Magi [Archive] - Page 2 - Gotwoot Forums

Buffalobiian

Sun, 12-15-2013, 09:58 PM

Or it's a place where the dead become dark ruhk and that's why he won't bring anyone back from it. It's also why he would protect it. If that organization would get their hands on it....

He says that he's not sure if he is capable, but also that he "prefers not to". He didn't say that he'd prefer not to bring her over to the other side, so I doubt it's the case where the dead become dark ruhk. This assumes that he has a desire for people to not become dark ruhk, which may or may not be true.

How do you know?

This is a magic world where dead people turn into butterflies that are used to fuel magic.

They could very much require protection.

They would only require protection if they suffer harm from the process.

DarthEnderX

Sun, 12-15-2013, 10:07 PM

They would only require protection if they suffer harm from the process.Not sure what you mean by "the process". I assume you mean normal magic.

He could be protecting them from some evil wizard coming to that place and taking them to power some evil scheme.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 12-15-2013, 10:23 PM

DarthEnderX

Sun, 12-15-2013, 11:04 PM

He's protecting people from physically accessing the underworld? This Rift is a physical barrier between the living and the dead?

And yeah, I mean magic by "process". It's not like the dead are being dragged from their happy underworld homes to slave-drive magical items when Ruhk is being used for magic.Right, but he could be protecting them from exactly that. Some villain going to their happy underworld homes and slaving them for some evil purpose.

I'm saying, you don't KNOW what he's protecting them from, and to assume the dead don't need protecting, when they are a power source in this setting, is silly.

This is, of course, assuming that this actually is all some kind of metaphor for the underworld. Which I'm not convinced is the case.

Kraco

Mon, 12-16-2013, 03:30 AM

Generally speaking in ancient folk lore and legends living people travel to the underworld with considerable more success than they manage to escape back to the world of the living from there. If that abyss is indeed a boundary to the world of the dead in this show, then having a guardian there claiming none may return makes historical sense. In addition to the Ruhk theory, it's also quite possible that if one manages to return, they could bring a dead person with them, either for a full resurrection or to some form of undeath, which would be a concrete reason not to want anyone to return.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 12-16-2013, 04:15 AM

See, I don't think the dead are living in some happy underworld home. They're a bunch of energies being returned to collective mother earth. Remember that big ball of Ruhk that we saw some time ago? I think that's where the dead reside.

Ruhk is like The Force. I don't think you can "stop" someone from accessing it physically or lock it down.

That said, we do see Ruhk flying off into the distance all the time. Exactly where they go. That observation gives weight to your theory of having the underworld as a "place".

NeoCybercoin

Mon, 12-16-2013, 08:01 AM

True, but it could also be that he is protecting the world from that place. I mean grudges, negative emotions give rise to the black Ruhk which in turn is used by Al-Thamen to create Dark Metal Vessels etc. From what I remember those black Rukh kind of spread the negative emotions causing more of them to be created. The Fanalis had their entire race enslaved killed w/e. That would be one hell of a grudge and if Al-Thamen could get their hands on something like that....

But it's all just speculation at this point I suppose.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 12-22-2013, 06:07 AM

HS - Episode 12 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=504844)

------------------------------

I'm rather surprised that Hyakuryuu's mother really was a bitch. I was so expecting the "save my children by giving myself" plotline from her. Equally surprising was that the magical training arc is now essentially over.. unless the real meat is during 2nd year curriculum.

NeoCybercoin

Sun, 12-22-2013, 10:05 AM

Well time does fly by quickly in the show. I mean they travel a lot which also takes a lot of time. I mean Kouha had to go back to his country when Aladin was training in his first year. From what I've heard Magnostadt and the Kou Empire are pretty far apart so that's a long travel. Hell it might already be the second year for Aladin right now.

On sidenote I like how cunning Sinbad is using Kogyoku to spy on their plans. At least that's what I gather from her eyes lighting up green for a moment and the image of Sinbad's Full Equip in her mind.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 12-22-2013, 12:06 PM

I wasn't sure whether it was spying, or whether she was under manipulation. Still, a very resourceful move.

By the way, them moles are hot.

Ryllharu

Mon, 12-23-2013, 06:11 AM

They have sure turned Kogyoku from the psychotic bitch we first met to super-adorable pretty fast.

But seriously, they really are setting up her and Alibaba up as a compatible couple. Both being the child of a prostitute and a ruler, both having confidence issues, both wanting to do the right thing but not having the power to do it, etc. Sorry Morg, you can become Kou Empress after Hakuryu regains his senses. Kogyoku can then be used to join the Kou Empire with Alibaba's "Chosen by the Magi" kingdom. Peace through marriage, not conquest!

I'm disappointed in Hakuei. I kinda expected Hakuryu to be all rabid about murdering his mother with some grand scheme (ultimately bound to fail) to share with his blood sister, but everything he said was far more persuasive accurate than anything Kouen said. Hakuei just doesn't get it. The only reason the Kouga submitted was because Aladdin encouraged them to end the bloodshed, reminding them of Baba's will. Hakuryu was right, Hakuei still subjugated them with force, they just didn't fight. There are bound to be members still upset about it, carrying that grudge, but the memory of Baba's words overpower that in the meantime. Hakuryu was remarkably sensible, but she is too smitten by her adoptive brother I guess.

What the hell did the empress do to the previous emperor? Even the royals were horrified.
Are we to assume that she's the Queen Bitch of Al Thamen, their actual leader (or at the very least as inner circle as you can get)? She seems more powerful than even Judal, because she didn't appear to do much of anything to stop Hakuryu. Even Judal would have had to actively shield himself. She didn't even do that, because whatever defense she had up would have stopped when she went to touch him.

Kraco

Mon, 12-23-2013, 10:52 AM

Hakuei was certainly disappointing, not that I'd have really expected anything much from such a minor character, but I'm a little disillusioned by Hakuryu himself. While his sudden plan to upset the internal order was quite sharp, he still counted far too much on his new powers or perhaps couldn't keep himself in check enough to see those plans he had to the end. In other words, he acted like some upstart.

The Empress certainly seemed like a big boss villain. From Hakuryu's earlier recollections I had thought she might be some kind of a witch, but still mainly a cheap opportunist.

Kraco

Sun, 01-05-2014, 06:12 AM

Episode 13 - HS (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=508765)

- - - - - - -

Interesting stuff. After seeing the whole episode I can't help but wonder why Leam's magi chose such a sore, arrogant, and hot-headed spy to send to Magnostadt. While it makes sense the spy had to climb to the top and thus be strong and to a degree ruthless, what we saw here still doesn't make much sense. The balance between being the top student to gain access to deeper secrets yet not gathering unwanted attention is a very delicate one, and a fool can't pull it off. So, why did Scheherazade send such a dude? Aladdin is certainly making much better progress with his approach full of innocence. But then again, if Magnostadt really is a kingdom of evil, maybe Titus's wickedness will appeal to those in power...

In any case, Aladdin is learning a lot by attending the academy. Regardless of what he manages to find out, he still made absolutely the correct choice by going there. I bet his magic in general will not only be far more innovative and varied in the future but also stronger due to having to raise his efficiency exponentially by relying only on his inborn rukh.

Kraco

Sun, 01-05-2014, 06:12 AM

Buffalobiian

Sun, 01-05-2014, 06:46 AM

I can't help but wonder how Scheherazade and Titus are related. Is the former just some subordinate? Is he a familiar of her, or perhaps even a blood descendant? I ask that because normally people can't access external Magoi, assuming that the stone really is there to suppress Magoi absorption. It was used as a communication tool here, but it makes no sense to implant something merely used to communicate.

I'm glad Aladdin went for his (lack of) tits, because I wouldn't have been convinced either.

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-05-2014, 06:57 AM

So, why did Scheherazade send such a dude? Aladdin is certainly making much better progress with his approach full of innocence. But then again, if Magnostadt really is a kingdom of evil, maybe Titus's wickedness will appeal to those in power...
[Emphasis mine.]
If she had sent a girl though...Aladdin would be ruined!

I think that last line is exactly why she sent him, though the way he was whining in the solitary, I wonder how much he truly is like that. I'd guess that she's after investigating the same thing Aladdin's dreams keep pointing him to, where Aladdin came for Dunya's revenge and why Magnostadt is creating so many dark vessels and this new dream thing is secondary.

In any case, Aladdin is learning a lot by attending the academy. Regardless of what he manages to find out, he still made absolutely the correct choice by going there. I bet his magic in general will not only be far more innovative and varied in the future but also stronger due to having to raise his efficiency exponentially by relying only on his inborn rukh.
I think they're really underrepresenting Meier's teaching ability. We know that inside she's a big softie, so maybe she voluntarily always takes on the worst students in their first year. She gets rid of the ones who lack determination, and ensures the rest are well-rounded enough that they can take on purely magic users. A strong magician can excel at offense and defense, but Meier's students are spellswords, excelling at both simultaneously. Even magicians have trouble against pure martial arts geniuses like Morgiana or many of Sinbad's merry band. Meier's students would have less of a problem.

Would Aladdin's Vibration Shatter work with any object or staff he's holding, or is Baba's a lot more than what it seems? The words from the audience were a little ambiguous. Was it "no ordinary staff" because Aladdin was combining two magics at the end of it, or did he mean that it's a special staff to be able to take that kind of combination without disintegrating itself?

Buffalobiian

Sun, 01-05-2014, 07:27 AM

Would Aladdin's Vibration Shatter work with any object or staff he's holding, or is Baba's a lot more than what it seems? The words from the audience were a little ambiguous. Was it "no ordinary staff" because Aladdin was combining two magics at the end of it, or did he mean that it's a special staff to be able to take that kind of combination without disintegrating itself?

I thought it was special in that it didn't use much Magoi, but that sounded like it was spell-specific. I think you're right about the disintegrating part, but then again staffs don't end up burning just because they fired a fireball either :S.

Edit: The director was the other person of note this episode. He's nice, but I bet you he's only nice to magicians. He rates whether boys are "good" or not by their magical skill/potential, and loves them accordingly, much like this character (http://s1.zerochan.net/Tohsaka.Tokiomi.240.1475795.jpg).

DarthEnderX

Sun, 01-05-2014, 03:07 PM

I ask that because normally people can't access external Magoi, assuming that the stone really is there to suppress Magoi absorption. It was used as a communication tool here, but it makes no sense to implant something merely used to communicate.I think it's actually the opposite. While Aladdin's stone is used to suppress his Magi powers, I think Titus's stone is actually being used to transfer some of Scheherazade's Magi power to him.

After all, if it was a suppression stone, it's not working for shit, because he has magoi swarming all over him.

If that's the case, that sucks for Titus, because he needs an outside buff just to be able to go toe-to-toe with Aladdin with a limiter on.

Kraco

Sun, 01-05-2014, 04:18 PM

If that's the case, that sucks for Titus, because he needs an outside buff just to be able to go toe-to-toe with Aladdin with a limiter on.

Normal humans aren't really supposed to be anywhere near magi, and I doubt it's only because of the amount of magoi. Aladdin knew next to nothing about magic compared to some of the students we have seen, yet now he was already competing for the first place among the former first years / new second years. He's sucking knowledge faster than Bill can suck canned soup. He also has no troubles applying the knowledge in novel ways. Thus I don't think comparing to Aladdin, or any magi, is relevant. Titus does kick ass against any normal people, that much is clear and that's what counts. I very much doubt Scheherazade would have ever imagined a noob magi was secretly among the new students.

KrayZ33

Sun, 01-05-2014, 04:49 PM

Normal humans aren't really supposed to be anywhere near magi

if thats the case, what does Alladin have to fear
I believe the stronger, more experienced mages are able to deal with them rather well, its probably more of a problem with how many spells the "normal" mages are able to cast before they run out of magoi

Kraco

Sun, 01-05-2014, 04:59 PM

if thats the case, what does Alladin have to fear

He had to fear running out of magoi. Not to mention he's still a beginner, which means he's vulnerable. Even a tiger is vulnerable as a cub.

KrayZ33

Sun, 01-05-2014, 05:12 PM

I thought they have an unlimited amount of magoi, because the rukh always love them or something like that and he can use not just his own, but everyones

Kraco

Sun, 01-05-2014, 05:58 PM

I thought they have an unlimited amount of magoi, because the rukh always love them or something like that and he can use not just his own, but everyones

Aladdin's external magoi source is blocked at the moment, so he has to worry running out the same as anybody. But unlike anybody, he's not risking his life. If shit seems to get too near the fan, all he needs to do is to remove the gem and he has got nearly unlimited magoi, especially now when he's used to a limited amount and wouldn't be wasting it anymore.

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-05-2014, 06:18 PM

Archangel

Sun, 01-05-2014, 06:36 PM

I thought they have an unlimited amount of magoi, because the rukh always love them or something like that and he can use not just his own, but everyones
Dafuck do you think the red stone's for, bling bling? You need to pay more attention, not sure how you missed that.

Kraco

Sun, 01-05-2014, 06:40 PM

The downside is that everyone will know he is a magi, in very bad place for that to happen, especially now that we've been getting hints the magicians destroyed the previous world.

The only worse place would be in front of the Kou Empress.

Yeah, but it's still better than dying. I'm also not certain Magnostadt would do anything immediately. They can't be fools and should know that if they react suddenly, Aladdin would flee. Since Aladdin came in hiding his real identity, Magnostadt's rulers should realise he's not a free magi served on a platter. If the geezer noticed something now, he should play it safe and just observe Aladdin for a while. That is, if he's wise.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 01-06-2014, 02:13 AM

And since Titus has a stone as well and isn't a Magi, we know that just having a stone won't immediately mark Aladdin as a Magi. The Master probably noticed them, but now has to figure out exactly what they are.

KrayZ33

Mon, 01-06-2014, 02:02 PM

Dafuck do you think the red stone's for, bling bling? You need to pay more attention, not sure how you missed that.

who said I missed that

kraco said no human can stand up to a magi and that its not just because of their unlimited amount of magoi
yet he has to hide he is a magi with the help of that stone...because if they find out, they'll kill him
so all I'm saying is that they can kill him with or without the stone and that the only difference between them is *indeed* - the amount of magoi available.

what else would it be?
the show made clear that Alladin has to master spellweaving just like everyone else

David75

Mon, 01-06-2014, 03:27 PM

Are the stones identical? Alladin's seems to have a polyhedron cut, whereas Titus' seem to be round/ovaloïd.
So the difference might really be that Alladin's is to block external rukh, when Titus' serves as a ruhk antenna, the emitter being Sheherazade as proviously hypothesed.

Regarding the Geezer, it seems he's affected by that black power which serves as manipulation medium for Al-Thamen.
Maybe being a great mage he can control it somehow. But I wonder where he really stands, when his underling was very enjoying the idea of proposing a deathmatch between Titus and Alladin.

Kraco

Mon, 01-06-2014, 03:53 PM

yet he has to hide he is a magi with the help of that stone...because if they find out, they'll kill him
so all I'm saying is that they can kill him with or without the stone and that the only difference between them is *indeed* - the amount of magoi available.

I rewatched, jumping, a bunch of the early eps of the season, but I didn't find a scene where they would have suggested Magnostadt would harm Aladdin if they found out he's a magi. My logic tells me they would very earnestly try to win him over and use him, instead, since magi are the most powerful sorcerers and that country is a magocracy. Do you remember where/when they said that, since you are saying they would kill him if found out?

the show made clear that Alladin has to master spellweaving just like everyone else

Of course. He's no match for the likes of Judal, who can use magic in a more versatile manner. What I've been saying is that being a magi not only allows him a far larger supply of magoi but it also speeds up his learning of magic related studies in general. As easygoing a fellow as he is, not any bookworm, and despite knowing relatively little of magic before going to the academy, he already competed for the position of the best student of the class.

In any case I really hope Magnostadt isn't any vassal of Al Thamen. That would be pitiful for the most academically advanced country in the region.

KrayZ33

Tue, 01-07-2014, 12:48 AM

Alladin's Magnostadt tentacle rape scene is shown right before or after he has to use Bork

Kraco

Sun, 01-12-2014, 06:11 AM

Episode 14 - HS (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=511255)

-- - - - - - - - - -

The darkness in Magnostadt is already getting pretty deep. Titus will have something profound to report back, alright. Considering all those people are living underground, without the sky and sun, practically imprisoned and in spiritual desolation except for the cheapest of material things, I'd assume all the rukh the magicians are sucking from there can't be of the golden variety. Perhaps they use the dark rukh to build the weapons we have seen before.

I reckon Aladdin's learning days are nearing their end, even if they manage to escape the fifth district unnoticed.

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-12-2014, 06:52 AM

Not too surprised that they call them Ideology classes, when they're brainwashing classes. I can't imagine that most of the magician students are truly as cold-hearted as those we saw in the 5th district. No matter how much you pamper a student, not everyone can be so callous.

I'm also surprised the old man said the country was worse when Dunya's family ruled. We didn't get to see much of it, but there's just no way. Worse for the entitled 1/3 perhaps.

Titus is so girly though. No wonder Aladdin was so confused.

Kraco

Sun, 01-12-2014, 07:31 AM

I'm also surprised the old man said the country was worse when Dunya's family ruled. We didn't get to see much of it, but there's just no way. Worse for the entitled 1/3 perhaps.

I guess there were lots of slaves, serfs, and general poverty and famine under the previous rule. Little else could explain how the current situation could be an improvement.

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-12-2014, 07:35 AM

What's the difference between being a serf/slave and when you're locked in a hole, drained of life energy until they just throw you to the bottom of the pit?

You occasionally get to see the sun as a serf or slave.

It's a good thing Morg didn't tag along. She'd have been put down there, and then murder ever magician patrol that came down.

Kraco

Sun, 01-12-2014, 08:26 AM

What's the difference between being a serf/slave and when you're locked in a hole, drained of life energy until they just throw you to the bottom of the pit?

You occasionally get to see the sun as a serf or slave.

I'd assume they are happy they aren't forced to work from morning till the evening every day of the week. Probably they are now getting good food as well if they get even booze, after all. I guess they aren't randomly sold off, raped, or manhandled otherwise, either. Although they are unceremoniously thrown into the pit if they get too weak, which is surely a detail that should dampen their spirits more.

However, this all only applies to the old generation that knew worse suffering. For anybody brought in as a kid or born there, the place should be like the hell itself. I don't really see Magnostadt being able to maintain this system as it's now for too long, regardless of Aladdin's intervention. Sooner or later the administration would need to chain the people much more harshly to curb uprisings, sabotage, attacks against the mage patrols, and such.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 01-13-2014, 05:16 AM

@Kraco: I think the magicians have an overwhelming power advantage over the 5th district residents. That's particularly true for the nasty, combat-trained. This makes me wonder how Meirs takes all this in. She hasn't been shown to be have an evil aura like the other teachers (nor does she dress like them), but I have no doubt she knows about this place.

@Ryll: Ruhk is different from Magoi right? I only remember seeing dark Ruhk. The only "dark magoi" I remember seeing is Kassim's inside Alibaba, and that could have been drawn that way by the studio for illustration purposes only.

Kraco

Mon, 01-13-2014, 08:32 AM

@Kraco: I think the magicians have an overwhelming power advantage over the 5th district residents.

Sure they do. But currently the minority is exploiting the majority with considerable ease. All they do is send in the food and wine, and those occasional patrols for who knows what reasons, maybe only for disease control and to limit the food used by those who can't produce rukh. However, if the citizens of the 5th district turn restless, the magicians will need to dedicate a significant amount of troops to control them around the clock, plus keep repairing the damage caused to avoid the quantity of rukh collected dropping.

It's like pumping oil from a pleasant desert field far away from people and any delicate nature compared to going to a challenging sea location requiring expensive equipment and risking exceedingly costly environmental catastrophes. But like with oil, it's only a matter of time for Magnostadt before things get complicated. It would have happened eventually without Aladdin, but with him probably sooner.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 01-13-2014, 10:08 AM

So, I have a sneaking suspicion that Titus isn't a real person and is some kind of magical construct created by Shaharazad. What with him seeming to have no experience of seemingly normal things, and the way she said this mission is the reason for his existence.

@Ryll: Ruhk is different from Magoi right? I only remember seeing dark Ruhk. The only "dark magoi" I remember seeing is Kassim's inside Alibaba, and that could have been drawn that way by the studio for illustration purposes only.As far as I can tell, the Ruhk are the butterflies that represent, like, people's spirits or something like that.

Magoi is mana.

Rukh seem to be made of Magoi, or they carry it at least.

What's the difference between being a serf/slave and when you're locked in a hole, drained of life energy until they just throw you to the bottom of the pit?

You occasionally get to see the sun as a serf or slave.You say that, but there are countless people that would kill to be in a situation like that.

Free food and water, and all they have to do is live underground? The real world is full of places where living is way worse than that.

Kraco

Mon, 01-13-2014, 11:45 AM

Rukh seem to be made of Magoi, or they carry it at least.

They seem quite interchangeable, but only the magi seem to be able to collect rukh from air and use it for magic like normal magicians use their inborn magoi. Based on this episode it seems like Magnostadt is able to collect rukh as well, even if they need some fancy constructions and magical tools for it.

I guess magic (mana) is magoi when it's inside an organism and rukh when it's freely outside.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 01-13-2014, 10:38 PM

Kraco

Tue, 01-14-2014, 02:37 AM

That would also explain his girly interests: If he was created by a female, his personality construct might have such tendencies despite the body of a man.

Kraco

Sun, 01-19-2014, 05:53 AM

Episode 15 - HS (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=513889)

- - - - - - - -

Quite a story, and I have a feeling it was true as well. The lecture itself was such that there's no doubt it won over many of the magicians. The line about normal humans seeking power and wealth and magicians seeking knowledge was especially good. This gives the students a perfect excuse to live and pursue their interests, that is, knowledge and magical power, in the splendid environment of Magnostadt, despite the human rukh cattle in the dungeon. Humans seek their own comfort and it's easy to ignore something they have no personal attachment to. If some magician had parents or siblings down there, it might be a different thing, but I doubt many do.

Objectively speaking this is all, of course, just a reverse of the previous situation, so I doubt Aladdin (& co) will be convinced, but if nothing else, this hopefully will make them think of the alternatives. If they break the current system, will they accept the responsibility of building a better one or will they just be destroyers who will walk away leaving nothing but ruins and victims in their wake? A pretty tough situation.

In any case, this easily explains many of Magnostadt's actions; they don't care what happens to non-magicians anywhere, as long as magicians will get stronger and get to the top. So, spreading magical tools around indiscriminately is sensible as it gives powerful means of fighting to magic sensitive people even if they don't have the formal arcane knowledge and skills to defend themselves otherwise. Of course shaking the regimes of the normal people is another benefit.

I'll be really pissed off if this wasn't true history but only something cooked up by al Thamen.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 01-19-2014, 06:25 AM

I don't think al Thamen has a hand in Magnostadt, do they? I thought they were specifically backing the Kou Empire.

Mogamett said that none of the lvl5 citizens asked to leave. If they did, would it have been honoured? If that was the case then it's a fair exchange. My impressions were that they weren't though, especially how 1 criminal results in an entire sector being purged.

edit: and as good as the story was, it doesn't explain Aladdin's vision where magicians tried to destroy the unified world under Solomon.

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-19-2014, 07:37 AM

If some magician had parents or siblings down there, it might be a different thing, but I doubt many do.I believe none do. If a goi is related to a magician, they are automatically Level 4 citizens or something.

In any case, this easily explains many of Magnostadt's actions; they don't care what happens to non-magicians anywhere, as long as magicians will get stronger and get to the top. So, spreading magical tools around indiscriminately is sensible as it gives powerful means of fighting to magic sensitive people even if they don't have the formal arcane knowledge and skills to defend themselves otherwise. Of course shaking the regimes of the normal people is another benefit.

I'll be really pissed off if this wasn't true history but only something cooked up by al Thamen.
I found it hard not to at least understand his actions after this episode. Given the way he was treated, what he did is the logical step (for logical thinkers blinded by rage like himself).

Based on the scene where he asked about Yamuraiha, I have no reason to doubt him, and neither does Aladdin. He's telling the truth, and honestly believes this is the only way for magicians and non-magicians to peacefully co-exist and benefit each other. He's a good-hearted man who was pushed too far by grief and resentment. They were treated like slaves by greedy, self-serving cowards while the magicians were actually trying to benefit the nation as a whole. They advanced magic to keep themselves from being used up, but once a war started, the bureaucrats found another way to use them up, and used them as a scapegoat at the same time.

Do I think he used the right method by slaughtering Dunya's family? No. They could have killed off the nobility, blamed her father's death on them, and manipulated her instead using her as a figurehead. I suspect Al Thamen was involved in making the revolt so bloody, because they were so quick to pick her up afterward.

As Buff said, none of them chose to leave, even Marga. They have everything they'd want down there (except the sun) and don't have to do anything for it.

@Buff
I suspect Aladdin's vision has something to do with the magicians being manipulated to "unify the world" or something like that. Possibly by Al Thamen. They try to create some world-altering spell for the good of many but that summons an apocalyptic plague or something demonic instead. In Solomon's time they did it out of rage, similar to Mogamett's revolt, but taken too far.

edit:
It's also worth noting that the old man only produced golden ruhk. Even over the death of his daughter, he only looks forward, to a way to prevent it from happening to someone else. He has no desire to reverse the flow of time and change the past.

He also recognized Yam's teachings, and I bet it is because they are his own. He still very much cares for his second daughter, even if she strongly disagrees with his solution for co-existing with regular people. I wouldn't be surprised if she feels the same way about him, to some degree or another.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 01-19-2014, 08:05 AM

But raging against what? Were they oppressed even then? What we saw from Mogamett was the situation in his country during his time. Up until now we haven't actually seen slavery towards magicians, even though slavery is pretty rampant overall.

And since Solomon had everyone unified already, it's not like they were still scapegoats. If Al Thamen was in it though, then it's a wild card. Anything happens when they're around.

Kraco

Sun, 01-19-2014, 09:26 AM

What we saw from Mogamett was the situation in his country during his time. Up until now we haven't actually seen slavery towards magicians, even though slavery is pretty rampant overall.

We haven't been seeing magicians in greater numbers anywhere but in Magnostadt, so it's hard to say how they are treated in general. Although not seeing them suggests they are hiding or at least not trying to stand out overly much. In his past they were as good as slaves, escorted by spearmen and forced to perform their magic until the task was completed or they dropped dead, whichever happened first.

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-19-2014, 11:38 AM

And since Solomon had everyone unified already, it's not like they were still scapegoats. If Al Thamen was in it though, then it's a wild card. Anything happens when they're around.
I mean the current mages are being manipulated to repeat what occurred once before in the other world due to resentment and rage.

Aladdin is being shown the past to prevent it from happening now. Al Thamen is likely pulling the strings this time.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 01-20-2014, 01:52 AM

I found it hard not to at least understand his actions after this episode. Given the way he was treated, what he did is the logical step (for logical thinkers blinded by rage like himself).Yeah, his viewpoint makes sense given his personal experiences, but of course we know he's way overgeneralizing. There's obviously good people and evil magicians.

As Buff said, none of them chose to leave, even Marga. They have everything they'd want down there (except the sun) and don't have to do anything for it.THAT at least I don't think can possibly be true.

If nobody ever wanted to leave, they wouldn't have patrols down there making headcounts and whatnot making sure nobody left. It simply wouldn't exist unless people had wanted to leave before and they wouldn't allow it.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 01-20-2014, 06:22 AM

I mean the current mages are being manipulated to repeat what occurred once before in the other world due to resentment and rage.

Do you mean:

1) The current mages are being manipulated (due to resentment and rage) to repeat what occurred once before in the other world.

or

2) What occurred once before in the other world was due to rage and resentment, and the current mages are being manipulated to repeat it.

Now that I break it up, I don't think it matters too much to my point (but I'd like to hear which you thought anyway). The fact that wizards defied Solomon's united world proved that Mogamett's theory about wizards seeking only knowledge is wrong.

Kraco

Mon, 01-20-2014, 08:00 AM

Now that I break it up, I don't think it matters too much to my point (but I'd like to hear which you thought anyway). The fact that wizards defied Solomon's united world proved that Mogamett's theory about wizards seeking only knowledge is wrong.

How do you know Solomon's order was acceptable to the wizards? For all we know it might have placed all sorts of rules, regulations, limitations etc on using magic. When you think about modern fiction with magic, it's almost always like that: Either magicians are hiding or the society restricts their use of magic very strictly. Honestly, I don't know how I could live with bullshit like that if I was a magician, but at the same time it would probably be the only way to make the non-magician masses live in a grudging peace with wizards.

Besides, Al Thamen seems to employ magicians but it's certainly concerned about other things than pure knowledge. It's not like Mogamett's dreams or opinions would ever be shared by all magic users.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 01-20-2014, 08:27 AM

How do you know Solomon's order was acceptable to the wizards? For all we know it might have placed all sorts of rules, regulations, limitations etc on using magic. When you think about modern fiction with magic, it's almost always like that: Either magicians are hiding or the society restricts their use of magic very strictly. Honestly, I don't know how I could live with bullshit like that if I was a magician, but at the same time it would probably be the only way to make the non-magician masses live in a grudging peace with wizards.

Well we don't, but it didn't seem like Solomon thought his own offer was too hard to accept either. His (and Aladdin's view therefore) are biased though.

NeoCybercoin

Sun, 01-26-2014, 06:58 AM

Horriblesusb Magi S2-16 1080p (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=516452)

Kraco

Sun, 01-26-2014, 07:28 AM

Mogamett really can be so honest, straightforward and gentle after his own fashion because he doesn't consider non-magians humans anymore (or he doesn't consider magicians humans but something higher and humans are just animals). There's not a trace of doubt in him anymore. The same can't be true for the younger folks who haven't gone through what he did. Thus they won't be as genuine, and in the end they can go either way: Adopt the racist way of thinking as an ideology or they can keep doubting it. The latter people might find living in Magnostadt somewhat haunting, even if they pretended otherwise.

Titus's situation looks worse than I thought. It's clear his past was bad, but now it seems he has no future at all. I doubt Mogamett foresaw this when giving the human pet to Titus, but it couldn't have been better luck for him. It was Marga who made Titus want to defy his destiny, leading to betraying Scheherazade. Who knows what he is, in the end. Maybe he's a non-magician altered by Scheherazade to become a really powerful magician at the cost of his life? We don't really know if Scheherazade is any good, after all.

I still hope Al Thamen doesn't have too much to do with Magnostadt, at least in the form of direct influence. It would be strange if they totally ignored such a nest of magicians, but I want Magnostadt to be standing on its own.

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-26-2014, 08:15 AM

Mogamett Is a good person, just horribly misguided. The conclusions he reached are perfectly understandable given what he's been through, but as you implied, I don't think he realizes that what he's doing in spreading his views is that he's repeating the past, just the other way around. Bureaucrats treated him, his family, and his friends like something less than human, and he's making other people do the same, without any of the context he's been through. He treats the good or selfless goi like pets, he treats the greedy ones like insects. His followers treat them all like firewood.

We don't really know if Scheherazade is any good, after all.

I still hope Al Thamen doesn't have too much to do with Magnostadt, at least in the form of direct influence. It would be strange if they totally ignored such a nest of magicians, but I want Magnostadt to be standing on its own.
Scheherazade is like any other non-villain we've seen in the series. She will defend what is her own (in this case Leam) at any cost and by any means. The ends always justify the means for her, Sinbad, or the royal family of Kou (minus one bitch empress and one adorably naïve princess, both on opposite ends). If I remember right, they also speculated that Scheherazade is among the older set of Magi, unlike Judal who is young in both appearance and actual age, and Aladdin who ultimately isn't from this world but instead from the last.

Aladdin seems to have found his answer to Dunya's death, his sense of unease about Mogamett, and also the answer to why his vision brought him here.

Dunya's death wasn't a personal vendetta against the royalty as she had always thought, it was Mogamett's war against everyone who oppressed him and his kind. She was just unfortunately caught in the crossfire. Had Mogamett thought more clearly, he should have saved her for a figurehead.

Mogamett doesn't seem to be the cause of Aladdin's vision either. He's good natured and has the right idea, just going about it in the one of the worst ways possible. He genuinely wants the best for the majority of people, and Magnoshtat is that method. He doesn't want vengeance anymore, he wants acceptance of magicians.

On the other hand, something is going on underneath him, and that is the cause of Aladdin's vision. I don't know how much of it Mogamett is aware of, but I doubt he's responsible. He just doesn't seem the type. I'm not sure if Irene (also see spelled Elaine) is working for Al Thamen or not, but it is clear that Al Thamen is worming their way into the upper portions of their academy and government. Al Thamen is trying to manipulate the magicians into doing something truly awful for them. If they were working together directly, they would be allied with the Kou Empress Bitch of the Universe.

The magicians haven't been given the answer to make djinn, so Al Thamen is influencing at most. Irene caught that in Aladdin's expression. What she showed the three of them is at the infancy stage, where Aladdin and the audience have seen Al Thamen's total control over the process. I'd wager Al Thamen is trying to get the magicians to create a purely artificial djinn that goes completely out of control immediately. The opposite of Al Thamen's process of using an individual's resentment to guide and control that power.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 01-26-2014, 08:28 AM

At the moment I would think that Al Thamen treats Magnostadt as some sort of R&D/experiment/2ndary country to see what they can do with Dark Ruhk, while Kou is the main country they're using and commanding to take over the world. If the world stage becomes Magnostadt vs Kou, they could possibly just take the former out in one sweep since could have better control of Dark Ruhk.

I originally thought Titus was an artificial life-form. That could be true since you can make it from Ruhk, but the foreshadowing suggests here that he's someone who us using too much magic. On the other hand though, if that's his only problem then he could just stop using magic..

It is evident from this episode that not everyone who wants to leave the 5th District can. Mogamett has made some rather favourable conditions downstairs, but he's forcing them to be there.

--------------------

edit:
Mogamett doesn't seem to be the cause of Aladdin's vision either. He's good natured and has the right idea, just going about it in the one of the worst ways possible. He genuinely wants the best for the majority of people, and Magnoshtat is that method. He doesn't want vengeance anymore, he wants acceptance of magicians.

What vision? The only one I ever remember is him seeing Solomon unite the world and then having magicians destroy it. I don't see any reason to suspect that Mogamett caused that vision in the first place.

And as for the generations of Magi, I don't think it worked the way you said. Judal, Yunan and Scheherazade were all the "official" mages of this age (Scheherazade's been supporting Leam for 200 years or something, but she's not an older generation), while Aladdin's seen as the unexplained 4th Magi.

David75

Sun, 01-26-2014, 10:35 AM

Regarding Ruhk control, aren't Magis the one able to do so, good Magis with white Ruhk and evil ones with dark Ruhk.

Also, isn't Alibaba someone that might just be able to control both white and dark Ruhk, making him a unique and incredibly powerful being fit to be a successor to Salomon?

Ryllharu

Sun, 01-26-2014, 10:54 AM

What vision? The only one I ever remember is him seeing Solomon unite the world and then having magicians destroy it. I don't see any reason to suspect that Mogamett caused that vision in the first place.

And as for the generations of Magi, I don't think it worked the way you said. Judal, Yunan and Scheherazade were all the "official" mages of this age (Scheherazade's been supporting Leam for 200 years or something, but she's not an older generation), while Aladdin's seen as the unexplained 4th Magi.
His vision was sparked after Dunya's death, no? He saw precursors to the world ending vision when he tried to save Dunya in the first episode. As he headed toward Magnostadt to figure out where all that hatred came from, he got the world ending vision. Aladdin knows the World Ending vision and Magnostadt are connected, and Mogamett leads all of Magnostadt. Aladdin suspected him heavily, but that doesn't seem to be the case anymore.

I wasn't speaking generations, just ages. Yunan and Scheherazade are substantially older than Judal. There are four magi, three meant to be there. The older set is Yunan and Scheherazade. The younger set is Judal and Aladdin (an outsider). I wasn't aware anyone had confirmed Scheherazade's age yet. Just suspected. I was under the impression that she hasn't been a loli this whole time, like a certain wonderful Amber.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 01-26-2014, 08:53 PM

Regarding Ruhk control, aren't Magis the one able to do so, good Magis with white Ruhk and evil ones with dark Ruhk.

Yep, that's who they mean when they talk about legendary magicians.

Also, isn't Alibaba someone that might just be able to control both white and dark Ruhk, making him a unique and incredibly powerful being fit to be a successor to Salomon?

I don't think so. He had 2 different types of magoi in his body, and he was having extremely poor control as a result. It was a miracle that he wasn't dead. When he resolved things at his end, Khassim's magoi became Alibaba's. Everything mixed into one pool of white magoi.

Kraco

Mon, 01-27-2014, 03:18 AM

DarthEnderX

Mon, 01-27-2014, 04:19 AM

Scheherazade is like any other non-villain we've seen in the seriesI think it's way to early to just assume Scheherazade is a non-villain. I mean, she's probably not, but there's no reason she couldn't be.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 01-27-2014, 07:44 AM

I believe magi are able to control both types if they want. Though it's hard to see Aladdin, for example, wanting to control the dark rukh, at least for now. It might affect the magi's personality. If ordinary magicians can control both with some tools, like those at Magnostadt to a degree and definitely the Al Thamen villains, then it would be strange if magi couldn't.

Ordinary mages can only control Dark Ruhk. That's why it's so enticing, because up till now Ruhk was an energy source that only Magi could manipulate.

That's the only advantage I see from using Dark Ruhk, since White is in such abundance in the natural world. Dark Ruhk seems to stem from a source of hatred or evil as opposed to nature. I expect it to possess a will or attribute which, as you say, may have side effects on the user - if not make it outright incompatible with good-natured magi. If you're channeling it with tools, then it might not have such a significant effect.

I think it's way to early to just assume Scheherazade is a non-villain. I mean, she's probably not, but there's no reason she couldn't be.

Her country uses slaves, and she seems to consider Titus to be less than human (whether he really is human or not is yet to be revealed), so she could well be someone to fight against.

Kraco

Mon, 01-27-2014, 09:09 AM

Ordinary mages can only control Dark Ruhk. That's why it's so enticing, because up till now Ruhk was an energy source that only Magi could manipulate.

I suppose that would depend on the definition of control. Magnostadt is collecting a huge amount of rukh from the 200k goi, and I believe most of it is used to power the city itself plus any magical tool manufacture (although these would overlap), including those that require converting it to dark rukh. We haven't actually seen even a glimpse of the tool manufacturing process, so it's hard to say if they all require converting to dark rukh, but I'd find that unexpected, until proven otherwise. Especially since the teacher said they knew little about the dark rukh until 12 years ago. Surely manufacturing tools is an older art than that.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 01-27-2014, 09:25 AM

We're back to a definitions argument then. I still stand by that magoi collected from the goi is still magoi. It's not Ruhk.

The whole idea of using Ruhk is that you don't need magoi production, whether it's from yourself or your 'livestock'.

Kraco

Tue, 01-28-2014, 04:39 PM

Episode 17 - HS (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=517355)

- - - - - - - - - -

I really like the political situation in this show. Aladdin is the kind of idealistic, happy go lucky person who ought to have easy B&W situations and decisions appear in front of him, but instead he's always forced to choose between flawed, gray ones. Magnostadt is no good, despite saving magicians from oppression. Leam is a wretched place as well. Kou doesn't even need to be mentioned. So, he's left with little choice but to stop everybody. I guess the first moments of the first episode were about that.

For some reason I kept thinking Magnostadt is quite a powerful place, but apparently it's more like the weakest among the power players, if even that. Maybe it's only a little better than some random places like Alibaba's home country, though being a home to many magicians it has much more publicity.

Ryllharu

Tue, 01-28-2014, 05:36 PM

I'm still choosing to trust Mogamett at his words. Aside from viewing goi as cattle, he's a good person. He never seems to lie about anything, even to a person like Aladdin who he is convinced is spying for Sinbad (even if Aladdin is really working for himself). They may have gathered the knowledge from Al Thamen, but again he was betrayed. The terrible things he's done are still solely for the betterment of magicians, and though he helped create the dark metal vessels, he wasn't the one who put them into the hands of manipulated innocents like Dunya or Kassim.

I think Mogamett has faith enough in the power of magicians on their own. What we saw when Titus and Aladdin dueled was proof enough to me that they can stand their own against most metal vessel users. The average magicians can kill dozens of regular soldiers on their own, and the 1st Class kind can stand toe-to-toe with the best fighters. That said, the Fanalis are an entirely different breed of soldier. We've seen what just one can do plenty, and even moreso a properly trained one. These are a dozen or more.

Irene on the other hand...she seems to embrace dark ruhk and dark metal vessels. If the nasty stuff comes out of anywhere, my money is on her doing it, maybe even against Mogamett's orders. I don't think she's allied secretly with Al Thamen, I think she's just drunk on the power it provides.

edit:
I'm actually convinced after this episode and the last that Mogamett has been correct all along. Magicians should never be ruled or governed by non-magicians. Every story we heard from the other students or teachers has been along the lines of, "I was run out of my home by my own family," or "I was used by others for their own personal gain."

Even Yam is being used by Sinbad, willing or no. She's shortening her own life substantially to generate that barrier, when Sinbad can protect the country himself (and on his own!) when he's not too busy running around like an idiot.

There's only two magicians we've seen who haven't been treated like shit all their lives, or used by others for personal gain:

Aladdin, and Baba. That's it.

Even Judal is the way he is because of how his family was treated when he was young (shown in a brief flashback).

It's also worth noting that Aladdin has gotten hot-headed about injustices all over the world...except here. He doesn't argue with Mogamett. Titus does instead. Aladdin can't disagree with Mogamett because he's seen many of the same things.

The only thing Mogamett is wrong about is that goi should be treated like disposable garbage the same way he used to be treated.

Kraco

Tue, 01-28-2014, 06:21 PM

Yeah, magicians probably would be far better off with their own country and they surely deserved it. But it should be a country without a host of goi being kept underground as a rukh production facility. I'm sure quite a few non-magicians would eventually find their way in as paid workers of certain professions, as traders, as diplomats, etc, or born from magician parents even if they founded a country without a single goi within the borders, but that would still be far more preferable to the current situation. One can't help but think of Israel and Palestinians when looking at Magnostadt. As I've also said before, I don't think the current situation with the goi could last too long anyway, as soon as the new generation starts to grow up.

Mogamett is only made more dangerous because he genuinely believes the current system is splendid.

All in all Leam and Kou should just fight each other and leave Magnostadt alone for the time being. Magnostadt isn't currently interested in expansion, even if it would be interested in rescuing magicians from other countries. One of Mogamett's saving features is that he has no interest in ruling non-magicians, so he would likely leave them in peace in their own countries, as long as he didn't hear news of magicians being treated poorly.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 01-29-2014, 05:25 AM

Nothing like an existential crisis scored to the sweet sound of butt rock.

I don't know why Alibaba is in the Fanalis squad, but whatever man! Obvious irony in Morgianna going off on her own to look for the Fanalis and Alibaba is the one that finds them.

Scheherazade just does not seem very cool.

I'm actually convinced after this episode and the last that Mogamett has been correct all along. Magicians should never be ruled or governed by non-magicians.That is a...weirdly racist sentiment.

There's only two magicians we've seen who haven't been treated like shit all their lives, or used by others for personal gain:

Aladdin, and Baba. That's it.

Even Judal is the way he is because of how his family was treated when he was young (shown in a brief flashback). Magi are not magicians.

Yeah, magicians probably would be far better off with their own country and they surely deserved it.That's like saying gay people would be far better off with their own country.

Segregation is not the answer. No solution that involves treating one group differently than the other is.

The answer is to build a place where magicians and humans are all just considered people.

Kraco

Wed, 01-29-2014, 06:39 AM

That's like saying gay people would be far better off with their own country.

Segregation is not the answer. No solution that involves treating one group differently than the other is.

The answer is to build a place where magicians and humans are all just considered people.

Gay people are just people, nothing more, nothing less (although they would go extinct in their own country since they couldn't breed, but that's not the point).

However, there is a huge fundamental difference between magicians and everybody else. It's the simple fact magicians are inherently far more capable and strong. Throughout the history differences in political power and wealth have caused one revolution or civil war after another, not to mention lesser civil disorders. But those are things that can always be changed. A person may lose their riches or be thrown out of a political position (even if it was inherited nobility). However, if a portion of the citizens were born with powers that allowed them to best 10 normal ones in any fight and that would grant them other boosts as well, there would be no solution to it. They would always be better. Period. Normal folks would get envious more and more, thinking the magicians only get what they do because they were born that way, not because of their efforts or contributions to the society, and the magicians would start to think they don't want to be ruled by lesser people who only want to drag the magicians down because of envy and unfounded fears. It wouldn't happen overnight, but it would happen, inevitably.

No matter what Mogamett says now and even honestly believes, things would change and prove true what I think Star Trek put nicely: Superior ability breeds superior ambition.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 01-29-2014, 12:28 PM

However, there is a huge fundamental difference between magicians and everybody else. It's the simple fact magicians are inherently far more capable and strong. Oh, so professional athletes should have their own country then. Or scientists then?

Do you just segregate everyone that's better than you at something? Everyone has advantages and disadvantages to other people.

You can't even say it's just being racist, because at least people of a specific race are born from other people of that race. Magicians are born spontaneously from normal people. So what happens when the world finds out you're a country run by mages that enslaves it's unpowered human populace? All they have to do is stop sending Magnoshtadt their magicians.

However, if a portion of the citizens were born with powers that allowed them to best 10 normal ones in any fight and that would grant them other boosts as well, there would be no solution to it.Bullshit. You only think that because that's the trope X-Men and every other fictional work pushes. And they push them because it's a conflict that creates a good story, not because it's a problem that actually has no solution.

No matter what Mogamett says now and even honestly believes, things would change and prove true what I think Star Trek put nicely: Superior ability breeds superior ambition.Except that Star Trek is full of subversions to that notion. In fact, it's really weird that you'd bring up Star Trek because that's pretty much one long example of the greater aspects of humanity ultimately triumphing over their own failings. The entire Federation is built out of races that are innately better than others, all working together for common goals.

And for every example like Q that proves that adage, there'll be some other all-powerful being that will be the exact opposite.

Kraco

Wed, 01-29-2014, 01:33 PM

Bullshit. You only think that because that's the trope X-Men and every other fictional work pushes. And they push them because it's a conflict that creates a good story, not because it's a problem that actually has no solution.

Hmm... You might be right. Considering some absolute monarchies did last a very long time, it might be possible to have a country where magicians formed the nobility and royalty, the non-magicians the rest, as long as the non-magician masses were given a degree of freedom for economic growth and success, for example, and weren't universally treated as slaves. They could never cross the commoner-nobility border, but the general stability might be enough for the magicians to maintain and crush any unrest effectively.

It would never work the other way around, though. No non-magician rulers could sleep their nights peacefully imagining there are groups of people around who could defeat the royal guards and remove the leaders easily, whenever they wanted. Sooner or later they would either try to curb or eliminate the magicians. Even having court mages wouldn't ensure stability.

Ryllharu

Wed, 01-29-2014, 04:17 PM

Moving aside the notion that a group of people traditionally used like slaves as deserving the right to govern themselves as somehow being racist...

Magi are not magicians.
You're serious? That's amazing.

They most certainly are magicians. They're a special kind of magician, with the largest reserves of magoi, the ability to change golden ruhk rather than merely make commands (per Myers' and nameless instructor's lesson in eps 8), use the ruhk of other's, and raise dungeons.

We've since learned that magicians can forcibly manipulate black ruhk, so controlling Ruhk (in general) is not unique to Magi.

You're saying that is that a tiger isn't a cat, only housecats are cats.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 01-29-2014, 08:27 PM

Considering some absolute monarchies did last a very long time, it might be possible to have a country where magicians formed the nobility and royaltyWhy does one group or the other have to exclusively make up the leadership?

Why can't you have some leaders who are magicians, some who aren't, and the determining factor isn't whether your a magician or not, but who is actually good at leading.

The best solution here is not to form weirdly exclusive kingdoms where each group rules over themselves. It's to not have kingdoms at all, but to have democracies.

Moving aside the notion that a group of people traditionally used like slaves as deserving the right to govern themselves as somehow being racist...Well because it is. An easy way to tell is to simply plug in an actual race in place of the fictional races being used here.

What you said is basically like saying "Black people should never be ruled or governed by non-black people." Which is being racist in favor of black people, but that's still technically being racist.

They most certainly are magicians.If we're talking about the English language, then yes, anyone who uses magic is a magician

But I'm not sure that's how this SERIES uses the term. I think they use it to mean humans that can use magic.

It doesn't seem to me that Magi are even human.

Ryllharu

Wed, 01-29-2014, 09:09 PM

But I'm not sure that's how this SERIES uses the term. I think they use it to mean humans that can use magic.

It doesn't seem to me that Magi are even human.
How I described it is exactly how the series uses the term. "Magicians" is the blanket term. Magi are a subset of that set, they are magicians with additional abilities. They are as human as anyone else who happens to have extraordinary magical powers. Scheherazade uses advanced, continually cast spells (using external ruhk no doubt) to create things like Titus. We can safely assume she can do even more than that. Yunan did...whatever it is he's done to that void in the Dark Continent. Judal has very strong offensive magic and manipulates black ruhk to the same degree Aladdin does with Solomon's Wisdom, but for Al Thamen's ends. Aladdin is fairly mundane by Magi standards, because he's pretty weak when compared.

Aladdin has gems installed by Yam to block his ability to manipulate external ruhk. But he can still use his own internal ruhk like anyone else attending or working for Magnostadt. He can only push magoi outward from himself to issue commands to the golden ruhk, fueled by his internal reservoirs. That makes him a magician. Those internal stores were weak because he was overly reliant on external ruhk.

I don't know why this is so hard for you to understand. The series couldn't have been more clear from the early episodes of season 1, his brief lessons with Yam, and finally the exhaustive explanation on how it all works during his time in Magnostadt.

Buffalobiian

Thu, 01-30-2014, 01:06 AM

Aladdin is born with average capacity, not from lack of use. Using his own stores more won't change that, just his proficiency level.

Kraco

Thu, 01-30-2014, 03:06 AM

The best solution here is not to form weirdly exclusive kingdoms where each group rules over themselves. It's to not have kingdoms at all, but to have democracies.

In a democracy everybody should be equal (even though even in most of our democracies some people are clearly more equal than others). However, magicians would never be equal with non-magicians. The non-magicians especially would feel that, whereas magicians, with their vast extra powers and possibilities, could of course appear magnanimous for their own part, but that would be just a facade. You seem to forget one thing about democracy, though, which is its other name: A dictatorship of the majority. Magicians would remain a minority, likely, so the majority made of the non-magicians would try to set all sorts of rules restricting the use of magic, to make non-magicians and magicians more equal with each other. There's a plethora of fiction depicting just that. Since magicians are just human, many would be sheep and swallow their pride, but many wouldn't accept such bullshit. The result would be civil unrest and unhappiness.

DarthEnderX

Thu, 01-30-2014, 11:49 AM

How I described it is exactly how the series uses the term. "Magicians" is the blanket term.Okay.

Magi are a subset of that set, they are magicians with additional abilities. They are as human as anyone else who happens to have extraordinary magical powers.How do you know that? Are they actually born from human parents?

For all you know, Magi are some kind of magical construct like Titus.

Aladdin lived alone in some space city for, like, hundreds of years. What makes you think he's human?

In a democracy everybody should be equalNo, in a democracy, everyone should have equal RIGHTS, not equal capabilities.

Being able to do something someone else can't doesn't make you not a person. Otherwise, again, pro athletes and scientists would be their own race somehow and be discriminated against.

A dictatorship of the majority. Magicians would remain a minority, likely, so the majority made of the non-magicians would try to set all sorts of rules restricting the use of magic, to make non-magicians and magicians more equal with each other. There's a plethora of fiction depicting just that. Since magicians are just human, many would be sheep and swallow their pride, but many wouldn't accept such bullshit. The result would be civil unrest and unhappiness. Dictatorship of the minority is only applicable if you separate magicians into a minority, instead of just grouping them with everyone else, which is a completely unnecessary thing to do.

Look, what you're talking about is absolutely LIKELY in this story. Because it IS a story so it IS probably going to follow the tropes.

But you and Ryllharu are both talking about the situation like the solution is impossible. It's not. It's as simple as everyone stopping being assholes. Now, that's not going to happen, because then you wouldn't have a story to tell.

shinta|hikari

Thu, 01-30-2014, 02:34 PM

I'd say it is possible for magicians and humans to coexist equally, in fiction or in reality. It is just extremely unlikely.

Ryllharu

Thu, 01-30-2014, 04:06 PM

How do you know that? Are they actually born from human parents?

For all you know, Magi are some kind of magical construct like Titus.

Aladdin lived alone in some space city for, like, hundreds of years. What makes you think he's human?
How do I know that? I've been watching the show.

Judal is a Magi. Judal had a flashback again referenced during the scene where he talked about it to Sinbad after breaking Yam's barrier (season 1) that showed his parents. They were murdered by Al Thamen. It was pretty clear that they were either from Kou, or a region that has since been conquered and absorbed by Kou. Scheherazade and Yunan it is less clear. Aladdin also had a parental figure, though he can't remember them or is adamantly choosing not to remember them. You might be right about Aladdin, since he "doesn't belong in this era" being from the old world.

It wasn't a space city. We've since learned it is the remains of the old world after the catastrophe occurred. The one that Aladdin has been having visions of while in Magnostadt. The dungeons connect to it, which is why when they conquer one, we see the sequence where the victors are being transported back to the present world (often with a giant pile of treasure).

edit:
To make it clear, the flashback to Judal's past was at the end of a fight with Aladdin when Aladdin grabbed him. But it was discussed between Sinbad and Judal later.

Kraco

Thu, 01-30-2014, 04:53 PM

Aladdin is obviously perfectly human. If he wasn't, he wouldn't have such a healthy and manly interest in women. Since we now know Titus is in fact a clone of a woman somehow made into the shape of a man, his girly interests are natural. He's clearly not as wholesomely human as Aladdin.

Ryllharu

Thu, 01-30-2014, 05:19 PM

Yunan is really the only "otherworldly" Magi. Detached about everything for sure.

Scheherazade is pretty attached to Leam, and she's probably transcended past her own humanity, callously making short lived clones and using them as largely-disposable agents. That said, she did want Titus to come back and wanted to do, 'everything she can for him in the time he has left, just as she has for all the other children,' so she was certainly human at one time. She may use them, but she cares for them...to some degree.

DarthEnderX

Thu, 01-30-2014, 05:27 PM

I'm wondering if the reason she wants him to come back is so she can reabsorb him. And if that's not a positive thing for him. But he doesn't know it.

Like he'd live on inside her as a part of her, but by preventing him from going back, they're actually dooming him to oblivion when he dies.

I'd say it is possible for magicians and humans to coexist equally, in fiction or in reality.Aw hell no. I'm just talking about fiction here. I don't want those top hat wearing fuckers in MY community!

To make it clear, the flashback to Judal's past was at the end of a fight with Aladdin when Aladdin grabbed him. But it was discussed between Sinbad and Judal later.Okay.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 02-03-2014, 11:44 AM

No Ep this week?

vejita613

Mon, 02-03-2014, 03:19 PM

There is, it's just late for some reason.

Buffalobiian

Tue, 02-04-2014, 06:04 AM

Watchable subs. They have some additional subtitles on screen that advertise the sub-group and/or the source, but it'll do as a fix.

[SkynetSubs] Magi - The Kingdom of Magic - 18v2 (848x480 x264 AAC).mkv (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=519745)
[SkynetSubs] Magi - The Kingdom of Magic - 18v2 (1280x720 x264 AAC).mkv (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=519746)

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Damn, I like that Fannalis girl too. Morg is more cultured but still... eyecandy-wise she easily passes. Too bad we don't get to see Alibaba's training (and the Toto interactions that would have come with it) or more of Morg's side of things, but this keeps the flow of the story I suppose so I'll take it.

I couldn't quite put words to it before, but this episode showed how Morgamett's idea really came out of desperation in trying to find meaning to magic (and that it has to have a meaning).

Leam and Magnostadt are actually quite similar in that both have a superior guardian race with the common people backing them. The only difference is that as Scheherazade said, in Leam even the common people can advance their country, while in Magnostadt only the magicians are making any progress. At the same time the opposite is true: Fannalis are superior, but they probably aren't actually getting stronger unless they're continually developing better martial arts. They've reached their limit by relying on their physical performance, the same way that Goi in Magnostadt can't advance because their magoi output is physically limited.

Kraco

Tue, 02-04-2014, 03:08 PM

A good thing Morgiana didn't meet thing gang of Fanalis fanatics. She would have been tainted. She doesn't need to become a person who gets excited and gleeful when chasing and slaughtering fleeing people.

Mogamett's (and the whole country's) faults and limits are obvious for anybody to see, but I'm beginning to think Scheherazade is still more twisted of the two, and in a far more dangerous way: She has raised herself to godhood and is now enjoying the achievements of her people from high above as if they were all her own personal deeds and accomplishments. Mogamett might not think anything of the goi, but Scheherazade considers all the citizen's of Leam her children, whom she must guide - and punish if needed, no doubt. Likewise all the people of foreign countries who are denied the grace of her wisdom are to be pitied and their misguided ways to be mourned, to the degree they are better off dead than forced to suffer a continuous existence without her brilliance shining upon them.

Aladdin can't put a stop to this foolishness soon enough.

Ryllharu

Tue, 02-04-2014, 08:04 PM

Maybe it was just the effect of not being as ridiculous, but these Fanalis seem a hell of a lot weaker than Morg. Sure, they tossed some crazy-sized boulders, but not of them punched through people or broke the stone ground just by leaping.

I hope Yunan transfers Morgianna here to wreck some shit. Judging by episode 1, they're on their way, along with everyone else.

I was kind of appalled at some of the spells the magicians used. Big crispy explosion makers resulting in instant death is one thing (though still pretty bad), but acid rain is just cruel. Irene isn't a nice magician. Sadist for sure.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 02-05-2014, 05:07 AM

She has raised herself to godhood and is now enjoying the achievements of her people from high above as if they were all her own personal deeds and accomplishments.Is that really not appropriate?

If you can't take pride in the accomplishments of your country's people as it's ruler, what can you take pride in? Your castle's lawn?

If you've made your country into a place where such achievements are possible, that makes you a successful ruler. The accomplishments of it's people reflect directly upon your ability to build a successful country.

I was kind of appalled at some of the spells the magicians used. Big crispy explosion makers resulting in instant death is one thing (though still pretty bad), but acid rain is just cruel. Irene isn't a nice magician. Sadist for sure.While that's certainly true, I don't blame an individual wizard for the forms their attacks take, since they don't really control what powers they're naturally good at.

Maybe she's just a Water mage and that's the most damaging attack she has access to.

Kraco

Wed, 02-05-2014, 06:43 AM

Is that really not appropriate?

If that was all, I'd say it would be not only appropriate but perhaps even preferable, assuming she could be satisfied with just that. But from this ep and to a lesser extent the previous ones, I got a feeling she has raised herself to a higher place in her mind. Mogamett, however, considers all magicians equal, himself among them, though he would accept leadership if the others gave him the position, and likely only as long as the others were happy with his performance. Scheherazade's opinion, I dare say, is that of the old absolute monarchs who let the power go to their heads. I suppose that's normal considering the period is ancient in this show, but that hardly makes it better. Yeah, Leam is Scheherazade and Scheherazade is Leam. When she was walking among the craftsmen making gunpowder and telling how the people can do it if they want, it was like fricking Kim Jong-un walking among nuclear physicists telling how the mighty North Korea can manufacture nuclear weapons if they want.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 02-05-2014, 07:13 AM

But from this ep and to a lesser extent the previous ones, I got a feeling she has raised herself to a higher place in her mind. Mogamett, however, considers all magicians equal, himself among them, though he would accept leadership if the others gave him the position, and likely only as long as the others were happy with his performance.I like how it's not okay for her to think she's higher than everyone else even though she's a Magi and probably is, but it's okay for Mogamett to consider the group he happens to be a part of higher than everyone else.

For all we know, she just thinks all Magi are better, which would make her exactly the same as Mogamett. It's not her fault there's only 4 Magi.

Kraco

Wed, 02-05-2014, 08:00 AM

I like how it's not okay for her to think she's higher than everyone else even though she's a Magi and probably is, but it's okay for Mogamett to consider the group he happens to be a part of higher than everyone else.

For all we know, she just thinks all Magi are better, which would make her exactly the same as Mogamett. It's not her fault there's only 4 Magi.

I said earlier Mogamett and the whole Magnostadt's faults are very obvious. So, don't go jumping to hasty conclusions. Yet it's still marginally better for a person to think a group of people are better than to think he/she alone is somehow divine compared to the rest of humanity. Mogamett is very humble and compassionate when he's dealing with other magicians. Scheherazade doesn't care who you are, as long as you listen to her enlightened vision. If you don't listen to it, you are better off dead to free resources for somebody who does listen. I also don't like how Scheherazade on one hand preaches how humans can stand on their own and achieve anything, yet on the other hand she's looking down on everybody opposing her and pities them. That's just nasty. Aren't they also standing on their own?

Buffalobiian

Wed, 02-05-2014, 08:04 AM

She specifically pitied the Goi who rely on magicians or protection, who give up their autonomy and freedom to a ruling class in order to get by. To borrow a phrase from a certain maid, they're insects. And Scheherazade pities insects.

I do share some of your feelings regarding this issue Kraco. A lot of it comes from how Scheherazade keeps referring herself as the saikou Priestess of Leam, a title that sounds like it was self-given. That said, she's like a parent - not very diplomatic but not exactly wrong either.

Kraco

Sun, 02-09-2014, 06:19 PM

Episode 19 - HS (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=521485)

- - - - - - - - -

I really liked this episode. Despite the pacifism of Aladdin, he managed to be badass with those sand golems that looked all but impossible to everybody else, save Scheherazade naturally. The more mundane battle before his stunt was quite good as well, even if I'm not 100% satisfied by the magicians' performance against the Fanalis. It's kind of strange the Fanalis evaded all of the magicians' attacks on the ground, yet the flying magicians were hit by every Fanalis attack. In any case I'm happy Aladdin is defending the country that gave him more or less all of his current magical knowhow. There's much wrong in Magnostadt but it doesn't deserve to be destroyed. I hope Aladdin manages to set afoot some sort of a reform.

I also hope the Fanalis corps leader is going to attack Aladdin in the next ep, only to be intercepted by Alibaba.

Ryllharu

Sun, 02-09-2014, 06:42 PM

I also hope the Fanalis corps leader is going to attack Aladdin in the next ep, only to be intercepted by Alibaba.
My interpretation was that Alibaba isn't too happy that Aladdin is fighting to defend Magnostadt. He was given the impression by the head of the Fanalis Corps that no foreign students were defending. In actuality, pretty much all of them are.

Kraco

Sun, 02-09-2014, 07:06 PM

My interpretation was that Alibaba isn't too happy that Aladdin is fighting to defend Magnostadt. He was given the impression by the head of the Fanalis Corps that no foreign students were defending. In actuality, pretty much all of them are.

Alibaba is indecisive during his best moments, totally paralyzed at his worst, but I reckon even he would always block a sword pointed at his friend. In fact that's what has caused him troubles in the past, like in his home town. Thus, even if he was unhappy with Aladdin's decision (in his inherent ignorance), he would still see no harm to befall Aladdin.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 02-10-2014, 03:52 AM

So...I mean, it was fine and all.

But is Scheherazade just completely useless or something?

Leam is all "Oh, they have a Magi, it's hopeless. He'll just keep pushing us back." So what the hell is Scheherazade doing while all this is going on?

The cracks on Aladdin concern me. I hope they're just temporary from the stones. But they seem to be growing since he took them out rather than healing.

Buffalobiian

Mon, 02-10-2014, 07:41 AM

Leam is all "Oh, they have a Magi, it's hopeless. He'll just keep pushing us back." So what the hell is Scheherazade doing while all this is going on?

A sea away, watching. Remember that she advocates that Leam are people who rely on themselves instead of hiding behind their Magi figurehead.

As for Aladdin's cracks, back when I saw them in the first episode I feared that they were some form of corruption that Mogamett did to him, but now it just looks like Ruhk overload. Perhaps not having any influx of Ruhk for such a long time meant that his body is now not exactly tolerant of it yet.

Alibaba's dilemma is more purely based on the fact that he is now possibly facing Aladdin. As far as he can tell from the outside Magnostadt is this shady country that develops Black Djinns and hands out harmful tools to pirates, and it deserves to be destroyed. If Aladdin's defending it though, it's not that simple and he wants to know why. I think he has more faith in Aladdin than to think than to be disappointed in Aladdin for defending this country. He might be confused. He'll definitely ask Aladdin why he's doing this for such an 'evil' country, but he won't think any less of Aladdin because of this.

Totally with Kraco about Alibaba intercepting that. I think his transformation would probably be cooler if I haven't seen it in the OP so many times already.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 02-10-2014, 01:45 PM

A sea away, watching.Oh. I thought she was on one of the ships.

Munsu

Tue, 02-11-2014, 07:22 PM

Just began watching this series, and overall better than what I was expecting going into it, quite enjoying it. Don't like the two main characters all that much, but Morgiana is awesome. I'm 8 episodes in, hope to catch up in the coming days.

shinta|hikari

Tue, 02-11-2014, 09:54 PM

That is exactly how I felt about this as well.

It just keeps getting better.

Buffalobiian

Wed, 02-12-2014, 03:27 AM

That is exactly how I felt about this as well.

It just keeps getting better.

Well.. it's better now, but it sure as hell took a nose dive during the Alibaba/Balubad arc. Maybe Bud will be less disappointed since he's marathoning that part now.

shinta|hikari

Wed, 02-12-2014, 10:40 AM

I never really felt that because I actually like character development arcs. I am used to seeing pathetic main characters, so I can patiently wait for them to redeem themselves.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 02-12-2014, 03:37 PM

I never really felt that because I actually like character development arcs. I am used to seeing pathetic main characters, so I can patiently wait for them to redeem themselves.That's only acceptable in instances like Gurren Lagann where they provide you an awesome character you can pretend is the main character until the pathetic character gets their shit together.

shinta|hikari

Wed, 02-12-2014, 03:43 PM

Morgiana was there the whole time.

Kraco

Wed, 02-12-2014, 03:48 PM

Morgiana was there the whole time.

I couldn't have watched through some of the eps if Morgiana hadn't been there. In fact I doubt I'd have kept watching the show. The recent episodes have been good even without her, but I'm sure I'll be glad when she's back again.

KrayZ33

Wed, 02-12-2014, 04:49 PM

I don't get why everyone hates Alibaba so much, he was *very* likeable during the first episodes and I can't say I disliked him during the Balbadd-Arc - the problems came after that (Zogan-arc, or whatever that lifeforce-Djinn is called) because he couldn't let things go past him.

he has his lows whenever he's using that ugly 2h-sword of his though, I prefer his Dagger-King-Style fighting. The fight against Toto proves that imho.

shinta|hikari

Wed, 02-12-2014, 05:14 PM

I never disliked Alibaba. I just like Morgiana an infinite times more.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 02-12-2014, 06:13 PM

I don't get why everyone hates Alibaba so much, he was *very* likeable during the first episodes and I can't say I disliked him during the Balbadd-ArcI hated him in the Balbadd arc, BECAUSE he was like 180 degrees from the way he was in the beginning.

His time in Leam brings back a little of that first episodes magic.

Munsu

Sat, 02-15-2014, 02:36 PM

I'm all caught up now to the 19th episode of the second series. I've really enjoyed this series so far, but have a bit of mixed emotions. In one hand, it's better than I expected and it at times surprises me with the level of violence it has and some aspects of its worldbuilding, but at the same time it feels like the series could be much better than it currently is.

But in any case, I've been entertained.

Munsu

Thu, 02-20-2014, 07:38 PM

Is there an episode this week? Haven't noticed a release or RAW of the episode out there so far, so curious if anyone knows something on that regard.

Ryllharu

Thu, 02-20-2014, 07:47 PM

I was told the Olympics superseded its normal slot this week. Perhaps an event where the Japanese had a decent chance in.

Either that or CrunchyRoll is sucking ass again.

Munsu

Thu, 02-20-2014, 07:51 PM

I was told the Olympics superseded its normal slot this week. Perhaps an event where the Japanese had a decent chance in.

Either that or CrunchyRoll is sucking ass again.

Makes sense, I normally wouldn't ask, but with the absence of the RAW thought something might be amiss.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 02-23-2014, 07:03 AM

HS - Episode 20 (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=525936)

Note: Translation error @ 22:28 - it should read 200 000, not 20 000.

-----------------------------------------

I hope Scheherazade gets saved somehow. I'm imagining her real form to be elegantly preserved rather than semi-rotting. There probably isn't quite the material for a spin-off series about her young exploits like they've done for Sinbad, but I'd take notice of that just to see some cute expressions from her. :>

I'm starting to hop onto the idea someone mentioned before about the Fanalis existing as a giant pot of Dark Ruhk now. It makes sense for Yunan to guard such a thing. Perhaps it was him who made it so inaccessible too.

As for Mogamett, at this stage it no longer looks like he wants to simply rule over his country. Maybe he did until he just concluded that the only way to stop wars like this would be to rule over not only a country, but the world.

Kraco

Sun, 02-23-2014, 07:13 AM

This episode restored Scheherazade much in my eyes. She was quite cute. Although that doesn't change the fact I was more or less correct about her disposition, which she admitted in this episode herself. Still, I don't really care if she lives or dies. In a good story characters should die if they are to die, not be miraculously saved for no particular reason.

If Mogamett no longer simply wants to secure his own country, it's all thanks to Leam and Kou. The casualties were extremely bad considering it's such a tiny country, and now he's hearing another large force is marching in to add to the list. I'm actually looking forward to it! But I suppose Aladdin will be able to stop it before the worst happens.

NeoCybercoin

Sun, 02-23-2014, 07:42 AM

So if Scheherazade is dying could it be that Alladin was 'sent' to replace her? I mean there have always been 3. With Judal as the youngest. Why is he the youngest? Did he replace another Magi?

Ryllharu

Sun, 02-23-2014, 07:55 AM

Aladdin is an outlier. As a Magi he doesn't belong. This is why Scheherazade was skeptical, and why Judar was curious in the first place. He's certainly the youngest and third Magi of the old world, though it is a mystery how he was in that dungeon-like space beyond time, unaging, with Ugo for so long.

Now that Aladdin has told Scheherazade what he's seen, she trusts him. Yunan has told her something similar years ago, and all of the sudden she has an aberration (the 4th Magi) standing in her way and telling her he's doing this to prevent the end of the world.

Aladdin isn't going to replace her. But I bet I can guess who will.

It's kind of a shame that the Kou showed up right when Scheherazade was willing to back off and allow Mogamett to cool down. Probably part of that bitch's plan. She never had to have the Kou even fight. They just had to show up at the right moment.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 02-23-2014, 08:39 AM

I'm not so sure about Aladdin being a magi of the old world in the same regard as the other three are of this world. He's from there, but he sure was late to the party if he was born right when the world ended (and Solomon was presumably made a King by his own magi). In fact, could magi be an entity that only exists in this special world Solomon created? I can't remember whether they said magi existed throughout the ages or the worlds.

Or was Aladdin Solomon's magi whom Solomon "preserved" somehow? We only know that Ugo was Solomon's Djinn - and if Djinn are acquired in dungeons then I assume a magi was around in that world to erect them.

As for Scheherazade dying and Aladdin replacing her, I've found it weird that not all of the magi appeared at the same time. Are they supposed to be staggered such that each generation is supposed to try correct errors of the past magi by choosing a more appropriate king if required? We've been told that the magi choose their own king, but it needs not be a competition like it sounds like.

NeoCybercoin

Sun, 02-23-2014, 08:56 AM

Those Djinn were people living in that other world of Solomon. They weren't someone's Djinn as far as I can remember. When they met up with Paimon I think there was a flashback that showed several Djinn like Ugo and Paimon together as humans. They could turn into blue giants we know as Djinn but that doesn't mean they were bound to the same rules as in the current world. Towers were erected by Yunan in the current world but that doesn't mean that the same thing happened. Aladin states that a few remaining survivors were guided by King Solomon to the new world. I think they were the people we know as Djinn like Paimon.
And there were magicians in Alma Toran but that doesn't mean that there were Magi as well.

DarthEnderX

Sun, 02-23-2014, 09:22 PM

I mean there have always been 3. With Judal as the youngest.It could be that there was always 4. And Aladdin was simply trapped in that place the entire time with no concept of the passage of time.

Aladdin isn't going to replace her. But I bet I can guess who will.Who? Wouldn't her replacement be born after she dies?

Buffalobiian

Mon, 02-24-2014, 09:48 AM

Who? Wouldn't her replacement be born after she dies?

... Morgiana?

.......Hakuryuu?

.............The little girl Titus saved?

Edort4

Mon, 02-24-2014, 10:02 AM

Magis have hair the same colour of the rukh they use/favor. Aladdin is an exception because he is a magi (made from)/is a djinn(blue).

Just made this up. I could write some shonnen.

shinta|hikari

Mon, 02-24-2014, 10:20 AM

I could write some shonnen.

This is probably the worst compliment a writer could give himself.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 02-24-2014, 06:08 PM

Yeah, how awful it must be to write something millions of people love. If only they could be REAL writers instead.

Edort4

Mon, 02-24-2014, 07:14 PM

Ohh c'mon dont give me that crap. I was joking about who could be magi and why just making the point that any half assed explanation will do. But you have to admit that most shonen writers could vomit whatever they want into their scripts (as long as it isnt killing the hero or some popular emo character) that fans will devour it without even giving it a thought. That really scares me as species/human being although that explains the leaders we choose.

Kraco

Sun, 03-02-2014, 04:55 PM

Episode 21 - HS (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=528493)

--- -- - -- -- -

Hmm... How should I say it. There was lots of nice effects in this episode and seeing Alibaba in full control of his powers was good after such a long wait, but I was disappointed by the dark djinns. They were like cannon fodder. Of course it's kind of hard to get something similar to the atmosphere of Alibaba's friend back in their hometown, I still expected the dark rukh matter to be more oppressing and terrible. It still looked exceedingly promising when Mogamett snapped and cracked, his old ideals being replaced by the coldness of needing to choose who to protect, who to abandon and sacrifice, but when the attack began, it was underwhelming, despite the effectiveness of the first attack. After that they were merely mindless, hulking dolls.

Now that Kou brought out the big guns, I wonder if Mogamett will finally do what Aladdin feared the most or if Mogamett's role is now actually finished and it's Aladdin & Alibaba stopping another invasion force.

DarthEnderX

Sun, 03-02-2014, 11:06 PM

Well, the big issue seems to be that the black djinns just keep coming back because the dark rukh just keep going back and reforming.

Aladdin is going to have to do something to purify the dark rukh to stop this.

Alibaba's reaction to getting upstaged in his moment of glory was priceless.

I wonder how this show gets away with showing naked titties. Is it okay cause the chicks are blue for some reason?

Kraco

Mon, 03-03-2014, 02:57 AM

Well, the big issue seems to be that the black djinns just keep coming back because the dark rukh just keep going back and reforming.

That's true, they are still quite dangerous for the common soldier, but my problem was that even if they are dangerous because they are persistent, they can't create the kind of dread I was hoping for.

I wonder how this show gets away with showing naked titties. Is it okay cause the chicks are blue for some reason?

Yeah, the blue tits of a giant which aren't shown in a very fanservicey way at all. It took me a while during the scene to even notice there were bare tits. Half the time tv stations censor stuff to boost bluray sales, but it would take a super prudish station indeed to censor something like this. So, I don't see how they couldn't get away with it.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-03-2014, 03:26 AM

Yeah, the blue tits of a giant which aren't shown in a very fanservicey way at all.

http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f383/bobsozin/anime/magi/Paimon2.jpg

http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/518/255/716.jpg

Buffalobiian

Tue, 03-04-2014, 09:41 AM

Ah, too bad Alibaba only got to have some real muscles for the first 3 seconds of the fight. Toto would have been pleased to see those results of his training and how manly he had become. :P. Instead, we got some temporary flashy scenes before we're back to "normal" musculature again.

DarthEnderX

Tue, 03-04-2014, 11:40 AM

I just realized that all of the Djinn in the series except Ugo are named after demons from the Ars Goetia.

Which, I suppose is fitting given that the Ars Goetia is part of The Lesser Key of Solomon.

NeoCybercoin

Sun, 03-09-2014, 07:50 AM

Magi S2 Ep 22- Horriblesubs 1080P (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=530918)

Out now.

Buffalobiian

Sun, 03-09-2014, 10:33 AM

Crazy bitch mother is just annoying now. It feels like we're nearing the end of everything, but we still haven't seen any signs of Morigianna yet for ages, nor has Hyakuryu made his move yet. Even if it does take a while to end though, I don't see us going back to some good old adventuring. I really did enjoy those moments the best.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-10-2014, 03:54 AM

I'm guessing that the black thing is the series' big bad, but I don't think Aladdin is going to let it...I dunno...arrive at this time? It's probably just giving you a sneak peak at it for later.

Wasn't expecting Titus and Mogamett to bite it already.

Even if it does take a while to end though, I don't see us going back to some good old adventuring. I really did enjoy those moments the best.Me too. I was expecting to see more than two of those towers get done in this series. But instead it seems like they're just showed us those to give us the gist, then introduce 50 characters that already completed towers.

Ryllharu

Mon, 03-10-2014, 04:37 AM

They ran out of main characters that can even use them.

- Aladdin doesn't need one.
- Morgiana doesn't need one, and even if she got one she couldn't use it due to how small her magoi is. She'd be even worse than the Fanalis Corps leader. She pretty much died using from using her household vessel.
- Alibaba and Hakuryu both have one already.

Sinbad is the exception to the rule, by having more than one, much less the seven he actually has. He is a special being. Aladdin already saw that Sinbad is more than qualified to rule the world, though Aladdin also saw the same in Alibaba and prefers his personality and values more. Most metal vessel holders have exactly one, and generally they can barely handle a full djinn equip.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-10-2014, 04:40 AM

Kouen has a real Byakuya Kuchiki vibe going on. He's probably going to be a good guy eventually.

Also, more Ars Goetia named Djinn this week. I wonder if that means there's gonna be 72 total.

Sinbad in the exception to the rule, by having so more than one, much less the seven he actually has. He is a special being.They just said last episode that Kouen has three(or at least, had 3 when Kouha got his, he could have even more now).

I see no reason why Alibaba shouldn't be trying to get more. In fact, I'm pretty sure the intention when they went to Zagan's dungeon the intention was to get Alibaba his second Djinn and not Hakuryuu his first.

NeoCybercoin

Mon, 03-10-2014, 01:55 PM

Yeah that's true. Everybody seems to have a limit on how many Djinn they can have. Sinbad has 7 and Kouen has 3. So Alibaba could and should get more.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-10-2014, 04:48 PM

Everybody seems to have a limit on how many Djinn they can have. Sinbad has 7 and Kouen has 3.I don't think it was that Kouen's limit was 3. It was just that the Leraje didn't want to belong to anyone that already had other Djinn(calling Kouen a "philanderer").

NeoCybercoin

Mon, 03-10-2014, 05:34 PM

I mean what Sinbad himself said is that everybody has a limit because after his 7th that Djinn said that it was enough. So there's a limit on how many Djinn would be willing to lend their power to someone.

Ryllharu

Mon, 03-10-2014, 08:36 PM

DarthEnderX

Tue, 03-11-2014, 12:34 AM

Buffalobiian

Tue, 03-11-2014, 07:08 AM

Also don't forget that Alibaba's is one of the most destructive ones out there. Amon can cut through any metal vessel, no matter what.

He can render other dungeon-clearers useless for some period of time by destroying their vessel.

He may only have one, but there is a big difference between creating a giant tidal wave or smashing something with gravity and rendering a household vessel user or even a dungeon clearer useless with just an average attack.

He's strong, I'll give him that. Depending on how skillful he is he may be as dominating as you say. He should at least have a shitload of Magoi now that Kashim's with him.

Amon can cut anything, but other vessels can damage his as well. I daresay that Mu is faster than Alibaba. If he gets Alibaba's insignia first, he wins. Gravity is also able to disable Alibaba (and it's not an attack that Alibaba can cut through). I'm not sure who'd win against who in a straight out fight without anybody getting the jump.

NeoCybercoin

Mon, 03-17-2014, 04:59 AM

Magi s2 ep 23-1080p- Horriblesubs (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=533345)

Pretty awesome.

Archangel

Mon, 03-17-2014, 05:26 AM

The manga's Djin equip artwork is quite detailed and holy shit that does NOT translate well into anime

Look at this derpy shit

http://i.imgur.com/48t394Y.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/goTr6nP.jpg

Buffalobiian

Mon, 03-17-2014, 06:43 AM

I didn't expect to enjoy Kougyoku's appearance more than Hakuei's. You better make your appearance soon Morgianna, or Alibaba-chan might get stolen.

Kraco

Mon, 03-17-2014, 11:31 AM

I didn't expect to enjoy Kougyoku's appearance more than Hakuei's. You better make your appearance soon Morgianna, or Alibaba-chan might get stolen.

Yeah, I felt the same. Morgianna can't wait much longer or no amount of pouting will save her chances. Kougyoku looked so spirited and cheerful by floating next to Alibaba that they really are best friends or even more. Especially now that Kougyoku is watching Alibaba fight right next to the Kouen.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-17-2014, 11:57 AM

ACTION ACTION ACTIOOOOOOON!!!!!

Where the hell are Sche's Dungeon Capturers? They should be helping with this shit.

Kraco

Tue, 03-25-2014, 10:53 AM

Episode 24 - HS (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=535891)

-- - - -- - -

Finally! Morgiana is back. I was quite pleased by the manner of her return and how impressed and glad Alibaba was. Maybe there's still hope for those two. Although it's really too bad for Alibaba that Morgiana only saw him fall from the sky, not his fierce fight moments earlier, not to mention fighting side by side with Kouen.

This fight hasn't been a bad one. The enemy is nicely overpowering but at the same time not utterly untouchable. It's quite good how they thought for a while they were getting somewhere, only to be proven wrong. That really created a suitable setting for Sinbad & gang's timely intervention. Kouen can't anymore steal the limelight whenever he wants with Sinbad present, but he already had his moment of unquestioned command.

Ryllharu

Tue, 03-25-2014, 03:30 PM

I'm quite stunned at how bad the animation is getting. There were whole attack sequences (usually Kouen) that were copy-paste multiple times in the episode, frame for frame. If we were lucky there was a different background.

Other times there was simply misdrawn faces (Kougyoku and Kouha suffered the worst), and the wildly varying length of Morgiana's hair (looks even better longer btw).

I guess the big reveal that Gyokuen is former Magi from Alma Toran (who even set off the previous apocalypse) and that Aladdin is the reincarnation of Solomon gets a bit overshadowed by the fact that it's ending next week. She's also quite pissed that Sinbad...exists. He's so overwhelmingly powerful, and devoted to protecting the planet that I'm honestly a little surprised they're not more adamant about assassinating him.

I also thought it kind of ruined the dramatics when the "Father" extends a tentacle and starts getting pulled down. Wasn't the world supposed to end the moment that it touches the planet? Just pulling on that tentacle allows for that to happen. It would have been better if the two sets of tendrils are just about to touch when Sinbad strikes.

Buffalobiian

Wed, 03-26-2014, 03:01 AM

The bad animation certainly killed things a little. I skipped back and forth to see if it was a PC problem since I made some changes. That's just for the awkward movements though, not to even touch Alibaba's changing vein colours or the non-moving mouths of some characters. Morg's return was very welcome, but even then I'm not sure how I think about it since their interactions have been slightly awkward for some time now.

I'm glad they explained where the giant beings (assimilated Household Vessel holders) come from now. They've been a big wtf for a while now.

DarthEnderX

Thu, 03-27-2014, 08:35 PM

Man, I don't even know what the fuck is going on anymore.

Who are all those people with Sinbad? I know a couple of them were his household members, but I didn't recognize a bunch of them.

So, the evil lady is a Magi. But there's only supposed to be 3 magi. Cause there was 3 back then. Only now there's 5. But Aladdin doesn't count cause he's actually Solomon. But that means there's still 4, so what the hell.

I can only assume the reason the animation sucks is because of how ridiculously overcomplicated the Djinn Equip costumes are. Who the hell wants to animate all that nonsense.

I notice Morg's powerup included putting her chains back on her feet after originally deciding that was a bad idea. It's like the writer can't make up his mind.

And yeah, Solomon's 72 Household Members are obviously the Djinn what with, again, them all being named after the 72 demons in the Ars Goetia.

Buffalobiian

Thu, 03-27-2014, 09:20 PM

Who are all those people with Sinbad? I know a couple of them were his household members, but I didn't recognize a bunch of them

They're all people from the Seven Seas Alliance, which Sindria is a part of.

As for the Magi count, 3 Magi were created for this world. Then there are others who travelled from the previous world.

DarthEnderX

Thu, 03-27-2014, 10:16 PM

They're all people from the Seven Seas Alliance, which Sindria is a part of. I thought Sindria WAS the Seven Seas Alliance. Like it was all the territories that Sinbad combined into one kingdom.

So it's, what, a bunch of separate kingdoms?

As for the Magi count, 3 Magi were created for this world. Then there are others who travelled from the previous world.Oh...so at least 6 then.

shinta|hikari

Thu, 03-27-2014, 10:30 PM

Sindria is one country, the tiny island Yamuraiha protects with a barrier. The Seven Seas Alliance is, well, an alliance of countries.

Buffalobiian

Fri, 03-28-2014, 05:23 AM

Oh...so at least 6 then.

Assuming they didn't die, there's a potential for 6 (7 if you include Aladdin).

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-31-2014, 12:48 AM

[HorribleSubs] Magi - 25 - 1080p (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=537880) | 720p (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=537879) | 480p (http://www.nyaa.se/?page=download&tid=537878)

-------------------------------------------------------------

Bah, that's the last episode?

I wanted to watch Aladdin explain everything to Kouen.

So Leam is part of the 7SA now, and so is Magnostadt. And Titus is the new Scheherazade. That seems like huge wins for Sinbad all around.

Seriously, Morg got a raw deal in this entire season. Barely any screentime at all!

Buffalobiian

Mon, 03-31-2014, 04:28 AM

Leam is allied with them, so in a sense they're "part" of whatever you call their group now (7SA + Leam + Magnostadt = Anti-Kou Alliance?)

Sinbad got a lot, but he also lost Aladdin. All the countries have their own magi except him. It was a pretty low-impact episode overall. Things just concluded. I wish could feel more sad about Yamraiha's case, and Al Thamen were all jolly "Let's do this again next time!"

Does anybody even know that the bitch is behind this? >_>

I'm not expecting another Magi series for some time to come, but I'll welcome it when it happens.

NeoCybercoin

Mon, 03-31-2014, 06:08 AM

Buffalobiian

Mon, 03-31-2014, 07:58 AM

So...just who is Ugo? I mean he had to ability to sent back Titus as the new Magi and he was also the one who gave Aladin Solomon's Wisdom. But about Alladin with Kou...he promised he'd explain everything. He never said anything about allying with them. Plus they got Judar and last time I checked Alladin and him were not on very good terms.

Given his demeanor and power, I had a feeling he was one of Solomon's loyal magi from the old world. But the image projected when we saw Scheherazade die showed Aladdin and Alibaba as 'wise men' as well.

Aladdin got kidnapped by Kou as a 'guest' and he's not allied with them. But by being tied up with Kou it robbs Sinbad the chance of appealing to Aladdin in the first place. Maybe it wouldn't have mattered much either way since despite Aladdin's childish looks he's really deliberate about who he places his allegiance to.

Judal doesn't like Aladdin, but it also looks like Judal/Hakuryuu have their own plans that doesn't necessarily benefit Kou, so I'm not sure that they'll hang around much anyway.

If Aladdin goes to Kou and Alibaba follows.. would we see a Morg vs Kougyoku love triangle? That would be somewhat amusing to watch. :)

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-31-2014, 08:29 AM

So if Magi reincarnate when they die, it would make sense if the current Magi were reincarnations of the original 3 Magi.

But one of the original 3 Magi is still around. So that doesn't really work.

Sinbad got a lot, but he also lost Aladdin.I doubt that. Aladdin only agreed to tell him everything. It's not like he agreed to be his prisoner or anything. Unless they're going to try and hold him against his will, after he's done talking to Kouen, there's nothing really keeping him with Kou.

All the countries have their own magi except him.Well if he's allied with Leam and Magno, then he's got Titus. Cause Titus will presumably be running one of those two contries.

Does anybody even know that the bitch is behind this? >_>Probably Judal and Hakuryuu.

shinta|hikari

Mon, 03-31-2014, 09:16 AM

Aladdin is Alibaba's Magi. He will never be Sinbad's, Kouen's, or anyone else's.

The anime has caught up with the manga. It will be a while before we get a new anime for this :(

Kraco

Mon, 03-31-2014, 11:15 AM

Aladdin is Alibaba's Magi. He will never be Sinbad's, Kouen's, or anyone else's.

And Alibaba hardly has any ambitions or plans of his own. I guess that suits Aladdin just fine, since their values are largely similar (such as wanting to visit brothels) and both would want to stop Al Thamen above anything else. That wouldn't really end up making Alibaba a king of any country, though. It could be better that way in any case, considering he doesn't really have the mindset of a king.

shinta|hikari

Mon, 03-31-2014, 01:51 PM

But Alibaba is a prince of Balbadd. If he wants to save his country, he will inevitably be king.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-31-2014, 03:30 PM

Oh yeah, just an aside, I'm pretty used to the trope of someone yelling at someone who has just died for them to open their eyes or get up.

Usually, the body in question is not a fucking skeleton. Did you really think he might have just been unconscious Sphintus?!

shinta|hikari

Mon, 03-31-2014, 04:32 PM

LOL right.

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-31-2014, 04:52 PM

Man, 3 of the 6 anime I was watching ended this week.

When does Fairy Tail and Jojo start up again?

Buffalobiian

Mon, 03-31-2014, 06:39 PM

DarthEnderX

Mon, 03-31-2014, 08:22 PM

I would think he'd either take Sche's place as Leam's Magi, or he'd stay with the magicians out of attachment to them.

Either way, he still ends up allied with the 7SA.

Kraco

Tue, 04-01-2014, 01:48 AM

I never meant that Aladdin would actually become Sinbad's Magi. That was never in question. The loss is that from Sinbad's perspective, Aladdin is out of reach and is being held in Kou. From our perspective as viewers, he was never in reach, but as far as Sinbad's concerned Aladdin just got a whole less accessible.

He was plenty less accessible already in Magnostadt. He spent quite a long time there studying. I can't imagine he would have stories to tell in Kou for quite that long a time. Unless Kouen notices he can keep Aladdin around forever by promising (and delivering) a new big boobed girl to amuse him every few days. Though on the other hand Kou is exactly where Aladdin & Alibaba should be going considering the witch of Al Thamen is right there.

DarthEnderX

Thu, 04-03-2014, 07:22 AM

I mean, we didn't even get to see Morg interact with all those Fanalis from Leam!

lelouch

Wed, 07-02-2014, 12:35 AM

Man, 3 of the 6 anime I was watching ended this week.

What are the 6? I'm looking for some new stuff.

I just marathon'd this series in the past couple days. I have mixed feelings. I think I feel similarly about this anime as I do about Lupe Fiasco's music - it's certainly very enjoyable, although I could do without the antisemitic undertones. I understand that it's an arab-themed anime, but I think certain details were a bit overboard.

For example, the banker. The character is not "Jeffrey the Banker" or "Bob the Banker"; it's simply "a banker", villainizing all bankers as well as the fiat money system and the concept of interest on loans. I could let this fly as simply not a big deal, if it didn't turn out that the main antagonist was an evil wizard named Jewdal.

Sinbad seems to be a little bit OP as well. Purposely letting his items get stolen and getting cursed because he just does not give a fuck resembles Zaraki Kenpachi a bit with wanting a challenge, but if he stopped being such an arrogant prick about it, half the unnamed characters in this show might not have died.

I also don't know how I feel about them instantly being friendly with the Kou princess. Maybe I'm remembering this wrong, but is she not the one who, during the magis' first battle, came in and said "oh, those are your friends? Kill them all." and probably killed a lot of them, for no fucking reason. I don't care how cute and innocent she seems, bitch needs to repent.

Naruto would prob want to shoot a rasenshuriken at Aladdin too for all that destiny talk.

Putting all this aside, it was a pretty good watch. Hopefully season 2 comes out in the next year or so, but by the looks of it doesn't look like that will happen.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 07-02-2014, 04:02 PM

What are the 6? I'm looking for some new stuff.Ah jeeze. You expect me to remember 3 months later?

Wait, no, I remember.

At the time it was Naruto, One Piece and Hunter X Hunter(like it always is). And then Magi, Hajime No Ippo and Kill La Kill all ended at the same time.

Hopefully season 2 comes out in the next year or so, but by the looks of it doesn't look like that will happen.You mean Season 3? This WAS season 2.

shinta|hikari

Wed, 07-02-2014, 04:18 PM

Off topic, but I just wanted to ask. Do you only watch shounen action anime?

lelouch

Wed, 07-02-2014, 05:14 PM

Off topic, but I just wanted to ask. Do you only watch shounen action anime?

I was thinking the same thing haha

DarthEnderX

Wed, 07-02-2014, 07:23 PM

Off topic, but I just wanted to ask. Do you only watch shounen action anime?Does stuff like Hellsing, Black Lagoon and Ghost in the Shell count as that?

Archangel

Wed, 07-02-2014, 09:43 PM

Lol, yes...

lelouch

Wed, 07-02-2014, 09:49 PM

You mean Season 3? This WAS season 2.

I watched 25 episodes. Was that season 1 & 2? Or did I only finish season 1?

DarthEnderX

Thu, 07-03-2014, 06:24 AM

Lol, yes...Then yes, I only watch shounen action anime.

I watched 25 episodes. Was that season 1 & 2? Or did I only finish season 1?You only finished season 1. There's another 25 episodes out already.

Buffalobiian

Thu, 07-03-2014, 06:46 AM

Technically a "season" would be 13 weeks since that's how long a season lasts for (and four of those make up a year), but I suppose fine-lining series and seasons isn't always worth the effort.

shinta|hikari

Thu, 07-03-2014, 07:58 AM

They are called cours, and yes, it usually lasts 12-13 episodes. 24-26 episode ones are called 2 cour shows.

Buffalobiian

Thu, 07-03-2014, 09:15 AM

They are called cours, and yes, it usually lasts 12-13 episodes. 24-26 episode ones are called 2 cour shows.

That's a less ambiguous alternative.

I had a look on wiki (for whatever credibility that has), and it argues that a season is the US equivalent of a series in the UK. I suppose that validates the use for season to mean more than 13 episodes, but I dislike it since it doesn't make logical sense. Just like how housemates share a house, but the US use roommates to describe people who share the rooms (of a house) when it could be misunderstood elsewhere (due to logic) to mean people who share a room.

DarthEnderX

Thu, 07-03-2014, 11:25 AM

Yeah, in the US, a "season" of TV is all the episodes they make for a year in one continuous chunk.

And since most chunks in the US start in the Fall and continue through to Spring, that's counted as one Season, even though it stretches across two years.

In anime, I just count seasons where every time the series stops, when it starts up again, assuming it actually picks up where the previous one left off, that's a new season.

So shows like Naruto and One Piece don't even have seasons that I recognize. So I just divide it by story arcs in stead.

lelouch

Fri, 07-04-2014, 01:52 PM

Wowww I'm 9 episodes into Season 2. What an improvement! This show is getting awesome. I'm having reminiscences of Yu Yu Hakusho with this 3-way training split.

EDIT: -------------

Just finished marathoning the series (there go all my plans for the day). Holy shit, this was awesome. Why the fuck did I let this slip through my radar? I think when it first came out I saw a little kid on the cover pic and it turned me off. This was like, a mix of game of thrones / yu yu hakusho / FMA. Fking awesome awesome awesome show. When is S3?

I can't help get the feeling that Sinbad will end up as the show's ultimate main antagonist. Anytime these shows have an ally that is so goddamn OP, they end up being the final antagonist. Which makes me sad, I think he's one of my favorite characters of all time.

Good to see that the racist grandpa finally came to his senses, although I can't help but agree with him somewhat. A lot of what he said made a lot of sense. The only hypocrisy in his philosophy was treating the humans the same way they treated the magicians. He should have created a country for magicians without feeding on the weak. Sure the city wouldn't have as many high-tech tools to rely on, but it would have the moral high ground and be free of human corruption.