GotWoot Story Contest - Preliminaries - Round 3 [Archive]

Sapphire

Mon, 06-27-2011, 10:58 PM

Hi all!

GotWoot members have each written their own original short story.

Vote on your top two favorite stories!

If you participated in the contest, you have to vote, but you can't vote for yourself.
Therefore, you have to vote in every voting bracket but your own.
Please read ALL of the stories before you vote!
If you only vote for one story your vote is automatically discarded.
Pick your FAVORITE two (or at least the best two), trolling the other vote screws the other contestants over. If you do this I will know and hate you forever.

Preliminary rounds 1 - 5 have 4 stories each. The preliminary groups were completely randomly chosen. The top two stories from each bracket of the prelims will move on to semi-finals, then the winners of semi-finals will duke it out in the championships!

Authors will remain anonymous until the final results are declared! If an author wants to respond to a voter, they can do so through me.

Voters should give personal feedback below to our budding or seasoned authors!

The voting period for each round is 72 hours.

ROUND 3 - FIGHT!

Note: Round 2 voting (http://forums.gotwoot.net/showthread.php/19978-GotWoot-Story-Contest-Preliminaries-Round-2) is still open for about 16 more hours. (till 06/28/11 4 PM EST)

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Pastebin Mirrors
Screwed Story - no mirror, was sent as PDF
The Flu (http://pastebin.com/ptzXnwzL)
(Not) Your Average Chat (http://pastebin.com/SEfrzdsK)
The Beginning: My Orgasmic Seventeenth Summer (http://pastebin.com/WK4Wf55B)

Readability Mirrors
Screwed Story - no mirror, was sent as PDF
The Flu (https://www.readability.com/articles/0wipaxyk)
(Not) Your Average Chat (https://www.readability.com/articles/itjf6yen)
The Beginning: My Orgasmic Seventeenth Summer (https://www.readability.com/articles/bzcyerjb)

KitKat

Tue, 06-28-2011, 01:52 AM

Alright, time for comments!

Screwed story - Umm.... at least we got a small amount of amusement out of your predicament.

The Flu - I'm kind of a sucker for the post-apocalyptic genre, and this story was no exception. Interesting writing style, that gave a sense of a dizzying amount of time passing. I feel like it should be made into a tv miniseries, with the amount it covered. I just wish there was a better sense of who the author is. What is this half-mad survivor like? There were also a few small spelling/grammar mistakes, but not such that it detracted significantly from the story.

(Not) Your Average Chat - Well, I think it's fairly obvious who authored this funny and cute little anime parody. Kudos on fitting all those references in there. I did find the dialogue confusing though, and the breaks between the different sequences weren't very well marked leaving confusion whether something was a continuation of one event or a different event at a later time. Though having some self-referencing of the story to itself was rather clever and tongue-in-cheek, I think the impact was lessened by the chaotic flow. Switching from past to present tense was also a little distracting. Overall, I enjoyed this one.

The Beginning: My Orgasmic Seventeenth Summer - Please, I would rather not read your lesbian sexual fantasies. Good stories might contain sexual themes as part of the story, but when the story is sex for the sake of writing about sex, that's just literary porn. No thank you.

twofacedkitsune

Tue, 06-28-2011, 01:56 AM

This round was really hard to critique.

edit: I tried my best to evaluate the stories for what they were, or seemed to try to do. (since I felt it would be unfair to have my vote affected by how well the author could speak English, or their preferred subject matter)

Screwed Story - ...no comment haha.

The Flu - This was hard to comment on. The writing style was.... written as if in a feverish state. On one level, this makes it hard to engage the reader, yet on another, sorta supports the whole description of the Spanish Flu: "The fever killed most; those who survived were often touched. Wracked by guilt, delusional, suffering all the mushy-brained confusion a soft boiled mind can manage. Loss of senses, loss of speech, loss of direction, a lost mind and a wasted species" especially when the narrator himself is affected by it. It probably wouldn't hurt to be more specific about things (e.g. switch out words like visions, madness, panic, etc. for more specific visuals or events). But I would try to find some happy medium between the delirious prose and specificity.

*(Not) Your Average Chat - I think the area that could use the most work would be the story's "believability" (believability on multiple levels - narration, story progression, dialogue, story details, etc.). For example, it was narrated first-person, from a character who supposedly has had very little exposure to anime/otaku culture his entire life, yet at the same time, the prose was riddled with anime references, etc. This style of narration (as well as much of the dialogue and how the story plays out) could function as a critique of anime/anime love stories (if that was the intention), but otherwise I felt like it kind of undermined the protagonist's credibility. Here's an example of this:

"To be honest, I find anime pretty mundane, or even stupid. 90% of the shows are generic to the core, and fan service has replaced plot in terms of importance. It is riddled with overused elements, and even the art can be all over the place. I do not understand its appeal at all."

The first sentence makes it sound like the protagonist doesn't have any interest in anime (i.e. doesn't watch it, steers clear of and has no interest in anime/otaku culture). But then this is followed by a series of critiques that, due to their specificity, would be really hard to make unless he had watched a lot of anime, or was fairly knowledgeable about it.

A couple minor plot issues- is it even possible to become so knowledgeable about the world of anime in such a short period of time (enough to make specific references to say, Haruhi or Evangelion)? Or to even watch so many shows in such a short period of time? Why is the protagonist trying to get closer to this girl?

*The Beginning: My Orgasmic Seventeenth Summer - ...again, no comment haha. It didn't get me going, but the writing/dialogue/story progression all flowed well, and didn't feel forced or unnatural. Of all of the stories in the contest so far, this was by far the easiest to read, and I wasn't getting bogged down by ambiguities or forced, unnatural dialogue/story progression. While the story doesn't score points for originality or innovative writing, it did occasionally have a few details that kept it interesting and helped prevent it from being too generic... like the thing about the dog toy.

enkoujin

Tue, 06-28-2011, 02:51 AM

Good Lord. I'm not going to vote just yet because I felt all of these stories were hit-or-miss. You either like it or you don't.

"Screwed Story"

So here I am, the story of how I screwed myself coz I'm lazy.

So I really liked the title - it was the only good thing about it, really due to a great pun.

I also liked how the author was trying to be artistic with the font sizes and the intended spelling and grammar errors. This was the very essence and uniqueness that made it different from the other ones. It was easy to read with the bigger fonts.

All in all, it was like reading someone's Facebook/Twitter statuses. I'm not into that kind of thing, so I'll have to pass on this one. It could have been better if the author had more interesting things to talk about while procrastinating.

"The Flu"

We see patterns where none exist; life is random.

I liked this passage for some reason; surely, it must have greater meaning for the entire story, but I can't decipher anything just quite yet.

From what I've interpreted from a quick read, what I got was that the protagonist kept on heading West which alluded to such historic events like the Oregon Trail, the Gold Rushes of California and the flux of immigrants to settle on vast lands in the Canadian prairies in search of hope of a better quality of life than their current ones. This seems to be consistent as the protagonist moves from an apocalyptic setting to one of a social utopia.

The main messages I got were a handful. There were messages about enduring hardships by moving forward and that individuals are insignificant when compared to communities and even the cosmical stars. There existed messages about humans always being forever plagued, whether physically or psychologically, despite being able to move forward. Additionally, I think the author was trying to say that humans should walk around our environments to truly understand them. These were powerful messages, but unfortunately, this was not effectively communicated through this form of writing.

In the last paragraph, I think that the protagonist tried to cross the Pacific Ocean as a closure to the story assuming he/she started off living on the east coast of the US. This is supported by what he said earlier:

...More daylight, less despair, a semblance of hope, manifest destiny. Hah; destiny. My destiny was to live.

If the sun "rises in the East" and he is heading West to get there, one may conclude since the protagonist is heading East, which is where he started, before the Flu hit, he will find lots of "sun" and therefore, peace there. I could be wrong, though, since the only community in the story that became the sanctuary of the world is New Mecca, which I can only assume is in the Middle East. In that case, there has to be some religion involved here which is not my forte.

What I can say is that the author tried to cram a bucket of fried chicken down my throat with no beverages to help me swallow. It's not a bad style, but like the others from round #2, there was a lack of characterization, build-up and association with the protagonist. It was just setting, setting and more setting. Like the previous story, it was like reading Facebook/Twitter status updates over the course of someone's life.

Frankly, I think this should be redone as a log or journal with fewer concentrated scenes with emphasis on the lives the protagonist saved, the ones he failed to save and his experiences in different orders. Then, the audience can try to piece together the fragments to form a greater picture.

"(Not) Your Average Chat"

“End of conversation.”

Probably one of the more viable stories here because of the theme of anime that the audience shares a common interest in.

I thought this was more of a parody-novel written by the SHAFT animation team. It was a protagonist that was more-or-less breaking the fourth wall by mentioning stereotypical protagonists' lifestyles in romance-comedy-harem anime.

I may be wrong in my references here, but this entire dialogue felt like a conversation between Senjougahara and Araragi from "Bakemonogatari".

The protagonist seemed clueless of the conversation while the girl of interest felt quiescent and introverted. I felt that this theme is very similar to "Nogizka Haruka no Himitsu" in terms of both main characters, Ayase and Nogizaka, except that the girl of interest is more "tsundere" and that the protagonist became more like Takumi Usui from "Kaicho wa Maid-Sama!".

I'd like to say I like the allusion and multiple references to "Neon Genesis Evangelion", "The World God Only Knows", "Gosick", "The [emotional and physical state] of Suzumiya Haruhi", "Steins;Gate" and many more that I forgot to pick up, but I didn't due to personal preferences. It's a hit-or-miss with anime/manga fans whether they are casual or hardcore.

I enjoyed it and the execution was interesting and not overdone. Excellent spelling, grammar and spacing. However, I felt that there was something missing and I can't quite put my finger to it. It's a hit-or-miss story.

"The Beginning: My Orgasmic Seventeenth Summer"

"Yes! We're gonna have so much fun together!"

The flow was good, but I felt like I would rather watch some smut than read it.

Grammar, spelling and spacing were all well done. Otherwise, I don't have anything to say about it. It's another hit-or-miss story.

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 07:18 AM

Screwed Story - This story is hilarious. Also, I'm one of the main characters of the story, so how can I not like it? And while I was doing the posts, I was totally unaware that I was a character in someone else's story, so I'm really freaked out. It leads me to many questions. Were the actions my own, or was I just a puppet of the author's wim? Am I being controlled by the author now. Is there someone, somewhere, writing a story about this very post?!

The Flu - Great, provocative writing. I like how the story is set in the future. I like how the West is once again used as a promise land.

Survival of the one was meaningless, it was the group that must persist.

I hope the negative parts of this get expanded in part 2, do not want communism society in my post-apocalyptic world. :<

How did he save a life? I need more details. Also reminds me of The Book of Eli a bit. I'd slow the narrative down so we got to see more of the (inevitably interesting) aspects of his day to day life.

(Not) Your Average Chat - I HATE tsunderes. Can't stand them. Their presence pisses me off. And "tears falling on fists" is physically impossible I think, but was cute. I like the slight breakings of the fourth wall, and I thought the "End of Conversation" parts were very original, as I've never really seen it before. I hate the main characters though, it's one boring noob trying to impress a total bitch (let's not say tsundere, tsundere is just another word for bipolar bitch anyway). I must be dumb because I don't understand the last bit of the story at all, let me reread it.

No, I'm still confused by her reaction. Is the tsundere pissed off and overloaded by too much human interaction? I know someone like that, I STEER CLEAR. But the main character just keeps derping along, trying to get to know this pre-stages sociopath better.

I have to agree with TFK on his observation of the litter of anime references that the protagonist makes, though he claims to have no anime knowledge. However, this would prolly sell well with anime fans, so I might end up putting it on the FP when the contest is over. It can be a "how many anime references can you find" game. I like the dialogue, it's very novelesque. When no one has anything to say anymore (due to whatever reason, like being a BITCH or a boring anime noob with no social skills) the conversation just ends awkwardly.

My Orgasmic Seventeenth Summer - This is exactly like the stories I see on Nifty or Literotica, so when all is said and done you can always throw your stories on there, and get thousands of views. I felt like there was too much exposition and not enough sexing, I mean I think 3 of those pages of exposition could have been replaced by sexing. And I don't want no normal lesbian sex, I want CRAZY sex that I've never even heard of, stuff that's titillating and insane so you go, "damn, never seen that before," so GotWoot can speak of it for generations to come.
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Can't decide which to vote for. If I vote. I pretty much hate (Not) Your Average Chat, but it was well-written enough to make me emotional which is no easy feat. I am a main character in Screwed Story, enough said. 17th Summer has sexing, and the first paragraph seems to imply promises of craziness. The Flu is just awesomely written and post-apocalyptic, which I LOVE.....
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PS - I really need enjoukin's intepretation of (Not) Your Average Chat because I don't get it.

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 08:28 AM

Author of (Not) Your Average Chat says [spoilers, highlight to make visible]:

The switching between past and present tense is intentional. It is because the POV of the protagonist moves along with the story. In narration parts, he mulls over past events, so the tenses follow. In the conversation parts, he is actually narrating while events happen, so it is in present tense. The reason for doing this is to make the development more exciting. If the protagonist/narrator himself does not know how his attempts will turn out, the readers won’t either. I know it seems arrogant to toy with an established rule, but I wanted to be adventurous.

I agree about the transitions. I think that was mainly due to the word limit. The story is already 50 words over, which I believe is pushing it. I tried my best to make use of the length.

About the believability, the first 5 conversations happened in a span of a week (as stated in the story), which meant that the protagonist did some hardcore watching and research. It is possible, if you sacrifice sleep like most otaku do. Take note that he was only watching stuff that he mentioned, meaning really popular shows and some recently airing shows. He chose what he watched for a purpose after all. He did not just watch them too. He studied them.

The narration at the beginning that had information on “average” anime happened after their first 2 conversation (as implied by the completely past tense narration in the thought segments). This means that he has already done some serious research, and knows enough to say what he did.

The rest of the references increased gradually, and reflected what kind of research he has been doing. The must watch research allowed him to reference Haruhi and Geass. The otaku lingo and recent show research allowed him to use the term tsundere and comment on GOSICK. The rest of the references and comments are made possible by the other stuff he watching during the rest of his free time.

I know it is a bit confusing, so let me explain the ending for those who got didn’t get it. The last part is basically the girl asking why the protagonist is hanging out with her even if he ends up being bullied as well. The reason why she was so quiet and reserved is because it lessens the bullies’ attacks. The girl stopped talking to him because she didn’t want him to get involved in her troubles. The protagonist said that he doesn’t care about all that because those are not important (even the reason why he likes her, which is why he intentionally does not reply to her question). It supposedly ends with a kiss, which was implied by the protagonists actions and the quoted (meaning spoken) “End of conversation” line.

I tend to fit too many things that people won’t notice in my stories, and I apologize about that. The 2500 word limit really was challenging. Thanks for all the comments so far!

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 08:40 AM

I sort of gleamed the bully part from the text, but still, her reaction was very... ugh... tsundere-ish. I wish she was more like Tora, and could beat the bullies asses, at least. The increase of anime references as time goes on makes sense.

I thought this was a lesbian story?

Well, my looks are fairly good, even if I don’t look like a girl or cute at all.

Why does the protagonist do all this stuff for the antisocial homeless looking girl? Now the protagonist seems like a creepy stalker. :<

I like how the story's main setting is in the classroom, yet still allows us to imagine all the stuff that's happening on the outside. (Not much though, sitting in class and watching animez at home).

RyougaZell

Tue, 06-28-2011, 09:16 AM

Screwed Story: I wasn't amused by this attempt to be funny. It lacks structure, idea and purpose. Its just a cluster of random ideas. If the purpose was to portray what goes around the mind of someone with a mind-block, it didn't deliver enough explanations or feelings to really understand it.

The Flu: The story has a central idea of events that happened and what the main character did afterwards. Yet the story has a problem. The title and the content. I wouldn't name this story 'Flu' when the 'Flu' changed from the central theme to a background event no longer important as the story progressed from a viral catastrophe into a supernatural plot with a character with powers. Grammar and narrative are okay, but the focus is lost and changed as each paragraph passed.

(Not) your average chat: The relationship between the characters was perfectly portrayed, conveying both their feelings to the audience, aided by a very good grammar and distribution of paragraphs. The main problem, though, is that the story tries to hard to please this forum's members by making references to current series. It would have been better to use another hobby that wasn't 'anime' or make the character anything else than 'otaku'. If using this was a must... the references should have been only un-aired series... not series we could have seen yesterday. The use of jokes from this series only hurts the story itself. The breaking of the 4th wall was a terrible idea. Funny, but terrible. In the end this story feels like a piece of fanfiction instead of a story due to all the copyright infringements.

Seventeenth Summer: A bunch of smut so I won't go into detail of the plot. Characterization is good, progress is good.

To be honest... I will only be voting on Summer based on grammar, characterization and arrangement of ideas. If I could vote for only one story I would. Flu and Screwed don't manage to qualify for a vote, so Summer gets it. I don't expect this story to pass from the 2nd round though.

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 10:00 AM

I disagree with you about (N)YAC Zell. Like "A Live Arm," the author wrote about what he knew. This made me more comfortable to read it. However, referencing fake titles would be interesting too.

RyougaZell

Tue, 06-28-2011, 10:09 AM

The story works as it is Saph. The problem I see is that it can't be used as a legal story because of all the copyright issues. I know that wasn't part of the rules or anything, but I think that an original story should not use other works to make itself better.

Heck, I voted for it because its good and fun... but making the character speak like Keima from TWGOK or act like Okabe from Stein's Gate, while funny, is plagiarism. Even the title takes advantage of the recent Evangelion movies.

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 10:12 AM

He's not making a profit so it's fine. There's no legal issue with making references to other anime in one's story. If it really was an issue (like in Japan) he could just change the titles slightly like they do in Genshiken.

Some shows are total parodies of other shows, like "Community," and "Yakitake Japan," and "Tower of Druaga," and some are just tribute anime to nerd culture like "Denpa Onna," and "Lucky Star," and "Genshiken" and countless others. If you see it as copying the personality of a character, you're possibly just noting how extremely archetypal, tropey, or common the character is.

Copying many lines and phrases (without it obviously being a reference), however, is questionable, but I haven't seen the shows so I wouldn't know.

RyougaZell

Tue, 06-28-2011, 10:15 AM

Correct. Hence why I voted for it. Its the best of lot. But the character ends with no personality as he acts as anime characters, despite being portrayed as someone who doesn't like anime.

Buffalobiian

Tue, 06-28-2011, 11:54 AM

Smut and I Rode West tied for second for me. I ended up voting for sex because I enjoyed the characters, but it really is pretty much a tie.

Anime story took first place

Janice

Tue, 06-28-2011, 12:00 PM

but making the character speak like Keima from TWGOK or act like Okabe from Stein's Gate, while funny, is plagiarism.
Making a character speak or act like another character from another story isn't plagiarism. You can't copyright a personality.

kokujin-kun

Tue, 06-28-2011, 01:33 PM

Okay, one sentence reviews of all the stories I read this round:

Screwed Story:

Nice blog post.

The Flu:

Managed to cram in a whole lot of tropes about dystopian futures.

(Not) Your Average Chat:

Give this dude a generic light-novel publishing contract, stat!

The Beginning: My Orgasmic Seventeenth Summer:

It actually made me half hard, so it gets points from me.

RyougaZell

Tue, 06-28-2011, 02:34 PM

Making a character speak or act like another character from another story isn't plagiarism. You can't copyright a personality.

The main character said 'I can see the ending' and pretended to speak with his secret agent. Don't tell that isn't copying Keima and Okabe

KitKat

Tue, 06-28-2011, 02:49 PM

The main character said 'I can see the ending' and pretended to speak with his secret agent. Don't tell that isn't copying Keima and Okabe
I think you're mistaking this story for a genre that it was never intended to be. From what I understand, the author never intended realism (correct me if I'm wrong, author). This story is a parody, and as such it follows different writing conventions. The characters are more social constructs made from an anime culture, and their interactions are a commentary on that culture.

Dark_Sage

Tue, 06-28-2011, 07:50 PM

@ whatever the first one was

Fuck you. Your submission wasn't funny. If you're gonna bitch out, at least make a shitty story that shows you don't care, rather than blog your shitty life to me. You got invited to a wedding? Great. I invite you to jump off a bridge.

@ Not Your Average Chat

Wow, like omg! What a cute (LOL) story!

Seriously? What is this shit?

The intro paragraph reads like the intro to a Nickolodean series. "I'm so average in a way that's not average in the way that average is thought of. Check out The Average Life of Jesse, weeknights on Nick!" But at least Nick shows have their characters get into wacky hijinks. This story would have been at least readable if that had been the case. Unfortunately for me, the author tried to take in a totally different direction.

Oh, before I rip this story's vagina apart like a group of black guys who see a white girl at a rap concert, I just wanna let you know that a parody has to be funny for the "It's a parody" excuse to work.

“Hey, would you like to go home together?”
“I can’t hear you through my AT-field.”

Oh, what wit. What hilarity. This ranks right up there along the all-time greats, such as

Oh hey, we should be friends.
Oh, I'm sorry, I have to go Poketraining with my Pokemon because you know this is a Pokemon reference.

and

What did you get on your test score?
Oh, my test score is OVER 9000!!!!

Amazing. I don't know how long it took the author to think of that one, but I can't see more than half a day having gone by for it to finally pop into their head.

And yes, I get that the idea is that the main character is average. You repeated the word seven fucking times on the first page. Do not ever fucking do that again. It's tedious and makes my head hurt.

OH COOL MORE ANIME REFERENCES. ASTRO BOY, ANYONE?

You know what? Fuck this, I'm not pissing away my life on a play-by-play commentary.

This story is one of the most pathetically-written pieces of shit I've ever read and I've read Lord of the Rings. I have no clue how the author managed to write this thing up to seven pages, but they at least deserve some kudos for trolling my ass into reading it all.

@ the one with orgasms 'n shit

This is a poor excuse for... well, everything. Let me put it bluntly, if you're trying to get people engaged in your story, don't write like a middle schooler who just found out what a puberty is.

Your writing is atrocious, and considering it's not that hard to write a story about carpet munchers, I'm fucking disappointed.

I wish I didn't have to vote for two entries or I wouldn't even bother voting for this waste of e-ink.

@ The Flu

+1 brofist for you for your unnatural love of the comma.
-1 brofist for writing like a pretentious twat
+1 brofist for STILL managing to write better than the other entries here

Overall? *brofist*

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 08:54 PM

Legitimate criticism Dark_Sage, please.

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 09:26 PM

Author of The Flu says, "The Bay area (SF) is New Mecca, as there was some confusion".

Sapphire

Tue, 06-28-2011, 09:49 PM

Author of (N)YAC says:

The plot and characters serve as a satire of the pitfall in which majority of anime and manga titles get trapped. While complaining and denying the average, ultimately it still could not escape from it. The classroom setting, the tsundere (kuudere to be more specific) female lead, the blush scene, the bullying, and the kiss conclusion are all generic elements intentionally included in the story.

The writing style is a pastiche of how many popular light novels are written. This includes the gratuitous use of references. Credit and gratitude go to enkoujin and kokujin-kun for noticing.

Parodies don’t need to be funny all the time. It can be ironic like in this story. I do hope, however, that some parts at least made some people chuckle a bit.

SeanW

Tue, 06-28-2011, 10:23 PM

A mixed bag, decidedly. Better on average than Round 1, not as good as Round 2.

A Screwed Story: putting almost no effort into a story isn't necessarily bad; some authors have a gift, and good stories just seem to roll off their fingers. Admittedly, the other story so far which showed so little effort was pretty execrable, but at least 1000 Dicks didn't rub the reader's face in it.

The Flu: well, it's not terrible. There are a number of grammatical and spelling glitches (it's a good sign that I wanted to dive in and fix them; beyond a certain point, as with The Game and Madness' Door, I'd rather throw the laptop against the wall than edit them). Unfortunately, the bulk of the story is just exposition of an entirely standard post-apocalyptic world, the kind of thing that ought to take up a few paragraphs of the beginning of a novel. It's told decently enough, with picturesque but not overblown language. But once the real plot kicks in, it starts to read a little like a story outline interlarded with overly cryptic and flamboyant exclamations ("No time! No choice!") and random scraps of seemingly unrelated text ("Mechanic by day, artist by night."). The last line, though, is just out of left field. It doesn't explain anything in the rest of the story, it's basically just a "to be continued" flag. (And riding west from San Francisco generally just gets you very wet.)

(Not) Your Average Chat: Ugh. Technically sound, but it's one enormous love letter to anime. It seems to have been created solely to allow the author to cram as many anime references in as possible. The attempt at recursion, "being meta", breaking the fourth wall, whatever you want to call it, doesn't help (and itself could be construed as a ref to the likes of "Pani Poni Dash"). It's not a story, it's one long in-joke.

The Beginning: needs more sex. LOL. Seriously though, it's a whole lot of build-up with no real payoff, and the intriguing lead-in about the narrator's career seems to have been forgotten completely. This is basically the first chapter of a book, not a short story at all. Technically it's very good, though there are a few rough spots (the very first clause is missing the word "of", for example). But all in all it's by far the best entry in this round.

XanBcoo

Wed, 06-29-2011, 11:48 AM

Sapphire

Wed, 06-29-2011, 05:28 PM

I agree with everything Dark Sage said.

It really bugs me that every single story in this competition (aside from the Mechanic story in bracket 2) reads like fanfiction. Surely Gotwoot is better read than that.

Edit: And I can't believe the author of the "wacky anime" story had to write an additional 1,000 words just to defend and explain their story. If it takes that much effort to explain it, it isn't speaking for itself, man.

It bugs me that every single comment that you've made in this competition is not only derogatory but useless. If you know a way that an author can improve his story then say it, surely as a literate adult male you have more words to say about something than "wacky" and "fanfic"? It's as if your very existence is offended by these stories.

Some people actually worked hard to write these. This implies that it doesn't make people feel good, (meaning they don't feel any desire to do a better job) when you just shit all over them. Just as you are disgusted by these stories, I'm disgusted by your inability to say anything that can help these authors become better writers in any way shape or form.

Lucifus

Wed, 06-29-2011, 05:37 PM

I'm also inclined to agree with Sapphire here; jesus dude, after your first series of 'critiques', give them a break will ya?

I agree when you say they obviously aren't the best short stories in the world but goddamn no one has claimed to be a professional author here.

Maybe they aren't writing to the best of their ability but you can't just chalk that up to laziness. Despite what you think, writing can be time consuming, and I'm sure most of the people who have submitted something spent more time trying to come up with something to write about than actually typing it up. Half way through, I'm sure they lost their motivation.

But they still completed their works and submitted them to the best of their ability with what they had. So try not to take too personal an insult from their poor degenerative writing abilities. Or your just taking something bad home from work. I personally like critiques, as most in general give me a great deal of motivation to improve my work twice-fold. However, that doesn't hold true when they sound like the person critiquing has fire-ants up their ass. And no, I don't have a story in this competition.

I'm fairly certain this competition was put together with the intent of having fun, and I'm certain the participants didn't take the time out of their day to make it happen to listen to people call their work shit.

Edit: My apologies for the rant, I realize this time around you didn't piss all over everyone's stories; however I'd gotten ticked over your last posts, and I guess seeing this one brought it back.

XanBcoo

Wed, 06-29-2011, 05:41 PM

It bugs me that every single comment that you've made in this competition is not only derogatory but useless. If you know a way that an author can improve his story then say it, surely as a literate adult male you have more words to say about something than "wacky" and "fanfic"? It's as if your very existence is offended by these stories.

Some people actually worked hard to write these. This implies that it doesn't make people feel good, (meaning they don't feel any desire to do a better job) when you just shit all over them. Just as you are disgusted by these stories, I'm disgusted by your inability to say anything that can help these authors become better writers in any way shape or form.
Ok, open a creative writing subforum or something. Some platform to share stories and ask for critiques. I don't think I've ever been unfairly critical or have ever "shit all over" someone's art in the fanart subforum and I hope I wouldn't be in a similar subforum for writing.

This is a competition. The stories in this bracket were not that good. That is what I think. I agree with a lot of the points that people have already brought up, and disagree with those who had leniency towards them because they had anime references or something. I'm not going to be "nice" and give a pass to stories that I think are poorly constructed, too long, and hackneyed.

Sapphire

Wed, 06-29-2011, 06:00 PM

Ok, open a creative writing subforum or something. Some platform to share stories and ask for critiques. I don't think I've ever been unfairly critical or have ever "shit all over" someone's art in the fanart subforum and I hope I wouldn't be in a similar subforum for writing.

This is a competition. The stories in this bracket were not that good. That is what I think. I agree with a lot of the points that people have already brought up, and disagree with those who had leniency towards them because they had anime references or something. I'm not going to be "nice" and give a pass to stories that I think are poorly constructed, too long, and hackneyed.
Interestingly enough, despite the title of this forum and the fact that this is a competition, through this venture, authors have the opportunity to improve their writing and even their stories. This means that this thread and comment section is a "platform to share stories and critiques".

Nevermind the stories in this contest, we are trying to say your comments themselves are unenjoyable to read and offensive because they are so useless and derogatory. Say something specific, better than the bland "OH ALL THESE STORIES ARE SHIT OUT IN 5 MINUTES, wacky fanfics," etc.

Also, your negative comment about the author trying to explain his story was just "extra".

XanBcoo

Wed, 06-29-2011, 06:09 PM

Yeah, I literally haven't said anything close to that.

I said all the stories read like fanfiction and that if you had to write an extra several paragraphs to explain your story then that is evidence of it not being clear enough to stand on its own.

I have not personally insulted any of the authors. I have not used inflammatory language. In every post of every bracket I have said at least one constructive thing and explained why I did not like the stories. I am not required to type out paragraphs of detailed criticism and I don't wish to. Others have been critical enough and I agree with the majority decision on this.

Lucifus

Wed, 06-29-2011, 06:16 PM

I would classify that edit above as a personal observation. It isn't a direct insult to the author, but you still didn't need to tone the message like the author was a special kid. Personally, I feel that's the first decent critique you've made in this competition as you were actually specific on something the author could take to heart and improve.

You obviously didn't feel others were critical enough, as you were exponentially more critical than any previous reviewer. (Dark Sage's opinion does not count on the charges that he is a troll.)
-_-

Your critiques, are not constructive in the least. Now read that last line twice. Now read that same line again. Get it yet?

Whether or not you do, I feel I've made my point, and if these posts don't change your mind, arguing over it anymore wont either. Lets leave it at that and stop derailing the thread.

Edit: And as for Dark_Sage, learn some goddamn respect. Who da fuck raised you? I suppose this is the internet but goddamn! I'm glad I don't moderate these forums, because if I did, I'd abuse my effing powers on you. -_-

Sapphire

Wed, 06-29-2011, 06:18 PM

Yeah, I literally haven't said anything close to that. . -

It really bugs me that every single story in this competition (aside from the Mechanic story in bracket 2) reads like fanfiction.

If the stories we read are objectively terrible, we can't fool ourselves into thinking any differently. Why should I vote that someone has a chance at winning a prize for their writing if their story reads like something they crapped out in 10 minutes?

et. cetera.

Close enough.

And saying something "reads like a fanfiction" without saying why, also is not constructive. Not to mention that one of the best things I have ever READ is a fanfiction, you're just labeling it something that you think is insulting.

enkoujin

Wed, 06-29-2011, 07:36 PM

I agree with Lucifus.

I don't want to belittle anyone in GotWoot, but not all of us are authors nor do we write regularly. Give the writers a slack; we're all doing this for fun, amusement and what I can only assume is the rebirth of GotWoot to draw in more members. It's like bringing in a high-class connoisseur to review food from a fast food restaurant and he/she belittles every item the restaurant provides. What would you expect?

I do understand that XanBcoo does provide some positive feedback although most of it is negative and condescending. It's not helping anyone if we have an intellectual seriously critiquing amateur pieces of work.

I do understand that you have high standards from a community you've been part of for the last six years, but you should know best, since you're a moderator, that this is an international forum where everyone is legitimately busy with their own lives, try to communicate their ideas through a language that might not have been their first language and simply took this idea as something fun to do and not serious (even though there are prizes at stake). I'm sure people like David75, who wrote "Screwed Story", could have come up with something beautiful if they were seriously ambitious about it.

The other thing is that saying simple sentences about a story isn't enough. What constitutes a "fan-fiction"? Some people would not be able to tell from reading that what a "fan-fiction" is. If you say that that you're not required to type out paragraphs of detailed criticism and don't wish to, then that is fine with me. But if you're going to post something you're taking seriously, don't be a half-assed poster. Your posts will end up degrading to those of Archangel and those of the Bleach Manga thread where they say share their opinions about something but aren't willing to put time and effort to explain why they liked or disliked it.

Lastly, to Dark_Sage. I know this isn't a dreamland with ponies and rainbows around us where everyone can write something so profound that its ideas can't be found on TVTropes, but stop trolling and learn to appreciate a piece of work that people put their souls into - even if you don't like it.

Dark_Sage

Wed, 06-29-2011, 09:09 PM

Never mind, delete lol

Lucifus

Wed, 06-29-2011, 09:14 PM

Can someone, please, mod the fuck out of this guy? Why hasn't it already been done?

I see a troll. So take it to the fucking trolling thread.

Buffalobiian

Wed, 06-29-2011, 09:23 PM

Never mind, delete lol

I read that man. Consider this your final warning for personal flaming.

En, you too. I edited out something from your last post.

DeadlyOats

Wed, 06-29-2011, 09:43 PM

Yeah, man. I thought this was suppose to be a fun contest with amature writers, and small-time hoakey prizes for the winners. The way you haters are hatin', it's no fun at all.

Yeah, man. I thought this was suppose to be a fun contest with amature writers, and small-time hoakey prizes for the winners. The way you haters are hatin', it's no fun at all. Take a good laxative, then have a good dump, and let the stress out. Wait a minute.... They are trolling..... Stop spoiling the fun for us, you Forsakenly, Orcish Trolls! You act like a Horde of evil Blood(ed) Elf-Gobblins!

twofacedkitsune

Wed, 06-29-2011, 10:48 PM

Yeah, man. I thought this was suppose to be a fun contest with amature writers, and small-time hoakey prizes for the winners. The way you haters are hatin', it's no fun at all.

Agreed, this isn't the nobel prize for literature or anything.

Not to play the devil's advocate or anything, but I see where Xan and Dark_Sage are coming from. Contests aren't any fun if the stakes aren't high, people don't put a lot of work into their submissions, etc.

That being said, even if the stories aren't award-winning literature, it seems like most of the authors tried pretty hard to write something they thought was good. Some people can take criticism better than others, but I'm sure most of the non-aspiring writers didn't enter the contest to have their efforts flamed and stuff. No need to shower them with glowing praise or anything, but massive props to everyone who did submit a story, for doing so

If I'm not mistaken, the reasoning behind leaving feedback was primarily to give the writers whose stories were chosen advice on improving their stories, so that they could edit them up for the next round

DeadlyOats

Wed, 06-29-2011, 10:57 PM

I voted for "The Flu" as my first choice, because it was an interesting story. LOL! Really, it was. The first thing we learn is that events are unrelated, and that there is no pattern to historical events. Why that is important to know, I din't quite get. However, what I did get was that Spanish Flu destroys brain cells. And this guy has lost his mind, or was losing it after his bout with the flu (Spanish Flu). One of the earlier reviewers seems to have gotten the impression that the guy gained special powers to see into the future, and that he could save people, but what I got was that he was delusional. Him, saving a life, was all in his broken brain. What we are seeing, here, are events that occurred his his delusion. Has the world really ended? Did he really "go west", or was he "taken west" to a mental ward? I WANT TO KNOW how much of this is delusion, and how much is real life, how this man is perceiving it all - through his flu-broken mind! There I go.... speculating again... But that goes to show how hooked I got.

I voted for (N)YAC as my second choice, because.... it was not my first choice. I admit, I had to re-read certain passages a few times - the switching between past and present tenses - and that "aside" (I was taught, when studying Shakespear in high school, it was called an "aside" - but folks are calling it "the fourth wall" these days - or are they different devices in storytelling?) kind of threw me for a few loops, but I kind of lost track at the end.

I din't understand why she was crying, or that there were bullies. I din't see anything about any bullies until it was explained later in a follow up post by Sapphire (who had to go and really dig for it, before she saw any evidence of bullying). And even though the word "parody" did not enter my mind, I did get that the story was making fun of anime love stories. I liked the way the author made fun of the description of every anime I've ever read about. "So and so is an average high school boy who meets such and such a girl who... and then....."

As for Screwed Story... It was hard to tell if the protagonist was thinking out loud or talking to the audience or talking to someone in the story. I got the general idea of the story, but it was a hard read for me.

As for that other story.... There were no problems with the story telling per se, but I didn't like the story.

RyougaZell

Thu, 06-30-2011, 08:32 AM

*sigh*

Let me try this again, since it seems I choose the wrong words and caused misunderstandings.

I *liked* (Not) your Average Chat.

What I liked of this story:
- Pacing of the story is very well done
- Like characterization of the main guy and the girl.
- I *did* like the references to other stories (even if my comments didn't reflect this)

What I didn't like of this story:
- It relies heavilly on knowing recent anime
- The main character's personality is overshadowed by the jokes of him acting like other characters, making him look bland.
- Breaking the 4th wall. While funny handled... I've never *never* liked the breaking of the 4th wall.

The word plagiarism wasn't the correct one used. That is the truth. However, as this isn't fanfiction I expected at most similar personalities... but a direct word by word action.

I do understand this is suppossed to be a parody... but it still bothers me.

And no. I didn't vote for it because if was the least bad or anything (that goes to the sex story). I voted for this story because IT deserves it. I'm just bothered by the main character.

Yukimura

Thu, 06-30-2011, 10:58 AM

I'm done with this contest, I am only posting to give feedback on why I don't feel it's worth it to continue participating and I apologize to the authors for disrupting the thread that should be about the stories in order to say my piece.

The response threads all have positive critiques and negative critiques, flamming critiques and fluffy critiques. What bothers me is that while all of these are normal and predictable responses to a contest of this type several posters, including the moderator of the contest, seem to be somewhat hostile toward certain types of critiques. Negative critiques seem to be held up to a standard that they must be 'useful' and/or 'constructive' and/or 'agreeable' to other posters or else a debate breaks out between meta-critics who would seemingly defend the 'honor' of the authors against negative feedback and the negative critics who have said their piece and will defend their words as their legitimate responses to the stories they just read. No one bats an eyelash at positive critiques that don't say much of anything so the 'be constructive' and 'be useful' arguments fall apart in my mind. Instead it seems the only way to say your piece unmolested is to say nothing negative about the stories at all.

I also don't agree with the notion that criticism in a contest such as this should be based on the presumed amateurishness of the authors. No one was forced into this contest and I don't feel anyone is entitled to having their story given a pat on the back for existing as opposed to not. I also don't feel authors are entitled to not hearing that their story fell short of the expectations or standards of some who read it when they submitted it to a public contest knowing there would be feedback and judgment. I feel that if the authors were willing to put their work out there to be seen by all (and expected to be read) they should be willing to accept that some people did not like it and would tell them so, possibly without specific pointers for improvement.

That said I have no wish to force my views down anyone's throat if they would be unpalatable so I will abstain from the contest rather than risk offending anyone, author or fan, on the chance that I feel like saying only negative things about a work or allotting my votes based on my feelings toward the stories as influenced by all the other fiction I've been exposed to and not any compassion I might feel for the authors.

shinta|hikari

Thu, 06-30-2011, 11:07 AM

It makes me sad that this is happening.

I think that everyone should be able to say what they want about the stories, no matter how harsh it is. People can disagree and debate about it too. That is part of the fun in reviewing literary works. I would suggest that they tone down the harshness in how the critiques are made, BUT I won't stop them if they want to keep doing so, even if I had the power. They are entitled to their opinion, period. While I want to keep it fun, freedom of expression takes precendence, particularly because this IS a writing contest.

Sapphire

Thu, 06-30-2011, 11:09 AM

The response threads all have positive critiques and negative critiques, flamming critiques and fluffy critiques. What bothers me is that while all of these are normal and predictable responses to a contest of this type several posters, including the moderator of the contest, seem to be somewhat hostile toward certain types of critiques. Negative critiques seem to be held up to a standard that they must be 'useful' and/or 'constructive' and/or 'agreeable' to other posters or else a debate breaks out between meta-critics who would seemingly defend the 'honor' of the authors against negative feedback and the negative critics who have said their piece and will defend their words as their legitimate responses to the stories they just read. No one bats an eyelash at positive critiques that don't say much of anything so the 'be constructive' and 'be useful' arguments fall apart in my mind. Instead it seems the only way to say your piece unmolested is to say nothing negative about the stories at all.

Wait, so it's okay to give a negative response to a story, but not a negative response to the negative response? And realize that you're giving a negative response to the negative response of the negative response.
-
Realize that no one's walking around with the ban hammer (at the moment). I welcome Xan's comments, but I'm still going to call him out for it if I disagree with his approach. Negative feedbackers can also call out positive feedbackers on their approach, which is what's been happening (though on a lesser scale, admittedly).

Lucifus

Thu, 06-30-2011, 11:18 AM

The moral of the story here; be as fucking harsh as you like; just use the manners you've managed to scavenge throughout your life doing so. From the display of some of the posters here, it would appear this elusive creature called manners is nonexistent.

KitKat

Thu, 06-30-2011, 12:23 PM

Even though there's an extra layer of anonymity in this contest, when you speak online you are never speaking into a vacuum. All the comments and critiques are read by real people, and I get tired of the whole, "Everybody flames on the internet. If they take it the wrong way they need to toughen up" argument. The things you say can be genuinely hurtful. If nothing else, they hurt me when I read them and put myself in the shoes of the person the comments are directed to. The fact that they are participating in a contest does not justify making personal attacks against them. (Though in the same vein, neither should anyone be making personal attacks against those posting negative critiques. Be respectful please.)

I won't go into the manner and justification of critiques. Y'all can use your good judgement there. But when it comes to saying things like, "This story was written in 30 minutes" or "The authors are all morons", those are making assumptions about the authors that should not be made because neither the authors nor their situations are known. I don't so much care what you say about the stories, but I do care what you say about the people who wrote them.

What are we trying to accomplish here? This is a fun contest for some amateur writers to try out writing a short story. If by the end of the contest all the entrants never want to enter a gotwoot contest again because they are so discouraged and intimidated, I would call that a fail. I would rather call off the contest completely, honestly, and do a different community activity that encourages participation and interaction.

Sapphire

Thu, 06-30-2011, 12:49 PM

What are we trying to accomplish here? This is a fun contest for some amateur writers to try out writing a short story. If by the end of the contest all the entrants never want to enter a gotwoot contest again because they are so discouraged and intimidated, I would call that a fail. I would rather call off the contest completely, honestly, and do a different community activity that encourages participation and interaction.

Wat. This sounds quite extreme. For the record, the contest will not be called off because of some negative criticism.

Also, negative criticism is not banned from this contest. Not being insulting is generally preferred behavior, but we're not going to punish you for a few harsh comments here or there. This is GotWoot, after all.

People who espout negative (or positive) critisicisms should be prepared for other people to disagree with them. Having someone disagree with you or critisize you is no reason to flip out and call the whole thing off. This thread is making me think that everyone wants the world to be happy care-care-joy-joy-land, where everyone can say what they want, and no one else can have a rebuttal. Come on guys. It's GotWoot.

KitKat

Thu, 06-30-2011, 12:55 PM

Sorry, yeah, I phrased that wrong. I meant IF every participant is horribly discouraged, THEN I'd rather call it off. I don't think that is the case right now, as in general most of the feedback has been useful and I think the authors going to the semi-finals are getting ready to apply it and improve their stories.

Edit: Just for clarification, this is personal opinion, using an extreme hypothetical scenario that would probably never happen, but hyperbolized in the heat of the moment. My apologies for taking it too far. These views are not indicative of the moderation team. Additionally, I fully support this contest and I fully support Sapphi who has put so much work into making this happen. I look forward to future rounds and seeing what our authors bring to the table next.

Lucifus

Thu, 06-30-2011, 12:56 PM

We've been squabbling like children. Lets just try to have some fun writing and reviewing, as we had intended. We're adults here, lets move on and take more care in what we say(both parties).

I still think this can be a great deal of fun, as I've had a number of good laughs reading some of the work of gotwooters.

And KitKat, have you ever thought of being a negotiator? ^_^

Yukimura

Thu, 06-30-2011, 01:55 PM

@Sapphi: I think it's fine to have negative responses to negative responses to stories ad infinitum, but I think that detracts from the discussion of the stories which is what I thought the feedback was supposed to be about. When people are arguing over each others criticisms they generally drift away from talking about the stories and towards talking about each others tastes and presentations and behaviors. If we're all here to argue over each others tastes there was no need to make the authors write stories as you could have just grabbed some random stories off fanfiction.net or livejournal and had people criticize and meta criticize those. Heck once this is done why don't you have a criticism contest. Pick a story or show or movie or something and have people submit criticisms of it and then we can vote on who had the best criticism, and then we'll end up squabbling over each others criticisms of the criticisms. Rinse and repeat for infinite fun!

Sapphire

Thu, 06-30-2011, 03:56 PM

@Sapphi: I think it's fine to have negative responses to negative responses to stories ad infinitum, but I think that detracts from the discussion of the stories which is what I thought the feedback was supposed to be about. When people are arguing over each others criticisms they generally drift away from talking about the stories and towards talking about each others tastes and presentations and behaviors.

So basically what you're saying is commenting on other comments is useless. Valid point. My previous statement (http://forums.gotwoot.net/showthread.php/19982-GotWoot-Story-Contest-Preliminaries-Round-3?p=491724&viewfull=1#post491724) about commenting on comments still holds, however.

Heck once this is done why don't you have a criticism contest. Pick a story or show or movie or something and have people submit criticisms of it and then we can vote on who had the best criticism, and then we'll end up squabbling over each others criticisms of the criticisms. Rinse and repeat for infinite fun!

LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!!! This snippet was the best of the whole thread.

-

I don't have much else to say. Our conversation has gone a bit abstract. I humbly request that we go back on topic, or at least 1 degree of saturation away from on topic. We are like... 4 degrees of saturation away at the moment.