Book: Harry Potter -Half Blood Prince-

[masamuneehs]

How is there not a topic on this?!?!

Oh my god, I just finished this book and my head is still spinning with all the things that I'm left with and the questions I have about teh next book!!

POST your reactions, thoughts, speculations, feelings ANYTHING!!

Cuz I'm sure going to go on a tired when I'm good and well-rested (worked all day and then read right up until a little bit ago)

1. Dumbledore - I was just a little saddened but had a (false) suspicion that he was being controlled by Snaper or Vold the entire time. But he needed to go otherwise HArry would always have a thing in the back of his head saying "Dumbledore will save me! Dumbeldore can help!" when he faces Vold for the big showdown. Harry needs to firmly realize that he is the head role in taking down Vold, not Dumbledore, and now he has no choice but to face it.

2. Draco Malfoy - Finally some character development and wits displayed by this young guy! He's always been one of my favorites because I sort of had a suspicion since book 1 that he was going to be very important in the grand scheme of things. Prior to this book he was a trifle, an occasional annoyance, a small-time hazard. But he finally pulled through and even surprised himself with how much of a regular honest to God human he is deep down. He also took a lot of spotlight as the #1 villian of the hour (naturally Vold looms largest in the background, but I felt like Draco was the biggest concern, at least to Harry, for the 6th book)

3. Romance - finally progressed a little bit beyond middle school level. But perhaps the development with Harry and Ginny was TOO fast I ask myself? Cho as a total non-entity also shook me for the first couple chapters. Lots of interesting couples set up...

4. Snape - I honestly never expected he was the Half Blood Prince. I thought his Vow in Chapter 2 was a part of his plan to serve Dumbledore better. I was wrong. God he is set up well to be a #2 villain for the final book! And some of his past actions, like actually weakening Harry during Occulmency lessons in Book 5, make sense now.

5. Slughorn - Was sort of pissed when he emerged. Didn't really want him to play the cookie-cutter role of New Dark Arts teacher being a big problem for Harry. A very believable character and didn't play the role I was afraid he might. Actually a breath of fresh air.

6. Felix Felics - that luck potion - Way too much of a Deus Ex Machina for me... But the scene After the Burial was so well-written! I loved that part anyway, despite its impossibility and blatant convienece for the main characters... Was pissed that it save the members of the DA though, couple of expirienced Death Eaters should be able to take down a bunch of twerps....

7. Death Eater choice of spells - Why not Avada Kerdava every enemy? Rowling never established or explained how or why certain Dark spells are used when they are. Do you have to have some sort of requirement to kill a person with Avada? Wormtongue did Cedric Diggory and he didn't even know the guy... just like a bullet from a easilly pulled trigger. But then they run in using hexes that don't do much more than burn or hurt their enemies when attacking Hogwarts?!?! No taking advantage of the smoke cover to kill off enemies? No being smart and making people dance uncontrollably or sneeze so that they can't fight and become sitting ducks?

Also, why do some people shout spells (usually the good guys) far faster than their attackers. You'd think "Crucio!" would be a quick short attack, but it gets cut off by "Expelliaramus!" and counter jinxes.... No reference to wand movements playing a part in the logistics of battle... oh well, maybe I'm just too much of a hard nose for such conflict specific aspects...

Anyway, what did you all think about the book? And can anyone throw out a guess as to who R.A.B may be? I think I have a decent guess...

[Roko]

Good question...I finished the book on Sunday and it never occured to me to make a topic...

well, I agree with all you said. I thought it really sucked that Dumbledore died, but it had to happen; plus, we finally get to see whose side Snape is on. My first thoughts upon finishing the book was "wow, guess it's not gonna be 8 books based on Harry's school years anymore."

What I was curious about was how he still thought there were 4 Horcruxes...I mean, didn't R.A.B. (I've been trying to figure out who this is...no luck so far) say he destroyed the locket?

Romance finally progressed, but it was dissapointing that Ginny didn't join Harry and co.; it would be cool if members of the D.A. such as Neville and Luna helped them, but I highly doubt it'll happen.

At first, I thought the person who took the locket might have been Slughorn since he typically knew Voldemort's secret, but then the initials didn't fit. What's your guess on who it is, masamuneehs?

[2:25]

I've finished the book a few days ago too.
It was good; I've enjoyed it more than Da Vinci Code.

Am a bit sad that Dumbledore's dead. He was my favourite character :< I can't help but feel that there's some twist to it. Like maybe he's still alive but pretending to be dead. It can't be that dark, right? It was, after all, originally labelled as a children's book :/

[Honoko]

well, i'm glad alot of things were cleared away-- like snape's loyalty. but that whole R.A.B. thing is annoying.

as for "it can't be that dark"-- i hope u'be been noticing the trend since book 4. plus in book 6, the way ron constantly asks "so who died this week?" to me indicates how desensitized that world is now w/ all the dying. so dumbledore dying isn't that much of a stretch. besides, it was bound to happen.

as for my thoughts-- i'm just glad harry's character made improvment over his book 5 personality. i can't stand reading teenagers in angst and rowling always does a hell of a job capturing the thougths of an age group. she suceeded a bit too well in book 5 =P so book 6 where harry's still grieving but able to function properly (as much as he is able to function =P) allowed me to raise my opinion of him again.

i feel like bk 6 finally returned to the feeling it had for books 1-3. no? yes?

[SK]

Originally posted by: 2-25
I've finished the book a few days ago too.
It was good; I've enjoyed it more than Da Vinci Code.

Am a bit sad that Dumbledore's dead. He was my favourite character :< I can't help but feel that there's some twist to it. Like maybe he's still alive but pretending to be dead. It can't be that dark, right? It was, after all, originally labelled as a children's book :/

great post. first referring to the Da Vinci Code, theyre 2 totally different genres of books, so i dont see how you can compare them, but if youre going to then i dont see how the Da Vinci Code isnt better. didnt you realize once his picture is up on the wall he really is dead, that was the point of rowling telling us that.

i thought it was clear for most of the novel dumbledore was going to die. the way he was showing harry everything and trying to give him the tools to beat voldemort and basically send him on the quest for the horcruxes, he seemed to know he might not be around any longer. the only curveball i seen possible was snape dying, it was always possible that he really was on the orders side, and would die from breaking the unbreakable vow. i thought voldemort was the half blood prince for sure, he was half pure Slytherin blood, the Slytherin heir, which might make him view himself as a prince.

im happy that harry finally got laid.

edit: honoko books 1-3 were not nearly as dark as 4 on.

[Winged Dancer]

I finished it on sunday morning or something, was waiting for someone to make a post

Dumbledore's thing almost shocked me. I kept thinking that maybe SNape hadn't killed him - that it was another spell disguised as an Avada Kedavra or something.

I still think we can't say anything regarding Snape's loyalties yet. When he was "running away", why did he keep on almost teaching Harry? Like "learn to close your mind!" and that kind of stuff. If he was a real real bad guy he would've, I dunno, just insulted him?
'Sides, I get the feeling that when Dumbledore was "pleading", he was pleading for Snape to actually kill him, and that's why Snape was overheard saying stuff like "I can't do this anymore" and so on.

I was actually happy they gave Draco a bigger part. Last book he was just there to be stupid and help that Um-something cow (last book sucks IMO) but now he really got a chance to at least grow a little as a character.

What makes me interested in book 7 (besides the facts that its the last one) is that it'll be so different. We wont have Hogwarts. We wont have OMG I got to win Quidditch. It'll be Harry, Ron and Hermione searching for the Horcruxes or something... it's just going to be such a different structure, if it really is like that. No teachers, no classes, no "I have homework so I can't fight the Dark Lord right now!!1". So yeah, I kinda wanna see that.

BTW, how many Horcruxes are really left? Four? Or three? Slytherin's locket was false, yes, but this RAB guy wrote he would destroy it before dying. Does Harry need to be "armed" with the Horcruxed objects in order to defeat Voldemort? Or is it enough to just destroy them? If its so, then he has only three left, I would think.
At any rate, I guess he'll have to go and find whether this RAB really destroyed it or not.

[SK]

he has to destroy them or else voldemort will still exist. the thing with the slytherin locket, is that before they had a clue to where it was, and now who knows where the RAB guy had hidden it. so theres still 4. the only person ive heard with anything near RAB is Regulus Black, Sirius' uncle i think. im wondering who is going to teach harry now, he isnt near good enough to go against snape or voldemort.
why would dumbledore plead for snape to kill him?
EDIT: Just thought of this if it is Regulus Black, who had deserted Voldemort, he could have hidden it in the Black house, which mean Harry now owns it.
EDIT2: O shit, Dumbledore could have been pleading for Snape to do it so that Dumbledore wasnt destroyed by Death Eaters, and because he knew Snape had to keep up the act. The look of disgust and hatred could of been because of what he was made to do. Plus if Dumbledore knew about the Unbreakable Vow ( I cant remember if he did) then he wouldent want Snape to kill himself, which would have happened if he didnt kill Dumbledore.

[Honoko]

Originally posted by: SK
edit: honoko books 1-3 were not nearly as dark as 4 on.
Of course. But in terms of book structure, humor, and a lack of details (ie, writing style) *compared to books 4 and 5* I would say that Rowling reverted back to how she wrote in the beginning. There's a level of "childishness" that's returned that was lost by the end of book 4 and all of book 5.

At any rate, seems like Harry's got a new quest set up for him in book 7. I think it's a good change from the previous books. I'm pretty convinced that Snape was always on Voldemort's side. And that Regulus Black theory sounds pretty good. But isn't he dead? Does that mean he destroyed the locket with himself?

[SK]

Yeah he is dead, in the note he said he would be dead by the time someone found it, but that he has hidden the locket. I'm now thinking Snape is on the Order's side, Dumbledore must have had some reason to trust him.
edit: http://www.filefarmer.com/Xizer/pottercrash.MOV

[masamuneehs]

I will take a stab and guess that R.A.B. is Regulus Black, Sirius' younger brother.
If I remeber correctly, he was a Death Eater who deserted and was tracked down quite viciously. That's how he would address Voldermort as "Dark Lord" and seem to have had a relationship with him. I know this is sort of a stretch because Dumbledore made it seem like the Death Eaters wouldnt know about the Horcrux, at least Lucius Malfoy didn't... Also "I know I'll be dead long before you read this" fits with Regulus being tracked down only two days after deserting the Death Eaters.

As to Snape still possibly being a double agent... unless Dumbledore really did ask Snape to kill him... I dunno, I just see him as evil through and through. But he might have been instructed to do so, ... interesting thought. He also did signal the retreat quickly and was very reluctant to fight Harry, even ordering the other Eaters not to harm him "because Voldermort wants to do him"

As for 7 Horcruxes.
1. Riddle's diary - destroyed by Harry
2. Marvolo's Ring - destroyed by Dumbledore
3. Slytherin locket - R.A.B. (destroyed, or just hidden?)
4. Hufflepuff Cup - missing
5. "Something of Ravenclaw's or Gryffindors" - tho Dumbledore points out that Gryffindor's sword is the only last know relic of him, safely away from Voldemort
6. Nagini the Snake - with Voldemort
7. Voldemort himself.

Now, I just have been wondering about this, and it might be totally stupid but I'm saying it anyway:

What if Harry is the last Horcrux?

Consider this: Voldemort would try to make 7 before he died. Dumbledore says he was going to try to make the 7th after killing Harry, but failed to do so and later made Nagini the snake the 6th and Final Horcrux besides Voldemort himself. But I've been wondering, if Voldemort was "killed" when he attacked Harry as a baby, wouldn't that mean he had to use a Horcrux at that time? Or at least lose one of the Horcruxes? Now, I don't necessarily believe he would need to lose any of them, because the whole point is that they are a backup system of sorts, allowing the entire 7 entities to remain alive....

Voldemort the body died trying to kill Harry. He was brought back to life using Harry's blood as part of the ingredient. It seems that Voldemort himself would not be a Horcrux after dying... leaving me wondering about Harry's scar. The scar is a link between Voldemort and Harry, allowing them to share thoughts and feelings, even allowing Voldemort to possess Harry at the end of Book 5 (only other time this was done was Ginny Weasley in Book 2, with the Diary Horcrux) So why can't it represent the final Horcrux?

maybe I'm wrong... I'm just speculating. Thoughts?

[2:25]

great post. first referring to the Da Vinci Code, theyre 2 totally different genres of books, so i dont see how you can compare them, but if youre going to then i dont see how the Da Vinci Code isnt better.

What the fuck is your problem SK? It was just my personal preference. Does every word I type annoy you that
much? Why must someone always insult me back about my personal opinion. I didn't point a gun up to your head and claimed you have to agree with me.



I get the feeling that when Dumbledore was "pleading", he was pleading for Snape to actually kill him
I actually got that feeling too and plus, we never found out why Dumbledore trusts Snape so much (not counting the whole remorse for killing the Potters thing).



But in terms of book structure, humor, and a lack of details (ie, writing style) *compared to books 4 and 5* I would say that Rowling reverted back to how she wrote in the beginning. There's a level of "childishness" that's returned that was lost by the end of book 4 and all of book 5.
Agree, the writing style, in my opinion, is most noticeably different in book 5. The whole teenage angst thing @__@ Nice to see the old Harry, back to normal.



What if Harry is the last Horcrux?
I've thought about it too. But then Harry would have to sacrifice himself. I dunno...the tragic hero's death in the last book might make a good ending...

[Honoko]

Originally posted by: SK
I'm now thinking Snape is on the Order's side, Dumbledore must have had some reason to trust him.

If that's true, then I'd want to think that white tomb at the end is significant somehow. why did everyone act surprised when it appeared like that? i guess that's an unusual kind of funeral in the wizarding world?

i could see rowling putting such heavy emphasis on snape's betrayal only to throw a huge twist in our faces in book 7. but for now, i'm content with hating snape. his personal vendetta with harry/harry's dad can't possibly let him be the kind of guy any sane person would trust =P



Originally posted by: masamuneehs
What if Harry is the last Horcrux?

Now THAT is interesting. Plausible... but i feel like it's one of those wonderful theories rowling WANTS us to think, and is not necessarily true.

[SK]

im pretty sure dumbledore knew what all the horcruxes were, and im not sure if you can split your soul into another person. plus, i dont think voldemort would think harry a great enough container for his soul.
edit: btw stop being sensitive 2-25, i was just stating my opinion.

[Honoko]

could quirrel (turban man from bk 1) possibly qualify as a Horcrux? if u make a snake a horcrux, i don't see why it can't extend to humans.

[2:25]

interesting speculation but I don't think Quirrel as a Horcrux is very likely :/

[Honoko]

haha i didn't think so either. jsut throwing it out there for the heck of it.

besides, now that i think about it, i'm sure the "harry as horcrux" can be debunked based on all that explanation dumbledore did in book 5 about why harry can get insights into voldemort's mind. i highly doubt it's b/c he's got a piece of voldemort's soul in him. but like i said, it would be very interesting if it were true =P

[masamuneehs]

I agree that Voldemort might not feel Harry was a worthy vessel for a Horcrux, until he was killed trying to curse him... but is it plausible for Harry or any human being to be a Horcrux?
but I think it would be cool if the only way Harry could totally destroy Voldemort was through killing himself. Would also reunite him with his parents, Sirius, Dumbledore and any others that die in the upcoming 7th book (Ron?, Hermione? Ginny?)

Quirrel wasn't a Horcrux either. Voldemort was just "borrowing his body" while a Horcrux seems to be a more permanent container.

Oh, and I was wondering what, if any, roles some of the other characters will play in the future seeing as how the direction seems to be away from Hogwarts next book.

I personally have been impressed with Neville and Luna Lovegood and would like to see them helping Harry somehow. I can see them as his liasons at Hogwarts.
Also, Hagrid. Having someone like that with you is incredibly helpful in a major fight, and I think now that Dumbledore is gone and Grawp tame enough to bring to a funeral, both of them might tag along with Harry Ron and Hermione.

And 2 - 25 = -23. You do seem to not be cut out for some of the harsh shit people throw around the forums... Just learn to not care, its just other people stoking their egos and trying to look cool half the time. Don't be so negative.

Finally, does anyone think Hogwarts will be open at all? This might do the trick getting Neville and the D.A. in Harry's little battalion...

[ChaosK]

hogwarts wont be open because undoubtly, hermonie and ron will join harry and theres no way ms. weasly would let ron go instead of school.

EDIT: now for a more thoughtout post after reading all your responses.

like the rest of you i'm happy harry finally got laid.

Dumbledore's death was pretty shocking but i knew from the moment they went to the cave he was going to die. Before the 6th book came out rowling said "i promise 1 of the main characters wont survive" i thought this meant ron, but it was dumbledore.


-snapes duelling abilities are badass though the visual they give of him in the movies sucks. (he repelled every single one of harry's attacks with a flick of his wand)
-Throughout the book i always figured Voldermart was the half blooded prince, think about it he's a halfblood, and his father was pretty much nobility.
-and the avada keradva (i cant spell these spells) question mentioned by some1 up there, bellatrix lestrange explained that with unforgiveable spells you have to set out your brain and heart into that spell, wanting it to hit with all your energy, it seems to not be a simple task to use one, i doubt malfoy's would've been too successful considering harry's been under it before and gained control (book 4) considering he must have little experience in doing it.

the books overall story was good, but it was only saved by the last part. throughout the book, the ron-hermonie jealousy hatred thing was extremely blown out of proportion. They have a fight in almost every book. The Romilda Vane or whoever's obsession with harry and ron eating the love potion was extremely funny, but really had nothing to do with the book. Harry getting the elves to help him was genius, except that part where he couldnt get into the room of requirement was pretty gay.

heres some questions i have i wonder if any of you can answer it:
-if the 6th years are able to almost master silent spells, why cant death eaters do it?
-the time it takes for the death eaters to say crucio somehow the others get "perfectlos tenclotus" out or something of the sort (the 1 that makes their body stiff)?
-did dumbledore ever say which house he belonged to? (i remember hufflepuff or gryffendor?
-how would voldermart have gotten his horcrux (the 1 in the cave)? dumbledore said it needed 2 people and voldermart would never let his deatheaters know about them, yet he cant do it alone.

[SK]

yeah, and who says you can hold a fragment of someone else's soul when you still have your own soul within youself? i dont think hogwarts will play a part next book, they set up harry's quest for the horcruxes and i think that will be the main focus. however, i think Dumbledore's Army will play a role.

[masamuneehs]

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
-snapes duelling abilities are badass though the visual they give of him in the movies sucks. (he repelled every single one of harry's attacks with a flick of his wand)
-and the avada keradva (i cant spell these spells) question mentioned by some1 up there, bellatrix lestrange explained that with unforgiveable spells you have to set out your brain and heart into that spell, wanting it to hit with all your energy, it seems to not be a simple task to use one, i doubt malfoy's would've been too successful considering harry's been under it before and gained control (book 4) considering he must have little experience in doing it.

heres some questions i have i wonder if any of you can answer it:
-if the 6th years are able to almost master silent spells, why cant death eaters do it?
-the time it takes for the death eaters to say crucio somehow the others get "perfectlos tenclotus" out or something of the sort (the 1 that makes their body stiff)?
-did dumbledore ever say which house he belonged to? (i remember hufflepuff or gryffendor?
-how would voldermart have gotten his horcrux (the 1 in the cave)? dumbledore said it needed 2 people and voldermart would never let his deatheaters know about them, yet he cant do it alone.

Snape did rock, he always was really good at Dark Arts and knows the flipside of Defense against them, being with Dumbledore's crew for so long... He also knows all about Harry and can use this to his advantage.

The Death Eaters are evil people, they love to do evil things. Even that Fenrir Greyback particularly loves to attack young children, but he only managed to bite one of the older Weasley brothers... I can't imagine these people couldn't produce some damn good Unforgivables on the kids just because they don't know them. It may not be simple, but its what they're best at for crying out loud!

Why can't Death Eaters do it? I remember in Book 5 Hermione got hit with a Sectumseptra (the swordlike slashing spell) which was from a Silenced Death Eater. This seems like the way to go, rather than stupid stuns and basic hexes that just cause people so boo-boos. I would go in their slashing people apart if I were a Death Eater, and since they were on a covert mission, stealth and silence would have been key.

Also, if two people were required to get the Horcrux, how could R.A.B. get it? (since he obviously did) and did the spell just go back in place over the fake locket, or did R.A.B. put it there (and why would he?) It seems to me that if Voldemort made the defense around the Horcrux, he would also be unharmed by it. But ya never know...

Part of it is just that J.K. Rowling would rather sacrifice some realism and plausibility than have some characters die or get hurt. Is there any way that the Death Eaters shouldn't have killed all the D.A. during the 5th Book? Not those who got seperated from Harry at least... A group of Death Eaters with a vast arsenal of spells can't ever seem to get the words out before the Hogwarts children for the same reason, Rowling is attached to the good guys and doesn't want to face the facts that, in the world she herself constructed, the kids would be screwed and evil would prevail over good. But since she has all the power of an author, she gets to do as she pleases. She has Harry and others get hit by some spells, but none of them do lasting damage or have any specific malady, they're all sort of like getting kicked or punched...

Also, we have Snape, Harry and others dodging and blocking and even REVERSING spells in defense. But the Death Eaters never seem to do this...

[Honoko]

Originally posted by: masamuneehs
Part of it is just that J.K. Rowling would rather sacrifice some realism and plausibility than have some characters die or get hurt. Is there any way that the Death Eaters shouldn't have killed all the D.A. during the 5th Book? Not those who got seperated from Harry at least... A group of Death Eaters with a vast arsenal of spells can't ever seem to get the words out before the Hogwarts children for the same reason, Rowling is attached to the good guys and doesn't want to face the facts that, in the world she herself constructed, the kids would be screwed and evil would prevail over good. But since she has all the power of an author, she gets to do as she pleases. She has Harry and others get hit by some spells, but none of them do lasting damage or have any specific malady, they're all sort of like getting kicked or punched...
Well, this is supposed to a children's storybook, after all....

[ChaosK]

Originally posted by: masamuneehs

Snape did rock, he always was really good at Dark Arts and knows the flipside of Defense against them, being with Dumbledore's crew for so long... He also knows all about Harry and can use this to his advantage.

Considering harry's most successful spells were created by Snape, i doubt that snape would've had any trouble repelling it, what i dont get is, is snape more powerful than say...bellatrix? harry almost dueled bellatrix head on successfully, but never stood a chance with snape?



The Death Eaters are evil people, they love to do evil things. Even that Fenrir Greyback particularly loves to attack young children, but he only managed to bite one of the older Weasley brothers... I can't imagine these people couldn't produce some damn good Unforgivables on the kids just because they don't know them. It may not be simple, but its what they're best at for crying out loud!

i believe the DA students credited it to something about the felix fr....(luck potion)

Why can't Death Eaters do it? I remember in Book 5 Hermione got hit with a Sectumseptra (the swordlike slashing spell) which was from a Silenced Death Eater. This seems like the way to go, rather than stupid stuns and basic hexes that just cause people so boo-boos. I would go in their slashing people apart if I were a Death Eater, and since they were on a covert mission, stealth and silence would have been key.

hmm? thats right it WAS like sectumseptra though i'm not sure the same thing, it was described to have a little purpleish flame or something.



Also, if two people were required to get the Horcrux, how could R.A.B. get it? (since he obviously did) and did the spell just go back in place over the fake locket, or did R.A.B. put it there (and why would he?) It seems to me that if Voldemort made the defense around the Horcrux, he would also be unharmed by it. But ya never know...

ah, i thought of something, maybe the potion doesnt affect halfbloods, it would suit perfectly! he assumes the best wizards are purebloods, so being able to get that far voldermart assumed the wizard/witch was a pureblood. If R.A.B was a halfblood, he wouldnt have any trouble getting it. Also, with this defence voldermart wouldnt have to worry about most of his supporters betraying him because he made sure almost all of them were pureblooded. Technically speaking, harry who has the most similarities with voldermart should've been the one to drink the potion, it would've affected him least because like the prophecy said the dark lord will mark him as his equal voldermart gave harry some of his powers, so harry is very similar to voldermart.



Part of it is just that J.K. Rowling would rather sacrifice some realism and plausibility than have some characters die or get hurt. Is there any way that the Death Eaters shouldn't have killed all the D.A. during the 5th Book? Not those who got seperated from Harry at least... A group of Death Eaters with a vast arsenal of spells can't ever seem to get the words out before the Hogwarts children for the same reason, Rowling is attached to the good guys and doesn't want to face the facts that, in the world she herself constructed, the kids would be screwed and evil would prevail over good. But since she has all the power of an author, she gets to do as she pleases. She has Harry and others get hit by some spells, but none of them do lasting damage or have any specific malady, they're all sort of like getting kicked or punched...

this can be proven from the book why the DA members stood a chance.
-logic in harry potter books are not normal logic ex. "the strongest wizard of all time who has so much pride, forbids anybody to speak his name"<--if i was voldermart i would want everyone to know my name so i could rule under it!
-harry SOMEHOW was able to elude voldermart when he was only 14, AND harry fought voldermart and survived, though he is "special" he should've been long dead.
-Voldermart asking Draco to do the task of killing dumbledore, this was pure stupidity because it contridicts with the plot until the end. draco's mom pleading at snape "HE'LL DIE IN THE ATTEMPT AIEE!" and all that crap, i figured he was going to break the death eaters out of prision.
-it appears, that by the time your a 5th year in hogwarts, you should already know the most effective, counter-jinxes, curses, hexes and charms.
-in the 6th book defence against dark arts class focused on silent spells, no new ones, just the ability to perform the ones they already knew silently. <--this might explain how the DA members were able to fight against the death eaters. also it seems when your playing "Defensive" you have more of an advantage instead of pursuing, all the death eaters were afraid to harm harry because he had the prophecy.



Also, we have Snape, Harry and others dodging and blocking and even REVERSING spells in defense. But the Death Eaters never seem to do this...
well, it seems that the death eaters fighting at hogwarts are, lower classed, because undoubtly, voldermart would've sent his best to get the prophecy. also, the DA members were never in a real duel against the death eaters. They never fought like the way the members of the Order did against death eaters in the 5th book where everybody was dueling 1v1.

[masamuneehs]

I admit it is a children's story for the most part, but Rowling takes it seriously and so do lots of the readers, many of which are older. Just because it appeals to kids doesn't mean inconsistencies in spell use and effects and all I elaborated on earlier are ok...

As to the Half-Blood Pure-Blood thing with the barrier on the Horcrux in the cave. If I remember correctly Regulus Black (who I still belive is R.A.B.) was a Pure-Blood from the very pure-blood Black family. So the issue of how R.A.B. got through Voldemorts defenses still remains to be seen. I havent got a clue as to how he pulled it off, since Dumbledore, who knew Voldemort better than almost anyone, needed to take his time decipherign where Voldemort's magic was in the cave. Dumbledore also is a tough one, even for an old man, and drinking that potion was impossible for him to do alone... R.a.B. had an accomplice?

As for playing defensively against Death Eaters, it does make some sense. but I just can't seem to stomach the idea that some 16 year old brats can go at it with expirienced dark wizards and not get crushed... I guess that Felix Fricius (sp?) luck potion had a lot to do with it... but that feels like a lame way to win a fight, don't it?

[SK]

the luck was enough to not get them killed, they didnt win.

[ChaosK]

then it might be untrue that R.A.B. is Regulus Black, because that was a guess from the start. we can consider R.A.B. to be an unknown with the possibility that he is a half-blood.

Who was the guy that owned the sorcerer's stone in book 1? i think his initials had something to do with R.A.B. ??

[masamuneehs]

But R.A.B. seemed to know Voldemort from the letter he wrote. He also seemed to know that Voldemort would have him killed soon.

However, it doesn't seem to make any sense that Voldemort would let ANY of the Death Eaters know about hi Horcruxes. He didn't tell Lucius Malfoy and even Lestrange doesn't seem to know about it. I do just hope that R.A.B. is explained well, because right now its a very confusing thing to me...

Oh, and nice new avatar Chaoskiddo. Meow.

[Masamune]

plausible theories

http://www.livejournal.com/use...arlandgraves/3409.html (http://www.livejournal.com/users/garlandgraves/3409.html)

[Honoko]

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
Who was the guy that owned the sorcerer's stone in book 1? i think his initials had something to do with R.A.B. ??
Wasn't it Nicholas something? I don't have book 1 handy w/ me rite now..

[SK]

i think it is regulus black, and more likely to think he had an accomplice in getting the locket.
from that site:

"First of all, R.A.B. has to be Regulus Black. This has practical implications for Harry because, when he figures it out, it will help him find the real locket Horcrux.

Where is the locket? On page 116 of OotP (U.S. paperback edition), Sirius and the kids are cleaning out an old cabinet which contains items such as a snuffbox with Wartcap powder, a music box, and a 'heavy locket which none of them could open'. I'd bet that's the locket in question."

[masamuneehs]

SK's post I believe hits the nail on the head. I figured there was something bigger around harry's inheriting 12 Grimmauld Place other than Kreacher. All Kreecher did in Book 6 was tail Malfoy and make shitty reports to Harry, Dobby could have done that by himself. So yeh, that locket will come back in to play, although probably not for some time in Book 7.

[ChaosK]

but wasnt it supposed to be "Destoryed?" and didnt sirius say that his brother was burned off their family tree, so how in the world could Regulus Black return to the house and hide the locket?

Hey, didnt Sirius say in book5 that he had "blood traitors" in his family? i dont remember and i'm too lazy to look but Regulus might be one of them, then it would also prove my point with the half-blood theory.

EDIT: just fully read the theories proposed on that site, which i think i have found a flaw.



Snape gazes at the Headmaster for a moment. Two accomplished Legilimens do nothing but look at each other for a moment in the midst of a heated battle situation, and we are to assume there is nothing passing between them? Oh, no. I think Dumbledore is asking Snape, via his thoughts, to kill him. Remember that Dumbledore's pain and delirium in the cave have already led him to ask for release by death ('Kill me,' he says to Harry). Now Dumbledore is a bit more rational, but he sees that his own death at Severus' hands can serve a purpose. His pleas are not for his life but for his death.

why would dumbledore go through the trouble of not even leaving a note to anybody in the order that snape is still on their side? by not doing this, dumbledore should know that IF snape is acctually on their side, and does as dumbledore commands, the Order is unaware that snape acted under dumbledore's commands. Thus, when Snape returns to the Order's aid, the order will reject him and kill him. So snape was probably really on the side of Voldermart. Why would Dumbledore have snape take the unbreakable vow if he knew that draco could not kill him? it would be much easier for dumbledore to LET draco kill him. i can understand why dumbledore wouldnt tell the Order BEFOREHAND that snape was going to kill him because at the funeral you see how many people he was associated with and how much they all cared for him, the whole Order, would've probably gone to his aid but dumbledore did not want this so leaving a note to be read AFTER his death is reasonable, but we have yet to see one.

[blightian]

hmmm.... i wonder how would harry potter survive in the next bk without going back to Hogwarts. i believe he's not even one-tenth of dumbledore in terms of magical skills and power. i'm doubt he'll be able to accomplish what dumbledore has failed to do. i wonder how jk rowling could make Harry grow all powerful in one bk.

[SK]

i got to ask did you read the 6th book chaos? for one thing he didnt need to leave a note telling snape was really on their side because everyone in the order believed he was. dumbledore did not know snape would end up killing him, he didnt know to leave the order a note saying, "hey snape is going to have to kill me, but he is still on our side." also dumbledore didnt have snape make the unbreakable vow, draco's mother did.

i doubt that sirius would call anyone in his family a "blood traiter" that is the term for Purebloods that marry Mudbloods or Half-Bloods, or a non magical person, sirius wasnt a purist.

edit: harry already has a ton of potential, and he also has the information dumbledore passed on him. this is a great weapon since voldemort has no idea harry knows about the horcruxes. i think snape or slughorn will have to train harry in the next book.

[2:25]

heh, blightian brought up a very good point i/expressions/face-icon-small-tongue.gif


Originally posted by: blightian
i wonder how jk rowling could make Harry grow all powerful in one bk.
I've been wondering that myself. Though, I do admit that Harry has some talent here and there, along with a lot of luck.

[masamuneehs]

Maybe Snape told Dumbledore that he made the Unbreakable Vow with Narcissa Malfoy and then Dumbledore decided that if one of them had to die it should be him. He has helped Harry as much as possible and now Snape, if he's still loyal to the Order, will be able to help Harry alot by Voldemort (& neccessarily everyone else) believing he is a loyal Death Eater. Besides, if Harry ever found out that Snape was still working for the Order, Voldemort could use Legillemency to find out and Snape's cover would be blown.

As for how harry will get stronger than Voldemort, I believe Dumbledore said something about him having "the power of love" on his side (or something cheesy sounding like that) and that Voldemort knows nothing about that and that will be his undoing. So maybe Harry is already stronger? (but not wiser nor as expirienced, and he has true friends, not just minions)

Love will find a way!

[masamuneehs]

Oh I also noticed a strange thing about the Unbreakable Vow scene.

It says in parenthesis right before Lestrange makes the third and final bond that Snape's hand twitches momentarilly. Does that mean the Vow is no good? Or is this a sign of his apprehension at taking the Vow and showing he really isn't a Death Eater?

Other things that now make me think Snape still works for the Order:

1. He only deflected Harry's spells and ordered the other Eaters not to attack him.
2. He can help Harry in his fight against Voldemort in a way that Dumbledore could never. in fact, I believe that is why Dumbledore BEGGED for Snape to kill him, because he realizes that Snape is going to be the only one who can help Harry later on, due to his status as what must be #1 Death Eater.
3. Dumbledore would never beg for his life to be spared. Look how calm he was with Draco seconds before.
4. Snape could have killed Harry in Book 1 and helped Voldemort get the Sorcerer's Stone, instead he saves Harry and helps thwart Voldemort. Far too much to keep your cover, don't ya think?
5. It just figures that JK Rowling would mess with our heads by having Snape kill Dumbledore and making it look like he's evil, only to have him help Harry (maybe even at the cost of his life) greatly in a critical part of the final Book 7.

EDIT: Oh shit I totally didn't see that I was the last one who posted to this topic... Shit, well, err, don't ban me! Sorry!

[Deblas]

This book was really concentrated on love and jealousy. Bill and Fleur, Harry and Ginny, Tonks and Lupin, Ron and Hermione. But still it was another one of J.K's masterpieces. And I can't believe Snape. I thought he was actually good and was in undercover.i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif DUMBLEDORE!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SK]

scroll up deblas, some of us still think he is.

[ChaosK]

Originally posted by: SK
i got to ask did you read the 6th book chaos? for one thing he didnt need to leave a note telling snape was really on their side because everyone in the order believed he was. dumbledore did not know snape would end up killing him, he didnt know to leave the order a note saying, "hey snape is going to have to kill me, but he is still on our side." also dumbledore didnt have snape make the unbreakable vow, draco's mother did.

i doubt that sirius would call anyone in his family a "blood traiter" that is the term for Purebloods that marry Mudbloods or Half-Bloods, or a non magical person, sirius wasnt a purist.

edit: harry already has a ton of potential, and he also has the information dumbledore passed on him. this is a great weapon since voldemort has no idea harry knows about the horcruxes. i think snape or slughorn will have to train harry in the next book.


yes i did read this book, i was just saying since there is aa theory that Snape may still be on the side or the order, except after murdering Dumbledore, how in the world would he ever be able to convince the rest of the order that he is acctually on their side? snape was already on thin ice but the order left him alone because dumbledore said so, without dumbledore to explain snape's reasoning, the order would probably kill him if he ever returned to say "i'm really on your side"

and i didnt mean that sirius called his family blood traitors, his parents did though, like he said some people were burned off the family tree like he was. (his mom did that) i was just suggesting that regulus might have been one of the people burned off.

[masamuneehs]

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo

and i didnt mean that sirius called his family blood traitors, his parents did though, like he said some people were burned off the family tree like he was. (his mom did that) i was just suggesting that regulus might have been one of the people burned off.


Regulus is still on the family tree. Sirius points that out to Harry when Kreecher is trying to save it from being thrown out in Book 5. Apparently his parents died before he did...

And to Deblas: Glad you enjoyed it too. From your post I see you are more or less in the same state I was in after first finishing. Everyone's got their theories and speculations, especially regarding Snape and Horcruxes, so feel free to add some more fuel to the fire.

[Roko]

Originally posted by: masamuneehs
3. Dumbledore would never beg for his life to be spared. Look how calm he was with Draco seconds before.

Just wanted to point out that the situation was different. He knew that Malfoy wasn't a killer, and wouldn't have the guts to do it, so he just reasoned calmly with him. I agree with all your other points though, especailly number 5. Wouldn't surprise me at all if she did that (I can just imagine all the crazy HP fankids going "omg omg, I can't believe Snape was good! =O" etc etc)

[ChaosK]

i bet now JK Rowling is just sitting in her huge mansion thinking "i'm so evil, these little kid's minds are going to be dead after they read my 7th book" by the way, do you know she's already finished with it?

[JusDaMan]

I havent read book 6 yet.. but I bet in book 7 it will have some anti climatic cliche ending like... Nevele is the chosen one not harry. (If I remember in book 5 they were born on the same day)

[SK]

i was thinking the same thing, but dumbledore explained in book 6 that in the beginning when the prophecy was made it could have been either nevelle or harry, but since voldemort chose harry, then the prophecy refers to him, and its his destiny.

[Deblas]

Originally posted by: SK
i was thinking the same thing, but dumbledore explained in book 7 that in the beginning when the prophecy was made it could have been either nevelle or harry, but since voldemort chose harry, then the prophecy refers to him, and its his destiny.

7th book? #6 was just released. And its Neville. And that is a good statement JusDaMan. They both were born in the same day and they both suffered greatly cause of Voldemort. But still I think that it will be Harry who would end it. I think he suffered the most and he arleady accepted himself as the so called "Chosen One".

[SK]

oops meant book 6 hehe. like dumbledore explained the prophecy didnt have to come true at all, it only did because voldemort chose to believe it, and it was only harry because voldemort chose him.

[ChaosK]

Originally posted by: JusDaMan
I havent read book 6 yet.. but I bet in book 7 it will have some anti climatic cliche ending like... Nevele is the chosen one not harry. (If I remember in book 5 they were born on the same day)


they werent born on same day, it was just both in end of july. "as the seventh month breaks" <--prophecy
and also, it has to be harry because "the dark lord will mark him as his equal" thus giving harry the scar and also the ability to speak to snakes, neville doesnt have any of voldermart's great abilities.

and the prophecy was explained in book 5

[Honoko]

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
by the way, do you know she's already finished with it?
i'm pretty sure i read this in an article a long time ago, but i'm under the impression that when rowling started creating the books, she outlined the entire plot from beginning to end. and she had planned 7 books-- one book to represent each year at hogwarts. i think after the outline, it was the matter of filling in all the little details so that took up all time between releases-- that and the fact that somewhere along the way she got married and had babies. Real life does have a habit of getting in the way =P

so to answer ur question: no, she's not done with it but she knows what needs to be written.

[SK]

yeah, she said she has written the final chapter already, but the book itself isnt complete yet.

[Paulyboy]

I got the book and finished within 2-3 days.

1. Sucked when Dumbledore died, but he might be alive because Harry saw a phoenix when that fire lit up.
2. Didn't know that Snape was the half blood prince, and that his father was a moogle.
3. New Malfoy couldn't kill Dumbledore, but damn, I didn't think Snape would do it, but he had to since he was on the Unbreakable Vow.
4. Harry and Ginny together? Didn't expect that.
5. It was cool when we finally get to explore some of Voldermorts past, and wierd though how the Salazaar blood line had to marry each others cousin just to keep the bloodline running.
6. I think Ron and Hermione might hook up.
7. I also liked the Hocruxes how you can be immortal (kind of) just by taking part of your soul and putting it in an object and possibly "something".
8. Better spells this time, and sucks for Billy how his faced is all scarred up because of Greyback. And I thought Fleur wasn't going to marry him.
9. Didn't talk much about Cho.
10. Snape and Harry fighting was kinda of a cool fight.
11. Thought Malfoy was going to die, when Harry did that Secumptra spell on him.
12. Professor McGonagall as Headmaster, knew that.

I don't care what anyone says, Harry Potter books are the shit.

[ChaosK]

Originally posted by: SK
yeah, she said she has written the final chapter already, but the book itself isnt complete yet.

really? in some newspaper, it said that she said she finished up to the last word of book 7. I assumed that meant she did the whole book, not just the last chapter...

[Deblas]

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo


Originally posted by: SK
yeah, she said she has written the final chapter already, but the book itself isnt complete yet.

really? in some newspaper, it said that she said she finished up to the last word of book 7. I assumed that meant she did the whole book, not just the last chapter...

She must be writing the last book now but, since the release of the third or fourth book . She revealed that she has written the last chapter for the seventh book. In which the last word will be scar.

[ChaosK]

"as he walked into the sunset, he ripped off his scar..." i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif just kidding

[masamuneehs]

Originally posted by: Paulyboy
2. Didn't know that Snape was the half blood prince, and that his father was a moogle.
6. I think Ron and Hermione might hook up.
9. Didn't talk much about Cho.

I don't care what anyone says, Harry Potter books are the shit.

LOL 2. Didn't know that Snape was the half blood prince, and that his father was a moogle.
Snape's father was a mOOgle? A Mog? My god that makes me laugh, thinking about Snape as half a Moogle half a man. Oh wow, ohh god that image... Puff ball body and greasy black hair ohoh...

Dude, Ron and Hermione getting together is a LONG time coming. The writing has been on the wall since book 3 and this book was filled with their flirtations and jealousy.

Cho. Dumb onna... She was too much of a crybaby for me. Harry's better off with Ginny. I'm glad she wasn't in there as much.

And I highly highly doubt JK Rowling has finished the final book yet because I recently read in an interview that she is "dreading parts of it" and that it upsets her because her children constantly ask her what is going to happen in the end and she can't tell them anything.

[Deblas]

You know. Since the second book. There has been many rumors that Harry might actually die in the seventh book. In one interview a kid asked J.K "why stop at the seventh book, why not continue Harry's life as an adult" in which J.K answered "What makes you think he will live through the last book" in kind of like a teasing matter. I myself think its a plausible idea that one of Voldemorts Horcruxes could be Harry's lightning scar. Once he destroys the soul that remains in Voldemort. He will have no choice but to destroy the horcrux with Voldemorts remaining soul so that he will be completly destroyed. and It ends in a dramatic matter Harry dying. But we don't want Harry to die do we?

[ChaosK]

maybe we do...couldnt he probably use spectruma to slash the scar out or something? leaving him with a bigger scar, but the horacrux would be out...besides, harry doesnt know how to destroy horcruxes yet does he? since dumbledore destroyed the ring before harry learned about horcruxes and the amulet turned out to be a fake.

[NM]

Well, I finally finished the book so here's what I have to say about it.

-Dumbledore dying. Man...I couldn't believe it, and who did it! Whether Dumbledore wanted Snape to do it, I don't know but Dumbledore was the man. I'm really gonna miss him.
-Snape. Sucks. Like I said before, I don't know if Snape was doing it on Dumbledore's orders but I got the impression that he was only doing it to prevent himself from dying from the Unforgivable Vow. I'll probably stick by this until we see what happens in the final book. But wow, I can't believe him. If it was me, I would've chosen death, rather than kill a man who took you into his school despite his dark background and put so much trust and faith in him.
-Ginny. Man, this was really unexpected. The whole time, I was thinking Harry was gonna knock boots with Cho and here he is, dreaming about making out with his best friend's sister. I thought this went too fast between the both of them.
-Ron and Hermione. STILL nothing between them. But alot did develop with the both of them so meh.
-Malfoy. I must say his scheme was pretty clever but who would've thought he couldn't bring himself to kill Dumbledore? And Harry actually felt pity for him...things look to be interesting between Harry and Malfoy in the final book.
-Horcruxes. Yes, I am sad about the fact that Dumbledore died for nothing because of that fake locket. But R.A.B...I have no clues as to who it could be but I read through the first few posts and Regulus Black seems like the only choice as of now. Maybe when we see Harry go to Godric Hollow, we'll see some more clues? And about Harry being the last Horcrux...that would be kind of interesting. But even if Harry defeats the Horcrux in Voldemort and kills himself...sure, that would make Voldemort mortal again but do you guys think just any old Auror can step up to him and kill him?

I must say the Rowling set up the events for the final book perfectly. I just can't wait!! i/expressions/face-icon-small-happy.gif

[yallo]

I really do hope that Snape killed Dumbledore because that's what Dumbledore pleaded him to do. I don't doubt that he hates Harry Potter's father and Siruis Black, but somehow, I've always been convinced that Snape is the tragic figure of most-misunderstood-and-maligned good guy in the Harry Potter series. Now, all that's left is for him to miraculously save Harry Potter in his showdown with Lord Voldemort! And perhaps sacrifice his own life in the process *sniffle*

I'm kinda confused here, but, can someone please remind me of the relationships between Bellatrix, Narcissa, Snape, Siruis Black and Lucius Malfoy? I remember reading that all the purebloods are related. So...
Bellatrix & Narcissa = sisters
Lucius Malfoy & Narcissa = husband & wife
Narcissa & Snape = ???
Bellatrix & Snape = ???
And how does Sirius Black fit into the picture?

I too wonder how the hell Harry Potter is gonna fight with Lord Voldermort in bk7. Man, he's gotta learn to use curses & hexes the silent way during battle. And all that talk about how 'love' is his one power over Lord Voldermort, uughhh that's so cheesy. ><

[NM]

Originally posted by: smilealwiz
I'm kinda confused here, but, can someone please remind me of the relationships between Bellatrix, Narcissa, Snape, Siruis Black and Lucius Malfoy? I remember reading that all the purebloods are related. So...
Bellatrix & Narcissa = sisters
Lucius Malfoy & Narcissa = husband & wife
Narcissa & Snape = ???
Bellatrix & Snape = ???
And how does Sirius Black fit into the picture?

Narcissa and Bellatrix don't have any relations to Snape, I believe, other than the fact that they are Death Eaters. Sirius, however, is related to Bellatrix and Narcissa. They are Sirius's cousins.

[Paulyboy]

Originally posted by: masamuneehs


Originally posted by: Paulyboy
2. Didn't know that Snape was the half blood prince, and that his father was a moogle.
6. I think Ron and Hermione might hook up.
9. Didn't talk much about Cho.

I don't care what anyone says, Harry Potter books are the shit.

LOL 2. Didn't know that Snape was the half blood prince, and that his father was a moogle.
Snape's father was a mOOgle? A Mog? My god that makes me laugh, thinking about Snape as half a Moogle half a man. Oh wow, ohh god that image... Puff ball body and greasy black hair ohoh...

Dude, Ron and Hermione getting together is a LONG time coming. The writing has been on the wall since book 3 and this book was filled with their flirtations and jealousy.

Cho. Dumb onna... She was too much of a crybaby for me. Harry's better off with Ginny. I'm glad she wasn't in there as much.

And I highly highly doubt JK Rowling has finished the final book yet because I recently read in an interview that she is "dreading parts of it" and that it upsets her because her children constantly ask her what is going to happen in the end and she can't tell them anything.


Aahaha I meant to say Muggle i/expressions/face-icon-small-smile.gif, I guess Final Fantasy was stuck in my head

[Tinks]

I dont think R.A.B. will be anyone we all know, but I guess its possible since theres only one book left
The hardest part is that the last book more than likely wont come out for a few years, at the very soonest next summer/fall

The only part that bothered me, is that Harry didnt try to use spells silently like Snape was saying, they never said whether he had mastered it or not since learning it came quite early in the book somewhat

Also Dumbledore is gone, but why dont they just question the new painting in the headmaster office instead of trying to interrogate Harry? Why doesnt Harry talk to the painting in fact?

[masamuneehs]

Tinks, I agree with you on the not using Silent Spells thing, it does seem like Rowling made up a way for people to be very dangerous and stealthy in combat but then never has the characters do it when it actually matter. I'd imagien the teachers at Hogwarts and the Death Eaters would use some silent spells, but all the ones that got cut off were spoken aloud...

And as for the paintings, I don't believe they neccessarily know everything that the person themself did. For example, with magical photographs people are however they were when the picture was taken. Like the picture of the Order that Moody has in Book 5, everyone was all smiles despite some getting killed soon after. And also, Wormtail is in there all chummy with everyone. If pictures or photos could change, then they'd probably be having a group beat-down on Wormtail in the picture.

Dumbledore's painting was probably done some time ago, and therefore almost certainly doesn't know everything that Dumbledore knows. Harry asking it would be useless, and I'd imagine Dumbledore the Painting would be all hush about if Snape is still with the Order or was really a traitor... keep his cover going.

[ChaosK]

i always wondered what was the deal with the paintings, it seemed to me if your headmaster and you leave you get to live there or something, harry could always talk to dumbledore through there?

[Raven]

I just finished this book last night - woah, emotional stuff at the end there.

Dumbledore has always been my favourite character; unfailingly polite, calm, in control, pleasant no matter what the situation, and tough where it counts. It was really disorientating for me when he was screaming insanely in the cave and then so weak at the end there - he always seems to be completely in control.

Throughout the series of books he has always strongly maintained his trust in Snape. No matter who questioned this faith (which happened dozens of times) he has always remained firm. Even when Harry - the main character- loathed Snape to such a huge degree, Dumbledore's faith in him (Snape) never wavered. Because of this faith, and because of how 'all-knowing' Dumbledore seemed to be, this strongly points me to the fact that Snape is in fact still one of the good guys, like many have mentioned in this thread. There has to be a good reason why Dumbledore trusted him so completely, it has to be more than just the fact that Snape was remorseful.



So, here's my theory: when Snape appears, Dumbledore knows this is the perfect opportunity to accomplish all of his immediate goals--save Malfoy's life and keep him from doing a despicable act, plus allow Snape to fulfill his Unbreakable Vow (which I am sure he knew all about, just as he knew all about Malfoy's plan) and therefore a) not die and b) remain 'in' with the Death Eaters as a spy--and all this simply by doing something he knew he was going to do anyway: die.
I agree with this for sure. Dumbledore was willing to sacrifice his own life at that point because he knew he was going to die soon anyway; at least this way Snape's cover wouldn't be blown and with Snape on the inside their chances are much, much greater. Snape would have died if he hadn't killed Dumbledore at that point anyway, as a result of the Unbreakable Vow, and that would have been a needless loss.

This is also reinforced by the fact that Snape didn't fight Harry back, but just repelled all his attacks and then knocked the wind out of him rather than hurt him. You could almost take this as an "I'll explain later" type of action.

I still thought Dumbledore's death at the end there was a bit fishy - Harry sees the pheonix for a second, then the white tomb constructs itself mysteriously so nobody can see the body ... hmmmm... i/expressions/face-icon-small-wink.gif



Originally posted by: Winged Dancer
What makes me interested in book 7 (besides the facts that its the last one) is that it'll be so different. We wont have Hogwarts. We wont have OMG I got to win Quidditch. It'll be Harry, Ron and Hermione searching for the Horcruxes or something... it's just going to be such a different structure, if it really is like that. No teachers, no classes, no "I have homework so I can't fight the Dark Lord right now!!1". So yeah, I kinda wanna see that.
Yeah, my thoughts exactly, I was thinking this all throughout book 6. Book 7 will be a completely different structure. Hogwarts will probably still be in it, they'll probably have to go there to get the sword for something (to kill the snake maybe).

There's HEAPS JKR is going to have to fit in there too, things that need explaining, etc. The book is going to be one almighty brick, heh. For instance, Ron and Hermione still need to get together. Harry has to track down all the horcruxes and destroy them (whether or not he is one himself) and then kill Voldemort. We have to have closure on everything and all the characters. We have to see the aftermath after Voldemort dies. We have to see the changes in the Ministry. We have to see a reconciliation with Percy and the Weaselys. This book will be HUGE!

...and I want it right now.

[darkmetal505]

shes made the book like it is because shes saving a big finale for the end.... for those who do not think dumbledore is not dead or snape is still on the order's side... go to here (http://www.dumbledoreisnotdead.com)

[masamuneehs]

Originally posted by: CmDr_RavEn
...and I want it right now.

God don't we all feel that? To think how long it'll be... crushes me...

[Raven]

Originally posted by: darkmetal505
shes made the book like it is because shes saving a big finale for the end.... for those who do not think dumbledore is not dead or snape is still on the order's side... go to here (http://www.dumbledoreisnotdead.com)
An excellent site. This further convinces me that either Dumbledore is not dead or that his death was part of some elaborate plan involving Snape.


Originally posted by: masamuneehs
God don't we all feel that? To think how long it'll be... crushes me...
2 years or so isn't it? i/expressions/face-icon-small-sad.gif

[2:25]

darkmetal505, awesome find.
That site touched on a lot of theories I had in mind. Actually, there some other hints I would like to share with them, but I can't find their email O_O

[darkmetal505]

yea there are quite a few clues, but theres one thing i dont get. Only the goblet could enter the forcefield thing and pick up the white liquid, well Dumbledore didnt have to drink it, he could have just emptied it, right? Even if he had to "put it in his mouth" for it to work, he could have spit it out after that. Guess if he did that the story wouldnt have been as interesting.

[ChaosK]

Originally posted by: darkmetal505
shes made the book like it is because shes saving a big finale for the end.... for those who do not think dumbledore is not dead or snape is still on the order's side... go to here (http://www.dumbledoreisnotdead.com)


its unanswered questions were answered though...

[Raven]

Originally posted by: darkmetal505
yea there are quite a few clues, but theres one thing i dont get. Only the goblet could enter the forcefield thing and pick up the white liquid, well Dumbledore didnt have to drink it, he could have just emptied it, right? Even if he had to "put it in his mouth" for it to work, he could have spit it out after that. Guess if he did that the story wouldnt have been as interesting.
It probably would have replenished or something, just like Harry's conjured water kept disappearing. JK always says something is "bewitched" to get around loopholes like that.

[Rek]

yay magick! yanno, thats how the bible works ^^

[Raven]

Originally posted by: Chaoskiddo
its unanswered questions were answered though...
... such as?

[ChaosK]

1. If Snape Didn't Fulfill The Unbreakable Vow, Why Isn't He Dead?

what evidence was there that he didnt fulfill it? seemed to me like he did.

If Dumbledore Is Alive, Where Is Umbridge's Portrait?
well dumbledore's not ali ve and it has nothing to do with umbridges portriat but you see, she never got into the headmaster's office (remember? the gargoyal wouldnt move)

edit: i just remembered didnt dumbledore seem a bit...off throughout the book? like when harry told him about malfoy and snape and asked if he understood dumbledore replied with something like "yes i did as i'm blessed with extraordinary brain power" he's never been so full of himself or cocky before has he? i remember him also saying "i am a very powerful wizard" or something of the sort when he was trying to get the horacrux with harry. i thought he may have been half way fighting a curse from the fight in the ministry (book 5) where voldermart did a hidden spell and got dumbledore (as snape also said "he was quite shaken from the fight in the ministry" (ok if you havent figured it out by now i'm not precisely quoting the characters because i dont have the book within reach.)

[TruthofMistake]

well i cant remember if iv posted here or not and dont feel like checking and my views have prolly changed since then anyways, anyways so IMO
R.A.B. = Regulus Black b/c like everyone else has said, it makes sense.
Snape = not evil if hed wanted he could have easily killed harry he was practicly playing with him when harry was chasing him and the reason he killed dumbledore is b/c of the unbreakable vow, and probably fits into some crazy plan of dumbledor's
Overall view of the book= it was alright but a dissapointment, it was a good book and worth reading but i expected much more, she did adress a lot of concerns i had about the book such as the harry/ginny romance (which she killed) Ron/Hermione, and several others and im glad we got more backstory on snape hes an interesting char. if not a great one....

[2:25]

I don't think R.A.B is anyone we know...

And yeah, Snape's backstory was good. I enjoyed Voldemort's too.

[masamuneehs]

DO NOT READ THIS IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO GET HEAVY HINTS ABOUT WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN IN THE SEVENTH BOOK OF THE HARRY POTTER SERIES.

This is an interview that JK Rowling recently gave about her plan for the last book in the series. It contains concrete info about what important events will occur in the next book.


Click on this link at your discretion
Rowling Interview Reveals Plan for Final Potter Book (http://www.ndtv.com/morenews/showmorestory.asp?slug=Rowling+speaks+about+final+ Potter+book&id=90939)

-edit: And apparently, as my trusted IRC source now informs me, this info has actually been circulating for awhile. But it's news to me, and I thought I'd share it with those curious enough to look.

[Honoko]

Another link of interest would be: Dumbledore Theories (http://www.dumbledoreisnotdead.com)

Don't even bother clicking on the link if you haven't finished book 6 =P

[NM]

That link Masa posted is so tempting to click...but I really wanna be surprised in the final book. Must...refrain...from clicking...

Quick question though...is there a confirmed release date for the final book yet? I want to re-read The Half-Blood Prince a little bit before the the last book comes out.

[RyougaZell]

Harry should die at the end being a Horcrux but... this is Rowling... she would not kill her main character.

[Honoko]

That link Masa posted is so tempting to click...but I really wanna be surprised in the final book. Must...refrain...from clicking...

Quick question though...is there a confirmed release date for the final book yet? I want to re-read The Half-Blood Prince a little bit before the the last book comes out.
I heard a rumor that it's gonna be released 07.07.07-- some gimmick so that they can sell the 7th book in the 7th day of the 7th month of the 7th year. I haven't read any confirmation about that yet but I wouldn't put it past those marketing people.

[mage]

I heard a rumor that it's gonna be released 07.07.07-- some gimmick so that they can sell the 7th book in the 7th day of the 7th month of the 7th year. I haven't read any confirmation about that yet but I wouldn't put it past those marketing people.
They do things like that all the time. Final Fantasy VIII and the Dreamcast both came out on 9/9/99 (US), for instance.

[darkmetal505]

Masa's link doesn't really give away too much, actually, nothing out of the obvious. Someone has to die, it's not a big deal.

[LaZie]

I'm betting at Snape and Harry dying and Hermione and Ron getting together to tell the tales of Harry Potter :p

[masamuneehs]

yes, obviously someone has to die. but the author setting a specific body count for the final installment of a blockbuster literary epic is more than some people may want to just read about over the internet.

i myself, before and after reading that interview believe that Harry will die at the end of the 7th Book. I say this because I house a theory of my own design to explain the parts of plotline remaining for the last book. To sum my theory up, I believe Harry IS the 7th and final Horcrux, and therefore defeating Voldemort involves him killing himself as well.

...unless he's saved by the power of love, or some sentimental shmiznass like that...

i've already said my peace about what I think the deal with Voldemort's Horcruxes are here:

http://forums.gotwoot.net/showpost.php?p=220112&postcount=10

[saman]

edit #2: umm, spoiler warning? i have no idea if spoilers are allowed in this thread, so, yeah...

hmm, that news conference went into a lot more detail. here's the summary of it from mugglenet.com (with my own comments added in):

- Other than Harry, Jo would most want to bring Hagrid into the real world.
- There's more to Aunt Petunia than meets the eye, and we'll find out what's unique about her in book seven.
- Don't expect Dumbledore to pull a Gandalf.
- Dumbledore IS really dead. (ha!) "Everyone needs to move through the 5 stages of grief" and get past his death. She also apologizes to DumbledoreIsNotDead.com for ruining the purpose of their site.
- Jo's future after Potter includes taking a long break from writing. She also plans to release a young children's book (currently half written) that is shorter than any Potter novel.
- The librarians in the Potter novels have to be evil, otherwise the students would have nice librarians to help them find all the information they need. "Hermione wouldn't have to do any work!"
- Author Salman Rushdie came up with his son to ask, after a detailed theory, if Snape is good or bad. Jo replied that "your opinion was correct." Rushdie's opinion, unfortunately, was hard to follow.
- After being asked if there was one question fans should have asked by now but haven't, Jo couldn't reference any question in particular.
- While taking a shower before the reading today, Jo said that she had come up with a different title for book seven that would work better than her current title. No word on which title will be used, though.
- Stephen King said he was scared of Death Eaters, to which Jo replied, "I scared Stephen King."
- Moderator Soledad O'Brien asked the three authors who from their books they'd invite to dinner. Stephen immediately said he'd invite Harry and Hermione.
- While Jo is listing the characters who she'd invite to dinner, she names the trio but then pauses. The crowd begins to shout out other characters, but Jo responds, "I'm the only one who knows who lives through the series," accidentally implying that she could only list characters who make it through the final book. Her final two choices (after realizing what she said) were Dumbledore and Hagrid. (people seem to think that by naming the trio before pausing to think about people who survive in the end, she accidentally implied that the trio does survive in book seven)

edit: oh yeah, according to hpana.com, "She also suggested there were to be plot twists in book 7 that she didn't think anyone has already or could possibly guess about."

[ChaosK]

...Voldermart will die...:eek: I bet nobody thought of that. :rolleyes:

Seriously though, Voldermart has to die, and then I expect Lupin to save Harry's ass once. They will not kill off Potter because he is fucking Potter.

[Raven]

Still, I don't think Jo would have a problem killing Harry, it's not totally out of the question. She's said that numerous times.