Gundam 00 Episode 09

[Buffalobiian]

Menclave's releases this week:

HD (http://bt.mendoi-fansubs.com/torrents/%5BConclave-Mendoi%5D_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_00_-_09_%5B1280x720_H.264_AAC%5D%5B8F40646C%5D.mkv.tor rent)

SD (http://bt.mendoi-fansubs.com/torrents/%5BConclave-Mendoi%5D_Mobile_Suit_Gundam_00_-_09_%5B704x400_H.264_AAC%5D%5BB394CC1A%5D.mkv.torr ent)

[TheBladeChild]

dangit you beat me to it

[Ryllharu]

Mods: Please add a "0" in front ofthe 9 for convention's sake? I forgot that. thnx
Just edit your post in advanced mode. The thread title is aptly under "Title:"

[Darknodin]

Awesome ep! (i'm actually rooting for HRL)... and Neil's twin?

[Ryllharu]

[spoilers below]


Definitely agree, fantastic episode. It just goes to show that a coordinated effort led by apparently a great war hero (Sergei) can oppose CB. I didn't expect that Soma's new suit would protect her and still mess with H/Allelujah. The HRL also went all out and made her a nice cockpit.

I don't read the manga, so I was surprised by Felt's admission that both her parents were Meistars. How come no one heard of CB until now? They must have gone on missions if her parents ended up dead.

[TheBladeChild]

[spoilers below]


Definitely agree, fantastic episode. It just goes to show that a coordinated effort led by apparently a great war hero (Sergei) can oppose CB. I didn't expect that Soma's new suit would protect her and still mess with H/Allelujah. The HRL also went all out and made her a nice cockpit.

I don't read the manga, so I was surprised by Felt's admission that both her parents were Meistars. How come no one heard of CB until now? They must have gone on missions if her parents ended up dead.

CB must have been more a underground group until now. I guess this is the first time that they announced their precence to the world. Im interested in what that UN/CB guy is planning to do with Azadistan.

[Shinji Ikari]

This is the first good episode. Finally do we se glimps about who the characters are. Before this everything has been like a lecture of how the politics of the world works with no character in the center. Really crappy in that way compared to Seed and Destiny. Hope CB gets their asses kicked, they are just too arrogant.

[Yukimura]

Great Ep, I'm surprised at how early in the series CB is getting the heat put on it. But it's good to see that they aren't any smarter than any of the other groups they fight against, they just happen to have much better technology. Christina freezing up like that was awesome too, she may talk a big game but of all the CB memeber she always struck me as the least suited for the grittiness of battle. They really need to just send her to the intelligence cell of CB.

The preview has me really excited. Hallelujah makes another appearance and the last time a Gundam had its arms and legs bound like Virtue did it whipped out funnels (AKA bits AKA DRAGOONs AKA little mind controlled rocket propelled lasers) and ruined quite a few peoples day. If that's Virtue's hidden ability it would be awesome.

[masamuneehs]

so, wow, they did a bit of a time skip... even though you can sorta see how each of the first eight episodes may have represented a half of a month each.

It's nice to see someone acting. Go HRL, go!!! (I was rooting for them)

Did anyone notice that strange piano variation music playing very softly in the background while the Gundams were docking and then the awkward sequences with Setsuna? He and Tieria so want to fuck each other... (not really)

A shit ton of good background in this episode. We learned a lot about Felt and Lockon, not to mention how CB operates. I like how the relationships between CB members are rather open and direct with the love connections in a strange way. It's refreshing to not see so many 'secret crushes'.

"Are we really going to fight? This ship isn't armed!" This made me lol, as it was the most absurd strategical setup flaw for CB from way back when the MS designs and the Ptolemaios design were shown in model kits and promos....

Can we please talk about how awesome the HRL was in this episode? Setting up such a massive net to catch CB (although they could have used more mobile sutis, it seems to me...), using the transports as diversions, then the kamikaze transport ship, those were all absurdly sweet moves. The minefield should have straight up destroyed the Kyrios. It was simple protagonist BS advantage that Hallelujah survived such a trick.

And, I was totally wrong, Hallelujah and the HRL girl's connection simply exists because of their own nature... It wasn't initiated by anything more than them being in close proximity last time...

This show is kicking ass.

what isn't cool is the possibility of Lockon having some separated twin brother. (from the sequence before the OP) The soap opera character cliches still loom with the threat of ruining this thing.

[Buffalobiian]

They guy who took over Christina's shift wasn't too bright. He looked straight at the error panel, and went "All's well!"

So with all of CB's infiltrating intelligence, they didn't pick up anything about this surprise attack. Guess I'll add secrecy to HLR's awesomeness, or maybe just Sergei's. So the incident was Sumeragi's failure. They got me good. Sumeragi's still one of the top strategists to me in the series, but I always thought they talked about her and that incident in a positive way. Now we see why the professor and Billy were worried about her thoughts of it. She probably caused a catastrophe of some nature, and was mentally shocked by it for some time.

And if you thought one Haro was good..... meet the siblings!

@Ryllharu: thanks for the tip.

[animus]

The brain-flash zippy thingy that goes on between the HRL lieutenant and Allelujah is pretty stagnant throughout Gundam. Like Mwu and Kreuze in Seed, and a character in Gundam X. They're newtypes or whatever. And that usually involves controlling probes like the Dragoons. So maybe Allelujah/Hallelujah has that? But then again, there must be a reason why Virtue is so fat and bulky. Maybe it's cause of it's huge frigging gun, so he needs a lot of mass to keep him grounded, maybe he has those Dragoon thingies. But so far Tieria's Gundam seems to be the blandest one having shown only one attack and that's it's big gun.

Kyrios can transform from plane to Humanoid, fire lasers, have a gun. Stratos has a sniper rifle, dual pistols and those mini-missiles which were introduced this episode that released GN Particles? while it imploded that Kamikaze ship. And Exia just has like a million swords, a shield, and a laser gun built into one of his swords.

[Ryllharu]

Remember how pissed Tieria was after H/Allelujah saved the space module? He wasn't angry that Allelujah used Kyrios to save the people (though a little bit at that), but he was really angry that Lockon had to help, thus revealing that Dynames could shoot shit out of space from the ground. Tieria is by far the most disciplined and fervent of the Meistars. He hates being on the ground, is very strict on policy, and so far, hasn't gotten out of line.

I'm sure Virtue, being the big fatty, has something really strong hidden. If the super beam cannon is the weapon Tieria is willing to expose.


@Buffalobiian: Guess it didn't work in the end. It may be that having replies at all prevents you from editing the actual thread title.

[masamuneehs]

Ryll's point makes so much sense that it's fully convinced me Tieria's Gundam will have funnels. I never liked the inclusion of Funnels (or Bits or Dragoons or whatever you want to call them) in Gundam, because it usually takes some of the amazement out of watching a fight and just adds more flashy lasers and explosions. I mean, when you can attack from 5+ free-floating points, it makes getting out of jams too easy... I'd rather see strategy...

Also, I was pretty sure Sumeragi's "incident" was a bad one all the way through, mostly from facial expressions and tones used when people talked about it. I'm wondering if Alejandro Corner was involved and if that marked Sumeragi's breaking point with the Union...

More Haro's... I don't like that. One is enough for comic relief.

So some wild thought came to my mind. Saji's girlfriend is pretty stupid and flaky and all that. But this episode confirmed something about her and gave us new information. First, we learned that her mother has ins with EAU politicians, or at least one of them. Second, it's confirmed that Louise is the kind of girl who dreams of "the knight in shining armor coming to her rescue", or at least wants to be with a guy who is all about protecting her and standing up for his manliness (when it suits her interests)

So, combine those two and I think Louise's mother's political involvement is going to get her caught up in some terrorist / hostage crisis, which she'll be saved from by one of the Gundam pilots who she'll then fall in love with. Saji seems more and more to be leaning against CB and their agenda, so it might just be the straw that breaks the camel's back for her to go gaga for one of their guys...

Or Louise might take advantage of Saji and his sister to get info / get close to CB, considering the guy is completely pussy-whipped despite them probably not having sex yet...

[Ryllharu]

But this episode confirmed something about her and gave us new information. First, we learned that her mother has ins with EAU politicians, or at least one of them. Second, it's confirmed that Louise is the kind of girl who dreams of "the knight in shining armor coming to her rescue", or at least wants to be with a guy who is all about protecting her and standing up for his manliness (when it suits her interests)

So, combine those two and I think Louise's mother's political involvement is going to get her caught up in some terrorist / hostage crisis, which she'll be saved from by one of the Gundam pilots who she'll then fall in love with.

Or Louise might take advantage of Saji and his sister to get info / get close to CB, considering the guy is completely pussy-whipped despite them probably not having sex yet...I didn't even give what Louise's mother said a second thought. Very observant. She's already been involved in one crisis, one Soma caused, and then her near proximity to the terrorist bombings...Louise is probably a magnet for terrorists, and now there is a reason for it. She's not just the daughter of someone with ins to the AEU, we already know she's a very wealthy ojou-sama. Kidnapping seems almost definite now.

I'm not convinced of seeing her rescued by a CB member yet. Unless it is one of the moron operators. Tieria wouldn't give a shit, Lockon has Felt ( ^_^ ), and Setsuna...is at least connected to Marina. That doesn't leave H/Allelujah out of the question though. Though he's got a connection to Soma already (at least in how they were created), Hallelujah is enough of an asshole to appease her overbearing personality, and Allelujah is already her "knight in shining armor."

[rockmanj]

Well, Im not gonna weigh in anything too heavy yet, but isnt Felt like 14 years old?

[Ryllharu]

I've accepted that fact.


Any affection for her is more a 'cute' thing than anything else. She satisfies the moe requirement this season. Look who you compare her to aboard the ship.

[TheBladeChild]

I loled at when Alleluia caught Felt and Lockon together. Thought Lockon seems like more of a big brother to her at most. I was surprised to find out that Wang Liu-Mei is actually older then Felt. I thought they were about the same age. Anyway I like to hear more about her parents seeing as they were Gundam Meisters.

[masamuneehs]

Pretty sure the story about the second generation Celestial Being members is the subject of a manga or other, isn't it?

Also, I forgot to mention one thing that I really liked about this episode: there was maintenance being done on one of the Gundams, and it affected their combat ability. I really like when they try to get down to gritty stuff like that, even though Dynames supplied more than adequate support gunning from the flagship.

[Buffalobiian]

How old is Wang Liu-Mei? She's underaged, that's all I know.

Also, Christina cried out to Allelujah when she was distressed. The fact that she didn't yell out to Tieria indicates her attraction for Allelujah is more comparative to Tieria, but is that saying much?

[KrayZ33]

whats so special in this episode? i found it rather boring....
somehow i found episode 7 and ... uhm was it 3 or 4 (when he fought against that blonde?) much more entertaining..

i mean... i don't even understand the reason why they didn't equip anti-ship weapons... i mean come on, they didn't even try to fight the gundams so whats the reason for their anti-mobile equipment? and with their mothership destroyed it would have been much easier to capture the CB-suits since they can't hide in the orbit anymore and they would have lost their commanding and operation center..they would even have got a suit (well... they couldn't have known ) because Lockon can't move away from the ship and the explosion of the ship would have thrown him most likely into space.

and if their intention was to capture a suit, why didn't they overhelm one of the diversion (virtue or this airplane one,forgot the name...) instead of attacking the mothership (without the right equipment) were at least 2 Gundams are waiting + the diversion which are on their way back to the ship after they destroyed THEIR diversion... this is just nonesense.. or do i miss something?

or is the attack on the ship just the "real diversion" and they try to capture this air-plane-gundam?

[masamuneehs]

huh, Krazy brings up some tactical points that really do make you question Sergei's "brilliance". It's clear that he's trying to capture the Gundams... but you would think destroying the Ptolemaios would be part of that...

but, now that I think about it, you may be right when you say all we saw in this episode is Sergei's own diversion... holding back the Ptolemaios (no way that he knew they didn't have any serious firepower on the ship... in fact, you'd almost have to assume that a ship belonging to a group as technologically advanced as CB would fuck your day up...) while trying to capture the Virtue or Kyrios (the airplane looking one).

Either way, one thing is clear, and that's that Sergei is spreading his forces to engage all the Gundams at once. This seems absurdly risky. I understand that you need to keep the Gundams from ganging up on you, and his strategy certainly keeps them relatively isolated and avoids getting flanked by the Kyrios and Virtue...

You'd assume they'd leave the Exia (clearly an anti-mobile suit Gundam) and Kyrios (fast enough to probably escape no matter what) and go for the slow Virtue or the Dynames. Both of those units seem to be weaker in close combat. They're both hard to get at initially because of their incredible range, but once you swarm them...

[Buffalobiian]

When they have overwhelming suits like they have, Sergei decided to divide and conquer. If he focused all his troops onto one target, like Sumeragi thought he would, then she would surround him using a pincer manoeuvre(if he attacked the mothership), or she'd have the other gundams launch an attack at their exposed backs (if they attacked one of the gundams in front). Now that they've split up, Sergei can attack each gundam specifically using data they've collected from previous battles to pinpoit each gundam's weakness, while at the same time, they can perform a co-ordinated attack due to their numbers.

edit: hmm, didn't see massa's post for some reason. He summed it up better. Oh well.

[KrayZ33]

well but they didn't send mobile suits to virtue... just an empty transport-vessel

so they attacked the mothership with nearly everthing (except for these ~6 suits and that pink one). and they KNEW that it was their ship and they DON'T shoot at the gundam but on the heavily shielded ship. so this can only be a diversion but what is the point of not bringing any anti-ship weapons with them and do some serious damage. they intend to destroy that ship (the kamikaze-attack proves that) so...

i understand that part with diversion and they did good when they lured that fast gundam (i think its kyrios?) into the minefield and blocked him. but they could have done so much better i think.

and i m not sure of the effectivity of a minefield but why didn.t they surround kyrios and lay minefields on his escape route... this would also cut of reinforcements... + they do need 6 minutes to actually get there which should be plenty of time for so many units... i mean when they think they are able to capture kiryos with only 6 mobile suits, they also should be able to caputer him with even more suits who are protected by a minefield.

the only one who could intervene is Virtue but he can do that now too...

well i think next episode will answer some of my questions, i still like gundam very much so no problem :P

but i wish they would stop making these awfully made fighting sences where a gundam fires 3-4 beams into space which do obviously miss and the mobile suits around these beams do "dodge skillfully".... it looks so stupid it makes me vomit.

i m happy that the enemies are at least a little bit skilled and not like in seed or so where only the main characters and 2-3 other can pilot a gundam... the rest do control their suits like a 4 years old girl.

mobile suit 1: pew pew
mobile suit 2: pew pew
mobile suit 1: destoryed
mobile suit 2: pew pew

or even better

Gundam: pew pew *slice and dice*
mobile suit 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9,.....20: *ahhhhhhh we are totally outmatched*

but in Gundam 00 it does at least LOOK like: skill > equipment and that's what makes this series worth watching and thats why i actually did like this episode a little bit :P (not very much but still worth watching!)

[shinta|hikari]

skill>equipment? I doubt that. Maybe if the gap in skill is way too large yes,but the equipment is by far the mostdecisive factor, and is technically CBs edge over everyone.

[Kraco]

The only people who have any skill in this series are those who have a name repeated at least a few times. If you don't have a name, you will pilot your mobile suit like a four years old girl and get killed instantly (no wonder, though, if you pilot like that). If you have a name, you will stay alive in a fight against the Gundams (though still not win, it seems).

And even if this particular space fight has so far looked a tiny bit better than the previous fights, I think it's far too premature to think this will be anything else but another act of comedy in the end. In almost all the previous battles we have seen so ultimately poor leadership and personal piloting skills that it would make even a soviet general cry out in horror.

[shinta|hikari]

Exactly.

[KrayZ33]

well that's why i said "the enemies are at least a *bit* skilled"

in gundam seed destiny 10 or 20 dropships deploy their suits which are killed in nearly a second when kira or so went on a rampage and shot 10000 lasers out of 4-5 guns.

and in this episode it did at least look like the normal suits are actually able to do something and the gundams even do miss! (not only in this episode but in the ones before too) in all the other gundam - series every shot was a direct hit which destroyed their weapon or the whole suit.

they simply dont die the same way again and again... its actually funny to see that someone in the background does get shot and loose his right leg or arm while the others are spreading out to make it more difficult to get hit. i m fine with gundams being much more superior but not as much as it was before... there was actually no reason for a army because one could destroy like thousands of them in one second..

if they keep that up i m fine with it... but when they are ending up forming exia to a second kira i will stop watching gundam forever
i mean look at episode one.. i m sure Exia would have lost if Lockon didn't help him and there only ... hmm let me guess... 6 mobile suits?

as long as they work as a team they seem very strong but this proofs that one alone can't do much... and thats good

edit: the gundams do have weaknesses!

exia is very weak in range combat, while lockon is very immobile when he is sniping (haro is controlling the suit while he aims)

i dont know the weaknesses of virtue and kyrios but i think very is very slow (yet powerfull) and kyrios does not have any defense abilitys (but he is very fast)

but yeah you guys are right when the equipment is totally outmatched (like in the first 2 episodes where the suits couldn't even aim at the gundams because they were so freaking slow) even the most skilled fighter won't win... its just the same in every online game *lol*


edit2: hmmm maybe its just the good animation that got me this time... i didn't see a repeated scene yet (while they were fighting)... i hope this wont change so soon

[TheBladeChild]

Ditto the animation is holding me this time, also the fact this is the first gundam series to be shown in HD :) which is why the mendoi subs have such awesome quality. Im liking what this new crew is doing to the series, as long as it doesnt turn into seed/gsd then ill be happy. So far it seems that Setsuna wont have a love interest. I cant see any of the girls in his age range[Wang(17),Louise(17),Felt(14)] ending up with him.Mariana is 24 so shes quite older then him and she seems more like an older sister if anything. I'd be glad if he didnt end up with anyone because I always hated the rule that the hero must have a woman thing in gundam.

[Ryllharu]

There is still a lot to do with skill. Did you forget about Setsuna's former mercenary/jihad leader? He didn't have an extremely tricked out Flag like Graham and he was far more effective at countering Setsuna. This is largely due to him being his teacher, but it does show that technology is not everything in this series.

Even Sergei used the dumpy HRL Generic Unit 07000 to put Setsuna into an uncomfortable position.

Now that the HRL and Union are coming up with better models, we should see the Gundams challenged quite a bit more.

[Yukimura]

Wasn't there something special about the mobile suit the AEU gave Ali? I remember it either being an experimental model or somehow customized to be better than a standard Enact. Anyway the way things have been established so far the current powers shouldn't be able to completely close the technology gap since that would require them to get GN particle technology. I don't think even the current CB actually understands how to create GN particles, just how to harness and utilize them.

00 is doing a decent job of making the pilots seem fallible and vulnerable, even to grunts, which is cool. But still the pilots don't completely suck, since awesome mechs with crappy pilots would just be depressing.

[TheBladeChild]

I just looked on Animenfo.com and it seems that S2 or Part 2 of this series will be released in October 2008, can anyone confirm this? If thats the case then S1/Part1 of this series will end about April. Dang 6 months gap is a long time. Well at least CG will start around that time. So I wont have nothing to watch :)

[Ryllharu]

There kind of has to be a break. Sunrise animates both Gundam and Code Geass. If one is starting up again in April, the other won't be running.

[TheBladeChild]

Well I guess im ok with the break, it just means(I hope) that the quality of the anime is better.

[masamuneehs]

I still don't understand how nobody is talking about Lockon's "twin brother" or whoever the guy hiding behind that tree at Lockon's parents' grave was.

Personally, I think it's an ultra lame plot device. It's like they're digging through some of the cheesiest anime character cliches ever. We have anti-social, robotic, emotionally challenged anti-hero protagonist who lets his emotions run wild. There's split personality who is also a designer baby and a reluctant fighter. We have a super femme who is also a complete asshole and stickler for the rules, probably because he feels guilt for some event that occurred before the series started and that he'll have to confront before the series end.

And we have the talkative "cool guy" who now also has a mysterious twn brother.

The main characters are seriously hodgepodges of absurdity.

[TheBladeChild]

I still don't understand how nobody is talking about Lockon's "twin brother" or whoever the guy hiding behind that tree at Lockon's parents' grave was.

Personally, I think it's an ultra lame plot device. It's like they're digging through some of the cheesiest anime character cliches ever. We have anti-social, robotic, emotionally challenged anti-hero protagonist who lets his emotions run wild. There's split personality who is also a designer baby and a reluctant fighter. We have a super femme who is also a complete asshole and stickler for the rules, probably because he feels guilt for some event that occurred before the series started and that he'll have to confront before the series end.

And we have the talkative "cool guy" who now also has a mysterious twn brother.

The main characters are seriously hodgepodges of absurdity.

Didnt you answer your own question? I dont find his brother particularly important and I agree with you that it is a lame plot device.

[Ryllharu]

But isn't that why we're attached to all the satellite characters? All of them have been far more interesting than anyone that actually pilots. We've got Soma and Sergei, the connection between Graham, Billy and Sumeragi, whatever screwed up way Louise fits into the story, Shirin (Marina's very politically savvy secretary), and all the other support characters that have proven more interesting.

I say let the pilots be lame cliches. They are only the blade that is directed by the rest of the cast.

[TheBladeChild]

But isn't that why we're attached to all the satellite characters? All of them have been far more interesting than anyone that actually pilots. We've got Soma and Sergei, the connection between Graham, Billy and Sumeragi, whatever screwed up way Louise fits into the story, Shirin (Marina's very politically savvy secretary), and all the other support characters that have proven more interesting.

I say let the pilots be lame cliches. They are only the blade that is directed by the rest of the cast.

Lol nicely put.

[masamuneehs]

I say let the pilots be lame cliches. They are only the blade that is directed by the rest of the cast.

do you really think that'll last though? (the part about them only being the blade). I dread the day when the pilots start spouting philisophical idealist nonsense and, in the words of the original Setsuna, "Acting on their emotions". Then again, it's possible I'm just completely expecting the worst because of how SEED turned out...

The main characters are the main for a reason. Even i'd be a bit pissed if they were pawns forever. I'm confident (and frightened) that they'll move on their own eventually.

[Kraco]

I'd be more surprised if none of the pilots had any siblings. People tend to have those, after all, except in China (and possibly Japan with it's ultra low birth rate).

[KrayZ33]

hmmm the pilots arn't japanese... at least not all of them

[Buffalobiian]

lame and boring may it be, I still hope they quickly explain Lockon's brother. Just why have they put him into this? I always thought the one under the tree was Lockon, since if he's with CB, he probably disappears now and then, or disappeared completely from everyone he previously knew, so when his brother came, he was surprised to actually see Lockon again.

[Naruto_RNG]

For the 1st time after watching so many gundam series, I want the gundams to fail, and this series might just as well give me that. A brutal utter defeat, by low class mobile suit. Very nice eps. I guess it finally gave the feeling to ppl who were waiting for the gundams to be in the "BAD" situation. again best eps so far, I know they're gona pull a 360 on us and gundams will win this somehow but I enjoyed my fill.

[shinta|hikari]

A 180. A 360 is a full rotation.

[Buffalobiian]

A 180. A 360 is a full rotation.

Didn't we have this argument somewhere before?

[shinta|hikari]

Haha, it wasnt with me though. I just read it before, with Ryll doing the arguing.

[Ryllharu]

I believe it was RyogaZell with whom I had the discussion. (If it wasn't, I'm sorry for thinking it was.)

However, careful wording does make a difference. A "turnabout" is definitely a 180. However, a "complete turnabout" can be both. From a literal standpoint, a "complete turnabout" is a 360. But from a literary standpoint, it still refers to a reversal, and thus a 180.

[Kraco]

From a literal standpoint, a "complete turnabout" is a 360. But from a literary standpoint, it still refers to a reversal, and thus a 180.

Really? What do you call then an indecisive action where someone first changes his opinion to the contrary, but then later is found to be back supporting the initial stance? Shouldn't that be a complete turnabout?

[Naruto_RNG]

I didn't mean to open up an argument. By saying 360 I meant to say that they have to come up with whole new plan to beat HRL which puts them back to squre 1 again, hence a full rotation. Sorry if it caused any confusion.

[Ryllharu]

@Kraco: I used "turnabout" not "turnaround" for a reason. Yes, a "complete turnaround" is a 360. a "complete turnabout" is still only a 180.

@Naruto_RNG: No, no, we had the argument long ago already. This is just me waiting for eps 10 to be subbed and being very, very bored.

[Kraco]

I used "turnabout" not "turnaround" for a reason. Yes, a "complete turnaround" is a 360. a "complete turnabout" is still only a 180.

Hmm... I suppose I see your point.