Bleach 59 [Archive] - Gotwoot Forums

FrogKing

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:10 AM

Wow, the hollow Ichigo is fricken insane! Kinda looked like Gin with that maniacal laugh/face. All I got to say is, "Kuroi Getsuga" was awesome!
Looks like BanKai has several (if not many) different levels/moves. Byakuya's second was strange...I still don't quite get why Ichigo was slowed down so much. Can anyhow explain? I'll certainly have to watch again.
@XanBcoo: Yeah, I was thinking, "Show what is inside, show what is inside. SHIT, a cliffhanger!" Oh, well guess we'll have to wait 2 weeks before finding out. I need to somehow ween myself from this show. Tuesday nights are killing me and the wait sucks too!

edit:

Originally posted by: DarthEnder
It did suck that hollow ichi went away so fast. It's almost like the first time Naruto uses the fox power, you think, omg, this is so fucking awsome, and then 10 seconds later it's over.
Not that that isn't an astute observation DarthEnder, but...here we go again with the Naruto/DBZ/Bleach comparisons.

Kensee

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:50 AM

Originally posted by: V
Yeah, he got that mask when he almost died in training right? Really weird. Byakuya didn't even know what it was, but he did say it was another entity or something. My reaction when I saw it was "Wow! What the hell is this?"

I like the way the fight ended. Byakuya's sword got destroyed, so nothing left to do.

But the real question I want answered is: Does Ichigo have yet another power move that Zangetsu hasn't gotten around to teaching him? Damn, is this the move that finally collapses the ledge?

The ledge? No, its the ultimate DEFENSE! (couldn't resist) i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif Anyhow I'm quite sure Ichigo has many more techniques, but he is sortof a noob at all this (his fighting skill is not really up to par though his strength is, and he can't control his bankai fully yet). Plus he said "Zangetus only taught me this one techinque" which is kidna foreshadowing that he might learn a different technique later on (and it seemed like masked Ichigo was doing dark variations of Ichigo's attack?

Speaking of the masked version of Ichigo, freaky son of a itch wasn't he? =P Listen to his voice and ask yourself does he remind you of some character you met in the past. I mean I'm sure almost everyone noticed the tone and fighting style of this guy. And yes first time it came out I was also like "wtf is that?" lol good times.

Originally posted by: FrogKing
Wow, the hollow Ichigo is fricken insane! Kinda looked like Gin with that maniacal laugh/face. All I got to say is, "Kuroi Getsuga" was awesome!
Looks like BanKai has several (if not many) different levels/moves. Byakuya's second was strange...I still don't quite get why Ichigo was slowed down so much. Can anyhow explain? I'll certainly have to watch again.
@XanBcoo: Yeah, I was thinking, "Show what is inside, show what is inside. SHIT, a cliffhanger!" Oh, well guess we'll have to wait 2 weeks before finding out. I need to somehow ween myself from this show. Tuesday nights are killing me and the wait sucks too!

edit:

Originally posted by: DarthEnder
It did suck that hollow ichi went away so fast. It's almost like the first time Naruto uses the fox power, you think, omg, this is so fucking awsome, and then 10 seconds later it's over.
Not that that isn't an astute observation DarthEnder, but...here we go again with the Naruto/DBZ/Bleach comparisons.

I think I can answer your first question about Ichigo slowing down... this is pretty much Ichigo's first real battle test run with his Bankai (as in not training with it) and its very strong and impressive. Yet it does have it's downside ... think of it as a HUGE battery that makes him go really really fast, but eventually that battery runs out of energy. Now replace the battery with Ichigo's body, theres only so much of the Bankai he can take before his body gets so warn down that he hits his limit. When he hits his limit, thats pretty much it for him. I believe he has pleanty more attacks and can probably control his bankai better and last longer if he has more training with it. Rmember bayaka said usualy they gotta train for 10 years + with the bankai before they can really get it down (thus Renji getting pwned quickly). This is not anything that hasn't been said in the Anime, just clarifying for FrogKing or anyone else who is confused about it.

Nice sig btw Frog King

NeoBear

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:54 AM

Unless im wrong he was saying he was slowed down because his own power was kicking his bodys ass so even though he had all that power his body could not deal with it or at lest thas wut i got outta it, that shit all of it rocked btw

only one thing im kinda wondering about if you watch like the first few episoides of bleach its like it has nothing to do with wuts going on now, i mean i love wuts going on and all i just feel like it sure fliped a switch.

Edit: er yeah wut kensee said too =O

Kraco

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:55 AM

A fine episode indeed. I certainly didn't expect a hollow form to appear like that, but it was very cool. Also seeing how aggressive and overpowering the hollow form was, it makes sense it also disappeared so quickly; lest it would have completely taken over Ichigo. Considering how little in the way of explanations we got, it seems likely this won't be the last time we get to see it. Or at least some analyses would be fitting. Even if that's not exactly something Ichigo would like to brag about... Maybe it's something that Ichigo needs to fight against. And when he was badly wounded and close to death, he just lapsed for a moment, and thus allowed the inner demon to take control.

Byakuya's reason was a bit simple and plain... I wonder if they wanted to make it like this to let him live and let him eventually drop the chase for Rukia. If it had been some really personal or weird reason, it would be impossible for him to ever stop trying to kill Rukia. Now he is just a simple bastard.

NeoBear

Wed, 11-23-2005, 05:00 AM

yeah that was kinda a letdown i was thinking we would get an episode wear they showed him and rukia and why he hated her but just turns out thems the rulls ...... WOW!!!

el_boss

Wed, 11-23-2005, 07:29 AM

Finally a good episode again. There were almost no interuptions at all and at last something significant happened. Man I was so excited when hollow-Ichigo appeared, I've been waiting for that since the episode they showed him inside Ichigo. It's wierd though that Zangetsu lets him be there, so he can't be all bad right. It sucks a little though that Ichigo is immortal now a days. Everytime he is about to get defeated they just bring out the mask.

One stupid thing about the episode was the silly shit with Inoue at the end of the figth. And she all of a sudden turns into Hinata. Ehy didn't she heal Ichigo? He just lies there with fatal wounds and she's like "omg Ichigo-kun... ummm... I... was really... worried about... ummmm... you".

And about Ichigo getting slower. Was it not because of that Byakuya's bankai made it easier for fatal wounds to appear? So the strain from Ichigo's bankai (much like Lee opening gates and what not) became even bigger. And the wounds that Byakuya made also became more severe.

Kraco

Wed, 11-23-2005, 08:38 AM

Two other things: Yachiru apparently didn't have a chance to fight anybody, again. Will we ever get to see her fight, aside from head biting mode? Or is she just a simple comic relief? And the company of friends didn't meet Renji and Rukia, which means they had already cleared the stairs. I wonder where they are heading... So, Rukia is still separated from her original saviors. But based on what Ishida said, there might be still more fights to settle, before Rukia can be secured a future without the fear of being hunted down again.

Interesting times. And the pause sucks... But fortunately the pause didn't happen in the middle of this battle.

mage

Wed, 11-23-2005, 08:41 AM

this fight was so much more serious in the manga. it feels like it was totally ruined in the anime.

Phoenix20578

Wed, 11-23-2005, 09:37 AM

Well, the hollow fight looked better in the anime than the manga. I liked this episode. The last one was a
little better, but this was still good. Also, Dec. 6 is too long to wait (not really).

yapchagi

Wed, 11-23-2005, 09:44 AM

I think in the next episode we'll see someone that we haven't seen in a long time. The mastermind behind everything.
Then the real fight and probably the last fight begins. Yep, it's only the beginning.

Sirian

Wed, 11-23-2005, 10:06 AM

To me its pretty clear that ichigos Bankai is not a "Battery Type", I dont think such Bankai's do exist
The Hollow Ichigo said it pretty clear

You Really do suck at this, Ichigo!
You got braten by your Bankai's Reiatsu, cracking the bones throughout your body.

I mean this is the risk in projekting that much power into your own body, if you dont do it properly you might kill yourself.
So the longe Ichigo uses his Bankai the more he damaged his own body since he could not control it completly.
And with a body like that you cant run all over the place^^

btw
I just noticed that the attack the Hollow used was named "Black Moon Fang"
the Shikai attack from Ichigo was named "Moon Fang Slicing the Heaven".
Well that makes me wonder if that nasty attack from the hollow was aktually something like his Shikai
maybe Ichigo can learn that as well, but I'am more courius if "Heavenly Chains" do exist i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

KoKo37

Wed, 11-23-2005, 10:31 AM

hmhmhm this espisode was ok imo, the hollow was cool n all, but it kinda just went to fast lol like he did crazy laughs n super fast attacks it lasted 11:45 - 14:05 the hollow thing for a total of 2:20 mins so in that time he transformd into a hollow, he to attacked as a hollow, kuchiki talked about it, and for him to scream n take off the mask it just goes to fast for a couple mins -.- lol i kinda feel that way about most bleach fights XD there all super good but they make the parts u want to last, lasy only a super short time T.T ne ways still a pretty good espisode but i got a couple questions

1. no offence but did the wind die down - { Complety }- at 18:30 - 19:17 i mean even when hes walking his clothes move like lil to none its so akward >< lol
http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/5696/nowindbleach9ia.jpg

2. ok this is my DB download BUT OMG its ends short!! at 24:15 T.T heres waht mine ends at~~
http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/820/short6sn.jpg

i wanna see waht happens in Shinigami Cup Golden T.T tahts like the best parts in the entire espisode i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif
t(-.-t) ( take that daybattyo -.- lol )

Dionysos

Wed, 11-23-2005, 10:36 AM

This episode was indeed cool, but the next will definitely blow your minds

kenren

Wed, 11-23-2005, 10:43 AM

hollow-ichigo rocks...
we need more scenes for him i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif

nests

Wed, 11-23-2005, 11:06 AM

I liked that they changed the voice on Hollow Ichigo for some reason I tough they would use the same voice to make him sound like he was talking to himself but after seeing this it was much better. we finally know why that mask kept appering after he would trow it away

kenren

Wed, 11-23-2005, 11:11 AM

yeah...i like the voice.
made him sound more evil-ish i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif

naruto22

Wed, 11-23-2005, 11:29 AM

Yeah real evil. Remember everyone, you need another 10 years to CONTROL and MASTER your Bankai. Ichigo's one is no exception. Its just like after getting your first pistol as a gun, you receive a M-16 as your next weapon. Sure the M-16 is a nasty weapon even in the hands of someone who doesn't know how to use it but sooner or later, the recoil is going to kill your body if you don't know how to hold it properly or aim properly.

Next episode is SO LONG TO WAIT!! I WANT MY HITSUGAYA TAICHOU!!!!!!!! HYOURINMARU!!!

Ah well, audit peak is starting anyway. Gonna be freaking busy so I guess I can wait, Accounts Accounts Accounts to check.

Good episode but unfortunately, such a cliffhanger on which you have to wait 2 weeks.

Dionysos

Wed, 11-23-2005, 11:41 AM

Ichigo is the maincharakter so he his definitely an exception...and will master his bankai a lot faster than 10 years...

Though i dont know if it was an inaccurate translation or the anime itself, but im quite sure to remember the manga saying something like ichigos bankai being a battery and that it was empty in the end....could be my memory too i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif

Kraco

Wed, 11-23-2005, 11:43 AM

Originally posted by: naruto22
Yeah real evil. Remember everyone, you need another 10 years to CONTROL and MASTER your Bankai. Ichigo's one is no exception. Its just like after getting your first pistol as a gun, you receive a M-16 as your next weapon. Sure the M-16 is a nasty weapon even in the hands of someone who doesn't know how to use it but sooner or later, the recoil is going to kill your body if you don't know how to hold it properly or aim properly.

It's interesting though that the Hollow Ichigo was so much better at using the Bankai... Or maybe it was because he just acted without stopping to feel the pain or exhaustion. Although hollows might also have some inborn ability to access and use spirit force.

Well, it has nothing to do with this, but assault rifles don't really have much of a recoil. I don't know how many rounds you would need to shoot to "kill your body", but it would take quite a many! They are nice guns to shoot with, not anything like shotguns.

darkmetal505

Wed, 11-23-2005, 12:24 PM

http://img430.imageshack.us/img430/1497/grumpykuchiki3ie.jpg

im grumpy mcgrumples

Kensee

Wed, 11-23-2005, 12:28 PM

Originally posted by: Kraco

Originally posted by: naruto22
Yeah real evil. Remember everyone, you need another 10 years to CONTROL and MASTER your Bankai. Ichigo's one is no exception. Its just like after getting your first pistol as a gun, you receive a M-16 as your next weapon. Sure the M-16 is a nasty weapon even in the hands of someone who doesn't know how to use it but sooner or later, the recoil is going to kill your body if you don't know how to hold it properly or aim properly.

It's interesting though that the Hollow Ichigo was so much better at using the Bankai... Or maybe it was because he just acted without stopping to feel the pain or exhaustion. Although hollows might also have some inborn ability to access and use spirit force.

Well, it has nothing to do with this, but assault rifles don't really have much of a recoil. I don't know how many rounds you would need to shoot to "kill your body", but it would take quite a many! They are nice guns to shoot with, not anything like shotguns.

I've noticed things that were said before are being repeated o.o as if by some silly coincidence people just skil posts here and there >_> <_< -_- =P

Anyhow, I think even a couple of years are reallly needed just to get it down (hrm I'm repeating myself now =P) to get Bankai to a good level of control.

And on the M-16 notion ... why need a gun when my kicks already make big men fall down! Guns bah! Your body is the ULTIMATE WEAPON >_<!

DarthEnderX

Wed, 11-23-2005, 12:49 PM

It boggles the mind that people are surprised about hollow ichigo. I mean, what fucking show have you been watching. They've only telegraphed it like 8 times now. I mean, the 3 or 4 times the mask saved him. The "negative" Ichigo that he fought in that one episode and now shows up in the fricken Opening for crying out loud. And lets not forget the giant fucking hollow mask that his spirit force takes the shape of at the end of his fight with Kenpachi.

I mean, okay, we didn't know that THIS was gonna be the fight where his Hollow side showed but if you didn't see it coming eventually I really want to know where you're head's been.

I'm gonna guess that this all comes from when he almost became a hollow early in the show. That seems to be the obvious answer. I guess he got out at the exact last moment, so his hollow self came into being but his regular self wasn't destroyed yet.

EpyonNext

Wed, 11-23-2005, 01:25 PM

Originally posted by: naruto22
Yeah real evil. Remember everyone, you need another 10 years to CONTROL and MASTER your Bankai. Ichigo's one is no exception. Its just like after getting your first pistol as a gun, you receive a M-16 as your next weapon. Sure the M-16 is a nasty weapon even in the hands of someone who doesn't know how to use it but sooner or later, the recoil is going to kill your body if you don't know how to hold it properly or aim properly.

Next episode is SO LONG TO WAIT!! I WANT MY HITSUGAYA TAICHOU!!!!!!!! HYOURINMARU!!!

Ah well, audit peak is starting anyway. Gonna be freaking busy so I guess I can wait, Accounts Accounts Accounts to check.

Good episode but unfortunately, such a cliffhanger on which you have to wait 2 weeks.

I think a better analogy would be a shotgun instead of an M16. You can press the butt of an M16 against your crotch, fire the weapon, and not feel any pain what so ever.

FrogKing

Wed, 11-23-2005, 02:03 PM

Ok, thanks for the clarifications on why Ichigo slowed down.

Originally posted by: el_boss
And about Ichigo getting slower. Was it not because of that Byakuya's bankai made it easier for fatal wounds to appear? So the strain from Ichigo's bankai (much like Lee opening gates and what not) became even bigger. And the wounds that Byakuya made also became more severe.
Everybody else's made sense too. However, I have one other point. If Ichigo destroyed Byakuya's sword in the sortie, then how did Ichigo get sliced? Was he just succumbing to his former injuries or did Senbonz akura get him? I am gonna hope it was the former and that it was his body failing rather than getting struck fatally. When they squared off, I was hoping for a finish different than Kenpachi vs Ichigo (rnd.1) where both opponents fall from their blows after a simultaneous attack. Does anybody have any thought on this?

@ Kensee: Aren't you supposed to be studying for a mid term...what are you doing watching and posting here? Thanks for the props on the sig; KitKat made it for me and I am very happy with it! and I hope they test went well!

Also, to all the Americans at home, abroad, or are just stuck here, "Happy Turkey Day!" And if you aren't an American, have a good Thursday.

edit: Btw, did nobody else think that hollow Ichigo looked and fought kinda like Gin?

Xyrox

Wed, 11-23-2005, 02:24 PM

Originally posted by: DarthEnder
It boggles the mind that people are surprised about hollow ichigo. I mean, what fucking show have you been watching. They've only telegraphed it like 8 times now. I mean, the 3 or 4 times the mask saved him. The "negative" Ichigo that he fought in that one episode and now shows up in the fricken Opening for crying out loud. And lets not forget the giant fucking hollow mask that his spirit force takes the shape of at the end of his fight with Kenpachi.

I mean, okay, we didn't know that THIS was gonna be the fight where his Hollow side showed but if you didn't see it coming eventually I really want to know where you're head's been.

I'm gonna guess that this all comes from when he almost became a hollow early in the show. That seems to be the obvious answer. I guess he got out at the exact last moment, so his hollow self came into being but his regular self wasn't destroyed yet.

People seem to have missed some parts: Possible spoiler (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ichigo5nc.jpg)

Oh well. Can't wait for the next episode. I think they showed what's inside in the preview, or rather who's inside....

FrogKing

Wed, 11-23-2005, 02:34 PM

Oh, I have some more ideas/questions:
What happened to Rukia and Renji? Wouldn't they have passed Ishida and the rest on their way down the stairs? If not, wouldn't they have passed Yachiru on her way up the stairs? Guess Renji can run really fast.
Also, what the hell happened to the fight between Yama-Kyouraku-Ukitake? I think that whatever Hitsugaya has discovered behind the door will over ride Yama's anger at the two captains and they'll stop fighting. Despite this, I was still hoping to see a little action between them because last we saw Ryujinjakka was about to put the smack down on Katen Kyoukotsu AND Sougyo no Kotowari at the same time!
There are so many good things happening that I hope they don't start inserting fillers. I can wait two weeks, but if they took a whole season off...don't know what would happen. I wish they would just show some re-runs or something. Kinda like the 'greatest moments' fillers. I realize Bleach is relatively short, but it has had some really good episodes and battles.

edit:

Originally posted by: Xyrox
People seem to have missed some parts: Possible spoiler (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ichigo5nc.jpg)
Don't know if it quaifies as a spoiler if it had already happened. If it was, then my sig would be a spoiler.

Aeon

Wed, 11-23-2005, 03:07 PM

Another meh episode, I'm glad that Gin is finally back by the preview for next ep. I don't see what's so good about hallow Ichigo, it seemed like just another thing to make him overpowered to me.

el_boss

Wed, 11-23-2005, 03:26 PM

Originally posted by: Aeon
Another meh episode, I'm glad that Gin is finally back by the preview for next ep. I don't see what's so good about hallow Ichigo, it seemed like just another thing to make him overpowered to me.

I liked the hollow because it is so much cooler than Ichigo. I really hope it takes over permanently.

Honinbou

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:30 PM

well.. I think that hollow-ichigo pwns... but it seems to me that in almost all animes the main-character has hidden and/or special powers..
so before alot of people make comparisons with other animes about it... dont do It cus I'll send you 15 lists full of animes where that happens i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

aznroyale

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:34 PM

man i wanted Byakuya to win

Splash!

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:45 PM

ichigo still really hasnt outdone Byakuya. He would have been dead meat were it not for the hollow. Black Getsuga looks awesome but i am not a big fan of the the hollow ichigo was animated while fighting. He was jumping around awkwardly and making weird faces.
Seems like the focus has shifted from Ichigo to Hitsugaya. Where is the fight between Yamaji and his students?

darkmetal505

Wed, 11-23-2005, 04:54 PM

Originally posted by: FrogKing

edit: Btw, did nobody else think that hollow Ichigo looked and fought kinda like Gin?

yea hollow man was all twisty and was "shooting" the sword

Kraco

Wed, 11-23-2005, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by: splash
ichigo still really hasnt outdone Byakuya. He would have been dead meat were it not for the hollow.

Yeah. Ichigo seemed to suffer more during the combat. He couldn't even stand anymore, whereas Byakuya flash stepped away. Byakuya just lost his sword for the moment. A tough guy. And certainly knew his Bankai. I wonder if even the old geezer can pull out as many tricks with his zanpaktou...

darkmetal505

Wed, 11-23-2005, 05:08 PM

Originally posted by: Kraco

Originally posted by: splash
ichigo still really hasnt outdone Byakuya. He would have been dead meat were it not for the hollow.

Yeah. Ichigo seemed to suffer more during the combat. He couldn't even stand anymore, whereas Byakuya flash stepped away. Byakuya just lost his sword for the moment. A tough guy. And certainly knew his Bankai. I wonder if even the old geezer can pull out as many tricks with his zanpaktou...

im sure old geezer has plenty of firepower. But ichigo had outdone him. He could have slit his throat earlier in the battle. Pimp or not, byakuya wouldnt be able to survive that.

Knives122

Wed, 11-23-2005, 05:18 PM

the ep. was alright, I was just glad they made Senbonzakuras final form white instead of pink. Hollow Ichigo was used quite differently in the anime then how I pictured it would look, making him do weird things and make monkey sounds was kinda weird.

Oh well Gin is causing more trouble with hinamori, he's a clevery little villian that one is.

here are the pics(Im posting alot of them I think):

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/2074/165034xh.jpg

This was the reason why I wanted it white(along with another thing):
http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/3856/165041qu.jpg

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/2281/165066tq.jpg

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/9817/165074oo.jpg

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/3931/165094ww.jpg

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/3300/165104hr.jpg

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/5145/165117rf.jpg

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/4094/165147si.jpg

http://img334.imageshack.us/img334/2153/165164ke.jpg

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/2208/165173pe.jpg

http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/8788/165182yy.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/9676/166040br.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/4230/166050lh.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/4332/166098km.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/5640/166104wx.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/5176/166128kv.jpg

http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/1920/166166nr.jpg

This was the other reason(the whole demon/angel thing....again!!)
http://img165.imageshack.us/img165/6299/166197ud.jpg

ChaosK

Wed, 11-23-2005, 05:39 PM

didnt byakuya say "hadou" in the anime? it said bakydou, or something, up there.

FrogKing

Wed, 11-23-2005, 05:58 PM

Nice post Knives. I was about to request some manga pics. Thanks.

Knives122

Wed, 11-23-2005, 06:03 PM

I'm pretty much going to do this every ep now seeing that I have chapters 154-204 on my comp.

Konohamaru

Wed, 11-23-2005, 06:25 PM

was it me or did Byakuya just shout his own name for the white lightning technique? Byakuya means white but I didn't hear the lightning part. Unless he said Byakurai

Cool episode tho. Can't wait for the rest!

The Heretic Azazel

Wed, 11-23-2005, 06:47 PM

Heh it sounded like Byakugan to me.

I NEVER expected hollow Ichigo to be this crazy, I must be in the few who thought it was totally cool how they pulled that off, with that flipped out voice and animation jerking all over the place.

Konohamaru

Wed, 11-23-2005, 08:49 PM

byakugan means white eyes.

hollow-ichi was super cool tho.

Cal_kashi

Wed, 11-23-2005, 09:25 PM

I like the way that they did Hollow-ichigo in the anime, it made sense, in my mind, for him to go completely beserk like that.
Think of him as being drunken lee.

DarthEnderX

Wed, 11-23-2005, 09:39 PM

Originally posted by: Knives122
I'm pretty much going to do this every ep now seeing that I have chapters 154-204 on my comp.

I wish you wouldn't, if anyone needs to see an ENTIRE fucking manga chapter they can download it themselves, without making the forum page take 5 minutes to load.

And obviously, byaku means white.

aznroyale

Wed, 11-23-2005, 09:50 PM

hallow ichigo is like slimy
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b322/aznroyal11229/bscap002.jpghttp://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b322/aznroyal11229/bscap004.jpg

Mae

Wed, 11-23-2005, 11:07 PM

Originally posted by: DarthEnder
I'm gonna guess that this all comes from when he almost became a hollow early in the show. That seems to be the obvious answer. I guess he got out at the exact last moment, so his hollow self came into being but his regular self wasn't destroyed yet.

That's possible, I guess, but from what we've seen earlier (with Inoue's bother) is that a hollow isn't a separate spirit, but the person's own soul gone evil and insane. With Ichigo it seemed like it was actually a second spirit living inside of him. I'm sticking with my theory that Ichigo is the reincarnation of Kaien, and the hollow is the one that was joined to his spirit when he died.

And so much for Bykuya being part of a larger plot. He was just following the rules, how boring. Still, he fought a good fight, and he looks much better without those stupid clips in his hair. Now, did I misunderstand, or was his sword completely destroyed in the fight? I thought he meant that becasue it was gone for good he coudn't chase his sister anymore. Too bad for him, I wonder what he will do now? Maybe, as is the tradition in shounen anime, not that he is defeated he will join the good guys?

And damn the cliffhanger!

DarthEnderX

Wed, 11-23-2005, 11:54 PM

I don't see how it could be gone for good. In the past a broken soul slayer has never been permanant. But you can't reform it till you've recovered from the fight. So Byakuya probably needs to go rest. And by the time he's finished, Rukia will be gone.

heero

Thu, 11-24-2005, 02:45 AM

hollow ichigo is insane and funky

Assassin

Thu, 11-24-2005, 02:47 AM

Knives122, if you're going to post manga pictures, make them links next time. Its a bitch having to scroll down all of that.

Anyway, as for the ep.......holy insane cliffhangers batman. I can't wait till the next episode. If memory serves, it should be an intresting one i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif.

Btw, to the manga readers: Doesn't bayakuya explain the whole deal with him wanting to kill rukia at this part in the manga? instead of just the lame 2 sentence speech he gave in the anime. Or does detailed explanation come at a later part?

Aramis

Thu, 11-24-2005, 05:50 AM

i don't read manga but i'm quite certain that was his whole reasoning, and it's a good one too. of course, you can't hope to fully understand someone who has lived as long as Byakuya.

Saranis

Thu, 11-24-2005, 07:04 AM

Meh, that episode was alright but I'm starting to get tired of all the different story lines going on at once. They need to wrap some up and focus on Ichigo. I really dont care who wins between the olg geezer and 2 captains and why should I? I am assuming they are in some plot which hasnt really been explained in any amount of detail, it kinda just looked like they decided 'wth, we wana fight'

Then they keep showing people traveling and talking about things which really hold no bearing on the current story. Maybe in the distant future they may but as for no its just boring.

Personally I liked it better before the whole Soul society thing began.

The Heretic Azazel

Thu, 11-24-2005, 11:44 AM

Yeah let's focus all on Ichigo and forget the other characters, that wouldn't be terribly boring at all.

chambers

Thu, 11-24-2005, 03:06 PM

i thought the way hollow ichy was animiated was very very nice, kinda makes me think that Iori from the KoF game would be animated int he same way. suits an insane guy to a tee.

ChibiYali

Thu, 11-24-2005, 03:28 PM

sooo... with the one week break.. think next one will be a double ep? or that something big will happen? (not talking about plot, we KNOW something big is going to happen there i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif)

That said, this was a good ep, loved it in the manga as well... This entire "who killed aizen and how are we going to save rukia" thing had me gnawing on my fake nails i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif
Can't wait for the animated "end" of the arc...
Hold onto thy horses!

DarthEnderX

Thu, 11-24-2005, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by: Saranis
Meh, that episode was alright but I'm starting to get tired of all the different story lines going on at once. They need to wrap some up and focus on Ichigo. I really dont care who wins between the olg geezer and 2 captains and why should I? I am assuming they are in some plot which hasnt really been explained in any amount of detail, it kinda just looked like they decided 'wth, we wana fight'

Then they keep showing people traveling and talking about things which really hold no bearing on the current story. Maybe in the distant future they may but as for no its just boring.

Personally I liked it better before the whole Soul society thing began.

That has to be a troll post.

Assassin

Thu, 11-24-2005, 05:11 PM

Saranis, its called plot development. If all you want is to see the main character fight every battle, try the naruto filler eps.

The Heretic Azazel

Thu, 11-24-2005, 06:53 PM

Two weeks and only a single episode.

Terracosmo

Thu, 11-24-2005, 07:26 PM

Pretty nice episode and conclusion to the battle. As with some of you, I preferred the manga version of this. It felt more dramatic for some reason. The hollow was however very sweet to see in anime action. Totally apeshit, just the way I like it. Next episode is going to be monumental. i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif

Hikyuu

Thu, 11-24-2005, 11:25 PM

ooo, Awesome episode ... So what do you guys think Hitsugaya saw? Im gonna go with Dogs playing poker except with hollows..

Assassin

Thu, 11-24-2005, 11:40 PM

i say it was gin playing poker with hinamori, since we see those two in the preview. And maybe yamaji is also there with ukitake and the samurai

DarthEnderX

Thu, 11-24-2005, 11:47 PM

I don't know whos normally supposed to be in the building, but I'm gonna guess that Hits saw whoever they are dead all over the place.

The Heretic Azazel

Fri, 11-25-2005, 12:19 AM

Gin is a smart man if he's playing poke-her with Hinamori.

Heh heh.

Kraco

Fri, 11-25-2005, 03:40 AM

I have no idea what they saw... But lots of dead people is a safe guess, I suppose. Although it could also be wrong.

Was that the place where Rukia got the info into her cell phone from? There needs to be some location giving the orders to the shinigamis in the real world. And so far we haven't actually seen that many high-tech or other possible information processing places.

el_boss

Fri, 11-25-2005, 06:33 AM

I think the dead bodies everywhere scenario is almost to simple. Mayby it's the first time anyone has actually been in there and all the "higher-ups" are like hollows or robots or just computers. It could also be that Aizen and/or Gin are sitting there. It would make alot of sence if Aizen was in on the whole conspiracy. If you think about it Gin used to be Aizen's vice captain.

On a different note: Do you think that hollow-Ichigo has something to do with Kaien-dono? Because he was killed by a hollow and the fact that they look so much alike can't be a coincidense. And we don't really what happenes to shinigamis that die. They might get reincarnated or something.

Munsu

Fri, 11-25-2005, 12:14 PM

I'm a fan of the dead bodies everywhere scenario myself... It also seems like Gin is back in action next episode, so he might've something to do with Ichimaru's surprised face...

el_boss

Fri, 11-25-2005, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by: Budweineken
I'm a fan of the dead bodies everywhere scenario myself... It also seems like Gin is back in action next episode, so he might've something to do with Ichimaru's surprised face...

Ummm, Ichimaru is Gin. His full name is Ichimaru Gin. But I'm assuming you meant Hitsuguya. It's obvious though that Gin has some sort of involvement, or that might just be what they want us to think. That Gin would be the bad guy feels too obvious.

Munsu

Fri, 11-25-2005, 12:34 PM

Lol yeah, Hitsugaya is what I meant...

Well, I'm tired of always trying to make a case for too obvious villians turning out to be good, and I always get proved wrong by the freaking series... There's apparently no such thing as a too obvious bad guy...

Assertn

Fri, 11-25-2005, 12:49 PM

I always assumed gin wasn't really the evil guy too

It'd be way too obvious

Munsu

Fri, 11-25-2005, 12:58 PM

Maybe I should join you guys in believing that Gin is good also... I think this is the first time I haven't been alone in thinking that a certain obvious bad guy might turn up being a good guy...

And whomever compared Inoue to Hinata earlier in a thread, can shut the fuck up... Don't compare Inoue to a shitty character like that...

Another thing I found interesting was when Ichigo and Byakuya clashed, the pressure produced knocked Yachiru off the tree branch... of course she did a safe landing on top of Ganju's head...

Kraco

Fri, 11-25-2005, 01:04 PM

Originally posted by: AssertnFailure
I always assumed gin wasn't really the evil guy too

Well, while it's possible he's not THE evil guy, he's somewhat evil nonetheless. I doubt a decent guy would tease Rukia like that, after all. Nor play with Hinamori like he did. And he was pretty happy to let the ryoka live, thus granting them a chance to get in and cause havoc. There's something wrong with him.

el_boss

Fri, 11-25-2005, 02:21 PM

Originally posted by: Budweineken
And whomever compared Inoue to Hinata earlier in a thread, can shut the fuck up... Don't compare Inoue to a shitty character like that...
Did I strike a sore spot or something? Are you seriously saying that the way Inoue acted wasn't similar to the way Hinata acts around Naruto? You wouldn't have reacted so strongly if there wasn't some truth to the statement.

Munsu

Fri, 11-25-2005, 02:33 PM

No, just saying that Hinata is the crappiest of the crappiest... So, go a little easier on Inoue

Sirian

Fri, 11-25-2005, 02:43 PM

well I aktually like Hinata, but they could kill Sakura and I would do "the happy dance" as one here has said^^

He could compare her to witchever char he want there will be always someone who is pissed by that i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

XanBcoo

Fri, 11-25-2005, 11:17 PM

Ugh, reading through 5 pages is what I get for being with family for thanksgiving instead of being on GW.

My thoughts on the episode have already been summed up, though.

1. Hollow Ichigo was really cool, especially the animation. However, I am kind of disappointed that even Bleach would resort to a hidden power boost when Ichigo gets in trouble. I guess it balances out though.

2. I hadn't considered that Hitsugaya had seen dead bodies everywhere. I thought it might have been something more earthshattering, but it seems VERY possible that he walked in on Gin standing amongst a bunch of fresh corpses. Or Gin could be good like the rest of you say. Who knows.

3. Did anyone notice the colors of Ichigo's and Byakuya's reiatsu? I thought it was funny that the good guy's was black and the baddie's was white. Though I suppose it fits Byakuya to have white energy.

4. I thought it was obvious that Byakuya was simply just a stickler for the rules. That's the impression I've had from him since his introduction to the series. I never really thought that there was anything besides that motive for killing Rukia (though I didn't rule out the possibility there WAS a larger conspiracy either). Was anyone else not suprised by his speech? Every bit of dialogue he's had has just proved he's an ass willing to kill his sister because she broke the law.

ChaosK

Fri, 11-25-2005, 11:20 PM

....wait, i was too lazy to read the last 5 pgs so screw it but

is there 3 releases now?
shikai-initial
bankai-secondary
senkai-3rd or final?

XanBcoo

Fri, 11-25-2005, 11:24 PM

Senkei is just the name of Byakuya's final form of Bankai. If anyone wants to check for the translation, post it. I forget what it means.

kooshi

Fri, 11-25-2005, 11:44 PM

Shikai and Bankai can have multiple ways of showing themselves. It's like how Tousen had that sleep thing he used on Ishida and the summoning of all those swords against Kenpachi.

DarthEnderX

Sat, 11-26-2005, 01:29 AM

Well, while I don't think Gin is the villain behind everything thats going on(for the aformentioned, he's just TOO obvious), he's definatly not a good guy. He's a huge dick. Kind of like how Byakuya isn't really a villain. Just a jerk.

I'm gonna have to assume there's some kind of Hollow controlling events here. I mean, they're supposed to be the badguys in this show.

Honinbou

Sat, 11-26-2005, 03:22 AM

Originally posted by: kooshi
Shikai and Bankai can have multiple ways of showing themselves. It's like how Tousen had that sleep thing he used on Ishida and the summoning of all those swords against Kenpachi.

hmmz Tousen didn't use his bankai against Ishida did he? he didn't say "bankai" but "sing" or something (cant remember exactly) so I guess that was his shikai..

Kraco

Sat, 11-26-2005, 04:40 AM

Originally posted by: XanBcoo
3. Did anyone notice the colors of Ichigo's and Byakuya's reiatsu? I thought it was funny that the good guy's was black and the baddie's was white. Though I suppose it fits Byakuya to have white energy.

Technically Byakuya isn't a bad guy. He's just extremely unsensitive and sticks to the law till the end. He's one of those people who think the letter of the law is more important than the spirit of the law. However, that doesn't make him a bad guy. Rukia broke the law and obviously her offense was bad enough to warrant a death penalty.

Moreover, Ichigo & company are people who broke into the SS and fought, destroyed property, and caused general havoc everywhere. To me, that sounds more like bad guys' action than following a law a bit too tightly and unmercifully - but still following the law.

Besides, nothing else but black would fit Zangetsu...

Naruto_RNG

Sat, 11-26-2005, 12:28 PM

I too think there are 3 stages once or release bankai. if it's true that would be cool. cause if ichigo reached his final sword tranformation now this early in the series, it could only mean one thing they're trying to finish the show soon. that would suck even more. does anybody remeber DBZ, SS3 was supppose to be the last transformation but DBGT had one more up it's sleeve. now i'm not comparing the animes but wouldn't be cool if ichi achived the 4th transformation using his hollow side.

FrogKing

Sat, 11-26-2005, 03:33 PM

Originally posted by: Honinbou

Originally posted by: kooshi
Shikai and Bankai can have multiple ways of showing themselves. It's like how Tousen had that sleep thing he used on Ishida and the summoning of all those swords against Kenpachi.

hmmz Tousen didn't use his bankai against Ishida did he? he didn't say "bankai" but "sing" or something (cant remember exactly) so I guess that was his shikai..

Just to clairify what I think Kooshi meant was that against Ishida he released by saying, "Sing Suzumushi" and against Kenpachi he had a second Shikai form "Benihikou Suzumshi". Therefore, it is perfectly conceivable that there are multiple froms of a Bankai. The said example is from Byakuya's 3 forms: 1) Kageyoshi 2) Senkei Senbonzakura Kageyoshi 3) Shuukei Hakuteiken. I think that Ichigo has a long way to becoming more skilled in his Bankai (and Shikai for that matter)
Mmmmmmmm, turkey......

edit: I realized that form and release are not comparable, so I omitted release when I really meant form.

XanBcoo

Sat, 11-26-2005, 03:51 PM

Originally posted by: Kraco
Technically Byakuya isn't a bad guy. He's just extremely unsensitive and sticks to the law till the end. He's one of those people who think the letter of the law is more important than the spirit of the law. However, that doesn't make him a bad guy. Rukia broke the law and obviously her offense was bad enough to warrant a death penalty.

Yeah, I knew that. I was just using "goodguy" and "badguy" in the traditional sense of the terms (as in, the good guy's energy is usually pure white, and the baddie's is black). I like how Bleach made the contrast in this episode, and I was just wondering if the colors of their energy's are more of a metaphor (maybe Byakuya's white reiatsu stands for the Justice of SS), or just for style (like how Byaku = white, and as you said, nothing else but Black would fit Zangetsu).

Also, Tousen obviously has multiple attacks with his Shikai. We saw him use one against Ishida and the other against Zaraki. I don't think they are separate forms, just different abilities.

mage

Sat, 11-26-2005, 06:27 PM

in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

el_boss

Sat, 11-26-2005, 07:42 PM

Originally posted by: mage
in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

Your point being? Does it bother you that the "hero" has a black aura? I bet you would rather it were "white white vs white white."

Sirian

Sat, 11-26-2005, 09:34 PM

Black is much cooler anyway. i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

ChaosK

Sat, 11-26-2005, 10:02 PM

wait...if there are 3 forms of release, then ichigo beat byakuya's 3rd release with a 2nd? thats bullshit...

The Heretic Azazel

Sat, 11-26-2005, 10:07 PM

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: mage
in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

Your point being? Does it bother you that the "hero" has a black aura? I bet you would rather it were "white white vs white white."

Well, I found it funny that the manga said that i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif

Byakuya has white pride baby!!

kooshi

Sat, 11-26-2005, 11:41 PM

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
wait...if there are 3 forms of release, then ichigo beat byakuya's 3rd release with a 2nd? thats bullshit...

I was probably not clear on my previous post, but Shikai and Bankai can have different.... representations.

Examples: Tousen's Shikai includes:
- Nake (Sing)
- Suzumushi Form 2: Benihikou

Ikkaku's Shikai includes:
- Extend
- Split

Byakuya's Bankai includes:
- Kageyoshi (Blossom Brutal Shadows)
- Senkei Senbonzakura Kageyoshi (Thousand Cherry Blossoms Brutal Shadows)
- Shuukei Hakuteiken (White Imperial Sword)

Carnage

Sun, 11-27-2005, 12:14 AM

Wow. One of the best episodes so far. That hollow Ichigo was so badass. But now Ichigo seems so powerful, the only person left that i can of to beat Ichigo is Yamaji.

DarthEnderX

Sun, 11-27-2005, 03:53 AM

I don't think thats right about Tousen.

Sing Suzumushi is him releasing his shikai.

Benihikou Suzumshi is his shikai's special spell-like ability.

XanBcoo

Sun, 11-27-2005, 12:39 PM

Darthender, a shikai alone is just the form of the sword. Everything else along with it is it's ability. Kooshi is exactly right.

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: mage
in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

Your point being? Does it bother you that the "hero" has a black aura? I bet you would rather it were "white white vs white white."
No one said it bothers anyone. Mage was just answering my point about the "reverse roles" of the reiatsu colors. Turns out it was a metaphor referring to Ichigo's will and Byakuya's pride. No one's getting racey, dude.

ChaosK

Sun, 11-27-2005, 02:40 PM

wasnt tousens dark thingy his bankai?

el_boss

Sun, 11-27-2005, 03:34 PM

Originally posted by: XanBcoo

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: mage
in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

Your point being? Does it bother you that the "hero" has a black aura? I bet you would rather it were "white white vs white white."
No one said it bothers anyone. Mage was just answering my point about the "reverse roles" of the reiatsu colors. Turns out it was a metaphor referring to Ichigo's will and Byakuya's pride. No one's getting racey, dude.

We all know what he meant. You don't need to protect him. Remember this is the guy that has been known to say things like "go lie in a tub of bleach, 'cause black people aren't wanted" and "is it ok to say I hate black people".

mage

Sun, 11-27-2005, 03:53 PM

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: mage
in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

Your point being? Does it bother you that the "hero" has a black aura? I bet you would rather it were "white white vs white white."
it took me awhile to figure out what you were talking about, but, good one.

The Heretic Azazel

Sun, 11-27-2005, 04:45 PM

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: XanBcoo

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: mage
in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

Your point being? Does it bother you that the "hero" has a black aura? I bet you would rather it were "white white vs white white."
No one said it bothers anyone. Mage was just answering my point about the "reverse roles" of the reiatsu colors. Turns out it was a metaphor referring to Ichigo's will and Byakuya's pride. No one's getting racey, dude.

We all know what he meant. You don't need to protect him. Remember this is the guy that has been known to say things like "go lie in a tub of bleach, 'cause black people aren't wanted" and "is it ok to say I hate black people".

There's no need for pointless flaming, so don't.

yapchagi

Sun, 11-27-2005, 04:51 PM

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
wait...if there are 3 forms of release, then ichigo beat byakuya's 3rd release with a 2nd? thats bullshit...

Actually, Ichigo beat Byakuya with only his 1st form of Bankai, but then he used Getsuga Tenshou while he's in the 1st form of his bankai.
And Byakuya is using the 3rd form of his bankai.

I would say that Ichigo has the following :
shikai mode - 1st form is the normal one with Zangetsu sword, 2nd form is Getsuga Tenshou.
bankai mode - 1st form is when he fights Byakuya, 2nd form unknown.

el_boss

Sun, 11-27-2005, 04:59 PM

Originally posted by: The Heretic Azazel

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: XanBcoo

Originally posted by: el_boss

Originally posted by: mage
in the manga there is a cover page that has ichigo and byakuya on it and says Black Passion vs White Pride

Your point being? Does it bother you that the "hero" has a black aura? I bet you would rather it were "white white vs white white."
No one said it bothers anyone. Mage was just answering my point about the "reverse roles" of the reiatsu colors. Turns out it was a metaphor referring to Ichigo's will and Byakuya's pride. No one's getting racey, dude.

We all know what he meant. You don't need to protect him. Remember this is the guy that has been known to say things like "go lie in a tub of bleach, 'cause black people aren't wanted" and "is it ok to say I hate black people".

There's no need for pointless flaming, so don't.

Flaming? You mean what XanBcoo said?

The Heretic Azazel

Sun, 11-27-2005, 05:36 PM

No..

Mage has been a good little boy lately, he was just making an observation which was funny. I'd like to see the race stuff be over and done with now.

XanBcoo

Sun, 11-27-2005, 07:00 PM

Me too.

I would say that Ichigo has the following :
shikai mode - 1st form is the normal one with Zangetsu sword, 2nd form is Getsuga Tenshou.
bankai mode - 1st form is when he fights Byakuya, 2nd form unknown:
No, Ichigo's Shikai has only one form, just like the rest. It is possible that they have multiple abilities though. The same goes for Bankai.

DarthEnderX

Sun, 11-27-2005, 09:06 PM

You know what people, none of you know wtf your talking about. All this 1st forms 2nd forms bullcrap. There's no system to it. Whenever the writer wants a character to have a new power he's just gonna add one. If he wants Byakuya's bankai to have 5 different shapes then it will, with no reguard to the rest of all that.

Overthinking people. Jesus christ.

Oolite

Mon, 11-28-2005, 02:23 AM

Originally posted by: DarthEnder
Well, while I don't think Gin is the villain behind everything thats going on(for the aformentioned, he's just TOO obvious), he's definatly not a good guy. He's a huge dick. Kind of like how Byakuya isn't really a villain. Just a jerk.

I'm gonna have to assume there's some kind of Hollow controlling events here. I mean, they're supposed to be the badguys in this show.

I think you are over thinking too. i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif

Everything are on the table, in the next few shows things will become apparent. It depends on how much they wanted to stretch the story line.

Kensee

Mon, 11-28-2005, 01:24 PM

Originally posted by: XanBcoo
Me too.

I would say that Ichigo has the following :
shikai mode - 1st form is the normal one with Zangetsu sword, 2nd form is Getsuga Tenshou.
bankai mode - 1st form is when he fights Byakuya, 2nd form unknown:
No, Ichigo's Shikai has only one form, just like the rest. It is possible that they have multiple abilities though. The same goes for Bankai.

Yep, the multiple moves you guys see are just different abilities of the Shaki n stuff (this is noticed when Ichigo says thats impressive but his sword only taught him ONE ability). Pretty much what he is saying is the answer to all specilation, that in fact there is only 1 shikai and only 1 bankai, but of course you can learn certain techinques for each form (usually the Shikai form). In tossen's case, his shikai has two attack techniques .. the circle he used on the Quincy, and the Rain of blades he used on Kenpachi, that is not his SHIKAI but just attacks he can use (much like how Ichigo can use the attack technique that shoots out a beam of energy etc).

Bayaka really only has 1 bankai, its just he cna manipulate it depending on his situation. If he wants defense and attack, he does sakura flowers, if he wants all out attack and no defense he does his sphere of swords thing.

Yeah and theres still a lot of the story to be uncovered (hell the Manga isnt that farther off from the anime so even manga readers still have so many unanswered questions). SO just sit back and let it come =D.

FrogKing

Mon, 11-28-2005, 03:00 PM

Originally posted by: XanBcoo

I would say that Ichigo has the following :
shikai mode - 1st form is the normal one with Zangetsu sword, 2nd form is Getsuga Tenshou.
bankai mode - 1st form is when he fights Byakuya, 2nd form unknown:
No, Ichigo's Shikai has only one form, just like the rest. It is possible that they have multiple abilities though. The same goes for Bankai.
Actually, XanBcoo I think this is a semantic argument because I would argue that there is only 1 Shikai and 1 Bankai release ; however, there are multiple forms for each release. Form is defined as "the essence of something; the mode in which a thing exists, acts, or manifests itself." Whereas, ability is defined as " the quality of being able to do something to accomplish something." In this case, ability is a little broad, but form I think is fitting because of the nature of each Zanpaktu. As far as we know, the Zanpaktu in the essence of the sword and each Zanpaktu has 2 releases (Shikai and Bankai); however, how the Zanpaktu manifests itself can be in multiple forms (exactly how Kensee stated it in his post above).
Furthermore, the translations in the anime (I haven't read the manga translations) states on a couple occasions a reference to form (and more loosely to ability).
Byakuya, "The true form of Senbonzakura."
Byakuya (to Ichigo), "So it was not you in that form who was trying to attack me relentlessly."
I actually tend to agree with Darth's latter statement about a writer and the freedom to make liberal interprutations of his 'rules'.

Orginally posted by: DarthEnder
Whenever the writer wants a character to have a new power he's just gonna add one. If he wants Byakuya's bankai to have 5 different shapes then it will, with no reguard to the rest of all that.
However, in the end I think Kensee hit it on the nail:

Originally posted by: Kensee
Yeah and theres still a lot of the story to be uncovered (hell the Manga isnt that farther off from the anime so even manga readers still have so many unanswered questions). SO just sit back and let it come =D.

XanBcoo

Mon, 11-28-2005, 03:12 PM

Originally posted by: FrogKing
Actually, XanBcoo I think this is a semantic argument because I would argue...

You're right, "release" is a better word, but my point is still the same. The different forms and abilities of the soul slayers are not different releases. And yes, of course the original artist/storywriter has certain freedoms pertaining to the rules he's set up as part of his "universe", I was just trying to clarify my point above.

But overall, I agree with you and Kensee.

Carnage

Mon, 11-28-2005, 03:48 PM

Just simply think of it like this:

there are two releases of a soulslayer:

1.) Shikai

2.) Bankai

the two forms can have different multiple attacks each.

there u go

ChaosK

Mon, 11-28-2005, 08:30 PM

Originally posted by: yapchagi

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
wait...if there are 3 forms of release, then ichigo beat byakuya's 3rd release with a 2nd? thats bullshit...

Actually, Ichigo beat Byakuya with only his 1st form of Bankai, but then he used Getsuga Tenshou while he's in the 1st form of his bankai.
And Byakuya is using the 3rd form of his bankai.

I would say that Ichigo has the following :
shikai mode - 1st form is the normal one with Zangetsu sword, 2nd form is Getsuga Tenshou.
bankai mode - 1st form is when he fights Byakuya, 2nd form unknown.

umm...u mis understood me.

i meant there are 3 releases, not 3 forms of bankai.
like ichigo said he couldnt beat byakuya's bankai with his shikai, so he did bankai vs bankai, and won, but then byakuya did something called "senkai" and i interperted it to be his 3rd release, and thus ichigo still being at his second release (bankai) defeated byakuya's 3rd release? according to ichigo's logic with beating byakuya's bankai with his own bankai, he should've had to go "senkai" too in order to defeat byakuya's senkai.

FrogKing

Mon, 11-28-2005, 08:55 PM

Chaos, I think I understand what you are getting at and I think you are incorrect. I went back and rewatched the episode and I think that there are only 2 releases (Shikai and Bankai) but multiple forms. Based on that, I think your logic is a little skewed. See Kensee and my above posts.

Phoenix20578

Mon, 11-28-2005, 09:58 PM

Originally posted by: FrogKing
Chaos, I think I understand what you are getting at and I think you are incorrect. I went back and rewatched the episode and I think that there are only 2 releases (Shikai and Bankai) but multiple forms. Based on that, I think your logic is a little skewed. See Kensee and my above posts.

I agree. If we remember, Ichigo said that he doesn't know any impresive techniques like Byakuya. We can
then assume that Byakuya has been using techniques and not a 3rd release.

Anyway, further proof that the creater of VGCats.com is obsessed with Anime and Bleach

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/8686/bankaidesktop8006ce.jpg

XanBcoo

Mon, 11-28-2005, 10:12 PM

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
i meant there are 3 releases, not 3 forms of bankai.
like ichigo said he couldnt beat byakuya's bankai with his shikai, so he did bankai vs bankai, and won, but then byakuya did something called "senkai" and i interperted it to be his 3rd release, and thus ichigo still being at his second release (bankai) defeated byakuya's 3rd release? according to ichigo's logic with beating byakuya's bankai with his own bankai, he should've had to go "senkai" too in order to defeat byakuya's senkai.

CK, did you not read my post where I explained to you that Senkei is the name of the particular form/ability that Byakuya is using??

Senkei ("execution ground" - judging from DB's translation) does not = senkai

Kensee

Tue, 11-29-2005, 01:38 AM

Originally posted by: Phoenix20578

Originally posted by: FrogKing
Chaos, I think I understand what you are getting at and I think you are incorrect. I went back and rewatched the episode and I think that there are only 2 releases (Shikai and Bankai) but multiple forms. Based on that, I think your logic is a little skewed. See Kensee and my above posts.

I agree. If we remember, Ichigo said that he doesn't know any impresive techniques like Byakuya. We can
then assume that Byakuya has been using techniques and not a 3rd release.

Anyway, further proof that the creater of VGCats.com is obsessed with Anime and Bleach

http://img202.imageshack.us/img202/8686/bankaidesktop8006ce.jpg

Yeah Frog's logic/explanation is how most people interpret it ...
That picture rocks >_<! OMG hahahah I'm gonna make it my desktop wallpaper!

Edit: noo looks horrible as a wallpaper =P

FrogKing

Tue, 11-29-2005, 02:13 AM

Lol, Kensee I tried to use it for a wallpaper but the resolution was not right. If you go to their website, they have some various sizes.

Kensee

Tue, 11-29-2005, 08:46 AM

Originally posted by: FrogKing
Lol, Kensee I tried to use it for a wallpaper but the resolution was not right. If you go to their website, they have some various sizes.

There's a website?? Wha?

edit: silly me, it's on the picture -_-

ChaosK

Tue, 11-29-2005, 06:26 PM

Originally posted by: XanBcoo

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
i meant there are 3 releases, not 3 forms of bankai.
like ichigo said he couldnt beat byakuya's bankai with his shikai, so he did bankai vs bankai, and won, but then byakuya did something called "senkai" and i interperted it to be his 3rd release, and thus ichigo still being at his second release (bankai) defeated byakuya's 3rd release? according to ichigo's logic with beating byakuya's bankai with his own bankai, he should've had to go "senkai" too in order to defeat byakuya's senkai.

CK, did you not read my post where I explained to you that Senkei is the name of the particular form/ability that Byakuya is using??

Senkei ("execution ground" - judging from DB's translation) does not = senkai

nope i dont read....

Carnage

Tue, 11-29-2005, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo

Originally posted by: XanBcoo

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
i meant there are 3 releases, not 3 forms of bankai.
like ichigo said he couldnt beat byakuya's bankai with his shikai, so he did bankai vs bankai, and won, but then byakuya did something called "senkai" and i interperted it to be his 3rd release, and thus ichigo still being at his second release (bankai) defeated byakuya's 3rd release? according to ichigo's logic with beating byakuya's bankai with his own bankai, he should've had to go "senkai" too in order to defeat byakuya's senkai.

CK, did you not read my post where I explained to you that Senkei is the name of the particular form/ability that Byakuya is using??

Senkei ("execution ground" - judging from DB's translation) does not = senkai

nope i dont read....

Then You need Hooked on Phonix!
i/expressions/rolleye.gif

el_boss

Tue, 11-29-2005, 08:43 PM

I was just browsing the bleach thread and noticed something odd. There is no episode 60 realease thread. So I though "wierd better get it up then". A second later it struck me. There is no episode 60 this week. This made me sad, now I will go and cry myself to sleep.

Munsu

Wed, 11-30-2005, 12:25 AM

Same shit happened to me... I have to study all night and really wanted to watch 60 when I took a break...

DarthEnderX

Wed, 11-30-2005, 01:56 AM

Heh, yeah, I go click on DB's site like I do everyweek but I notice episode 60 is listed as by YHTB. Fortunatly, I remember thats what they name their joke subs before I even clicked on it.

yapchagi

Wed, 11-30-2005, 02:06 AM

Originally posted by: Kensee
Yep, the multiple moves you guys see are just different abilities of the Shaki n stuff (this is noticed when Ichigo says thats impressive but his sword only taught him ONE ability). Pretty much what he is saying is the answer to all specilation, that in fact there is only 1 shikai and only 1 bankai, but of course you can learn certain techinques for each form (usually the Shikai form). In tossen's case, his shikai has two attack techniques .. the circle he used on the Quincy, and the Rain of blades he used on Kenpachi, that is not his SHIKAI but just attacks he can use (much like how Ichigo can use the attack technique that shoots out a beam of energy etc).

Bayaka really only has 1 bankai, its just he cna manipulate it depending on his situation. If he wants defense and attack, he does sakura flowers, if he wants all out attack and no defense he does his sphere of swords thing.

Yeah and theres still a lot of the story to be uncovered (hell the Manga isnt that farther off from the anime so even manga readers still have so many unanswered questions). SO just sit back and let it come =D.

Maybe I should say it this way...
There are 2 stages:
- Shikai.
- Bankai.

And for each stage, there are probably more than 1 form depending on the user if he/she is able to use the it.

Captain Tousen:
So far, we've only seen 2 forms while he's in SHIKAI stage.
When he fought the Quincy, he used some form (not 2nd form) and the 2nd form Benihikou he used againts Zaraki Kenpachi. (Notice that he said Suzumushi second form: Benihikou)

We're not sure if it was the 1st form (when he used to the Quincy) or maybe it was the 3rd form...well he didn't say it. He may have more than 2 forms right?

Kuchiki Byakuya:
While he's in Bankai stage...He has 3 forms:
- Senbonzakura Kageyoshi.
- Senkei Senbonzakura Kageyoshi.
- Shuukei Hakureiken (the final form or the true form)

Simply, 2 Stages:
STAGE 1 SHIKAI :
- 1st form
- 2nd form
- etc

STAGE 2 BANKAI :
- 1st form
- 2nd form
- etc

And of course, u can use all the forms of Shikai stage when u're in Bankai stage. (Notice Ichigo used Getsuga Tenshou while he's in Bankai stage).
But u can't use any of the forms in Bankai stage while u're only in Shikai stage.
Well maybe someone can if he's strong enough while in Shikai stage.

It's just like u can read CD with a DVD-ROM, but u can't read DVD with a CD-ROM.

FrogKing

Wed, 11-30-2005, 03:08 AM

I think that this is a fitting time to drop Xan's previous reply...

Originally posted by: XanBcoo
http://img506.imageshack.us/img506/5244/lastweek0bg.jpg

Kraco

Wed, 11-30-2005, 04:01 AM

Originally posted by: DarthEnder
Heh, yeah, I go click on DB's site like I do everyweek but I notice episode 60 is listed as by YHTB. Fortunatly, I remember thats what they name their joke subs before I even clicked on it.

Uhhuh. I haven't been too interested in those ever since I happened to download that gay stuff...

XanBcoo

Wed, 11-30-2005, 12:09 PM

DB did a joke sub for ep. 60? What was it this time?

EDIT: Nevermind, I just looked at the Episode 60 release thread.

masamuneehs

Wed, 11-30-2005, 03:53 PM

Wow, i finally got around to watching this episode. Pretty damn good shit!

I am still a little pissed that Byakuya didn't last longer, and that he really didn't explain his feelings towards Rukia (all he addressed was his will to adhere to the rules...) but the fight was pretty kick-ass and I'm glad that Hollow-Ichi is finally getting some screen time. I have always suspected that this was the case with Ichigo, and I'm glad it wasn't me just overanalyizing the stuff.

Off to watch the fake sub. Should be pretty funny. Looks like they're poking fun at Lunar and all the groups that use a shit ton of slang in their subtitles. The opening lyric translations were pretty fucking funny in and of themselves.

Kraco

Wed, 11-30-2005, 04:47 PM

Originally posted by: masamuneehs
...and that he really didn't explain his feelings towards Rukia (all he addressed was his will to adhere to the rules...)

Ah, well. He also said, what comes to feelings, that he didn't have such useless things in the first place...

XanBcoo

Wed, 11-30-2005, 05:43 PM

Originally posted by: masamuneehs
Off to watch the fake sub. Should be pretty funny. Looks like they're poking fun at Lunar and all the groups that use a shit ton of slang in their subtitles. The opening lyric translations were pretty fucking funny in and of themselves.

I watched them this morning. Quite funny actually. Byakuya now ends all of his sentences with "nigga" i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif

My favorite parts:
"They're more than just homies. Kuchiki is Kurosaki's boo."
"WTF Nigga?"
I can't remember the exact wording, but Central 46 is now a crack house that Hitsugaya is busting down to get the money back that they owe him. He also tells Matsumoto to get her bitch-ass home and make him some pie.

aznimperialx

Sun, 12-04-2005, 05:29 PM

Finally caught up, Riuka's brother is a dick head and Ichigo is overrated

Parkalash

Sun, 12-04-2005, 07:33 PM

Havent read all the page's just the first thee page's. So i dunno if anyone has mentioned this. But the hollow ichigo that appear's seem to be the same ichigo that appear's in episode 39 When he is fighting Zaraki Kenpachi and is in that insideworld of his..

Munsu

Sun, 12-04-2005, 07:43 PM

Not sure if anyone mentioned that, but I thought it was obvious...

Jadugar

Sun, 12-04-2005, 07:48 PM

Originally posted by: aznimperialx
Finally caught up, Riuka's brother is a dick head and Ichigo is overrated

Yes, Byakuya is a dick head but Ichigo is not overrated. Watch the episode agian.

darkmetal505

Sun, 12-04-2005, 07:52 PM

Originally posted by: Jadugar

Originally posted by: aznimperialx
Finally caught up, Riuka's brother is a dick head and Ichigo is overrated

Yes, Byakuya is a dick head but Ichigo is not overrated. Watch the episode agian.

nah, byakuya is not a dick head, but ichigo is overrated

aznimperialx

Sun, 12-04-2005, 11:10 PM

Originally posted by: Jadugar

Originally posted by: aznimperialx
Finally caught up, Riuka's brother is a dick head and Ichigo is overrated

Yes, Byakuya is a dick head but Ichigo is not overrated. Watch the episode agian.

I don't need to watch the esp again. Its my opinion

Kovash

Sun, 12-04-2005, 11:16 PM

Oh god...

While I am curious as to what part of Ichigo was acctually fully hollow, I get the imporession that it's going to become an annoyingly convinient plot device that could perceiveably ruin the show for me.

I'm just fickle though.

Kensee

Mon, 12-05-2005, 12:07 AM

Not really a bad plot device that was just put in ... well not in my opinion...

I like bayaka but I guess he's misunderstood a bit, hopefully next few episodes will clear up his reasons and show another side of him?
Ichigo is like most heros, at least he won using his own strength at the end rather then letting the hallow part of him clench victory yenno? Then again haven't you noticed Ichigo learns from his hollow side? When he was ontop of the execution grounds, he swung his sword by the handle wrap just like the hollow did, and at that time he said "I never thought of using [insert sword's name here] in that way," so maybe he'll learn a new attack (hollow ichigo is SUICIDAL which reminds me of my GUNz character when i strap on rocket launchers +D)

Anyhow all good, Im ready for the next episode!