Gundam 00 Episode 20 [Archive]

Darknodin

Mon, 02-25-2008, 11:28 PM

ok... i personally think the design for the new suits suck... this said, I actually felt the joy of the HRL people... they've been pushed around for so long it must be like freaking Stalingrad or something for them.

also... I cheered when Graham said "no"... Flags FTW!!!! and Ali is... well interesting.

btw, right now, i'm starting to doubt that the Trinity Team will end up being the villains in this (and Veda is the Chouginga Gurren-Lagann!)

oh and also... seems the CB team is gonna be getting some upgrade soon. I really wonder where the season finale will go...

Inazuma

Tue, 02-26-2008, 08:59 AM

CB to me, really need some "Badass Captain char"(Black Lagoon's Dutch) with them backing the gundam with some One man operated GNDrive powered Kickass Battleship.(Uber USS Iowa styled ship).
And after that his char got developped enough and the big ass ship prooved to be a highly reliable asset I hope that battleship goes down with his captain over some fuckup cause by sumeragi so that everyone will be allowed to stone her to death or cry like an emo.

Yukimura

Tue, 02-26-2008, 04:25 PM

Gundam 00 - 20 - [Shinsen] (http://bt.shinsen-subs.org/%5BShinsen-Subs%5D_Kidou_Senshi_Gundam_00_-_20_%5B929E2E88%5D.avi.torrent)

Kraco

Tue, 02-26-2008, 05:58 PM

Man, Ali is one seriously malicious miscreant. But he truly loves his job, that's for sure.

Saji and Louise are starting to become a pair of uber tragic young lovers... Quite a burden already to bear for both of them. And we also got an answer to the hand question: Looks like the Gundam pilots won't be getting any cheap health insurance plans with having to bathe in such radiation. But I guess people like that would have accepted the position even if they were told they won't be living to see their grandchildren marry. At least Graham doesn't need to worry about that.

I don't actually have anything bad to say about this episode. It seemed surprising Throne had no idea the GN drives would be distributed but considering what kind of morons two out of the three are, I'm not really surprised after all. This and how things are falling in pieces for most of the CB and Throne makes me think the rail tycoon just might have more mundane plans than any fancy, idealistic stuff Aeolia had in mind. I'm happy I can't see where this is heading right now.

Yukimura

Tue, 02-26-2008, 09:43 PM

Poor Kinue, you will be missed...until you show up in S2 and we find out you were saved at the last minute by a mysterious stranger with ties to CB.

As usual, good pilots in Gundams >>> non-main character angsty teenagers in Gundams. It's kind of sad Graham won't fly one. And the GN Arms sound like the staple Gundam power up we've been waiting for. I just hope CB can get more than one power up before Corner blows up Veda since I'm pretty sure that will lock up a bunch of stuff for CB.

The new mechs really don't do anything good for me, they have sharp finger tips which automatically makes them bad guy suits anyway. How anyone could produce 30 Drives and 30 suits to go with them without any of the people who actually know about CB and GN drives noticing seems a bit weird, but CB did produce their Gundams without anyone in the world knowing so I'll just chock it up to Intelligence in the future being terrible.

Also Louise Halevy...Laguna Harvey ???? lonely...ronery ????

The GN Drives were given right after Louise and her whole family we're blown up, but what if not every family member was there?

rockmanj

Tue, 02-26-2008, 10:02 PM

I was thinking that there must be a "Harvey Connection" between Louise and Lagna...I dont believe that shows like this have coincidences that are that glaring. And, so basically there are like 30 new gundams running around, and methinks Liu-min has something to do with that...she seems to be getting around a lot these days.

Also, I wasnt aware that Louise's had was shot off; i just thought it was crushed irreparably in the rubble. That's pretty harsh, to have your hand shot of by the edge of a giant beam. And for my last point...was the scene with Alejandro and that boy on the ship not one of the creepiest scenes EVER?

Chiodos

Wed, 02-27-2008, 06:19 AM

Yes, and that was make it a nice scene. Creepy villians are fine by me, as long as their not utterly dumb, as the some of the Trinities are.

I guess that having 30 new suits who all look gray, red, evul, and dull...
Graham will problaby die by taking down some Gundam. But not before they've joined up some "good guys".

It's pretty sad if Kinue will dissapear, wich she problaby wont becuse she's extremey kickass in intelligence work.

Well, 5 more episodes go to!

Kraco

Wed, 02-27-2008, 06:55 AM

Poor Kinue, you will be missed...until you show up in S2 and we find out you were saved at the last minute by a mysterious stranger with ties to CB.

She was a kind of strange character if you think about it. She had a decent amount of screen time, she had a plotline of her own; quite a strong one that you would have thought would bear some significant meaning later on. And she was shown to be resourceful. It was not like she would have just walked from place to place and everything would have been dropped on her lap ready and waiting. And then she suddenly died before she actually reached her goal. It's quite a bold move, though highly realistic one. You can bet throughout the history there have been lots and lots of people who sought answers, found some and then disappeared before they were able to reveal anything.

Inazuma

Wed, 02-27-2008, 10:47 AM

Well Graham not getting a GNDrive is a good thing, it'ld be like giving bankai to Kenpachi.
It's Over Nine Thousand !

masamuneehs

Wed, 02-27-2008, 03:56 PM

"ah, yes, this will be your first time time tasting it."

Sergei was awesome in this episode. It was great to see the HRL beat back the Trinity Thrones, and that scene with Sergei, Soma, and the cheering soldiers really struck me.

Motherfucking railroad men... always the bad guys... Lagna doesn't look to have the grit it takes to stand up and be a true bad guy. Looks like typical, greedy businessman going too far. But what makes him interesting is that he's connected to Ali (I'm still calling him Ali). We'd heard that the Trinity triplets were getting orders from "Lagna", but Ali working for him also really adds a spin on it, especially because he's involved in distributing the 30 GN Drives and the Thrones had no idea they'd be up against them. I'm nowhere close to even a basic explanation for all of this...

It certainly answers all those questions from episode 3 though...

Livonze, Livonze. My little angel, indeed. This kid is starting to really pique my interest. Good to see that his connection with Tieria was openly acknowledged in this episode. The term "Biological CPU" was used in SEED (and it didn't even make any sense in the way it was used...), but it's clear they're both at least part machine, almost certainly something designed by Aeolia... or maybe from the Jupiter project... Let's just hope that whatever he's up to, it's badass, and that he's got a understandable reason for doing it. If he turns out to be a disgruntled clone, I am going to be very pissed off.

Alejandro Corner.. biggest patsy who thinks he's the shit in those show? Also, it was hinted at as strongly as possible in a mainstream shounen anime that he's gay for Livonze, and in my mind that secures him a death at the boy's hands. Once Livonze has used him, he'll "repay" him alright...

I really am liking the twist Saji's story is taking. To space indeed... Bring your angst and engineering skills, those usually turn into mobile suit prowess in these shows.

Kinue, I liked you alot, but you better stay dead! I was hoping Ali would tell her something he shouldn't, even though I knew it meant she probably could wouldn't make it. When I saw them together in the preview for this episode, I was really torn. I liked both of them, and you knew that one would have to get the best of the other...

When Wang Liu Mei gave no negative reaction to the Thrones, then made a point about how they might actually be a good thing, her character went from plot device hentai fodder to actually interesting character hentai fodder. I'm hoping she stays on the Thrones' side... they look like they could use the help...

Ten episodes I said this show wasn't doing anything for me. I am very glad I stuck around. This final stretch has really taken off in a way that, provided they finish strong, would make up for the otherwise okay-at-best first quarter, and, well, the sky is the limit.

Chiodos

Wed, 02-27-2008, 04:59 PM

Damn, you made me remember the clones...
..and the unexplaination of the term SEED.
No, no clones. I can't really take that.

The "Angels" part in this show, after tampering with the Veda himself..
..well, maybe we'll see another third-party, consisting the origins like Tiera and himself. They're might be this bad guy, who problaby the first nanomachine input human (or "upgraded") that has gone mad and well, want to just have this one race to dominate the "inferior" beings.
But I just may throwing stones on empty cans here.
Kinda..very farfetched and damn, I don't want any more Newtype intrigues.

Darknodin

Wed, 02-27-2008, 07:45 PM

Seriously though.. is this show officially slated for 50 eps? or 25?

Buffalobiian

Wed, 02-27-2008, 07:54 PM

Shinsen HD (http://bt.shinsen-subs.org/%5BShinsen-Subs%5D_Kidou_Senshi_Gundam_00_-_20_%5BBC645DAE%5D.mkv.torrent)

edit: It's good to see Sergei and Soma kicking ass now that they're on an even playing field, even if the suits look dull. I'm still trying to figure out whether Trinity is really connected to Alejandro or not. Livonze, rather than Nena, has show that he's a living computer like Tieria, so perhaps it was him who hacked through the security and let her into the terminal, and also disengaged Tieria's program. Thing is, there isn't an obvious connection between L/Ragna and Alejandro yet, only their smug grin when something happenes. Saji's dad has something to do with Kinue's obsession in discovering what's behind CB. Maybe he was a scientist abducted last generation, or he was also a reporter who found some lead on a secret organisation and got assassinated. Ironically, Kinue headed down the same path.

DDBen

Thu, 02-28-2008, 12:02 AM

To me this episode seemed really out of place. In show they stated what 3 days passed? Yet in that time your telling me 30 Gundams were made from scratch in I'll assume 3 different designs and transported to the 3 main powers on earth? Seriously thats just moronic even IF CB gave them suit designs as well as the drives it still seems completely out of plac to have HRL with 10 battle ready Gundams that can completely ignore the thrones and just happened to be stationed at a different base within what a 10 minute flying distance from the random one being attacked? Even if Ragna did it as a setup its at the least bit questionable the suits were complete so fast.

Saji is still being boiled down into a worthwhile character in this series as so far he's a random side plot thats yet to really manage to accomplish anything. I mean big surprize of all the random characters involved in his story the most girly is likely to become important. His sister being killed should just make the plot quicker as its one less side plot to slow it down.

Overall this was just alright for me and I actually think they need to slow the plot down a bit or do a bit more extensive time skips in order to make this even remotely able to buy some of the latest plot advancements.

The rest with Veda being on the dark side of the moon and Wang Liu Mei is just wait and see stuff as the actions of both parties are pretty random and only understood to those involved. Ali is getting a gundam that goes without saying and in the end he's clearly the Char of the series he will live until the end always being a pain and be the final battle opponent for Exia.

Kraco

Thu, 02-28-2008, 03:17 AM

To me this episode seemed really out of place. In show they stated what 3 days passed? Yet in that time your telling me 30 Gundams were made from scratch in I'll assume 3 different designs and transported to the 3 main powers on earth? Seriously thats just moronic even IF CB gave them suit designs as well as the drives it still seems completely out of plac to have HRL with 10 battle ready Gundams that can completely ignore the thrones and just happened to be stationed at a different base within what a 10 minute flying distance from the random one being attacked? Even if Ragna did it as a setup its at the least bit questionable the suits were complete so fast.

The three powers each got 10 drives and 10 mobile suit frames compatible with the drives (thus they are ugly; they didn't design them by themselves). Even today any important big country would have enough transport capacity to move something like that anywhere in the world in 3 days. I don't see how that's "just moronic" in the future.

And if Lagna gave the Throne the next target, it's entirely possible he purposefully gave them one right next to where the HRL Gundams were located. After all, by giving the three powers Gundams, he was already planning to have them confront the CB and Throne so what difference does it make when it happens? Even just right away.

DDBen

Thu, 02-28-2008, 07:35 AM

The three powers each got 10 drives and 10 mobile suit frames compatible with the drives (thus they are ugly; they didn't design them by themselves). Even today any important big country would have enough transport capacity to move something like that anywhere in the world in 3 days. I don't see how that's "just moronic" in the future.

And if Lagna gave the Throne the next target, it's entirely possible he purposefully gave them one right next to where the HRL Gundams were located. After all, by giving the three powers Gundams, he was already planning to have them confront the CB and Throne so what difference does it make when it happens? Even just right away.

clearly you didn't read my post based on your comments here Kraco because I didn't simply state they couldn't move them in 3 days. Its the fact they went from nothing to having 10 battle ready mobile suits in under 3 days. On top of that they didn't even take apart one of the suits in order to check out the new technology which is the first thing any nation would do being 10 or 9 suits is likely to get the same results.

I'd take screen shots but I'm having issues with doing it from media player classic.

from episode 19
at 22:14 we see the back and sides of the room with GN drives we see the drives are all close together over little holes each the size of the drive and round. They are not attached to mobile suits.
at 22:19 we see a closeup and pan of the drives and still no frames or frame weapons in sight.
at 22:20 we see then entire GN drive from bottom to top and it is NOT attached to a suit and with how the walls are there is no magical adjacent room full of suits.

rechecking over it they do claim they came randomly came installed in mobile suits but...

in episode 20
at 7:02 of episode 20 we do see the GN drive being shipped with a mobile suit that it appears to just plug into the baco of but that suit didn't come from the same place they got the drive and it didn't come installed. The suit is of course MUCH larger then the drive and in no way fit in the room they got the drives from in episode 19.

Noting when they fight throne they suddenly have all GN weapons the only way thats possible is if they were given the suits and weapons as well. The question remains when and where did they get these suits as it wasn't Antarctica with the GN drives. Plus I find it VERY unlikely all 3 of the earth powers got 10 of the same suit just based on model kit sales I'd assume there are 3 new types of suits.

I'm sorry but that just feels rushed and I certainly feel we needed another episode and a time skip before this one took place it just feels like a episode is missing.

Kraco

Thu, 02-28-2008, 09:02 AM

Well, my assessment of the situation was based on this scene:

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1884/suitswiththeminstalledwd9.jpg

As far I can comprehend, it indicates they got both suits and the drives. Whether it was wise of HRL to send all of the ten or just most of them is another matter. Strategically it always makes sense to use clear superiority in numbers and strength. Not only it makes the victory more sure but it can also reduce the chances of casualties. And it's not like after this one interception mission they wouldn't magically anymore have the possibility to take one unit apart to study it. 30 minutes here or there isn't going to change anything when studying such a tremendous thing.

Yukimura

Thu, 02-28-2008, 10:53 AM

Since the topic of discussion is about unrealism you guys seem to have forgotten the complete lack of training time. Other than super soldier Soma I find it hard to believe any of the pilots could have become familiar enough with the new suits to fight in them effectively in such a short time. It's safe to assume that the pilots selected were all very experienced (or engineered in Soma's case) so they'd probably be candidates to test new high performance equipment anyway, but is it really wise to send test pilots into combat in untested hardware that they've only had a few days to get accustomed to? And then to have them performing complex maneuvers (Sergei's kick, Soma's dodging) when they don't even know the limits of their machines...it just reeks of typical Gundam immaculate piloting skill and I think it deserves some haterade from the realism camp as well.

And remember when the three powers hatched their 'full proof' plan to capture the Gundams and it got ruined by unknown elements. Prudence should have dictated they hold back something in reserve lest a heretofore unseen element be brought to the battlefield that overpowers even their new squadron. The HRL should have had the plans as well, but they should know that construction of a new suit is certainly not the same as having a working one already built.

shinta|hikari

Thu, 02-28-2008, 11:05 AM

The premise for the sudden ease with which they pilot the mobile suits is simple. It pilots the same way, only better. Its like being given the same ps2 control pad, with the previous one being old and worn down, while the other is new. It just means that they were being limited by the machines before, and that not much (or nothing) has changed with how to control it.

Yukimura

Thu, 02-28-2008, 11:31 AM

Note: I'm playing devil's advocate here, I have no problem with immaculate Gundam skills.

Gundams are much faster and more agile than the suits currently out there, thus the same control motions that worked on an old suit should produce much more of an effect in the new suits (barring any calibration limitations) and it's not like any of these new pilots have ever had a suit that can respond as well as a Gundam.

In the case of Soma, I can see it not being as hard since she's used to feeling held back by her hardware. However all the other pilots are used to what they had before and used to it being the best available. When they push the throttle forward X amount they are used to their suit responding by moving a distance of Y. On a Gundam the same X motion on the controls is not going to produce a mere Y position change unless all of the enhanced abiilites of the Gundam have been calibrated out before hand. Since the new Gundams were keeping pace with the Trinities I think it's safe to assume these suits have not been calibrated to respond like old Tierens but to respond like Gundams. For that reason there should need to be time for them to get acquainted with the enhanced abilities of the new suits so that when the wanted to move the suit only Y distance they would have a feel for how much to push the new controls. It's like getting accustomed to playing an FPS with a standard mouse, then switching to a high performance mouse with the sensitivity set to maximum. Until you get used to it you're naturally going to overcompensate all over the place.

Kraco

Thu, 02-28-2008, 11:53 AM

You have valid points, Yuki, but you are forgetting one thing (although the series itself is forgetting it as well often enough). It's the future. Even today the most modern fighter jets would be useless in the air if their computer controls broke down. Now, something like a giant man shaped robot flying in the air wouldn't stay there for a second (or to be precise it would stay there for as long as it would take to drop down) without a highly sophisticated AI controlling system. We can thus assume the pilot has it actually pretty easy up there, probably much easier than the fighter or helicopter pilots of our days. And thus when they get a superior mobile suit, it will either fly steadily by an unexperienced pilot or perform crazy stunts by somebody like Graham, Ali or Soma. However, it won't crash down even if the pilot is somewhat unaccustomed to it because in the end it's the AI that's keeping it in the air at all in the first place.

What comes to the HRL decision, once again, the Throne was decimating one of their bases, killing people and destroying property and equipment. It might have been wise to be careful with their brand new equipment but you don't need to be a klingon to say avoiding the fight because of that would have been an epitome of cowardice and it would have sent many more people to their deaths if the Throne had been left unchecked in their murderous ways.

DDBen

Thu, 02-28-2008, 12:19 PM

The control system and magically being able to pilot them I give a little more lenience for a few reasons.

The first reason they actually had to Pilot the new suits from a secondary base to the one under attack. They didn't just come out of a hanger so they had a little time to adjust. That is assuming the controls are the same and as they only had guns and beam sabers with no special weapons used thats exceptable. Also only 2 of the HRL pilots did anything and those were both established characters who I can believe were good enough in a mobile suit to adjust while the rest just flew in formation and shot at the Thrones who didn't really even try and kill anyone else they just ran off to get more information.

@Kraco regarding that scene that is one of the ones I rechecked and I want to see what conclave/Mendo do with it. The scene just seems incorrect based on all of the visuals. a claim is made in the subs that they brought them mobile suit where the GN drives were already installed and thats not possible because of the scenes I mentioned in both 19 and 20. Its possible suits were also given to them at another location but I don't find it plausible they received suits and gn drives from the location shown at the end of 19. If they did receive the suits from somewhere else it would have been nice to see.

Now also note with these new suits. They don't know whats inside the GN drives. The GN drives are the kind used in the throne gundams with red particles and not the kind used in the original Gundams. So your talking about trusting these from the new more aggressive Gundams and putting your aces into them without even researching any of the suits? Everyone got 10 and being the HRL still had 10 nothing was taken apart to look for say remote self destruct devices nor did they determine how to recharge the GN drives which being they have red particles have a limited amount of operation time. Plus even if all 7.

As for your overwhelming numbers argument. 9 suits is still a 3 to 1 advantage over the thrones who you know have been acting on their own at this point so there is almost no difference between sending 9 or 10 of the new suits to play the numbers game.

Kraco

Thu, 02-28-2008, 01:13 PM

So your talking about trusting these from the new more aggressive Gundams and putting your aces into them without even researching any of the suits? Everyone got 10 and being the HRL still had 10 nothing was taken apart to look for say remote self destruct devices nor did they determine how to recharge the GN drives which being they have red particles have a limited amount of operation time. Plus even if all 7.

While I agree that sending 9 instead of 10 would probably have made no difference, the truth is that if they had sent 9 and studied the one remaining they likely wouldn't have learned anything at all in the insignificant time the operation took. So, it would have been practically speaking 9 suits in combat and one sitting at home.

Who knows about the translation. But if they needed to travel all the way to Jupiter to manufacture the blue GN drives, the red ones could also have peculiar requirements. The suits, however, probably can be manufactured anywhere. That's why it would even make sense if they were made in different places. And although the super powers have no intelligence services it would still make sense for the tycoon to disperse the manufacturing of common components here and there and then have the parts later put together somewhere else to make tracking their origins harder.

DDBen

Thu, 02-28-2008, 01:50 PM

I also agree the mission time alone would have made no difference in examining the suit/gn drive. However, we are not talking about a 30 minute window we are talking about 3 days at least of wasted time in not starting work to understanding the suit. My point here is do they have any spare weapons for these suits? If not they had better learn how to make them. They need to learn how long they can operate for without being recharged. They need to learn how to recharge them. They need to learn how to destroy the other Gundams and checking for a weakness in the GN drives might give them that edge. They need to learn if they are booby trapped for say remote detonation. There is tons of stuff that R&D should be looking into from the moment you find something like that even if you MUST use most of them in combat because you have zero other options to deal with the Gundams.

As far as GN drives go I believe ALL of them must be made on Jupiter the difference is the core power supply. Apparently the red ones have a limited amount of power output while the gold ones are able to operate independently forever. As all of the ones the Earth powers got are emitting red they are limited in there overall operational usage even if we have no idea what that time limit is.

Also I agree the suits can likely be made anywhere as far as we know the frame itself is nothing all that special all I said is it would be nice to have a better explanation of where they magically got 30 suits because it wasn't from the base at the end of 19. I mean its a given the had to also be handed the suits and weapons for those GN drives to have any use at all but I wish they took the extra time to explain where they came from. At this point we have never seen a GN drive destroyed for all we know you can't even blow them up so even just being able to make replacement frames for the GN drives you have could be extremely beneficial. Given if they were given plans to make the frames thats less relevant and you should only need to examine a GN Drive.

masamuneehs

Thu, 02-28-2008, 01:56 PM

i seem to have forgotten... where did they state how long it had been since the last episode? They've made it quite a habit to skip a considerable amount of time during some episodes, so I'd simply assumed that happened this time too.

also, I refuse to participate in the "realism" debate for this episode beyond this one sentence: "Is it really worth our time arguing?"

DDBen

Thu, 02-28-2008, 02:55 PM

From the looks of this episode the 3 powers immediately made the announcement after finding GN drives and presumably being given mobile suits. Then we saw everyones immediate reaction and them stating distro has gone well. That should have all taken place within at most a day. Then Trinity talks about how they have had no contact after the Gundam fight took place and say it will be 3 days until the next operation. As such its pretty safe to say this episode took place over 3 or 4 days time. There was also no mention of a time skip or interventions being done by anyone after the last episode.

They really could use time stamps under the location headings it would help this show out quite a bit. Note though if more time has passed it only makes more sense they would have dismantled and be examining one of the new suits/drives they were randomly handed. It does seem there was a one day delay on Trinity receiving orders so the new drives/suits could be distributed.

Kraco

Thu, 02-28-2008, 03:21 PM

I have no doubt they have all studied the new suits and GN drives. For example the screenshots I posted indicate the Union at least has been scanning them. The HRL should have been doing the same, logic alone dictates. But apparently they haven't been ready to possibly break one of the units by disassembling it. Yet. That's why it was all the same to send all of them to the battlefield just to make sure they have the absolute superiority of power, I deem.

DDBen

Thu, 02-28-2008, 03:47 PM

They have no way of even detecting Gundams due to the GN particles so what makes you think they can get anything from a scan of the outside of a GN Drive? If they could do that in any way they would have some way to locate Gundams aside from sending out thousands of probes and looking for what ones don't work. Those were essentially just pictures of it and provided no more information then they already knew from pictures of the Gundams. You can't understand technology thats decades ahead of anything you have with a quick scan you need to take it apart so you can figure out how it works while documenting everything.

Its possible you can't open a GN drive safely being they can only be made on Jupiter. Not only that but the unions head scientist is dead and the his apprentice is pretty heavily injured. Its somewhat possible though the union will be the ones to take apart a gundam in order to learn about the tech and due to the agreement they will share that information with the other powers but its fairly unlikely thats the reason.

Those screen shots could indicate almost anything and most likely all they really show is dimension for the external view entered into a cad like program.

Kraco

Thu, 02-28-2008, 04:48 PM

They have no way of even detecting Gundams due to the GN particles so what makes you think they can get anything from a scan of the outside of a GN Drive? If they could do that in any way they would have some way to locate Gundams aside from sending out thousands of probes and looking for what ones don't work.

The dormant drives don't seem to be emitting too much of those particles. The stealth abilities might very well be something the pilot needs to enable, or it might be due to the particles emitted when the drive is powered up and keeping a Gundam in the air; so, a side effect or purposeful alteretion of the particle properties. In any case I doubt anything else in a Gundam is so resistent to whatever scanning and probing methods they have. Just the drive (and the frame when it's surrounded by the particles emitted by the drive).

And I don't know why you say you can't detect a Gundam. They are bloody visible to the naked eye in full colour. That alone tells the particles readily let the whole visible spectrum of electromagnetism to pass. Who knows what other wave lengths not to mention totally different kind of scanning methods would be available.

But of course breaking one into pieces would be more useful. However, they are rare toys.

DDBen

Thu, 02-28-2008, 05:13 PM

Exvept the HRL already captured Kyrios in the past so any quicky scans they could have managed on a dormant Gundam would already have taken place. They couldn't really figure out anything when they had him however so aside from pictures I think its safe to say you can't just run up and scan a Gundam without proper CB technology. As when Captured Kyrios wasn't emitting the particles yet still resistant to anything they attempted to from cutting it open to finding a way to open it.

These Gundams of course seem to be more of the knock off variety so certain parts of that may not matter and the suits were not originally attached to the suits so they might have been able to scan those. Regardless of that though the drive makes particles and whatever the particles are made of is what prevents scanning so internal pictures of one of the GN drives would have to be completely impossible without taking the thing apart. Everyone has been trying to get a hold of a Gundam for this entire series to attempt to reverse engineer one so them ignoring that option as soon as they get some is totally illogical

Also I'm sorry but I still kind of see the free Gundams as some form of trojin horse I just don't see what CB hopes to gain by handing out 30 suits like that in the first place.

Kraco

Thu, 02-28-2008, 06:01 PM

KrayZ33

Fri, 02-29-2008, 12:50 PM

woohoo these new gundam look awesome don't they? i wonder if they all look like this, or if the union etc. have different ones.

DDBen

Sat, 03-01-2008, 12:28 AM

The CB? I was under the impression they were given to the three powers by the railway tycoon. Lately I've been believing he doesn't much care for any ideology behind the CB. Well, of course we don't know everything yet, so who knows, but I think he had a reason to give those 30 units, and the reason isn't anything as stupid as to blow them up afterwards. The three powers have unlimited mansupply, unlike the Throne or the CB, and so losing 10 pilots wouldn't be that big of a deal, even if Graham has been established as an exceptional pilot. But the Union alone probably has thousands of pilots so given a chance, they likely would have 50 Grahams if they needed.

The 30 units could be a trap of a far more elaborate nature, though. Like to bound the three powers somehow if they feel those units are their only hope. We don't simply yet have enough information.

in case you missed it the Railroad tycoon is part of CB. Its also clear the Gundams were handed out to the powers as "stage 3" of whatever is trying to be accomplished in order to change the world. Stage 3 obviously happens whenever the stage 1 Gundams fight the stage 2 Gundams.

What any of this means your guess is as good as mine but it was certainly part of the plan to hand out the Gundams and not a completely random action by a individual.

@KrayZ33

I can't believe there are not going to be 3 different models 1 for each major power there is no way they would pass up a chance to sell more model kits with a Gundam series.

Chiodos

Sat, 03-01-2008, 06:41 AM

I can't believe there are not going to be 3 different models 1 for each major power there is no way they would pass up a chance to sell more model kits with a Gundam series.[/QUOTE]

I thought that the more the merier when it comes to model kit selling.
Like buying the "Three New Superpower Suit Set".

Atleast they had that idea in Gundam SEED/Destiny, giving almost everyfreakingpilot a new suit every half'n'hour.

Ryllharu

Sat, 03-01-2008, 07:49 AM

I thought that the more the merier when it comes to model kit selling.
Like buying the "Three New Superpower Suit Set".
They're mass production models (well, "mass production" of 30 for Gundams is pretty impressive). Gundams in G were all individually hand-created and maintained, not too unlike CB's secretly created with the true Solar Furnaces. I don't think the ones Billy and Graham where looking at were any different.

---------------------

But, if anime has taught me anything, being mass production models, they'll either get possessed by the enemy, forcing Setsuna to kill his good friend Saji (who secretly became a pilot) or all go berserk and eat Tieria because he is a tsundere and too pretty for his own good.

Everon

Sun, 03-02-2008, 08:39 AM

I was under the impression that the "mass produced" gundams were also created by the Celestial Being Traitor (not just the GN drives). I'm sure the different nations will develop their own custom models in the months to come. We've got lots more episodes left.

Man, they just keep pilling unfortunate accidents on Sagi. Give the man a break!

Chiodos

Sun, 03-02-2008, 04:59 PM

I do hope we see a time jump through the season change. It doesn't really have to be more than two years or so.

Positive side is that Saji wont be the engineering brat that gets his own suit in space like many other series... Atleast he has put a few years on his mind.

Fanboy-ism: Graham, the man who's clinging onto his own pride, will have his (and others) upgraded, duh!. Maybe he finaly has to swallow a lil' of his own to have his suit somehow custom made with GN-whatevers.

Negative side are though extremly heavier......
They need to upgrade the current regular suit for each military power, upgrade the current Gundam and special suits.
An outwar is can also be an effect being now that each country trying to stand on it's own by having the newer military equipment, thus making CB's first plan a failure (wich they WILL try to repair by wierd means).
The problem is just open scale war, flashy-dashy scenes and lesser plots and many other things looses it's meaning..

Overall, a new party is introduced or they introcuse more homies into Alejandro's gang.

The Trinities, who are introduced as the evil onces..they still really has no position in the series ecxept being dumb, annoying and more a harder wall to break.
Firstly, will they join the evil ones and secondly join the good ones, now knowing their mistake?

Eh =) ?

...or maybe my thoughts, guesses and speculation forever stained by Gundam SEED Destinys flaw..

Damn, I need to sleep.

Ryllharu

Sun, 03-02-2008, 05:30 PM

You need to watch something that doesn't take itself seriously, and is full of pointless destruction and violence. You need G Gundam.

I can't see Saji becoming a pilot, but rather a sidekick/equivalent to Billy (maybe, maybe not in one of the other nations). He's an engineering brat, but he has no skill for piloting, and Anno Domini has been going for the more sensible route of pilots needing at least a few years of training to be anything decent. Granted, the Gundams do seem to aid their pilots a lot, but look at Patrick. The AEUs "ace" (though I wonder if Kathy Mannequin is better than he is) but he gets owned by everyone.

Graham might get the Overflag retrofit with one of the fake furnaces, but if you think about it, all he needs is something to be an inertial compensator like the all GN furnace units have. If he could take any less of a beating, there would probably be no one that can take him on.

I want to see Soma return to her Taozi. Now that she has the new suit, it doesn't seem too likely, but she didn't get enough action in it. I still think it has the potential to take the severe beatings of the Gundams and maybe show them up, but the old suit needs better armaments.

I don't know what Alejandro is up to, but I'm sure that Libbons (Livonvze, however you want to spell it), is using him. Perhaps once he is done with him, Libbons will move on to Wang Luimei, who seemed to approve of their methods anyway. She's turned rather abruptly.

I kinda want Tieria to go full blown feminine. He's been "softening" up recently, and if Nadleeh's going to get more action, it just seems likely.

But then we've got Setsuna. He's gonna turn pacifist. I just know it...

Buffalobiian

Sat, 03-15-2008, 05:28 PM

Finally.

Menclave HD ep20 (http://bt.mymenclave.com/torrents/%5BConclave-Mendoi%5D_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_00_-_20_%5B1280x720_H.264_AAC%5D%5B64574C72%5D.mkv.tor rent)

Maverick-DBZ-

Sun, 03-16-2008, 02:05 AM

This is why I always wait for Menclave! Did you guys checkout the first 54 seconds? WOW. Also the translation of the GN drives on the screen at 6:11, loved it!

Yukimura

Sun, 03-16-2008, 01:28 PM

I loved the error at 9:32!

masamuneehs

Sun, 03-16-2008, 01:32 PM

couple things I hadn't noticed or that Menclave's translations uncovered:

Ragna Harvey, as thought, supplied not only the GN Drives but also the mobile suits to the three powers.

The conversation with Ali (I'm still calling him Ali, too many names) and Harvey really implies that Ali has some serious info about what is going on with CB, the Thrones, and probably Alejandro. It'll be interesting to see where he gets it all from...

I also noticed that when he was asking Ragna Harvey to get him one of the GN Drive equipped mobile suits, Ali asked to be placed into the AEU or Union, but left out the HRL. Does this have something to do with his past, or maybe shows that the HRL has something on him? You'd think he'd take any opportunity he could get to obtain one of those suits... And I don't think it has to do with Harvey not having influence in the HRL, as I believe most of episode 3, with the CB pilots and their Gundams being transported up into space, took place at the HRL's orbital elevator.

Also, and it came to me before, but I never mentioned it because it wasn't an issue after this episode, but there was a very strange time skip between Ali revealing his secrets to Kinue (notice he also says that he kidnapped Setsuna as a kid, not just trained him) and her "death" scene. It goes from midday and sunny to night and raining, and it's at that time that Ali makes the call saying he got rid of her. That's an awfully long time with a "pretty" woman who you've told so many things to...

Also, I really should have looked more closely at the transition between the short scene of Sagi's after returning to his apartment and the scene with Kinue out in the rain. The parrallel symbolism going on should really have left no doubts.