Naruto Chapter 364

[fahoumh]

"The Touch" at Mangahelpers posted these:

Spoiler 1 (http://img19.imagevenue.com/view.php?image=72611_vwtuvaki_1_122_1105lo.JPG)
Spoiler 2 (http://img22.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=72617_vwtuvaki_3_122_753lo.JPG)

Source thread: http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15642

So I guess Tobi is an Uchiha? Unless these are fake....

[Raven]

Hard to tell if they're real or not. If he does turn out to be an Uchiha that's no surprise to any of us, really.

[Assertn]

Oh holy Jesus Christ. Tobi is Uchiha Madara.

[KCMmmmm]

.....Does this mean I wont get bashed for suggesting a possible connection between Tobi and Obito....?

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

Oh holy Jesus Christ. Tobi is Uchiha Madara.

Could be, or maybe Obito like everyone said before?

[Idealistic]

Oh holy Jesus Christ. Tobi is Uchiha Madara.

Oh damn... That would be cool. A lot better than if he was Obito I would say.

But man, another Uchiha?

I'm hoping there will be more Naruto after the Akatsuki is gone? At least so it has room to add more variety of ninja in the show?

Too much Sharingan!

Maybe that's how Tobi wtfpwned that 3-tails. He used MS? (hint hint, 3 users of MS if Sasuke got his.)

What if Itachi already knows Tobi is Madara? And what if Itachi and Madara are both plotting something of their own? Then more about Itachi killing off the clan will be revealed. Perhaps Madara was his sensei? Maybe Madara is the corrupted one who threatened Itachi and made him kill off the clan.

Madara probably planned to kill off the clan and Itachi didn't want Sasuke to get hurt so Madara made Itachi kill off the clan himself if he wanted Sasuke to live.

OHHH another twist.

[Assertn]

Could be, or maybe Obito like everyone said before?
According to manga helpers, the second image says:


"My power.. The power of Uchiha Madara".

[KCMmmmm]

Yeah, but on the other hand, he may just be referring to the Sharingan as "the power of Uchiha Madara". I think it's most likely that he is Madara himself....but there is a possibility that it's just another passing reference.

In which case, I wonder how the Nine-Tails came into contact with Madara before. If "Tobi" is as young as he acts, then it must have been just before the demon was sealed that they met. OR, he acts childish to hide his identity....which would definitely make him a sort of spy.

Or, of course, the spoiler pics turn out to be fake.....but they look good to me.

[conquistaDan]

heres another

http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/8765/61naru364sj3mt9.jpg

[Kensee]

I'm glad as hell that Tobi is still alive. He'll be a character i like just cause he actually does have a sense of humor. Anyhow ... WHAT A TWIST!

[Assertn]

heres another

http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/8765/61naru364sj3mt9.jpg
I think the manga helpers guys were pretty sure that one was fake though.

Although if it wasn't......then it would surely prove my theory that Sasuke did in fact absorb Orochimaru into him.

Oh man......Just imagine a battle between Sasukemaru and Kabutoro =o

[chet_chetty]

Man I cant get enough of this Uchiha/Sharingan shit. Obviously Tobi is the one with the Sharingan eye in pic #1. But if we were to go with Kishimoto only introducing characters if they inevitably play a significant role in the story, Madara has to fit into this also.

With this whole symbiosis thing going on...if Sasuke is an Uchiha with the power and spirit of Orochimaru in him, there's a few possibilities with Tobi. it's quite possible Tobi is an Uchiha with the spirit of Madara in him. even more farfetched is Tobi is the reincarnation of Madara in the body of Obito.

Regardless, I'm really digging this suspense.

Even more we still got Itachi who is bound to be a wrench in the works of all this.

[conquistaDan]

Fresh from the block
(spoiler video:) )

http://youtube.com/watch?v=CmcAu5hwwBE

Enjoy

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

I dont get why they would leave Sasuke alive to avenge his clan when this other Uchiha is out there?

ps. This one is better. Looks like Naruto sees Pein.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=3rrB6k0Ev6E

[Assertn]

Because the other Uchiha isn't Itachi's brother!

Also....I'm sure most people think Madara is dead.

[uhicha neji]

2 Sharingan users in the same organization :confused: That seems like laziness on part of Kishi... I for one am not pleased that Tobi seems to be apart of the Uchiha clan :\

I hope those are false.

[Assertn]

2 Sharingan users in the same organization :confused: That seems like laziness on part of Kishi... I for one am not pleased that Tobi seems to be apart of the Uchiha clan :\

I hope those are false.
Yeah...laziness. These events are probably one of the most thought-out plot elements in all of shippuuden. Obviously, Tobi isn't part of the organization just to be an akatsuki member. Considering his interest in Sasuke, I'd guess that he joined because of Itachi.

[Koyuki]

We really need a scanlation. If Tobi is Obito. We'll probably see a Tobi vs Kakashi...
Kakashi will cry :)

Anyways: Isn't Uchiha Madara the one who fought Shodaime at the Valley of End?

[*Enlighten*]

2 Sharingan users in the same organization :confused: That seems like laziness on part of Kishi... I for one am not pleased that Tobi seems to be apart of the Uchiha clan :\

I hope those are false.

I agree it’s already enough having 3 Sharingan users known- Kakashi Saskue and Itachi now what it seems to be another Uchila to join the A-team......?? I'm not downgrading the uchila family when first introduce it was raw but ever since the MS saga started uchila’s is ultimately is gaining a God complex amongst the world of ninja

…. Like I said before the route that it’s going to if you don’t have a bloodline limit and special enhancement or a demon inside of you..You’re basically a bench warmer …. Needless to start naming ninjas that are regular but still bad ass… ?? Rock lee? Shikamaru? Jiaraya Useful and tactful but very limited

[itadakimasu]

when sasuke goes inside naruto.... what did the kyuubi say to him about being uchiha? i really cant remember and i'm not at home right now. like others have said, tobe really doesn't act like he is older which he would have to be to be this madera guy...
*waits anxiously for scanlation*
oh.... and we have not yet seen sasuke use the MS have we? dont think so.

its good that both the anime and the manga are both doing so well right now.

with bleach the manga is pulling all of the weight lately

[KCMmmmm]

I dont get why they would leave Sasuke alive to avenge his clan when this other Uchiha is out there?

ps. This one is better. Looks like Naruto sees Pein.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=3rrB6k0Ev6E

The "iLead" part was hilarious.

[*Enlighten*]

when sasuke goes inside naruto.... what did the kyuubi say to him about being uchiha? i really cant remember and i'm not at home right now. like others have said, tobe really doesn't act like he is older which he would have to be to be this madera guy...
*waits anxiously for scanlation*
oh.... and we have not yet seen sasuke use the MS have we? dont think so.

its good that both the anime and the manga are both doing so well right now.

with bleach the manga is pulling all of the weight lately

Nine-Tailed Demon Fox, said that Madara's chakra was even more sinister than its own at the time and that Sasuke now holds the same chakra.. nine tails demon said that "his charkra is cursed than the my own"... and no its not confirm that sasuke have the MS if he did then i believe he would of used it earlier when he fought deidera....
but he did look into deep with the body of naruto and spoke to the nine tail demon fox showing a deeper depth in S eye capabilities if he doesn't have it the MS speculation would say that he is almost there or he has it....but needless to say it wasn't mention that he aqcuire it. and Sasuke powers grow tremendously since the time jump becuase he knew that naruto had a demon but didn't know the extent when they fought at the waterfall ,but since the timejump Saskue had the ability to talk to the nine tails and supressed it to

[ChaosK]

Is anyone really surprised...?

I mean Obito=Tobi with an extra o.

Besides, having one eye hole would make sense considering kakashi took the other eye.

[kyubisrage]

Is anyone really surprised...?

I mean Obito=Tobi with an extra o.

Besides, having one eye hole would make sense considering kakashi took the other eye.


Yes but a huge boulder smashed his right eye and his right part of his body..

[conquistaDan]

Yes but a huge boulder smashed his right eye and his right part of his body..



Noooo, a huge boulder smashed what we think was Obito. Could've been a clone, or something else.

[KCMmmmm]

Noooo, a huge boulder smashed what we think was Obito. Could've been a clone, or something else.

I'm pretty sure if it was a clone, it wouldn't be possible to extract a true Sharingan from it.

[Yukimura]

Well, that could explain the metal body Tobi seems to have.

[Assertn]

Most translations based on unconfirmed chapter summaries and the spoiler images are refering to Uchiha Madara. I highly doubt they're going to draw any connection to Obito.

[KCMmmmm]

Most translations based on unconfirmed chapter summaries and the spoiler images are refering to Uchiha Madara. I highly doubt they're going to draw any connection to Obito.

Which is actually quite funny. If he couldn't be Obito, then I would have never guessed him to be a Sharingan user. Odd coincidence? Or did Kishimoto decide to play tribute to the Tobi=Obito theory by shooting it down and making him a different Uchiha? I mean this from the writer's standpoint, of course. I'm sure he's heard most of the theories and guesses regarding his work; why wouldn't he play around with them?

[Kensee]

So much discussion and there's not even a raw out. I'm curious how this will affect the storyline ... i'm thinking somethings just not gonna fit or they are going to have to explain the past a lot just to clear up the questions this'll bring.

[Zhan]

Obito changed his name to Madara :P hey it could happen.

[fahoumh]

EDIT: Found 3 more here, althought he last one seems to be just pieces of 3 other pages, the bottom piece has already been seen:

New - 1 (http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m231/fahoumh/bc4bacfeabc9427832eff63zq9.jpg)
New - 2 (http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m231/fahoumh/b5ee093e67dda8f7e6a1135zs2.jpg)
New - 3 (http://i105.photobucket.com/albums/m231/fahoumh/sanstitrevn2.png)

Source (http://hayakunoforum.forumactif.com/Manga-c8/Naruto-f3/Le-Manga-f31/Spoil-Naruto-Chap-364-t5942-45.htm)

EDIT: Imageshack seems to have taken down the photos due to "high bandwidth", I could only find the last 3 in my cache, the first one I couldn't as of yet. Sorry, everyone.

[Uberbaka]

Alternative and with no basis what so ever theory: Another Uchiha ninja gave one of their eyes to an outsider? =P Naw.

I doubt the boulder crushing obito would stop him in this case as we have never seen his body/face which might be totally mangled and took the damage instead of his eye. Let's remember how much regeneration these other people have gone through after all..

[*Enlighten*]

Obito changed his name to Madara :P hey it could happen.


I HIGHLY DOUBT THAT OBITO HAVE ANY CONNECTIONS WITH MADARA .... WHEN THE NINE TAILS ENCOUNTER SASUKE DURING THE CONNECTION HE DID WITH NARUTO ..HE SAID THAT HIS CHAKRA IS AS EVIL AND SINSTER THAT OF MADARA AND MORE EVIL THEN MY OWN THEN SASUKE SUPRESSED THE NINE TAILS... IF THE NINE TAILS KNEW OF UCHILA MADARA THAT MEANS IT WAS WEN THE NINE TAILS DIDN'T HAVE THE A HOST MEANING YEARS BEFORE THE SHOW STARTED AND NARUTO BEING BORN… THE WAY IT SEEMS THAT MADARA IS PRETTY OLD

[Koyuki]

I think it's safe to say it isn't Madara. (Not 100% sure, but I think Madara and Shodaime was friends.) It could be Obito.

*Enlighten*: Did you forget to turn of Caps-Lock?

[Assertn]

Can anyone find which chapter they mentioned the two statues where Naruto and Sasuke fought at?

Edit: Oh yeah, and new pic (http://photo6.hexun.com/p/2007/0727/115964/b_DC0A1BD34C6D0E293CE3C3F612566CBA.jpg)

[Koyuki]

Assertn: Chapter 218.

[*Enlighten*]

I think it's safe to say it isn't Madara. (Not 100% sure, but I think Madara and Shodaime was friends.) It could be Obito.

*Enlighten*: Did you forget to turn of Caps-Lock?


My fault..... i was kind of in a rush....... but yea i agree the chances of Madara and the Shodaime is a possibility but i'm leaning more to the 3rd acknowledgeing his existantance and was probably known of somewhat background but more than likely friends ?? i really wouldn't know... because the way it seems is , Madara had an evil chakra like Saskue

the theroy about Obito is really up in the air becuase really we never saw him die, kakashi and rin retreated thus leaving him breathing so there is possibilities' he could have live ....but the chances are very slim becuase he was left in the enemys hideout..... and those times was a time of war between the ninja clans... most likely he could've lived ...somewhat but mostly when found get excuted but who knows..... if anything Orochimaru could of found him and patch him up like he does to everything...experiments........ lol

[Koyuki]

My theory is that Madara and Shodaime was friends. Much like Naruto and Sasuke.

In the Naruto vs Sasuke arc Kakashi metion that their lives are remarkably like theirs (Madara and Shodaime). You can find the pictures of Valley of End in chapter 218 and 233. I think those are the best.

Madara betrayed Shodaime, and I think it's why fought.

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

My theory is that Madara and Shodaime was friends. Much like Naruto and Sasuke.

In the Naruto vs Sasuke arc Kakashi metion that their lives are remarkably like theirs (Madara and Shodaime). You can find the pictures of Valley of End in chapter 218 and 233. I think those are the best.

Madara betrayed Shodaime, and I think it's why fought.

I couldnt find in those Chapters where it stated that it was Madara that was the other statue. And if that was him fighting the first, wouldnt that make him REAL old?

[*Enlighten*]

My theory is that Madara and Shodaime was friends. Much like Naruto and Sasuke.

In the Naruto vs Sasuke arc Kakashi metion that their lives are remarkably like theirs (Madara and Shodaime). You can find the pictures of Valley of End in chapter 218 and 233. I think those are the best.

Madara betrayed Shodaime, and I think it's why fought.


i never once read or saw kakashi say anything about Madara .. what excatly is the chapter of when he mention it Koyuki just for clarity ????

[Koyuki]

No, that's my theory. My theory it that the man on the left side of Valley of End is Uchiha Madara. The one on the right is Shodaime.

http://home.no/zuluzion/valley.jpg

[itadakimasu]

the hair definately looks to be uchiha hair ;)

OOOooOoOoOooo Hebi minus sasuke encounter itachi and kisame?!?! omfg... we're about to experience a complete overload (in a goodway) naruto vs pein; hebi vs itachi / kisami !?!?! although i realise this could take another 30-40 chapters to complete, maybe more.

edit : i just remembered that sasuke is with hebi........ sasuke and itachi meeting !?

WHERE IS THE SCAN !?

[Koyuki]

Naruto 364 chn raw (http://www.datorrents.com/download.asp?id=24068&name=%5BRaw-Manga%5D%20Naruto%20364%28chn%29.torrent)

Zomg! Tobi is the leader!?

[*Enlighten*]

the hair definately looks to be uchiha hair ;)

OOOooOoOoOooo Heba minus sasuke encounter itachi and kisame?!?! omfg... we're about to experience a complete overload (in a goodway) naruto vs pein; heba vs itachi / kisami !?!?! although i realise this could take another 30-40 chapters to complete, maybe more.

WHERE IS THE SCAN !?


an Uchilia hair style or not.........i don't believe that its Madara Uchilia kakashi never mention Madara..... neither a connection to the 3 hokage, if it was true don't u think Madara would be mention somewhere down the line while the 3rd was alive???

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

Naruto 364 chn raw (http://www.datorrents.com/download.asp?id=24068&name=%5BRaw-Manga%5D%20Naruto%20364%28chn%29.torrent)

Zomg! Tobi is the leader!?

Not bad quality. Just wish that I knew what they were saying...
Manga helpers has this to say about it....
http://www.mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15642&page=3

[Idealistic]

I rather Tobi be Madara than Obito.... Being Obito is just dumb. Obito served his purpose for bring created already. Bringing him back would just screw up everything and then we'd have to deal with a emo Kakashi.

[Tsukasa]

Naruto 364 Raw (SS) (http://www.sendspace.com/file/oxopmn)

I'm loving the direction this manga is taking.

[toonice714]

THIS MANGA IS AWESOME!!!!!!! I cant believe tobi is the leader. So he must be uchiha Madara because ifthe kyubi thinks madara's chakra is more sinister than his it must be for a reason. He probably want all the power from the biju to make him a god or something. Its also kinda funny that he lets pein boss him around in front of everybody.

[Assertn]

Nah, I think its hilarious to imagine him running away from the 3 tailed bijuu even though he's the one plotting their capture.


Team Naruto + Team Kiba + Kabuto merging with Oro + Deidara + Sasuke + Suigetsu inheriting Zabuza's sword + Juugo as the Curse Seal origin + Pein Revealed + Tobi = Madara.....

Man, this arc sure delivers!

[Deadfire]

364 scan by Mangashare (http://www.mangashare.com/releases/Naruto_364%5BMS%5D.zip) and a mirror link here (http://www.proxydistro.com/files/naruto/364%5BMS%5D.zip)

Awesome chapter!

[Hikyuu]

Yum~ good chapterness..I hope tobi takes that mask off -.-

[fahoumh]

Wow, another intense chapter this week....! I would have never guessed Tobi was the mastermind behind Akatsuki.

[ody]

Jesus. Wikipedia has already updated the page and has Tobi as Madara and the mastermind behind Akatsuki.

[Idealistic]

Madara must also be the mastermind behind making Itachi kill off the clan.

My theory is that Itachi wants Sasuke to become strong enough to defeat Madara because Itachi can't. But to defeat Madara, he must be able to defeat Itachi. Though I think something will spark and Madara tries to kill Sasuke and Itachi takes the hit for Sasuke and Itachi dies.

And then Naruto will fight Pain.... 1v1 maybe?

Others will probably be occupied.

[ody]

By the way, I remember Itachi saying that if Sasuke were to obtain Mangekyou then three people would be capable of using it.

Itachi has Mangekyou and Kakashi does as well.

So this means that Madara doesn't have Mangekyou by Itachi's logic?

[big_ac]

Wait, I'm confused. The way the panels are structured leaves it ambiguous, so I'll go ahead and ask: Is Pain the girl with the hair flower or the dude with all the piercings who we used to think was the leader?

@ ody, Kakashi has his own version of Mangekyou Sharingan, and he uses the same name out of convenience. His Mangekyou has effects that differ drastically from Itachi's, so it is safe to assume that Kakashi is not one of the three.

[vejita613]

By the way, I remember Itachi saying that if Sasuke were to obtain Mangekyou then three people would be capable of using it.

Itachi has Mangekyou and Kakashi does as well.

So this means that Madara doesn't have Mangekyou by Itachi's logic?


No, at the time Itachi said that, Kakashi didnt have mangekyou. So, now that itachi, madara, sasuke and kakashi have it, that means there are now four people that can use the ability.

[FullMetalAlchemist]

By the way, I remember Itachi saying that if Sasuke were to obtain Mangekyou then three people would be capable of using it.

Itachi has Mangekyou and Kakashi does as well.

So this means that Madara doesn't have Mangekyou by Itachi's logic?


He stated that before he knew kakashi had/showed mangekyou. Madara is the one to first unlock it. My question is how old could he be if even the nine tails knows of him.

[chet_chetty]

I dont see where it's acknowledged that Tobi is really Madara.

[animus]

Man Tobi feels like Darth Sidious (or whatever) in those last 2 panels. I seriously hope he isn't Obito, cause if he is, until his intentions are known I'll be thinking "Man, Obito becoming an Akatsuki leader, not being a genius either, and apparently stronger than Kakashi, makes absolutely no sense to me."

[Assertn]

I don't think Sasuke has mangekyou.

[animus]

Yeah, I don't think he does either. Do you people not remember the episode/chapter where Sasuke did NOT kill Naruto and said he was going to take a different path from his brother's to get stronger, via Orochimaru. Also the fact that we haven't seen the visual difference in his eyes, or any of the abilities a Mangekyou user would have.

[Death BOO Z]

wow, now i reallly feel stupid.
I should have switched to team Sasuke years ago, then I wouldn't be so dissappointed to find that everytime we get a plot advance, it's about the Sharingan...

give me fuckin' break, more uchihas? and now they even ruined Tobi for us (He used to be cool, before going mega-villian), i'm not even going to talk about it. how can you be a ninja without depth perception? he has only one eye! he can't throw shurikens with that!

now, the things that do intrest me in this chapter.
the way to beat Suggi is with a tree fist, or something, a leach seed would do really good, since he avades direct attacks, using the wood element will sap out all of his water power, leaving him just a pretty weak ass dude (of course, he'll tehn reveal his ultra powers).

also, Yamato suggesting a space/time jutsu right away? are they out of thier mind or something? why the hell do they even use the switcharoo trick (kawawimi jutsu, i don't remember the spelling, since it hasn't been used in ages) if they can just fart out mega ass powers like that...
as for payne never losing a battle. That doesn't impress me much, i remember the guy from YYH saying the same, and all I could think off was "so this guy is so shelterd that he never got into a fight he wasn't completly sure about his own victory?".


last thing, for a guy supposing to be crushed by stones, Madare's legs seem pretty healthy to me... no mummy bandeges, no iron fill-ins... So i'm guessing that the body is just a doll he uses, and he's really a midget with only a head, and he moves the strings with his tounge to move that body around...

[Assertn]

DBZ, I never understand wtf you're talking about half the time.

[Parkalash]

Damn this was a good chapter, but this is Dbz all over again, haha with all the sharingan's and Uchia member's poping up :p soon they are all super saiyans, haha.. meaning they all have Ms with is So super duper rare :D

[Death BOO Z]

DBZ, I never understand wtf you're talking about half the time.

well, you're still in the upper side of the spectrum, most people complain what i'm saying is 100% nonsesnse.

I wonder wheather Tobi was a real person (the leader played out the part), a regular clone or some sort of other de-attachment, like Naraku's babies (from Inuyasha)... at least we can understand why he said that people like Tobi are easy to replace, he can just bring him over.

[itadakimasu]

well tobi is not madara if the translation was correct where he says my power, blah blah madaras power. i was LOL'ing when karin kicked suigetsu in the face.... and then again when juugo just decided that he wanted to kill somebody. The spoilers showing that made me think that they were confronting itachi.... damned spoiler pictures. the spoilers for this chapter brought so much anticipation .... plot development is great but im here for the action.

[iMUSTbeTHEdevil]

I think that he just stole Madara's powers!

[chet_chetty]

what would be interesting plot direction is...

if Tobi really is a jaded Obito and he wants Sasuke simply for his eyes. With one he is limited. With two, he can kill Kakashi and get MS.

I'm lead to believe the "Sharingan's true power" is "Uchiha Madara's power" (what Madara eventually attained in his lifetime), and that this power is not MS but rather one that surpasses MS.

[uhicha neji]

what would be interesting plot direction is...

if Tobi really is a jaded Obito and he wants Sasuke simply for his eyes. With one he is limited. With two, he can kill Kakashi and get MS.

I'm lead to believe the "Sharingan's true power" is "Uchiha Madara's power" (what Madara eventually attained in his lifetime), and that this power is not MS but rather one that surpasses MS.

I hope Kishi doesn't add another *power level* to the sharingan, it's already insane.

[rockmanj]

how can you be a ninja without depth perception? he has only one eye! he can't throw shurikens with that!


You can be the white fang's son...


And on another note, Jugo can commune with the animals?? That came outta nowhere.

[Koyuki]

No, it can never be insane... it's my precious eye...

Anyways Kishimoto has really taken Naruto to another level in this arc. I don't see Sasuke having MS, otherwise he would have used it against Deidara, or maybe he's keeping it a secret till he meet Itachi. And I don't think Tobi is Madara.

[Idealistic]

If Tobi was Obito, that would be the dumbest plot twist ever.

[Yukimura]

And on another note, Jugo can commune with the animals?? That came outta nowhere.

It was hinted at when Hebi first split up, Suigetsu goes to the broker, Karin wanders aimlessly thinking about Sasuke, and Jugo is seen with loads of animals flocking around him.

[Zhan]

On the last page that chick said "The sky is crying again...Pain...you..." I think Pain's power is somehow related to the weather or something similar.

[Idealistic]

On the last page that chick said "The sky is crying again...Pain...you..." I think Pain's power is somehow related to the weather or something similar.

Wouldn't doubt it, I mean he was from the rain village I believe.

[mage]

I don't think Tobi is Madara either. He says "My power.. Uchiha Madara's power.." It would not make sense to say "My power," and then his own name, so he is obviously speaking in reference to Madara. Perhaps he just means that Madara was the first person to obtain Mangekyou, so it would kind of be "his" power, or maybe he means it in a more literal sense and actually took Madara's eye(s) like Kakashi did Obito's. We'll probably find out exactly what he means in another few hundred chapters.

On another note, I'm really liking Pain's design.

[uhicha neji]

Can't wait to see Pein in action. Who do you guys think he'll end up fighting first? Naruto?

[Assertn]

They do leave it ambiguous, but I wouldn't put it past the japs to refer to themselves in the 3rd person that way.

The three lines were basically an increasing definition of tobi's power. Starting with the sharingan and ending with the legacy. He can't be anyone else other than Uchiha Madara. Especially if he's the ultimate villain

[mage]

The three lines were basically an increasing definition of tobi's power. Starting with the sharingan and ending with the legacy. He can't be anyone else other than Uchiha Madara. Especially if he's the ultimate villain
I have no clue what you're talking about here. Three lines? Increasing definition? Legacy? How do you come to the conclusion that he is Madara from these things?

[Assertn]

Ugh.....I can never get away without having to write things bluntly....

Three lines:
1) The Sharingans true power...
2) My power...
3) Uchiha Madara's power...

Increasing definition:
Each line encompasses a greater representation of power.

Legacy:
As in the name of a person precedes them. This is especially true with Tobi, whom appears to be a nobody, contrasted to the name Uchiha Madara, who's name is recognized even by Kyubi.

[mage]

So you have come to the conclusion he is Madara based on these things? It doesn't seem to be a very logical conclusion to me. He says "My power.. Uchiha Madara's power.." Like I said, if he calls it "His power," then says Madara's name, it would not make sense for him to be Madara. Tobi is not Madara.

[Assertn]

So you have come to the conclusion he is Madara based on these things? It doesn't seem to be a very logical conclusion to me. He says "My power.. Uchiha Madara's power.." Like I said, if he calls it "His power," then says Madara's name, it would not make sense for him to be Madara. Tobi is not Madara.
So because he also says "The sharingan's power," he is also not referring to himself? Doesn't seem to be a very logical conclusion to me.

[Splash!]

Yeah, I too am unsure as to where people are drawing conclusions from that Tobi is Uchiha Madara. I am pretty sure that all that line refers to is the power of the Sharingan. Just reinforcing the same idea by using different words. Even Sasuke was referred to as having the same sinister chakra as Uchiha Madara by the 9-tails.
As mage has already pointed out several times, the 2nd line wouldn't be in there if Tobi was talking about himself in the 3rd person. And even if the 2nd line wasn't there, I still wouldn't be to hasty to jump to the conclusion that Tobi is Madara.

My Theory:
It could be that some other mastermind is simply making use of Obito's half wrecked body and the lone sharingan eyeball that somehow remained undamaged inside his socket for their own purposes. I wouldn't put it past someone. Orochimaru tried to do the same thing. Maybe this host didnt care all too much about who it was or how badly damaged the body was, so long as it had a working Sharingan (Hunter nins aren't probably doing their job right). If someone who knew about the Sharingan's power happened to salvage his dead body from beneath the rocks and found that the lone eyeball had been preserved, I don't see why they wouldn't want to keep the body for themselves. They could have later fixed it up and possessed it.

I think Tobi's physical body is indeed that of Obito's. But Obito never seemed to have the right personality or the aspirations to be the big villain behind it all. Somebody 'pulled an Orochimaru' on him.

[Kensee]

Yeah, I too am unsure as to where people are drawing conclusions from that Tobi is Uchiha Madara. I am pretty sure that all that line refers to is the power of the Sharingan. Just reinforcing the same idea by using different words. Even Sasuke was referred to as having the same sinister chakra as Uchiha Madara by the 9-tails.
As mage has already pointed out several times, the 2nd line wouldn't be in there if Tobi was talking about himself in the 3rd person. And even if the 2nd line wasn't there, I still wouldn't be to hasty to jump to the conclusion that Tobi is Madara.

My Theory:
It could be that some other mastermind is simply making use of Obito's half wrecked body and the lone sharingan eyeball that somehow remained undamaged inside his socket for their own purposes. I wouldn't put it past someone. Orochimaru tried to do the same thing. Maybe this host didnt care all too much about who it was or how badly damaged the body was, so long as it had a working Sharingan (Hunter nins aren't probably doing their job right). If someone who knew about the Sharingan's power happened to salvage his dead body from beneath the rocks and found that the lone eyeball had been preserved, I don't see why they wouldn't want to keep the body for themselves. They could have later fixed it up and possessed it.

I think Tobi's physical body is indeed that of Obito's. But Obito never seemed to have the right personality or the aspirations to be the big villain behind it all. Somebody 'pulled an Orochimaru' on him.

Yeah I would agree with you on a lot of your points made here...

I just don't think Tobi/Mastermind is Obito because even though Obito was a Uchiha, he was more like the "Nartuo" of the old group, where Kakashi was more like the "Sauske." I just don't think Kish would make a twist like that, it would just kinda be pulling the whole self-sacrificing and whole moral out of Obito. The same guy who said "Those who don't help their friends are worse than trash!" (or something like that). Doing a 180 on his character would be a bad move.

Now, I do think Tobi (before him reveling himself to be the leader), did act more humorous and like Obito, and he does his vision around the eye that Obito had left, but bleh ... NO =P.

Madara, we never heard from. I don't recall any part of the whole manga that reviled that Itachi did acutally kill his friend Madara. He kinda just went Sharingan crazy and obliterated his village. So Madara does seem like a likely candidate, and also he seems to be well knowledgeable about the Uchiha clan and also the Sharingin.

Tobi ftw.

[February]

You guys think that Sasuke doesnt have the Mangekyu but Orochimaro DID tell Sasuke not to use a certain technique...and Sasuke did say to Deidara that he had another trick up his sleeve...so we never know for sure..

If Uchiha Madara was still alive:

And IF Uchia Madara is still alive, I am convinced that Tobi = Madara. Because Itachi already knew of another Sharingan user was still alive (hinted in this chapter), he must have faked Madara's death. Uchiha Madara must have instructed Itachi to act like he killed him so he can pull him toward his plan. And the wording as someone said, Japanese language can refer to oneself in 3rd person often so it wouldnt be surprising

If Uchiha Madara wasnt alive:
Maybe Itachi acquired Madara's power while killing him. Then by getting to Itachi, Tobi can harness his powers. But I am almost 99% sure that Tobi is Madara because we saw the sharingan. The only two possible candidates for Tobi is Madara or Obito because we heard that everyone in the clan got killed except Sasuke by Itachi. And Obito died way earlier. Tobi does not look half his body was severely mutilated and there is no way that someone who couldnt surpass Kakashi could be strong enough to control the strongest organization in the ninja world. And its been so long. Obito has no reason not to return to his friends or village or hide from the outside world living under a mask.

But Madara does have a reason to hide and live under a mask. Why? Because he's SUPPOSE to be dead. He faked his own death and what good is faking if people realize it soon after?


The only thing that disappointed me was that the badass supervillian acted so whimpy earlier in the chapters, even though it was an act, im still sad about it

[Honoko]

I'd much rather think after Madara ran away he started this trend of passing off his eyeballs to someone else before dying. And in that way Madara's power has been handed down from person to person, similar to how Kakashi was able to gain a Sharingan from Obito. To me, that would be the only way to justify a line like, "my power.... uchiha madara's power...." because referring to yourself in 3rd person is just totally lame.

[KCMmmmm]

So....what happened to Kabutoro? He just up and vanished. Anybody else notice that the arc's newest villain has the power to disappear as if he were completely forgotten by the writer?

I think the jury is still out on who Tobi is: I think there is an equal chance of him being Obito or Madara.....or another Uchiha completely. But I hope not....I'm hoping it's Obito, personally.

[Idealistic]

Either Tobi was talking in a 3rd person, or....

Tobi could be the person who killed Madara and he took his sharingan eyes.. Or maybe just 1 eye?

Then he'll be another 1-eyed sharingan user.

Itachi vs Sasuke, Kakashi vs Tobi.

[fahoumh]

Wait, I'm confused. The way the panels are structured leaves it ambiguous, so I'll go ahead and ask: Is Pain the girl with the hair flower or the dude with all the piercings who we used to think was the leader?
The dude with the piercings is Pein, we don't know the girl's name.

Also, I think it's premature to say Tobi is Uchiha Madara....having someone's power doesn't necessarily mean they are that person. Like Yamato has Shodai Hokage's powers but he's not the same person...although he is a quasi-clone. Maybe that's a bad example.

[Death BOO Z]

.

My Theory:
It could be that some other mastermind is simply making use of Obito's half wrecked body and the lone sharingan eyeball that somehow remained undamaged inside his socket for their own purposes. I wouldn't put it past someone. Orochimaru tried to do the same thing. Maybe this host didnt care all too much about who it was or how badly damaged the body was, so long as it had a working Sharingan (Hunter nins aren't probably doing their job right). If someone who knew about the Sharingan's power happened to salvage his dead body from beneath the rocks and found that the lone eyeball had been preserved, I don't see why they wouldn't want to keep the body for themselves. They could have later fixed it up and possessed it.

I can't see that happenning, Obito had his sharingan awakened about 20 mintues prior to his death, not likely that the super villian was there by chance and did all that emergency cutting and surgery without time to prepare (unless the sharingan is like Kuripata's eyes from HxH, which keep thier changed state if dead), other option is that he was waiting for this to happen, but Obito wasn't close to awakenning his eyes at that time, and there were probably Uchihas more close to that during those days.

Tobi is Obito, I can see no other way, it's like how Gin was Nigg (HxH), Obito was too lazy to think of an alias, so he just pushed his letters around, also, if you consider the personnality (Obito always making fun and excuses, being a 'naruto'ish guy) he is quite similiar to Tobi, who has since then upgraded the humor level manytimes over.

where did we see mentionnings of Madare's name? the kyubi spoke of him while Sasuke stuck his snobbish nose inside Naruto's head, and that's it, right? I can't remember wheather he was in one of those annoying Sasuke chapters...

Juugi can apparently speak to animals, it fits his charecter archtype - the crazy going gentle noble warrior. BORING.

I really wish to see Kabutoro again, though he's off the hook, at least for a while, he's got nothing to do with the current plot, and from his point of view, it's better to let all the others kill themselves and only then start his evil (master)plans again, if he even still has any use to them.

though, it will be cool if Kabuto was really Tobi's henchman, and is now creating the 2nd genration of the akatsuki base...

edit: Payne, who seems to be the zombie guy, I'm guessing he also has an hidden agenda. or is following the girls agenda, probably also has some usless power.

[Raven]

I think we need more information before we can 100% confirm Tobi's identity. I'm sure it will be concreted soon enough. For now let's just leave it as "he's the main bad guy".

I'm looking forward to seeing Pein in action. I wonder what he can do, if it is indeed to do with the weather. Never having lost a battle, that kind of suggests he's damned strong, but like it was mentioned in this thread, maybe he's just never had a really tough opponent? ;)

[toonice714]

Looks like tobi might just be the final boss to part 2 of naruto. This part of naruto will end with the falling of akatsuki and sasuke or naruto becoming famous for beating them. Then there must be another sasuke v naruto in part 3. I'm pretty sure kishi said there were gonna be three parts to this manga btw. Also i'm guessing itachi had another reason for killing the entire uchiha clan because he is showing that he obvioulsy cares for his brother. It wouldn't make sense for him to care if sasuke died or not if he killed his entire clan. I bet he needed MS and one other uchiha to beat madara. I dont think he and sasuke will ever team up but i do see them fighting and sasuke not killing him.

[Splash!]

If Uchiha Madara was still alive:

And IF Uchia Madara is still alive, I am convinced that Tobi = Madara. Because Itachi already knew of another Sharingan user was still alive (hinted in this chapter), he must have faked Madara's death. Uchiha Madara must have instructed Itachi to act like he killed him so he can pull him toward his plan. And the wording as someone said, Japanese language can refer to oneself in 3rd person often so it wouldnt be surprising





Madara, we never heard from. I don't recall any part of the whole manga that reviled that Itachi did acutally kill his friend Madara. He kinda just went Sharingan crazy and obliterated his village. So Madara does seem like a likely candidate, and also he seems to be well knowledgeable about the Uchiha clan and also the Sharingin.


:confused: I thought Uchiha Madara was someone that existed around the same time as the 1st hokage, who later fought him, and an early member of the Uchiha clan (Perhaps the first person to display the abilities of the Sharingan). Why are you guys referring to him as the friend that Itachi killed to acquire the MS?

Edited the part of him being a friend after reading below

[Assertn]

Well, I did sympathize that the line does leave it open to interpretation, but my realization of Tobi being Madara actually came from the first spoiler pics w/o any translations. It just makes the most sense to me, since:


There have been frequent references to the existence of a 3rd Uchiha
Madara has been revered as the "ultimate Uchiha"
The likelyhood of someone besides Kakashi having a sharingan implant seems very small. The likelyhood of a "false uchiha" having the strongest sharingan seems completely impractical.
Obito would OBVIOUSLY not be the main villain.


Edit:
Nobody has confirmed that Madara was the 1st Hokage's friend.
Itachi's friend was Uchiha Shisui (sp?)

[Carnage]

New Outofmyass Theory: Perhaps Akatsuki needs Sasuke's sharingan to summon the Phantom Dragon?

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/4665/vlcsnap285327ua4ga6.th.png (http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vlcsnap285327ua4ga6.png)

[February]

wow i completely mistaked Madara for Itachi's village friend, Shisui (spelling?)
But if it is the guy from way in the past, how is he surviving up to this point? ??
Maybe another similiar version of Oro's life prolonging jutsu?

[oni roh]

I can't see that happenning, Obito had his sharingan awakened about 20 mintues prior to his death, not likely that the super villian was there by chance and did all that emergency cutting and surgery without time to prepare (unless the sharingan is like Kuripata's eyes from HxH, which keep thier changed state if dead), other option is that he was waiting for this to happen, but Obito wasn't close to awakenning his eyes at that time, and there were probably Uchihas more close to that during those days.

Tobi is Obito, I can see no other way, it's like how Gin was Nigg (HxH), Obito was too lazy to think of an alias, so he just pushed his letters around, also, if you consider the personnality (Obito always making fun and excuses, being a 'naruto'ish guy) he is quite similiar to Tobi, who has since then upgraded the humor level manytimes over.

where did we see mentionnings of Madare's name? the kyubi spoke of him while Sasuke stuck his snobbish nose inside Naruto's head, and that's it, right? I can't remember wheather he was in one of those annoying Sasuke chapters...

Juugi can apparently speak to animals, it fits his charecter archtype - the crazy going gentle noble warrior. BORING.

I really wish to see Kabutoro again, though he's off the hook, at least for a while, he's got nothing to do with the current plot, and from his point of view, it's better to let all the others kill themselves and only then start his evil (master)plans again, if he even still has any use to them.

though, it will be cool if Kabuto was really Tobi's henchman, and is now creating the 2nd genration of the akatsuki base...

edit: Payne, who seems to be the zombie guy, I'm guessing he also has an hidden agenda. or is following the girls agenda, probably also has some usless power.


i'm inclined to aggree with you. Although it makes sense tobi = obito. If you catch the one page where kisame says to itachi about him being the "Last of the uchiha clan" if sasuke was dead. I don't find it believable for them to be in Akatsuki all this time and not know of Tobi's true identity, so in that aspect they don't view him as a uchiha survivor.

[Assertn]

If you ask me.....the past doesn't have to be more than 15 years ago. We know for certain that Kyubi encountered Madara before he was sealed, and we know that Madara was long gone before Itachi wiped out his clan, but both of these conditions could have been met anywhere between the beginning of Konoha and up until Kyubi attacks Konoha.

[animus]

Now that I recall when Kyuubi told Sasuke that his chakra or whatever was more sinister than his own, that really ticked me off. I hated how much Kishimoto overpowered the Sharingan, and tries to add so much depth to it now. The Sharingan branched off the Byakugan, but it just completely overwhelms it. It's such a huge deus ex machina plot device now, that it's kinda annoying.

[Assertn]

I wouldn't make a big deal about the sharingan as a decendant of byakugan. For one thing, Kakashi mentioned it out of passing, as a myth. Even if its true, it would be a trait that likely evolved very gradually throughout the history of the clan.

And let's not forget one key factor in evolution, if newer genetic mutations end up remaining in the gene pool, then they must provide some sort of superior adaptation for the creature to its environment. ;)

[February]

I wouldn't make a big deal about the sharingan as a decendant of byakugan. For one thing, Kakashi mentioned it out of passing, as a myth. Even if its true, it would be a trait that likely evolved very gradually throughout the history of the clan.

And let's not forget one key factor in evolution, if newer genetic mutations end up remaining in the gene pool, then they must provide some sort of superior adaptation for the creature to its environment. ;)

Yeah I agree, evolution = improvement. Since Sharingan was an evolution from Byakugan, it should be stronger than it for sure. I just wish that the manga would go into deeper depth on Byakugan and let its user develop do-jutsu with it.


Anyway, although I am almost positively convinced that Tobi is not Obito, I am taking a different direction to this approach. As you guys have said that Tobi is Madara, I can see that possibility but what if Tobi turned out to be Itachi's friend that he claimed to have killed long ago? Suisui? (spelling again?) You might think that guy came out of nowhere randomly but they did say that Itachi looked up to him (Tobi commanding Itachi at the moment) and they did say that he was very strong if I can recall. And furthermore, he seems to fit the age gap more appropirately than Madara since Madara is suppose to be an existence even Kyuubi knows about/ some past affiliation with the 1st hokage maybe? as someone hinted out earlier. And it makes alot more sense for him to hide under a mask because Suisui was suppose to be killed by Itachi (but my theory is that he faked his death) And maybe Tobi was talking about acquiring Madara's power somehow? Not too sure...my theory is unlikely so i'll stop talking about it for now

Can someone get that last picture of Obito being crushed under a rock? I want to see which eye was crushed and compare it to Tobi's eyehole. I want to eliminate this possibility if I can..because it seems absurd that Kakashi's old weak friend would rule the strongest organization and not return to his village and friends when he had no reason not to.

[Assertn]

Well, obviously it wasn't Tobi's left eye that was crushed, because that's the eye he gave to Kakashi.

[Mhalador]

I don't think it's too far fetched for Tobi to still be Obito, though I agree that it would be pretty lame for him to be the ultimate villain without a damn good reason.

Obito was killed on a mission in the grass country, and I think it'd be pretty safe to assume that Zetsu is from the grass country. It's possible that Zetsu rescued Tobi from underneath the rock which would draw a connection between Obito, Akatsuki, and Zetsu. Don't forget that Zetsu was the one who "brought" Tobi in to replace Sasori, furthering a possible connection between them. Who knows why he would go to this sorta length to hide himself as the true leader.

[*Enlighten*]

Uchilia Madara, i will presume that he is not tobi..... reasons that will bring me to this conclusion is that 364 only shows one sharigan in his eyes... and when he quote the power of uchilia madara doesn't bring to the account that he is him.... if that was tru then he would of join the A-group soon as they started because if Madara was alive he would’ve been pretty old, since the nine tails knew of him.... only way for the nine tails to have knowledge of him is when the nine tails didn't have a host... naruto - ninetails = a span of over 15 years ago when the nine tails didn't have a host...... and who knew when they first met? but reasons say that they met when the nine-tails roam the world...I still say it is a more high possibility tobi is obito because they assume that obito had died when kakashi and rin fled the scene... but tobi was alive in the enemies hideout when they left... usually hunter nins would've look for his body so that the secret of Sharingan and its ability wouldn't fall in to the wrong hands. But there is no grave? so tobi could be obito....it's more relevant then tobi being Madara....

[KCMmmmm]

I can't wait for the next chapter now. Even though Sharingan is ridiculously over-powered, or perhaps because of that reason, I can't help but feel very excited about another user of this bloodline. It's difficult to feel very threatened by new villains like Kabutoro what with the prospect of the once considered all-powerful Pein being set loose on Naruto, our nearly forgotten main character, and the idea of yet another Uchiha powerhouse.

It's great that every villain who has at one time or another seemed to be the ultimate villain continues to get outshined by a newer threat. Orochimaru seemed invincible until Itachi showed up....who seemed incredible until Akatsuki revealed that there were at least seven other supposed "equals" amongst them, led by the all powerful Pein.....who is now dwarfed in power by the mysterious Tobi. At least from our perspective. I figure any of these three could still prove to be the best; Itachi, for example, doesn't seem to be the type to follow orders without having a personal goal in mind, and we know nothing of Pein or Tobi besides their position in Akatsuki (which may change again within a few chapters).

[chet_chetty]

Actually I'm now very certain that when Tobi refers to Sharingan's true power, he's referring to the ability to suppress and control bijuu.

It was never said that the bijuu extraction process with the eye statue included the ability to control the bijuus. Neither was it ever explicity stated or implied that each Akatsuki member was meant to become the next jinchuriki nor did any of them ever state the specific expectation of becoming a jinchuriki.

[KCMmmmm]

Actually I'm now very certain that when Tobi refers to Sharingan's true power, he's referring to the ability to suppress and control bijuu.

It was never said that the bijuu extraction process with the eye statue included the ability to control the bijuus. Neither was it ever explicity stated or implied that each Akatsuki member was meant to become the next jinchuriki nor did any of them ever state the specific expectation of becoming a jinchuriki.

In one chapter, Pein revealed that Akatsuki's plan was to unleash the tailed demons on the world, just so that they could save villages from them, and gain money and power. It had something to do with destroying all other ninja villages, so that every village would need to request Akatsuki for help in war and missions. And then something lame about saving the world. Of course, it would be much easier to stop the tailed deomns with the Sharingan's ability to suppress them.

I hope that this plan is just a front, and that the true plan of Akatsuki is less lame.

[chet_chetty]

Yes I remember the goal Pein marked as Akatsuki's ultimate objective. With the going assumption that controlling (ninja) economy is a lame supervillain goal, I would have to believe that Pein's explanation is a front what with all new revelations in the storyline including: the fact that the Akatsuki leader is not Pein (unbeknowest to all Akatsuki except the female), but someone above, who is 1. Tobi (perceived by his peers to be the weakest Akatsuki) and 2. a Sharingan user aiming to control or become the ultimate Sharingan user outside of Madara (given they are not the same person). So yeah, as ridiculous as that explanation sounded at the time Pein said it, it has to seem even more insignificant now. All this (kind of) deception and risk for the sake of economic dictatorship is absurd.

And for suppressing bijuus (and their chakra) to be the extent of Sharingan's true power would be dumb if you cant make a bijuu do what you want. In fact we just saw Sasuke's control Manda which could be seen as a foreshadowing of Sharingan's true power.

[Assertn]

There would be absolutely no reason for Tobi to be deceiving everyone unless there was an ulterior motive. My question is: Why did he bother taking Sasori's spot in the first place, just to be "killed off" by Deidara later on?

[Raven]

It was probably never planned for him to die, he probably had no choice because as far as the rest of them are concerned he shouldn't have survived Deidara's final blast. There's no way they would have foreseen Deidara fighting Sasuke and blowing himself up.

[Terracosmo]

What I personally don't get is why Tobi, being the apparent leader of akatsuki, pose as some dim-witted goofy loser when he's around the rest of the organization? What's the point of that whole charade if he's the leader anyway?

[KCMmmmm]

What I personally don't get is why Tobi, being the apparent leader of akatsuki, pose as some dim-witted goofy loser when he's around the rest of the organization? What's the point of that whole charade if he's the leader anyway?

The only thing I can think of is that he wanted to scrutinize one or more of the members of Akatsuki without revealing himself to be the leader. Maybe he wanted to ensure their faithful allegiance, or perhaps he was afraid some of the members would attempt to overthrow Pein. More likely, I think he wanted more time to closely watch Itachi - and filling Sasori's empty place seemed a bit closer than watching from the shadows.

[chet_chetty]

Why is it so hard to believe that Tobi is using Akatsuki for his own goal? If his actions and words in the last chapter did not scream ulterior motive, then I must be looking into this way to deeply.

And there is information to be gained from within the ranks as well as what's gained from being the leader of the ranks.

[itadakimasu]

im not sure if its even been confirmed that tobi is the leader but so many people keep talking as if he is. You may be right bout some of it but it is all speculation right now. All we know for sure is that tobi has sharingan, and wears a mask w\ only one eye hole which makes his being obito possible but as others have pointed out that would be kinda lame to bring a charactor like that back into the story as a villain. the next few chapters im sure will help to settle alot of this speculation floating around

[KCMmmmm]

im not sure if its even been confirmed that tobi is the leader but so many people keep talking as if he is. You may be right bout some of it but it is all speculation right now. All we know for sure is that tobi has sharingan, and wears a mask w\ only one eye hole which makes his being obito possible but as others have pointed out that would be kinda lame to bring a charactor like that back into the story as a villain. the next few chapters im sure will help to settle alot of this speculation floating around

Obito could reappear as a villain for many non-lame reasons. He might have lost part of his memory (being nearly killed by a boulder which crushed half of his face could have caused amnesia). He also might have pledged a debt to whoever saved him. Or, he may have another reason for aligning himself to Akatsuki. There is a possibility that he is a spy working for another group - and their goal may be the destruction of Akatsuki, which would make him something of a secret hero.

As you say, it's all speculation. Let's see where Kishimoto-san takes this.

[thejustin2]

what if the reason the nine-tail knows madara is that he is the one who sicked him on konoha to destroy his bloodline and he just had itachi do it later....

[tehlegend]

since everyones so intent on suggesting obito is connected to this some how, lets throw around the idea that obito actually died under that big ass boulder, and after kakashi and his team hightailed it out of there, another random ninja came around and ripped obitos other eye out?

-_-