice to see some short scenes of other pilots where they talk to each other, like "incredible that this brat managed to actually do it! I had thought of something similar, but I wasn´t confident enough to try it". Because when it comes down to confidence, Id have no problem accepting that Inaho is more confident then other pilots. But the point stands: What he did shouldnt be enough to earn the title "genius".

Some nitpicking with two things here, obviously Inaho knew how to use a Kataphrakt, it's not out of the blue seeing as they already showed and talked about how it was part of their school curriculum to learn how to use one. Also from what I noticed there was a total of three pilots that survived this encounter the rest died. And seeing as the other two actually know Inaho etc I don't see why they should have that kind of conversation.

And you're right fire does beat ice but still you're missing that Inaho made calculations, he checked how they get frozen, how long it takes etc. Sure you say you might have thought of the same idea but would you think it through and calculate how many shots are needed, the detonation time to ensure it doesn't get frozen and you with it, which speed you need to go at and the distance between shots? Because if you're off on even one of those then you're most likely dead. I highly doubt any normal gamer would figure that out in that short amount of time, some might have winged it and it might work but Inaho didn't wing it that's probably the difference.

By the way I wouldn't call him a genius, I'd call him cold/level headed and calculating to some that's probably the same thing though.

[KrayZ33]

Nothing excuses why nobody else of those pilots came up with a similar plan

Because they can't do that kind of math during a fight... or anywhere else
He went in there knowing how fast he had to move forward to recieve the "heat-explosion-bonus-buff" from manually fine-tuned custom-setting grenades.
Miscalculations would obviously result in death, either by freezing or due to a grenade
His autism allows him to not only do that, but also to disregard his own safety.

Why do you have a problem with that though? It's such a normal thing in anime, it shouldn't bother anyone who watched more than... 2? Especially since you believe Lelouch was a true "genius"... even though ihis situation was not really that much different from what is happening here.

[MFauli]

So Inaho doing all these absurd calculations in seconds is okay, but Death Note is unrealistic? Okay :P

Yes, I couldnt do these calculations, neither could other pilots. The question then is, why can Inaho? Has it been said that he´s autistic and that´s where his super-math skills stem from? Because otherwise, it´s just bullshit to accept this sort of skills without any doubts. No non-autistic person in reality could do calculations like those required on the fly like that.
If we accept these skills to be true, then Id rather call Inaho a robot, rather than a genius.

And still, the basic idea wasnt special. What made it somewhat special is to pull it off just like that. But then it remains to be question if it´s still genius-behavior or something beyond that.

[KrayZ33]

So Inaho doing all these absurd calculations in seconds is okay, but Death Note is unrealistic? Okay :P

It's not about it being realistic or not. *You* are stupid enough to believe it is possible for everyone (with gaming experience) to do just that, just in case you missed shinta's stealth-flame. *You* fail to see that every other show has the same issues and this is anime.


The question then is, why can Inaho? Has it been said that he´s autistic and that´s where his super-math skills stem from? Because otherwise, it´s just bullshit to accept this sort of skills without any doubts.

I don't know, why is Lelouch considered a genius? Who trained him in warfare? Let's just accept that he is intelligent enough to save Japan... because well... that's the plot.
Why is Light so intelligent and able to help the police to solve several cases, even though they have people with so much more experience etc.? Let's just accept that he's smarter than everyone eles, because otherwise he would get caught 2 episodes later.

What can I say, Inaho is smarter than the rest, that enough is reason enough to believe he can pull off something like this. It's obviously nothing too far fetched, because you would've done the same in Zelda.

[Ryllharu]

i dont know about using grenades, but it should be any person´s normal train of thought: enemy uses freezing attack, we cannot approach him - only solution: unfreeze the path towards the enemy.


And you're right fire does beat ice but still you're missing that Inaho made calculations, he checked how they get frozen, how long it takes etc. Sure you say you might have thought of the same idea but would you think it through and calculate how many shots are needed, the detonation time to ensure it doesn't get frozen and you with it, which speed you need to go at and the distance between shots? Because if you're off on even one of those then you're most likely dead. I highly doubt any normal gamer would figure that out in that short amount of time, some might have winged it and it might work but Inaho didn't wing it that's probably the difference.

Fireheart covered it perfectly. It wasn't that Inaho knew to use grenades to close with the enemy kataphract. It's that he knew how many he would need and the appropriate intervals to fire them. He had to go at X km/h firing grenades at Y meters every Z seconds.


And Inaho isn't even the first character that can do math in his head to accomplish these kinds of feats.

Ikkyuu Tensai from Ryuugajou Nanana no Maizoukin (timing out the crazy traps)
Katase Shima & Otoyama Kouta from Stellvia (especially the former).
Dan JD from Basquash (an idiot through and through who can subconsciously rebound objects, including off surfaces beyond his vision).
L-elf from Kakumeiki Valvrave
Edward Wong Hau Pepelu Tivrusky IV from Cowboy Bebop
Koiso Kenji from Summer Wars (cracking high level encryption with pen and paper)
Numerous characters from Medaka

[fireheart]

So Inaho doing all these absurd calculations in seconds is okay, but Death Note is unrealistic? Okay :P

Yes, I couldnt do these calculations, neither could other pilots. The question then is, why can Inaho? Has it been said that he´s autistic and that´s where his super-math skills stem from? Because otherwise, it´s just bullshit to accept this sort of skills without any doubts. No non-autistic person in reality could do calculations like those required on the fly like that.
If we accept these skills to be true, then Id rather call Inaho a robot, rather than a genius.

And still, the basic idea wasnt special. What made it somewhat special is to pull it off just like that. But then it remains to be question if it´s still genius-behavior or something beyond that.

You're mixing arguments from different people and throwing them together as if one person said it. IMO it diminishes your arguments since neither KrayZ33 or I mentioned Death Note but you're throwing it around as if we made that statement.

What you're basically saying in your second paragraph is "Why should we accept any genius type/OP character that doesn't have any kind of believable reason for it (that I can accept)?". The short answer is: Because it's fiction. Sure plot armor exists and is applied to Inaho but I sure didn't start watching Aldnoah.Zero because I wanted realistic action/setting/characters/plot. I honestly have no idea what you expected a mecha show were mechs have super powers to be like.

Does it matter that the basic idea wasn't special? Would you accept it more easily if it was some sort of absurdly elaborate plan that no one would have ever thought of?


It wasn't that Inaho knew to use grenades to close with the enemy kataphract. It's that he knew how many he would need and the appropriate intervals to fire them. He had to go at X km/h firing grenades at Y meters every Z seconds.

I should have you summarize all my posts, the point would probably get across way easier that way.

[MFauli]

Would you accept it more easily if it was some sort of absurdly elaborate plan that no one would have ever thought of?

Put very simply, yes.
Since these anime keep getting mentioned: Light and L from Death Note, or Lelouch from Code Geass, were geniuses, because they were capable of thinking up plans outside of anybody´s realm of thinking. And yes, realistically speaking, many of these plans were bullshit, in how far-seeing they were and such. But that´s what made it awesome and exciting to follow. You really got the feeling that these were geniuses that are so far above all other characters, wondering what they´d do next, what exactly their current goal might be.
With Inaho, sans the apparent super-math skills, it´s different. Inaho isn´t really thinking outside of the box. He´s having ideas that, imo, most people would come up with (and I only used videogames as an example btw). His ideas simply aren´t special enough to make me go "Woah!". Now, that still would be okay, you know. A plan is a plan, as long as it works, what else matters? But here arises the problem: The other characters in this anime, including supposedly highly-intelligent military leaders, keep praising Inaho for his ... ?genius?. They act as if their own plans can only ever consist of sending their own pilots out against the enemy, standing there shooting ... and waiting to be killed. Because they dont have any clever ideas.
That is why I´d have preferred the confidence angle: Have other characters come up with similar ideas, but have Inaho is the only one daring to actually do it. Exceptional confidence is better than faw-creativity.

In the end, yes, Inaho is a genius within the world of Aldnoah.Zero. But that, very obviously, isnt saying a whole lot.

[Ryllharu]

If it is absurd, contrived, there is no foreshadowing for it, it is "true genius".
If it is methodical, sensible, and well thought out, it is "bullshit".

I think we're done here.

[Buffalobiian]

That is why I´d have preferred the confidence angle: Have other characters come up with similar ideas, but have Inaho is the only one daring to actually do it. Exceptional confidence is better than faw-creativity.

If you don't try the idea you're dead. That's why everyone else is dead.

Everybody used Inaho's plan to escape the very first absorbing mech. Confidence was not an issue. Coming up with it is.

No one pussies out from an idea when the alternative is death.

[MFauli]

We´ll have to agree to disagree then. I´ll stay with the opinion that Inaho´s idea arent so special that nobody else could come up with, especially other trained military personell, including veterans and leaders.

[KrayZ33]

There are no veterans on Earth's side except for Marito. Each Cataphract is a complete unknown for every soldier on Earth. Knowledge is gained through death.

[fireheart]

Put very simply, yes.
Since these anime keep getting mentioned: Light and L from Death Note, or Lelouch from Code Geass, were geniuses, because they were capable of thinking up plans outside of anybody´s realm of thinking. And yes, realistically speaking, many of these plans were bullshit, in how far-seeing they were and such. But that´s what made it awesome and exciting to follow. You really got the feeling that these were geniuses that are so far above all other characters, wondering what they´d do next, what exactly their current goal might be.
With Inaho, sans the apparent super-math skills, it´s different. Inaho isn´t really thinking outside of the box. He´s having ideas that, imo, most people would come up with (and I only used videogames as an example btw). His ideas simply aren´t special enough to make me go "Woah!". Now, that still would be okay, you know. A plan is a plan, as long as it works, what else matters? But here arises the problem: The other characters in this anime, including supposedly highly-intelligent military leaders, keep praising Inaho for his ... ?genius?. They act as if their own plans can only ever consist of sending their own pilots out against the enemy, standing there shooting ... and waiting to be killed. Because they dont have any clever ideas.
That is why I´d have preferred the confidence angle: Have other characters come up with similar ideas, but have Inaho is the only one daring to actually do it. Exceptional confidence is better than faw-creativity.

In the end, yes, Inaho is a genius within the world of Aldnoah.Zero. But that, very obviously, isnt saying a whole lot.

Looking at the past few pages, no they don't keep getting mentioned, you mention them and others only mention them in reply to you.

I don't really remember any of the plans etc that Light and L did so won't talk about them. Lelouch I do remember though since it was more recent. If I compare Inaho and Lelouch and break down their actions then they're not really that different. Step 1 (Intel): Inaho gathers intel by experimenting himself in midst of battle, Lelouch gains intel through others or by using his geass. Step 2 (Make use of intel): Inaho makes some kind of decision based on what kind of resources he has at his disposal in midst of battle, Lelouch usually spends days or weeks to come up with a plan and useful pawns. Step 3 (Win): Inaho wins (unless plot says otherwise), Lelouch wins (unless plot says otherwise). Honestly if we had access to all the intel that Lelouch had about everything in the city it's hardly impossible for any of us to make a note of what could be used or make counter plans when you have days or weeks to plan.

As Ryllharu says there's no foreshadowing in the things Lelouch does and we get to see some intel (far from everything) -> end result. While with Inaho we get to see every step from intel gathering -> decision -> execution -> end result.

Looking at Lelouchs track record, he's easily swayed by his emotions and doesn't really handle unknown factors/surprises well. Inaho is basically the opposite he's cold and reactive so he can deal with unknown factors/surprises a lot easier and really that's what makes him different from the rest in the show. Another thing to keep in mind is that most of Inahos fights are 1v1 while Lelouchs usually fight by moving troops around.

Finally a quote from Rider in F/Z: "Using a simple method to accomplish something impressive far outshines using a complex method to achieve the same thing." honestly I agree with this quote, why make anything needlessly complicated if you can achieve it through more simple means?

Edit: By the way your idea about putting napalm all over the place probably wouldn't work. It saps the molecular motion of everything within 1 km radius. If you drop the napalm to make a path the whole path would get frozen at the same time and from what Inaho gathered the grenades won't make it past 50 m without being completely frozen. Having burning napalm rain down into his field and travel 1 km? Seems very unlikely that it'd even make it to the ground since he could stop chemical reactions as proven by the batteries. So unless you have any other ideas you'd probably be dead now (For the record if it was me I'd probably already be dead).

[Ryllharu]

HS-S02E02



--------------------------------------------














What the fuck is this "wind" that they keep referring to?

The satellite belt is in LEO, there is no solar wind. Even if it was the solar wind, it wouldn't affect their shots much at all. They follow the curvature of the earth thanks to gravity. Intercepting objects is something humanity has done since very early on in the space race. The Russians have had to do it by eyeballing it (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soyuz_T-13).

It should be an easy calculation for their kataphract's onboard computers to handle and compensate for.

[Buffalobiian]

What the fuck is this "wind" that they keep referring to?

The 'wind' refers to the gravitational forces within the satellite belt that is supposedly altering the projectiles' trajectory.

Slaine's mech's power is pre-cognition? That's.. handy.

[lelouch]

If I compare Inaho and Lelouch and break down their actions then they're not really that different.

Yes they are. Lelouch is 100% strategy. Inaho is 100% tactics.

[Buffalobiian]

Yes they are. Lelouch is 100% strategy. Inaho is 100% tactics.

Lelouch is kind of both. Strategy = What are we trying to accomplish. Tactics = How do we it.

[lelouch]

Lelouch is kind of both. Strategy = What are we trying to accomplish. Tactics = How do we it.

No, what you're trying to accomplish is called a goal. Strategy is the high-level ahead-of-time planning. Tactics is real-time analytics and on-the-go planning.

[Buffalobiian]

Victory is your goal.

Choosing the path you take (economic, military, cultural = if we're to take a Civilisation view), and therefore choosing your battles is your strategy. That's 'what' you're trying to accomplish. (Victory as the overall endpoint is a given).

Winning those battles is tactics.


If fighting consisted of a single act, no further subdivision would be needed. However, it consists of a greater or lesser number of single acts, each complete in itself, which... are called "engagements". This gives rise to the completely different activity of planning and executing these engagements themselves, and of coordinating each of them with the others in order to further the object of the war. One has been called tactics, and the other strategy... According to our classification, then, tactics teaches the use of armed forces in the engagement; strategy, the use of engagements for the object of the war.

http://www.clausewitz.com/readings/Dunn.htm

How you organise your troops, use the lay of the land and call our when/what to shoot is all tactics.

Deciding that you'll win the war by winning over the princess, or by splitting royal family members - that's strategy.

All levels require prediction and prior planning. The difference is in the overall scale. When Lelouch sits at the top of his order and directs his units, that's strategy (scale-wise it's probably operational, but we'll leave that out). When Lelouch is one mech out of 5 and tells them how to move and which wall to shoot through, that's tactics. He does both.

I agree that Inaho takes no place in strategy. He is a soldier who isn't even officially in command of his unit. He just wins the fight he's told to.

[lelouch]

Nah dude that's not right

[Ryllharu]

I watch this show for Inko.

Though it was pretty clever of Inaho to rile her up to use her as a baseline. We also saw how much more of it is in him. It's a lot more than just a cyborg eye, they gave him brain replacement parts and additional processing power.

His personality is also changing a little. The old Inaho didn't seem like he would ever tease Inko like that. Rayet noticed what he was doing even if Inko didn't.


I'll also admit that I like the fake princess a little more this episode. Cliché as it may be, I do enjoy, "I'll steal everything from you!" characters. It shows the viewers more about the other characters. Slaine's already falling for it, even if he pines after Seylum in the tube, the Emperor was happy to see her alive at all that he doesn't bother looking harder, Inaho will already be disgusted by her, etc.

[fireheart]

Yes they are. Lelouch is 100% strategy. Inaho is 100% tactics.

Doesn't really matter since it doesn't change the points I mentioned. Unless you refute those points my statement stands that they're not really that different.

[KrayZ33]

Nah dude that's not right

It's correct...

A strategy is a campaign plan, a tactic describes the actions to gain an objective of said strategy/plan.

Lelouch did indeed handle both sides.



What the fuck is this "wind" that they keep referring to?


I always thought they meant the gravitational pull caused by the asteroids
Which is why each bullets goes left, then up, then down, then left etc.... which is weird but meh.

[Ryllharu]

Fine, then don't call it "wind".

Wind in the context of space means one very specific thing, that isn't what they're using it for.

edit:

Buff answered it too before this silly debate about how to compare Code Geass to this.

[shinta|hikari]

The new OP and ED suck, at least in comparison to the ones in the first season.

I find it funny how "No differences" was playing while Earthlings and Martians are killing each other.

Hey, the sky is blue for a different reason in A/Z. I don't mind them using a term differently. They even call their mechs "horses/steeds."

[Buffalobiian]

Hey, the sky is blue for a different reason in A/Z. I don't mind them using a term differently.

?

I thought we established last time that the Rey-whatever effect was actually a thing and probably does contribute to the blue in our sky.

[shinta|hikari]

Okay I got confused. What was the reason Slaine mentioned again?

[Ryllharu]

I can't find the exact wording because I can't find that scene where she describes it and Inaho gives her an "Um, Actually...", but over the years, Slaine has told both Princesses that the sky is blue using the explanation usually given to children, that it is because of refracted light.

Inaho described the correct answer to Asseylum, Rayleigh scattering. Blue light gets scattered more, thus the sky appears blue.

[MFauli]

just watched the new episode.

so .... why dont terrans implement the technology of inaho´s eyes into their kataphrakts, so thatt eeeeverybody can calculate ideal shots? And in case you want to say "it would still lack inaho´s mind skills", that´s bs, unless this version of earth has shitty coders who cannot create an adequate software.

man, even though slaine is such a bastard, im rooting for him to beat inaho.

[KrayZ33]

why dont terrans implement the technology of inaho´s eyes into their kataphrakts, so thatt eeeeverybody can calculate ideal shots? And in case you want to say "it would still lack inaho´s mind skills", that´s bs, unless this version of earth has shitty coders who cannot create an adequate software.

why would they even need to pilot the mechs themselves if they could do that? Let "AL" handle it.

[lelouch]

Episode 3:

---------------------------

Well that was unexpected. I don't fully understand Slaine. I hated both Saazbaum and Inaho as characters in the beginning. As soon as I start liking either of them, he kills them. Now I don't like him. Will he kill himself?

[KrayZ33]

It's cool how things turned out for him... it was really odd when he spared Saazbaum back in Season 1. Turns out he used him to climb up the ranks to change into Evil-Suzaku, so he can "change whats wrong from withing"

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 04 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=650977)

------------------







Aldnoah Zero - Fight between two supercomputers.

I just realised Yuki is the only person who can get Rayet to smile.

The gravity knight better survive. With Asseylum out of the picture he's the only one who can start some meaningful Martian-Earthling conversation.

[Ryllharu]

I'm just glad that there was an episode that almost didn't require Inaho. Marito and Yuki figured it out all on their own. Someone else intelligent exists!

Any orbital artillery unit could have provided the attack they needed to damage the kataphract. Inaho was more for the "reuniting" with Yuki than his actual assistance.

What I don't care for is Slaine being played up as a tactical genius all of a sudden. The guy was an idiot last season. His skill is almost entirely from the kataphract. Outside the cockpit he's still an idiot, the bastard princess is playing him like a fiddle.

[Xelbair]

I think that his sudden increase in tactical and political skills is due to:
a) Saazbaum teaching him over the time
b) He's using Tharsis to gain insight to the future.

[shinta|hikari]

Agreed. It's still annoying as hell, though.

[MFauli]

I never got the future seeing thing. How exactly is he enabled to do that? You mention the Tharsis. How does it work?

As for the episode, can I claim to be as intelligent as Inaho now? lol :P
Dropping something onto this Aldnoah-powered Kataphrakt was exactly my train of thought. I only wondered what they could use for it. Of course, Inaho had a satellite up there :Di

[Buffalobiian]

It's just some sort of prediction/calculation engine, much like Inaho's eye. The difference being Tharsis outputs this visually as to require less thinking. It also has superior performance to earth units such that it can also react to said predictions.

[Buffalobiian]

HS - Episode 05 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=653833)

--------------------------------












Fret not, Inko. You don't need a diet.

This episode's dialogue moved the story further than the other 4 did. There's been action, but really nothing's happened since it's just Earth vs Mars. Internal investigation like what Slaine did last season is what's required.

Fight-wise, there's no competition other than Inaho vs Tharsis. Everything else will just die in the wake of either of those. The princess needs to be careful too. I do believe she underestimates Slaine if she thinks she can free herself from his cage just by being an entitled princess.

[shinta|hikari]

The fact that the fake princess was moved by the words of a smarmy random character whose name we will never remember proves how insignificant she is outside of her Aldnoah triggering genes. What was her name again?

I loved it when Inaho referred to Asseylum as Seylum in front of his brocon sis.

InahoXRayet? I love Rayet, but no, Asseylum all the way.

Inko looks so generic I have trouble identifying her at times. I am unsure why you guys like her so much. I don't disapprove. Rather, I'd appreciate it if you enlighten me.

[Buffalobiian]

InahoXRayet? I love Rayet, but no, Asseylum all the way.

Inko looks so generic I have trouble identifying her at times. I am unsure why you guys like her so much. I don't disapprove. Rather, I'd appreciate it if you enlighten me.

Ryll, your move.

Personally I find that Inko's a good balance of everything. A jack of all trades. She's not as girly as the blonde, but not quite as tough as Rayet. It's that middle ground that makes her approachable as a person and useful as a soldier. She fits in with the girls and also coordinates with Inaho's earlier plans while maintaining common sense. (Inaho doesn't have common sense, that is true)

Her cutest aspect would be her reactions. The way she talks during battle, or sighs when realising Inaho was still a virgin etc.

Things might change a bit now that Rayet's matured more, but early-game Inko was the best of the three girls (blonde girlish girl, Red brooding Rayet). Seylum and Yuki are in categories of their own.

[shinta|hikari]

So you're saying it is precisely because she is so average that she's good?

[Buffalobiian]

"Average" is one way to put it. "Complete" is another way. She's balanced, but her stats aren't bad. She's just not appealing to hardcore girly fans or tough-girl camps. She's not outstanding, but you see her reactions much more readily so she's overall less boring.

I prefer the term "balanced" because these days "average" implies relative incompetence. Nobody likes just average.

[shinta|hikari]

I see. If that is indeed her appeal, I completely understand why I do not like her (not dislike). I have always preferred more polar characters.

[MFauli]

episode 18:
------------------


lol
from simply accepting a terran as one of theirs to marrying their princess. ya know, if i were martian id refuse to accept that, too. I guess if Slaine was a real, he´d have ended slavery, homophobia and sexism in a week.

[shinta|hikari]

The smart thing Slaine did was he took advantage of all the backward systems in place in the Vers empire. He had the advantage of a more educated and politically advanced upbringing. It was kinda annoying how HE was able to do it considering his incompetency in the first season, but it isn't impossible if you have a fake princess and a crystal ball.

Now that Seylum is awake, I wonder how emoprincess will fare. She is absolutely inferior, like she said so herself. Having the real thing around makes her useless, until of course, Slaine finds out that Seylum is in love with Inaho and completely against everything he has done so far.

[Buffalobiian]

I'm pretty sure Slaine deep down already knows that Seylum and Inaho are in love.

How Slaine won the duel was still a little weird though. It's true that while the funnels were forced to attack from a single direction, the same was true for Slaine. He should only overcome that situation if he had an overwhelming speed advantage, or a superior firepower advantage that wasn't too slow. What we actually saw, were the funnels acting weirdly as if they malfunctioned and lost their chance to shoot.

[shinta|hikari]

Yeah, execution was lacking. Slaine's explanation was that the funnels were designed to surround the enemy, making it hard to shoot them down because they are all over the place and shooting at you from different directions. However, the entire fight was the funnels shooting at Slaine from behind because he was dashing away the whole time. The supposed advantage of the funnels were never really displayed.

If I had directed that, the funnels should have been moving in different directions and covering a larger area, trying to corner Slaine as he zipped around. Then Slaine would use his dumbass crystal ball to somehow avoid being cornered and then hide into that tunnel. Then it would make perfect sense that he would be able to shoot the funnels down because they are clumped together in one direction instead of trying to surround him all the time.

[Buffalobiian]

If I had directed that, the funnels should have been moving in different directions and covering a larger area, trying to corner Slaine as he zipped around. Then Slaine would use his dumbass crystal ball to somehow avoid being cornered and then hide into that tunnel.

Add to that some shots of where Slaine predicts a funnel and tries to shoot it down only to be warned that another funnel has sneaked up on hin from another position, thereby forcing him to continue running.