Naruto Shippuuden Episode 85

[Marik]

[DB]​_Naruto​_Shippuuden​_085​_[5962F2C8].avi (http://www.dattebayo.com/t/ns085.torrent)

No ep again, til 12/04.

[Buffalobiian]

DO NOT WATCH THE PREVIEW

Just don't, because certain "professionals" don't know what a cliffhanger is for.
And there's no funny ending neither.

-----------------------------------------
Kakuzu's voice when he teased Hidan about the beheading was just awesome. Him living a couple hundred years was interesting, and quite rightly explains his careful nature. After all, you don't live for 5 generations performing suicide moves. Or just being stupid.

As for Ino having the highest amount of chakra? Well, that looks like Kishi's way of putting her one level above complete incompetence. At least Chouji can break things.

[arondruiz]

Lol, told you guys 85 would be epic.. but damn it was even better than I expected.

[DarthEnderX]

GREATEST FUCKING EPISODE EVER!!

[Killa-Eyez]

Immensly enjoyed this one! Watched it, twice! I just love the taijitsu fights!!!
So Kakuzu killed the first, aye? Interesting...

[To Young]

how come sound tracks are
... awkward .

It sounded like wedding music.

I just went back and watched some of the Zabuza clips from old episodes. They still pump me up. Although back then half the episodes would be review and violence was significantly less than today's episode.

something is missing here. I blame it on soundtracks.

Don't get me wrong this was one of the better shipuden episodes. I enjoyed it.

[ASSpirine]

These drawings are the same as the Naruto vs Sasuke fight in the end of Naruto. Still don't that kind of animations, but this episode totally rocked.

I really feel sorry for Kakuzu for having such a dumbass for a partner :p
It's already the third time he's been caught by Shikamaru, whehe
Getting really funny

I hope Kakashi somehow gave some blood of Kakuzu or one of those mask thingies to Shikamaru and he pretends he's hit. Meaning Hidan kills something else instead. Cause the fact that Shikamaru got hit so easily by Hidan isn't right, I don't trust it

I want more!!!

Finally, Naruto is back to the great series it once was.

[DarthEnderX]

Okay, now I've calmed down.

So Kuzaku seems to be water type, so obviously the one that died was the Earth type.


So, I think I know what Shikamaru's plan is. Kakashi passed off that injector to him, so I think Shikamaru poisoned his own blood so that when Hidan licks his blood, he becomes poisoned.

[arondruiz]

Okay, now I've calmed down.

So Kuzaku seems to be water type, so obviously the one that died was the Earth type.


So, I think I know what Shikamaru's plan is. Kakashi passed off that injector to him, so I think Shikamaru poisoned his own blood so that when Hidan licks his blood, he becomes poisoned.


The mask that was killed was Water, so the heart in his main body is probably Earth

I think there's a good explanation for this, this is how I see it: Kakuzu's original elements were Earth and Water(he's from the Waterfall village after all, and remember most Jounins can use 2 elements). So he replaced his main bodies heart with someone who had the same affinities as himself(Primary: Earth, Secondary: Water). Makes sense to me

[Harima Kenji]

haha, first post scared the shit out of me.. when I saw 12/4 I thought the 12th of April :D
Forgot you guys put it backwards.. (yes, we do it right)

downing the ep.. I'll skip the preview.. as suggested. I just happened to see it in the post that I should skip it.

For the other posters: plz put down a warning when you comment the preview.

[Abdula]

I think Shikamaru poisoned his own blood so that when Hidan licks his blood, he becomes poisoned.
Lol, poison. Poison? Darth I don't even know what to say to that. I'll say this much, your lack of imagination is stunning.

So Kakuzu killed the first, aye? Interesting...
Uh no. He fought the 1st, if he had killed him I doubt he would have hesitated to say it, he was trying to intimidate them after all. I say he was soundly defeated and ran away with his tail between his legs.:D

[Marik]

The mask that was killed was Water, so the heart in his main body is probably Earth

I think there's a good explanation for this, this is how I see it: Kakuzu's original elements were Earth and Water(he's from the Waterfall village after all, and remember most Jounins can use 2 elements). So he replaced his main bodies heart with someone who had the same affinities as himself(Primary: Earth, Secondary: Water). Makes sense to me
It was the opposite. The mask that was taken out by Raikiri was Earth, his own heart is Water. The 4 masks were Wind, Lightning, Fire, and Earth.

[Rikudo]

Lol, poison. Poison? Darth I don't even know what to say to that. I'll say this much, your lack of imagination is stunning.


Wow, you're proving your arrogance again "Adbula." You wouldn't be saying that if you haven't been reading the manga. I read the manga and I though Darth's point was valid. Troll much?!

[Abdula]

Arrogance huh. You know you really shouldn't troll because you're not good at it.

You wouldn't be saying that if you haven't been reading the manga. I read the manga and I though Darth's point was valid. You know you contradicted yourself here right.

And I didn't say anything about whether his plan was valid or not, I just thought it was really funny that he would think of poison. Like I said I just think he lacks imagination.


Kakashi passed off that injector to him, so I think Shikamaru poisoned his own blood so that when Hidan licks his blood, he becomes poisoned.
You gotta admit, thats just funny.

Anyway get back under your bridge, troll.

[DarthEnderX]

Lol, poison. Poison? Darth I don't even know what to say to that. Then don't. I didn't ask.

[DDBen]

It was the opposite. The mask that was taken out by Raikiri was Earth, his own heart is Water. The 4 masks were Wind, Lightning, Fire, and Earth.

I disagree completely. Note that he uses the body hardening technique when he's going after chouji which Kakashi mentioned was extremely high level previously. The only water technique he's used is a Water clone which is fairly low level. He has used zero high level water techniques during the fight.

Also we know the red mask is fire for sure. The yellow one is wind for some reason. the dark blue one is lightning. The destroyed mask was light blue which I would reason is water. His natural element is Earth.

Hmm wonder why lightning isn't yellow with wind as dark blue

[DarthEnderX]

He also created a water wall to intercept shikamaru's exploding tag.

[Abdula]

Then don't. I didn't ask.
Do I sense a little hostility?

Anyway what makes you think poison would be a viable option against Hidan. They know next to nothing about Hidan, and have absolutely no idea how his immortality works so what makes you think poison would work? Secondly if they were just going to poison him there are certainly much better ways to do it than waiting for him to lick someone's blood, know what I'm saying.

And you don't think the way you phrased that was funny. You said that you think Shikamaru poisoned his own blood so that when Hidan ingests it he'll get poisoned.

No one thinks that is funny?:(

[Yukimura]

Wow, the freaking previews ruin almost every surprise for non-manga readers and every 'will that make it in' for readers. It's like they don't want there to be any suspense in the show at all (or they just assume everyone who watches has read the manga and already knows what happens and the preview is meant to heighten the suspense of OMG they're animating that scene next).

Anyway this episode was pretty damn sweet, it almost felt like a mini movie or something. My favorite scene was when Chouji got knocked back by Kazuku that first time. As soon as I thought "I wonder why Kazuku isn't pressing his massive advantage and following up on Chouji" he instantly appeared in front of him and proceeded to deliver even more smack, awesome.

Still I think he spent a little too much time standing around on the whole. He should have been able to easily kill the three chuunin while Kakashi was busy with Hidan and the monsters. Plus, if he's strong enough to hold two people off the ground I think he should be able to just break their necks instead of having to choke them to death. Stupid plot armor holding him back.

@Poison: Hidan can't die, that doesn't mean he can't be affected by debilitating or paralytic agents. Giving him a massive dose of ipecac for example wouldn't kill him but if he was too busy puking his guts out to defend himself it would be that much easier to cut his head off. Someone as good as him is probably not going to get be easy to hit with a weapon, poisoned or otherwise, however he does have a penchant for drinking blood after wounding his enemies which would make faking a wound a fine opportunity to deliver a toxin capable of incapacitating him into his body. A bait and switch poisoning is an unnecessarily complex way to deal with Hidan's abilities but that doesn't make it completely unviable.

[DDBen]

He also created a water wall to intercept shikamaru's exploding tag.

Indeed but both of those were done in a pool of water Shikamaru summoned he hasn't actually created any water or done any high level jutsu's with it.

[RyougaZell]

The animation rocked... enough said.

[Buffalobiian]

Indeed but both of those were done in a pool of water Shikamaru summoned he hasn't actually created any water or done any high level jutsu's with it.

This revives our issue of element mastering vs time. We said Jounin generally can't learn more than 2 or 3 elements because either A) they physically can't, or B) they don't have enough time to master it.

For a guy who's been around since the First, time isn't an issue, so we're back to square one guys :p

@poison issue: It's definitely viable (the incapacitating, not killing), but what doesn't make sense is why it's not affecting Shikamaru. One way it can work is for the poison to be slow acting, get Hidan contaminated, then inject the antidote. Those who watched the preview know how paralysing Hidan would work, though it may not happen that way necessarily. Those who didn't, keep it that way :)

[Kagari]

wow, epic.

Loved it. Edge of my seat.

I wonder what Kakashi gave Shikamaru? There's no way he's dead from Hidan's move, but what a friggen cliffhanger...I'll never watch previews, and I'm sure anyone who did is spoiled. I don't care.

God damn. Gotta wait another week? God damn.

[Rikudo]

Arrogance huh. You know you really shouldn't troll because you're not good at it.
You know you contradicted yourself here right.

And I didn't say anything about whether his plan was valid or not, I just thought it was really funny that he would think of poison. Like I said I just think he lacks imagination.


You gotta admit, thats just funny.

Anyway get back under your bridge, troll.


Contradicted myself?! Ha, you really are a bag of hurt. And look at my post count compare to yours? Which one of us spend more time here trolling, or should I call you taxi-trollboy from now on.

Poison may not kill Hidan but as Yuki pointed "IT" might be able to disable him long enough to decapitate him. Where's your imagination?

And no thanks, I think your space under the bridge is just enough for yourself.

[Spaceaprion]

I just hope Choji and Ino redeem themselves somewhat in the next episode. Hell for all they did this episode, it might as well have been Konohamaru and his gang out there backing up Kakashi and Shikamaru. That said, this is probably my favorite episode in Shippuuden.

[Pandadice]

well, I must say that it didn't leave as nearly as big of an impact on me as 82 did, but it wasn't bad either. it was pretty good.

I mean, the fights were really cool, when they were happening, but it seemed like it'd start then stop, start then stop quite a bit. so it'd like build it up, and then have it settle down, and then build it up again.. well, that's just how it felt to me I guess.

the ending was really cool. I can't wait for the next episode ^^!

I don't get why the masked akatsuki didn't like instantly kill chouji and ino.. that would of been so cool if they just killed them both off like that.

[Dark Dragon]

I don't get why the masked akatsuki didn't like instantly kill chouji and ino.. that would of been so cool if they just killed them both off like that.

Unfortunately this isn't HxH so even completely useless side characters whose redeeming qualities can be counted on one hand still has main character death shields.

This episode is simply awesome, i'm convinced that Kishi can still create excellent fights if he wish. It just seems that Kishi decided that none of those good fights will ever involve Naruto.

edit: I'll also hand it to Kishi that he at least is willing to kill off some useless characters, even if he does spend a long time over dramatizing them before hand.

[DarthEnderX]

Other's have already explained what I was thinking. That Shikamaru gives himself a debilitating poison, when it starts affecting both him and Hidan, he hits himself with the antidote, then does stuff to a still crippled Hidan.
I hope Kakashi somehow gave some blood of Kakuzu or one of those mask thingies to Shikamaru and he pretends he's hit. Meaning Hidan kills something else instead.That would be pretty badass except...does Kakuzu even have blood? He just seems to be full of sgwiggly black things. And the mask thingies I'm almost certain don't have blood.

[StingRay]

Great Episode. Definitely one of the best ever made.

Yeah i think its painfully obvious that Kakuzu's blood was put in that empty capsule Kakashi got from Shikamaru in a previous episode. Taking back the capsule before the split up was a dead give away.

oh yeah and LOL at chouji and his stupid fat ass. Dude almost got killed for being an asshole and not sticking to the plan.

But yeah loved the entire episode!

[DarthEnderX]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that water scroll too. I guess scrolls really can be used to use techniques you don't actually know(since I'm assuming Shika doesn't have Dark and Water elements).

[November 11]

Hi guys, I sign up just to say that this episode rocks!

It has all the good stuff that I'm looking for in an action anime:

1. Intelligent fights - ie. Hidan evading Shika's dart at the last sec by using his scythe & Kakuzu creating a quick water wall to block the explosive tag

2. Use of environment/items - ie. Shika using explosives, shadow shurikens & especially the water scroll+lightning combo!

I'm definitely not missing the Naruto clones & rasengan nor Bleach's Ichigo hack & slash.

[ASSpirine]

I've learned never to watch previews again :)
Luckily just in time when the people of this forum warned us. It's just the smart choice, after the nexr episode I might look at the previews.

OK, how muh does Ino still suck... Kinda like Sakura in the past. When Kakuzu got Chouki, she just threw some fricking Kunais...

[DarthEnderX]

I've learned never to watch previews again :)
Luckily just in time when the people of this forum warned us. It's just the smart choice, after the next episode I might look at the previews.Now you know that thing that I've been saying for 3 years!

[Buffalobiian]

I hope Kakashi somehow gave some blood of Kakuzu or one of those mask thingies to Shikamaru and he pretends he's hit. Meaning Hidan kills something else instead

The more I read this, the more I think it'll happen, for two reasons:

a) Right at the beginning of the battle, Shikamaru said "this time I'll get my priorities right". Priority was to kill Kakuzu first. Though it looks like they're falling apart from Kakuzu's awesomeness, the mention of that role hints they've still got a plan in mind. As far as tactics go, you have an ultimate goal, and depending on the situation, you adapt your means to achieve it.

b) Second point has to do with the preview {Preview Spoiler}The preview shows Hidan no longer in his Black&White ritual mode. From what we know, he only turns back to normal after the designated person is dead, or suffers a mortal injury. Since he's already black&white, we know he ingested blood. Therefore, someone died. And if you watched the preview, you know it's not Shikamaru.[END SPOILER]

[ASSpirine]

The more I read this, the more I think it'll happen, for two reasons:

a) Right at the beginning of the battle, Shikamaru said "this time I'll get my priorities right". Priority was to kill Kakuzu first. Though it looks like they're falling apart from Kakuzu's awesomeness, the mention of that role hints they've still got a plan in mind. As far as tactics go, you have an ultimate goal, and depending on the situation, you adapt your means to achieve it.

b) Second point has to do with the preview {Preview Spoiler}The preview shows Hidan no longer in his Black&White ritual mode. From what we know, he only turns back to normal after the designated person is dead, or suffers a mortal injury. Since he's already black&white, we know he ingested blood. Therefore, someone died. And if you watched the preview, you know it's not Shikamaru.[END SPOILER]

I'll see if my guess was right
I haven't even thought about a poison actually. A poison is not only intended to kill someone, I think it can also serve as a paralysis. Even if Hidan is immortal, paralysis would probably work ;)

[Nintendo]

Great Episode indeed but i wish they don't put preview of the next episode in Naruto like they are doing now in Bleach so they don't remove the suspense element and ruin the cliffhangers.
I'm so happy that both Naruto and Bleach are at their peak of greatness now and i'm sure there is still more.

[Assertn]

Well, I don't think the previews were as bad as I thought they were, judging by the reactions...but yeah...i'm pretty sure it would've been impossible to show any footage of this next episode without it spoiling a lot anyway.

I don't know about you guys...but I think this episode just proves even moreso that Kakuzu's main is still an earth-affinity. His body hardening jutsu is a high level earth one (definitely higher than mizu bunshins), and we saw him use it when he was about to pierce chouji.

[Abdula]

Yeah Assertn. there was a huge inconsistency there too. I agree with you that Kakuzu's main seems to be earth based on how often we've seen him use that body hardening jutsu.

Anyway the anime guys messed up a bit when they threw in that little water scene with Shikamaru. Kakuzu has four masks supposedly wind, fire, lightning and water and he himself has a natural affinity, which I think is earth. Anyway regardless of what his natural affinity is, he has one and he has the four masks so that he can use the other four elements but here after Kakashi kills one of his masks, we still see him using all five elements. They really dropped the ball there.


That would be pretty badass except...does Kakuzu even have blood? He just seems to be full of sgwiggly black things. And the mask thingies I'm almost certain don't have blood.

Yeah he does have blood, you see a bit when Kakashi pulls the raikiri out of his chest. They really limit the amount of blood you see in the anime though. Hidan is a good example, the guy got decapitated but we hardly saw any blood.

Thats one of the reasons I doubt poison would work on Hidan too, the guy doesn't even seem to need blood and they have no idea how his body works so I don't think poison would work and I doubt they would risk using poison if they didn't know for sure that it would work. What if he drinks it and nothing happens, then what. Besides poisoning an Akatsuki, very anticlimactic don't you think. Anyway whatever.

@Rikudo: When you start posting in the other sections of the forum then we can talk. Until then, leave me the hell alone and stop trolling the Naruto forum.

[Jessper]

I'll throw my hat in on "poison doesn't make sense" if he had a poison why not take 2 seconds and give it directly to Hidan while he was bound? Simple solution that doesn't put Shikamaru at risk.

I'm not sure why showing Kakuzu use low level water techniques is a screw-up, it makes more sense that someone that old should know lots of techniques regardless of their type.

Either whatever was given to Shikamaru was Kakuzu's blood and he somehow switched it (doesn't seem likely given that the cut was on his cheek, if it had been something covered in clothes it would make sense) or he is about to wipe away some of the blood symbol of Hidan's with a shadow or something. I doubt he gets hit for real.

[Abdula]

I'm not sure why showing Kakuzu use low level water techniques is a screw-up, it makes more sense that someone that old should know lots of techniques regardless of their type.

I don't think you got my point. Five hearts, five elements. Every one of his hearts represents an element and with every heart they take out he is supposed to lose the use of that particular element. Kakashi already took out one heart but we still see Kakuzu using all 5 elements. Low level or not it just doesn't make sense.

Its silly that losing a heart only means that he wouldn't be able to use high level techniques, but they change the rules all the time.

[Assertn]

I don't think you got my point. Five hearts, five elements. Every one of his hearts represents an element and with every heart they take out he is supposed to lose the use of that particular element. Kakashi already took out one heart but we still see Kakuzu using all 5 elements. Low level or not it just doesn't make sense.
So by this logic Kakashi has two..maybe three hearts then?

[Harima Kenji]

Hidan is definately killing something useless..
Don't forget that Shikamaru said that he would fulfill that role aswell.. I'm sure he means playing the bait for the blood drinking. They prepared for this, so I guess they gave him the blood of a dead animal or something, making Hidan's technique worthless.

I didn't watch the preview, since I like cliffhangers. Even though I know Hidan's going to be fucked.

[ASSpirine]

Hidan is always getting fucked by Shikamaru
Brains over brawns man ;)

And I don't see a screw up with the elements, it's not that weird that Kakuzu could use a mizu bunshin, not that high a level I think. And that water wall really is a piece of cake.

Shikamaru keeps on amazing me, was a really smart move to eletrocute Kakuzu

[Assertn]

I believe that role is either the role of a knight chess piece, or the role of Asuma's avenger. I wouldn't look too much into it.

[DarthEnderX]

Ooh, something else I interesting I noticed this episode.

So Shikamaru can't bind Hidan any longer and loses the technique. We used to think this meant he ran out of chakra.

But then, a couple minutes later, he binds Hidan all over again, only to lose it again 5 minutes later.

So apparently, Shikamaru doesn't have crappy chakra. He just can't maintain the shadowbind for more than 5 min.

[November 11]

Or chakra can regenerate overtime, so Shikamaru needs a short rest in between binds?

I wonder if Hidan has only two abilities, immortality and the blood curse, though these are already quite potent.

[lilphatboi88]

Watching it right now...

Just wanna say that after the intro scene, Kakashi is being smart by not being aggressive and waiting for backup to come.


Edit: And who's stronger between Kakashi and Asuma. I'm thinking Asuma because of his 35 million ryou bounty, which is 5 mill above the fire monk.

Second Edit: I'm going to be pissed if whoever first posted the thing about that capsule being Kakuzu's blood. Or whether it's poison whatever. If you've guessed that right, then you're a manga reader that doesn't belong in here.

And thanks Buffalobian for warning us about spoilers, unlike some idiots.

[Buffalobiian]

Or chakra can regenerate overtime, so Shikamaru needs a short rest in between binds?

Chakra does indeed regenerate over time. As your chakra reserve depletes, stamina is converted into chakra.

@lilphatboi: no problem


Second Edit: I'm going to be pissed if whoever first posted the thing about that capsule being Kakuzu's blood. Or whether it's poison whatever. If you've guessed that right, then you're a manga reader that doesn't belong in here.

I wouldn't jump to conclusions just yet. It's a legit theory, and perfectly derivable from the anime alone.

[Spaceaprion]

I don't get why the masked akatsuki didn't like instantly kill chouji and ino.. that would of been so cool if they just killed them both off like that.


Maybe he can't use their hearts if they die before he extracts them?

[lilphatboi88]

I wouldn't jump to conclusions just yet. It's a legit theory, and perfectly derivable from the anime alone.

I mean, how can you guess that capsule could and did contain blood after kakashi raikiried him.

[Buffalobiian]

I mean, how can you guess that capsule could and did contain blood after kakashi raikiried him.

You'd be amazed at some of the theories our GWooters come up with :p

I wouldn't think many (if at all) of us thought it out that thoroughly right after watching. But it's not that hard to come up with it after a bit of thinking and bouncing ideas off each other.

For one, that was Shikamaru's intentions at first. He controlled Hidan, and wanted him to take down Kakuzu. That puts the idea of Hida killing Kakuzu in our heads.

Then, we see a capsule, and Hidan takes in some blood shortly afterwards. How could Shikamaru have turned that around, if we assume the capsule played a role? Fire away.

I see pros and cons with both the poison and the Kakuzu blood ideas, but they're both quite good. I'm left thinking if "Kakuzu's blood" is the more imaginative answer Abdula was looking for ;)

[Assertn]

Second Edit: I'm going to be pissed if whoever first posted the thing about that capsule being Kakuzu's blood. Or whether it's poison whatever. If you've guessed that right, then you're a manga reader that doesn't belong in here.
None of the predictions made in this thread are from manga readers.

[Abdula]

He just can't maintain the shadowbind for more than 5 min.
I think this was already stated before in fact twice. In the Chuunin exams and then again in the Sasuke retrieval arc. We just haven't seen Shikamaru in action since then so we forgot:D

And who's stronger between Kakashi and Asuma. I'm thinking Asuma because of his 35 million ryou bounty, which is 5 mill above the fire monk.
It was already stated in like the third episode of the series that Kakashi is the strongest ninja in the village. Besides based on their performances it should be easy enough to tell which one is stronger


If you've guessed that right, then you're a manga reader that doesn't belong in here.
Well Assertn already answered you. Speaking of theories anyone seen Kray lately. He came up with the theory of Kakuzu using other people's body parts after only seeing his stitches in a pic.

[lilphatboi88]

Well Assertn already answered you. Speaking of theories anyone seen Kray lately. He came up with the theory of Kakuzu using other people's body parts after only seeing his stitches in a pic.


I don't know if you know this but...I can read. And I can see that he has answered me after I posted.

[Goran]

Second Edit: I'm going to be pissed if whoever first posted the thing about that capsule being Kakuzu's blood. Or whether it's poison whatever. If you've guessed that right, then you're a manga reader that doesn't belong in here.


And I'm hoping I'm wrong in thinking it was Kakuzu's blood in some kind of mask being worn because then I know if you are a manga reader who doesn't belong in here.

*hugs tin foil hat*

[Abdula]

I don't know if you know this but...I can read. And I can see that he has answered me after I posted.
:rolleyes: It was an edit. I had already typed a response to your post before I read Assertn's.:o

[Assertn]

Abdula has a response pre-written to every question before they're even asked

[Buffalobiian]

Abdula has a response pre-written to every question before they're even asked

lol, after reading that I had a funny vision of Abdula in Shikamaru/Lelouch mode:



(Abdula lin the darkness of his room)
"Episode 85 is out. All conditions cleared. Now what will you do GotWoot?"

"Hahahaha, out of all the possibilities, you chose the least imaginative one."

"Very well. Pattern Delta."
Abdula copies and pastes reply from 108 prewriten arguments, starting with Q-1.doc.



Really, it explains all those long posts written in 3mins flat. :p

/random

[lilphatboi88]

Seriously Abdula? I'm pretty sure I made the second edit when no one replied after me. Because, I would if someone had responded after my post, I would have made another post instead of editing it.

[ASSpirine]

Watching it right now...

Just wanna say that after the intro scene, Kakashi is being smart by not being aggressive and waiting for backup to come.


Edit: And who's stronger between Kakashi and Asuma. I'm thinking Asuma because of his 35 million ryou bounty, which is 5 mill above the fire monk.

Second Edit: I'm going to be pissed if whoever first posted the thing about that capsule being Kakuzu's blood. Or whether it's poison whatever. If you've guessed that right, then you're a manga reader that doesn't belong in here.

And thanks Buffalobian for warning us about spoilers, unlike some idiots.

First, no way Asuma was stronger than Kakashi. A bounty doesn't mean anything. Do you know why Asuma got a bounty? That was because he was one of the surviving members of the guardians. It had nothing to do with strength

And secondly:
You are saying I've read the manga?
No way, I only read the manga after it appeared in the anime.
I came to the conclusion of that blood capsule because Shikamaru was hit too easily, come on. Hidan was just rushing towards him... And also because Kakashi secretly handed him something. Put one and one together...

[DarthEnderX]

I especially like how he said "If either blood, or poison is right, you guys are manga readers!" Which means that either solution is too brilliant to brilliant and unexpected for him to have thought of on his own, but one of them isn't even right!

Now I'm on the edge of my seat waiting to find out if I'm a manga prophet or not!

(even though I doubt its poison now since, as people mentioned, if poison worked, why wouldn't you just stab him with it.)



(unless Shikamaru has figured out how Hidan's immortality works and has developed a counter agent and it has to be ingested....)

[Buffalobiian]

I'm going to guess that for every life that he takes, he gets +1 to his, as long as it's physically possible to get himself together. Much the same as Kakuzu. Also, someone mentioned Kakuzu's elemental affinity being water or something because he came from a particular villiage. The heart he's got now isn't his own, so that line of thinking isn't exactly valid. You can argue, however, that since he's proficient at performing said elemental techniques that he'd prefer a heart with the same affinity.

[Abdula]

Thats why its so hard to say what Kakuzu's natural affinity is, because none of the hearts he has now are his and it seems he can switch the positions of his hearts at will.

Oh and I'm glad I could provide you guys with some humor, and Bill that does sound like me, except it all goes on in my head:p

[Azonalanthious]

Second Edit: I'm going to be pissed if whoever first posted the thing about that capsule being Kakuzu's blood. Or whether it's poison whatever. If you've guessed that right, then you're a manga reader that doesn't belong in here.

Well, I've never read the manga and I assumed the capsule was for blood to trick Hidan the second I saw it way back before the fight began when they were discussing strategy. I initally assumed that they were going to put his own blood in it (who knows, might work and actually kill him) but as far as I could see he hasn't been injured yet this fight and Kakuzu has, so I'm 100% behind the Kakuzu's blood theory.

[Carnage]

I haven't felt this excited about the Naruto anime since part 1. I recall them using similar animation for the Sakura vs. Sasori fight. But I never really enjoyed that fight. But this one was spectacular. I wonder if its the same animator who did the Rock Lee fights.

[Rikudo]

Abdula has a response pre-written to every question before they're even asked

It because he doesn't have a life and trolls in gotwoot forums 24/7.

Here's his quote,


@Rikudo: When you start posting in the other sections of the forum then we can talk. Until then, leave me the hell alone and stop trolling the Naruto forum.

A complete emo living in his parents basement.

[darkshadow]

I actually watched this ep randomly out of boredom ( streamed it), and I was suprised at how good it actually was, prolly cause its one of the few eps that is totally absent of naruto's appearance. >_>

Also yeah, the preview totally kills the suspense for non manga readers, fucking stupid.

[ASSpirine]

Yeah, that's why people are warning about the previews. It's the sensible choice to not watch it anymore.

[lilphatboi88]

Well, I've never read the manga and I assumed the capsule was for blood to trick Hidan the second I saw it way back before the fight began when they were discussing strategy. I initally assumed that they were going to put his own blood in it (who knows, might work and actually kill him) but as far as I could see he hasn't been injured yet this fight and Kakuzu has, so I'm 100% behind the Kakuzu's blood theory.


Nice, you're basically quoting what everybody has said. Good job!

[Dark Dragon]

It because he doesn't have a life and trolls in gotwoot forums 24/7.

Here's his quote,



A complete emo living in his parents basement.

How are you any different since you've just wasted an entire post flaming him?

anyways time to get back on topic.


Much the same as Kakuzu. Also, someone mentioned Kakuzu's elemental affinity being water or something because he came from a particular villiage

Does anyone happen to know which village Kakuzu is from? I don't recognize that symbol at all.

[Marik]

He's from Takigakure. The Village Hidden among Waterfalls.

[arondruiz]

I haven't felt this excited about the Naruto anime since part 1. I recall them using similar animation for the Sakura vs. Sasori fight. But I never really enjoyed that ight. But this one was spectacular. I wonder if its the same animator who did the Rock Lee fights.

You're right, there were different animators/artists from pretty much every legendary fight in the series all packed into this episode

1. Hirofumi Suzuki - Animation Director, Art Director, also worked on
Part 1: Episodes 17, 19, 48, 151
Part 2: Episode 82, 85
Movies 1 and 3
Every opening except for Re:member and Closer

2. Norio Matsumoto - Key animator, also worked on
Part 1: Episodes 30, 48, 71, 133
Movies 2 and 3
Actually someone made a video of most of his stuff from Naruto
http://liquidskin08.multiply.com/video/item/21/21
His style in 85 is very clearly the Kakuzu vs Kakashi taijutsu fight

3. Hiroyuki Yamashita - Key animator, also worked on
Part 2: He's actually been in tons of episodes, over 10. But he does very small parts. Most notable is his work on 26, and the tree jumping scene in 45. Also, he did that amazing Asuma flashback in the filler arc, can't remember wehre it was.

4. Seiko Asai - Key animator, also worked on
Part 2: 35, 42, 55

[Azonalanthious]

Nice, you're basically quoting what everybody has said. Good job!

Why yes, yes I did. Its called 'agreeing with people.'

[lilphatboi88]

Why yes, yes I did. Its called 'agreeing with people.'

Why yes, yes it is. That is what it's called.


EDIT: Hey, back to who's stronger between Kakashi and Asuma. I do believe that Kakashi could be stronger than Asuma, then in that case, I would expect Kakashi to have a pretty hefty bounty on his head considering his reputation and sharingan and everything. What do you guys think?

[DarthEnderX]

I "think" that Kakashi and Asuma aren't even in the same league.

[lilphatboi88]

Well, they are both jounins...but I guess sometimes that doesn't say much.

[Rikudo]

I think Kakashi is way above Asuma's level. He's also a one time ANBU member so he probably encountered a lot of stronger ninja from other village. I would say his bounty is around Kabuto's level.

[lilphatboi88]

Why Kabuto? I think I kinda remember he has a bounty, but not really.

Besides, the ninja world hasn't really heard of Kabuto have they?

[ASSpirine]

I've already said what I think about the bounty. It's not because Kakashi is stronger that he'll have a bounty on his head. Asuma had a bounty because he was one of the twelve guardians. That's the only explanation, I really can't believe that someone has a bounty over his/her head because they are strong.

Although I can understand that it might be possible because of the sharingan.

[Kraco]

Why not? If Kakashi has a reputation out there, has captured lots of big name villains, has hampered plots against the people in the Fire country, it would make sense he could earn a bounty just to get rid of him. If you are special, you can't be easily replaced and thus it's worth it to get rid of you individually. In the real world a war rarely misses one man but in the Naruto world losing Kakashi would be a significant blow to Konoha.

Just because you were a member of some old dusty group not anymore even existent shouldn't give you much of a bounty. However, if that group was something special and did something special that still matters, it's another story. Having a bounty also assumes there's somebody interested in paying the money, and that usually requires somebody benefits from the death.

[ASSpirine]

I'm not saying Kakashi doesn't have a bounty over his head. But the reasoning that because Kakashi is stronger than Asuma (who has a bounty) he'll have a bounty on his head doesn't do it for me.

That Kakashi is wanted wouldn't be so weird, especially because of the rarity the sharingan is. But who do you send after him?

[darkshadow]

like the databooks have stated numerous times, kakashi is the strongest jounin in the village, there is simply no way to question if he is even remotely stronger then asuma.

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

Asuma only has a bounty because of the fact that he was in that group of guardians. And really to say that Asuma isnt lower than Kakashi is an understatement. The Sharingan trumps most non-bloodline limit anyday.

[Assertn]

Oh i'm positive Kakashi has a bounty. At the very least, we already know he's on the mist village's bingo book.

[Abdula]

If Kakashi had a bounty on his head Kakuzu would have undoubtedly let us know. The thing that seems to be lost here is the significance of the 12 ninja guardians. Although the villages play a major role in this series in the big picture, the villages are really a very small part of the Naruto world, and the ninja guardians protected the Feudal Lord who is the leader of the entire country. The villages are only a small part of that country, and don't allow yourself to think that the Feudal Lord isn't important just because of some crappy filler episodes.

@Assertn: being in a bingo book is a little different from having some nefarious organization put a bounty on your head.

[ASSpirine]

I thought the bingo book had something to do with rogue ninjas... Ninjas from your own village that took of carrying the town secrets (bloodlines or others)

[Assertn]

@Assertn: being in a bingo book is a little different from having some nefarious organization put a bounty on your head.
What nefarious organization? Bounties are placed on individuals that are considered dangerous to other countries. If a country wants someone dead, then that person's head becomes valuable.

It's not like there's just some random group out there collecting corpses for their own interest.

[Kraco]

It's not like there's just some random group out there collecting corpses for their own interest.

This is Naruto so who knows? Based on the Third-Oro fight all you need is a corpse of a great man and the soul of a nobody, and you can summon an undead warrior possessing all the unique skills the dead man once had yet obeying your every command like a slave. That's the most advanced and powerful necromancy of pretty much any story, so corpses themselves would be of immense value and easily worth even a sizable sum of money.

[DarthEnderX]

Why not? If Kakashi has a reputation out there, has captured lots of big name villains, has hampered plots against the people in the Fire country, it would make sense he could earn a bounty just to get rid of him. If you are special, you can't be easily replaced and thus it's worth it to get rid of you individually. In the real world a war rarely misses one man but in the Naruto world losing Kakashi would be a significant blow to Konoha.

Just because you were a member of some old dusty group not anymore even existent shouldn't give you much of a bounty. However, if that group was something special and did something special that still matters, it's another story. Having a bounty also assumes there's somebody interested in paying the money, and that usually requires somebody benefits from the death.Abdula has the right of it here I'm certain. There's a difference between having a bounty on your head, and being in a ninja villages bingo book. Ninja villages don't pay their shinobi to kill their villages enemies. It's their duty to do so.

In order to have a bounty on your head, some member of the private sector must want you dead. And its likely some criminal organization(like the one Gato belonged to), facilitates those transactions.

I think the most likely situation is that the 12 Guardians did things in the service of the Lord of the Fire County that drew the ire of some other feudal lord. Hence their bounties.

If most of Kakashi's time is spent fighting shinobi from other villages, he's probably in the bingo books of all those villages, but those villages don't offer a money reward for his head. They expect their own shinobi to take him out if they get the opportunity.

[lilphatboi88]

like the databooks have stated numerous times, kakashi is the strongest jounin in the village, there is simply no way to question if he is even remotely stronger then asuma.

I would consider those databooks out there to be Spoilers because they haven't come out to state that, have they? And most of the time, these databooks get data from the manga.

[animus]

I'm pretty sure Kakashi has a bounty on his head. Just nobody has really cared enough to go after him just for money. And the only people stronger than Kakashi are probably only Kage and Akatsuki-caliber shinobis, that's not to overestimate Kakashi, but from what we've seen, it seems to be the case.. Yeah, that's kinda a lose-lose.

[lilphatboi88]

u think orochimaru will go after him once he realizes he won't be able to use sasuke's body?

[Abdula]

Why won't he be able to use Sasuke's body?

And no. He doesn't just want the sharingan, he wants an Uchiha.

[Jeff_from_MD]

like the databooks have stated numerous times, kakashi is the strongest jounin in the village, there is simply no way to question if he is even remotely stronger then asuma.

Hmm that piece of information that hasn't yet been revealed in the anime. Is it THAT hard for forum posters to just derive their opinions on what they've watched, and shut their trap about everything else they've read about Naruto?

Also, what's with the excessive cursing in the DB translation. Hidan calls Choji a "fat f***" when he merely said "fatty." If only I knew more japanese so I wouldn't take DB's lame potty mouth interpretation at face value.

[tystic]

Because in DB's translator's opinion, that's how Hidan would talk if he were English-speaking based on his attitude.

I personally think it's not necessary, I like the TW/AonE translation styles better, but since it really does fit his character, I can live with it.

[Abdula]

I would consider those databooks out there to be Spoilers because they haven't come out to state that, have they? And most of the time, these databooks get data from the manga.

Hmm that piece of information that hasn't yet been revealed in the anime. Is it THAT hard for forum posters to just derive their opinions on what they've watched, and shut their trap about everything else they've read about Naruto?
Wow. Just Wow. Its been said more than once by multiple people, get with the program. Oh and a little advice. Don't mess with DS, its just a bad idea.


Also, what's with the excessive cursing in the DB translation. Hidan calls Choji a "fat f***" when he merely said "fatty." If only I knew more japanese so I wouldn't take DB's lame potty mouth interpretation at face value.
Its not excessive, its not excessive at all. They are actually painting a pretty accurate picture of Hidan because he curses a whole lot more in the manga. DB is actually doing a good job of toning it down.

[lilphatboi88]

Why won't he be able to use Sasuke's body?

And no. He doesn't just want the sharingan, he wants an Uchiha.

I don't think he'll be able to use Sasuke's body because I feel like the whole point of the Naruto anime right now is to stop Oro from getting Sasuke. And this being a shounen and all, I feel like I can predict it's not going to happen. And if this has already happened in the manga, there will be a plot twist in which Sasuke will be back to normal.

Unless, Kishi or whatever his name is, decides to go back to his old ways and stop caring about American fans, then Oro will take Sasuke's body for good.

[animus]

I don't think he'll be able to use Sasuke's body because I feel like the whole point of the Naruto anime right now is to stop Oro from getting Sasuke. And this being a shounen and all, I feel like I can predict it's not going to happen. And if this has already happened in the manga, there will be a plot twist in which Sasuke will be back to normal.

Unless, Kishi or whatever his name is, decides to go back to his old ways and stop caring about American fans, then Oro will take Sasuke's body for good.

You honestly think he cares what you think?

[lilphatboi88]

Who and what are you talking about?

I just gave my opinion on why I don't think Oro will take over Sasuke's body.

[animus]

I think it's painfully obvious what I'm referring to, which is the assumption you make that he's ever remotely had an American demographic in mind when he made his manga. Besides, that statement sounds like all kinds of angry fanboy.

[lilphatboi88]

All right, I don't expect him to care what I think. Secondly, my mistake. I meant the people who produce the anime, the ones that make the fillers.

[DarthEnderX]

I don't think he's gonna be able to take Sasuke either. But that's mainly because I think he's doing too good a job teaching him, and when the time comes, Sasuke is gonna be too strong to force, and I'm sure when it comes down to it, Sasuke's not gonna want to.

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

I don't think he's gonna be able to take Sasuke either. But that's mainly because I think he's doing too good a job teaching him, and when the time comes, Sasuke is gonna be too strong to force, and I'm sure when it comes down to it, Sasuke's not gonna want to.

Before Sasuke left he told Naruto that he didnt care if Oro took over his body, he only cared that he was apart of killing Itachi. Why would that have changed? And from what we have seen, do you think that he could really take Itachi?

[Archangel]

Before Sasuke left he told Naruto that he didnt care if Oro took over his body, he only cared that he was apart of killing Itachi. Why would that have changed? And from what we have seen, do you think that he could really take Itachi?

Well sasuke does have 2 dreams:

- The ressurection of his clan

- Killing Itachi

By going along with Oro he can only complete one of the 2 ( maybe ), and besides i'm sure he would very much rather enforce his revenge personally

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

Well sasuke does have 2 dreams:

- The ressurection of his clan

- Killing Itachi

By going along with Oro he can only complete one of the 2 ( maybe ), and besides i'm sure he would very much rather enforce his revenge personally

He really hasnt mentioned ressurection of his clan in a long time, and if he really wants to do that he is going to need to make a bunch of babies, and even then, they will only be half Uchiha.

[lilphatboi88]

Sure, killing Itachi is all he cares about. But when the times comes, if he manages to kill Itachi, you think his life will be complete? Kakashi told him to give up this vengeance because he has seen people like him that don't end up well. After they get their revenge, it won't satisfy that pain and hunger that they've felt.

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

Sure, killing Itachi is all he cares about. But when the times comes, if he manages to kill Itachi, you think his life will be complete? Kakashi told him to get up this vengeance because he has seen people like him that don't end up well. After they get their revenge, it won't satisfy that pain and hunger that they've felt.

Wow Phatz, that was deep.

But is that really a question? Sasuke's only ambition is to kill his brother, I think that he has shown in the past that he is willing to overlook the advice of others and do what he wants. He took the dark power from Oro, left his village to train with him and he has always known Oro's intentions. So to me it is pretty cut and dry.

[lilphatboi88]

So cut and dry to the point where, once he kills itachi, he'll let Oro take over his body?

[Buffalobiian]

He really means that as long as he can kill Itachi, he doesn't care what happens to him, including sacrificing his body to Oro. That's only valid if he can't kill him with his own power. He's learning from Oro right now. By the end of it, if he thinks, or confirms he can kill Itachi without losing anything, of course he'll keep control.

The crux is he'll kill Itachi no matter what the cost is.

[lilphatboi88]

crux?

anyways, yeah that's what I'm saying.

[Buffalobiian]

Crux - the basic, central, or critical point or feature.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/crux

[lilphatboi88]

Thank You

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/thank_you

[Alhuin]

Arguments aside, I thought this episode was pretty epic. Loved the fighting between Kakashi and Hidan/Kakuzu. Everything seemed to flow nicely, and fit much better than that lame attempt at hand-to-hand combat in an earlier episode with Kakuzu and some other Konoha ninja. Shikamaru's tactic to separate the two was well played... I didn't expect him to get in close range like he did. And as for the ending... well, I don't really know what's going to happen, but there's no way he could have gotten to Shikamaru THAT quickly after just being separated. It's a shounen show... they have to draw it out at least a little bit longer.

[lilphatboi88]

hey....

you seem to be hinting you know something about the ending...

[Kraco]

You know what, lilphatboi88? Unless you start to come up with something concrete instead of suspecting every person with thinking faculties to be a manga spoilerer or otherwise "knowing" something, or if you insist on making mocking no content spam posts like these last two of yours have been, you will be free (=without choice) to find another Naruto forum to pester. Consider this the last and only warning.

[lilphatboi88]

Sorry Kraco, I didn't mean to offend you. I guess I'm just having some house troubles and I'm venting on here. I'll stop.

[darkshadow]

Hmm that piece of information that hasn't yet been revealed in the anime. Is it THAT hard for forum posters to just derive their opinions on what they've watched, and shut their trap about everything else they've read about Naruto?


Oh? why don't you just stop posting and go back to lurking again


Also I kinda forgot about the episode already, but didn't kakuzu say something about that shikamaru would grow up to have a pretty good bounty on his head? If that is the case, I'm pretty sure kakashi has at least some sort of a bounty.

[Kraco]

Kakuzu only thinks about money, so it's natural for him to judge others in terms of money. So, a promising person could gain a high bounty, some small fry nothing. I don't think coming from his mouth it's yet any sure assurance an elite ninja would automatically get one. Though on the other hand you'd think Kakuzu also knows everything there is to know about bounties.

[KrayZ33]

This episode was soooo enjoying to watch... it feels great to see something like that once in a while.

Kakuzu and Hidan are truely my favorite villain so far and the best thing about this is, that we didn't get to see Naruto even once.

Kakuza plus Hidan equal awesomeness.The best, coolest and strongest team I've seen so far... Kakuzu is the one I like the most. He has a cool attitude, seems to be aware of everything, intelligent and the has a really nice way of fighting.

[Assertn]

Oh? why don't you just stop posting and go back to lurking again


Also I kinda forgot about the episode already, but didn't kakuzu say something about that shikamaru would grow up to have a pretty good bounty on his head? If that is the case, I'm pretty sure kakashi has at least some sort of a bounty.
What he meant was that some uninvolved 3rd party will gather in a round-table discussion and assign an arbitrary value on shikamaru's head, the compensation for which is backed by unknown players with nonsensical intentions.

That is...according to popular belief in this thread.

[Abdula]

Okay Assertn why would villages put bounties on people's heads and have guys at exchange points to pay guys like Kakuzu for killing people, when the villages themselves have both the means and the motive to kill them. Early in the series the Third said one of the things the villages are often hired to do is perform assassinations, so why when they themselves need someone killed would they turn to outsourcing. They couldn't possibly be making a profit by paying out millions of dollars per corpse when they could have sent their own ninjas to do the job.

Hell aren't the anbu there for the purpose of performing assassinations, I mean they are the Special Assassination and Tactical Squad after all. We already saw that Sai's job prior to joining team Kakashi was assassinating people who were deemed a threat to the village and it was said that Kakashi's raikiri was created specifically for performing assassinations.

I can't see any reason why it would be necessary for the villages to place bounties on anyone's head. Besides its not as if we've seen anything that suggests that the villages are the ones placing bounties on people heads. Its not as if Kakuzu said, X village has a bounty on your head. In fact right here (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/320/03/) its says it was an underground organization that placed the bounties on their heads.

[Assertn]

The underground organization just acts as a medium to facilitate the bounty hunter trade. They probably serve as an unbiased trade center, and Konoha probably utilizes them as much as anyone else would (why else would Konoha know the locations of the 5 nearest drop-off points?)

Anyone could issue bounties, but the most likely candidates are villages and countries.
We already know that a country leader can buy services from ninjas outside of their respective village, as explained during the sand village coup against Konoha.

Plus, the entire Naruto world's economy is driven primarily by combat and fighting power.
How many ninjas from other villages have Kakashi killed? How much does that affect the village those ninjas belonged to? The consequences of losing men are both emotional and financial. If you had the opportunity of substantially increasing the number of assassins against a specific threat, wouldn't you offer money to do so? If one of your own subordinates by chance takes down the threat, then you can save the bounty fee.

If Konoha isn't offering bounties on Akatsuki and Orochimaru, I'd be really surprised.

[DarthEnderX]

I don't think its accurate to assume that the ninja villages are that wealthy enough to offer massive bounties.

Everything we've seen about Konoha seems to suggest that they bust their ass just to keep that place running.

Meanwhile, the Naruto world seems to have plenty of yazuka-type organizations and corrupt nobles that probably have the kind of disposable income and shinobi enemies to warrant having a bounty system.

I mean, pretty much the first bounty we ever see in the series is the bridge builder's from Gato's organization.

[Assertn]

Konoha busts their ass to maintain their position of power and respect.

But yeah, I'm not saying that only villages utilize the bounty system.
Also, I don't see much of a difference in daimyos offering bounties vs kages offering bounties. As far as I can tell, both share a common economy

[Jessper]

Everything we've seen about Konoha seems to suggest that they bust their ass just to keep that place running.

But them trying hard to keep up could include bounty fees they payout on occasion.

[Azonalanthious]

I would shy away from the idea of villages offering bounties on just anyone - as already pointed out, they could just use their own ninja for it. On the other hand, I could see them offering bounties for really tough targets. If you were the Village Hidden in the Mist, for example, would you want to risk, and possibly loose, some of your best jonin trying to take out someone like Kakashi? Or would you rather just pay some other poor smucks to take the losses?

One way I could see the whole system working is for it to be run by an underground organization who combines multiple bids - so its not person x saying "I'll pay 5 mil for you to kill Asuma"; its person A contacting this organization and saying "I'll toss 50,000 in if you get rid of Asuma", then person B contacts them and says "Asuma interfered with my operation, add 20,000 from me to the bounty", then person c adds say 75,000, and so on and so forth until you end up with the 5 mil.

If someone actually HAS 5 mil and considers it worth spending it all to take out Asuma, they go to a village and hire an assasination mission, which is probably going to be more reliable and faster. But if they don't have that much or aren't willing to spend it, they contact the bounty organization and put down what they can afford in an effort to encourage folks to take him down without having to pay for a full assasination.

[DarthEnderX]

One way I could see the whole system working is for it to be run by an underground organization who combines multiple bids - so its not person x saying "I'll pay 5 mil for you to kill Asuma"; its person A contacting this organization and saying "I'll toss 50,000 in if you get rid of Asuma", then person B contacts them and says "Asuma interfered with my operation, add 20,000 from me to the bounty", then person c adds say 75,000, and so on and so forth until you end up with the 5 mil.That'd be a pretty smart way to do it. I've never heard of anyone doing it that way though.

[Kraco]

It indeed would be. But like you said yourself, the world seems to be rife with crime organizations and corruption, so it could work. After all, you need a big bounty for the real mofos to get interested, and small-time customers individually might not have the money needed. Even if the organizer claims like a 15% cut, it could still accumulate enough for everybody to get things going, assuming its common knowledge such a system exists. And since we are talking about bounties, nobody loses money unless the deed is actually done.

[Archangel]

He really hasnt mentioned ressurection of his clan in a long time, and if he really wants to do that he is going to need to make a bunch of babies, and even then, they will only be half Uchiha.

So the only way for someone to be a true uchiha is through inbreeding...?

[KrayZ33]

Okay Assertn why would villages put bounties on people's heads and have guys at exchange points to pay guys like Kakuzu for killing people, when the villages themselves have both the means and the motive to kill them. Early in the series the Third said one of the things the villages are often hired to do is perform assassinations, so why when they themselves need someone killed would they turn to outsourcing. They couldn't possibly be making a profit by paying out millions of dollars per corpse when they could have sent their own ninjas to do the job.

Hell aren't the anbu there for the purpose of performing assassinations, I mean they are the Special Assassination and Tactical Squad after all. We already saw that Sai's job prior to joining team Kakashi was assassinating people who were deemed a threat to the village and it was said that Kakashi's raikiri was created specifically for performing assassinations.

I can't see any reason why it would be necessary for the villages to place bounties on anyone's head. Besides its not as if we've seen anything that suggests that the villages are the ones placing bounties on people heads. Its not as if Kakuzu said, X village has a bounty on your head. In fact right here (http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/320/03/) its says it was an underground organization that placed the bounties on their heads.

even today states put bounty on peoples "heads" when the police isn't able to get him/them...

I don't see why countries in the Narutoverse wouldn't use bounty.. just because they have ANBU?

Hell who cares, if a person is greedy and can draw out the "bounty" into the open (by acting like a friend) it'll alot easier for ANBU to kill him... and the person will be paid for doing so.

And it's a lot more stressful when the bounty has to fear bountyhunters in ther own town... and the country doesn't have to use it's own soldiers, which means that they don't have to fear losing them during the assassination mission..

[DarthEnderX]

even today states put bounty on peoples "heads" when the police isn't able to get him/them...

I don't see why countries in the Narutoverse wouldn't use bounty.. just because they have ANBU?First of all, the countries and the ninja villages are not the same thing. That's why there's a Hokage and a Lord of the Country of Fire. I can totally see Country of Fire nobles putting bounties on people while I can't see Konoha doing the same thing.

Secondly, I'm sticking with the argument "because they can't afford to". Ninjas get paid to kill people. They don't pay others to kill people.

It's like a plumber paying someone else to do his plumbing cause he doesn't feel like it.

[Assertn]

First of all, the countries and the ninja villages are not the same thing. That's why there's a Hokage and a Lord of the Country of Fire. I can totally see Country of Fire nobles putting bounties on people while I can't see Konoha doing the same thing.

Secondly, I'm sticking with the argument "because they can't afford to". Ninjas get paid to kill people. They don't pay others to kill people.

It's like a plumber paying someone else to do his plumbing cause he doesn't feel like it.

You mean like how Kabuto helped out Sakura so they can go off and kill more akatsuki to save him and Oro from having to do it themselves?

It's just a means of outsourcing tasks that either aren't of imminent concern or practical to pursue. Unless Kakashi tries to storm the mist village himself, they're not going to waste men hunting him down. If they can create a few more enemies for Kakashi to deal with instead, then that should suffice. You guys are all freaking out about $M overheads for bounties, but that figure is probably a drop in the bucket for a large village.

Maybe I just see things differently than everyone else here cause nobody has much business sense on this forum...

Also:
A plumber paying someone else to do his plumbing is a successful business man.

[DarthEnderX]

Yeah, but he's also lazy, or an incompetent plumber. One of those is keeping him from doing his own plumbing. I don't think a ninja village is either for those things.

(either lazy or incompetent that is, not a plumber).

[animus]

Yeah, but he's also lazy, or an incompetent plumber. One of those is keeping him from doing his own plumbing. I don't think a ninja village is either for those things.

(either lazy or incompetent that is, not a plumber).

You have much to learn.

[Kagari]

Maybe I just see things differently than everyone else here cause nobody has much business sense on this forum...

Also:
A plumber paying someone else to do his plumbing is a successful business man.

I'm right there with ya, Assertn. Hey, how long have you been without the "Failure", by the way?

[tystic]

If the time you spend fixing your own plumbing could have been spent making more money than hiring another plumber would cost, it is better to hire.

Similarly, if sending shinobi to quell a situation removes them from another client, and the pay from that client is more than another village asks for settling the problem, it is wiser to hire from the other village.

[DarthEnderX]

You know what? I've officially lost interest in this argument.

[Abdula]

As have I, but I have to say this.


Maybe I just see things differently than everyone else here cause nobody has much business sense on this forum...
You should really try to keep your ego in check when you're posting. The only thing me and DE don't see is how the villages could possibly have that much money. We have seen nothing to suggest that any village has a large enough income that would allow them to be able to afford to pay out millions of dollars for bounties. As DE said, from what we've seen thus far and based on what the Akatsuki leader said it would seem that in this age where there are no ninja wars. Ninjas villages are struggling just to keep themselves afloat and the only reason the top five can maintain their position is because they are well respected and their countries are large enough to support them, i.e provide them with clients and missions. His entire plan is based on the fact that in this time of peace the villages are going broke and he is essentially going to create an army without allegiance to any country, that will take on any mission for as he put it, "a minor cost" thereby bankrupting the villages.

Your entire argument is based on the fact that you think the villages can afford to drop 30M on a bounty, which just doesn't seem likely.

I even pointed out where it explicitly said that it was an underground organization that put the bounties on Asuma's and Chiriku's heads but then you post this.

The underground organization just acts as a medium to facilitate the bounty hunter trade. They probably serve as an unbiased trade center, and Konoha probably utilizes them as much as anyone else would (why else would Konoha know the locations of the 5 nearest drop-off points?)
If the organization just acts as a medium to facilitate the bounties then whats the point of saying the organization put the bounties on their head. Why not just say X village put the bounty on their head.

Anyway, that is pretty much where you lost me.

A plumber paying someone else to do his plumbing is a successful business man.
Oh please. A plumber who pays other people an exorbitant fee to do a job he himself is capable of doing for significantly less, not to mention that he already has people in his employ for the specific purpose of performing said task, is a fool who won't be in business for long.

You know the biggest problem I have with your little theory Assertn is that it makes the villages look useless. To think that any of the big five villages are incapable of eliminating people who they themselves deem a threat to them is just ridiculous. Not to mention the unwanted consequences, you don't seem to see. Not only are the villages too weak to take care of their own interests but they are paying shady characters like bounty hunters ridiculous sums of money to do their jobs for them, and only creating an even greater potential threat.

I mean with all the money this underground organization would have pouring in whats to stop it from itself becoming a threat to the villages. And whats to stop enemies of a particular village from cashing in a bounty and then using that income to gain enough power and influence to turn around and attack that village using that very same village's money. I mean isn't that why Kakuzu was collecting bounties in the first place, to gather enough resources so Akatsuki can achieve their goal which ultimately is the destruction of the villages themselves. And surely Kakuzu and every Akatsuki member has a bounty too right. If the Akatsuki leader is going to use money paid out by the villages to bring them down then he is alot more devious that I thought.


(why else would Konoha know the locations of the 5 nearest drop-off points?)
Because they're ninjas and its their business to know whats going on in and around their village. I would be surprised if they didn't know where the drop off points were. Regardless of how pathetic Naruto makes ninjas seem they are still ninjas and they do have ninjas that specialize in many different fields be it reconnaissance, interrogation or assassinations.

[Uberbaka]

As have I, but I have to say this.
Your entire argument is based on the fact that you think the villages can afford to drop 30M on a bounty, which just doesn't seem likely.

Now I honestly don't find this discussion very interesting or remotely relevant to anything, but how do you know what kind of money they do or do not have? They build stone heads in mountains every time they change leader, who knows if they have to pay for that or not? There's too many unknown variables about how their economy works.

Do you even know what currency they have and how that would convert into whatever you think it is?

Your counterargument is based on the assumption they can't, and both arguments are flawed because they rely on assumptions.

Just give it a rest.

[Assertn]

Uberbaka, exactly. The bounty prices are completely arbitrary because we don't have any other frame of reference to currency in the series. For all we know $30M could be the price of a single B-ranked mission.


As have I, but I have to say this...
And you sure had a *lot* to say for someone who's tired of this discussion.


I even pointed out where it explicitly said that it was an underground organization that put the bounties on Asuma's and Chiriku's heads but then you post this.

If the organization just acts as a medium to facilitate the bounties then whats the point of saying the organization put the bounties on their head. Why not just say X village put the bounty on their head.

Anyway, that is pretty much where you lost me.

Semantics.



Oh please. A plumber who pays other people an exorbitant fee to do a job he himself is capable of doing for significantly less, not to mention that he already has people in his employ for the specific purpose of performing said task, is a fool who won't be in business for long.


What about a plumber whose employees are constantly being resourced and yet they still have a list of orders that they are struggling to fulfill...however they want to fulfill them in order to maintain their client-base? Thats pretty much been Konoha's position since Oro's invasion.



You know the biggest problem I have with your little theory Assertn is that it makes the villages look useless...etc etc...

You know the biggest problem I have with you thinking that a village is so incapable of contracting out $30M bounties is that it suggests that Chiriku's head alone is enough to make Akatsuki more financially powerful than Konoha.



Because they're ninjas and its their business to know whats going on in and around their village. I would be surprised if they didn't know where the drop off points were. Regardless of how pathetic Naruto makes ninjas seem they are still ninjas and they do have ninjas that specialize in many different fields be it reconnaissance, interrogation or assassinations.
They why not dispose of them to render the bounty incentives null?

[DarthEnderX]

Uberbaka, exactly. The bounty prices are completely arbitrary because we don't have any other frame of reference to currency in the series. For all we know $30M could be the price of a single B-ranked mission.I think the biggest clue to the relative value of the bounty is the focus with which an S-rank criminal like Kakuzu pursues it.

[Kraco]

Kakuzu would probably rob a kid of his candy money... He seems to be in for his interest in cash, based on his talks with Hidan. Actually he would probably make much more money by working as a freelance witch doctor for wealthy people. If he can give Deidara The Armless Ninja new hands just like that, he should be able to fix a large selection of problems folks in such a violent world should have for a very good price, and above all far more consistently than by seeking random bounties here and there.

[Assertn]

I think the biggest clue to the relative value of the bounty is the focus with which an S-rank criminal like Kakuzu pursues it.
That's like saying that Luffy's crew should have at least $600M on them at all times because their combined bounty is at least that high.

[Uberbaka]

Has the currency in the series ever been specified? There is a significant difference between 1 million USD and 1 million Yen...

(1,000,000.00 JPY=10,468.46 USD if anyone is interested)

[ASSpirine]

The currency is ryou I thought

[DarthEnderX]

That's like saying that Luffy's crew should have at least $600M on them at all times because their combined bounty is at least that high.No. That's not even remotely what I said.

I'm saying, that for a shinobi of Kakuzu's powerlevel, for him to consider the bounty worthy of his time, it must be significant.

[Abdula]

And you sure had a *lot* to say for someone who's tired of this discussion
You'd be surprised what little interest I have in anything, period. Its part of my winning personality:(

Anyway you're right, until we have some idea as to what value $30M actually has, continuing this discussion is kinda pointless. So I'll leave it alone until then.

[Yukimura]

@DarthEnder: How would you propose to compare what is significant to Kakuzu with what would be significant to a ninja village? or a country? The utility of a given amount of money to a given individual or entity is based in large part on how much money that individual or entity is already used to dealing with.

If you're homeless and jobless you might kill for a chance at $10 million dollars. If you have a job and expect to earn $100,000 a year then getting $10 million would be a 'significant' amount of money to you though you probably wouldn't be as willing to murder for it. However, if you're the treasurer of a small bank that holds $100 million in assets then landing a $10 million account would be 'significant' to your bank but not to the same degree that it would be to you personally. If, instead, you were treasurer for a multi-national company that regularly has annual profits in the billions then a $10 million contract might be seen as a waste of time. And for the government of a country with a budget nearing the trillions giving out that $10 million dollar contract might barely even register on the books.

How can you judge the value something on an absolute scale by looking only at how valuable it appears to one individual or entity?

[DarthEnderX]

Because I'm not looking at an individual. I'm looking at an organization.

Kakuzu is a part of Akatsuki, whose first goal is to "obtain a ton of money" for the purpose of 1. Basically starting a ninja company and 2. Not being paid very much to do jobs. So you're talking about enough money to run the equivalent of a small ninja village at a substantial loss without running out of funding. Either way, I'm assuming that the amount of money Akatsuki needs is a shitload if it qualifies as Step 1. of a plan whose other steps are "capture the tailed beasts" and "rule the world".

Now Kakuzu is the one who's "in charge of Akatsuki's finances". Which means he has to weigh a the bounty's value against his time and abilities being used to further Akatsuki's goal.

[Kraco]

Kakuzu isn't very smart, either, so his evaluation of what manner of a bounty is worthwhile is of limited importance. No matter how big those bounties are, they are mere pocket money compared to the kinds of sums he could get from rich folks needing healing or a new heart to live longer. You know, there would be no end of millionaires that would give him half of their wealth if he gave them 20 or 30 more years with a new heart. Instead he wanders around looking for random bounties...

Or he just really likes to fight.

[Pandadice]

since there was no new episode this week, I assume we'll get a two-part one next week? which means maybe something big, like the end of this battle, and maybe a death or two?

[ASSpirine]

I don't know actually. When it's a special episode (2 episodes in 1) it's usually announced in the preview. And I dont look at the previews, that's why I don't know.

[Buffalobiian]

There's been skipped weeks without specials, and double eps have been aired without breaks. It's not a reliable indicator.

[Assertn]

Yes. It's an hour long special

[lilphatboi88]

Nice, we should be in for some good action.

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

Nice, we should be in for some good action.

I dont know about all that, seems like the hour long specials seem to have more flashbacks than anything. Not to mention the constant looping of a fighting scene. :(

[DarthEnderX]

Kakuzu isn't very smart, either, so his evaluation of what manner of a bounty is worthwhile is of limited importance. No matter how big those bounties are, they are mere pocket money compared to the kinds of sums he could get from rich folks needing healing or a new heart to live longer. You know, there would be no end of millionaires that would give him half of their wealth if he gave them 20 or 30 more years with a new heart. Instead he wanders around looking for random bounties...He wanders around because his duties in Akatsuki involve more than just obtaining money. Such as capturing Jinchuuriki.

I don't know how you can say he's not smart either. Unless your basing that purely on the fact that he's not selling his medical abilities. Because they are definitely portraying him as an intelligent villain.

Also, there's the problem with the fact that, he's a wanted criminal, which means anytime a rich person tries to contract him to perform some medical work, it could just be a trap set by shinobi.

At least with bounties, nobody contacts him directly. He just checks posted bounties, kills them, then shows up at a contact point for his reward.

[Azonalanthious]

Plus, don't forget that we don't know that he isn't selling his medical abilities - its not like its ever been mentioned in the series one way or another. He very well could be selling them to millionaries as well.

Also - I haven't gone back and watched the episode, but I remember when I first saw them hit the fire temple, I thought they were looking for a Jinchuurki and stumbling across the monk with the bounty was just a lucky break. Kakuzu wasn't there looking for a bounty, he just found one and though it was worthwhile to turn it in before moving one. Then ditto for Asuma - Asuma found them, not the other way around. So it could well be that their bounties aren't high enough for them to be worth Kakuzu's while to hunt down... but since he ran into them anyways, its worth it to go ahead and collect them.

[Kraco]

Plus, don't forget that we don't know that he isn't selling his medical abilities - its not like its ever been mentioned in the series one way or another. He very well could be selling them to millionaries as well.

That's actually such a simple point that I can't think of anything to say to counter it.

And I don't really think he's not smart. By what we have seen he's the smartest one in Akatsuki. It was just something I said to counter all the bounty talk as if random bounties would easily make enough money to fund a whole mercenary army.

[Assertn]

I see it as more of a down payment

[tystic]

Maybe it's more of a finishing act. They remove potential enemies that have the highest chance of chucking a wrench into their plans, but since they have bounties on their heads in the criminal market, Akatsuki can pad their pocketbook at the same time. Doesn't matter if it's insignificant to whatever other funding system they have, it still is money that's guaranteed to be in their hands and not their enemies'.

[Crash]

If the organization just acts as a medium to facilitate the bounties then whats the point of saying the organization put the bounties on their head. Why not just say X village put the bounty on their head.


Thought i'd chime in on this, as i don't think anyone's pursued this angle.

Likely the organization is like a "black market" for assassination. Sure you can get a gun from a store, but if you don't want it traced back to you it's not a very good idea. In my mind the organization running the bounties probably works off that same principle.

There is plenty of political tension between the different Countries/villages in the Narutoverse (at least it's implied that there is though we don't see much of it). So if a Country/Village precieved a certain individual (ninja or otherwise) as a threat killing them is a fairly obvious option. However if you don't want to potentially spark a massive war in the process those countries/villages may not want to send their own ninja to do the deed.

So the reason a country/village would bother using such an organization would be simple anonymity. The organization takes a cut and in return no one ever has to know that X country wanted a ninja from Y country dead, fulfilling the objective without the possibility of disastrous political repercussions.

That at least is my theory, though in the end i suppose it makes little difference. We'll likely never learn anything of value about it. I could have just said "The Lollipop King decree's the bounties from atop his candy throne to obtain retribution against those who would consume his people." and had just as much chance of having ever been proved right.

[DarthEnderX]

I just assume that ninja villages also have some kind of confidentiality clause as well. It'd be...weird...if they didn't.

[Assertn]

That's actually a good point, too....just look what happened when Hyuga Hiashi killed that cloud ninja: the cloud village almost declared war.

It would definitely be bad for relations if a ninja village directly assaults prominent ninjas from another village.

[ASSpirine]

I'm also wondering about the different towns inside a country, you have Konoha inside the fire country which you might see as the capital. But I assume there are other villages, do they also produce ninjas? And would they have the same head protectors? Wouldn't seem logical if they do, Konoha means leaf, so...

[Buffalobiian]

Konoha's the only hidden villiage of the Fire country, and is the only villiage there to produce "ninjas"

[DarthEnderX]

Konoha is also not the capitol of the Fire Country because the Lord of the Fire Country doesn't live there.

I imagine whatever city the Lord of Fire's castle is in is the capitol of the Fire Country.

[Abdula]

So the reason a country/village would bother using such an organization would be simple anonymity. The organization takes a cut and in return no one ever has to know that X country wanted a ninja from Y country dead, fulfilling the objective without the possibility of disastrous political repercussions.

Sounds about right but lets just suppose Kakashi disappears, there are obvious signs of a battle, he is assumed dead but his body doesn't turn up. Whats to stop some leaf ninjas from going to one of those drop off points and interrogating the guys there to find out who put the bounty on his head and why. I mean we already saw Ibiki interrogating the guy from the bounty station Kakuzu used.

Sending in some hunter nins that could eliminate Kakashi discreetly just seems like the better option to me. This bounty system doesn't seem discreet at all since it seems Asuma not only knew that there was a bounty on his head, but exactly how much it was worth too. So I figure being in a ninja village and all, if he knew that much he would also know who put the bounty on his head and why, and they said it was an underground organization.

Anyway..........

[darkmetal505]

Maybe they release bounties in a monthly magazine.

Could happen. I'd suscribe.

[Kraco]

Whats to stop some leaf ninjas from going to one of those drop off points and interrogating the guys there to find out who put the bounty on his head and why. I mean we already saw Ibiki interrogating the guy from the bounty station Kakuzu used.

Why exactly would those random dudes at the drop off points know anything but the amounts and the faces of the targets for verification? It's obviously not the highest position in the organization to rot away in some hidden chamber behind a toilet.


it seems Asuma not only knew that there was a bounty on his head, but exactly how much it was worth too. So I figure being in a ninja village and all, if he knew that much he would also know who put the bounty on his head and why, and they said it was an underground organization.

Some pesky bounty hunter might have blurted out the amount after Asuma kicked his ass. Also, Asuma knows himself best what he has done in the past so he can make pretty educated guesses who might want to see his head detached from between his shoulders.

Real world mafias are also underground organizations but everybody knows they exists in quite a few countries and are heavily involved in various legal and illegal businesses. Doesn't make them any less underground organizations.

[Abdula]

Why exactly would those random dudes at the drop off points know anything but the amounts and the faces of the targets for verification? It's obviously not the highest position in the organization to rot away in some hidden chamber behind a toilet. Ah but even the lackeys take their orders from someone. He doesn't have to know anything himself all he has to do is point them in the direction of someone who does. Even if all they get out of him is a name it'll be enough, and with all the crazy jutsus we've seen thus far I'm sure they must have some creative interrogation techniques.



Some pesky bounty hunter might have blurted out the amount after Asuma kicked his ass. Also, Asuma knows himself best what he has done in the past so he can make pretty educated guesses who might want to see his head detached from between his shoulders.

Real world mafias are also underground organizations but everybody knows they exists in quite a few countries and are heavily involved in various legal and illegal businesses. Doesn't make them any less underground organizations.
I'm rather confused. I don't see the point you're trying to make here.

The point I was trying to make wasn't whether the organization was underground or not but that it was explicitly said that an underground organization put the bounty on Asuma's head and I would think Konoha would definitely be very interested in an organization that is paying out money for the corpses of its most prominent ninjas. They certainly won't just let it be.

[Kraco]

I would think Konoha would definitely be very interested in an organization that is paying out money for the corpses of its most prominent ninjas. They certainly won't just let it be.

I wouldn't place too much trust on Konoha. Despite the group hosting the massacrer of one of the most important Konoha clans, they did absolutely nothing to wipe out Akatsuki before their ally ninja village's leader was kidnapped by the group. And actually even then they only wanted to save that leader and engage Akatsuki members if necessary to fulfil that objective. So, I wouldn't say they pay too much attention to criminal organizations or follow leads too deeply.

[Archangel]

I wouldn't place too much trust on Konoha. Despite the group hosting the massacrer of one of the most important Konoha clans, they did absolutely nothing to wipe out Akatsuki before their ally ninja village's leader was kidnapped by the group. And actually even then they only wanted to save that leader and engage Akatsuki members if necessary to fulfil that objective. So, I wouldn't say they pay too much attention to criminal organizations or follow leads too deeply.

Well it's been mentioned before but Konoha's military power has lowered drastically in the last couple of years and quite frankly engaging akatsuki at that point would be suicidal.

i think they made the right move by ignoring them while they could while they fortified their power ( shinobi ) so they could eventually take them down.

That at least, does seem to have been a good move on Tsunade's part.

[Assertn]

It doesn't matter....everyone in Konoha knows that their prominent ninjas have bounties on them. Asuma not only knew that he had a bounty on his own head, but that his is larger than Chiriku's. It's no surprise that other villages want people dead. It's a different matter when those villages act on this.

[Rikudo]

I bet Konohamaru already have a bounty on his head just for being a descendant of the Sarutobi clan. I'm guessing about 3 1/2 ryou.

[Death BOO Z]

I'd kill him for free.

my 2 cents for bounties:
As people said, I think that the bounties aren't placed by ninja villages, they are placed by personal people who hold a grudge against a particular ninja (maybe Asume slept with someone's wife when he was young? that's the ninja thing to do), and probably stack up with time (take Tsunade, for example, she probably made a lot of small enemies during her time as ninja, so if a few of them offer around 10k-100k each, then it gets pretty big), and after a few years in action, people in that profession are bound to step on a few toes.

also, the bounty system works as a proxy for villages to get rid of threats without getting the entire village into a new ninja war.

[Abdula]

It doesn't matter....everyone in Konoha knows that their prominent ninjas have bounties on them. Asuma not only knew that he had a bounty on his own head, but that his is larger than Chiriku's. It's no surprise that other villages want people dead. It's a different matter when those villages act on this.
You're guys are being rather closed minded. Anyway......

1. I don't think many ninjas actually have bounties on their heads.
2. Even if they are prominent ninjas or the best in the village that doesn't guarantee that they actually have a bounty.
3. The more ideas you guys have about how this supposed bounty system would work, the less and less likely it seems to me.
4. The fact that Kakuzu was carrying around Chiriku's entire dead body intact, leads me to believe that placing bounties on someone isn't just about wanting them dead.

I wouldn't place too much trust on Konoha. Despite the group hosting the massacrer of one of the most important Konoha clans, they did absolutely nothing to wipe out Akatsuki before their ally ninja village's leader was kidnapped by the group. And actually even then they only wanted to save that leader and engage Akatsuki members if necessary to fulfil that objective. So, I wouldn't say they pay too much attention to criminal organizations or follow leads too deeply.
Itachi aside because I don't think thats really relevant. I don't have that impression of Konoha. They had only just found out about Akatsuki when Oro attacked the village and at that point rebuilding was their main priority. Since the skip it seems they have been a lot proactive. They have undoubtedly still been gathering info on Oro and Akatsuki and Tsunade even formed a special group just for the purpose of hunting them down. Plus Danzo and the elders are undoubtedly looking into it.

So I wouldn't say they haven't been doing anything I just think its all been going on off screen because all Kishi's screen time is devoted to developing Naruto instead of the world around him. Kishi has definitely done a good job of making the villages seem weak and inept, and makes it seem as if Konoha wouldn't be able to do a single thing if not for a kid in an orange jump suit but I just don't think its true.

The village would have never survived if they weren't actively pursuing and eliminating threats to them and Kishi gave us a little glimpse of that with Danzo and Sai.

[Assertn]

I'd kill him for free.

my 2 cents for bounties:
As people said, I think that the bounties aren't placed by ninja villages, they are placed by personal people who hold a grudge against a particular ninja (maybe Asume slept with someone's wife when he was young? that's the ninja thing to do), and probably stack up with time (take Tsunade, for example, she probably made a lot of small enemies during her time as ninja, so if a few of them offer around 10k-100k each, then it gets pretty big), and after a few years in action, people in that profession are bound to step on a few toes.

also, the bounty system works as a proxy for villages to get rid of threats without getting the entire village into a new ninja war.
So who's the asshat who wanted a monk dead?

[Pandadice]

any atheist in the area?

[Kraco]

Like I said way back when this whole bounty discussion started, the other reason for bounties could be to collect bodies. Oro showed us that you can create terribly powerful slave zombie warriors (that even sounds cool) by simply having the rotting corpse of a powerful ninja and then sacrificing any nameless minion of yours to power it. So, you can simply place a bounty on some asskicker ninja, have him taken down by an uber powerful bountyhunter like Kakuzu, and you have a weapon to use in some special operation. Nothing personal but extremely efficient compared to devoting 20 years to raise a ninja that still might not turn out well.

[DarthEnderX]

So who's the asshat who wanted a monk dead?If I had to guess, I would say that since he was one of the 12 guardians, as was Asuma, I would say someone who was a political enemy of the Lord of Fire during the time they were his protectors.

[Abdula]

Like I said way back when this whole bounty discussion started, the other reason for bounties could be to collect bodies. Oro showed us that you can create terribly powerful slave zombie warriors (that even sounds cool) by simply having the rotting corpse of a powerful ninja and then sacrificing any nameless minion of yours to power it. So, you can simply place a bounty on some asskicker ninja, have him taken down by an uber powerful bountyhunter like Kakuzu, and you have a weapon to use in some special operation. Nothing personal but extremely efficient compared to devoting 20 years to raise a ninja that still might not turn out well.
Yes that is what I was thinking but I'm not expecting to see any zombie armies. Rather I think this has more to do with something that was mentioned back in the Zabuza arc. That stuff about hunter nins having to destroy the bodies of rogue ninjas to prevent the villages secrets from getting out. Surely the body of Asuma, who was not only the son of the Third and one of the Leaf's top ninjas but one of the twelve ninja guardians, contains a lot of secrets. Secrets that would make his corpse extremely valuable.

[DarthEnderX]

Well, when they said secrets contained in their bodies I always assumed it related to Kekkei genkai.

Since Asuma didn't have one as far as we know I don't think there's much they can get from his corpse.

[Buffalobiian]

Secrets don't always have to be genetic Blood Line limits. The body may contain things like evidence of the village's training methods, any soldier pills the pharmacy may have secretly produced, or maybe hints of how certain techniques are performed.

That's why they send Hunter Nins around to kill Missing Nins, regardless of whether they've got special genetic traits.

[Tetsu]

Well this isn't about ep 85 but I didn't want to make a new thread for 86-87 because I don't have a torrent for it.

Ep 86-87 already out on Usenet , http://www.animeusenet.org/, but not on torrent. The nfo says "lol usenet only release". Is it some sort of joke by the poster or by DB? I already downloaded the episode and it looks real so far. Going to watch it now and see... Anyone know what's happening? :confused:

File is [DB] Naruto Shippuuden 086-087 [B46272E9]

[Marik]

It's legit, just finished watching it.

[darkmetal505]

Yea dunno when torrent will be out, here it is streaming though:

http://www.veoh.com/videos/v16824752NAdxZNEd?source=embed

[ASSpirine]

hmm, if you're looking for [DB] Naruto Shippuuden 086-087 on google you see differente torrent files, but all with another code behind the name. What's that about?